Ever Wonder How Brands Find Their Manufacturing Partners?

Happen to have your aboard here for the really big barbecue show. We cook because we have to and we grill because we want to. Hit me. Fine. How as wrong. You have a great show big can. But going. So what what what seems to be the problem You know, this man looks like dead and he's in the in the crackle. Succulent finished what? For wheeler. So is Liberty chicken beef. Now shipping like dog, shit pink seeds. We have all been working on it right now. And just like that, we are into the

second hour. It is the Barbecue Central show. Where we cover the most important items of the barbecue and grilling world, happening every Tuesday night live, 9 to 11, Recording audibly for podcast, released Wednesday, first hour, Thursday, Second hour. Video, auto archiving as soon as we stop the feet. So if you're just rolling across the second hour right now. Where were you in the first hour? But again, recorded. So no worse. Get it tomorrow. The show originating from... I'm city Usa

Cleveland. Still they come on the show tonight, James Howe from Winners products. We say good evening to those of you watching tonight through 1 of our video streaming platform. You can go to facebook dot com or twitter dot com slash bbq central show. You can also watch show over on Youtube. Which is Youtube dot com slash at bbq b central show. We're asking everybody this Youtube poll question of the week, including All guests this evening, Did you watch either of the hotdog dog

eating contest on July fourth? It is claw back, but still 88 percent of you are saying no. You did not watch any of the hotdog dog eating contest. And that's a shame. I said I wouldn't watch it under protest because jaws was not in Brooklyn. In half the amount of time, Joey Chestnut ate only 1 shy of what took the 10 minute event. At Nathan famous, Pat Bert, eating 58 hot dogs and buns, Joey Chestnut eating 57, hot dogs and bun. But Pat did it in 10 minutes and Joey did it in 5 minutes.

So we know world record breaking pace, and it didn't happen because pet somehow rear its head in something called major league eating, which is a shame.

Coming up on the best moments of the barbecue Central show in 10 minutes or less this coming Friday, episode 341, taking you back to July ninth of 20 13, and this week we feature, the first Tuesday of the month regular guest in the second hour saying the cooking guy, John, who puts these shows together from Michigan, not typically into doing many best moments shows. That revolve around the monthly recurring guests for fear of overload

for you, the listener. I don't know if I necessarily agree with that up or not. Nevertheless, the subject we head on back in 20 13 was former food network icon. Paula Dean. Anybody remember her, You might recall back then. Paula had some issues, with P r stemming from an account from a former employee that she had made some racial comments. Also, there was an issue of her keeping back some information about her health.

Most pointed having diabetes while creating recipes that certainly didn't shy away from certain unhealthy ingredients, probably causing diabetes over a certain number of years if you ate like that all the time. Snowball, causing quite a bit of media back then, and saying the cooking guy shared his thoughts on both topics. And if he felt that Paula was being sincere in her words, or if she was just doing it to try and keep the sponsorship money that she was getting. Great segment from back

of the day. So that's what you'll will be hearing this coming Friday, don't forget you can subscribe to the podcast feed, which you need to be subscribed too to hear the best moment show. If you like it. The bbq b q central show dot com slash subscribe is the way you wanna do that. And you can see all the options to subscribe and the platforms. And so on, you can use... Even subscribe through email if

you don't wanna use a podcast platform. Don't forget if you wanna hear a guest or segment again, that's been loss in the archive, email John, and let them know what you would like to hear that is J0N john J0N at the Bbq b central show dot com, and he'll do his best to meet your needs. Look at crashes in the chat. It's got an email from crash, He's in Hawaii. So is Lance. Crash, are you in Kona? I can make an introduction between you and Lance?

I feel like it could be instant man love just like that, but I don't know exactly where in Hawaii you are. And I'll reply back to your email that I got a little bit earlier today as well. So thank you for doing that. As famous Days, All star Barbecue series was, and off again this past weekend. We knew that. No winners to tell you about for the second week in row However, what do we know? When play resumes, which I'll tell you about here in a second.

The grand champion in reserve grand champion in for the location events, we'll earn spots into the 20 24 World Food championship in the barbecue division in So we'll see who's next in line to qualify and the next famous the Dave's All star Barbecue series event is this coming Saturday, July thirteenth and hermit Tennessee. The event is full, so don't try and register for it. The El paso, Texas, Event on August third, and the Columbia Maryland event, August 20 fourth, still still showing as

having 1 spot left open. So if you are interested in taking part in the famous Dave's, All star Barbecue Series events, El paso, Texas, which is the... Second trip through El Paso on August third still has 1 spot and Columbia, Maryland, which is the last event for the series. It all culminate at the end of August. There is 1 open event or 1 open spot there as well. I believe the deposit is a hundred bucks to hold your spot.

So you can find out all the past results and the remaining schedule of future events by visiting world food championships dot com's. Slash all stars and remember the world food championships will take place in Indianapolis, Indiana in November, so we look forward to that. Before we get to James, I am asking you you know what? I'm not even gonna ask. We'll save it for another day. I do wanna thank show fan, podcast listener mostly. Raj Sc. Or giving me this book.

This is the ladies, ladies home Journal Cookbook. Let me get a date on this. Ladies Home Journal Cookbook. Double play and company, a Carol is it tracks T. Here we go. Wow. No way. This book coming out. 19 63. 11 years before I was debuted into the world. So quite a timely peace. He stopped over today to give this to me for my, impending birthday, which is tomorrow, Oh, as we turn 50 years old tomorrow, if you can believe it.

So, Rod, thank you for the book. We're gonna be comb through that through the rest of the weekend on the weekend and start ear marking, recipes that we would like to try from back in the sixties and see how we might bring them into current day with different types of ingredients or different cooking styles because I'm sure there wasn't a lot of options back then. I'm just making an assumption. But 50 years old. We are now officially tomorrow or 12:01.

As the day turns Tuesday into Wednesdays. We are officially at E0D watch. You know what I mean? Not gonna get into that. So, I wanna thank Rob for that. Also I wanna thank embedded correspondence doug shining from Texas and Rusty Mon from the Great City of Utah, and Matt Os from Tennessee for the birthday gifting of cigars, which I certainly appreciate. Well, mister Jay was consult it as well because I said, as I'm going through these cigars. I'm not... Like, Doug was in the cigars

at 1 point. I don't think the other guys know anything about cigars. Both certainly not to this level, and I'm looking at these going wow. These are some elite levels cigars that I can believe, Doug Rusty or Matt have any clue about. And the low and behold, Doug tells me, yeah. You know, we consult to mister Jay, and he's the 1 that kinda hooked it up and made the final call at the end, but it was a lot of communication back and forth between them. So as

a semi recurring guest to mister Jay, and then, of course, the embedded correspondence working together to get me such a great gift. I say thank you very much. By the way, we thank, our pal and first Tuesday of the month regular guest 14 past the first hour. Malcolm Reed from killer hogs and how to barbecue write for outfit fitting your humble host

here with the take pride in your q t shirt, with the American flag pig. Believe it or not. This symbol, is what a lot of countries think about it. American pig. Right? Of course. That's alright. Hey, James Howe is ready to go o, and the grain room will get to him here in just 1 second. Before we do that, our friends at o Franklin barbecue pits are here to tell you all about their unique, heavy.

And personally crafted offset barbecue pit. In fact, you would find these However, in a much larger version at Aaron's Restaurant, Franklin Barbecue in Austin, Texas. So what you have with the Franklin pit is a deep leaf. Thought out and refined version of the old propane tank style cooker.

Stylist, it reflects the kind of bare bones industrial thought handmade aesthetic that Aaron loves as in the peanut and the way the build allows you to see the weld in the craftsmanship shift schematic of a Texas off style barbecue fit relatively simple even if the things that happen inside or complicated dynamic physics in chemistry very few moving parts here. Numerous and massive differences divide this franklin fit from the average barbecue smoker sold at the box stores.

Franklin pits primarily made of quarter inch Take America made steel in a word strong. Anything that sees eat engineered to be incredibly solid should last at least a century or more cared for properly. And the thickness of the steel guarantees professional grade heat, retain which is the critical component to making great barbecue. Every franklin pit unique unto itself to include their own natural markings and its own badge number.

And Franklin Pits can be found in Barbecue specialty stores in select regions of the country. If you of the listener Arnold odor of such a store and you wish to become a certified Franklin dealer or visit the website, Franklin d dot com. And fill out the dealer for. Odor If you the listener of the show, Want to own a Franklin pit and live in a part of the country that doesn't have a certified Franklin dealer nearby. You can visit Franklin Bbq pits. Dot com and purchase a pit.

Franklin Pit will happily ship you a Franklin pit right to your driveway. So you either have a store and you wanna start carrying elite level off offset pits. You go to that website. Or if you're away from a certified dealer, and you still wanna buy, you can do a D on the website. Same website. Franklin bbq pitch dot com for either. Let's learn about how manufacturers, same and brands find each other, fall and love and make great product. Let's do it Stick around I'll be right

back. You're listening to that Barbecue hughes Central show. Howard stern, Jim Rome, dan Patrick and Greg Rem. The mountain Rushmore more of talk show entertainment. No. Let's get back to the Barbecue Central show. This portion of the show being brought to you by Pit Barrel cooker. The most unbelievable cooking device on the planet, available in 3 sizes with a host of accessories, Whether you're beginner or professional, it's a cooker

you wanna add to the arsenal. You visit pit barrel cook dot com and tell the Barbecue Central She'll sent you terrible news that I just learned that coffee mug that I used to pi all the time that no longer avail oh, the heartache can paint. However, great accessories nonetheless. Let them know the Barbecue Central Show sent you. My guest in the second hour made his debut on the show to rave reviews back in June where we talked about as company, winners products.

And how they came to be the largest barbecue and grilling manufacturer in the world. We also talked a bit about the new grill that Sam's club is selling, you know, the 1 with the thermostat control that everyone wanted for decades. Back on the show tonight. We have another topic to tackle that I'm sure you will enjoy. So we welcome back friend of the show, James How.

James before we talk about brands and manufacturers and matching these 2 together to to bring products to market, we have a most important Youtube poll question of the week that we're asking everybody, which is this. Did you watch either? Of the hotdog dog eating competitions on July fourth. Unfortunately, I did not. 86 percent of the Youtube voting public is with you, and me, we did not watch either hot eating kat. 5 minutes. How many hot dogs is a in his prime James Howell pudding down.

Obviously, I think probably... Maybe 2 or 3. That's about it. That's about it. I'm with 3, 2 is like, so, as I mentioned last week, 1 is the best. I mean, any kind of hot dog ballpark, worse than ballpark, the snap, but first 1 always great. And then I immediately need to have the second 1 wasn't nearly as good as the first 1. So what do I do? I have the third 1, which was tremendously bad. And it's nowhere near the second 1 and really far away from the first 1. And I said, I just should've have

stopped at 1. So 3 for me, at no doubt about it and frees questionable. I don't know if you get them regularly, but since we are now on the teeth of grilling season. Any feedback from a Sam's club, the members mark Pro series Grill, and how they're pulling through at location. Yeah. The units are doing well, and I think customers are like the control some of them admittedly or having to learn a bit about how to use the grill or learn the grill can be used as an oven. Getting

but that's gonna happen. I think with any new technology. But for the most part, I think 1 of the great things about it is that you can use the grill as a normal grill. Right? And I I mentioned that last time, and it works great like that. And then now people are kinda discovering how to use the oven mode and different things to cook with it. So you know, up in Canada, we sold that a version of that technology for, already for 4 years.

And it took some time for people to kinda of really understand the value of that technology. Did they realize? It was on there. In other words, were they buying a grill because they needed a new grill. They saw either the 4 burner or the 5 burner, members market Sam's and just bought it. Because they were their shopping. And then all of a sudden, they're like, oh, what's this dial in the middle of all the normal looking dials? And then they start to dive in a little bit and

see, Oh, I can make it enough? How would I do that? Or do they buy it knowing the technology and they just aren't employing. I think it's I think it's a little bit different for Sam's versus Canadian Tire. I think Canadian Tire you have a regular assortment like you what you would see it like a Lowe's or Home Depot where you have multiple brands and different choices for every price point.

So I think at Canadian Tire, the feature of temperature control is much more of a thing that you might choose to purchase because you have... Other choices at that price point other brands. I think at a channel like Sam's Club where there are more limited selection of product, You know, I think you do have the customer that's in there that just wants to spend 500 dollars on the grill and he buys it or her. Goes home and then discover that they have

this feature. I think there are some other people that have seen the feature, and you know, that's what made them decide to buy it. So I'm an una fan of the grill. I was a little skeptical at first when we talk about building for price point, and private labels. Maybe there is a a subconscious unconscious stigma attached to the term private label when you hear it in certain instances. So I wasn't ready for it to really rock my world, but I've had it for a good couple months now.

And as I was telling, Robert Moss, a little bit earlier in the first hour I find myself trying to figure out ways to use it. I'm not looking... I don't feel like I have to use it. Like, it's, like a contract thing or pressure in any way I'm trying to use it more and more, and it's 50 50, whether I'm using it as a traditional grill all the way through. Or as an oven all the way through, and then there's the other half of the half of that time where I'm starting it

let's say or reverse here. So I'm dialing it all the way down in the oven mode at 02:25. Once I get to my target temperature, I pull them off, and then I turn it into regular grill mode. And go as how as it again? Or I use the infrared side burner and finish it that way for a a really nice sear on the steaks It's just in my heart, I feel like in 10 years, this grill is still gonna be around. Like, the 1 that's in my backyard right now, it's still gonna be around.

Well, yeah. I mean, I think that was the intention from the beginning. Right? I think any new application of technology on con of a traditional product, has the potential to be confusing to people. So that's... What we what we wanted to avoid was, of you know, people avoiding the grill because they thought it was too complicated

and so forth. We... Our our intention was much more buy the grill because you need a girl or you like the way it looks and its features, and then you can, you know, go on the process of discovery on how to use it for a lot of and things. Once you get to know how to use it, the the temperature control. So so, yeah, happy that you're that you're liking it from And at a sub 700 price points. As I was saying you put another badge on that from a brand standpoint,

you're probably easily. Into 1800 bucks or more, for the same grill because there's a lot of a great value items that are in there, specifically the real grace that we talked about the last time, you know, I'd beginning to appreciate those even more and more every time I use it. So big fan here. I mean, some people might say, you know, well, what else you're gonna say. I mean, I probably wouldn't be h up nearly as much if I wasn't as

hyped up on the grill. Be a lot more of a very business type, tone for me. But I'm a fan and I'm recommending it out, no doubt about it. So, the topic that I wanted to talk with you about tonight because you're a guy that can really shed a lot of light on this. Probably nobody else has access to. And this kind of a show setting is building a relationship with a trusted brand. So here's James you own the factory. You're making it. And then here's Greg.

Barbecue Central has a a brand of grill, or I wanna I wanna make g, but I don't have any manufacturing. So somehow, I find James. Let's start there. How do I find James? If I have a great idea for a grill, and I don't have the manufacturing behind me. How do I find you? Good question. I think our our our our our customers have been more along, Like I said, like you said, the brands and retailers. So in the industry, people know, I think they pretty much know how to find me.

But, you know, I think just if you were to go online, you could you could look it up. The challenge is, you know, we get a lot of requests from people to build product and grill, the nature of our footprint doesn't lend itself well to con small inventors or manufacturers. And and not because not because they're not important, but just, you know, we're more of a large scale manufacturer. Now, if a brand or manufacturer retailer did wanna con... Tech me,

how would they go about it? Well, there's a lot of information just available in the industry. So we'd be able to validate each other and say, well, who's who's asking and what type of product do they sell and who do they sell to? And then we'd begin the dialogue there? So there's the opportunity where a brand reaches out to winners, but there's also another side of business, which would be

making active calls manufacturer onto the brand. So How do you identify a brand to call on to see if there might be a good relationship to start. Well, to be honest, there know, the industry is not that big, I think, you know, in terms of people doing, did the different types of products, I think everyone pretty much knows who everyone is with. And mh, you know, to a certain extent, you also know who is building what where.

I so there's that kind of circle of information, but certainly, you know, people do reach out and you do do, new projects or tenders for business. And so that also happens all the time. And then it happens from retailers as well, retailers typically work in 1 or 2 year cycles. Where they'll be reviewing their line in private

labels and so forth. So you can choose to participate in those reviews as well, when you first started was the manufacturer, the brand by and large, so both components together, and if so, when did that start to separate? So you have just a brand, but they didn't have manufacturing behind it? I think I think the start of this would have been, you know, early 2 thousands. Right? So back before 2000, most manufacturers and brands that they were 1

company. So back then, you would have had sun beam, you would have had, you know, Char, obviously, Weber you would had, even coleman back then. Mh. Cha. Charm glow. Charm will, I think was gone by then. But these were all manufacturers located in North America. And then I think in the early 2 thousands when you kinda had this. Kinda outsourcing to to China.

Some brands, kind of change their business model, to become more product development marketing, R and D and after sales, and then they would outsource their manufacturing to they would do a hybrid of both, you know, much like Weber, and I think Napoleon would do today be a hybrid of that approach. And then you'd have other brands that have come up purely from a R and D marketing design point of view that into the manufacturing space.

You know, so that would be you know, more people in the recent years, I guess, in the industry, you know, I think T is a good example of that, you know, they don't have any manufacturing that that I'm aware of themselves. So so again, it... It... It's changed over the years. Is that the same for, like, a a master build I remember having John Mack at 1 point. Mh And he was...

Very open almost bringing it up themselves saying, you know, the biggest benefit to us is we're coming up with all these great ideas or things that we wanna implement but then we're going offshore to actually get it manufactured. It... To us... To a point it almost sounded like, if he had to keep it in country, The company wouldn't have made. It was almost a necessity for them to take everything offshore from a manufacturing standpoint to remain competitive and grow.

Yeah. A master built is a good example. And you know, they... They're close to the market. They had their own, you know, call it approach to smokers, electric smokers, that type of product. And so they were able to give that information to factories in China And, you know, China had the supply chain. They had the engineering. They had the manufacturing capacity to deliver that product to market at a reasonable cost. And so that was I think the secret of their success for sure. When you are

aligning with a brand. You're coming up with 1 02:10 grill, whatever you're gonna do. Is there also talking in the beginning about how long the relationship is gonna last. Is it assumed that it will go on in perpetuity unless somebody screws somebody else how does that work? No. I don't think anything is assumed. I think there's a lot of capacity everywhere. Right? And I think you have to you, you know,

as a manufacturer. I think you have to do what it takes to try to maintain in that relationship because you know that there's another 05:10 factories out there that would love that business is well. Mh So it's in your... It's in your interest to have a good relationship to maintain quality to be transparent around... Whether it's costing or quality challenges or how you're building the product. So for sure, it's I don't think you really see long term written supply agreements very often.

No names please, but do customers of, I'm saying yours, but customers 2 manufacturers, try and overs step a little bit and and try and get better deals, by threatening to take away business to go to another manufacturer or is that dirty pool? No. I think it's I think it's part of the business. You know, I think a any procurement or sourcing person within these organizations part of their job is to ensure that they are getting the best value or deal that they can.

And sometimes that involves, you know, double checking outside, you know, outside of your current relationships. Or what's going on, not necessarily revealing anything proprietary. But I think that's a healthy kind of friction for both sides to keep both sides. Both sides honest because sometimes the... Sometimes the customer will go outside, Or the... They have to go outside to realize what a good value they're getting with their current supply chain. Right? So it works both ways.

So where does it matter to the consumer? For instance, as I'd mentioned, I'm Barbecue Central show, grill brand. I decide that partnering with XYZ manufacturing isn't working out for me. James from winners comes in, blows my minds and makes a great pitch to take over manufacturing. How can that move affect the consumer that has bought a grill for me prior to, you know, you guys taking over manufacture. I think I think for brands, you know, so I'll

say 1 thing first. I think whether it's cost or quality, it all ends up in the... It all ends up in the equation at some point. Right? So if if the manufacturer of the brand or the cusp... Has been unreasonable as it relates to expectations around cost or you know, things like that. You know, that d typically manifest in the product somehow. Meaning, you know, there's no magic formula there. If if there's a artificially low cost target, then the product is not going to come out well.

You know, by the same token, if the manufacturer is a bit too hungry for business and artificial quotes very low to get the business. There's obviously a risk that that manifests in the product as well. And at the end of the day, that all ends up in the consumer's hands, and that's never a good story. The second order effect of course is if you constantly change manufacturers, then access to replacement parts or spare parts sometimes gets gets limited.

So in the case of private labels, sometimes with retailers, if they're constantly churning their vendor base, to the customer even though the brand is the same, you know, for example, a private label at 1 of the big retailers. If the fact... If you've gone through 3 or 4 manufacturers in the last 10 years. I would say good luck trying to get a replacement part for that specific grill or even getting any help. So that's that's been a challenge, I think for last a lot of retailers worldwide.

Do you know of any brand saying, hey, if you're gonna take over our manufacturing, we also... Want you to look at making a slew of replacement parts for the stuff authority in the market or is that unreasonable? But it it sometimes it it... It would be a request. A lot of brands if they manage it properly. They probably get an inventory of parts before they leave their previous manufacturer. Oh, that'd be the way to do it.

But short of that, you know, of course, you could reverse engineer almost anything so if that was part of the business then you would do it. How many grill brands out there right now are not owners of their own manufacturer? Did you say... I'm not looking for a specific number, but, would you say the majority? Of things that we see available for sale or just the brand and they're not the manufacturer as well. Yeah. I would say the majority, but, you know, that that is that

I, you know, I'd say that that... There's a lot of nuance there because I think some brands just choose not to focus on factoring, put a lot of investment in R and d, quality standards, you know, customer support and marketing. And that's just where they choose to to to spend their resources, and I think that's a that's a very good thing to do.

Other brands would be more just, I would say putting labels on existing product that has been ear, you know, at the manufacturing level, and that would be more of a trading model, I'd say, If you're the brand of the the former, not the ladder that you were just describing. You're doing all this great work and innovation and marketing and all this other stuff. To me, you you're obviously missing, the biggest component. It's the manufacturing and now you're having to go out and try and...

Figure out or or navigate the different manufacturers to see. Are you trying to see who best of lines. Oh That was supposed to be. Are you are you able to navigate to see, like, which manufacturer best of aligns with you. How do you... If you... If I'm the brand and I'm doing all this work upfront. I mean, I wanna have the manufacturer, that's also gonna make it very seamless for me and

provide a great product. But if there is a number of manufacturers to choose from her how am I making the right decision? Good question. I think it comes down to, obviously first. You know, who do you who do you feel you can have a good relationship with? Because there will always be good and bad things that come out of a project Right? And how do you manage and navigate those good and bad things? 1. I think second, you also have to

look at capabilities, of course. So does that factor that you worked with, Do they have the... You know, do they have the manufacturing capabilities that are specific to your product, You know, a... A commodity cooker, you know, manufacturer is not necessarily gonna be good at manufacturing pellet grill or or a gas grill and so forth. Right? So you'd have to look at that.

And I think third, you'd look at also things like who are their existing customers and how what kind of relationships does that factory have with their existing customers. So if if that factory has a has a history of churning through different customers and, you know, having a bunch of issues, well that that might tell you something as well. I wanna ask you a question, but I'm gonna be very vague and, you know, not trying and put you on any any weird spot on this.

Let's talk about manufacturers and brands running promotions, you know, whatever that means. As a consumer, if you are signing up for promotion, Is it in the end caveat door? You're taking the the risk at, you know, let's say, hypothetically, there's a manufacturer or a brand says, you know, buy this grill, and then for the next so many years, you're gonna get some grill in replaced. Whatever that means. Are you buying it knowing, hey, I think I'm just getting a good deal on 1?

And if I get 2 or 5, or they fulfill the whole thing that's just cream on the coffee? Or as a consumer should I believe that if I'm signing up for this, they're gonna be able to support it all the way through. Well, I think you'd... Like, like any kind of consumer proposition, you do have to look at the brand. Right? And see the reputation in the market? How long have they been around? Do you think they'll still be around for the length of whatever contract it is?

I think that would apply to anybody not just a fact. Sure. Right? Any brand promise or or even warranty. Right? If you're getting a 10 year warranty on something. Mh again, this applies to sure brands that applies to retailers as well. For retailer in in our space, You know, if you have a 10 year warranty on something, the worst case that happens is you bring the product back and you scream and they could probably give you your money back. Right?

You know, but for a brand, you know, you have to ask yourself who do you go to to scream in in 10 years. If there's, you know, to to get that money back or to get your promise fulfilled on that warranty or whatever it is. So I'd say I'd say it really depends on the brand and their kind of reputation and how long they've been around. Where do you see the live market over the next... Well, I guess through the second half of the year now that we're

into the teeth of July? You see anything crazy coming up or do you see a continued flatness because from my end of it, it's kind of shockingly quiet, but you're on a different side of this. Yeah. I think I think everybody, and this would be around the world, not just not just, you know, the Us. I think everybody was hoping for you know, a stronger bounce back from some of the supply chain. Challenges and kind of inventory challenges post Covid. A lot of people bought

bought in this category during Covid. Mh. And so and so I think they pulled forward demand, and everyone was hoping that they would have burned through that demand already. But I I think it hasn't quite happened. There's there's certainly signs of life. Okay? In certain pockets and segments. I know that on the fuel side, on the fuel side, things are strong, which is good because it indicates people are still grilling. Mh. And still using the products.

It's just more on the hardware side that the replacement cycle hasn't really hit, So I think people haven't haven't burn through what they bought during Covid. And or people that were gonna buy now maybe bought during Covid, so, we just haven't had the the bounce back that the whole industry had hoped yet. So I think it's both. I think you have people that were gonna buy now bought 2 years ago and people that maybe didn't think they were gonna be buying 2 years ago decided to buy. 1,

2 or 3 coke. I think that's the other portion of this. When people were on the buy, they weren't just buying 1. They were buying multiple, well they never had multiple. Right? So now you have 3 times the amount of cooker to get through, and you're not using them all at the same time, every single time you're firing and up to cook. You have longevity that you didn't plan for. It's built in. So you you wanna... And now, you know, money's tied and world's gonna end and all this other stuff.

So you're not racing out to buy the next luxury ticket item when you didn't give a shit 2 years ago She just thought you're never gonna be able to leave your house again. So I think, you know, that part of it is... Is... And then you just have... I mean, if you're buying something that's, let's say, middle of the road or better. I mean, they just last... I'm sorry that it's gonna last 5 years. So if you were a Ceo banking on...

Whatever that non buy was, and you're like, you know what this is going to be how it's going to be going forward. You should have been fired. I mean, nobody was. But that was that was some really bad game planning by what are supposed to be really smart people, and I'm looking at it going, throw all these years away. Like, you can't even begin to forecast office. This is just more This is what's happening in real time and then completely discard it. Like, a pitcher

getting a home run head off you. Think out... You gotta immediately forget about it. And then when things start to flatten out, then we can start going back to normal forecasting. But it was crazy to me, The smartest people in the industry were saying, the way people are buying now is how it's going to be caring for.

Unbelievable. Well, I think I think they have different pressures, you know, that they have to say that, you know, on them, But I will say that, I think different segments are behaving differently as well. Right? I think you're seeing continued growth in grid. You know, obviously, it's it's it's... It's coming off a smaller base, so, you know, it it continues to grow as people kinda discover that product. And I think Blacks stones has done a great job in kind of getting that message

out there. I think that the... As I said, I think Pellets continue to be used, you know, you see the sales on the... Fuel side doing very well. So I think that space is certainly here to stay if not, you know, we'll continue to grow as people, you know, use it and kind of the Covid hangover, you know, finishes. And I think the last part is, I think gas grill you know, people are looking for more innovation and new

stories, including retailers. Right? So manufacturers and brands, have to work hard to bring more exciting stories and innovation and utility to the market. And I... And I certainly know that that's happening Whether it's our thermostat grill or whether it's some of our customers and some of the thinking they're doing there, including, you know, hybrid product that includes grid, you know, AAA grid pan, so you could use a gas grill as a grid land as a gas grill, things like that.

So I think, you know, everyone's working hard to bring excitement in. And, of course, the last biggest trend trend which you and I have talked to is electric. Right? Yep. I think the entire world is focused on bringing some sort of electric solution to the market that cooks that cooks well. At the moment, nothing really cooks as well as gas, I don't think or or charcoal. But certainly from a trend point of view, it's something that Cap be denied. I,

tons of people are working on it. You were at the sp event, which is Okay. I mean, no offense sp, but just for the Americans. This would be something akin to, like, the Hp expo. But this is actually, like, a real live event. Huge displays, like, it's a week long or whatever it is. What did you see aside? I know you said electric was was a pretty big push out there, But what else did you see that was interesting? Yes. Sp is the European equivalent of, I guess, the Hp and hardware show rolled into

1. So I think most major brands even American brands are there as well. The style of cooking in Europe is a bit different than it is here in North America. So you see a lot of different brands that you don't see here that are that are quite big. Because there's so many markets in Europe, you see a lot of regional brands as well, So German or French or or, you know, niche Spanish brands and so forth. So you get a lot of neat product id, that all of them translate, you know, to to North America.

You know, as an example, is I think grid cooking has always been part of the landscape over there. In fact, a lot of gas grill. Have always come 50 50 greats and grid. So that's been something that's been normal in Europe and and Australia. For for years and years.

So so it's interesting to see now full grid there are also gaining traction, but it's something that they've had there's also a lot of neat kind of social live fire type product where you have people standing around maybe like a a giant plant, and then there's a giant log fire in the middle. You know, the... These... It's a lot of those products. I don't... I've never actually seen 1 being used I had 1 for a years. Did you use it? Yes. I used it twice a year. Memorial Day and a labor day.

Right. Right. And so I think they're beautiful product. They are beautiful product. If you have a lot of space. I think they can be great. I just don't know how often people use use that type of product, but there's certainly lots of them. And then... And then, of course, you have your your your, you know, your global trends right now such as pizza, you know, that's still very big. Is it? I judging by the number of product you see, yes, I'd say. Are but are we on the downside of popular?

Or no. We're still we're still launching up or are we flattening? Alright. You know, I... I'd say I'd say what people are doing, you know, whether it's uni or whether it's ga, I think they're trying to take it beyond pizza. You know? So I think didn't Uni launch a very big 1 recently and and they're showing they're showing you can cook with all your kinda cast iron pans and it and so

forth. Yeah. So so I think I think what they're trying to do is they're trying to say, well, you should buy this not just for the pizza it makes, but you can do all this other stuff in into too. And certainly, I think that's the approach. Ga is taking as well. Because because... Yeah. I mean it's a different style of cooking. Right? It is almost closer to a, you know, I guess, a Hu style or oven style of cooking. Would you like to see air fryer off of grill?

Or do you not care? You'll put it on if the customer is gonna ask? Well, I I think, you know, it depends on which customer is asking and depends. You know, I and I don't know I don't know how many people use it, to be honest with you. But but certainly, there's a lot out there. And I... And I think the the... Is it the ninja that is out there right now. The the Ninja smoker. It's almost like a half indoor plants half out year. Yeah. Yeah. Did you would find you know? That that is done.

That's right. That's right. But that 1 is doing tremendous numbers from what I understand. Yeah. So there certainly is an appetite for it. And that uses a bit of kind of air frying. Technology to deliver kind of, it's cooking. Anything else? We can technology debunk myth or po authenticate on tonight before I let you go, James? I have no idea what else Did you wanna debunk. You think grid are still growing in the market? Or are they starting?

To flatten out. Because let... It's it's a loaded question because... Sure. Blacks stone still has the Lion's share. But if we're gonna be talking about what's a jumping the shark and and what isn't, I was shocked to see them deviate and go high line for a 2000 dollar grid. You know, stainless this or built in that. I was never surprised that they went into a pallet cooker

thing. I thought that was, you know, pretty easy thought to to make the jump to, but I was shocked to see them go into luxury g when it seemed... The everyday Ham and Egg was their main base. They were catering to what they were giving accessories. They were building an empire around it and to make that big of a departure seemed like a jump to shark moment for grid.

You know, I think that they are still doing a great job with their core audience, which is kind of like you said more of the core price points and mass product. I think the installed kind of built in island 2000 dollar fully stainless, you know, grid you know, a little bit of behind the scenes, I think from a development point of view, it would have caused nothing to develop that product.

You know? So from an R and D development, even a tooling point of view, it wouldn't have been a very big investment to build the product. So maybe from their perspective, they thought, you know, let's throw some high end stainless steel. Let's make it look premium and see if we can sell some. So is it a bigger maybe Is it a bigger Gp item for that? Oh, I would imagine something. Yeah. I mean I would imagine so. So...

And and, you know what? Maybe people are so maybe they're just trying to push the narrative that, you know, the girls can replace grill in every way. Right? So even in your installed island, you should be thinking about putting a grip as opposed to a grill. Mh right? And, you know, that's... Their they're there may be the brand to push that. You know? But I think you'll see you see big grid from you know, big grid from commercial guys have existed forever. Right? You know,

so so we'll see what happens. But but, yeah, It's they're very expensive. James Howe is the Vp managing director North America for winners products, winners products dot com is the website. And James sounds like a million dollars. Of course, because he has also been... Told you've gotta get a Usb microphone in order to be a guest on the show. However, James is not in Arkansas or in Illinois Tell us James. Where are you joining us from tonight doing this interview.

Oh, currently, I am in Taipei 8 Taiwan. I think you're almost the farthest away guest I have ever had. I had a, a guy from, was he He live in Australian was originally from New Zealand or the other way around, but he might have been the far of this guest. But you definitely gotta be, like second farthest, and you sound like a million

bucks. So this is why we have this technology because James sounds like he's sitting just to the left of me, but in the Barbecue Central Show Studios, but instead he's in Taipei Taiwan. Are you you doing a lot of travel out there or What do you want to? Yeah. Actually, the last show we did I was... I did it from Singapore. So Wow, yeah. So I do a lot of travel all around. How many days out of the year do you think you're out of pocket? I'd say at least a third? Wow, I'd

say at least... A third. So it's quite a bit. That includes trips, you know, to Europe and North America and and, obviously, the facilities is in China, so all around. James always appreciate the conversation. You lend great insight to the show that a lot of people would never have access to. So the fact that you... You're willing to reveal all this stuff and talk about. I certainly appreciate, and we're gonna line you up again. We're gonna talk about you're what did I have ready? Oh, growing a

private label from start to acceptance. Now I think that's gonna have a allowed of value for the folks when we get to that conversation, but we'll get it set up, and then we'll have you back on in the meantime, stay safe and continue success. Happy birthday. Thanks, James. 50. Alright. Yeah. You give this guy. That's James Howe. Winners products. Winners products dot com. I will tell you that if you are heading to winners products dot com and you're looking for

a whole bunch of information. That is more of a, a general information website. And I gotta find a lot of detailed stuff there, but you can get some contact information if you're ready to start a brand with James. He's willing to have that conversation. Maybe he can point you in the right direction of the smaller footprint folks. Grow you up, put you through the bush leagues and then transition to the major leagues over with winners. Who knows.

But the next conversation we have building a, with the trusted brand. Alright. Look. My clock is all jacked up. Let's do this. And me get right there. And me get right here. We'll get ready to close it up. Listen up gang. Our friends over at big pop smokers have something special for you, the listeners of the show whether you're seasoned to pit master. Or a grilling newbie, big pop smokers your 1 stop shop for all things barbecue from their championship.

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Don't forget to check out Big Pop full line of recipes at this website, cooking with big papa. To cooking with big papa, and, of course, follow on social media. For all the amazing recipes. We'll be back to wrap the show right after this stick around will be right back. Get Let's get back to a guy who was more experience giving you his opinion, then he actually has cooking. Once again, here's your host. Greg ramsey.

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Great info from James howe, For the extended segment there in the second hour, a lot of great stuff, a lot of great answers, a lot of great insight. So you're not finding this type of information on any other barbecue podcast because they don't have the access to a guy like James that I was lucky enough to meet during the whole Covid debacle. So a great positive that came out of that, many positive. But James certainly a shining beacon and of positivity for the Covid situation.

And I think that's gonna do it. Appreciate everybody wishing me a happy birthday on Instant chat, of course, and the emails that I've gotten earlier today. Again, thanks to Rod Sc for the Cook book that he brought by earlier today, Doug and Matt and Rusty for the cigars. And unfortunately, now that everybody knows my birthday tomorrow gifts will be expected hot and heavy from here pork. You got always to get it to me. Express shipping only.

It All the way back in the first hour, it was meat head from amazing ribs dot com, and then it was robert moss, robert moss dot com. Second hour all j all the time winners products dot com. He actually has a car detailing pressure washer website. See if I can find. Real quick. Active products dot com is the web website at like the way it's sound active product. If you're into like, washing your car your detail guy.

This is like the most elite pressure washers serving that niche to the industry premium, car bundle. You can believe. Active products dot com. We'll plug for James side business there, but winners products otherwise. Big show playing for you next week and you can believe it we're always gonna be through the third Tuesday of the month West right is coming in. We have a quarterly guest. Tuesday probably going to be a just trial. That who we got. Let's look Yes. Just p Oh.

That's gonna be tough, I. She's on like the 6 week travel journey. We're gonna have to iron that out directly after the show, so we can re refocus the messenger necessary. Anyway, how do I always lead you to 09/11/2001, I will never forget. Till next Tuesday at 9PM Eastern. This is your program host and proud Us American, Greg Rem, Good night now. This off the park since Pit master with Sm Mountain Dew in Nashville Tennessee and you are listening to the Barbecue Central show. Since