The Complicated Lives of Enslaved Women of the Bible An Interview with Dr. Christy Cobb Bible readers tend to skip over the stories of enslaved people because they seem to be treated as props for the ‘real’ meaning or main message of the biblical account. But a closer look at the lives of these marginalized enslaved people in the stories—such as sex workers who were might have been sold to brothels against their will—enriches our understanding of the Bible. Recognizing the invisible attitudes an...
Jul 02, 2025•33 min•Season 1Ep. 78
Part 2 of our interview with Matthew Goff and Dylan Burns continues the discussion we started in Part 1 about the relationship between the Dead Sea Scrolls and the Nag Hammadi Library. Goff and Burns explain the significant differences between the two, such as their different dates and locations of origin. But they also explore the similarities, with their mutual interest in more ancient writings, such as how some important figures from Genesis—such as the Book of Watchers, with its myths of evi...
Jun 04, 2025•41 min•Ep. 77
Is There a Connection Between the Dead Sea Scrolls and the Nag Hammadi Library? An Interview with Dr. Matthew Goff and Dr. Dylan Burns (Part 1) Professors Matthew Goff and Dylan Burns realized there were some surprising commonalities between the Dead Sea Scrolls and Nag Hammadi Library. Traditionally, these ancient writings are studied separately, despite their modern discoveries around the same time and relatively close locations. With Dr. Goff’s expertise in the Dead Sea Scrolls and Dr. Burns’...
May 07, 2025•34 min•Ep. 76
An interview with Dr. Kimberley Fowler Dr. Kimberley Fowler explains the Gospel of Philip, one of the lesser known texts from the Nag Hammadi collection. She loves it and finds it “charmingly and remarkably weird,” even though is it does not stray too far from orthodox Christian theology. Although it includes a brief reference to Jesus kissing Mary, that kiss seems to be only one of the many ritual Christian practices explained in the rather randomly organized gospel. Kimberley Fowler is Assista...
Apr 02, 2025•34 min•Ep. 75
An Interview with Dr. Meredith J. C. Warren We asked Dr. Meredith J. C. Warren to describe how Jesus’s family and followers would have practiced their religion. They were probably a typical Jewish family, where the types of houses and everyday life were all intertwined with religious practices. She claims that both Jesus and his mother were probably less unusual than we have been taught to think, especially in everyday life—except that Jesus was probably more radical in his commitment to Torah t...
Mar 05, 2025•35 min•Ep. 74
What is the Nag Hammadi Library? An Interview with Dr. Dylan Burns Dr. Dylan Burns, a leading scholar on the “Nag Hammadi Library” and related texts, describes the significance of the 1945 archaeological discovery in Nag Hammadi, Egypt. It is not only of great importance for a better understanding of Christian origins, but many of the texts also reveal a great beauty and probing inquiry into the meaning of the divine in human experience. Their great diversity and welcome for women leadership wer...
Feb 05, 2025•40 min
An Interview with Dr. David Galston Some obvious differences between Plato and Jesus would include the fact that Plato preceded Jesus by three and a half centuries. Jesus was a Jewish teacher; Plato was a Greek philosopher. Plato taught with dialogues; Jesus taught with parables. But they are both figures of wisdom. Both styles are placed in everyday life, and yet both teachers encourage their students to exercise critical thinking and to discover reality beyond the obvious. David Galston is the...
Jan 08, 2025•32 min•Season 1Ep. 72
An Interview with Dr. Andrew Crislip Ancient concepts of bodily functions differ so radically from modernity, we need a basic overview of these beliefs in order to understand both early Christian and non-Christian healing methods. Two competing concepts were viewed as causes for disease: an imbalance of ‘humors’ in the body and an ‘invasion’ of the normally healthy body. Jesus’s approach was addressing invasions, such as demons. By the second-century, thinkers had expanded the idea of illness to...
Dec 04, 2024•32 min•Ep. 71
An interview with Dr. Samuel Zinner Dr. Samuel Zinner describes the ancient Apocryphon (or Secret Book) of James, then, focusing on two common elements in so-called ‘gnosticism’—the meaning of the demiurge and ascending—he shows how this text does not neatly fit any category. It includes no reference to demiurge, but it does involve a lengthy and unusual description of Jesus, Peter, and James all ascending. Inclusion in the Nag Hammadi collection does not necessarily define something as ‘gnostic...
Nov 06, 2024•35 min•Ep. 70
An Interview with Dr. Amy Jill Levine Amy-Jill Levine, a distinguished New Testament scholar, provides examples of Christian commentators making Jewish practices and beliefs look bad in order to make Jesus look good. A more realistic understanding of these Jewish practices helps us understand Jesus better and understand Judaism more respectfully. Examples of these Jewish beliefs and practices include feminist perspectives, being identified as the Chosen Ones, and stereotypical attitudes about we...
Oct 02, 2024•34 min•Ep. 69
An Interview with John Dominic Crossan Crossan draws on Paul’s life and experience as a devoted Pharisee to understand his insights and expectations for the meaning of resurrection. Unlike the well-known ancient belief in ascension, which was reserved for the near-Godlike humans, Pharisees believed in resurrection for everyone. This was based on a faith in the end time. Paul’s revelation about the resurrection was his realization that Jesus – as Messiah – had begun the general resurrection! He w...
Sep 04, 2024•39 min•Season 1Ep. 68
An Interview with Dr. April DeConick April DeConick theorizes about how gnostic ideas that emerged as a concept in antiquity keep reproducing themselves within different environments. This is one of the things that propelled religion toward its therapeutic aspect and individual relations to God. It came about during the desperate time of harsh Roman occupation, when people felt let down by their gods. Looking for some divine justice, they imagined a new kind of relationship to God, as children o...
Aug 07, 2024•34 min•Season 1Ep. 67
An Interview with Dr. Kimberly Bauser McBrien Kimberly Bauser McBrien finds the Secret Book of James to be a humorous critique on the idea of apostolic authority. From our 21st-century perspective, it is difficult to decipher the difference between a weird or absurd tale from a clever parody on a serious subject. She argues that this late second century author is taking shots at his contemporaries who gave weight to apostolic credentials through false claims of unity or the experience of tempora...
Jul 03, 2024•35 min•Ep. 66
An Interview with Dr. Erin Galgay Walsh Macrina was born into a wealthy and historically important Christian family. Her virtuous life, devoted to Christ, was based on her ascetic ideals. That is, she rejected human pleasures and comforts in order to free herself to be fully present to Christ. The 4th century text, The Life of Macrina, which was written by her brother Gregory, describes her as a woman living the angelic life, the" life of the resurrected body." Professor Erin Galgay Walsh teache...
Jun 05, 2024•33 min•Ep. 65
An Interview with Dr. Tony Burke If the Secret Gospel of Mark turns out to be authentic, it could provide important insights into early Christian thought and practices. Popular theory claims it is mere forgery, however, created and circulated due to pro-homosexual motives. Professor Tony Burke explains the origin of the text, its content, the basis for the doubt, and the reasons for his own support of the theory of authenticity. He sees a more mystical interpretation than an erotic one. Dr. Tony...
May 01, 2024•37 min•Ep. 64
An Interview with Dr. David Brakke David Brakke challenges the common notion that Christians had a New Testament type of Bible by around 200. Rather, he claims, their Bible was Jewish scriptures plus a wide variety of written texts by Jesus followers used in multiple contexts. Marcion and his followers would have been the exception, since he rejected the Jewish writings. Brakke’s recent analysis of two ancient Christian texts concludes that the early Christian years were diverse and served diffe...
Apr 03, 2024•34 min•Ep. 63
An interview with Dr. Sarah Parkhouse Dr. Sarah Parkhouse has made a discovery that is quite noteworthy for anyone interested in the Gospel of Mary. One of the hundreds, if not thousands, of small fragments of papyri found in the garbage dump Oxyrhynchus, Egypt, just might be a missing part of the Gospel of Mary. The fragment includes a description of baptism, which is closely related to the ascent of the soul in the portions of the gospel we already have.
Mar 06, 2024•32 min•Ep. 62
An interview with Dr. David Litwa The strange story of Simon in the Bible illustrates the uncomfortable truth that Christianity seems to reinvent itself when it defines itself in opposition to its perceived enemies. In this biblical account, Simon (later called Simon Magus) appears to have been repenting properly from his mistake of offering to pay for the spiritual instructions, when Peter lashed out at him harshly. Litwa thinks the Acts of the Apostles was written many decades after the strugg...
Feb 07, 2024•32 min•Ep. 61
An Interview with John Dominic Crossan John Dominic Crossan draws on his own Irish life experiences to create an image of Jesus living in an empire dominating the Jewish world of Jesus. The Roman Empire might have been perceived as “the world of civilization,” accomplishing great power and wealth. But this success came at the expense of its conquered nations. Jesus’s nonviolent opposition to Rome originated in his perception of Sabbath creation of Genesis 1, in other words, the divine means of d...
Jan 03, 2024•37 min•Season 1Ep. 60
An Interview with Rabbi Evan Moffic Rabbi Evan Moffic, senior rabbi at a vibrant Reform Jewish congregation in northern Illinois, thinks Christians can understand Jesus’s words and works better – and Jews and Christians can understand each other better -- by considering the Jewish world of Jesus more fully. In this podcast interview, he explains Jesus’s relationship to his students, why Jesus himself was not apocalyptic, the Jewish origin of his ‘Lord’s Prayer,’ and the spiritual purpose behind ...
Dec 08, 2023•33 min•Season 1Ep. 59
An interview with Dr. Susan M. (Elli) Elliott In answer to a listener’s question about how attitudes toward singleness evolved in Christianity, Dr. Elliott draws on her knowledge of family legislation that Caesar Augustus inflicted on the Romans well before Jesus’s ministry. Followers of Jesus often followed the common but conflicting Roman attitudes toward elite and lower-class women. But early on, they also assumed a counter-cultural position against the notion that spouses were disposable....
Nov 01, 2023•33 min•Ep. 58
An interview with Dr. Deborah Saxon. Martyrdom in antiquity was often a painful choice. The dual powers of religion and politics made those decisions complex, but also caused a search for identity. Christians had to determine whether they would live under Roman systems, by Christian faithfulness, or by imagining a reward with Christ after martyrdom. Disagreements arose between advocates for martyrdom and those who opposed its glorification. Our modern reading of the ancient writings should take ...
Oct 04, 2023•33 min•Ep. 57
An interview with Dr. James McGrath Professor James McGrath explains why you should read ancient texts outside the Bible. A knowledge of apocryphal and other noncanonical texts give more background to biblical writings. The meaning of canon itself becomes clearer in the context of the many cousin-like texts that relate to the biblical writings. McGrath demonstrates this with an exploration of the books of Enoch, the history of the Maccabeans, the widespread beliefs in demons or unclean spirits, ...
Sep 06, 2023•33 min•Ep. 56
An Interview with Dr. Jeremiah Coogan Dr. Jeremiah Coogan, a scholar of ancient manuscripts, explains the significance of the recent discovery of an ancient palimpsest. That’s an ancient writing found underneath other writing that had covered it. The object we’re discussing contains the Old Syriac translation fragment of the gospel of Matthew, and it gives us a window into what the text of some Greek copy of Matthew would have looked like in the late second century. Coogan also discusses his wor...
Aug 02, 2023•31 min•Ep. 55
An interview with Dr. Jason BeDuhn. Dr. Jason BeDuhn, an expert on Manichaeism, takes us into the ancient world where Mani was a leader of early Jesus followers in the East, before the fourth century Council of Nicea. He paints an intriguing picture of Mani’s interpretation of Jesus’s teachings and how Christianity might have been different if he hadn’t lost the competition with other leaders from the West. Mani’s followers saw his willingness to sacrifice for others parallel to Jesus’s martyrdo...
Jul 05, 2023•38 min•Ep. 54
An Interview with Dr. Joseph Bessler. Dr. Joseph Bessler challenges and delights us with his suggestions that learning what we can about the historical Jesus contributes to the betterment of society. The surprise of the past few decades has been the revelation that our traditional teaching of Jesus has been used to silence the voices of any ‘other.’ Certain texts reinforce certain theologies. But the loving gesture of listening to others brings to our attention surprising texts we have not notic...
Jun 07, 2023•32 min•Ep. 53
An interview with Dr. Arthur J. Dewey Arthur Dewey explains how the “blood curse,” based on Jesus’s trial before Pilate, has been taken out of context and turned into a false basis for blaming Jews as a whole for the death of God. The “trial” in the Gospel of Matthew (which could not have taken place historically) was based on Mark’s original critique against the leaders of the Jews. This was another one of many squabbles among different Jewish factions.
May 03, 2023•39 min•Ep. 52
An interview with Dr. B. Brandon Scott Dr. Brandon Scott explains the complicated history of resurrection. It was not an Easter celebration during biblical times, but the hope of God’s restoration of things was handed down from Daniel and the Maccabees. Sacrifice was widespread in the ancient world, not because of sins, but as an act intended to realign the world with God. Writing of Jesus’s death come from a conviction that his death was not defeat but that God made him alive. Bernard Brandon S...
Apr 05, 2023•38 min•Ep. 51
Early Christian Texts is celebrating the 50th episode of our Bible and Beyond Podcast! We have collected snippets from ten episodes featuring several of our interviews since the podcast first aired in 2019. All fifty episodes have been quite unique and fascinating, but these ten excerpts exemplify the depth and breadth of the topics we covered — from why anyone should even look at extracanonical writings to the meaning of Jesus’ passion.
Mar 01, 2023•35 min•Ep. 50
This month Shirley interviews Perry Kea, an expert scholar on the Book of Acts. Dr. Kea explains why the objectives of the author of the Book of Acts differ from simple historical documentation. The letters of Paul provide an excellent example of such differences and illustrate why the objective of the Book of Acts is inconsistent with historical facts. Stories in Acts were a means of using resources to address other questions, such as the source of authority for the new Christian movement....
Feb 01, 2023•36 min•Ep. 49
