Toy Story with Sadie Dupuis

most recent East Coast tour. One was in Philadelphia at Good Good Comedy Theater and one was at the Rockwell as a part of the Women in Comedy Festival in Boston, Um with our wonderful guest speed Or Teases Sadie Dupre So, thank you to everyone who came to those shows. And I think we we've got the best of both, to quote my Lord and Savior Hannah montana Um contained in today's episode. Yes, so enjoy that. But before we get to it, we just have a few things to plug.

Hot plug. Speaking of live shows, we've got another one right here in sunny Los Angeles. Yes, we are going to be covering one of my favorite movies, Anastasia eight h with Anna Sara Gina at the Ruby on July And it's your birthday show, It's my birthday show, and it's also our last l a live Bechtel cast for several months. So if you've been thinking about coming to a show and I haven't done it yet, this is the one to come to because it'll be a couple

of months before we're back. And why is that, bitch, I'll tell you We're gonna be in uh Europe for a bit of the summer. I'm going to be bringing my show Boss Home Is Girl to London and then Edinburgh Fringe Festival. Uh. You're doing a whole day month at every damn night for a whole month. So if you live there or you know anyone who lives there, please make them come to the show. I don't know anyone there. Uh. And that's what like first of August

through they or something like that. So I'll be in London doing the show on July at the Bill Murray Yikes in London. So and that's only five pounds to attend five pounds five pounds very affordable, so so please come. There'll only be to London shows and then I'll be in Edinburgh from July to August every damn night at ten pm at Pleasants Baby Grand except for August twelve. So don't come on that. And my actual birthdays August eighteen, so definitely come to that. That's the day to that one,

and that's the European t for me. Well guess what, listeners, I will also be in Europe around this time. But if I didn't know, I was like what, I am joining up with Jamie in Edinburgh towards the end of August. I'm going to be doing some stand up shows at Fringe. I'm doing some shows in London, and who knows, keep your eyes peeled for perhaps another live show. Perhaps we're in talk. Perhaps if you listen to this podcast and you may want to, you know, see us live in

a particular city that may be called London. But for the moment, you know, just get tickets to everything to be safe, and keep keep checking our social media's and our website becktel cast dot com and click on the live tab because we will put any and all show dates, including live becktel Cast if there ever were to be one of those, and then also Jamie's shows, my shows, all the the info will be there. So we'll see

you in l a and July. We'll see you in your up in August, and we'll see you right now at our live Toy Story episode Wow Wow we take Tity and Beyond dodcast. The questions asked, movies have win minimum all their discussions boyfriends and husbands? Do they have individualism? The patriarchy seth and best start changing it with the cast? What the fuck? Guys? Who as us? Oh my god, Mike's black cherry lemonade. That's a good six or seven? Yeah,

I'm sorry, there's more than there's there's it. There's at least ten. Blood orange is number one, but that doesn't come in bottles anyways. Hey, welcome to the Beckdel Cast. Thanks for coming. What's Oh my god, so I'm saying we're back at the Women Comedy Festival. Yes we are. We're in Boston. We've got the hometown of Banding. Such a strange mix of people from all phases of my life here tonight. My divorce parents are here together. Yeah,

this is well. The Women In Comedy Festival is special to us for a number of reasons, but it was also I believe our first ever live Bechtel Cast show was at the Women In Comedy Festival two years ago. It was and then twenty people came and no one knew where they were there. So, uh, clap if you have listened to the Bechtel Cast before. Yeah, yeah, okay, that was a free applause section. Now the question we're

curious about. Clap just as enthusiastically. If you have never listened to the show before, and we're brought here by a friend, Oh okay, cool, So we will give you the rundown and what to expect. So our podcast is a feminist movie podcast where we examine the representation of women in movies not that good, and we use the Bechtel test as a jumping off point to initiate that conversation.

And the Bechtel test is the media test invented by cartoonist Alison Bechdel that requires that in any piece of media there there there be pirate. Uh, there are two female identifying characters with names who speak to each other about something other than a man. Sounds like it should be easy. But but but the movie we're talking about tonight, you know. So we're super we're super psyched to be here, and I'm really really happy to bring out our guests. Yes,

she is a writer, a poet. She is the guitarist, vocalist and songwriter for the rock and roll I ever heard of it? Uh the rock band Speedy Ortiz. It's Sadie Dupuis, welcome, thanks for being here. Thank you the city where dreams sometimes come half true and then you leave. That's sums it up for me too. I love it. I love that about here. So we're talking about Toy Story today by rock of applause? Is anyone not seeing

the movie Toy Story? Yes, one person brave bravely applauded. Okay, great, so we Yeah, no, I really I always love the noise that the person who hasn't seen the movie chooses to make because it just is very There is a cowardly way to do it, in a nod cowardly way to do it. Now you owned it. Yeah, I love You're like, yeah, fuck that. So Sadie, tell us about your history, your relationship with the movie Toy Story. Yeah, I saw it in theaters. I think I'm probably the

same age as the kids in Toy Story. Okay, so I'm like the target demographic for buying a Mr. Potato Head loved the Randy Newman songs, have gone to see the subsequent Toy Stories in theaters, But I don't think I've ever repeat watched any of them until last night, Jamie, what about You? I've seen a million times. The first time I saw it, I don't know if I was

fully forming memories yet. I feel like those are the kind of movies that funk with your head the most, Like the ones that you don't even remember seeing for the first time and then you're like, oh, I enternalize whatever funked up thing happened in that one. But yeah, no, I mean, I love. It's not my favorite Pixar movie because I'm Monsters Incorporated, stand But I mean, I mean, I feel like I'm just as attached to it as as any kid. It's it's good. What's your history with it?

I guess I would have been nine when it came out, so I like, saw it right away, grew up with it, watched it quite a bit. I love Toy Story three. I've never cried harder in my life except for the beginning of Paddington one and the end of Paddington two. Story three, like in any other Disney movie putting characters in a trash compact or about to die a fiery hell death, would I mean in Toy Story if like

you're so emotionally attached that it's really sad. But in any other like underthought Disney franchise, it would be kind of funny, Like if Beauty and the Beast tour in a trash compactor about to be lit on fire, I'd kind of like, maybe go for it. So yeah, should I? We just jump in with the recap. Let's do the recap? Okay? So we meet Andy. He is a young boy who loves playing with toys. He's very original. His favorite toy

is Woody the Cowboy. Yeah. He And then we meet various of Andy's other toys, Slinky Rex, bo Peep, Mr Potato Head Ham Ham Ham, I like Cam. He's got all male toys except for a piece of his lamp, which I never realized watching this movie before the bow Peep, How does she? How does she detach? She would shatter right right, like those three sheep are stuck together? Why is she not on that lamp? And then yeah, and then it's like she's porcelain because like she's they can't

get down from the night stands. That's a problem I always have. God relatable. And then we learned that all of these toys are alive. They are sentient. They have more complex emotions than I do. Uh, that scene is still so fun. I don't know. I like, I know, obviously, I know that the toys come to life, right, but I sort of forgot and and then the mom re shuts the door, and then Tom Hanks is like hello, Like it's well because the first scene they're getting battered

around violently like lifeless toys. Yeah, and then suddenly potato heads like no more toddlers. Does that hurt them? I think it must on an emotional level at least, right. I was like, they can't bruise, but they do hurt. They have a nervous system, but they have cognition like this, how do you have a brain but not a nerve? It's fine, I just have a lot of questions about the toys. Okay. So in a week from the day that we opened the story, we learned that Andy's family

is moving. But today is Andy's birthday party, which is concerning because all the toys are worried that Andy will receive gifts that are other toys that will be cooler and that will replace the existing toys. Yeah, and that like that whole like line of thinking. I feel I just generated a whole generation of child hoarders, right because in theory sharing is good and like giving your toys away to someone else's in theory nice, But in this universe it makes the cowgirls sing a really sad song

about you in the second movie. Yes, but the toys are sitting there. We've got these like g I Joe standings. I think they're called combat carls. Yeah, they're spying every toy that comes in on the birthday party, and the toys upstairs are like judging what comes in potato heads, Like someone brings like bed sheets or something, and he's like seven years old, who brought bed sheets to his

birthday party? Yeah? That that goes on to expless. They're buzz light ear Budge, which which we do see Andy having like a new bed spread and maybe but changes his whole bed and the decor of his room a week before they move. I don't think so that's true. Yeah, mom's just doing whatever it takes to get through that move with less crying children. Yeah. So everything seems fine at first during the birthday party, but then a surprise

gift comes out. It turns out that it's a buzz Light year figure see I like my version of the twist, which is that Tom Hanks peeks over the bed and he's like, oh my god, it's Tim Allen, a Republican, and he gets really freaked out. Politically, sure, because there is what feels like a pretty complex power structure within the toy community, like a dictator who like, no one elected Woody, He's just the leader because he's Andy's favorite toy.

There should be a democratic election. What are they doing? Well? They set Woody up in the opening scenes as this gregarious boss of all the toys. He's like if Michael Scott never fucked up. But as soon as there's competition, Woody gets really sour. Yeah, and I guess the original direction of Toy story was for Woody to be like a bully villain. They had Josh Wheden like doctor the script because wood he was too mean. And yet he

is still very means. He's still attempts a murder in the movie, and then probably casting Tom Hanks, they're just like, no one will notice, no one will remember the murder. Tom Hanks was still when they cast him, he was like not really quite famous yet, like Forrest Gunk came out after he'd already been cast, so he was like a relative unknown because this was like one that they cast him. Yeah, because computer here, I'm about to say

something very intelligent. Computer movie take a long time. Thank you had no idea. It just comes out of me sometimes. But do you have a master's degree in screenwriting from Boston University. I don't like to bring it up. So buzz let your shows up on the scene. He's this space ranger doll and what he goes and talks to him, and buzz does not realize that he is a toy.

He thinks he's like a real space ranger and then the other toys are like immediately very impressed with buzz Bo Peep's horny although that is he that's her resting face. Both people in this movie like first of all, and we'll like really get into this later. She's the only female character really that like or the one who appears on screen the longest, even though no woman in this movie has narrative impact. But the way she talks, it's like so horny that you don't really know what she's saying.

She it sounds like he reminds me of Jessica Rabbit if she were drawn good right, like like a chaster. Yeah, it sounds like her mouth never fully closes, you know. She's like, oh, I'm just a cup of it back well, which is funny because we see some of those, like toy Wooden get a really hilarious joke. Probably so all the toys are obsessed with buzz, and so is Andy, and it feels to Woody as though Andy might be replacing him with buzz. He gets worried. Then the whole

movie just turns into like a toy dick measuring contest. Basically, yeah, because it's like I have wings that become immediately erect. What He's like, what are you? He's like fingering his little string scure, He's like, why is string not hard? He's just dangling behind me, man emasculating the Meanwhile, we meet Sid the sky boyfriend. Yes, he is the neighbor boy who tortures toys for fun. And yeah he's a maker. He started Double Team. Sid could go to Harvard on

an independent study. I mean he is creative. We have to give him that. He does have a sign in his bedroom that says I heart explosives, which is concerning. It was really when I saw that, like the aesthetic of his room, like the glowy poster. I was like, I've fucked future. That guy he's got like a fake Marilyn Manson poster. It says like rocker dude or something

like that. Okay, so we meet Sid and then Andy's mom's like, let's go to Pizza Planet Andy, and he's like okay, and she's like, you can only bring one toy and wood. He knows that and he's going to pick Buzz. So he premeditates a crime. Okay. The way that premeditation is shown though, it's like in one shot and you just see would he look at Buzz look at a window and they go, which is I guess premeditation.

But he sends the RC car flying across the window sill without its consent, making him an accessory to his crime. Not fair to the car, right, and then it is attempts to just like knock him under the bed. He accidentally knocks him out of the window and all the other toys are like, oh my god, would you you're a murderer? Right, and he's like it was an accident and we know We're like what do you are a murderer? Yeah? Mr potato head like pulls out like an undercover cop badge,

and it's like I've been trailing you for here. It's also like, um, I think the etch a sketch at that point sketches a noose and a sketch when other people are involved, like what he's in the beginning, there's this gag where um would he's like draw with the to sketch and etch a sketched as a pistol Um potato Head has him doing noose when Ea sketches of his own volition, he's drawing buzz fan pictures. Fan art is key, which is not good like it looks like okay,

I'm sorry. Only other options are to draw weapons of death. Let Edra sketch do his buzz fan art even though it's bad. Just don't understand why he's you like he's a good Sorry to gender at don't gender I did it first, I did it. I mean all of Andy's toys are coated male, so I think it's except the troll and etch a sketch. True, So this whole accident happens or that's what like woo are He's trying to

convince the toys that there was an accident. Um so now Andy has to take Woody to Pizza Planet, but Buzz like manages to hitch a ride along. They're getting a little scuffle and they get left behind, but then they make it to a piece of planet. And then before Woody and Buzz can get back to Andy did the scary neighbor boy part of the Aliens? He comes into the Little Claw and then the Aliens are there and we're like, where that's when we go? What's what

I show up for? The little Alien scene? Really, I'm like, I can't wait till this is over. Oh, I love it. It's so annoying. I love it there. I feel like the Aliens are like a prototype for what the Minions would later become. It like looks great on a lunchbox. They basically say the same thing, except I think that maybe like the Aliens were too christ complex e to like get their own franchise because I forgot They're like the Claw is God, I haven't chosen. I love it

so much. The Minions are like Lawless, but the Minias are wild and also I love them. They're so they're cute. We're gonna do can we do Minions Month on the Patreon for my birthday. Oh, in August, I get to choose minions. August would be fun. That's horrible. Um, there's no end. They're all like dudes, all the minions. Yes, or would we even talk about we're talking about the complex male dynamics and how they're toxic. Yes. So they get captured by Sid, who takes Buzzing Woody back to

his house. And there are some other toys who have been They've gotten plastic surgery, and they're like amazing because baby Spider, Baby Spider, we got roller Bob, We've got we got legs, we got wind the frog. Yes, little wine ducky. Sid is taking these toys in for surgery and Buzzes observing this, He's like, I don't believe that man ever got his medical degree. And I love you know how like um, cats think that everything is a cat,

Like cats think you are a cat. I know that cats have eight nipples and that well, I can't really

think that every think something like this. I can't speak to how many nipples buzz has, um if any, but I'm willing everything is like a man like he believes he's a full size man, and Sid, in his mind as a grown man, not a real doctor, but so buzz and what do you look at these toys and they think that they are cannibals because they judge, which just goes to show how intolerant would he is this entire Yeah, he's like a stand in for like white

patriarchy that doesn't want to be replaced. It's like, I don't recognize these toys cannibals. They're trying to escape. And then like Buzz sees a commercial for himself and this is when he realizes that he is not the Buzzlighter, He is just a toy. So he has a nervous breakdown and gets very depressed. I like the buzz Lightyear gets so upset that he is not the coolest guy in the world that he allows himself to be strapped to a rocket to be killed. That is very that's

a very fragile move. His fragile man, not the coolest guy ever to fucking kill me. Now, Like it's also Sid is able to have rockets shipped to his home and he's what like ten, I don't know, he's got hearts e I mean he hearts explosives. Read when we see the buzz light your commercial, we see what we can only assume is um Sid's dad passed out with like soda cans. I mean, so there's a lot of like coded stuff about Sid's life that I's do in the best with what he has. He seems truly like

a neglected child that is turned into a villain. Like it's just so there's so much and with sid sister as well, but we can get into that. Yeah, here's a lot. Yeah, so the rest of the story is Sid's planning to blow Buzz up with the rockets, so what he has to rescue him and get back over to Andy's before the family moves away. And then what he's like, oh, wait, these toys aren't cannibals. Hey, can

you help me save my friend Buzz? And they're like, well, I guess even though none of them can speak, well, they fixed They just like fixed buzzes arm. And then he's like, oh, they're nice, And then you're nice. Now let me deliver my show stopping speech about friendship exactly. Yeah, steals the moment. He's got a friend in me, You've got a friend in me. Let's get out of this house.

They successfully save Buzz. They use the rocket to get to the moving van, they make their way back into Andy's family's car, and everything's great business business, and yeah, so that's the story to story. Do you want to start talking with with things we like? Because that's a shorter list, I think in terms of like what there is to talk about with women at all? Sure, do you have anything that you like? Is it? I mean?

I like the movie Don't Get Me yea. I mean it's definitely one of those movies that, like, we all like, but when you watch it with women in mind, you're just like where I mean, like the First Toy Story movie especially, and we have like some some stuff to talk about with with the other two, but the First Toy Story Movie is like known were women being almost completely absent from the story and especially like there is really no woman that has narrative impact in this whole

movie except for Andy's mom, only because she has a driver's license. Like if Andy's mom did not have a driver's license, women have no agency in this story. Metcalf is moving this whole family across the country, right, I

mean credit for this one person. Well, that's so that that is one of the things that I like, is like it seems like as far as we know, and like Andy and his sister are being raised by a single mom, and there's not a lot made of that, like I feel like usually in children's entertainment, especially like if there is not the you know, TV nuclear family that is pointed out to you a lot, and it's

pointed out as being a problem. Um So, seeing like Andy and his terrifying Uncanny Valley little sister being raised by a single mom who was also terrifying on Kenny Valley was kind of cool because it's not, you know, like drawn attention to have like where's their dad, you know, which I think would sort of be the default for that. But I think so I was looking into this because I was also curious and I hadn't remembered that um Lori metcalf in amazing nineties floral Print. Laggings was a

single mom in this movie until rewatching it. But apparently that was a financial choice rather than a narrative choice. Because Toy Stories the first like fully computer animated film. It's the first feature length for Pixar computer time. It

took a long time computer exactly. Pixar hadn't worked with Disney prior to this, and the only reason it was even considered was because um Nightmare before Christmas had gone well, So they were constantly running out of money, coming with like weird pushback from Disney, like Disney wanted them to make it a musical. They were not really how in that, Thank God, and they're like, we're going to split the difference, will give you Randy Newman, final Hartfen Randy Newman plus

a Kuna matata for like ten seconds. So the computer technology to build this movie was like not. They basically couldn't have done it, and they don't understand how they did. And they were under deadlines that they couldn't have reached. So they didn't have the time or money to build a second adult. So they just did the mom And if you look at Andy's birthday party, all of the

other children are also Andy. They have his face. And if you look at Sid the like bully neighbor kid, he basically is Andy with a different Yeah, all the people and so they've never commented on Andy's dad because it wasn't like a narrative choice designed to drive the movie. They just didn't have the money to make Dad. They're fine. Some of the best worst Internet rabbit holes to go

down are Pixar Reddit theories. People have a lot of time, and there's someone he said that there's they're like, oh no. Andy's parents are definitely not divorced because weeks before the events of Toy Story one, Andy's dad died of polio. Huh, a curable disease that no one gets anymore. Well, the theory is that Andy's dad contracted polio as a child and it came back. Wasn't support this theory. His father, his only surviving possession was woody. I hate it it.

I feel nothing for the pole, Like, who is his dad three hundred years old? Why can't he just have a mom? Why can't you just have a single mom? So yeah, good that the movie doesn't call attention to the fact that it's like, you know, what appears to be a single mom raising two children, or like villainizes that in any way because that's like another version of what we tend to see. But also Andy's mom, Yes, she does have narrative impact because she is she's the

driver of the vehicles. And then also we almost never see her face, even like there might be one wide shot where like we see a glimpse of her face, but usually it's like either her back and that might also be an animation. Is that a Peanuts choice too? Though That's what I thought was, Like, are just irrelevant in this world in the first one, but that changes in later year. It doesn't super bother me that, Like, I feel like you're not because you only see the

adults from like toy Angles in this movie. But I like triple checked this. As of the end of the third movie, we still don't know what Andy's mother's name is, which is like, I mean, and we like go back and forth on this. You know, it's like, is mom a character name? In some cases yes, in other cases it's kind of unclear. But if you've been in three feature length movies and have not been given the courtesy of a first name, that is violent. But how would

the toys even perceive an adults name? I mean, it could be, but but it's like, you know, how would they perceive Andy's name? We were discussing, I mean, we we went down a little redd rabbit hole before we got in front of all you tonight. But um, there's a theory that Andy's mom is the original owner of the toy Jesse, in which case she does have a name.

It would be Emily that bitch. Is there anything else that we like about the movie in terms of its like representation of women, I guess I like, Um, there are two moments where the main like macho toys are made to play women. For a second, so when when Woodie's like running point on the toy opening party, they call him motherbird, which I thought was very sweet. And then um, we have buzz later as Mrs Nesbit, he's

he's um sidds I forget sid. Sister's name Hannah, And Hannah's only toy with a head, so she's really slight. She can put a bonnet on him, and uh so I feel like I like that they they speak to the idea that toys can have a mutable gender depending on like what the kid playing with the toy wants. Like we see all of Andy's toys as male because Andy's got daddy is shoes. I don't know, I mean, he's got a lot of things to sort out. And Hannah does not care that buzz light Ear looks like

a spaceman. He's a space woman in a little bonnet. The Mrs Nesbitt scene is like polarizing too. It's it's where there's like a lot of different reads of that scene. I I don't really know where to fall in it. I I do like that, like the toy just becomes the gender of the child that is playing with it. I think that that's a cool philosophy to abide by.

And there was like when that when that especially just because it's when that scene came on and there was like a male coated toy that was dressed up like a woman, I was like, Oh, they're gonna make some like horrendous joke that's not going to age well, Like there's going to be like this panic e joke. This is really sick of drinking dargy linked tea. Yeah, Like and so I I was like, I'm like, it's not

necessarily a wind. But I was just relieved that they didn't take the cheap awful approach to that joke, right, I guess probably because it was rated G and they couldn't. I mean, tam, it's a murder, Yeah, I mean, I think there's perhaps a lot to not admire so much about this movie when it comes to the topics that we discuss. Andy's toys, As we already said, like they're all most entirely coated as male, there voiced by actors

who were men. There's like a damseling scene in the opening scene of the movie where bo Peep, like her sheep needs to be rescued by Woody and it's like and the ransom ist five bazillion dollars. So already we're just like, well, Andy's certainly not a progressive six year old because he's probably you know, watching movies where women are damseled and he's like, well, that's what women do.

But I mean, like bo Peep is like the one notable female toy character who has lines at all, because there is that little like troll Doll who bikini, but troll Doll never speaks and could be you know, just because of the outfit. We don't have to do how Handy designated that troll Doll definitely, but troll Doll is

just confident. I was like, hell yeah, there was so apparently in the script they wanted Barbie, they couldn't get Barbie, but tell was like toy story who they wanted Barbie, and Josh Weeden wrote this scene which I really like. So we were talking about in the end when the toys are all at at SIDS and they're escaping, and there's this like I assume we'll get into it like a horror horror scene where they scare SIDS straight to

never mess with toys again. Um. Initially, the way that the toys were meant to get out of SIDS was that Barbie was going to show up and do a terminator scene and be like, come with me if you want to live, and Barbie was going to rescue everyone from SIDS. But they couldn't get rights to Barbie, so they devised yet another like weird Rube Goldberg toy situation where they horror movie stood into letting them frame. So there was gonna be Yeah, there was gonna be a

like a female toy hero. Josh Weeden tried for it. Tel was like, that would have been pretty cool. I mean just like I mean, to have like female characters doing anything that acts the plot would have been nice. But bo Peep is literally there to either flirt or provide emotional support. She frets. She also frets she oh, you're right worrying The three came about I'm either fretting, flirting or providing emotional support. She's got basically no narrative impact.

You can take her out of the movie, the plot remains essentially the same if you apply the sexy lamp test, which is a sexy lamp, right, So like replace her with like the hot leg lamp from her Christmas story, and the movie is the same. Yeah, she's just there to flirt with wood with Woody and like give him horny connections. She's like, oh yeah, she's like whitty, I can't get someone us to watch the Sheep tonight, like and then, right, is this movie suggesting that these toys fuck?

I don't even like. But then also bo Peep seems like she's just made horny by any impressive male character, because whenever Buzz shows up and he does his like falling with style thing, she's like, I've found my moving buddy, and then it's like fanning herself and like so horny about it. So both people only exists in the story to be like Woody's girlfriend. Most of the time we see her on screen, she's doing some sort of like emotional nurturing because women be nurturing, like oh Andy loves you,

and it's like they don't even give her. I I for I was like, maybe there's like one of those shitty throwaway moments that we hate. But it's something where like in like an action scene, bo Peep gets to do one thing and everyone's like, whoa, she just used that staff to stab someone in the eye or like something less violent than that. Um, But she doesn't even get like one of those corny ass girl power moments like like that. I mean that was there was just nothing,

nothing for her to do. She's not even tokenized, which for a woman being tokenized, do you know your movie is a fucking up? And then both people, I mean she is. It's kind of like a weird character in this franchise in general, because she's in the second one to some extent, but it's very much sidelined because that's when Jesse the cow girl comes in, and then in the third movie she's not in it at all. It's like implied she was given away in a garage sale

because they're like, we don't know how to real characters. Bye, like they have we shipped her away. We all examined the toy story four plot summaries. Yes, so she's about to be heroic, right right, Well, I've seen the trailer that I do haven't explored much beyond that though, she's like a liberated toy now and she's going to teach Woody a trigger two. I don't know about all this.

There's like a like the new bo peep there. They do kind of like a number of things I think are like corny and like what dudes do when they're look, Oh, I actually don't hate women because she's wearing pants now. Like it's like she gets pants on that lamp there, she's porcelain. It is impossible, but they, I mean, they gave her a new outfit. She wears like a pant

suit now. Now her like sheep stick is like a like a way I don't know what, but it, but they basically did a post me to redesign of this character to be like, no, she's actually empowered and cool and also now and she's gonna, you know, tell Woody a thing or two about a thing or two, which is cool in theory, but it almost just feels like moving from one shitty trope to like a merry suit trope, just turning her from like this feminine to like a

badass hashtag girl boss who doesn't take any nonsense from anybody, And it's like we just want a character. Right, there's stuff that exists in the middle of those two things that I don't I mean, I'm excited to see it. I just anytime, like male screenwriters are like resolved feminism, like she got pants that she's made, Like I I just don't. I don't trust it because I want to read a quote from an article l A Times about

Tory story for specifically about the peep's character. It's as she became someone as Coolie, says Coolie as the director of towards story for who can stand up for herself, has confidence and has seen a lot of things, has lived through it. She's more well rounded. We looked at different kinds of female characters, mad Max Fury Roads and Parator furiosa Ray from Star Wars. Marian from Indiana Jones

is a huge one as well. And I quote, I just think he's naming women he's heard of, Like it's it just seems very defensive, like he just described something impossibly vague of like you know, she's a woman. She's done things before, she's woken up, she's fallen back asleep, she's gotten dressed, she's gotten undressed, she's washed a few times. Here's a list of three women I've heard of feminism solves it does. It feels very much like lip service.

It's like, yeah, who do people think are the feminist characters again? Oh? Yes, these ones? And then just like said it to a reporter. I really hope that I'm wrong and that they didn't just do this like very reductive like Mary Sue character that you know makes everyone feel like towards story fixed feminism or something, but that like just strictly based on like if you look at the visual of like before after, like it seems kind of like a hollow gesture. Sorry, keep her in the

same outfit. Why do I have to change my clothes to discover myself? But it's never changes damn clothes in his life, right, But I mean the way she's originally designed is that she's attached to a lamb tachoo lamp, but then in it like pink freely dress and like the character ever of these sheets, I just I mean, I don't hate the reason design dress and also like to I guess because female characters are just so often like hyper feminized in their look or wardrobe. I agree

with that. I just like she's logistically she's porcelain, you can't change her outfit. But and and also in the redesign, they change her into a blue pants suit. So I feel like they're just they're like, oh, you didn't like pink dress about blue pants? Like it's just it just seems so lazy, and I like it's a I'm with

her gesture for sure. Yeah, Like it just seems like if you have already written this character poorly, like since you've fumbled this, like you can't just put a new outfit on and be like the like there though I remember story three. What is the beau Pie Bark in Toy Story two other than being Woody's girlfriend. I think it's just that I think that she does a few more like Woody's girlfriend. But Woody has a female right now, and that's yeah. And then and then Jesse, I mean

we can talk about Jesse a little bit. She's not in the first movie, but like, Jesse is awesome in Toy Story two, and she's got this like really detailed female arc with a Sarah McLoughlin song about the tragedy of being rejected by Andy's mom. By Andy's mom, it's the only like woman woman relationship characters talking to each other across space and time there spiritually, and yet Toy

Story two also fails the Becktel test. But then in Toy Story three, Uh, there's like this bad storyline on a number of levels where like Buzz loses his identity again and then he becomes this like Latin lover stereotype and Jesse falls in love with him, and then she is there's already like an ongoing flirtation established between Jesse and Buzz that he does not need to be in

the movie. But because it's like, oh, we have a female character, we better make her like a boy because what else, because what else is she going to do? It almost like reminds me of like a Ron and her mind E thing, where like you feel like the writers were like, yeah, they're gonna love this, but then when you see you're like someone is clearly settling like this is Can we talk a little bit about how

much Woody sucks hestes terrible? Yes. I feel like there's a number of ways to look at the Woody and Buzz relationship. Ultimately, you know, it's like big picture. I do like that there are two male characters who learn how to have a meaningful friendship together. I feel like it's like rare to like encourage, especially like young boys to be like no, you can be friends with other boys like and it's like a good positive thing. I I like that. But their friendship is very fucked up.

It is mostly a dick measuring competition and it's all about I mean, both of those characters get pretty severely emasculated and have to recover at different points because, like Woody is emasculated by no longer being the favorite of Andy, and like he has to he lashes out from that rejection and pushes, you know, accidentally pushes Buzz out a window, and Buzz is emasculated by the fact that he is

not the only Buzz light Year. But to be fair, imagine you thought you were like a hot shot space cadet and you learn you are an eight inch tall toy. I'm like, wait a minute, I'm not the Caitlin Durante, host of the Backtel cast, which would you let yourself be strapped to a rocket? Um life would feel pretty meaningless if I learned there were like eight million others of me made in a sweatshop, which they the toys discussed very early on. They talked about that so much.

I just I mean, I do kind of like how naive Buzzes. I think if they were both as antagonistic and like world weary as what he appears to be, it would be like a different movie. I mean. And and like when Buzzes character starts out and everyone's impressed by him, he's a pretty nice, gregarious character, Like he is nice. There's like that whole montage where he's friendly to everyone, is teaching people how to lift weights. Well, I guess so along the lines of wood he originally

being a villain. They didn't intend for buzz to not realize he was a toy, But when they heard how Tim Allen was reading the character, they were like, he's not playing it like he's a toy. He's playing it like he's actually like buzz Aldrin. So they wrote that whole thing of him not recognizing he's a toy because Tim Allen wasn't a nuanced voice actor. He does. Tim Allen,

I hate him. So if you were if you were a woman, like if you were like a woman voice actor speaking from experience, they would say you're doing a bad job because they're like, oh, mr Tim, we're so sorry. We are going to have joh Sweden write you another draft tonight because you cannot do your job, like what

do he is? Uh? You know? In retrospect and antagonistic, flaccid devil many the way that Sid's family is presented, I feel like there's a lot implied about Sid's family that is bizarre and dark and unnecessary where I mean, it's first of all a wild choice to make like

an eight year old the villain of the movie. But I mean I mean when I was a kid, I fully bought into it and thought I hated said I hated his adorable little bull terrier dog Skud Scud, Yeah, King's Scud like there when in retrospect, I mean, there's so much about Sid's house and the way his family operates that just implies that he is maybe neglected by his parents a little bit, and that he might be

poorer than Andy's family. And there's I feel like there's like a lot of weird coding going on with that family that just sort of translates to like, very young kids is like poorer kid with like less attentive parents equals bad villain forever, which is such a horrible thing

to imply, like to any kids and also skull t shirt. Well, we really see how the toys are formed by who their owners are, because early on, when Buzz hasn't really had like Andy's room imprinted on him, he says said from the window from across the lawns, and he's like that happy child. He sees said, like destroying a combat carl and he's like that happy, smiling child. And like that's kind of when I rewatched it as a thirty year old and not a seven year old, I was like,

he's just having a really fucking fun time with his toys. Yeah, like he just like it seems like he's neglected to the point where he can have rockets shipped to his room. But that's how you get that that's not his fault. I mean, I think that there are some things implied where like you never see either of his parents other than a sleep, other than a sleep surrounded by cans.

Like there's a lot implied about his family. When Buzz sees the commercial for Buzz Lightyear, we know it is morning, but Buzz walks into a dark room where a TV is on and there are cans everywhere and someone is asleep on a recliner. I think it is implied that Sid has an alcohol like dad and that that is like it's just like the weird implicate like class and family implications of that character who is just outright the

villain of the story. Like there's no sympathy, empathy anything presented for Sid, who Like, if you saw a nine year old kid who was acting out like that in real life, you would be like, this kid probably needs some guidance so or like as I call it, or like someone to talk to. But um, in this they're like, no, he just needs to be harassed by Tom Hanks. That'll show him like he truly didn't seem like I don't know why I am like standing for sins so bad, but like he seems like a little goth boy who

like needs to be put on the right track. And I just I don't like how they present that. I mean, he is a product of his upbringing, and they imply that because his upbringing is like coded as being like lower income, that that's what and that's his faults. Is that that that they're like, he's just a bad kid. You know what bad kids are like, you know what they act like, But like that and it happens in

a vacuum and then they present. Andy is like, and this is a good kid because like his mom pays attention to him, and his sister looks scary, and his lawn is more manicured than sids is. I mean, if we're if we're putting like pound for pound, Sid is more interesting than Andy. He's doing laps around Andy. What does it? What was Andy do? Does sexist act outs with his toys? Sid's doing full on like surgery medical procedures.

He's an aspiring surgeon and just needs needs a mentor to be like Sid, you these are very scary, but there's a practical application of this interest. And he's just a kid who is like fucking around with his toys. Like that's every kid. I mean, he's just I had a couple. I had a couple baby dollar As a child, there was a baby doll that, um, it would like crawl a little bit and then cry, and then crawl a little bit more and cry. I don't know if anyone had this baby doll, but it was very annoying

and that the crying sounds were awful. So I ripped its head off and threw it over my balcony, like that's not all I played with barbies. Did you cut hair? I cut their hair off? I wasn't. I wasn't allowed to cut hair. Oh man, I cut I would. I had some barbies that I was like, I want you to keep your hair, but other ones I shaved their heads. And the older I got, the more the older I got in like, the less I was like into playing with toys, I was like, well, I might as well

just ruin these. I don't know what I was thinking. So I cut all their hair off and then I would paint them with nail polish. So I sort of related to sit in that way. But it is like he's just treating toys like a kid would treat it is really creative with them and creates like mutants that are toys are the best toys in the whole show. I want baby Spider Guy and legs, and it does love. It provide an opportunity for what I think is an important lesson where it's like, I don't know, don't judge

things or people by how they look. Because they're like, oh they're they look different from the norm, they must be cannibals. And then which is a wild assumption to begin with but yeah, it's like judging the other in any way. But even then, like that that lesson, like you almost get all the way there, But Sadie, you were saying this earlier, like sids toys help fix Buzz without being asked. They're very nice, even though they've been

treated badly by mostly Woody. Buzz hasn't been like outwardly means thought they were cannibals. But they help him anyways. And then what he's like, Oh, you're nice, can you help us do this thing? And then they help do the thing in the in the big horror scene where you know, like Sid finds out the toys are real, He's the only kid in the fucking world that knows that.

I Actually, my hot take here is that Sid is the only one who's really deserving of knowing that the toys are alive, because all through the movie, like there's a there's a semi truck that almost runs over Woody because he's so committed to playing the role of like toys not being alive, he lies down in front of the wheel. Is hat he even gets run over a little bit, But he'll break that like toy code of silence to teach Si a lesson he does like an

exorcist headspin. Yeah, Sid deserved that. That was cool. I love that Sid has to go through life with the sinister knowledge. But anyway, but like the toys help Woody and Buzz who have been cruel and judgmental towards them, and then instead of end of them getting some sort of redemptive arc, instead what he just goes thanks guys by and then they charge into the climax of the movie and like it and they like hanging out there. I hope so and being played with in an engaging

way all of those toys. But really, team said, I mean,

I don't think it's it's fault. I think it's like Woody and Buzz in the way they treat these toys who are different from them and then rely on them to do a bunch of ship for them, and then they're like, oh, thanks to you, and then just like DIP, I guess the idea is that like they helped liberate the toys from like Sid's will never hurt them again because that he was afraid of his sister's little right, another character that I thought didn't get enough or like

started it in a cool place and then was kind of like poorly written into oblivion. Was Sid's little sister Hannah. I really liked her when she first I forgot she was in the movie, which never as well for the impact that she would have. But like in the first thing, she's she's like seen challenging Sid right away. She's like get away, you know, like they're doing like a younger sibling older sibling thing. And it seems like creeps me

out from the beginning. I like her. I mean it's not saying I don't like that, like, but like Sid is like terror like I mean, he terrorizes his younger sister. He literally says that line when Hannah like runs off to tell her mom that said did something. Yeah, where it's like, don't believe her, don't believe she's lying. Damn nutshell. Uh, But I liked that, Like, you know, Hannah was like pushing back. She's the only person we see push back against, said do Andy and said even know each other? We

don't know, but you know, Hannah pushes back. And then I have a fight club theory about Andy and said, oh damn, I think they're the same. I mean they are literally the same character, the same mold, but then we see like Hannah is then when we see her again later. The only other thing we really see her in is like when she like goes to like the most stereotypical girl bedroom of all time, where it's like it's pink, pink, pink. She's having a tea party with

heads with her two beheaded dogs and her sister. She she starts out as like this kind of cool character and then they kind of just throw her into I mean, it's I would argue it's better than bo Peep, who just like starts lame and remains that way. But like Hannah, I feel like you're given this cool little nugget of like, oh, she's like argumentative and she's like gonna funk with her brother. There's versions of it where I can see her participating

in the plot and like helping William Buzz. She like takes a liking to Buzz. She like turns him into Mrs Nesbit like, but she's just kind of written out instead of like there's like this whole third act that takes place in her house, but she's only she's like relegated to like a tea party scene. And I just

don't know, I just so so after the toys. It's called like the wine the Frog scene because Woody orchestrates this whole thing in the scene in which they would have had Barbie rescue all of them, which I think would have been cool. Instead, all the toys do this like horror movie reenactment for Sid, so that he's now terrified of his toys and wood He is like, there's

a snake in my boot. Don't ever torture your toys again, and he runs screaming into the house, at which point Hannah's waving her doll in front of him, and Sid is horrified because now he knows the toys are alive and coming to get him. Yeah, so she's got a little agency there. She's got. She definitely does. I just like wish that she had been used more, because again it's like, as much as I like that character, you can remove her from the entire movie and like, how

much actually changes not not. I think what makes a little more sense for the movie is just too like the core group of toys that we meet, introduce some other female coded toys into the group and give them just more of an active role in the story. Like I mean, there's a lot of toys that could have gone either way, like Rex didn't. I mean, I'm not gonna say Wash should leave any movie, but Rex didn't

have to be male. Ham didn't have to be male, right, Really, most of Andy's toys, like there could have been like gender parody with Andy's toys and it wouldn't have changed anything. So really the movies a critique on Andy's just dumb imagination.

I yeah, Andy is an unoriginal chod and but I mean it's if you look at the Hannah character, where you know, she's got a pink room and she has dolls and they do tea parties, and there's nothing wrong with being interested in feminine toys, but just that that is such an egregious default for a young girl that just is not really challenged or explored. And then you've got Andy, who has all male toys. He does very

misguided act outs with them. There's a whole quick conversation that we can have about just the toy industry and how toys are you know, very specifically gendered and marketed, and uh, you know how that ruins children basically, um, But lots of studies haven't done on like the way children play and the toys they play with and how that affects how a child's brain develops. Um because these all these things I'll have a very profound impact on children.

Play is a large part of what gets a child to like understand the world that they're in and what their role is in that developing. And yes, so they've just found a bunch of stuff that playing with toys can help develop skills and influences a child's future, like what career they might go into. Right, So, researched by the Institution for Engineering and Technology found the toys with a STEM focus where three times more likely to be

targeted at boys than girls. I wonder if that has anything to do with how women are underrepresented instead it's true. I mean, well, and then the same thing with sports too. I've just like, that's not something that is marketed to girls when they're very young, and every kid is an idiot, that's the law, and what is presented to them is what they'll think, like, oh, that's what I'm able to do,

so let me do that. And then there's also so many I mean, this isn't in this movie, but like with the Mrs potato Head, there's so many versions of toys originally made for boys that they'll just slap a bow on and be like ever girls now or like legos are one of the few things that are for everyone. But even when legos were first marketed at girls, they were like ink and pastel and they looked different because they're like, well, girls won't pick up solid colors. Women

hate primary colors. They can't see them. Legos are invisible to them. We have to fem it up like there. And I do want the girl legos, however, because and that is like such a gender like neutral concept that they still managed to gender like through color and through marketing. There's so much I mean, I had. I did a brief stint as a toy reporter, which sounds like a lie,

but it is true because one must have many stupid jobs. Um. And the time I was reporting at was when they were releasing barbies with different body types, and there was so much written at that time of the way that children were reacting to them. And it is it like the thing that I took away from research again and then and then writing about it is kids form ideas on how toys and then by extension, what the world

should look like. So much younger than you would think, because there were barbies with different body types given to a group of four year olds and already, like there were kids who didn't mean any harm, but we're saying, like this isn't right. Why would I want this? This

isn't what I want. And so it's just like the not challenging anything is such an insidious thing to do because your kid can be you know, like you can do your best and your kid can still be skull fucked by the time they're four years old, just based on what is around and what is available to them, which is always with some exceptions. Now and I hope that you know, like kids that had barbies with different body types before they were four years old will you know,

be less conditioned to feel that way. But but it is like some something that hits with you so young that like there needs to be priority to uh, like representing a wider variety of of dolls of body types. I'm talking about dolls specifically, but like making them less gendered and less you know bullshit, um is like super important from the second you are yikes. Well, because toys are so often exaggeratedly gendered, like yeah, toys marketed to boys are like army men, g I do like fucking monster,

like very hyper hyper masculine stuff. And then like toys marketed to girls are like pretty pretty princess and easy bag oven and like very the most exaggerated versions of masculinity and femininity. And when that's what you're giving children to play with who have like mushy play do brains who like don't understand the world yet like playto toys a gender neutral toy that you can lump, you can make at home. My mom used to make anyone on my stovetop all the time. I don't know what the

ingredients are. Eat it? You can? I have eaten it? Uh yeah, I mean it is. It's like such an important and I hope that, like in Toy Story four, like a full twenty four years after their first movie came out, that that will be something that is more included, because like movies like this are so merchandizing based like how many actual buzz light years have you and like how many squeaky aliens have you seen? Like these movies are literally designed to sell merchandise because capitalism. I had

Woody and buzz toys. It's a genius move. To make a movie about toys and then you can sell those toys like it's it's a very like normal thing to do. But if you write, if you take priority to write in characters that are more inclusive and less just like this is a toy for boys, this is a toy for girls. A k. We're not making toys of it because that is how the toy industry works. Is like, there's even with like the Avengers, it took nine million years for them to make a black widow action figure

and and to include her in marketing. It's just the same thing with the Star Wars. Whenever the new trilogy started coming out, they didn't have Ray toys with all the other ones, even though Ray is the main character. Another thing is that UM toys across the whole gender spectrum mostly seemed to be representing white people or they're they're so like dolls, action figures, everything are mostly white,

and toy story reflects that. Yeah, sure does. Another way in which franchise about toys could challenge in the toy industry but instead just profits off of it. It's just it is weird, how like, you know, not surprising, but just how backwards the toy industry in particular still is. And but but if you're you know, in a place where you are helping to write a toy story movie, you can include something that you know will become a toy that kids can have. And that's like a cool

power to use, not like a fucking loser. Well guess who was behind this movie? Um, because that might have something to do with ye. Also, Um, so we've got written by credits from Josh Weeden, Andrews Stanton, Joel Cohen, Alex So I don't know a man though, um, and then I don't know a man the almost the full production list of every movie. Uh, and then story by credits from John Lasseter, Pete Doctor and Joe Ramped. So it's a lot of men. Um, Yeah I believe it

or not? Yeah, I mean, well this is this was the first Pixar full movie and there if you're into Pixar lord, which I'm not, thank god. Um, but I I've I've I did my homework. There is like all this before John Lasseter was canceled and they were still allowed to let him wear his hideous shirts in public.

He told the same story a million times about how he and I believe it was three other men who were involved in the you know, the ground floor of Pixar, came up with all these story ideas, all of which became very famous Pixar movies. I think that went from toy story all the way up to Wally, Like they came up with thirteen. They just went to fucking brunch

and they planned out thirteen years worth of movies. And it is extremely telling that that is the specific like amount of Pixar history that was written by three or sorry, three to four eight white guys, because in that entire era of Pixar, that's all the movies are about. That's literally like you don't get a lead female Pixar character until two thousand twelve with Brave, Like that's the first time.

Um and up until then, like there are female characters, but they're never the driving force of the movie until after all those guys ran out of ideas. Um is Coco the first Pixar movie that's led by a person of color, Like it's just it takes I think that that's true, Like it just takes ridiculously long for anyone, And that is not like the standard that are the people who get to write movies to be included in this universe because they're not included like behind the scenes.

It is eleven pm on a school nice, so we should wrap up here. Yeah. Does anyone else have any final thoughts about the movie? They wanted to call Bugs Life Bug Story? Oh, I think that would have worked okay, and then like a Toys like works out Wally Life Story, Monsters Story, Monsters University Story. Should we take some audience questions comments before or anyone do we miss anything? Or your here? We're gonna we want you to come up to the mike so it can get on the recording.

So so come on, form a cue, come on down. Oh that's perfect. Hi. What's your name? My name is Natalie. Hi. My question is do we think that animation and as an extension c G I sort of softens or like makes misogyny more cute, sort of like makes it easier for maybe children and like all of us to digest. That's my question. I think that children's entertainment in general

makes misogyny cuter. I don't know if it's I mean, I think it is probably easier to do when it's an animated character, but I mean there's very little like I wouldn't be like, well, live all live action children's entertainment is intersectional, and like I think that you could pull any episode of Drake and Josh and see some cutie pie misogyny, and I think, yeah, there's just like all children and teen entertainment really couch it, and just

like especially when it's like making characters that you like dismissive of women and not including them in any way the way that like what he does. But I think a lot of live action characters too. Sure, I definitely think that car making cartoon anything. I mean, especially if you're talking like cartoon violence, that definitely makes it easier to to go down than pushing a real wolf off a real cliff. True about your question, thank you, thank you. Hi.

What's her name? Hi, Emily Hi. Um. With regards to the moral framework of a toy society, Um, do you think that they got their sort of treatment of women like they treat bo peep from watching their human creators? Are they born with they created by them, or is there like some sort of in their toy society? Like well, that's a great question. Well, I mean, if we're judging off of if the toys are learning about gender roles

from Andy. That makes a lot of sense because maybe we are like, oh, Wood, he's an adult man, but we don't know that. So maybe Wood he has just only seen his owner like treat women dismissively and damseled and just has this very narrow conception of the world. I don't know, but Andy is only that way because of the toys that are marketed to him. So the snake eating its own tail, I don't know. I like that,

like blew my mind. I was just wondering if it was innate, because like I haven't seen the movie in a while, but you know, when Buzzes first brought to them, he's like a new toy. And I don't remember how he acted around bo Peep, but it was he already like he was kind of a clean slate towards everyone. I mean, even based on that, Like, I don't know, I think he doesn't respond to her any differently. In fact,

he does. He does his whole like flying around the room saying and then Mr potato Head says like, oh, I bet the dolls totally go for you, and Buzzes like, where is fucking Zorg who I'm trying to kill? So like he doesn't. I don't think he like noticed as women, which is also a problem to not notice women. But I mean, there's really not many women around to notice. There. I guess I'm down for the nurture argument there. Yeah, damn, all right, thank you, thank you guys. It's eleven eleven.

We'll make a wish you gotta. Hi. So there's some really great and thought provoking questions. I don't have one of those. So when you cut the hair off of the barbies, were they more in charge? Yes? Oh good questions? Did they take over? They did? Yeah, the loft of rule is upheld yet again. Yes, that was not provoking.

That was yeah. That don't sell yourself short my mind. Hi. Hi. It seems to me that both buzz and would He their character arc focuses on them learning to deal with the fact that they're losing something that they didn't earn. So do you think it's fair to say that both of them have two different sort of challenges of male entitlements? Oh? I think so. I think that. I mean, well, basically, wood He is the in cell and Buzzes the chad. Oh my god. Yeah, finally in terms I can understand

in cell talk. Yes, I would. I mean Wood, he is such an entitled character where when his like dominance in this funked up society has challenged, he tries to kill someone He's like Stalin, like he's scary, and then buzz I mean, I don't know. I guess the Buzzes Buzzes deal is that he is very threatened and like his masculinity is challenged by that he is not the one and only buzz light Year and that he is a part like he's he's a part of something larger

than himself and that upsets him. Yeah, I mean the Chad insult thing. Really does that? Does that? What do you think, Caitlyn? Yeah? No, I agree the end? Damn, thank you, thank you. I got you to agree with me. Wow. Uh does this movie pass the back tell test gang? No? Not? Okay, Okay,

there's there's a moment. Yeah, there's a moment in Sid's house whenever, um, Hannah, Sid's sister, and then Sid Sid's mother, Mom we do not see on screen, right, and we're in the constant battle of like, is Mom a character name because it's sort of treated the same as the way Dad is. We don't know. In this case, I'm inclined to not cut them a break. But what is the what is the exchange? So Hannah says, mom, have you seen my sally Doll? The mom from off screen says,

what was that? Dear said, dear, pop Dart is ready, and then Hannah says, never mind because she has just

found buzz ak Mrs nets Bit. Um. So I would say, because we don't even see the mom on screen, and that's like one of two lines she has, the other one being popped heart related, I would I don't really want to give that a pass, but it is it is about a Sally Doll, and it's not about But then Hannah says never mind because she sees a male toy, so she decides as Mrs Nesbit that's true, So that I mean, but buzz still identifies as male as far as we can tell, even when he is dressed as

Mrs Nesbit. Yes, doesn't pass. A second one doesn't pass either, but in the fourth one they put pants on her, so problems so we'll see. Oh boy. Should we rate the movie on a nipple scale nipples based on its portrayal of women, It's like between a zero and a half nipple. I think I'm gonna go with a half just because the movie isn't outwardly hateful toward women, because I feel like the movies that we give like a zero too uh contempt contemptuous of women. This movie just

ignores and or erases women's existence. So that's actually okay. I like that so far. So yeah, I'll give it. I'll bump it up to a half nipple because of that. But yeah, this movie, there was no reason why there could not be more, you know, female coded toys. There was no reason the different of the other female characters who are introduced and exist in the story already couldn't

have a more significant narrative impact. The toys are all white, yeah, as most toys are in real life, which is another extremely fucked up thing. I'll give my half nipple. I guess to Sid's mom, who's just trying her best with what she's got, and she there is a fan theory where she and Andy's dad alone. Yes, oh, I think if that Sid might actually be the child of Andy's dad, well that's why they couldn't afford a second child. Well. Also, I mean, between Sid and Andy looking pretty much the same,

there's some shared DNA there. There's one woman who is a producer on this movie. I'm forgetting her name. She has a theory that both sit In and R John Lasseter his his inner children. I don't I hate it. I'm gonna go with a half nip as well. I don't. It's a bummer, I because I do, Like, I mean, I think this is like a classic case of a movie that no one dislikes. Really, like everyone has a soft spot for this movie. I still, I still really love it. I'm going to see a new one. Yeah,

I'm gonna cry when instructed. I'm a I'm a fucking idiot. I'll do what I'm told. But I mean, upon further, I mean, I think that this movie is just very thoroughly an unchallenging product of its time, where it's we're presented with like an upper middle class white family that challenges nothing, um and has contempt for anyone poorer than

them and thinks they're villains. Um. So you know, I just like it's just it doesn't really challenge anything, but but it I just think it's like kind of doofy and dumb, Like I don't think it's out to really get anyone, but it's just there. It's clear that no one involved in the production, or there are very few people involved in the production that had a different perspective, or or you know, very simple things could have been switched to make it a more inclusive and fun movie

to watch. So I'll give it a half nippy. I'm gonna give it to Hannah because god damn it, I think that there there was more for her to do. Justice for Hannah. Also, there's a flash forward scene and Toy Story three where Sid is like a very cheerful garbage man. Make of that what you will. There's another fan theory for that though. There so Sid is the only one who knows that toys can talk, and this

haunts him into adulthood. But then he develops an altruistic side that uh that wants to rescue toys from He wants to save them from the trash and that's why he's the trash man. What I think is that John Lasseter hates poor people. Yeah, I'm going to a second Both of these I'm giving a similar rating, and maybe I'm at like a point seven apple WHOA, I don't know. Yeah, it's just again, I don't think it's meant to be hurtful.

But so many times when people are excluded, you know, no one's trying to be hurtful, they just have very limited world views. Um, I'm gonna give it to Mrs Nest, but very good an icon. Yes, I wish he had a spin off with Rex. I think Rex is the best character in the movie anyway. Uh, definitely the most emotionally complex. He feels it so much. He feels sad that he has guilt. He turns against Woody. Very relatable, full of regret and guilt for for nothing. It really

is the most close analog for a woman's experience. There's no reason that couldn't have been if we were going to make a woman toy. I mean is constantly park where all the dinosaurs are Fabale's Oh my god, can I give you one more factor? Click to close the switch. Josh Whedon saw Jurassic Park in the middle of making Toy Story, and that's why Rex is there at all. And I assume that's why Scud the dog like pops his nose out from around a door. It's got to

be the raptors. It is a direct Drassic Park reference and Toy Story two when they're riding through a toy store and Rex is like coming up behind them in the mirror of the side view mirror. It's it's wonderful. Um. Anyway, guys, I'm bored of these. Yes, you know, Drassic Park is cool. Um. I think that's our show. So thank you for coming. Give it up for Sadie, Yes, give it up for the Women in Comedy Festival, for the Rockwell, thanks for coming up a good night bye. Okay, that was Toys

Story live in both Philadelphia and Boston. Wow magic. Uh. So we want to thank Sadie for being our guest. You can check out her band, Speedy Ortiz or her solo work. She's on Twitter and Instagram at sad s a D one three Get it um, and her incredible band, Speedy or Tees is on tour right now. The next couple of dates. Uh, if you happen to live in any of these places, They'll be in Brooklyn, New York,

tonight June at Industry City June. They'll be at Logan Square Arts Festival in Chicago June nine, Sleeping Village in Chicago, July seven, Rebel in Toronto, and July eight, Warehouse Concert Hall in St. Catherine's Canada. They've got more dates. You can check out their website to find out more. What's their website. You can go to Speedy Ortiz dot com to find further tour dates. And thank you so much to Sadie for being our guests. Indeed, hey, speaking of plugs,

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