Kaskade

I used to not bother me at all, and I mean really and truly it doesn't bother me that much. Um, But I think E d M has kind of become a bad word in the last couple of years. I think now almost represents a genre of electronic music that I'm not necessarily that closely affiliated with. It's more of this big room kind of mayhem, uh, very loud, noxious music within electronic music. It's kind of become its own, little like sub genre. But for me, I'm just glad

anyone's calling this music anything. Look, I thought from the day when it was you know, we were unnoticed. Okay, but let's stay there for the uninitiated. They read all the different genres of dance music, house music, chill, etcetera. Can you go through and explain those to the audience and maybe unfamiliar with them. Uh, I'll do as good a job as I can in a in a short, little concise way. Um, house music is just I think for me, that's kind of just the very general broad term.

That's just post disco. Just think of disco, right, It's kind of what made it through the seventies. It's kind of the the eighties version of disco music, and that's kind of survived this entire time. That's kind of the backbound Disco is the backbone of electronic music, is the way I see it, Kid from Chicago. That's my perspective, very much so. Um. But then chills just like what you would think it is. It's relaxed down tempo um. Trap is kind of a version of hip hop music.

That's uh, you know, modern version of hip hop music. That's the way I see It's very aggressive um. And I mean within each one of these big genres, there's fifty subgenres, you know. I mean with trap there's bro staff and hard staff, and and then you have drumming bass, which A lot of this stuff is differentiated by tempo. Drum basis, you know, sixty per minute, beats per minute yep, and then houses you know around one tw kind of like a disco groove. UM. You know, trance is very

fast like one forty, very synthetic sounding, UM, very synth driven. UM. Yeah, I don't know. There's so many genres out there, it's hard to even I think trance house electro is uh similar to house but um but much more aggressive sounding. And that was made popular with kind of E d M and Steve Aoki in that wave of artists bloody beat roots and that kind of thing that was happening a few years ago. So what would you consider your

music to be? Um. I mean, I like to say house because I think that's a very broad general term. But within that, yes, I make chill music. I make ambient music that doesn't have it's a tempo, real tempo. It's just kind of chill stuff, you know. That's that's me I mainly make and then I and then I have those kind of bigger more I call them big

room sounds. You know, that's another kind of subgenre of house music that's more popular on the main stage, and that's basically what I played at the sun Soap Festival. I had those more chill moments, but you know, I kind of go take it up and down. Um yeah, okay. So you're from Chicago, yes, and uh were born in Chicago nineventy one. And what did your father do for a living? H? Finance? This is why we're in Chicago. This is kind of a hub of a financial center.

Um helps out savings and loans, has his own business, goes out there and is helping small banks and savings and loans kind of. Um. He developed programs to kind of help them the way. So nothing music related at all. Okay, did your mother worked outside the house? Uh? She did. She helped my dad a lot, and then she was always doing stuff she was what was she doing? Her best job was working at the the ski shop there that was pretty close to my house. We gotta stop

here for a second. So you're a snowboarder, Yes i am. How often do you get to snowboard? Uh? I usually go up about one week a year. Okay, yeah, I'm of all those kinds of sports. I love to surf and run and do all this stuff that snowboarding. I'm the best at out of all those. Okay, did you snowboard when you lived in Chicago? I did? Okay, what do you know, I forget the little will you know? That's just get in there. Woman. Woman is a terrible hill.

But I had a lot of fun. My mom on Saturday morning would drop me off at the y m c A. And for like, I don't know what it was, twenty or thirty bucks. They would bust the kids up there. You know, we'd ski for the day and then come back, you know, come back down. Were you ever skier first? Were you always snowboarder? Now? I grew up skiing. I mean I'm old enough that you know when I first

started out, snowboarding didn't even really exist. I was there for that first wave when Burton Snowboards were putting out these wood snowboards that you would strap in. You know, you were you wearing Surrell boots that didn't right right right right right? You know, I'm going to the sled hill and strapping in and going down and testing this out. Because I was skateboarding from a really young age. So when snowboarding came along to me for me, I was like,

oh man, that's what I want to do. And then you said your mother worked in the ski shop. She did. Yeah, she's That's exactly why she worked in the ski shop, trying to outfit to older brothers, to your sisters, trying to outfit five kids kids in ski gears, you know, expensive. So I think she worked there so she can make that happen. Okay, so you're in the middle. I'm the middle child, so you know, I'm a middle child tooth theoretically overlooked. You know, the hopes and dreams were in

the older ones. The younger ones you're babied and you're kind of ignored and go your own way. I'm pretty convinced my parents didn't know my name until, like I graduated high Well, how much older your older brothers and younger sisters. So, and that's another interesting thing. They waited a while for my sister. So I was never in high school with them. I was in his school with them. I was like on my own completely my older brothers. Also, the brother'spread above me is four and a half years

older than me. So by the time he left high school, I was going in when I was a freshman, he was already a freshman in college. So Uh, yeah, I was kind of on my own. And then how much older your oldest brother, Um, he's only a year older than one above me. So, and then what's the age

of your sisters. Um, let's see they're my sister is five years younger than me, and then the youngest is seven years younger than On some level, when you you know, the older ones were so old, you know, you you never really coexisted, you know, everybody was like so much older or younger. Yeah, in the house, we did, we definitely co existed. But outside of it, no, we're all kind of doing our own things. And you know, in the eighties is a different time. We're running around riding

our bikes. Everybody's just like having fun. There was no Okay, now you're from north Brook, Illinois. Yes. The only thing I know about north Brook, Illinois supposedly the speed skating capital of the world. That's wow. You have done your research. Yes, I watched a lot of TV. I don't know how to do. Wow. Yeah, that's right. They practice over there, right at the sled hill. Um. Uh and uh yeah, there's a pool over there that I was a lifeguard at from many years. Um. But they that's where they

practiced right by the sled hill. But in the community, is it like, is it something where they're trying to drag people into the sport or which just happens to be there, just happens to be there. And I think, you know, they had some success early on, and then those guys kept going back to north Brook and it cultivated, you know, this small group of people and it's it's

still around. I mean I talked to one of my friends the other day and I forget the gold medalists that still lives there and you know, trains people there. I mean they you know, they've got a small facility and I don't know, just became one of these things that happened in north Brook, Illinois. Okay, so you're in north What are your sisters and brothers do for a living now or what are their lives about. Um My

oldest brother, Russ is um Um. He sells satellite dishes to trucking companies so truckers can have TV on the road. That's pretty good. It's an interesting thing. That's his own business that he started with a buddy of his. Um Rich is uh here in um he was into movie producing. He lives in the Palace Stads as well. Um, but he stopped that and went into the internet side of things. He does Zephyr, which their office is actually very close

to where we're sitting here. Zephyr is a kind of a um YouTube analytics company and they, you know, work with YouTube channels. Okay, and your two sisters, two sisters, Um, let's see, my youngest takes care of her her two kids. She's in the Bay Area, San Francisco. Um. And then my other sister lives close to my mom in Salt Lake. My mom after my dad, Mom and dad retired, they

made their way out west. They were in Las Vegas for a few years, and then they made their way to Salt Lake because a few of my brothers and sisters are there. And now everybody's still alive. My dad's passed away, but my mom still here and all the kids are still here. Okay, So what does everybody think of your success? Disbelief? Disbelief because of the genre where they never believed in you. No, they always believed in me. Becau, It's like, how Ryan will be fine whatever this guy

wants to do. My mom's like my youngest sister told that story recently. Mom said, you're the golden child. Okay, I don't remember hearing that, but that's awesome. Um yeah, I think you know, I was a hard worker coming up, so I think they thought I would have success no matter what I You know, all my brothers and sisters are successful, you know what I mean. Yeah, but we all know if you're successful in dance music, it's incredibly lucrative. You know. It's not like you go on the rail.

It's like being a comedian. You take your microphone and maybe a road manager. There's a little bit more. Maybe take your laptop or USB stick or your turntables. But there are these high fees which are paraded everywhere in the news now, and you have to pay an agent, maybe you have to pay a manager. But it's very lucrative. Yeah, and they like to rib me about that. I mean, you know, typically my family gets together once a year, at least once a year, and it's usually around July four.

My mom's got a cabin in Idaho over by Jackson Whole, Wyoming, beautiful part of the country anyway, But typically because of my schedule, me and my family, we fly private and this causes a lot of you know, hey, what's going on here? Guys? Fancy plane coming? So my siblings love to you know, where's the airport there? I usually find Idaho Falls, but sometimes I've flown into Jackson. Just depends, you know. Okay. Then another question. You've made all this money.

Your relatives asked for money? Not too much? No? Um, I don't know. Are they scared? This might be listening. I don't say anything you don't want to say. No, I listen. On my side of family, I mean people have done okay. I don't think anyone is you know, and whatever. I've been there a few times to help out when now needed. But okay, and then you know, a lot of times rock stars or famous musicians like by their parents a house or a car or something. Did you go through any of that? I haven't. I

haven't needed to. My dad was he did well? And he set it up so that my mom, you know, it's fine and everyone. Okay. Well let's stay with the money because around this topic, what do you do with the money? Um, I have a couple of houses. Uh, but there's a lot more money than a couple of houses. Yes there is. I mean you have it in stocks? Do you have it in companies. What do you do with that? I've invested a lot of it. Um, I've been very conservative. This is this is where I wish

my dad was alive. You know, he would help us the way as things really started to go crazy. Um, And yeah, you've been able to help me out. But you know I've done well. I've I've been very conservative. Okay, conservative means were like index funds or you're buying blue chips. Okay, all of that. And are you aware of where all your needs? Yes? I am, okay, because you know the legendary stories of people not so much recently being ripped off by their financial advisors. My wife forwards me every

single one of those articles. She was my business manager for ten years. She's been very involved in my business. And she was my business manager for ten years and that was a hard one to pass over. And you know, she's always so scared, like where is everything? So yeah, we keep a close eye on it, and I'm fairly involved with where everything is and I get updated. But yeah,

I don't know the biggest thing. You know, I bought a really nice car recently, but well I was just sort into what car did your body my I should say my wife bought a really nice car, Naomi. My wife loves to drive. She loves to drive. And now she's getting her pilot's license, which we probably get it. She's getting a helicopter pilot's license, and so we'll probably be buying a helicopter here fairly soon. Okay, once time, once subject, one time. What car did you get? A

Porsche Targa. Okay, But the only thing about helicopters is when there's a problem, they go right down. Oh yeah, I mean, you know, I remember I've told her about this, and I remember flying in videos on YouTube. I remember flying in the helicopter to E d C. Okay, in the way over there. You know, it's a it's a helicopter full of people or they were all talking and whatever on the way back the four thirty in the morning, and it's just me who's awake, and the thing is

bouncing up and down. It's not like being in a commercial airplane. We said, well, this thing will never crash. Well it good crash. I think it's still a fairly safe way to travel. Okay, just since we're on the plane thing, let's go the point. So when you fly private, do you have a net jet account or an equivalent, or do you just book every time you go? Typically a book every time I go. That's what I'm doing.

Nine nine percent of the time I joined one of these things and I haven't even been able to use it. So why haven't you been able to? Just it doesn't work for me. It's one of these like kind of you know, jets on demand kind of thing, and you get on there and you pay a fee, and every time I go on there to use it, it's like never working for me. But I don't want to put this image out that I'm flying around plat private all

the time. Well no, Well, with the point being that people don't understand that it's not about luxury, it's about convenience. It's like, okay, uh, you know this is why you know, I don't want to sound go between the halves and have nuts. But if you talk about corporations, etcetera, they feel the value of time of the CEO. They don't want them sitting on the ground waiting to get on

the plane. For those of us who have flown private, the greatest things you show up and you leave, so you're not burning two hours, you know, right there, So you and I'm sure you've had this because all successful DJs have where you're playing multiple gigs in a day or night. Yes, and the only way to do it is to fly private, and it economically makes sense. So uh, you know, I completely understand that, even though people might

want to judge you on that. But going back to Chicago, so you grew up into Chicago, when are you interested in music right away? Right away? And your parents playing music in the house, Yes, they do, mommy and everything from Mormon Tamanac acquired to the b G East, you know, and everything above is like we're getting everything in the house. Um, and my mom's got a piano in the front room and everyone's required to take lessons. So you did take piano lessons. I did too for how many years now?

I quit very quickly, which is the funniest thing. I mean, my youngest sister is actually a really great player. I mean, she lasted the longest, I don't know, the baby of the family. I don't know. Maybe she was very diligent, I should say, Um, but I was the guy who quit the quick I mean I lasted like a few months and I just threw a tant from my mom. I think by the third kid, she's like, good, fine, whatever, you know, she's worn out. So now, did you have

a record player or stereo system in your room? I did? And then in high school I got a bigger system in my room. And okay, so when you're in high school, you say you're an entrepreneurial, did you have jobs? I did what you do? I did everything in bad groceries, at lasco h Valet, parked cars. I mean, and you did that because you wanted the money or your parents said you have to work. Both. We worked in the summer. In my house, we always did that, you know. My

dad made me mow the lawn and mold bonds. I was a lifeguard for many years. Um, but I enjoyed having money. I enjoyed having my own money. I mean, with five kids, there wasn't a lot of extra and if there was, it wasn't trickling down to me. Right, Okay, So you brought the stereo with your own money? Yep? And do you remember what it was? I don't. But the big amp that I had was my buddy Chad Calibix. It was his amp that he would the very first keyboard a profit. No, no, no, no, no, no, okay.

First off, talking about listening systems, did you have with your money that you made, did you buy a stereos you could play room music and not make music, but listen to music. Yes, okay, remember what that was? Okay, nothing flashy, okay. But you were then buying cassette, c ds, vinyl what uh vinyl? There was a dog Ear Records very close to my house, which was a thing in the Midwest, I believe, and they had an arcade and a vinyl section, and I liked vinyl and vinyl was cheaper.

I just liked the format. And so what the kind of music? Were you buying a lot of classic rock? Because I had told her brothers, you know, led Zeppelin, the Who, um, you know, the Police. I'm buying all this classic rock stuff. This is all coming through. And then when my brothers went to college, when the first one he came back, and it was like the Cure, the Smith's And this is when I'm in middle school and I started getting into this new wave stuff. Um yeah,

I just man that stuff. Then it was you know, craft work and more into the electro and technopop and like the early electro stuff, and it was a bit of everything really Okay. Now, famously Chicago is the home of house music, that's where it started. Were you aware of that to a degree? And I think this play is a big part in my story. Well then lay it on us. Yeah, I think. Look, I'm growing up in Chicago. My that summer before, I was a freshman,

so I've graduated eighth grade, amount of middle school. Um, my brother that's right above me, Rich is going into nightclubs in the city. He's going to college. And they had a lot of like all age clubs were a thing back their team clubs, juice bars, you know whatever, juice bars. Kids are going, they're doing drugs, they're doing whatever, but they're staying out. Um, you could go to these things. There wasn't really an age requirement. I mean, I just think it was a much more care free time. I

don't even think that stuff exists now. Um. Anyway, that summer I went to my first night club and it was a lot of Wax tracks, which was like an early industrial ministry and you know, early depeche Mode and kind of like heavy sounding stuff but mixed with early house records because they're similar tempo. Right, So these things that kind of on craft work and all this is kind of happening, and that first experience, I was like,

this is it. I mean, I was in I went to Medusa's was the name of the club, um, whatever. I'd liked getting on the train, you know, going into the city with my brother, We're going out, We're staying out til midnight. You know, this was a big deal. And I just everything about it, the culture, the people, everything around this scene amazed me, and I just was like,

I want to be a part of this. Of course, I was up at the booth watching what the DJ was doing, and the DJ at that point didn't play as an important noble role as it does today, but it was still kind of an art and a craft and I understood that, and I was just very interested. You know, technically, what is this guy doing. See two record players, see this mixer? What is this guy doing? You know, he's doing these blends, and you know he's playing four in five hours and has this big arc

through the night and controls the crowd. The whole thing was very interesting to me. And the music was very simple at the time, so me, you know, I had musical ideas. I was like, I could do this you know, I was looking at the DJ. I'm like, I think I understand what he's doing. I could do this anyway. Fast forward a few years, I kept going to this nightclub and going more often, and you know, midweek parties started having Okay, but what are your parents saying? My

parents were cool. They were just kind of like, what are you doing in the city. What's going on? I'm like, I'm dancing, you know, and they're like, how do you dancing? What do you My dad thought that was funny, you know, show us how you dance. What are you doing. I'm like, we're dancing like this and it's awesome and it's you know, hundreds of people there and it's a fun time. And I think my parents were just happy that I was out doing something. Not they didn't care that you were

out till midnight. As long as I was home on time. They were cool with it. Because my parents, I was a middle child. I mean, they really cracked down on my older sister, but they just trusted me I could do whatever I want to come out. Oh yeah, my brother's got the beat down, especially the oldest one. And that's the way it is. Even my oldest child. Now, if she for sure gets the worst. You know, by the time you get to the second one, you're like

loosening up. The third one you're like whatever. So in any event, you go to the club say hey, I think I can do this. What's the next up really for me? Then I just started buying all these records that I'm here because it's not stuff you can really get on the radio. And I think this is where Chicago comes into play, right, because it's accessible. Right, I'm part of this scene and this click of people that are listening to these records and these DJs are playing.

I mean, there's parties going on. Gramophone Records is not too far from the nightclub that I'm frequenting, you know, it's like three blocks away, so it's in the same neighborhood. So I could go to Gramophone, which is arguably the first specialty like house music record store in the world. Um, and I'm flipping through there and I'm it can listen all my money at that points going into records and

I'm like flipping through this stuff. I think my first time with a set of turntables because this stuff is too expensive, equipments too expensive for Ford, you know, I can get a record here and there and whatnot, but to get a set of twelve and a mixture that's way beyond my reach. Um, A kidd ripped some off and we're at his house, one of these houses. He ripped off some turntables from where, you know, he's like, I saw him in a car, but I could care less.

I just was like, I want to try this. And you know, that night, instead of going to the club, we're up, you know, for hours, just trying to figure out what they're doing and understanding the beat matching and that. I mean, it wasn't until years later that I got my own set up. And then I was like, okay, cool, you know, Okay, so you're in a high school. How old are you when this friend, uh lifts these turntables? Okay, So at this point you're just collecting records, collecting records, okay,

and you do this at the friends house. What do you say, Oh, this is just a fun night, or no, this is a career path. No, man, just a fun night. I never thought career path until very recently. In the in the big picture of this story, it was a recent thing. Okay. So when you graduate from high school, you still don't own any turntables okay. And how many records do you think you own? You're an avid collector. Okay. So now it comes time to go to college, you go to b y U. Okay. Having lived in Utah

for a couple of years. Although back in the seventies, you know, b y U is the epicenter of LDS and although religious and you are LDS, you are more men. Uh. And that would be a place, but it's known as being a relatively conservative place. Okay, So how does that work for you? Uh? Is eye opening? Look a kid growing up in Chicago. My my brothers both went to be by you and they're like, hey, it's great, it's fun,

it's cool. And I think that for me, I wanted to go there because I wanted to be around other Mormons. We'll take a quick break and come back with more of my conversation with Cascade. Recorded at the tune In Studios in Venice, California. This podcast is brought to you by tune In, which brings together all the live, sports, music, news and podcasts you love, original live and on demand audio, all in one place. Go to tune in dot com slash left sets to download and listen. Okay, let's get

back to my conversation with Cascade. Okay, so you've gotta be yu and your expectations. Recording to your brother is gonna be great, but what's your experience. I loved it, and I think once again, this kind of plays back to me launching my career. So I've got creates of records and my brothers. I'm in one of these uh you know, for lack of a better term, fraternity, it's more like a social club. They didn't call fraternities there. They get suspended or whatever, but it's essentially a social

club of fraternity. And they're like, we need to throw a party and raise some money. And I'm like, I got create some records. I know how to spend these things, I think. So we hire some mobile DJ guy and I'm like, yo, I'll play the music that night. I just need your equipment. So that was my first like real gig. This is nine okay, and how many nights

had you spend on the turntables? Very few? I mean this is like, you know a bunch of kids from southern you know, these are all like transplants that are living in Provo, Utah. I'm like they're not going to know. The difference I'll try is that your attitude in life in general, you fake it till you make it. No, not really, but I just knew I listen. I was confident that I could do it. Okay, So but once again, to what degree do you fit in? Kid from in

Chicago and going to nightclubs every night now in conservative Provo, Utah. Um. I made lifelong friends there that first year because I was meeting kids. I met a kid from San Francisco became a really good friend, another kid from Cocoa Beach, Florida. You know, I was meeting people from all over the place. Some kid from Venezuela. So I was meeting all these different kids and hearing about their experiences growing up Mormon whatever.

For me it was it was cool. I not everyone has a good experience there, but for me it was great. I was the only reason I asked because you didn't go back there, you ultimately talking through the University of Utah. That was because my lack of studying that first year. I had a lot of fun that first year. I was really tan when I went home. It was a very warm spring. So when I showed back home, and when I showed it back home in Chicago, I was like tan from playing frisbee out at the park and

you know, but let's speak English here. Were you not asked back to be while you So I went on a mission after my first year, okay? Just so I know for traditionally is that when people go, Yes, now a lot of kids go before they start school. That kind of seems like a better time. Now people are just you know, go to high school, go on the mission, then come back and start college. I went to my first year, my freshman year, okay, and then you go on the mission to Japan, Japan. But so that's for

two years. Two years. In those two years, do you come back to the States at all? No? And you go to Japan with how many other people as a group of eight of us, but there's already like a hundred and sixty missionaries living in might I say Tokyo. It's like northern Tokyo and the northern suburbs of Tokyo. It's a large area that that covers. So like in your town, say Santa Monica, there would be two missionaries, you know, a station there, and then you go to

like Culver City, there would be another two missionaries, you know. Okay, so you're living with another guy in some sub of Tokyo and then you have your own apartment with his job. Yes, and what's the what are you supposed to do every day? Uh? Proselyte, teach, but you talk to people about Yeah, but you don't speak Japanese right now? I mean I took a crash course for two months before you go out, um, which is you know, crash course. And how how are you

going to talk to these people one language wise? And what are you going to talk to them about? What's what's the right way to approach this? In my life up to this point, you know, my conversations about being Mormon were like just with my friends from high school and whatever, and like oh, hey, this is what I believe or what do you believe? And so kind of refining that process. And then then really it takes me. You know, luckily learning Japanese wasn't it wasn't that hard.

I would say, it wasn't that hard for you? People are good with languages. I was that was it? It was? Which is weird because I failed out of Spanish in high school. It's like one of those things I wanted to do. I wanted to learn Janace and I was there and early on the second place that I lived, I was actually living with the Japanese guy. So I'm like, man, I better start really hitting the books. And I studied hard.

I mean every day I would up, you know, at the crack of dawn, studying for an hour or two before we went out. And you know, we're meeting people. So I was studying and carrying around vocabulary words. But I'd say a year into it, I felt like confident I could have a discussion. So you how does it actually work you knock on someone's door, and Japan that's kind of culturally a little not so nice. Um So, we spent a lot of time because I was in or really close to Tokyo the majority of my mission.

Um So I would hang around the train station a lot of times, or and just like walk up to random people, Hey, you know, what do you know about Jesus Christ, and like have a conversation if they want to or not. You know, there's a lot of ceto desks like I'm okay, I'm okay, okay, cool um But and then other times people just referrals they hear about somebody who's Mormon and their friends Mormon and they want

to learn about it or you know, so there's that. Okay, So sometimes you're educating people who have already been converted to a degree as opposed to trying to find Now it's sort of like being a salesman. I would think you get a lot of rejection, Yes, a lot, And how does that feel? How do you handle? That? Didn't bother me really, I mean I grew up in Chicago, so I was like, okay, not everyone interested in religion like I am. You know, I grew up in a

Jewish neighborhood. I knew that. You know, this is part of the deal. You know, people have different thoughts and ideas and and whatever. I think. Missionaries are there and my primary job was to speak to people that are looking for something and that want help. You know. So okay, cool. The key is to find those people, right, to come in contact with those people. Okay. So two years go by and then you go back to Utah. Yeah, why

do you not go back to b y Uh? Actually I went to New York and worked for a Japanese company. I went to New York for a year, which Okay, so it's important. So okay, so you gotta b y U for a year, you go to Japan for two years, then you go to New York to work for a Japanese company. How does that come together? Uh? I just interviewed with the company. I was like, I'm going back. I didn't have any money, you know. I was like, you know, I got to go back to school. I

could use the job. So I interviewed with this Japanese company that was hiring like a lot of Mormon kids because oh cool, these kids can speech Japanese. So we're tour guides around the city of New York. Um, which is funny. I've been to New York a few times, but I didn't know the city that well. So, you know, like telling these people about New York City And I actually didn't know that much, but I learned. How long

were you a tour guide? For about a year? And you know, wouldn't most people go back to college instead of having a tour guide job? Yeah? Probably? Did your parents where your parents concerned that you might not go back to college? No? Not at this point, I think there's still like what's he doing? I mean they were like that a lot around me. What's Ryan doing? Okay? So if you're living in New York, do you need any of their money or you can make enough money

to make it. I was making money, okay, So New York epicenter of dance music are you involved in? I'm going out. I'm going out every night that I can. I mean, I'm working like a dog. The place worked me like crazy. I mean I kept my time sheets for a long time because I was like, man, we could sue these guys, right, we need over time, you know. Um.

But yeah, I'm going out. A lot of stuff is happening because it's two thousand three, two thousand four, I mean, dance music is in New York and full swing can't be They kept gonna be like, yes, sorry, you very much have lost the techade. Okay. I trying to make sure here, Okay, okay, so yeah, so but not the dance music isn't happening. But if we're working on the timeline, so there's a lot of stuff happening up going out

club USA. It was in full swing. That was right there in Times Square, right off of Time to Square. Um lion light was happening, um, which there was a line Light in Chicago as well that I went to in high school. So you know, it was just cool dance music had matured a bit more. I'd become more musical. It was less just drums and bass, less industrial um. But that's really at that point. I saved up enough money, bought my own setup, went back to Utah. I went

back to you and bought my own set up. Okay, I've got some records, I've got some equipment. I'm playing some stuff here and there. I go back to Utah. Let's just be clear. You buy the turntables in New York or in Utah. In Utah, E mail ordered this stuff. Okay, Okay, So if this when you leave New York you're just interested in the scene, you go back to Utah, and what's your plan get through college? Okay? Why do you go to the U as they say and salt like

the University of Utah as opposed to by you? Uh? Because I knew I wasn't getting back in to by U. My first year was terrible. So if you wanted to go back to b y U, that would they that would have been a problem. It would have I didn't even reapply because after you've taken a break, and I've been off too and have three years now, and like, okay, either reapply and get rejected. I can go to the U and the University Utah is a great school, and

salt Lake is happening place. Thing is when I lived in Salt Lake, I lived in the Avenues and we were all ski bumps, and uh, I'd already graduated from college. With my two roommates. They would go to the U and they would sign up for the winter some you know, for the spring semester. It would snow when they drop out. They eventually graduated, but right up there, I took a few winners semesters. Basically off, I'd take one or two classes,

right and you and you'd go snowboarding. Where would you go? Brighton had a season passed the Brighton for four years? Okay, big cotton Wood can Okay. So now you go back to Utah and you do buy the turntables, and you buy the Wolf hundreds. Second, and you buy a mixture, you say, you buy a mail order. You remember who you ordered it from? Prose, sound and stage. Okay, this

is where everybody's buying the stuff from. They saying these catalogs and this is kind of like they were the DJ place, you know, but this is back before the internet. You know, you'd get these catalogs and right yeah, so okay, so you have an apartment where you're living in Utah, uh just right downtown third East. Um. Yeah, and then I moved to the avenue is I had an ane. I had a house on eleventh Avenue in between D and E. Okay, so I mean I was in that

little area. Okay, So you have your turntables, you're going to school. How much you work in the turntables and practicing a lot at that point a lot because I had time on my hands. I thought I was busy, but being a Japanese guid in New York, you weren't busy. And at this point you're just having fun and you say, I'm gonna get good, I'm gonna work. I'm having fun.

I'm having a lot of fun. I'm snowboarding a and I'm spinning records a lot record at this point, at this point of a much better student because I had put my mind that I can get through school. I had learned a lot of good study habits while I was in Japan. I'll say that I've learned some discipline while I was in Tokyo, so that was a good thing. Came out of it much better student. But I'm spending basically, I'm spending my days and nights going to school, spinning

records and snowboarding. That was it. Okay, when you're spinning records just for yourself, you're playing gigs a lot in my bedroom, just hanging out playing records. And in nine five, this is kind of when at all changed for me. It was the first time like, oh, you can make money doing this. We all of a sudde a part time job selling jeans at the Chalk Garden. Do you

remember Trollie Square of course seventies. I worked at this place called the Chock Garden Tarlie Square, and I lost my job and I still my parents were helping me out at this point. But you were losing You lost your job. War Oh, I don't know, they're cutting back. I don't know. And deeans weren't selling like okay, but it was this wasn't wasn't your behavior? No, no, no, okay.

So your parents were still helping you out a little selp me out a little bit, but um, not enough that I could just like live on what they're sending me. You know, there was a small monthly stipend, and like I needed a job to supplement that if I wanted to eat um and put gas in the car in my Honda Accord. So anyway, that's I approached this club called Club Manhattan. Was a small club. The capacity was

two people. That was not making that up the sign on the door people and I said, what's your worst night of the week, Because I've got crates of records that nobody has heard. And by this time, I mean, I'd put a lot of time into the craft, you know, to three years, I'd honed the craft a bit um and he's like, Monday night, I can't get anybody in here. Let's start from the beginning. Now, you're living in Utah,

where you're buying your records. A lot of mail orders still from Grammophone, so you could call guys up and be like, all right, I've got seventy five box, you know what's hot this week, and they'd send you stuff. But San Francisco has got a great tweak. In was another record store in San Francisco, Lower Hate. They were mail ordering stuff here in l A beating non stop. Um was a massive record store in melrose Um. So there's a lot of guys you could call up and

they were shipping you stuff. So I'm getting records sent to me and is there anybody doing this in Utah? Prior to you? Is there anybody there is? So there is one record store in Utah. But in terms of in terms of DJs, there was some guys doing it. There was a dude from San Francisco, Nick Cameron, another guy from l a Um. You know, there were guys doing it. Okay. So you got to this club and you say, and he says Monday nights by weeknight. You say,

I'm like give it to me. And he's like, all right, cool um, and he's like, we'll just split the door. I'm like, all right, cool, We've got to charge a couple of bucks at the door. You know, it was mainly students. I was gonna, you know, just hit up my friends, you know, call him up. Anyway, Monday night was a smash. The first night we did, like foreignered people showed up. Okay. That must have been because you worked your phone so to speak, you told all your

friends to come. You know what it was. It was snowboarding because me and my roommates, it's a very social thing. Just like you said, you had all these skier buddies. There's like this community of people, I mean people that are coming from like Amsterdam, that lived there for the season. So we knew all these people because it was not only I'm not the only guy snowboard every day, me and all my buddies that we're all living together, and

do we just put the word out? Sure enough foreignered people. Later, I'm like, this is a smash. The club owners freaking out. You know, I'm walking home with like three hundred bucks in my pocket. I'm like, I am king of the world. I'm not gonna sell jeans again ever, you know. So I that was a lot of money at the time for me. Okay, So now it's the following Monday night, so it just keeps going. I was there at that club for five years doing Monday nights and I only

missed a couple of them the entire time. So after you tap the snowboard crew, does word get out in town? Yeah, because it's a small town. I mean you're talking like what a million people or something like this, So that whole valley and dude, there's no other competition on Monday night. Like, so that was the place if you went out Monday night, that was the place to go. So then, you know, we raised the door price to five bucks. The entire cities showing up at this place, it becomes a problem.

The city is trying to shut me down. They wrote me a few citations to the club, you know, over overcrowding, all this stuff, you know, serving a mind, you know. So it was a hit, and then I started doing other I did a Thursday night for them, and then people around town started hiring me. Um. But all of this is happening, and it's the first time I had

a little bit of cash. So I started buying studio equipment about my first day to eight drum machine, rolling nine O nine and other drum machine and s H one O one small keyboards. I started like amassing equipment and that's how it's spending my days, so that by this time I'm out of school. I'm like, okay, I I love this Madonna record, Vogue whatever, but I don't like the arrangement. So I start getting in digital audio workstation.

I had a you know, a Mac you know, pretty basic Mac but I had a four track pro tools set up on there on my first copy of Logic, and that's really where I just started getting into it. And then it's just like all in. Once that happened and I had a small setup, I was like, okay, this is what I was doing every day. UM. And I put together put together my first kind of record that I sold commercially. Um, and it's a bad record.

How did you do that? Though? You recorded it, and how did you get it in terms of press distributed, etcetera. So press the Rainbow Records, Rainbow Records, Yeah, it used to be. Okay, I've been marrigelist, right, So I called those guys up. And that's what people on the West coast, that's where who they were, right, We're kind of like the premier guys. Um. And uh. During all this the records store UM that was local in town, which I

basically was hanging out a lot. You know, it's very John Cusack, you know, like hanging out just like arguing over what records are better. And you know, this is where you know, practice tej. It's just like where all the DJs were hanging out. Um. But one of the owners left, uh to to go work in Korea for the Olympics, so I bought her half out. So I was part owner in this record store. But I had

a relationship with the record distributors. So I was like, listen, I buy thousands of dollars records from you guys every week. I've got a record I'm gonna sell to you, and you guys are gonna buy it. I don't care if you think it's crap. And they did. They bought it. Okay, but did anybody vided retail? Uh yeah, I mean listen, we're talking back then. A couple of thousand copies was the success, right, You're making like a thousand bucks, Oh my gosh. Yeah. But you know, so the people in

Utah bought it. They knew who you were. Yeah. But and it was a drum and bass record, so it's a very niche thing. It was a very like London sounding record. Um. You know, it's hard to even track at that point because you're just selling it. But the point is you make a deal, you ship the records. If they don't tell, they usually come back. Yeah, they didn't come back, so so you assume they sold such a small quantity. Okay, but even so a thousand records,

somebody had to buy it. Okay, so you make that record, what's the next step? Um, well, this is kind of you know, late nineties, so things are starting to happen again for dance music because the late nineties early two thousand's that was kind of that first wave of moby and you know what do they called it? Electronica? And you know, everybody was bracing for this thing that was

coming that never came. But um, you know, so I was getting gigs and I was starting to do stuff, and um, my wife at this point, uh, well married in ninety six, so a little a little bit slower. How do you meet your wife snowboarding? Really? And did she what was she doing in Salt Lake that She's from northern California. She was one of these girls who

would come to Salt Lake. I met her, Um, she came back and I met her again, because it would just come up for the season, right, this is where these people do these guys, Yeah, they exactly, yeah, and you know, and they'd ride and you'd see them and you'd be friends with them, and then they'd leave and I'd stay there. Did she go to college? She she graduated from you. So then so you know her for a couple of years before becomes of romance. No, I knew her. I met her, she came back, and right

away I was interested in. I was like, oh, yeah, I remember her from last year. She's awesome, you know, and she responds, yeah, it's good. Okay, Okay, So how long after you meet or do you get married? Eight months? Eight months? Well, it's last day, so it's good. I mean, listen, in Mormon world, that's like that's that's ten years. So yeah, I was quick because okay, so you get married, how big a ceremony is it? Um? Hundred friends and family

in San Francisco? Um, what's the entertainment? Okay? No, DJ okay. So anyway, you're living in Utah, you're married, You're on the half of this record store. So what happens next? You put out a record, put out a record, you know whatever, a little bit of success. Um, well, I just kind of start noticing the industry. I'm like, who's successful in this industry and what's working? And I'm kind of just trying to pay attention because I'm like, can I make a living doing this? Like? How does it work?

You know? Um? Because here I am the kid of a conservative family, and my dad was just conservative across the board, meaning financially. He was very like, you know, go to college, get a degree, get a job, you know, just follow the path, you know, stay on course, you know. And here I am like, I want to do music like and I wasn't even necessarily saying that because I was scared to say that out loud because I didn't

want to. I wanted to be successful. So I was like, I don't know, music is fun and right, right, right, right, but I'm trying to do all this other stuff. I was working in an ad agency for a brief period of time, you know, doing graphic design for them, and um, you know, I felt really comfortable on a computer. So I was doing various jobs here and there. Um, but really I just started to understand how the business of

independent music was working. And I should say, independent dance music, Okay, you can press the record, you can sell it, Okay, you can get these gigs. And I slowly started getting gigs outside of Utah, very slowly. Where the very first gig I went to outside of Utah was in Soul, Korea. This guy is like he's passing through salt Lake gets one of my mix tapes. He's like, this is brilliant. I'll fly out here for a ticket and you play for nothing, but you can stay on my couch. And

I'm like, all right, cool. Late nineties. I go to Korea, I get a you know, I get a gig in Orange County. Like little things are happening, very small things, but I think it was enough to be like, Okay, potentially this could work. You're just gonna keep doing it. Not only that, the club is still happening at this time, so I'm still making money doing it, um, you know, and I'm just buying I mean, dude, I'm buying so much music because I'm just a junkie at this point.

I'm just buying music, buying studio gear, and you know, putting nothing into like where I live. You know, I'm still living like a college student, needing like five dollar pizza every night. You know. So it's all going into music and studio equipment. Um. And really, when my wife graduated in two thousand, uh, she's like cool, she's not from salt Lake. She didn't feel any attachment to that play ace. And you know, I've been there for seven years or eight years whatever, adding all this time up

of me going in and out of that place. I didn't really either. And I was like, okay, cool, you know, I'd spent some time in New York, and so let's go to New York. She's like, no, let's go to San Francisco where she's from. She's from Reading, which is way north. Oh yeah, that's not San Francisco. No, it's not not at all. Um, that's a stretch. But her grandma lived in San Francisco, and she felt like that's

a place, and that's happening. And I think a lot of Reading people kind of end up in San Francisco at her you know, or Santa Cruz or you know, in that area. We just were like, okay, whoever can get a job first, that's where we'll go. So at the time, you know, I'm emailing my attaching my resume and sending it out to these job places in New York, which was a very tech thing at the time. I was very proud of me to be able to do that. Um,

and she just got in the car. I mean maybe like not even a week after we graduate, she packed up the car and drove San Francisco calls me up like three days later. It's like, I got a job. Okay, wait, just stop you a little bit. You're married, you living in a couple. She's leaves, she packs up the car and goes to York and says it goes San Francisco and says, what I've got it because we had this kind of thing going. Whoever gets a jibo. But when you say when she left Salt like she didn't have

the job. No, She's like, I'm gonna go there and get a job. Which, if I'm sure, if I would have flown to New York, I probably have been a lot more successful, you know, Okay, should be there in people's faces. And she understood that. Okay. So she goes San Francisco, gets what kind of job? I'm just working for like one of these dot com you know things that's happening. Okay. So she calls you and says, this is our deal. You gotta move out. She's like, I

got a job. It's a great job, pays okay, you know, loaded up, And I'm like, oh man, she did it. So I loaded up, we moved to San Francisco. UM, definitely take a step back in lifestyle move into a crumby apartment that was terrible. I couldn't fit my studio into you know, my gear, my racks of gear. I'm like, I can't fit into this. This is but it's all we could afford at the time, So don't What do you do with the stuff? I put this stuff in

storage momentarily, um and until I figured out something. You know, it took me a while to figure some stuff out, a few variations of living. You know, we're bouncing around in different apartments. When we first got there, we just lived with a friend you know, crash on his floor apartment and it was tough. I mean, but saying the cool thing, and this is crucial to my story, I think, Um, I kind of saw this wave again of excitement. I mean, San Francisco in the early two thousand's was just crazy.

There's piles of money being loaded into the city. The dot com thing is going crazy. Rents are going through the roof, but everyone's out partying every night. So the club scene and just deejaying is just it's going crazy. The whole thing is going crazy. So I recognized that because I had experienced that first wave in Chicago when I saw house music break, which it took me moving to Salt Lake to be like, oh man, not everywhere

is experiencing this. That was That was Chicago, New York, London. Wow. You know. I had to get that separation, that distance to be able to look at it and be like, wow, I was in the middle of something that was a cultural phenomenon and I had no idea. But I was more of kind of onlooker, you know. I wasn't like actively participating. I mean, I was going out and dancing, but I wasn't like making waves. I wasn't one of these guys setting the trends. I was just following them.

But in San Francisco, I kind of realized that a second wave was happening, and it was going on there in the city. And part of that, I think was because the arts were flourishing, because there was so much money around, so all these artists and studios and just so much was going on in the city. Um, and this is when Naked Records and Home Records and all these little like boutique small labels that I was paying

attention to really started to thrive. Um. And I got a record at I got a job at Own Records. Just to be clear, you moved to San Francisco, your wife has his job before you get the job at Own Records, or do you have a different job. I went to the distributor that I was buying records from in San Francisco, TRC Distribution, and worked for them for a few months until I got my job with the label. Okay, how many people worked at home when you work there? Um,

it's about ten full employees. How hard was it to get that job? My timing was good, the owner needed an assistant, and I had been pitching the music. I had been sending them some of my demos and had bought one of them under a different Moniker. Skylight was this other thing. So I had a relationship with the owner. I showed up. I didn't, you know, have anything going on. I'm working at this distributor. It's like basically just at an art you know, a warehouse fulfilling record store orders,

you know, and talking to record stores on the phone. Um, And he's like, yeah, the guy who has your job is just left. He left to do this digital thing. iTunes are going to start this thing over Apple. I don't know if this is gonna work. You know who knows Bruno you Bara had just recently left. That was his old assistant, and he was there at the ground floor when they started iTunes um And you know, funny

to think back on that. Um, but yes, I stepped into his spot and they needed somebody and it was cool because I could I could listen to all the demos and filter stuff through to the boss. And and but I was also a DJ, and I was also pitching him demos, and I could run their studio. They had a small studio, so I was running sessions at that studio. By this time, I've got some time under my belt and I feel, you know, fairly comfortable at a at a mixing desk, and like, I know what

I'm doing. Um. And it was a help that I had graphic design stuff too, so you know, I mean, at these small labels, everybody does everything right. We're all pitching him to make this thing move on, and it was working and it was a good time for them. They had a compilation series, the you know early two thousand compilations were doing really well. Um. That a compilation series, the Home Lounge that was doing awesome. And Mark Farina

with Mushroom jazz. He's one of their premier artists on that label, and it was a fun time and I was there for a couple of years until well, I launched the name Cascade really soon after I got there and got more demos in the mix and my my, I was making music then that I felt like, Okay, this is commercially viable. And I was influenced by the scene and what was happening. It was kind of this hybrid of Chicago meets San Francisco because San Francisco house

music was very melodic compared to Chicago. Chicago stuff was very gritty, very you know, eight bits sounding very low fi, and San Francisco was more smooth and beautiful and melodic. So I was like, I can marry these two worlds and I make my own sound. Um. But that was another thing. I think that was the first time I experienced then this is kind of like remember sneaker pimps

and stuff. That wave of kind of down Tomple electronic music was happening, and it was clear to me that songwriting was an important part of what electronic music was going because back dude, even to this day of electronic music, instrumental you know, uh, and I sat in on these sessions and I was getting hired for remixes and the remixes were doing well, and I was like, man, production styles here and are there? I mean, I have my own preferences of how I like things to sound, but

songwriting is really the key. I mean, if you write a good song, it stays, you can produce it this way or that, when it doesn't matter, people are gonna love it. So that's what with that idea is where I launched Cascade. I'm like, this is going to be melodic based. Because up in the until Ryan Radden tracks and raid On tracks and all these other little names

that I was testing out, we're just me experimenting. But with Cascade, I was like, it's going to be more melodic, it's gonna be song based, and I'm gonna try my handed songwriting. Because I had a friend who was like, man, your dude, it's all about songwriting, and you're a pretty good writer. You should you know. You need to try and put your ideas into a song and that's really what's gonna set you apart. And I agreed. So then I was like, Okay, cool, that's my that's my lane.

Because I could see that the guys that were doing successful, they all kind of had their thing. You know. Mcgallen Niggs was huge in the city at the time, and he was like, you know, he had his thing. He had a whole vibe and his music had this style. So anyway, that's that's kind of we're up to that point. Okay. Two questions. How long after you moved to San Francisco do you move to a place where your equipment can

be in the apartment? Yourn a couple of years, okay, so you really can only work when you're at home. Actually it was a year and a half now that I think about it. I was on Polk Street. Yeah, I was working at home, So was a bunch of my equipment into home, now that I think about that, Okay, And although one can look it up on the internet, people are certainly going be fascinated. How do you come up with the name Casscade? I had sold some music to a Chicago label and it was the first kind

of jaunt in this more song based stuff. And it's funny the A and R over there Lady D who's an accomplished DJ in her own right and producer and whatnot. I was like, I don't want to name it Ryan Rad and she's like, well, you got two weeks to come give me a name, you know, because this thing is gonna go to press and we've gotta do art work. So take the two weeks and you know, whenever two weeks goes by, and like, literally the night before I'm just like flipping through a nature book and there's a

picture of a waterfall and I'm like cascade. And I go to my wife, Hey, what do you think a cascade? And then you know, the next day at launch, you know, we're all sitting there in the office and what do you guys think a cascade? And they're like, yeah, it's cool, it's memorable. Cascade is super memorable. And I just liked the idea because I wanted it. I wanted the sound of this project to be more organic. I wanted it to feel and I always liked nature and I thought

cascade is cool. And then my wife is like, oh, but there's you got to change the spelling. I'm like, I'll just use kids instead of seas and no, I don't know because she's like, oh, there's a dish detergent. That's that. And I'm like, okay, we'll change the spelling. And that was it. And it's funny when I called the and are like, all right, I've got the name, She's like, it took you two weeks to come up with that? Are you serious? Oh man? To like, she

just brought me right back down to earth. You're listening to my conversation with Cascade, recorded at the tune In Studios in Venice, California. I hope you're enjoying this episode of the Bomb Left Sets podcast. If you want to see videos, photos, and sound bites from Cascade and our other guests, visit apt tune in on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram to see them with me in the studio. Now more of my chat with Cascade on the Bob Left Sets Podcast. Okay, so at this point we're in what year, um,

two thousand three, two thousand three. What's your wife doing? She got a job? The dot com thing fizzled out, whatever, she got a job working for Levi Strauss. Their headquarters is there in San Francisco, is working at their office? And what about that? What about issues of kids? No kids yet? Okay, we're still just loving life. Okay. Okay, so you suddenly your a cascade and they press up

this record, cascade. What's the next step? Um grinding it really from two thousand and three to the first like seven eight nine years. Really things started change in two thousand, eight thousand, nine thousand and ten. I think two thousand ten was kind of like a two thousand, nine thousand ten. That's when things changed. But up until then, just grinding. I was working the job, you know, fifty hours a week, and then I'm just in the studio every waking moment.

It's good that we didn't have kids, because I'm sure our relationship would have been destroyed. I was already hanging on by a threat because it's like, I'm in the studio, I'm at work. I'm in the studio, at work. But it was fun because you know, we're young, and we're enjoying the city and having a great time. And she's got a lot of friends in the Bay Area. So it worked. But I was putting out more records, putting out more records, seeing a little success, and I started

touring a lot. Okay, how did you start touring? Um after Home? Put me out on a couple of compilations and put out a couple of singles, That's when people started taking note because that record kind of had had cloud within this little scene, right and uh so when they kind of were like, hey, this guy's cool and

he's making cool music, that changed things. So people started phoning me up, and I got a booking agent and it was very She was in house at Owned Records for all the little small time artists that are big

enough to have a real booking agent. They would call through her and all the requests would come through her, and um I started digging, and then um I did my first like, uh, Australia to where I did, Like, well, well, before you get to Westralia, you're digging in the United States all over the place, how often almost every weekend, almost every weekend, and you're driving yourself there. You're flying flying. I'm solo, no tour manage or nothing like that, just

flying to these places. I mean, these gigs are playing like five, so you need a couple of those a week, you know, seven, eight, nine thousand bucks. O man, Okay, cool, I can make a living. You know, I'm doing anywhere from like five gigs a month to ten gigs a month, and you're still working, a still getting paid, a still getting paid at on that came to a crash landing. I kind of screwed up one of the projects while

I was away. Um, the artwork files weren't right. And I came back and he's like, look, it's cool, You're things starting to take off. You're not gonna be able to do both of these, but I wasn't at a point where we could survive. I needed both incomes really um to be living in San Francisco. So uh, he cut me away, which was very nice of him. Um. Chris Smith, the guy ran, I was really nice of him. Where was he today? He's still running own records, still

in San Francisco, um um. And I took my wife out to a very nice dinner that I couldn't afford and said, hey, I've lost my job, but we're gonna be all right. And I felt that way. I was like, we'll be all right. I think this is gonna work. You know. I started feeling more and more confident when I was out there. I just needed some more time to kind of like gain get some steam going. Um. And I don't know, I think back then it was just such a hustle because there was so little money.

I think back then people were seeing me as successful. But you know whatever, I'm making sixties seventy thousand dollars a year living in San Francisco. We're dying. We're going under each month, just a little bit farther um. But I just kept that at you know, I don't know why, just because what I knew how to do it. By this time, I've got a decade or more of history. I understood the industry. It's like, I don't know what else ide do at this point, you know, and you're

talking about going to Australia. So ine to Australia. Yeah, that's when the Debaco happened. I came back and he's like, you're screwed up. Okay, So now you're continually living in San Francisco and it's not working economically. The same woman at Olms still booking you. Yep, okay, So what's the next step? And then I get a manager, uh, Stephanie Lefera.

I forget what year that was. It was about let's see, I knows it was just two thousand four, two five, Yeah, right around there, two thousand five, two thousand and six, something like this. She hears my music, she's based in New York. She's working at the office that books mobi and manage them. And she's a young intern kind of assistant coming up, finds my music, loves it. Hey, can I help you out? I'm like, sure, how much does that cost you? How do you do this? You know? Um?

And so then I kind of had a small team going. I had me a manager, a booking agent, and it slowly started to grow. And how many nights to work week are you working? Then I'm taking every gig that I can take. It didn't even matter. I mean they didn't know that at the time, that they referred me two d dollars or a thousand dollars that I would take it. It didn't matter. I mean I was playing gigs for next to nothing. But back then that was

super crucial because nobody there's no radio stations. There's no way to get people to hear your music. You know, there's no Spotify, there's no there's no The only way they play people your music is to get out there and play the nightclubs. And there are a clique of kids that were very devoted to the underground. Like there is now, it's just much bigger and it's more of a festival scene now, but you know there's underground house music clubs and every city from New York to l

A and Tokyo whatever. They're all over the place. There have been a wave of guys that had come before me, that Eric Morrillo's and the Junior Vasquez and Derek Carter's and Mark Freenez that had already kind of set up a platform for me to exist in UM. So I just was kind of following suit and doing what I could do UM. But I was definitely like that second or third generation of guys coming. So it's hard to break in, you know, it's very hard. So what was

the break? I never really had that ah ha moment. I had a few things along the way. I think for me. The biggest moment where I knew things were changing and I knew like the old guard was that didn't matter as much anymore. As much as I love them,

I think their relevancy was wearing off. Was two thousand and nine when I played E. D C. I played the main stage and I had had a string of hits and when I say hits, hits in the underground where I could play them to a club of three people and people were singing along, and I'm like, damn, this is working, right. I didn't no matter where I

was in the world, these people knew this record. So not only am I playing it my FM station, was these thousands of DJs across the planet that we're getting there and playing my music on Friday and Saturday night in their local clubs. So they're playing these mixes. I'm showing up and people are knowing them. So more promote as are like, man, the club's packed when you're here, you know. So at this point, I'm just rolling. I'm doing two fifty shows a year. I'm starting a family.

At this point, I mean, it's just getting chaotic. It sounds like and so Okay, you continue to have the same manager in the same agent. Yes, small change agents a few times along the way, Okay, how does that happen? You realize that person is not big enough for what you're doing, or someone approaches you this person is not big enough for what I'm doing. I gotta start looking elsewhere. Okay, you're starting a family and you're on the road for two and fifty days a year. That doesn't sound like

it's gonna work. It's a freaking miracle that it did. I can't when I look back to those times. So's some dark days there, but I was having so much fun and my wife Naomi, bless her so she stood by me this entire time. I mean, I don't know how we made it work. Okay, back on it. We were young and dombint we didn't know any for getting the family. Just talking about Naomi. Did does she like

your music? She does? She loves house music, okay. You know she was driving from Reading into San Francisco and going to their rave scene that they had then and with similar tastings. Okay. And did she believe in you? She did? She didn't. She didn't tell me no, but was she You're like your greatest champion saying she was? She was like out there do it okay, and she's you know, a really hard worker and understood that. Okay, this is important for you to keep doing these gigs.

It is slowly getting better and better with each year. Um. But going back two thousand and nine is when E d C. I sat down with the Pascuala and I'm good friend. I mean, I DJE DJed his wedding, I played his mom's funeral. I've known Pascual for years. This guy's booked me so many times I could had lost count um and he was a champion of me and my sound. So that was that helped. It was a

game changer. But I think a lot of American promoters felt the pressure and they saw electronic music as a European thing, you know, house music, and it was always it was such, it had that kind of you know, people listen to house music are the people who ordered the cheese platter. You know. It's kind of like it was a different kind of thing. What was funny because

where I came from it was very blue collar. It was like the working class music in Chicago was like, yeah, I get down and dirty and a you know, in a ugly nightclub. So I had a very different thought process and they did. Anyway, around two thousand and eight, two thousand nine, a lot more guys are coming over because money starts kind of pouring into the scene. These rays are getting bigger, the clubs are getting bigger. Things

are changing. I'm making a good living now. Um. But I sat down with him in a room and pounded on the he he had booked the Swedish house Mafia. Nobody really knew at the time in America. And I sat down and I pounded on the table and like, this is freaking crap. Man, you gotta have my back. These guys. Nobody knows these guys. That's wonderful that they're huge in Stockholm or that they are massive in London. I don't care. I'm here in freaking California. Man, you

can't do me like this. I got really upset. And he remembers me, and I was pounding on the table. He's like, I've never seen you like this. You're so passive. I'm like, well, I'm not going to take these guys scraps, dude. I'm playing rooms three times the size of what these guys are doing when they come here, because I'm here, I'm this is this is my circuit, bro. And I think they felt a lot of pressure from the European agents and promoters and all that that well there's you

know over there. This was the first taste of well on social media, they have these numbers and on this and that. Because up till this point in the underground it was hard to distinguish had value and who didn't. It was mainly who just thumped their chest. The loudest. That guy must be huge. You know. Then YouTube came along and you start pictures of these peoples and videos

of their shows, like, wow, they're huge anyway. But in two thousand nine, I played that main stage, so you can played the main stage because you basically bang your hands on the table for Pasqual. I think he was he was gonna put me there that year anyway, because I played some previous years and was attracting these massive crowds. I mean like I was kind of like the people's choice at this point um and a California favorite, so I think he was gonna put me there just on

the building. I was like, I'm not going underneath these people. I'm happy for them that they're huge overseas, that's wonderful, but when they come here, this is this is my place. They can be billed below me or beside me, but I'm not going to play under these guys. And he

heard me out and he gave me a chance. In two thousand nine was one of those moments where I was standing at E d C in front of you know, fifty six d thousand people whatever it was, that Colosseum was full and the place was it was a giants sing along to my stuff, and I think at that point he was like, Okay, yeah, you really have done something here, you know, so and that kind of solidified our relationship and um, I mean he was really great

and kind to me before that. But and then a lot of people and promoters around the world we're watching what ADC was doing. So the fact that I had clout with them and things were playing so well, that just helped. And then I think another important piece in the touring story. I mean, whatever, we can talk about so many different facets of this, but in two thousand tents when Vegas got involved, and that was a game changer that changed everything. I mean, that's forward for those

people who are not deep into the scene. So I know, Vegas goes into UH dance music and there's Pakistan. They're all these different clubs. But when you're there as part of the scene, suddenly you just get a call and they say, okay, you know, we're ready to do this. Two thousand seven, two eight. I'm going out there occasionally and playing for these casinos and some shows are good, some they're not so good. But it's different because everything is hip hop. It's all radio right up to that point.

And then I show up and I'm playing stuff that these clubs people have never even heard this stuff, like what is this? You know it exists in the underground. But it was working because I'd have enough fans at this point, I'm close enough to l A. People were coming out and they'd fill the club and they drank and there was a party. Um, so Vegas got interested

in the music pretty quickly. In two thousand and nine, Steve Winn and his team called me up and they said, we want to build a pool and have an outdoor pool party. And I'm like, hallelujah, let's do this. And I said I got a better they want to They're like, we want to book you once a month during our peak season during summer. And I said, I got a better idea for you from Memorial Data Labor Day. I'll play every Saturday for you guys, and we'll make it

a thing and we'll brand it. And they're like, yes, this is what we want. Perfect, let's work a deal. Whatever this is happening. I mean, there's only one other pool party in town at that point. It's rehab, but it's very it's hip hop. It's a hip hop driven, considered urban, so nobody is doing this in this country.

But I had been to a Beasa several times and I had seen how these guys are doing it, and I'm like, man if I didn't have to fly all the way to a Besa because that's twenty four hour travel, or I'm like, this changes my life if this works. And I remember coming home from the meeting. I flew back home. They showed me the big pit in the ground. This is where we're digging the pool, and it's going to be cool. And we want it, you know, they're we want a very European we want it, We want

it cool. We wanted Sheep play your cool house music. You know. Anyway, we opened up that Memorial Day two thousand and ten, and five thousand people are inside and there's probably another ten thousand people lined up down the block, and that town had never seen anything like it still to this day hasn't. I mean, it was just like dynamite Adam Bomb went off on the I mean, dude,

it just changed. It was just a massive shift from whoa we've got hip hop to like this kid from San Francisco can show up and attract ten thousand people and we can ring a million dollars? How much are we paying this guy? Okay? And everyone was flushed with cash. Um So I was there that summer and it was just I mean, dude grins from ear to ear, the staff, the owner's Mr. Wynn, was my body. I mean, it's just everything was firing on all fronts, you know, four

gigs into it. I'm like, okay, we need to readjust something. I need to get paid some more money, you know. Uh. And at this point I have an attorney, Had Shapiro. Great guy has been with me almost since the beginning. Um and he's the longest member of my team. I should say seventeen years I've been working with this guy. But anyway, he uh, you know, he really helped me out, and that my you know, agent, and everybody kind of rallied behind me. And I think we knew that that summer.

I'm like, because if something works in Vegas, every casino is going to copy it. Right. Of course, they can't make me making tens of millions of dollars and have people not rip off the idea, not in Vegas. So of course that next year, more and more stuff showed up and then you know, Cosmopolitan came online, Hakkasan came inline, and I mean they were just were buying talent like crazy. And what happened is there's so much competition and there's only a few artists, so the fees just went through

the roof. I mean it was just, Yeah, I could move from San Francisco down here. I was already feeling that because I was writing and producing a lot of stuff in two thousand and I moved down here in two thousand and nine, and I wanted to be closer to l A. And I had a studio in Santa Monica, and I was commuting from Orange County. I couldn't afford l A. So I was living in Orange County and

commuting back and forth. Um, but I knew things were changing and there was a shift, uh musically because I was doing all these remixes and then six months later versions of that remix with a new song, we're showing up. That production style was going closer and closer to the radio. So I'm like, I gotta be in l A and be closer to this, even if the d J thing kind of creps out because Vegas wasn't locked in, right,

I was like I could produce people's records. I mean, wow, you know, a little teeny bit of a Madonna record or Beyonce record is gonna that will take care of us by these producers there they're listening to my remixes. I know they are. They have to be. It's too close stylistically. Anyway, that all kind of happened in a very quick time that Vegas came online. I moved down here, and yeah, I changed my life. I mean, even to this day, Vegas accounts for about forty of my revenue

touring wise. I mean it's a it's a large number. Okay, so how often do you work in Vegas? Um? This year, I'm doing a little over thirty shows, thirty five shows something like. Okay, and you're working. We're in Vegas now. I'm with the Hakkasan group and that's Caesar's Omnia Um Hakkasan the club what Republic is at the MGM, So they have you know, they manage multiple clubs there, but I kind of rotate between those three venues. And if this late date, how business for them? It's cooled off

a little bit. I mean we're talking about two thousands ten where it was so then every club opened up, and so now you've got you know, twelve fifteen clubs on the strip, and you know, six pool parties, eight pool parties. Wherever it is, everyone's doing it. So when I say it's cooled off, it's cooled off for them. For me, it's it's as wild as it's ever been. So pay for you, because I know from talking to people to the business, pay for you has stayed the

same or going up. It's grown up. I kind of hit a ceiling about three years ago, but it's essentially stayed the same. They got a little bit smarter. Used to be in a locked in fee, it didn't matter five old people. There are five thousand people were there. Now they've built in bonuses, so they've hedged their bets a little bit um just because the club's kind of got smarter and started talking to one another and hey, what are we gonna do here? We can't pay for

these guys. You know, it doesn't matter five thousand people show up, We're not you know, because it just became more competitive. There was more real estate, you know, there's more tables, there's more clubs to go to, and you know that lowered the entrance fee for the patrons, and it changed it a little bit. Well, pause here for a reef moment and get right back to my conversation with the Cascade. You know, I'm primarily a writer, and you can read my work and left sets dot com.

Sign up for the newsletter or just read it on the blog if you don't want to get your inbox blown up. In addition to following my commentary on music, tech in the world at large, as well as my personal life, you'll be the first to find out when we've published a new episode of the podcast. Go to left sets dot com and sign up for the newsletter. You need a friend in your inbox to compete with all the spam. I know you'll enjoy it now more with world famous DJ Casscade, recorded live at the tune

In Studios in Venice, California. Okay, So in that ten year period and when you start with Vegas to now, what else changes for you? M I think the music just continued. I just continued to be an album guy, and there were there weren't many of those in my world,

and a song guy. You know, I sticked with my original kind of two thousand to two thousand three idea, and everybody kind of came around to that, like E. D M was kind of centered around that, like oh, as to have a vocal, this could potentially cross over to radio. That was never my thing, And I don't really particularly right like that. I've never had any radio success. Um, I still kind of right for a nightclub. I don't know. It's a hard lane to get out of, the hard

thing to change my mindset. But I'm I'm comfortable with that. That's fine. Um but um yeah, So I just continue putting out records, and my fan base grows and grows and grows, and social media. With the onset of social media, I mean, dude, I could talk directly to the people. Where before I had to go to St. Louis to meet my fans and playing a club and fill a club. Now I can on Twitter, I can get on Facebook, I can send a direct message directly to them I'm

coming here. And it totally helped me. So to what degree do you participate on social media? I am it's nauseating how much I'm on there. I apologize to anyone who follows me. But um, I think it was so important because we have no other way. People in my world, there's no other way to broadcast a message. I can playing a club here, I'm playing festival there. It's important for me to talk to these people. And I think

it's really gratifying. I mean, when SoundCloud was the thing, it was so awesome for me to like whip something up and edit a mash up, a remix or whatever it was, a new song, put it on there, go to Twitter and like, hey, check it out and post it up and just get that instant feedback before I'm pressing a record that takes two and a half months to press. I shipped the record out, it goes to the store, comes back. I go to that city six months later, you know, a couple of people have found

that record. Go there year later, everybody's singing. It was like this eighteen month twenty four month lag of me creating this thing to when people like it absorbed it. Now it's like I can put it out and have this conversation immediately with people. So I loved it. And to what degree on social media is it all primarily I'm coming, this is what I'm doing. Or do you also communicate with fans and talk about subjects that have nothing to do with you, particularly you'll have to do

with music or the world at large. Um, I talk about a lot of random stuff. Um, I let people into my world Somewhat. I'm pretty private, but I still share songs of like I should still share thoughts of hey, this is how I wrote this song, and this is what the catalyst was for this, or you know, this is why I'm touring. And I have a lot of discussions in and around music just about like whatever, this is what I'm doing on Thursday afternoon. And I think

people like that and they appreciate it. And what platform is your platform of choice? Sadly I'm I'm a Twitter guy because I don't know why. Sadly, well, because it's not as popular as it once was, and I think the younger kids have kind of lost that on Twitter. You know, they want Snapchat and whatnot. I don't. I don't want to feel like I'm producing a television show every day. I don't like pointing my phone at me,

and I don't appreciate that. I like Twitter because I like to write, so I can get on there and show you know quick atlantic. Don't think that's how many followers you have today. It's over a million, one point three million, one point four millions, And what about Instagram about the same amount Instagram. I enjoy Instagram because it can be very curated, and I feel like it's still an art. I have a photog and videographer follow me, and we can still put stuff up that's neat, but

it is more curated my my channel. I you know, I'm I'm aware of what's happening and put images that I like up. Okay, so you've achieved certainly far beyond most people's wildest dreams. What is left in the landscape that you would like to achieve? Um? I think now it's just more about legacy. You know, what have I added to this scene? I know what it gave me. It gave me a life and uh and I'm thankful

for that. So I think, you know, I still feel like there's quite a bit of writing left in me and a few songs that I still want to share. I still feel that I still want to write and produce and continue sharing. I'm really interested in Sun Soaked and seeing that become a brand that can stand on its own. I mean, right now, it's essentially a cascade concert, a show that people are going to that's on the beach. Well that's special. Um, but I'd like to see that

potentially be in more places. Um, something that I could be really having involved with. But um, you know, kind of transition and make it something more than just being about me, you know, bring other artists and make it multiple days. Have it been a few different looks? You know, we're sitting here on Thursday, the week following Sun Soaked in Long Beach. There were thirty one thousand people there. Uh, to what degree with your were you happy or unhappy

with certain elements of the show? Thank you for your right up by the way that was I said it was great and people should only go the amazing thing here. And I just know because this promoter, Eric Kurtz, took me two thousand and ten or whatever to Hard Halloween and it really opened my eyes. And the funniest thing was people very good friends. And I said, you're not

gonna believe. We gotta tell you a story. We went to the USC football game and walking by all these people and I said, I was there and there I've bucked out. So you know, that's how I really originally got into the scene. I've been to Abitha couple of times, etcetera. And what blows my mind is that people have no

idea what's going on here, being its sunsoaked. The amazing thing was and it's not amazing to you, but for those of us everyone singing along to songs that are not mainstream songs mainstream meaning you know, the Spotify top fifty are written about in the media or whatever. This is obviously that important to them. And the other thing, of course, is a social atmosphere. You got to a regular show and you bump into something. It happens all the time, Okay, just walking along, Hey man, what are

you doing? Hey? No, no, no, no, sounds like oh cool, no problem. It's very yeah, you know, so it's a great atmosphere. Now, the other thing, I was told that there were no trips to the hospital, okay, and this is very different from many other electronic music festivals. Why do you think that is? I think it's partly me as a person and the people that I've attracted, um

through years of touring you know, my music. I think I'm emitting a message that that you know, it isn't like that helps that right, that environment, So it's about you. It's you're setting a tone. I think listen, dance music is like that generally speaking, right, But then I think I'm one of those guys that's in front of that kind of leading that charge. I like to think of myself as that anyway. Um, you know, I've been very,

very fortunate with my live shows I've done. I mean, to my knowledge, that's the largest like single act ticket sales of anyone in my world, certainly in North America. I don't know about Europe, and I can't speak for some of these other places. But thirty one people, this is this is insane, and I think the thing that is so difficult for people in the music industry to understand. And I'm managed now by rock Nation and Jay Brown. They're just so fascinated because it is it's how do

these people know these songs? How you got thirty one people singing along to a song that I released eight years ago. I mean, I could turn the record off and they'll sing the course with the hands in the air. It boggles my mind. It blows my mind. But that's the age of the Internet. People are finding this stuff. When you look at my spins on Spotify, there there's nothing special, you know, on like four and a half

five million streams a month. This is you know, I'm not even in the top I don't think, you know, But yet I can go and sell these many tickets. Many popex have a very difficult time doing something like this, and that's really Listen. That's how I discovered your emails, because it was I'm outside of this music industry. I kind of sit on the outside. I'm looking in. But yet I've been able to find in carve my own niche. And I think that's what's been so fascinating to the

people around me and even myself. I'm still kind of like shocked and scratched my head. Okay, you know, if you go back to you know, the classic rockers, the Stones, the Beatles, they said, hey, we'll do this for ten years. We'll go back to hometown, we go back to the factory. Do you anticipate if your forty seven now, you anticipate years from now you'll still be in Vegas or somewhere spinning records? No? No, why not? I don't think so.

This is a young person's game. It really is. It's a it's very dance music is young, full of life, and I think it would be ficult to be like a really old guy up there trying to lead that charge. Um. I think listen, I'm always going to be writing and producing records on some level because that that satisfies something inside of me. Right. I love writing a song, I

love working on music, I love remixing stuff. Um and listen, I'm sure I'll have the occasional tour like dust it off the turntaip, let me get out there and do something. But to the degree that I'm touring now and stuff, no, I mean I've slowly been kind of winding it down for the last sound of three or four years. I've you know, at that peak when I was doing two hundred plus shows a year too. Now, you know, do a hundred shows this year, hundred and ten shows or something.

It's half of what it was. Um one, because I make so much more money per show, so to hustle is hard. Um, but I think it will continue to kind of go that way. Um. Okay, but a hundred is you know, you have many legendary acts who do sixty shows every other year, So a hundred shows there's still a lot of shows. Yes, it is, okay, not in my world, but yes, of course, of course you're in DJ but anybody as they become more successful, because we know I remember, I think I was talking to Metallica.

They went all they went on the road. When they all came back and got a divorce. You know, you're on you're working so hard on what you do, your life completely changes. So when you get to the point you want to get a certain point, you want a life work balance. But that does not necessarily mean you stop working, right, I agree with that, Okay. I mean you said twenty years from that. That just seems like

a really long time. Okay. I think what you're saying is with the classic rock accent, they couldn't even imagine especially you know. Okay, but come on, further questions. What's it like to be on stage when and don't forget I mean, you know, but people listening dance music, it's a very active audience. They're not sitting passively. You don't have to wait for the song to end man to get applause. What's it like being on stage in front of that many people, getting that reaction, having them in

the palm of your hand. It's insane. I mean, it's impossible for me to describe. It's the energy flowing through me is crazy. It's very difficult for me to sleep after a show or to calm down. It takes a while. I mean, dude, I've I'm it's electric. It's funny you say that because people, you know, people always say they're criticisms of musicians. You know, go into a minor. One would be, well they date models. Well, models have the same lifestyle, you know, traveling around the world, staying up

all night whatever. The next thing is, well, why do they all do drugs? I know you don't do drugs, but I always say it's very hard. You know, you're loved by twenty people in an arena, you get back into the bus with the same guys that you know since high school. You can't come down for hours. They use the drugs. I'm not saying that's a good thing, but the average person has no idea what it's like. You know, It's like if I write and I get most inspired later at night, you know, I can't write

and go to bed. You're just all fired up. You gotta get the idea. You gotta and I mean it's very physical as well. You see you on stage, I'm jumping around. I'm running to this side, run and that side. It's just and I have to do that because so much is flowing through me. I feel like I could lift up a car and throw it into the audience at certain point, you know, I mean, it's it's great. So that's a great analogy. Just you know. Another thing

that people have criticism electronic music. They say that basically it's all on hard drive and the guys just pressing and play. When you are on stage, how much are you creating on stage? Great question. I'm gonna make this as short of answer as I could possibly make. There's weren't an interesting spot with electronic music for a very

long time. A lot of it was being created. And what I mean by that as I show up and I've got two or three records behind me, I know the first record I'm gonna play, sure, but I have no idea what's gonna happen. And then it's this interesting

relationship that you have with the audience. And this is certainly true in the nightclubs where you're kind of like weaving this tapestry, this audio tapestry right with them, and you're going in and out, and there is a skill of lining this up and blending knees and picking the

next song. And it's very it's very organic thing, and it is a talent and whatever, I'll sitting here and argue, even if I'm not in this business, how I'm telling you there are guys that do it really, really well, that have learned and honed that for a very long time. As it became digitized and it changed things a little bit, it was a lot easier to have less talent and be able to pull it off because then it became more about the song. Okay, write a good song, get

up in front of the audience and play it. That's good enough, and you are just pressing play. I am trying to blend those two worlds of the old and the new. I mean, I still show up on stage and I have a playlist with a hundred songs on it, and I think I know what I'm gonna play. And to my two ring parties, Dismay and and and I mean they hate me for this that I still kind

of go off on these tangents. They want me to provide them a set list so all the pyrotechnics and everything can be all in sync and it can be this beautiful show. And I refused to do this because I'm like, look, man, even if I give you a set list, I'm not going to stick to it. Then it would be no fun. And for me, well, and I came up in a time when that didn't exist. I mean, I toured for ten years by myself, like I did whatever the hell I wanted to do, Like

I didn't have to answer to anyone. So they hate me in a twenty four hours of the gig. They're like, what are you starting with? You know, what are you gonna do? And I'm like, okay, I think I might start here, and I'm pretty sure I'm an end here in between, you know, but the guy. But what we've discovered is the guys that do the best with me,

they just go and play every show with me. So as I incorporate new mixes and finished new songs, and I can incorporate that on my show, and they're hurt and they're familiar with it, and so they become a season as I am. And that's the best way to to it. Instead of these guys just shown up at the big shows that they're at the big shows, the small shows. I'm playing five people they're they're they're listening to it. They work in the video of the lights.

So what about the health of the scene at this point. I think it's great. Uh, it's kind of broken into two things. So there's kind of like a pop lane where you got David Getta's and Calvin Harris's that have taken dance music and opened it up to a wider audience, which is awesome, um, and that angered some of the people when we were all in one scene, when we're

all just one group of guys. But now it's kind of fractured, and the underground has become like all ships rise with the tide, right, So even the underground is much bigger and more profitable and healthier because this pop stuff is there. But I think it took a moment for people to realize like, oh, that's them over there, that's the pop stuff, and this is us where the underground. So they're kind of separated now. Before there was that weird period of time where we're all together, well I

don't like them, and that guy doesn't like this. But now they've kind of they've gone their separate ways and there's a divide between them, um, which is weird. Because I kind of coexist in both worlds. I mean, I'm over here straddling defence. Um right, what would you like to have a radio hit? Sure? Yes, So whatever you sit at home saying, you know, whatever your process is, whether it be a premeditator after the fact, well this might this might work. Are you still strive? Are you

striving to reach that pinnacle? Uh? Yes, for a few reasons. One. Now, listen, I've done a lot and I've written a lot of music over twenty years. So now in the last like three or four years, as I got signed to major labels and went out of the indie scene, I mean before I used to turn in an album and it was here's the track order. I mean, it wasn't didn't

give me input. I was like, here it is. Then I signed with Warner and I had any and Our signed to me, and he's like, listen to the songs and give me feedback and hanging out in the studio. And I kind of liked it. Why not five years ago I would have told him to f off and get out of the room. But now I'm like, cool man, You've got some ideas. What's up? You know, I've been around I've written a song, I don't. It's not about ego. For me. I'm kind of like, just make something cool

and have a good time. So I kind of had to check myself and rearrange how I thought about the process. And not only that, Now it's like, I feel like I'm such a part of what the sound of what modern dance music is. I feel like songwriters coming and pitch me on songs. I'm like, wow, did you do you know this song by me? Because this is very similar to something I wrote five years ago or seven years ago or ten years ago. Oh my gosh, I love that song. Yeah, I can see the influence there.

So to me, it's cool when other songwriters come and want to work with me. Where before I was closed to that idea, now I'm like, well, let's collaborate. Two minds. Three minds are better than one. I've kind of learned to enjoy that process now, the part about do I want a radio hit, it's more about me because in this independent world where we could try and be like, this person is worth as much of this guy's worth. That much goes back to that conversation I had, you know,

a long time ago with Pasqual I deserved here. You know, Um, there's still a lot of guys that, oh, well, we're gonna build him here and build them there. Okay, then just don't include me on your festival. I'm fine, I don't need your dollars. Although that's a lot of money. Of course, I'll be playing for cheeseburgers right But to me, it was like, I don't need to be a part of that that that guy that you're putting on ahead of me or claiming that he has more value. I don't.

I don't subscribe to that cool you know. And so for me, the touring numbers became a really big deal. And I understood when you know, the Swedes and all these guys came around, they're like, I sold out Medicine Square Garden. I understood why they did that, because they're trying to, you know, put their value up to these promoters and show them things. So for me, when I come back, I mean promoters around the world right now, the country you're emailing me. They can't it can't be

thirty one people. You meant thousand people. Really, Oh, I had a promoter. I'm not going to say who's when I told him, like you mean three thousand, Like, no, this is thirty one thousand paid people. Guess what with another couple of thousand jumping the fence and probably a couple more thousand on my guest Listen. I mean, this is the thirty five thousand person party we're having here.

This is a show that we're creating waves and those those moments, because to me, whether it's five people or fifty thousand, it's more about success and not having to answer to the promoter and prove my value to them. So for me, the radio hit is like it's here nor there. But I can't stand answering to these guys that are like, oh, well, we're gonna put this kid who's eighteen on in front of you, and I'm like, no, you're not You're not cool. I don't have to play

your party, dude, I'm busy that day. Well, certainly the cutthroat business like this, but traditionally traditionally is a funny term to use. For over the last twenty years, but dance music has waxed and waned in popularity outside of its core audience. Yes, do you think that it will continue to grow or go back to base or do you have a viewpoint on that it's going back to base. Now we're in the middle of a shift. It's going back to base, which is cool, it's fine. I think

there's a handful of guys that it doesn't matter. They're just part of the pop cultural landscape. Um, so they've kind of risen above that here in this country. I'm very fortunate to be part of that small club of guys, um and girls. I think there's a girl in there somewhere, maybe, I hope. So I'm not touching that right, um, but I think we'll make it through. And I think the

underground as strong as it's ever been. But it's it's weaning because every listen everything is hip hop right now, and even a lot of successful dance song songs have to have okay, we gotta have a verse from g easy this or whatever. And it's becoming more you know, lab created music, right, everyone's got to have an opinion and make this and make that and make this. And me, I'm kind of like comfortable to sitting back doing what I've always done. Sure the poppit, yeah cool, I take

one of those. Cool And I listened to am I open to listening to somebody else's ideas and what I should being. Yeah, sure, is most of it a waste of time? Yes, I'm like because I'm perfectly comfortable what I'm doing. But if somebody's got a great idea and there's a brilliant songwriter out there, I love good music, and I'll spend a day in the studio with them, and you know, maybe some magic comes out of that. Well, there's a whole another podcast getting into the creation and

the scene. But you've been listening to the Cascade on the Bob Left Sets podcast. This has just been fascinating and edifying just to hear. And when people have no idea, all they see is like the Forbes list a successful DJ.

They have no idea of the hard work that's put in, and especially in your case, that you were attracted to the scene when there was barely any scene to begin with, when you're growing up in Chicago, and to use the old cliche, that started music businesses and every walk of life. Now you paid a lot of dues, so you're at the pinnacle. You have a smile on your face. It's been so great to have you here. Thank you so much. Thanks appreciate it. Until next time, it's Bob left Sets.

Tune in next week for another podcast that wraps up this week's episode of the Bob left Sets podcast, recorded live with the tune in studios in Venice, California. I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Cascade as much as I did. What do you think of the interview? You can email me at Bob at left sets dot com. Until next time, I'm Bob left Sets. Can't think of me reason and I don't know me. Saly one must be o