Okay, cats up little food for yourself life.
Oh it's pretty bad.
Hey, it's pretty beautiful. Thing beautiful. That's a little more exciting, said, he can cut your kicking it with four Thing.
With Amy Brown, Happy Thursday. Four Things Amy Here, And my guest today is Sarah Canoles. And Sarah sent me an email and I don't know what stood out to me most Sarah. I think I just saw breakup detalks and I thought, oh, this is brilliant. She's helping people navigate breakups and you're a coach, which some people might think, what that just seems really odd to need someone to help guide them through a breakup, But I think it's brilliant. When I was going through my divorce, I feel like
I could have used something like this. And then you and I were talking before we were recording, and I thought, shoot, I could have used you when my college boyfriend broke up with me. And I think it's just learning how to navigate something that is painful.
Yeah, And what I really find is that a breakup can be a portal to knowing yourself better and reconnecting to who you really are. And the way that I did my breakups, like every time I got dumped by a boy in my teens and twenties and thirties. It was always about what did I do wrong and why did I cause the breakup? And that's kind of using to beat myself up. And I went through a breakup a couple of years ago and really used my coaching tools to go through it, and I thought, that's the
healthiest I've ever done it. I actually came out more confident and more clear on who I am and what I want, and I thought more people need that.
I think that it's a time that you get to ask yourself, what does this now make possible for me? And it doesn't ignore the pain that you're in.
No.
Donald Miller's a guest on the podcast that gave us that question a few years back, and I've used it so much and I think it acknowledges that you're in pain right now and also what does this now make possible? And you're helping people get there. So we're going to go through some breakup detox questions in a minute. But also before we started recording, we were talking about my friend's daughter who has recently broken up with via text message, and that was a painful way to get broken up
with and you said that. So many adults do that, or they just ghost people and they are left wondering, what did I do? What happened?
Well?
An update to the text message story is when the parents of the boy found out that he dumped her that way there in high school, they went to their son and they said, no, So that is not how we break up with people. You are taking her to dinner. You're gonna pay for the dinner, and you're gonna have an open, honest conversation with her about why this isn't working for you. That way, she's not left wondering, and you are going to communicate in a healthy way. And
that's how it's done. You don't just dumper over text.
Yeah, it's the modern day equivalent of Sex and the City with Burger and the post it of like, I'm sorry, I can't don't hate me, and like now we send texts or we go see each other. And if we just developed a little bit of the ability to be uncomfortable with an uncomfortable like to sit in that discomfort of the uncomfortable conversation to say I want something different or this isn't working, it makes us better people. It
leaves the other person better. It's like the Girl's Scout and Boy Scout motto of like leave it better than you found it, right.
Yeah, Well, so let's just start right away with what is a breakup detox and why is it important to detox after or a split?
When I think about detoxing, I think we're all familiar with spring cleaning our house of like getting rid of the old energy and like getting deep into the base bores and all those areas, or like if you're doing a diet, you're going to cut certain things out of
your diet so that your body feels physically better. But we never think about our heart and all the gunk that might have built up, either from past relationships like we were saying of like our teenage years and first heartbreaks and stuff that we still hold on to, or even those patterns that we've got from just this most recent relationship that maybe've gone through a heartache. We need to clear all that away and create more space for the possibility of what's coming.
Okay, so when you're talking about detox and you use the example of eliminating certain foods that you know don't make you feel your best, or getting rid of things in your house for a little spring cleaning. I did that once when I got into a new relationship. I threw away a whole shoebox full of my last relationship before that, and looking back, I sort of regret dumping that in the trash and totally getting rid of it.
Not that I have any expectations for that relationship at this point in my life, But isn't it fun to just think that you could maybe go through your old stuff or have your kids or your grandkids go through your shoebox and like find fun memories. But I straight up through everything in the trash. Is that what you mean? Like we need a dtox, like get rid of it, because I don't know that you know, I want anybody to regret getting rid of something. But what's the detox part?
Yeah? Yeah, So I look at four key areas and I'm totally with you. I think I've kept like a few letters from each of my really significant relationships, or like I had a college boyfriend write me a song and I have the cassette tape. Like there's a couple things I held onto not because I want the relationship back, but like you said, someday it might be nice to look back on that stuff and remember my own love journey. So I'm not talking about like a total wipe of everything.
And I'm really not the kind of coach that gives hard and fast rules. I'm never going to be the person that advocates one hundred percent for no contact or like delete all social media or anything, because our lives are like we have gray areas in our life. And I'm sure you co parent with your ex. You can't go no contact if you're co parenting, But there are energetic ways to detox. So the four areas I look
at is physical, mental, emotional, and social. And so in your physical area, that might be removing their stuff, like if you have your ex's shirt, return the shirt, Or there might be certain items that just bring up a lot of heartbreak, Like maybe remove those really charged items and choose a couple to put away, or you could put it in a box and maybe give it to a friend of Like, can you hang on to that for a while, just so I don't have to look at it your physical space and separate that out so
that you're not in it all the time. You know, if you have to cohabitate for a while can you create a space that's purely yours, even if it's just a corner or a closet that you clear out something that is just you, just clean, just fresh, where you set up something cozy for yourself that's yours, and that way you have somewhere that you can get started on the healing process and the work. So that's physical. Mental
is your thoughts. And the reason I tell people I'm never gonna be hard and fast about no contact because you could be no contact with somebody but still thinking about them all the time. So we really have to clean up your thinking patterns so that you can't stop thinking about somebody. You can't control your thoughts. Just like if I said, don't think about a pink elephant, you're going to think about a pink elephant. But you can choose where you're going to focus, and you can direct
where you focus. So just kindly and gently notice, oh, I'm thinking about my ex again, and have sort of a mental boundary for yourself of like I. When I do that, I'm gonna kindly direct my attention of like, And this is really how I talk to myself like, No, sweetheart, we're not doing that right now, like we're going to think of something else, We're gonna we're gonna focus on ourselves. What do you need right now? And I always bring it back to myself because that's pretty easy of like
what do I really really need right now? And like I need a walk, I need a cry, I need a hug, I need a cuddle with my pet. Anything like that is totally fine as you're redirecting what you're focusing on. And next we've got the emotional detox. So just like if you were doing like a body cleanse, there might be some stuff coming up and out. You don't want to hold it in or hold it down. You want to get it out. So right now you've got a lot of emotions kind up and we want
to let those out. So great ways to do that. You might do a journal dump of like write it all down, get it out on paper so that it's not in your head. Or you might dance it out or shake it out or go for a walk. Or I love a temper tantrum, like straight up, like put yourself in your bag, kick and scream and get all your emotions out and go crazy for a couple minutes. You don't want to hold your emotions in you want
to let them out. And I feel like I've heard on a podcast of yours you talk about like an emotional appointment, like a crying appointment. I highly recommend that because it gives you time and space to do it well.
And one way that you can achieve that is if you know there's always a movie that evokes certain emotions, like you can know that, Okay, look on Friday night, I'm going to carve out time to watch this movie and have a release. And the movie may walk you through lots of emotions. You may cry, you may laugh. I think it's good to experience. It's a lot of things. But that's one way to appointment cry. Because a lot of us, we're leading these lives. You can't just have
a meltdown and break down wherever you want. We have jobs, we have children, we have responsibilities. So if you just give yourself that permission to appointment cry at some point, then that's helpful.
Absolutely. And I loved doing it in the shower, so I had like an extra lung shower and a certain song or I know a lot of my clients like doing it in the car because then you're kind of private.
In a movie that may be more of a time investment. I love that you mentioned a song because there's always a song that will take you there always.
So that's emotional, let it out. And then finally there's a social detox, because when we go through a breakup, your whole social circle probably is changing. You probably had well. Actually your ex is probably the closest relationship that you had or one of, and maybe you had patterns of that's the person I texted before bed or I shared all my good news with my ex. And you're having
to redefine who is my person? So kind of like Gray's Anatomy, Christina and Meredith for each other's person, and it was a best friend relationship, it wasn't about the guy. Maybe this is a time that you get to redefine who's my person, who's in my inner circle? Who do I want to be sharing my life with. And I also like to encourage people to think of who is your support system, because sometimes that's not your friends as well.
Meeting as our friends are, they have a hard time being with us through our pain or relating to it, and so having people that can really support and encourage you to go through your full range of emotions without having to fix you or change anything. Who will just listen can be really helpful.
Now, what are some of the biggest mistakes that people make when they're trying to move on from someone? Now? What are some of the biggest mistakes that people make when they're trying to move on from someone.
I think the biggest mistake I see the most is that they focus too much on their ex. I work with a lot of women who are really compassionate, people who are very giving, and they are worried about their ex, like I want to make sure he's okay and that he is coping with this all right, or that he has people he can turn too, like I was his best friend. I don't know what he's going to do. I love that that's the instinct. However, you have to trust that he's going to figure it out, and you
have to turn your attention to yourself. That you are your most important person right now.
So people that are coming to you, are they the ones that did the dumping or did they get dumped?
Yeah? Most of the time they get dumped. I work with a lot of women. Tear Cole calls us high functioning codependence, where it's like we want to make sure everybody's okay. And I identify that way too as a recovering,
high functioning codependent. We're the ones that are like, I got this all covered, and i got this all taken care of, and I'm gonna make sure you're okay too, and even through their own pain, rather than look at themselves and be with their own pain, they're looking to their ex of like, well, I'm gonna make sure he's okay.
Yeah, I feel like that's pretty common, but especially if you have any codependent tendencies.
Yeah, even if you're.
The one that did the dumping, I can see you. Why do we call it dumping, by the way, that just came into my mind of like why it's like we're just like maybe they just dump throw away the trash, take to the take it to the dump. I might need to look into the roots of that, because I'm curious.
But if you're the one that did the breaking up or you know it needs to happen, you may stay in a relationship longer because you're worried about the other person, And then that's definitely a code of behavior, absolutely because you're not doing what's best for you. Because you're trying to control what's happening in that other person's life. So what's the first thing that someone should do after a breakup if they're wanting to set themselves up for healing.
Obviously the detox, but is there one specific thing that should be done first.
This is so hard, but I tell people, let yourself fall apart. Don't resist that urge that you're falling apart and that everything is going to pieces. Let that happen. If you think about a caterpillar that's about to turn into a butterfly. The science behind this is still amazing to me. But once that caterpillar is in the cocoon, it dissolves into total goo and it has to do
that so it can reform into a butterfly. So right after a breakup, where most people are in shock, they're feeling all the feelings, and I say, just let that happen. Don't resist it, don't try to hang on. Let yourself fall apart.
Oh. I love that analogy. You're being able to picture that and see the goo. At least in my mind, I'm like, yes, let yourself go to mush and then you get to emerge a beautiful butterfly. Yeah, what are some surprising ways that people let go of an X that actually work? I don't know. I'm picturing like burning something.
I love a burn. I teach a whole writing a letter writing process. That is, I tell them to think about what were the things that they loved about their ex, and what were the things they didn't like about their ex? And then also what were the things you liked about yourself when you were with them and the things you didn't like about yourself and the relationship Because there's probably something in each of those categories and we don't always
fill them out. Most people are told write all the things you didn't like about that person, and that's not totally fair because we're all complex and we're a part of that story too, So we have to look at what was my part in the dynamic. And when we do it that way and you look at all four pieces, you start to pull apart. What are the things that I want to create again on purpose in my next relationship? I think people get really hung up and I did this.
I did this a lot of I'm never going to find anybody as great as my ex ever again, and that's not true. You will find other great people in the world. There are lots of great people. We just have to know intentionally what we're looking for and how we get to show up and we're in relationship with those people.
Okay. I love that the focusing on all aspects of the relationship, not just the negative. You're bringing in the positive parts too. And while you were talking, I looked up dumping and where it came from, because you know, I got curious. And it's a sudden and often callous way of ending a relationship, like discarding something unwanted, essentially throwing away the other person without much explace, a nation,
or consideration. So really dumping should only be used if it's in that way, like, but if someone is breaking up with someone and they've done it in a thoughtful, kind way, it should not be called dumping. I think. So that's what I just learned. But earlier I was saying if you dumped or he dumped, But it really isn't dumping unless you've been discarded with no thought and
no explanation. So when you are in a breakup season, like, we all have different seasons of life, So I imagine when when you have been broken up with or dumped, whatever has happened to you. Then you're in this season, and it's like you have a choice of how you want to navigate and live in this season. And I love that you're here to offer a healthier way to go about it. So what do you consider that season as there are particular time that it tends to last? Is
it different for everybody? Should we try to be out of the season by you know, a certain number of weeks or months, or is it just case by case.
I do like to think of it seasonally because sometimes when we're in the throes of it, it feels a lot like winter it's never going to end. It's going to be dark forever and the light is never coming, and it's always going to be cold. But it doesn't, and spring comes and things get to bloom. But actually, did you know there's actually in the calendar, like there's a time of year that is breakup season.
Well, now that you're saying that, I'm guessing, is it winter time?
It's March?
Oh wait, okay, that's this month. Yeah, okay, so people need to be aware. Why is it March?
Because it's after Valentine's Day, it's the biggest stretch between holidays. I also think people want to be single for summer.
Okay, my mind is blown. I did not know that March was like the biggest breakup time of the year.
Yeah, statistically, right before holidays and then March.
Okay, so there's two times of the year that it happens. So is it March and then closer to Thanksgiving or something?
Yeah? Yeah, because if you get to Thanksgiving, you got to go through Valentine's Day.
That is so crazy that that many people just make their way through Valentine's Day. You would think that people would maybe break up right before Valentine's Day because they don't want to deal with having to get them a gift if they're only going to break up with them a few weeks later.
I know, I hear it. A lot of people give me really weird stories of well, I gotta get this far. I don't want to be that person. I don't want to be that cruel. I'm like, oh, I mean heartbreaks, heartbreak, It's gonna hurt no matter what. Okay.
Well, being that we are in March and we've just learned this is a big breakup time, breakup season, what advice do you have for people that might be blindsided by a breakup at some point this month.
I always encourage people to start with passion, to be like radically compassionate with yourself, almost to the point where maybe you feel I don't know if your audience can relate to this. Of the we're the people that are the hardest on ourselves normally, and we are normally the first ones to criticize ourselves and really be harsh and judging.
And so when I say be radically compassionate, it is almost like treating yourself like you would treat your child or your favorite pet, and be that kind to yourself, because we rarely do that, and what that might look like. I like the phrase of course, So if you're feeling really sad, maybe you meet that sadness with telling yourself, of course I'm sad. Of course I'm feeling this way
because I really cared about that relationship. And when we use that phrase of course and we like guidide ourselves through that, there's something really comforting about it, and there's less judgment, and then it sort of clears a little bit of space that you kind of soothe yourself when you're crying. Is this making sense?
Yeah, no, I'm thinking that it's very similar to the what does this now make possible? This is another one I want to keep in my back pocket of you know, that's a statement for certain things, and now I think that I'll use, of course for myself in certain conversations that I'm having with myself or with a friend, even encouraging them. Oh yeah, of course you're feeling this way and helping them accept and know that this makes sense. This mattered to you.
Oh yeah, and that phrase works in all kinds of situations.
That's what I'm thinking, like, yeah, even beyond a breakup. I've even thinking, gosh, with my kids, that's such a good one for them to have as well. Of course you're feeling this way about being left out, you know, and not being invited over to this one friend's house. That makes sense and it validates their feelings.
I literally just did it as I was talking, because as I was moving, I noticed, like, I'm sweating through this shirt, and I'm like, of course you are. You sweat when you're excited and when you're nervous, and of course I'm like, both of those things are true. I'm really excited to be here. I love speaking, and of course I'm nervous. I love sharing what I do, but it's such an honor to be able to share this with your audience.
Well, and I think too, I was looking at it as like, of course in certain negative situations or things where you might be let down, but I think the horse could work too when there's something really exciting, like you were saying, of course your body is acting in this way because of this, and then it helps you then have control of like, oh, of course you're feeling a little nervous right now before you're about to go
do this, it's because it's important to you. Yeah, And then it's like, oh yeah, and it can acknowledge that those emotions are there, and then you can turn that nervous energy into something positive.
Yeah. I'm trying to like shortcut so that I don't let the shame come in of Oh, how embarrassing. I'm sweating through my shirt. I'm human, I get like I know, but of course, like I also carry shame, and so instead of going down the shame road, I go down the of course road and it feels better. Well. I love that.
I think that is good advice because I would bet if March is a popular time to break up. Somebody is going to be listening to this in March that needs this. Are there ways to prepare yourself emotionally if you sense like a breakup is coming, Like maybe someone's literally listening to this right now and they're like, I am just picking up on vibes that a breakup is on the horizon.
There are two things there. One it kind of ties back to the uncomfortable conversation we were having about the young man taking the girl out to dinner and having the conversation face to face instead of a text message. If you're sensing it and this is the person you love, maybe have the uncomfortable conversation and call it out of I'm feeling less connected to you or I'm feeling something has shifted. Can we talk about what's happening and be
brave and have the conversation. But the other piece of that, the part that you really can control, is how you're going to respond. And I think the most important thing to do to prepare is to practice having your own back, practice knowing I'm going to be okay no matter what happens. And this is something I really had to build a lot of reps. I had to do a lot of
practice of this. For me, this was a really weak muscle, and I think about what are the ways I can let myself know I'm going to be okay no matter what, if I fail, if the relationship ends, if he never wants to see me again, I'm going to be okay. And it's not dependent on him. It's not dependent on the relationship. So how can I strengthen that for myself?
I love that reminder of knowing that you are truly going to be okay, and it may not feel that way when it first happens. But that's the great thing about this is in preparation, you can get ahead of it. If you're sensing that something might be coming, and if you're blindsided by it, you're going to feel that way as well. But I would just like to I could be a story of hope, as there is light on
the other side. And to go back to the cocoon butterfly example and the turning to mush is if you truly believe that that person is for you, and there's nothing else for you out there and you're never going to find anybody, then that's where you're going to stay. Stuck like you'll forever be stuck in your little cocoon, and that's going to be very isolating and lonely and sad, and I don't want that for you. It's like the
Henry Ford quote. Whether you think you can or you think you can't, you're right.
Yeah.
So if you think there is nobody else out there for you, then yeah, stay in your little cocoon. That's exactly what's going to.
Happen for you.
But if you believe that you can emerge from this stronger and healthier and more beautiful than ever before, then you're right, you can, but it's going to take the work. Otherwise you're just going to be stuck in that little cocoon. I love that image in my mind right now.
I will say that's why a coach is amazing, because sometimes we only have a glimmer of that for ourselves. But if you're working with the right person, they get to hold the whole picture of I see the butterfly of what's possible on the other side, and I'm going to hold the whole picture and I'm going to help you through the process. I love that.
What is one mindset shift? I love a good mindset shift. Is there one a particular that makes a huge difference.
Yeah. I like to think about this like you're making a cake and the very first cake you made probably wasn't very good. You probably got the balance wrong, and you've maybe like got the ingredients all or you didn't quite get the science of it right. And then maybe you had a cake that you made that was amazing, and you've tried it again over and over and over again.
These are all of our relationships, are all these attempts at baking a cake, And each time you do it, you learn a little bit more and you start finding the more you do it, you start finding what is the right balance that I really like. And sometimes we need the balance of that bitterness with the sweet. We need, you know, that hit of that bitter coffee with the
chocolate to make the chocolate taste richer. So I like to think about this stuff that you're going through is that bitterness and it's going to make the sweet so much better and it's going to add so much depth to the life that you're baking right now.
Oh, I love that so much. You know. Earlier, right when we first started talking, you mentioned your love journey and keeping little bits and pieces from each relationship, not because you want something with that person down the line in any way that relationship is over, but it's part of your love journey. And that's the cake. It's all parts of your love journey being mixed together to make something really yummy and beautiful and tasty. And I think
of how much I learned from my marriage ending. I don't know that I learned much from relationships before that, because I got married in my young to mid twenties, and my serious relationship before that was in college, and I don't know that I learned that much, Like I wasn't in a place of learning and growth. I think I just went through the heartache and didn't really walk
with much. But from my marriage, fast forward seventeen years of that relationship and then in my forties, if I'm getting into another relationship wanting it to be as healthy as possible, I knew that I was going to have to do the work on myself. And as I am in a new relationship now, I like that I have that vision now of me in the kitchen with all my different ingredients baking my cake and all parts of what I am bringing to the table now are important
in building my cake. And I learned so much.
Yes, you learned so much. And I think as we get older, we also start learning to embrace all the parts of ourself. And I guess it doesn't translate so much into baking. It's more like cooking, but you think of like salty and sweet, balancing and new mommy and depth of flavor. And as we embrace all those parts of ourself, it makes you a full person.
Yeah, And thankfully I put in the work to learn from my failures in the relationship and then also my partners parts of our relationship that were very unhealthy, and it was very hard, Like I remember just wanting to be so far away from all of it because I was like, this is just all so hard, this hurts so much. But now I think of who I am and what I can bring to the table because of
that pain that I went through. And I also know it was painful too, because it was a relationship that meant a lot to me and I never thought I would get divorced right when I got married. That just
was not an option at all. And so then, you know, speaking of shame, you mentioned that earlier, I carried that around with me of like, oh, now I'm divorced and that was never supposed to be a part of my story and I've got two kids, but now it's like, oh, so much of that is a part of what makes up my cake.
Yeah.
So if you just had one piece of advice, I know you've got a lot of wisdom that you pass along to clients and if you're doing interviews like this, but if there was just one piece of advice to someone that is struggling right now to let go of somebody, what's that one piece of advice that you would give them.
My one piece of advice is that you are so much more powerful than you know, and you are capable of so much more than you know, and you have wonderful gifts that you need to share with the world. And the time that you are spending stuck, it's keeping those gifts and your power from really radiating out and from you shining your light. And we need your light
right now. And if it's hard to stop looking backwards, start looking where your feet are right now and where your heart is right now, and be there for yourself right now. It might be hard to look at a future. It might be hard to look forward, but take care of you right now today, in this moment, start right here.
Dolly Pardon has a quote that's the way I see it. If you want the rainbow, you got to put up with the rain. I love that, and it's just such a good one. It's a good one because we're all going to go through storms and rainbows are such a beautiful thing that we get to enjoy. But it is after the rain. It is after a storm, and if you stay stuck inside, you may miss the rainbow.
The butterfly comes after the goo.
That's right. That's Sarah's quote. So Dolly's quote is the rainbow after the rain, and I think I can get on board with the butterfly comes after the goop. That's such a good one.
Sarah.
Where can people find you? If they want to learn more about what you offer and what you.
Do, they can come follow me on Instagram. I'm at Sarah Cronol's so just my name all one word or I wanted to offer a little freak to your listeners because I know this conversation has been so deep. I have a free guide of ten journal prompts that they can do and they can download that at top ten journal prompts dot com.
I'll also link it in the show notes and Sarah spells her last name see you are Innoles, so that'll be linked there. We love a good journal prompt Sarah's got ten of them, and journaling is one of the ways that you can let go of an X. I'm sure those prompts help people process that and surrender, let it go.
They'll take what we started here and it'll go a lot deeper.
And then apparently I love fire because then after your journal I'm probably gonna be like, and then go ahead and burn it, do it.
Release it, send that up to the ether.
Yeah, there you go. Well, Sarah, thank you for this conversation. Break up Detox. I think that this is something that will definitely come in handy and unfortunately maybe for more people this month then others, but at least people can now be as prepared as possible and have hope that they're going to be okay. Absolutely, thank you, Sarah, bye bye.
Thank you so much for having me