Kenny Aronoff

Chicago to do a the Chicago Drum Show. It's it's with a lot of drummers perform, and I don't do as many of those anymore. But what I'm gonna do, I'm one of the feature drummers, is I'm gonna use my I'm gonna perform, but I'm also doing a kind of a teamwork speech, because it really is what drummers are. We serve songs, we serve artists, we serve bands, and so I have a whole multimedia thing I do. So I perform, but I have the whole show. I have

a whole show. Okay, you put it together yourself. You have a consultant. No I put together myself, but I've been working with about four or five years ago. I decided to start getting into the speaking thing, you know, and like anything else, okay, with your motivation giving back or money or both making money and giving and giving back. Wisdom is that. Okay, I'm just getting all the story.

So anyway, I because that's so important to me. I decided, and I've been doing these drum clinics for like thirty five years, but now it's more about inspiration. When I wrote my autobiography, I came with all these things and with the bottom lines, I'm gonna go do that and fly back Sunday night. Monday. I pack and then I go on the road for six weeks with Fogerty NonStop and zz Top together. It's a great package, most of the East Coast and a little bit in the Midwest.

Then I come home for two days and then I go to Europe for three weeks with my own band called Supersonic Blues Machine featuring Billy Gibbons, and the two albums I made was Supersonic uh. You know, we feature like guitar players like Billy Gibbons, Steve Lucasur, Eric Garrells, Walter Trout, Robin Ford, Warren Haynes, I really to be honest with you, and I don't really want to go on the voad for nine weeks. I mean, you know, I have a wife at home and i'd like to.

This is the first time I ever said that, you know, I always like, well whatever, But so yeah, that's a pretty crazy schedule. On top of which, you know, I'm editing a book, another book, and I gotta keep his speaking thing going, and I'm just dealing with lots of business sessions and all this stuff while I'm on the road. Now do you like this level of chaos? Well, I definitely have been addicted to it most of my life.

I'm just starting at my right as we were talking about how we're now seven, kind of getting into mm hmmm, how do I want to manage my time? You know what? You know, one of my one of the things that mean the most to me, and I'm trying to filter on my time and what I do in today towards those things. Now, let's let's assume you were home for a week, or let's say you went to a desert island for a week. Would you freak out or would you say, God, it's great to have a week off

for the first time. I would what I would do and one day I can't take a whole day off, but but I can knowing that I have some time during the day to have off. Then I you know, I always have work with me. So it kind of like I reward myself. I work a little bit. I just won't work as much as I would in the past, or I just work all day and then just look out at the beach. Now I want to get on the beach, you know, or hang out and go shopping with my wife or whatever it is. It's just relaxes

the mind. And you know, I always have to be when I get on a plane. There's two things I do well, three things sleep, uh, my office, and I like to watch movies, you know, so like watch the bomby iPad, you're download, No, I do well more and more becoming that you know you're on United and then they say download appened. Then you get more more, but then fifty percent time it doesn't work right. It's like like, well,

the big thing now you know it's Netflix. You can download to the iPad, so you don't have to worry about a connection. So, uh, how far out are you booked?

I'm booked you already. Someone tried to book me. They're trying to book me to be the musical director for this event in two thousand nineteen, and I'm trying to hire Sammy Hagar to do it with me, because then I've been getting into this musical director type thing where you know, a huge, you know, wealthy you guy wants to put on this huge event and I end up being a musical director, and which is It's tedious and a lot of work, everything from monitors to you know,

the schematics of of the each band and how many mikes and how high the stage is and or how hi the risers. I mean, it's just everything. So what did your wife say about being on the road all the time. Well, we haven't been on the road six weeks or nine weeks since we met, which was thirteen years ago, so we're not looking forward to that at all. But um, she is fin you up a three year

nursing school. This nursing program is like med school. It's I've never seen anything like It's it's kind of caite my first marriage. I was with somebody who was in law school, and I thought that was insane. Now I'm I'm in my my marriage with my wife and I'm watching to go through this. I just would like to be here with her, but it is what it is. Well, we'll get We'll be fine. And did your first marriage break up because you were on the road? Oh yeah, Oh my god, dude, I was. I was the model

rock and roll guy. Just debauchery. I mean, look at my My book is called Sex Drums Rocking Roll, but probably back then it might have had a little bit of sex, drugs rocking roll. I mean we were I was with Mellencamp and we went in eight years from playing in clubs to arenas uh and sold out three and sixty uh you know seats, you know, no opening act, three hours show. So we were young. Audience was young. Girls were throwing their bars underwear at us. I mean,

you do the math. You're on the road for right, we should come home for a week, you go go back out for eight weeks and you eat this NonStop. I mean maybe other people the difference today is they say, is today their cell phone cameras? So I don't think you can probably get away with a lot of that behole, no way, no, never mind, the me too movement. Oh tell me about it. I mean I should be in jail because for just you know, I mean when when what's his name? And I'll frank, you know, put his

hand on something. Girls, how many times I did that? But we were laughing. Everybody was laughing about it, you know, the girls. I talked to the girls women, because they're not young spintin. They'll go like this, I take pictures with my hands up in the air now, and I don't sue me. Don't sue me. They go like, I'll sue you if you don't touch me. That's the other side. Okay, I'm not clutching that because I'm being caught in the across. I'm I'm But the thing is what you're talking about too.

It's like, man, you could be a picture and this happened before, where I just you know, you've had a couple of glass wine and you just or take can a picture, but your hand goes around the way so you're pulling in a little close and you could look at the picture and go like wow. But when you were doing it was just like ah, yeah, come here, you know, like letting up in the moment kind of moment, but with no motivation or any any agenda. But the picture tells the story, as Rod Stewart once sang, So

you're from western Massachusetts. What was it like growing up in the fifties and sixties and western mass You know stock Bridge? Right? I do? But my audience doesn't, all right, Well that I just want to let them know that. You know, so the stock Bridge, as you know, is a was a very unique place to grow up. Um in Western Masster were all these little towns three miles apart, and I grew up in the hippest, coolest of them all, Stockbridge.

Uh you know, we had a summer stock theater right down the half a mile down the hill from me. So we I mean I was hanging out with Anne Bancroft and h you know, Franklin Jell And when he was just making it they're doing summer stock. How do you end up hanging out with them? Well? Oh kay, that's a good question. The real reason why I met

is because in that area they had summer stock. Bill Gibson, who wrote The Miracle Worker, lived in stock Which and I went to school with his son, and uh, He was friends with Arthur Penn, who was a director who had done I think he directed Bill Gibson's play Golden Boys on Broadway. He convinced our dependent build a house on the same street in stock which is is a building.

I know, I'm jumping, I have it. Didn't Arthur Penn direct Alice's restaurant, just you know, right, okay, But going back to um So, Arthur Penn builds a house on your street, on the street. And and ironically, my brother lives on that street. Identical twindentical twin who's a doctor. And this is like a dirt road. I mean when I say street, there might be like eight houses on it, you know. And it's in woods and everything in pond and you know, and your parents do what for a living?

And my mom was a school teacher. My dad worked for Peter J. Swite suits to the division of Kimberley claud There were these paper mills that ran My dad was studied chemistry and his specialty was in paper. And there are these mills that would run there was a river that would run down Vermont, New Hampshire into Massachusetts and Connecticut. They had these mills and and in the town over three miles away, which is radically different than my town as far as uh it was more like

we called it them. It was like one of the Greaser's, the tough guys. But they had the mill there, and so my dad would commute three miles a day down down. That's why he moved to western Massachusetts job. It was either that or they we're gonna go to um Minnesota. My mom went from she's from New York and went, well, no, at least Stockbridge is two and a half hours from New York Minnesota. So but anyway, so I'm I'm at my my friend Tommy's house on the street, the Gibsons,

and I remember it was my turn. He had a house a little they had a little cottage, and we would jam and play rock and roll out there, you know, probably smoke a little pot was thirteen, and we had the black lights, and it was my turn to go down to the house and sneak some beers out of

the fridge. I go down there, I'm a little buzz, grabbed two or three beers, and all of a sudden, Mrs Gibson, his mom, who's the therapist, says, Kenny, is that You're like, oh shit, I'm busted, and I screamed, put the beers baxtures, come out of here and say

hi to everybody. They're having a dinner on a porch at night, the candles and the wines going, and there is a Bancroft, Mel Gibson and Franklin No not Mel gives it wait Mel Brooks so and they would come up and do Summer stock just to get out of the city. That's how it all tied. And then I eventually was in a musical there. And you know, my mom loved the theater because she grew up New York,

so she was always getting his tickets. And then she'd get she knew Arthur pen and then we'd be backstage meeting Richard Dreyfus or whoever, Goldie Han, whoever was there acting and and and then you mentioned this Alice's Restaurant. There was this little diner in stock Bridge, and I was in fifth grade. I was a little kid trying to hang out with these kind of cool guy people,

and there was this lady called Alice's. Yeah, this little diner, and then she uh eventually hooked up with all these people would come in there like Arlo Guthrie and all the hippies, and and the famous story about Alice's restling for the audience is that they eventually got this church in Housatonic, another little town three miles away on the river, and they got this church and they lived in it like hippies, like you know, Woodstock was only two hours away.

So they all had they had this famous Thanksgiving and they had all this garbage and they didn't know what to do with it. So they put it in uh the v W bus, a hippie v W bus, right and loaded up. They go to the dump, but the dump is is closed, so they know what to do that. They're all stone and high and they just dump it on the side of the road down an embankment. Now, my best friend's dad was the chief of police, officer Obie, you remember that was my This this big menacine cop.

And he finds out that this is gardenge. Ok, we're getting the real story story for the song is they just dumped on a day you couldn't dump. Did they put it in the dump or they put it on the side of the road, not in the dump, Not in the dump because they couldn't get in and This was like an embankment, like the road and then there's the guard rail and then it goes drops down on a grassy hill. They saw it there, but they don't you know, they're their names were on letters they had picked.

I mean it was the evidence was there in the movie. And I don't know if this is too. In the movie they say they have to submit the evidence of the judge and he's blind. That had to be a joke, I would think, so I can that. Yeah, So anyway, and so they didn't. They just were told to clean up your mess. And they ended up bringing it all the way down to the barge in New York City for whatever reason they before they dumped it and so Arlo Guthie wrote a song called Alice's Restaurant, which we

can it was a funny story with great lyrics. Arlot lives in that area. Arthur Penn thought it was time to make a movie out of this whole scene. And then I was I could have been in it, but I was like, no, that's not cool. Okay, before the song comes out, because I'm growing up, like you know, hour and twenty away whatever, I know about it from the song, But did you know about it when it happened. Oh yeah, it was a big deal. Oh yeah, it was a big deal. They were my I kind of

looked up to all those guys. They were all older than me and and I thought they were the coolest, and you know, I was. I wanted to be part of their gang. But I couldn't drive. Alan was a bicycle, and you know, so I was kind of I always go to the restaurant because it was like just a mile from my house and just get on my bike or walked down. It was a food any good killer. It was like it was like a real diner, a

cool diner. In Alice was a great cook, and she eventually created Alice Is at Avalok, which was right above tang Wood in Lennox on the Hill. She took over the whole place became the Coose Restaurant hun And you know, Okay, so you're growing up. Your mother is into theater. Did she make you take piano lessons? Yeah? What they age? Did you start piano lessons? Well, it started when I can't remember. She put each one of us on her

lap and she teach us a song. And each each kid who was I had my brother, twin brother, and my sister was four years younger. We learned these songs and then you know, she was of the back down everybody. You know, if you're gonna be musical or be a well rounded kid, you studied piano. But one day I'm it's like nineteen sixty four and I'm outside playing with my brother and my mom screams at us to come in the house. I thought I was in trouble, but

I wasn't. On our black and white r c A TV set with the rabbit ears and the tinfoil, you know, was he had Salivan show guess Who. And I'm sitting there looking at these four guys with long hair. I could not I was. I was bouncing off the walls. I was. I couldn't believe what I was seeing. It was, I said, man who? These guys said, well, those are the Beatles. And I was enamored by ringo stars, do rum kids, it and the whole thing. And I literally naively asked my mom to call him up and get

me in the band. I had no other I did. I didn't know any other way to do it. Well, pause briefly and get right back to Kenny Aaronoff, recorded live in the tune In Studios in Venice, California. This podcast is brought to you by tune In, which brings together all the live, sports, music, news and podcasts you love, original, live and on demanded audio, all in one place. Go to tune in dot com slash left sense to download and listen. Now more with legendary drummer Kenny Aaronoff. Were

you a big fan of music? Were you listening on the transistor? The big thing was my parents always had jazz and classical music on the turntable, you know, and they and show tunes because from New York, you know, it was like you just show tunes, you know, and musicals and you know, West Side Story and this story and that story, you name it. It was there and

they would take us. I don't know if you knew this, but in Lennox they had obviously the bost pontif New Orchestra, but they had this thing called Music in and in sixties had a huge jazz uh program up there, and I would go up there. Uh. It was somebody thought of, you know, let's let's create a program out of the city. Get out of New York in the summer and go

to the Booshers, and they created a whole thing. And I'd see Dave blue Back every summer, Ray Charles, I'd see Charles mingus h. I wish I had seen Coltrane and el Fitzgerald, all these great jazz us, And so I was right there. Man, Okay, so you see the Beatles. How do you get a drum? Kid? I couldn't. I couldn't afford it. So my mom goes down to New York Manny's of course, gets a snare drum. How don't

she know to go to Manny's. Somebody told her somebody because they were in that whole circle of music and and they knew a lot of New Yorkers. This guy, Dick Cats, was a jazz pianist who actually lived in a house in summer and he was studying at the music in he was doing taking workshops and giving workshops. Who says Manny's is the place to go because there was not really a drum shop there. Definitely wanted maybe there was a music store in our area, but not

not not in stock but that's for sure. It was like three times over. So we're down there. My mom goes listen to my kid wants to she says, Mrs Aaronoff, here's a snare um. You buy this snare at um. If he doesn't like it in three months or six months, you bring it back and we'll give you your money back.

Who does that? I don't remember. I just remember going to me and he's you know, other than seeing the young Gene Cornish there and then all other famous musicians as a young kid, they would buy and sell stuff so fast you would save your money for a guitar and they go, what do you want feder strata caster? Okay, bring it down? How about this? How much money you got in your wallet? Touch? As they said today, how

much money you got in your wall? I'm like what they would They would push you in and out right exactly, dude. It was like ruthless. It's like I was nervous when I get in there, absolutely like they do the right thing, you know, I know. Okay, So you got the snare drum and then I got a symbol and I stood up and played. Okay, did you take lessons? Well you know that in no, not high school in uh junior huh even less than that, like up to grade six times.

That music teacher that taught everybody ever or there used to be. That's what instructor exactly, That's what I called him, right right, So band instructor, and he kind of taught me how the hold the sticks, and he needed he saw that I was in the drums and it was boring. Man. I had to plan a pad and learned to read, and it was like not fun, was not the Beatles. As far from the Beatles as you give me, so I would. But but that was the beginning of me, you know, trying to read. Trying to to me was

like and and and and move forward. In the high school and junior I had nothing to do with the marching band and nothing that wasn't cool. I was playing at clubs, playing Hendricks and the Stones and Beatles and stuff like that. Why would I want to listen to a squeaky clarinet? Okay, so you have your snare, drum and a symbol. At what point do you form a band? Well, right away it was called the Alley Cats, and uh actually have a picture not on me, but and I

stand up and play. And then for Christmas or Hanuka or whatever. Basically you had the band. Did the band play any gigs? The first gig. There was a thing

called the Grange meeting. And what the Grange meeting was all the elderly's of stock Bridge would meet once a month at the town hall and they discussed how to keep the the the looks and the vibe of Stockbridge, you know, preserved, you know, to say, you know, they go over things and the month, and the mother of the piano player, she wasn't too elderly, but she was part of the Grange meeting, said wow, would you like to have my boy and he and his band come

down and entertain us. We get a call and we think we're up playing mass and square guard parents, you know, throw my Snares symbol in the in the station wag and we go down. We set up and to me it was like I was on the Sulvan Show. I mean it was like and we're playing, you know, all these Beatles songs and a couple of Beach Boys songs. We get done. It was maybe five songs and everyone's up dancing and all going like that's what they'd call a rock band, Like it was new, that's that's that's

what the Beatles do. You know, it was this new thing. And we get done, and I'm shutting my eyes and picturing the whole thing. I'm in complete love and flipped out about this. And they said, do you know any more songs? And we said no, So we played the same five again. Wow. Wow, I thought the story was gonna go opposite. You were playing for the town elders and they were gonna say springtime for Hitler and get all the sting. So okay, So that was the beginning.

So when do you get a full drum kid? Well, the next Christmas hun a good time, you know, I got a base from next birthday. I got a Floria toime next and I saved up my money for the rack time. I just put it together slowly but sure. And I still have that kid and the funny stories that snared him. Um. When I got older, it was a kind of it only has six lugs, and when you only have six lugs, the standard is ten maybe eight. It was six because the less lugs and more ringky

the drummers. For jazz drummers, that's you don't play loud and you want lots of tone and dynamics and you control every with your hands. So that was interesting at a six lug and I realized it wasn't really good rock and roll drum, so I gave it to some kid for a couple of bags of homegrown pot. Now check this out. Whenever became famous, that kid, Carl Landa emails me and goes, Kenny, I was about to sell you snare them on eBay? Would you like to buy

it back? So when I call up a guy who knows about buying and selling old drums, just it's probably worth four to six hundred dollars. So I bought the thing back for four dollars. Wow. How many drum sets do you have? Well, I've had. I've been up as much as fourteen. But I'm starting to get rid of them because it just takes up too much space. They'm not going to use them. And your original drums were Ludwig, just like Ringo tweeted the other day that it's fifty

five years since he got his first Ludwig. Kid, And what do you play now? Tom? I've been with Tom of thirty five years. What's the real difference between drums? Definitely the manufacturing if if first of all, if any company can't make a good sounding drum now, they shouldn't be in the business. It's not rocket science anymore. It is a formula. But you know, um, the thing I like about tomah whose they came on strong. It was a family run business and out of Japan, and their

hardware was extraordinary. They're very creative and innovative company. And they they they're a little in common and they and I was blown away. And then it was Billy come from mahavishn Orchestra, Alvin Jones, Uh, all these different cool drummers literally de Vito from Billy Joel. Uh didn't be. I really dug their roster and then I played their equipment and it was unbelievable. It just sounded great. Now almost every company has a great sounding drum. But the consistency,

they've never let me down. At any level of drum, whether it's for the beginner, the quality is extremely high. Uh. And they believe you know you don't you know, you don't be cheap in any level on anything. And that's how you get somebody to fall in love with your product. And as they graduate up to the expensive kids, you know that they're committed. And uh, yeah, I could leave time. I remember a lot of companies tried to grab him

when I was big like Pearl. They I was a Nashville recording a lot down there and the Pearl which headquarters there. They brought me in they wanted they were trying to offer me to switch, and I said, look it, unless you offer me something that Tom has already given me, I can't. I'm not gonna leave a company for a lateral move. It's gotta be something. What is there? I mean, more advertising now I get I'm I'm I get plenty of advertising, more drum clinics and maybe guaranteed, you know,

but I'm on tour all the time. You know, it didn't make sense. Okay, Um, I'm just thinking a question about the drums that fascinated me, but it eludes me right this very second. But ultimately you get hooked in with Tanglewood and you go to Boston to be taught drums. Why don't you tell my audience about that? Well, when I was a kid, there was no school rock and in our family everybody went to college and I was a given. Um. You know, post World War Two. You know,

my dad, my grandparents came from Russia. Education education. My dad gets an education. But before you can even really get starready, flying bombers over Berlin, bombing the ship out of Hitler at last fifty And when did you find out about? Uh? Pretty young, because he had these books where he was he was the navigator and bomba deere. I had pictures of like the pictures that scrap books of, you know, Bombay's opening and bombs going down and what

do you talked about it? Not really, you know, but but I I still I have his suit, his his uh whatever he was, you know, I have the Sudi war um and uh, my my brother has all his all those pictures and you know, and my brother smartly. They were ten people in these these big, huge bombers, and they started that the whole Spielberg type of thing. They would get together every year. They still probably are, but you know, there's only a few left. And there

were six people in that plane of his. That's out of the ten that were still alive when they started doing this. Then there was four and the last three, ironically was pilot, co pilot and navigator my dad. And then we were all the guys up front last week. So my brother says, I gotta get this on film. So he goes and he does seventeen CDs or DVDs worth of filming interviewing these guys and my brother's psychoanas. So he came at it from an interesting standpoint. The

night they get down there. The next day is that like the two the weekends UH convention, my dad almost dies. He has goes into spasms and they have to bring the hospital and eventually they put a a pacemaker in the defiberator. I think he may have had the pacemaker, but he needed a defibrillator that would have he He lived, but he could have died. And my dad said, no, no, no, no, film filmed these guys and will film me later. And that's what he did. So um amazing, I mean the stories,

I mean from their perspective. I'm almost dying. My dad said he saw more planes go down. You just get in formation and there'll be nine of them. I think you take off, uh. And these planes were put together with spit and glue. They they were they was the first. That was the beginning of the air force and they but they had to do it to to beat the crap out of Hitler because he was taking over the

whole world. So um, they get in formation and and the first plane would send off at a colored flare of some sort, so you knew you had to be with the squadron of yellow. And they get all these nine planes up and they get in formation, and my brother asked the pilot, you know who might maybe was twenty at that time flying, how did you I mean you you know, the flag was coming up from below and they were blowing out planes out of the sky.

You see your buddies plane go. You see. It was just absolute hell and explosions and planes were getting beat up. And he said, how did you stay focused? He says, Mo, My job was. I just looked at the coordinates I had to go. I just ignored life or death. This is where I have to go. That's my job. Do it. And they survived a couple of times they almost had they were running out of gas and they are One time the bomber deer the bombay opened up and all

my dad's navigation plans went. You know how he navigated him stars? Wow, the stars. He had to learn about the stars in case that happened. Thank god they were high enough that you can see. And then they had to you know, he's using protractors and slide rules. I remember high school chemistry. I gave up science after the slide rules. You know they have calculators now. So anyway, but you end up going to Boston for so what happened was, Yeah, in high school, I saw my buddy

Tommy Gibson was getting better on drums. Uh you know Bill Gibson's son, and I was like, God, what are you doing? He said, Oh, I'm studying with the percussions from the Boston Symphony Orchestra. Are depressed when I want to do that. So I go down in the summer, you know they're there, but in the winter he's in Boston. So I get a bus, grahound bus to go down there, and I go to Arthur's house. He says, what's your name? Very menacing, slightly whiplash style, you know, like kid, what's

your name? I said, Kenny? Kenny? What Kenny arnofs? What have you prepared for me today? I'm like, what Tommy didn't tell me about preparing? He said, do you play marimbus? Is? No, Well, if you prepared a timpany piece for me? Said, I've never played timpany and I'm just getting smaller and small. He find says, what do you place I played drum sets as well. Let's come down stairs and I'll have you play some drum set. So he puts on spinning

wheels by blood, sweat and tears. In thirty seconds, he pulls me off the chair and he points to a rubber practice pad. That was the definitive moment where it's like I don't need this, but something told me inside me that I do. And that was the beginning of some severe discipline and you know the winner. I didn't practice a lox. There was a lesson every month, but in the summer when he was gonna be there every week and he's yelling at you and screaming at you,

I started practice. So then when I was starting to go to college, there was no School of Rocks, so I started auditioning, you know Western mass you know college so I could be near home. And I get into University of Massachusetts, and I had I prepared something on vibes because my dad got a set of vibes for me second hand at Carol's Music Shop in New York for like three hundred bucks. Had vibes and uh My,

Tommy had timpany. At practiced on timpany and I barely got into u mass and that's the fear of of of failure. The day I graduated high school, I started practicing eight hours a day, seven days a week because I was terrified to fail. And I was terrified I was gonna be way behind. And I was I got to school. All these kids that were in marching band and symphony orchestra that reading skills were better, they could follow conductors. I was a rocker, you know, and so

I was terrified and the fear of failure. I would practice to they throw me out of the building every night. And it gets better because I'm starting to get better, you know. And to teach you the reason why he actually with this. If all happened, if your parents had not insisted you go to college, Jess, I don't know what I would have done. Probably I would have gone anywhere because everybody was doing that. Everybody was going to college, he said. But it wasn't an issue of saying, funk this.

I just want to play in a rock band. No, because I had no business model. Living in stock which we didn't have. There was nobody who had done it. If I lived in New York, maybe I wouldn't done it, but there was no business. Mom. I was like, how do you do this? I realized that my mom wasn't gonna get in touch of the Beatles, you know, I realized I was I had no business. Okay. And when you're going to college with what goal? Just to get a degree or to then play in a rock band

or whatever, good good, good question. My brain was saying, you get into a symphony orchestra. My heart was saying in a rock band. And I always was playing in rock bands, jazz bands, R and B bands, any band, any music was fun. I just did whatever anybody. I wasn't selective. I just as long as I was playing, I was having a blast. And how did you slept the drums around all the time? Not an issue? I don't care. Somebody had a car. I didn't have a car until I got out of college. Somebody always had

a car or something. We picked them up. They wanted me, They get me in the drums. Okay. So you're practicing eight hours a day at mass, the eight hours a day at home, they getting new mass, and then you got full load of academics and music. And so I practiced the wee hours a night. And there was his hot cellis is how does a cellis can be in orchestra? And uh, she I heard going to Aspen this summer. She was a junior and what's asking? So oh that,

but Juilliard has this incredible program at Aspen. So I find out, I get the papers and I audition and uh um, I don't hear from them. And it's the end of the the the the school year, and I I'm to go home. I got my dad station wag and I got all my stuff and I got I'm gonna study with Arthur Press again, and I got our Almond Brothers type band and uh and so I'm a head about two miles out of town. I go, oh, kid,

I forgot my mail. I go back and went I said, it looks like I gotta check, and I open it up. It's you are accepted to AskMen. I think I was an alternate because there's two weeks before, so I go there. I am the absolute, by far, the worst percussious, Sarah. These guys were playing remember and Timpani and the Juili Yard Youth Orchestra when they were in diapers, and they

were a monster. Now the teacher there was this incredible, brilliant man George Gabor, who taught at Indiana University, number one school and music in the country, and um, I'm blown away by this guy's head. You know, his whole thought process, his whole he was way deeper than just playing percussion. So I said, I want to I want to go to Indiana University study with you. He said, come back in January and audition. I went to No. One audition. Now demanded an audition. He had to find

a faculty from four different departments from Indiana. That's the rule. You have to audition for four different faculty head department heads to get in so that it's not one sided. And they happened to be up there. They were all part of the asaid a lot of Indiana professors would teacher. I get in and for four years I busted my asset. Okay, So how many years have you done at you mass?

One year? You mass forward Indiana and every spring I would audition to get into tang Wood, which is in my backyard, which is the number one student orchestra in the country, and it's run by the Boston Symbiy Orchestra. And the cool thing about being an orchestra you get conducted by all the conductors that conduct the Boston Symphony Orchestra. So I auditioned one year for Vic Firth my you know the timperest and uh I strike out miserably. Next year I come back. Did you have stage fight or

you were good enough both? I was nervous man, and end up doing that summer uh starry with Arthur Press and had my own fusion band. I never ever stopped practicing, massively, practicing and um. And then what what is it when a drummer practice is what do they do well on? Remember there were scales, and they're there a tunes and melodies and and arpeggios and technical things. Then I do that for like maybe two hours or two or three hours,

and over the timpany the same thing technical exercises. Then you're learning uh A tunes and melodies that have been written specifically for the timpany tuning, and then you play along with symphony uh you know, um, symphonies, you know by you know Beetho. And I remember one of the questions that alluded me when they say tuning drums, how

do you tune a drum? Well, the the whole concept is that the shell on top and bottom has where the shell ends as a bearing edge, and you can sharpen those edges at a forty five or sixty degree angle. The sharper, the more aggressive the drum sounds. The rounder the edge, the more you have a bigger tuning range and it's a little bit warmer sounding. Then you have a head that you put on, and that's a whole variable.

Then there's this uh, steel or metal hoop that goes over the head that's just a little bit wider than the shell. And in that hoop there might be eight six on a tom maybe six lugs snared them eight or ten lugs. And lugs are just like screws, and on the shell are these little casings that will receive the screws. And you're basically the concept. You're trying to bring this hoop down on top of the head, tighten

that head down on that bearing edge evenly. When you do it evenly, you get your shooting to get one tone, one bing up by like that you want boom. So what I do is I tuned the bottom head first fingertight, get the lugs down, then I start turning equal turns, like maybe with a tuning a drum key half turn, half turn all the way around, half turn, half turn all the way around, and listen to feel how the tightness.

Maybe do a quarter turn quarter turn stop there. Then I put the top head on and I start tuning it up, and I'm using my ears. I've got this technical ability, but I'm really using my ears now at this point, when does it start to sound good? I'd like to have both the top and bottom head the same pitch, because then the drum sounds like one note, don't and each drum does have a sweet spot where it sounds the best. Let's say Thomas shipped you a drum kit. How long would it take you to get it?

Twee you're satisfied. Oh, I could probably get it pretty good in thirty minutes. But I'm like a speed demon on it. Uh. You know when I do these drums seminars um and they have a new kid, I tell them ahead of time, get the heads on, get it tuned as good as you can, and I come in and tweak it real fast. I'll check the bottom head first of Melia and go like, wamen, this is too tight, bring it down. Then I started bringing the top head up or down to the start sound like, and I

keep tweaking sometimes just one. Now, if you hear a weird garden good, a weird vibration, I'll feel around and they might be a head could have a flaw and it's a little not tight on the on the baring edge, and so I have to tune that particular lug tighter. Okay. And when you go to the studio, usually in the old days, you go to a big studio, the first thing they're doing is getting the drums sound of tuning the drums. Are they when they talk about tuning the drums,

they talk about the same thing you're talking about. Yeah, I just want to get the You want to get the drums to sound the best that those drums can sound. And if I if, if you're doing it like my my well known snare sound from the eighties with Mellencamp had a ring to it. We would tune after every take. We we had a recording of that pitch and we'd retune to snare at them to get it back to

that pitch. So it was consistent. So if you were splicing between takes, you had the same tuning then then, But but a lot of times I'd go into sessions and people like, wow, what's that ring? And I'm like, that's Kenny aaron Off and they go, well, can you put a tape on it? I'm like, I don't care, I'm sure whatever, and I would go. At one point, I was showing up in l A with hundred scenario dooms just because I thought more was more. Now I have my own signature series. I only need about really

six scenaridoms I gotta covered. You're listening to my conversation with legendary drummer Kenny Aaronoff, recorded live at the tune In Studios in Venice, California. I hope you're enjoying this episode of the Bob Left Sets Podcast. If you want to see photos and videos of Kenny Aaronoff and the tune In Studios, go to at tune In on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram. Now more of legendary drummer Kenny aaron Off

on The Bob Left Sets Podcast. Okay, occasionally you're in the studio and the producers say, oh, I want to rent this specific drum kit, now your your level? It does that ever happen? Rarely? It's occasionally like they want or you go in new studio and this is where the producer always works. And the drums this is this is what we like to use, or all my dubb but they really want Kenny Aronoff complete. Then you have me bring my drums, dude Fogy nineteen eight, I get

called to do Fogerty record. I'll I'll go right ahead and say this. He spent five years practicing all instruments to get ready to make a record. You know, he he quit the music business. He was disillusioned by failure after or just all this stuff that went down between him and the management, and it seemed like everything was not a good thing with music. So he let it. His wife convinced to get back and he spends five years doing I get called in the fifth year of

making Blue Moon Swamp. I didn't notice the way later, and so that's ten years. I'm the thirtieth drummer, last guy, and so I say, okay, when do you want my cartage coming to bring my drums? And were Bob fog his buzzes. You don't need to bring your drums all there. John had learned. He he learned how to tune drums. He knew that he wanted a Thomas twenty two by

eighteen maple drum kit front head off. He had learned how to take a piano packing blanket, certain way of folding it, sticking it in just the right place, a certain beater, remo fiberskin three based from head which he would tune he liked. My favorite start was super Funding four with a coded ambassador. He would tune it. He hit it down to a science half turn, half turn, third turn, turn, a quarter turn, and then take mole skin and tune it to an F shot. He was

tuning with my drums. Were you satisfied out? Well? You know me, uh, the whole A lot of my successes served the boss, served, the team, served whatever. But here's the quirky thing, which is a side story. You know, I got pretty pretty good at my crafty recording. So we learned this song and it's me and it's Bob Glober bass player and John, and I'm thinking we're all getting this together because we go out and we play this song two takes and then go back and listen

to John to make a few comments. Two takes, go back and listen to it. After six takes, I went pretty damn good, he says. Now, let's keep going. So we do it for three and a half hours and then took lunch break. We did the next song like this is awesome, and John says me after the first day, says, you know, I really enjoy working with you man, You're the drummer I've been looking for my whole life. Would you mind coming back tomorrow? I went absolutely creed. So

I go, Okay, what songs are we doing today? And they went, um, same two songs. I'm like what. So then I go like, what am I doing wrong? You know? So I'm trying real hard. This is what John liked. I didn't know that. I was like, and then he invites me back next day it's Wednesday and says, all right, what are we doing today? Same two songs. Thursday, I'm like, really lose my mind. I'm like, you're not We're not doing the same too song? I said, yeah, we are.

And Friday. Then I realized what was happening. Friday, same two songs, and he invited me to come back the next week and it was a new set of songs. But he through those five years, he was such a perfection. She was trying to find his voice and his sound and and the snare them thing. And this is for the listeners that we had the same issue with Mellencamp. It was like we were trying to get this unique drum sound and you get that, and then you get this cool guitar sound and you put it together. It

didn't work. And like if you put red the color red on a canvas, and then you put red on red, it starts to look brown. Literally. So we had to find frequency where the guitars would not overlap much on the snare sound. And that was a challenge. And that's why I always bought so many snare dums. And you know, I would work with the engineers and I would listen and oh, yeah, the snare is the same pitch. Let

me tune it down a little bit. And you know, in two thousand and five, when the whole you said, yeah, we would build. You build everything around the drum sound you had to get. There was no pro tools, so you had to get complete takes. You didn't want to be the guy to mess up a take and then they have to split tape and you can only get three takes on one wheel. Now, if you're getting into two wheels and three wheels, that's five dollars a reel plus.

You're going like, okay, let's listen to take number nine that's on real three. Let's go back and listen to take number two on reel one. I mean, you really messing up. The drummer has to play perfect, end time right, sounds right, feels right, groove right, everything, so they can build it anything off of that. And I still try to record like that, even with pro tools. What about a click track click track? No problem? I love it, use it and not use it started, shut it off. Uh,

the click track is a is a good mechanism. What do you explain for those people don't know what a click track? Click track is? Like a metronome, It's got a like if the temple is one twenty got cut cut cut cut personally like a cow bell in my head because I'm so definite. Has your hearing suffered a big time? You were the hearing aids. I try not to well, well, my wife I do. I wouldn't admit that to anybody, but I'm admitting it on your show.

I haven't me at home because her voice is very, very high, and she's English and she speaks quiet, and to preserve my relationship I because she got sick of me saying what okay, so so so the click track is the greatest thing about a click track is if you go, if you are editing between takes, you're the same tempo, right, you can and if you click track goes all the way through the song easy to make edits.

And nowadays we use pro tools, which are some form digital format which means you can go between a thousand takes in a split second and grab something from here and grab something there. If you're recording with a click track, the edit is easy because that takes that out of that factor out of the equation. What I find though, that the challenge for me is to make is to not allow the track to sound stiff or boring. Sometimes songs should speed up, you know, could you imagine that

who on a click track? It wouldn't sound like to be horrible And so um, what I will do is I will manipulate the click. I'll kind of push your head and of course come back in the versus and and so I manipulate the click. I kind of get along, tip pull back or I And sometimes I've done sessions who I say, just shut it off after a certain

point and let it breathe. Okay, So what's agree er, There's still sessions, still sessions that you're called for anybody's So I just did Brian Wilson and that was in a big studio because there's a budget. Um, I did something with Sammy Hagar and run DMC and I have my own studio. Now. I didn't want to have my own study. It was a big investment. But when I saw the budgets change in uh, this project coordinator, Sherek

Souftcliffe called me up. And I didn't even have an apartment in l A l A yet, I was still living in Indiana. Peop would fly me all over the world just for one song because there was a budget. People selling records, there was money to be made. It didn't get any business. You make money, you have money to reinvest in the business. And we did that. So

all of a sudden, Sherry sucklerf I'll never forget. I was at the Sunset Marquis Well, you know, let me explain Rock and Roll Hotel Block and Rottle Hotel de Bautry. I was one of the guys there and and uh, you know, they would fly me. I'd live in Indiana. They pay for my my everything, every expense in my parking, I'd be in first class. I'd land, I'd get a

cool rock and roll Mustang or some car. Say at an expensive cool hotel like Sunset Marquis where there I'm hanging out with you two and the Stones, and it was a great place to be because you were networking, and and I could be there for two weeks, three weeks a month, and you know that hotel was expensive. Uh. And then they would be a per diem and I would get paid really really well. Sherry calls up, says, Kenny, if you happen to be in town, I got this session.

When we mean, if I happened to be in town, I said, of the budgets changing, she said, yeah, what year this, I'd say that in the mid two thousands, and uh, I went wow. In one month, I got an apartment. So now all of a sudden I had an expensive two and a half to three grand I didn't have. But for me, it was like take my money,

but don't take that career of mine. Eventually I bought a house here and then the next step was eventually got a studio, two rooms, a control room and spent you know, hundreds of thousands on great equipment to sound like Kenny Arnold great Mike's drums, says always Mike, and I've done Avril Levine in there. I've done she went there.

But they sent me the tracks. People can send me tracks on all the world, Sammy Hagar list, last year's both this couson and he said, hey, Kenny, I want you to play drums on this and it's for me run DMC or d m C. And I said, well, do you want me to do it in my studio? You want to do it in a you know, a big room. And he says, send me what your studio sounds like. Send him some stuff and went, whoa man, that sounds great. Just doing your room so that I

don't charge from my room. I just charge for me. So yeah, it works. So how much she charge? I guess? I say, well, you know, I could ask you can you can decide whether the answer. Let's just put this way. It's it's not that expensive, but some people might think so if they don't have a record deal. Uh. The fee is for one song, is for the studio, me and the engineer. I pay the engineer and then if two or more it drops down, and three or more

it drops down. Very reasonable. But I'll get these emails from ound the world and and and I'll say what the fee is, and I never hear from anybody. Well, it happens to all of us. But will you if someone is willing to pay and you have the time, you're willing to work for any with anybod Yeah, I'll work for anybody. And what I do is I'm very very detailed chart writer, right, write every note out. And the whole purpose of that is when I get in

the studio, I'm not wasting anybody's time, including me. As like being an actor, like let's go and let's do the scene, and while I'm still hot, let's do it again, and let's do it again. And I like my engineer to move fast, and I get three takes. Usually the first take is just to make sure I wrote everything out right. Then it's bam bam bam, and their performances and that you can hear it and feel it. Okay, let's go back to Tanglewood. So the first year you

don't make it. What happens the next three year? Second year, I don't make it, third year, and I'll make it. And it's almost like strike three year out and fourth year I get in. Seven percussionists in the whole world. I get in. I work with Leonard Bernstein says you is our you know, another American composer, conductor, Aaron Copeland, Arthur Feedler, and this is the elite orchestra. And I mean, I got great pictures of me and Bernstein. I just

did that thing. Screwball. Um. I got asked to perform with David Pack who worked with Bernstein and hung out. Yeah, and he had apparently was involved with that that score or we're doing something with Leonard's mass and uh when he was young and they became friends and Alec Bernstein, Uh, Leonard's son I hadn't seen since I was a kid. And it was a great reunion. And uh anyway, Leonard was cool man because later on when he uh, you know,

he I want to concerto competition. This is this is this was a tangle whether you want to know Indiana University well before let's finish off tangle with So you're there finally the fourth year and other than having a great experience, do you learn anything? Oh my god? That was That was elite. Dude. Okay, he's a great story. First day, I'm nervous. You know, this is the best workers. I'm nervous still. I mean I've gotten way, way good.

But it's you know, I'm with the elite from all over the world, and says heos Hour one of the greatest conductors ever, who is a conductor for Bosses of the New Orchestra San Francisco, who Leonard Bernstein had found in Japan and brought him to Tanguin when he was a kid. Zaro had an impeccable memory. He walks in and conductors the story. Here's to show different styles of conducting. He comes in and says to the orchestra, looks at them. He's trying to gain power and control. He says, what

what are we playing? What are we what are we doing today? We had all the scores memorized, and they say, okay, we're doing this is let's play this. It was a revel thing and this conducting style was unbelievable. Wow, the form, the flow, and then about thirty seconds he stops and he rips through all the different sections. You're out of tune, you're behind the beat. You to to establish power. And at the end of the rehearsal, I'm picking up a lot of cussion stuff on the floor in the back.

Everybody scattered. It was just me and then I hear some talking. I look up. I'm still on the ground. I look up past my music stands. There's Bernstein with those hours and those hours going. I don't understand. This orchestra is supposed to be the best, and they're not performing. And here's the difference. Leonard put his hand on his shoulder and said says, so show some love and compassion and they will play for you because they are the best. Wow.

And then all the you know, in the percussion world, timpany is like the cool spot you know, you're by yourself kind of is all the percussion and is timpany And timpoty is a very very dynamic instrument. It supports, you know, basis when they're doing a long like you know, or cellos and on the timpany you're going, you're trying to make this sustained role that supports, or you play we allowed and you're you're tuning every day. I'm a tunable. Have to be in tune because if you're out of tune,

like even by a little bit. It's just a virtuostic instrument, and every one of the highest paid people in the orchestra. Anyway, the first week I'm playing percussion, second week, I'm playing percussion, third week. Finally I'm the only guy hasn't playing Timothy the Bailiest fifth Symphony, this big killer Timpothy part with Burnstein conducting, and oh this killer so you you didn't

choke a good joke. I crushed it. And the piece is so beautiful that I literally had was having to pinch myself while I was on stage, Uh to not well up with here because it's so beautiful. It's so beautiful. So this concerto thing I was telling about now we're back in Indiana University. Yeah, when I auditioned it U mass, I'd never played a remember before I had this vibraphone, which is a metal Mallard instrument, and the members the

bars are bigger, and it's a longer instrument. So the you know you're you're gonna miss notes if you're used to this aracing of one instrument you missed, you have to adapt. So I was the story is at eight and I played for the first time just about when I was about to turn twenty three. I had worked

so hard. I had won a concerto competition playing a violin concerto that I saw it's all Parlman play in in his performance at Indiana University with orchestra as his encore, and I decided at that moment that would be my marimba piece on my senior recital and your senior recital at Indiana University you had to play timpani multiple percussion mallet piece uh, and then you could decide if you

want to play drums, set or UH. Most people, if you were a classical major, would just pick a snare doorm a two, but it's all very classical and virtuosic. I picked this piece. I practicing in my senior year um three hours a day, three sixty five days a year, just for that one piece in my recipe idol. But teachers blown away by my performance ability and what I

had done. I had memorized all the phrasings of it's a promin, you know, like a violin, and I've done such a great job that he said, I want you to enter this concerto competition. If you win, you bit to perform in the opera hall, which is the size of the New York met at Indiana University with a full orchestra, six piece orchestra. I auditioned and I win, and so I the first time. When the night I was supposed to do it, I was so nervous, and I'm walking to the huge uh opera hall and everyone's

running out of the building. Looked like the Preside Adventure. You know. What had happened is a grid went out in Indiana University and the power was gone. So I couldn't perform a blessing because I was nervous. I was gonna make it. I was gonna mess up. So the conductor said to the orchestra, look, we don't have to reschedule, but I feel bad for Kenny didn't get do what do you all like? Let's do it? Look can that do it? So when I did finally perform, you know,

it's a weird feeling. They roll like you know, they roll them mber out and I walk. I'm not used to being up front. There's the conductor, the orchestra's back is on my back. Is the orchestra on the side of the conductor, And he looks at me says, are you ready, and I'm shipping my pants five people in front of big opera and we start and I'm going, oh my god, I got this. It's all memorized, you know.

I got this. And I get into the performance and the very last page, right before the cadenza, where I have two mallets, and I pick up two more mallets, and it's just like goo goo goo goo goo goo goo goo goo goo goo good good good good good goo go go. But little, a little, a little, a little, a little, a little bit, a little up and down this saying, and I'm like, oh, I got it. There's a couple of missnows. But I tore it up. It was huge. That was like the big you have made it.

And then I get into the Jerusalem Symphony Orchestra per my teacher, and I turned it down because while before I had gotten that position, I started studying drum set for the first time with wheel badass teacher from Berkeley was a jazz drummer, Alan Dawson, and in New York one of the biggest session the Hall Bline of New York Gary Chester. And I'm starting I'm practicing eight hours a day and I want to be in the Beatles again.

We'll take a quick break and come back with more of my conversation with legendary drummer Kenny Aaronoff, recorded live at the tune In studios in Venice, California. This week, I'm speaking with a veritable rock star behind a drum kid. In the past, I spoke with Tony Hawk and the head of YouTube and Google Music, Lee or Co. Check out the archives of the show to learn how people double down on their passions to make it big in their respective industries. Subscribe to the podcast on tune in,

Apple or your podcast player of choice. Okay, let's get back to my conversation with legendary drummer Kenny aaron Off. So, and all this time you're Indiana, the dream of the Beatles had evaporated, or you said, focused on I may always played in bands, but yeah, the dude, I was focusing on my my to get through college, to do an excellent job and get a job, and you know, presumably a symphony orchestra. And can you still play the

marimba today? I just pulled it out. I haven't remember. Because, uh, the president of Kodak Film wants to do a documentary on Kenny and when he played them that piece, he went, dude, we need an excerpt for that in the document entry. So I started to pull the murmber out with the idea that I would learn to work up a part of that piece, just you know, and uh oh yeah, I could get back up, just you know, just putting in the time. Right, So how do you end up

with melocap? Well, so I turned on Juice from I'm living at home, I'm humbled, and like here I am. I played with Burnesty. Now I'm back in my own house where I grew up, practicing in hours a day, traveling, trying to play in some bands in New York. And a bunch of guys from Indiana called me up. So we want to start a band with the idea of the business modelers, get a record deals, sell records, go on tour like the Beatles. I went and one of

the dads invested thirty grand. This is the nineteen seventy seven. It's a lot of money. We got a truck, lights, p a and we're in a band house. Loved it, moved back there. After three years, we didn't get a record deal, and I decided I'm twenty seven. I decided I gotta should probably go to New York. I knew more people New York than l A, so I'm gonna move. And then I hear about two weeks leaving, I hear about this Johnny Cougar, guy singer songwriter said Johnny Cougar

just fired his drummer last night or something. They got in an argument, and I started thinking, well, that's a guy on MTV. I'm not a huge fan of music, you know. I was more in diffusion, you know, more technique. When you're younger, you want to play as many notes as possible, and this was a songwriter, and I went but down. On the other hand, I was into the Beatles and the Stones and songs, so it was in my blood. So I went, wait a minute, this guy's

tourings making I want this bad. So I called up. I had the guitar players number, and he said, well call me a couple of weeks that we're just going through some stuff and call me, says um. John had asked around who's the best drummer in Bloomington and people says, you could check out this guy, Kenny. I learned that that name from just being hard worker and the guy that's always going for it, you know, just it just exuded out of me. So, um, I get an audition.

I said, what should I do? And they said, be familiar with the John Cougar record, which had I need a Lover on on ear from that and so covered by Yeah, and which gave him some money. So that the thing is, they said, be familiar with it. With with my training, I wrote every note doubt and memorized every song, so practicing my six hours six to eight hours, say that was that I didn't realize, but that was the discipline I've learned at Indiana University and U MASS

and asked me and Tangwood. That prepared me unusually for a rock band audition. And and then I would like literally go, I'd yell out a song and start playing without the music. I mean, I had it down. So I show up at John's house almost didn't get the audition. First of all, I beat up five cars leaking oil on his driveway. He's looking at that, looking at me. I'm dressed, not cool. I have a beard, and I didn't know what cool was back then, and UH had

no style. And and then he sees me pull out this mammoth drunk kid, you know, double bassed from twelve times a billion symbols. I walk up to him, Hey, John Tenney, who was John Mellencamp turns around, walks into the house and went, wow, this guy is not a happy guy. He was going through a divorce also, And I didn't also realize and I say in my book, I mean, dude, here's a guy from India and he goes, he gets a record deal, his manager, Tony de Freeze

that gave Bowie his name, Ziggy start Us. John makes a record. He shoves the record across him and John goes, who's Johnny couz Is that's you? He says, that's not my name me cripping the rust belt. He goes, he probably went home and got his asked kicked by his uncles. That that resolved everything with fistfights, you know what I mean. They were like brick players. Not only did he have his, and he said, well, if you want your record to come out, your name is Johnny Cougar. So he gets

he takes that and loses his deal. A year later, Now he's Johnny Couse. This guy was not a happy guy. He was fighting, and I didn't know anything about it. I was just happy to be playing in a band that was on the radio. John was in fear of losing his deal again. So I auditioned and I said, they said, you know any these songs? I said, I'm familiar with some of the songs that I pick one. I picked one, and I'll never forget. I mean, I

just destroyed everything. I broke symbols, sticks. I figured, well, they must play loud in arenas. And John's mouth was open, his eyes are bugged out. He gets up after two soon goes upstairs and yells, Mike, get up here. Mike goes up and I'm packing. I'm nervous. I really want this. Mike comes down, looks at me, smiles, shakes my hand, says, welcome to Hell. I'm going. What does he mean by that? I found out that was the beginning, and uh, and

I'm trying to make this quick. I tell everybody I'm going to Elie to make a record at Cherokee Studios on fair effect. I am so excited. I've told everybody. I get here and I'm staying at the Chateau Marmont and uh rock and Roll Hotel also and in two days, John, we have a band meeting, John says you're not on the record, and as he starts to say, you go back to Indiana, I said, no fucking way am I going back home? And I'm scrambling, I'm trying to negotiate

a deal. I'm humiliated, and I'm thinking in my head, don't you understand I played with Bernstein blah blah, had nothing to do with serving this song or getting a song on the record. I asked drummers all the time, what's your purpose when you're making a record of what's your purpose as a drummer? And they fumbled around. I say, the purpose of a drummer when you're making records get the song to be number one. That's it. Every part,

every idea, everything you say, everything you think. The goal is to get the song on the radio to be number one. Because when it does, then you made millions for the company. Then they say who played on it? Oh, Kenny, Let's get him on the next one, and the next one and the next one. And that's how I ended up on so many hits and being a team player and getting a long and adjusting. Monday, it's bb King and Bonnie right, Tuesday's out and John Wednesdays, the Smashing Pumpkin.

I mean they're all different. Everything is different, and you have to be able to adapt. And so I I didn't have any of that yet. So I was I was fighting and I just said, John, I'm not going home. I'll sleep on the floor. I said, are you am I still your drummer and he said, yeah, you're not playing on the record. He was perplexed. He didn't know what to why I was asking because I was sleeping the floor. You don't have to pay me, which is

probably the deal breaker. And then I did. I watched these guys and I learned from them, and I was like, wow, I was quite an education about tuning how to play these radio friendly drum parts that serve the song. I went home and set up my eight hour day practice routine, got Stones Records out, Credence Records out, a C d C Records, started up trying to I mean, it's much easier to learn something that's technically hard than to learn how do you practice simple? There's no book on simple Simple.

It's like looking through him, like it's like looking to it. Uh microscope where playing technicals looking through a telescope. They're both valid just different directions. So I was befuddled. How do you so? The only one you could do is repetition. I just kept playing the Stones Records, started to understand it and let me jump two years later. So that album you didn't play on was American Fool I did. American Fool I did. It was nothing matters when one

of it did so, which was not successful. It wasn't considered successful even though he had two singles in the top forty. But he almost but the two this time, I think in then he did a video with the egg Lady from that Crazy movie and then, uh, the other one was ain't even done with then. I kind of an R and B thing. Cropper was the producer, Steve Cropper, you know, and and I didn't know this,

but you're right. It was not considered successful when we were making American Fool two years later, which that got two Grammy Awards. The most the story on that as they finished the record and the label said we don't want to put this out, it's right because after nine weeks, I felt like I'd been and this is where I came up with the iconic Jack and Dian drum apart, fighting for my life um, thinking that if I don't come up with something, I'll be replaced again or fired.

And I come up with that song was off the record gone, nobody knew what to do with it, and I programmed this drum machine thing because that one of them, which I thought is hideous. I'm being replaced now, not by a human, by by a machine. I went, this is what's going on here? And then they that wasn't good enough, so I had to come up with this. They wanted like persent part the Red Sea right now. Now, I'm like, what, I have to come up with this

drum part? Thank god I did. Became John's biggest, most successful single. I made million dollars for the company, not for me. But he's still like one of the is one of the greatest songs played from the eighties. And after we after that, I go home. I felt like I've been in Afghanistan for nine weeks. John calls here two weeks later says, we're not done. We got only four songs. Record label doesn't like it. Uh, we only got four songs. Two guys have gotten fired. Me and

John was got in a fist fight. John was a complete manic, crazy man, and he you know, did some crazy stuff and I just went after him. Anyway, we're out in the band without tail between the legs, and that's what John Road. Hurts so good. And we came back out here six months later and recorded the Cherokee the same room that I was told not to play and finished the record. And then and I was in the same room at the Chateau Marma when Jack and

Ian went to number one. The first song that came on off of that record that let off was hurt So Good. It stayed at number two for six weeks. And this is on the top one d This meant something back then, the top one hundred med something. Yeah, it was for those listening when you were in the top one hundred. You couldn't get away from that song was on every station on the radio. And then we had MTV, so we were on. We were it was obnoxious,

just you couldn't get away from us. And then they say it started to go down a little bit and they said released Jack and the hand. They released Jack and Diane. He creeps up Jack and hurts what good didn't leave. Now we have two singles in the top ten. That's huge, and we John's career seriously launched. Then that was like a right, So millions of records, one Grammys, We were on a Saturday Live, we were on every

TV show, imaginable, and I was in the room. They shout to my mom when the song went to number one, Jack and Dane and the same movement where I got told not to play the record. But my fear was, holy sh it. Not everybody thinks I can do this again? Can I? How do I prepare for? How do you practice? There's no method. I was very insecure about, like, oh my god, god, do again. I'm not really number one? No way, Oh man, what do I do? What do

I practice? I gotta do this again? And obviously, okay, did you get the proper respect from John in terms of your addition to Jack and Diane. He never would would tell me such a thing. A matter of fact, he told me years later. I thought about this. He said, you know this is that makes that songs that guitar part. But about to me, it sounds like now I think he wanted me to sign off on it or something. You know what I mean. John's don't mean anything. Hell not.

The programming the drums were a big part of that. But John would never tell me ever to my face that I was doing a good job. He just he was like the Bobby Night coach of Indiana University, just completely big. You know Bill Belichick. Well I don't know about Bill Belichick, but you know Bobby and he's never get a compliment. It's like he gets his people to always fight to be better. And John, for seventeen years, I was trying to come up with beats that would

make his songs unique. And that was my what degree? What is this process? Did people start to pay attention to you as an individual? Yeah? Scared when the well about the American fool, But then the home record I started to get a sound, were starting to we push the drums up front. John wanted our songs to blow any song that came on the radio before us and after us. Great mentality. It's like, so I want the drums loud, I want vocals. I want this thing to

just me the loudest thing on the radio. And it was. And it worked because we were competing with either Tiger and at the knee and Ivery and then he was so good it was like a C D C. You know, And uh so I get hired to do. I have to say it was actually probably after Scare Call and the Scarecrow record, my sound became locked down as this wall, what do they do? Who is that? That sound? That so powerful? It was like a drum record, simple drum pus.

So then I get calls to do like buyd Setser's first solo record, Night Feels Like Justice, Blend the Car Heaven on Earth, which went to number one, And I'm starting to get these calls, you know, to to record, and then uh, John and a eight. We went from I went from number nineteen eighty eight John on it was like another Man did, which I didn't play drums on, American Fool, which I played drums on, which had pink houses of authority and coming down. Then it was Scar

Car Now we're arena rock band too. Was selling Milliams records in Jubilee, which we rechanged this whole. We came up with a whole new sound of violent and according together Americana and we're selling out arenas. And then John quits last show of the Jubilee tour, hands me a bonus check when they actually had bonus checks. He says, I quit and I took it literal he didn't quit, but I thought he just gotten divorced, had car payment,

child payment, uh, you know, mortgage, blah blah blah. And I'm like, oh my god, I'm at the most of this guy and never saw it coming. He can just quit. He's got millions in the bank. I don't he can quit whenever he wants. I'm like, that will never happen again. And that's where I went. I freaked out. And then I started to look at the same thing everybody else saw, but look at it different. I went, I've been working with one rock star for eight years, and I'm gonna

go work for all the other ones. And so I started coming out here. To what degree did you pitch people? And to what degree were they looking for you both? I was all over the radio, and then when they started hearing and I was coming out here, and one day I get this call, Hey, Kenny, it's Don Don Was. I'm like, from What's not? Was? Yeah, how did you think you're playing an iggy pop record? Now, Don was really just beginning. He was renting a house up in

Low Canyon. He says, Now, don you know it wasn't I was to be honest, I go to the record plan to meet him. I go right up to the singers, the black singers. I thought he was a black guy, and I go, so Don, and then he says, Sweepy goes, I ain't know Donn was, and I go over to Don Was, not knowing it's Don. Was said, dude, when does Don could get here? And Don starts bursting out laughing, he's Barefoot's got the afrot laugh aces I'm done. Was, I'm like, what you sound like that on the phone.

I was laying lass off and Sweepy is laughing. All those guys are laughing. So Don says, look at Iggy wants to meet you first, which I thought was cool because he has vibe. So I go to his house and you know, Iggy's sitting laying down on the count and he says, you know, I played Timpany in high school in Detroit, and I WHOA, I played Timpany too, and he liked me. So I played on that record and one night when Don said Don, they said Donna

has to leave. He's going to the Grammys. He wins two Grammys for Nick of Time and one for Love Check Be fifty two. All of a sudden, Don is getting I'm ton of calls. Now I do Bob Dylan's record with him. Now I do Bob Seger with him. Now I do Elton John with him. And then I've

been working with Don since nine. The big thing I do with Don as we do these big, huge extravaganzas like the uh, the Greg Allman Tribute, so I get to play with twenty artists Tomorrow Hagger Tribute while I'm playing with Loretta Lynn and Keith Richards and Don Henley,

and then he's just one after another. And then I did the Kenny Rodgers Tribute with you can imagine, you know, Dolly Pardon, Lionel Richie, all these It's just and then and then that, and then having done the Kennedy Center Honors. For the viewers listening, it's like I write meticulously every single note, doubt uh that I'm gonna play. I have tempo marking's, I have a vocal cues, I have guitar cues,

and Don basically he's the musical director. But once the show goes, I'm I'm I'm counting off the tempo's ending all the songs. Uh. He he hands the baton to me, and I'm timing. I know the script of the show, the flow of the show. I'm looking over to see when Don Henley walks on looking for the next artist. Are they gonna speak into the micro They not, and I have to make a decision. I got my hands up here, I've got the click going in my ear.

I've grabbed the attention to people. The guitar players are the keyboard player. This is get ready, one two, three, four, And as soon as the song is over, I gotta click going for the next song. So it's already going because you could go from one two to one twenty. It's not much, but it makes a difference with vocals. So don I make Don's life easier. I mean, I'm making tweaks and adjustments on charts until ninety minutes before the show, and it's a sixteen camera shoot and they're

recording it. I can't mess up. Ninety minutes before the show. I get all my charts, and I didn't take pictures of them, put them my iPad, put them in order, and usually have thirty minutes to eat and get ready, and then I'll do this whole performance. Let's just say hypothetically, you're booked that they can't get you. That just happened. Okay, who do you say to get I let them decide, great answer. Okay, so Mello Camp decides he's not retiring. Meanwhile,

you've built this whole business from the session work. How does it end with you in Mello Camp? Well, that was the beginning of headbutting, because now I took myself off the small teeny retainer. I mean, that's such an obvious flare up in the sky. But I you know, I thought, well, you know this way, he can't tell me when he wants me, but you don't tell him Melancamp retainer or not when he wants you. He wants you.

And this has happened before or after that. What I was saying that John was like, I'm making more money in the studio and I in the studio that I'm with you and I've made you millions. That's what I'm

thinking to my head. And I'm treated with respect and nice and John, I'm not even gonna put him down, just say it wasn't his demeanor to be nice, like nice nice, and so I would like be in the car those last five years after we got back together, and then we're back you know when we finally get back together officially as a band in nine and I'm driving to the student gonna rock on the rock. I'm gonna get and I get in there, and John was going through a lot of I mean, in all fairness

to John, he was like running all the business. He was dealing with interviews, dealing with the record labels, dealing with managers, dealing with merchandise. He was dealing with this everything, and uh, I think you know he had relationship issues. It was just tons of stuff. And then he had a heart attack eventually, and it was like there was so much times to play. When I get in the studio, he'd had sunglasses, he'd be smoke con cigarette, the blinds

would be drawn and it was just depressing. And once again, no insult to him, but he was suffering. But I walk in there and I would feel it and it was no fun. And I'd be like, come on, let's go up. We'd be in this dark place for an hour and a half. Now let's cut this song. And I'd be like constantly trying to coach myself and like, no dis respect to John at all. Man, he was going through a lot. Man. He was running the whole show.

But it wasn't fun to be around. So eventually John called me and I was doing something and I can't make it. I think I was with little Feet out here. We'll just cancel. Tell them. You gotta tell them that you're not available when I call you. I said, doesn't work that way. They you know, producers build rhythm sections. They want Kenny in this studio with that bass player. And if I'm gonna constantly be bambling, I think gonna work. And there was no It eventually ended where we parted ways,

you know, And what's your relationship with him? About? If I play with him like I've done stuff with him. We joke like I did the mer hag contribute. He'll come up and slug me in the arm, you know, uh, And we'll stand in front of each other, and you know, he's a very serious guy, but our conversations are fun, funny, you know, it's kind of like we make He'll make a dig at me, but it doesn't bother me because you're playing like the Merle Haggard tribute. Have you ever

played with him in his band? I played with Merrow Another Don was saying, where you know Willie Nelson and Merroll came on to do Poncho and Poncho and Lefty Lefty, and they were for some event. I played with Morril a bunch of times, you know, okay, But in terms of John Mellancamp, oh, not in his band. No, it's only one of these things where like the Obama inauguration, And that's that's how I broke the eyes. I was

playing Obama Inauguration. I played with twenty four artists. One was Melancamp and I thought, I don't want to wait, it's gonna be awkward, so I wait till I see him. So I called him up on the phone. They go, John's Kenny, Hey, Kenny, Oh, oh, Kenny, how are you? He was really friendly. So this I want to let you know that it's really cold on stage. We're outside and you up what Lincoln is and we're down below you. So you really are kind of alone. I just know

you'd like to be around the band. Just what I just want are You're still hitting a lot of symbols and went, yeah, and we're doing pink House. I said, you know the third chorus where you sing stop singing, it's a drum solo and it's just symbols going crazy, and he goes, this is motherfucker. I'm gonna come down there and take those symbols up. And I said, I hope you do. I'll get more camera. It was kind of he really wanted to know if he was performing

right after Biden's speech because he wanted the attention. You know. Okay, so is Mike the only guy left from the original band? That's right. I went and saw them here at the Hollywood Bowl and I have to say it wasn't the rock band that I was in, but it was cool man. The songs were great, except he placed Jack and Diana Cousty guitar and I got to the drum field he skipped it. He didn't even play. Just well, that's a

tribute to you on some level. Okay, So now you're playing sessions, but you all still go out of the Road with Melissa Ethridge for ten years on and off, Joe Cocker for ten years, on and off, Pumpkins for one year, a Bob Seger for one year, and Fogrety now I'm up to twenty five years. Okay. So first you're playing sessions. At what point do you decide do you end up going down the road on tour. You know,

this is what makes me different. Is like for the viewers out there, usually you're either a session drummer or you're a touring drummer. So a couple of us like Jeff Percarroll did it, uh, Jerr Robinson, Jared and toured that much. You didn't want to ever leave town because you don't want these sessions. What I did was I was living Indiana. I was recording in l a lot, but Nashville was only four and a half hours south of me. So I started a whole business down there.

I was making, you know, playing with Johnny Cash, the real the real guys, uh, you know, Willie Nelson's Waylon Jennings and and then in the country pop schlock started coming. I was playing on that too, But I I I was juggling everything, and in New York sometimes, and when I went on tour with Seeger and Melissa, I struck a deal like this. I got paid a lot, but I said, you pay me on show day. On days off, you don't have to pay me, but those are my days.

And I would fly anywhere to make records and keep it all going. All right, There are issues of getting back in time for the show. I got two big ones recently. Fog I'm in Mumbai, India with my band, Supersonic Blues Machine with Eric El's and Billy Gibbons, and I'm being promoted. So this is the classic thing fogies get a gig. I'm not unretained or I don't have any So we've got a gig the day after and I'm like, huh, I can make it, but it's gonna be. I can make it, but I'm gonna be in Mumbai

the day before, so you've gotta cancel it. Went I can't. It's my band and I'm being promoted. It's Kenny Aaronoff. It's my band. You gotta cancel it. So I said, let me see what the flights are, you know, instead of like there is no no, that's my new thing. There's no no. You just just come up with keep the conversation going. So I'm like, okay, look, I'm wanna let me look into this. So I said, I'll make it work. So I leave the stage. I figured out I catch a four am flight from Mumbai to Dubai

to me our layover. Unless is a military coup or sandstorm that goes to Houston. My only problem is I land in Houston five thirty. I have to be on stage at nine. And at San Antonio the problem was the rush hours insane is not the problem, but getting into Texas as a problem. So I tell them that. They're like, no, no, no, I said, Okay, let me see what else I can do. I get a private chet. Somebody offers me a private chet for five dollars if I get them v I p passes. Now I land,

I can get there by six thirty. I tell them that they're like what, they can't believe I got that together. They're like, well, what if? What if something really happens? I said, And I went to the next level. I got my buddy Stephen Perkins to sub for me in case I didn't make it. He went there, he learned the whole show, did sound check, and I made it on time, and I did the show, and then I would love that. I was like Piston Vinegar. I I the fact that you know that it was a challenge

made me. The adrenaline flowed and we kicked as the next day though we had we got on Don Henley's jet and flew all the way to New York or somewhere east. And that's when I felt it. I was like, oh man, and we had a couple of shows there, corporate shows, and I was hurting. Yeah, no, we just had for some reason, we want his jet. I just used that as a cool thing to say, so, but but um, I was gonna say, you know when you know, I was in business class of first class, so that

that flash slept the whole you know, eight hours. So, so who have you not played with? You want to play with? Well, my super group I played with Sting, but my ideal super group would be staying obviously, I'm bass singing and Jeff Beck on guitar played with Beck played on Blaze of Glory with him, but never played with him. You played the drums on Blaze of Glory. Yeah, I forgot you know. So yeah, and Jeff Beck, this is a great story. John. One day I get a

call out of Blue I'm in Nashville. The chords is, Hey, k's John bon Joeli. I'm like what he says, Hey, I got this project. I want to record two songs for this movie soundtrack. Are you available? BLA Bla says yeah, So I'll call you a couple of weeks, it comes I got four songs. Oh my god, that's awesome for Okay, cool, I'll call you a couple of weeks, dude, like, I'm doing the whole soundtrack. I'm doing I got a whole album. It's a whole concept. I'm even acting the movie. Okay,

we're gonna nail down you. Still available to said yep, calling a couple of weeks called says I got good news and bad news. I'm like, oh, no, what's the good news? Jeff Becker is on the record, what Molly hro what's the bad news? Jeff wants Terry bos you play Johnny side other way? No, but you know, Terry's great, Jef's great. I get off the phone and I start pacing back and forth and I'm so bummed out, you know. And then get a call from the co producer, Danny

korschmer Hey, Kenny's Danny. What's up? Man? He says, um, hey man, get you drums there. On Tuesday at nine am, I went, Danny, have you spoken to John Lady? Yeah? Well, I says, I'm not playing on the record. Terry Bojo says, what that's not yet? You're the right guy for the record, Terry, and then he said something very very smart that I should have known better. There's no way Jeff Beck is gonna be there on a tracking session. Let's do take

number four hundred. No, you record this song, you bring Jeff into just a couple of takes and it's done. He's not gonna be there making a record with bon Jovie from like you know, eleven in the morning, the eleven at night. That's not his style. I was right, so he says, So anyway, tell you a tech the bring the drums here by nine am. So I played on the record. So why is the drummer always the business guy in the group. I don't know. Maybe you've

learned to have to defend yourself. You're the guy you know all the music jokes. You know, you've got the brand and the guy that's oh yeah, and then we got a drummer, you know. I don't know. I think I don't know. That's a good question maybe, but that's what you do. You agree with that that usually the drummers the business guy. The drummer in many cases Danny Surfing from Blood, Sweat and Tears, Mick Jagger is the Stones, but Charlie Watts. It all goes to Charlie. You know,

he's one of the guys. Uh, silent leader. Um. And that's just form my intuition. Um. You know there's other Don Henley definitely running the show, you know. Um. Um, I think the drummers are you know, we have to defend ourselves, stick up for ourselves, protect yourself, make sure you don't get screwed. You know, maybe that's part of it. What's the most memorable gig you've ever played? May not be the best you performed, but your favorite where you

go I'm in the pocket. This is a great experience. Well, one of the most memorable ones besides the concertom was recording with the Buddy Rich Big Band. Scared the living crap out of me. I walk in there. I'm the last guy. There's a tribute record to honor Buddy Rich. And so they got they got all these great drummers and Neil Pert and Cathy, which decided they should have Kenny Aronoff and you know a couple of rock guys that are big. So Cathy calls me up and says,

I want you to pick two songs. So I picked jazz songs. Actually just one songs, big swing face, she says, because they sent me some rock songs that were like horror. Buddy wasn't the rock drummer and the music wasn't good. So I picked this great jazz tune, big band jazz tune, and I'm excited. But I've got sessions book three weeks before every like New Orleans, LA, Nashville in Montreal. So I said, Kathy, I better book me as the last

guy last day in case I don't make it. And she calls me a couple of weeks before and says, look, everyone's doing two songs and I'm like, God, I don't know. I want. I was about to say I would love to, but I don't know if I can pull it off straight no chaser. He says, we think you should do straight No chase. I went what I says, all right, all right, Oh now I'm nervous. It's really fast, and so I said, well, okay, but I I got the

final say if it's no good, and she's okay. So I barely get any sleep the night before because I'm according late and I have to fly from Montreal. I'll go through customs. I get there. I'm so tired and I get to New York. I don't lay down on the bed, you won't wake up, and and uh so I purposely walked the studio from the hotel just to keep myself awake. I walk in there and there's cameras and everyone's filming me, and the band is looking at him in and they looked at me like I was

a janitor, like who's that guy? You know? Like, and I'm like, oh, I'm like nervous. And so eventually get the drums and it's a new time a drum kit with a new shell. So I'm trying to figure out how the tune is and Neil post going, let's go on the clock. You know, I'm the last guy last day. So go to the van and talk about the arrangement. A big swing face, says, well, we actually do it a little differently. I'm like, oh no, so I make

my adjustments. We record. After four takes, I go in there and Neil says, all right, and one what's just yeah? I said, you know, I need to do it again. It's a little bit I can do it better and said, oh no, you only get four takes, Like, well, why didn't you tell me that in the beginning, I'd be like, you know, okay, this is my last shot. I thought, I have as much as I want. So they bring in the expert, Freddy Gruber. First I had a kid sounds great, So that was it. I got voted out.

Now we're doing straight now Chaser. Now I'm like fight mode. It's the it's a super Bowl. So I get in fight mode and uh, it's blazing fast and it's a solo at the end. The thing that's miracous. I played great. I'm reading music and great. The solo was impeccable. I mean, I'm not saying it was genius, but there was not one flaw like oh he's out of time or oh it was like and it was just and I'm telling you, when I was playing so fast, I looked at my

hands and went, wow, who's playing that? I can't play like this? Who's playing? And I said, shut up, Kenny, who's ever playing? He's doing a good job. You don't want to interfere with that guy. It was literally an out of body it was flowing. It was just that whole flow thing. And so yeah, I have a lot of great experiences of Kenny Center Honors and Obamas, But that one stands out because it was so different, so unique, so scary, so terrified, and I lose the occasion. So

it's extremely memorable. So you wrote a book, and for those people listening who were interested, the book is not a typical rock memoir. It's really Kenny story covers a lot of this stuff, but much more in depth. I really recommend I've read a lot of these books, just not because Kenny's here, but it's really great. But you're also now right, what's the name of that book again? That's called sex Droms rock and Roll? And I wanted

to put a whole bunch of others. By the way, three pages got cut out, just too many sessions, but I wanted to put this this other thing in there, and so I decided to write another book. What an idiot? This book is more are you live in your life loud? Are you dying on the vine? It's like how I became successful? How to make success? You're not born successful? There's no magic pill. How just a little kid from

a town of three thousand. I mean, everybody's got stories like this, But now I'm putting in some deeper things, like you know how to connect the head with the heart, and you know how you you can't do it just from your brain. You can make yourself do stuff, but you really have to connect with your heart to be exceptional. And that's what I've I've done a lot of work on that in the last year, and I'm starting to

put that back in the book. This book will be I mean, it's it's it's got team leadership stuff in it, but it really is how to de beat your own demons and become successful. Now, your brother is a psychoanalyst. Did you discuss these issues with him? We I've been trying to talk to him more and more about this stuff because he's, you know, an executive coach and I've been working with an executive executive coach. It's brilliant stuff. You know. Some people think it's phony blown. I think

it's it's amazing. It's uh, it's it's it's pretty good. And my brother does it. So we have these great talks. It's it's it's basically you know, you you know, we all have we all created ways to survive as as little kids, and so as an adult you can't ever get rid of like those those triggers you know, but you can come up with new agreements. That's what's happening

to me. Okay, I got a new deal. When somebody it's like, for example, it's not personal when John fog he wants to put me in a little plastic house that's they're discussing on stage to keep the sound away from his ears or something. At first, you go like, I'm not getting that. You know. Now it's like, well, hey man, he's just trying to do something that makes him feel good. It's not about me. That's a whole flip because you can go I can't believe of that

person is talking like that. Well, a lot of times it's it's not even about you, it's about them. You know. They're the ones going through this ship. You just have to be in their way. So I'm handling things differently based on that, not taking it personally. I can still decide what I want to stick around or not, but it isn't because of that emotional trigger and dynamic. I don't know if that's the best example, but that's a

tip of the iceberg of some of this stuff. And so to be successful, you have to be able to navigate through this stuff. If you really want to have a a full career, and that's what I'm trying to do. I'm writing in the book, I'm I'm really pushing the speaking business to be an inspirational because I love being in front of the drums. Going back to the drums. It's just, you know, the next step. You've been listening to Kenny aaron Off. I'm a Bob left Sets podcast.

As you can tell, he's not only drummer extraordinary, but rack and tour extraordinary. We could literally go on for another hour, though, but I'm afraid of burning out my one. If you'll have to come back tell some more rock and rolls, Kenny, thanks so much, dude, I and all you fans out there, thanks for listening. Okay, until next time, Bob left Sets with Kenny art Off. That wraps up this week's podcast with Kenny Arnoff. The guy had such great stories I canna let him go on for hours.

I was afraid of burning you out. Hopefully I'll come back with more rock and roll stories. Thanks for listening. Don't hesitate to email me at Bob and left sets dot com with feedback and suggestions. I may not always respond, but I read every email. Until next time I'm Bob left sets, thank me. Don't know exactly m