This is the baseline discussing the hot button topics of the NBA. Welcome everybody, your tune to the baseline Calie Warrenshaw discussing the hot button topics of the NBA. So much happening in the last week of the NBA and
we haven't even gotten down to basically the final stretch run. Essentially, there's still so much basketball left to be played, maybe a handful of games will be about fifteen to twenty games left to play, and yet we are so much further away from really determining who's going to be in it and who's going to be out of it. But
I guess that's what makes it all intriguing. But more importantly, a lot of stuff happening with teams who have made big moves, pushing chips all into the table, only to find the outcome being not what they had hoped for. So stuff to get into. Cannot wait to do it. Go ahead and roll out the red carpet to my right hand man Www. Dot Show Sports sat in Net Big going to PC my man, Mister warn Show repping out of Fort Floida and Florida rocking the nice fitted
nineteen Media group cap what's good, my man? Looking fresh to death today.
It's very kind of you, sir, I mean, just trying to follow in your proverbial footsteps, but you know what it is.
Man.
We back up here with the Baseline Bay Podcast. Another great episode, stretch run of the NBA season. Lots to talk about, fresh off the heels of a weekend where our Celtics, you know, and the Lakers winning streak, so I'm always excited about that. But again, a lot more information to kind of get into, and I just wanted to and before we kind of get into it, you know, I think we might have been well, you know what, No,
we weren't premature. We're right on time. But the impressed me segments continue because just a week after you talk about Jokic and the honest game and how how it was nice to see those big men kind of doing things, Joker goes out there and puts up a line we've never seen in NBA history, with thirty twenty and twenty MVP gap is closing in. I saw on something on ESPN today after that game. It cut SGA's MVP odds
in half after that one game. But I think I think Jokis has always been right there, right right there in the running. I think it's been neck and neck. I don't know how anybody was saying it was SGA's to win, nor it was his already. But I love what's going on in the NBA right now. Bro. Then these two guys are are in for a historic stretch as they're even playing today, as we're recording this evening.
Yes, those are the collapse for Thank you Nicola Jokic for doing exactly what I think a lot of people are afraid to have what happens right Like when you have already just assumed that you know, the the Handy Award because of Oklahoma City Thunder, you know, have the best record in basketball, and you know all this other kind of stuff, it's just like an easy give. And I'm not saying that by far SGA is still not ahead.
I'm not even saying that SGA, in what he's done in totality through this season, is not deserving of being the lead vote getter for MVP. But there's a reason why Jokic is a three time NBA MVP winner, right
And it's not about just what he's doing. Shaw we talked about sometimes it takes Iron to sharp sharpen Iron, and that, to me is part of the narrative that I think gets missed when we're watching these guys play their season out right, Like, if I'm SGA, I'm not saying that you should do anything outside the scope of what's major team successful and put them in the position that they're in, But yeah, go out there and drop another fifty Oh yeah, go out there and drop twenty
five assists. If the game allows you to be able to do that. Iron sharpens Iron. I think that game that he had against Giannis Antetokumpo, and I'm not saying it's because of Antetokumpo. What I'm saying is is he recognizes the magnitude of the moment, what's at stake for the Denver Nuggets, and he knows it this is the time where he has to step his game up even further. And those are the performances that are coming out. These
are the end results. And we as NBA, either pundits or those that are watching the game, get to watch this, absorb it and bass and glow in the greatness of what's made him the kind of player that we always have thought he was right And then what we're seeing right now, like this is what we're asking of our great players when the moment asked of it, he's delivering. And I think because of him, he's making this MVP you know, run even that much more interesting and hate
it to love it. If he winds up winning it, I'm not going to be mad at it. SG shouldn't be mad at it. If nothing, it should force him to go out there and take greatness to another level to secure his ability to win his first MVP award.
Yeah. Absolutely, And again we're recording this the day of the game that they're playing, so we don't even know the outcome of I don't know what that will be and how those narrors may even shift by the time
this absolutely airs. But I love the fact that there's there should not be this just coronation, if you will, for SGA, just because Jokers want it so many times I think, I don't think I know Joker is still very legitimately in this conversation, and the fact of voter fatigue is a real situation, and there's others out there saying that they won't, but it is that and it's really interesting because I was thinking about this tour we're
coming on air. It's like, well, he's an MVP, a multiple time MVP is now having his best season, the best season of what have been any other previous MVP runs. And that's not to mitigate into say that somebody couldn't come up from the throws like SGA and be right there and compete with him. But statistically speaking, you know,
Joker is doing a lot of the heavy lifting. And if you took both those guys off there, off those teams, I guess the question is, you know, who do you think would actually still be able to be maybe a playoff contender? And I don't know. I think I would pick Okay in terms of their overall totality because so much is centered around what Joker does in terms of even the play creation and the rebounding and the scoring. Is you will to and I will say she's just
a score because he does defend as well. But both of these guys have strong cases, and I know we're not in a situation where we want to see ties and give it to both of them, but I will be interested to see how the voters ultimately go. And this is not a conversation we engage in because it is a pretty healthy narrative that gets discussed on a regular basis. But it's intrigued my interest right now, especially the way Joker is truly coming on here and trying
to gain ground. It seems like on Ah and the MVP right well, And I.
Think the other thing you have to look at, Tooshaw is the scheduling and where these teams fit in the narrative of what they need to do for the remainder of the games left to play. Right Like, of course, if you are dagging out, you would love to give your team opportunity, your star players opportunities where there's some rest because obviously this is going to be a tough run,
right for the Oklahoma City Thunder. If you're the Denver Nuggets, unfortunately, you don't have the luxury to afford that kind of opportunity. So Mike Malone knows he has to maximize getting the Denver Nuggets in the best position possible to at least wind up hosting first round, you know what I mean. And so you're going to wind up seeing a skewed
version of the way that this is. And again, when we're giving this award, are we giving this award up until what he was so dominant and then now because they're laying off, it should not count against him. Forget that it's the MVP award through the totality of the regular season. And I think that's where it becomes very intriguing that you see these kind of matchups in a game like the one that you're speaking of, that as we're recording this show is highly watchable because of where
these two teams are. But more importantly, when you see a performance of like what Nikola Jokic did, and he's very firmly the second place, you know, in second place of the MVP, you want to see where that level of greatness comes from. In an SGA. He can he can go through the regular season again, he can drop another fifty burger or whatever. But I want to see where his impact when he has to play against his contemporaries.
These are his contemporaries now, Giannis atietekunmpos, the Luka Dankic's He's no longer second tier. And because the team is successful and he's basically the best player on the team, we're gonna no, he's gonna have to He's because of his performances through the regular season and why we've been watching him so closely and we've been pushing him into
that conversation. This is the game that we need to see where SGA should be constantly in that conversation because every time he decides to play against those great players, he's going to put out that best performance necessary, whether they win or lose. I just don't want to see
a dud. I don't want to see, well SGA just disappeared, because Yeah, that's gonna count against him, and it's gonna count against the viability of saying, is he really deserving to be the MVP when you're seeing equal contemporaries out there exuding that level of greatness in high level games, prime time games, or games where it matters the most.
Yeah, it's really interesting because I think, while we do want this matchup, but you want to see them go ahead to head, they're not really guarding each other, right, they played two completely different positions. It's different from the Embiid Jokic days, right when they did guard each other and they went up and then Embiid basically won the m v P in the one on one matchup, you know in Philadelphia, where he just kind of flamed the joker that in that in that game for whatever reason.
But it was it was I'm sorry, it was the turning point, right like where everything was kind of neck and neck. That performance really kind of made the sension. It made the exclamation point about we feel comfortable if Joel ANDB winds up winning the MVP, will not be disappointed because of where he was and in that matchup against Nicola Jokic.
Yeah, and there's the there's the other side of it too, where some people think it's you know, ridiculous, Okay, Well that one game was that, right, That's what decided it. When you know, even when you said previously it was it's a regular season award, it's the complete body of work.
And because until we get true determining factors and whatever the aspects are that are going to be the determinating these awards, it's always going to be subjective and a one game, one v one scenario, so to speak, can till the favors until the odds. Similar to a historic NBA performance of epic perfortions, when you have thirty twenty and twenty, you know in a game that you do ultimately win, you know all of a sudden, the other guys,
the league guys, odds have been cut in half. Like, it's very wild to see how this is, how it's you know, oscillating really from day to day. But that also goes to show you how close it is, how two great how these two great players are playing this season. And I don't want to take anything away from both of them. I want to be on the positive side of this. So let's see how things shake out again. We'll see how it goes in terms of the team matchup.
Also ultimately where both of these teams finish. While we know Case he's going to be the number one seed, can Denver and get a two seed or three seed? And does that give Joker a better line into winning another MVP?
Yeah? Yeah, well I listen, man, I want to see Sga cook. That's it, That's all it is, man Like, I want to see him. I want to see him cook. And look, it wasn't too long ago, Sean, that we were having this conversation about Jason Tatum. It wasn't too long ago we were having this conversation you know about Kyrie Irving, right, I mean you look at the numbers as some of these guys have been posting and and
and these are they're viable numbers. But again, part of that indicator I think of right now where the present state is, where it's all about what the eyes are telling you. It's when you have these kind of matchups happening on primetime television where at the height of the game of basketball is being watched.
Can't can Can I just say that because I was going to save this but you touched on it, and I just I got to get this off my chest. I am I am sick of the Jason Tatum denigration. Like I'm tired of it, you know, and whatever it is that Fox Sports or others people have against Jayson Tatum, Like it's absolutely got to stop, you know, like close your eyes and do you like get out of here, like stop it, stop it. Jason Tatum is in all time already an all time great, and I'm just not
because we root for the Celtics or whatever. I just feel like this this era of wanting to tear guys down and because he doesn't do it in the way that we're used to. And I can even grant the fact that well Kobe is his idol and the guy he will looked up to. He doesn't have the same
outward exuberance as Kobe. That doesn't mean he's that he's not a killer, doesn't mean he's not a fierce competitor, right, And everything that keeps coming out about Jason Tanta, especially within the last couple of weeks, Like it's just been so negative while he's been delivering. And you're talking about guys whos been giving forty forty point performances, you know, in wins and won in a loss against Cleveland as well, Like that guy is hooping and has been hooping. And
after the disrespect from the Olympics. Yes he didn't win, you know, I find MVP, but he won an NBA championship. There's just so much just negativity around this guy. First, for whatever reason, stop it. Jayson Tatum is is on a Hall of Fame pace. He's an all time great, and we need to give him his flowers in the current and in the present.
Yeah. So I had no idea that our conversations were going to lean into these different directions, but I completely agree with you. I will say this, though, Shaw, what I think now that I'm appreciating more about what I'm seeing from Jason Tatum is that he has found a way to show us his greatness within the confines of a of a of a of a very well balanced team.
And he doesn't make any bones about the fact that he's not going to be considered an MVP candidate in the same way as an SGA is Nicola Jokic, because he understands that the way that this team has been structured for him and for everyone of the way that the Celtics are is as long as they're successful in winning. And his guy, Jalen Brown is eating and all the rest of those guys are eating. He's all for it.
And at first I thought it wasn't as genuine because when I saw how he first came out, initially, I really thought that his mindset, very similar to the Mamba mentality, was one more to be so self obsessed, self possessed, self absorbed that you wind up just completely, you know, overlooking everyone else and what they could potentially help bring to the table if you so badly want to win
a championship. But you've seen how year after year after year, even as the distance about trying to make him the viable MVP candidate which there should not be His numbers prove that he should be an MVP candidate every single year, but he's doing it sacrificing certain things that I think has what's elevated that idea or perception that he's supposed to be an MVP, and yet he's not in that conversation by the time that we get to the end of the year and we don't really look in totality
about what is encompassed around what he deals with and what he does throughout the course of the regular season. That may mean why he's not one, two or three right like when we think he's supposed to be. But think about it, Jaylen Brown, if he was on another team, would he not be considered an MVP candidate alone? Like the reason why those guys are together is why we
see the sustainability as successful to Boston Celtics. And I think people who watch their favorite teams, their favorite players and stuff like that, look at how your team is structured and tell me, would you want it only about him being an MVP or would you want your team sustainably in the playoffs, in the Eastern Conference Finals, in the NBA Finals year in and year out, with confidence? Would you want that more than you worry about wanting your guy as an MVP. I'll and I'll give you
the perfect comparison or analogy to that. Look at Joel Embiid. Look at how many iterations of the Philadelphia seventy six we just talked about this last week. And I'm not shamming on Joel. What I'm saying is that is an organizational decision about how they structured that team. You look at Joel Embiid and you look at the iterations of
the sixers that they've had over the years. He's gotten his m v P. But for all of that, does that mean that they were as any more successful when he was there that in his rookie year and his rookie dominance. So that's what I'm saying. It's a lot of moving pieces to that part.
You know, there are a lot of moving pieces, and I think for Tatum, a lot of it is for media times specifically, it's a disappointment he didn't reach the mountaintop as fast as we wanted him to for the signs that he showed, and it took a certain level of changing his own mindset and took Mazula kind of coming in and kind of changing the team mindset to some degree for them to get there. Yes, they got to the finals with Udoka, but ultimately, you know, kind
of choke that away. And it's interesting now from you know, you sake it three years ago, four years ago, maybe now where old Tatum's for sure gonna be an MPP. He's going to win multiple now, no one's saying, no
one's saying those things. He's gonna proverbally always be slided in the four or five slot, you know when it comes to the bos like, yeah, he's good, but he can't really win, right, And guys like if you take future MVP odds, you take Anthony Edwards right now, probably most people would you know, over Overtatum in terms of tating, because like, oh, we feel like we've seen what he is, we know what he is. He's not going to be any more than what he's shown currently that may or
may not be true. I think the aspect of you know, just trying to crap on the guy and saying he's all these that he's not all these other things and and basically trying to take away from his greatness is where I'm just like it's a bridge too far, and I just I'm tired of it. And you know, it's and it's everything I see on social media right now. And you know, Jason Tatum is an amazing basketball player and he's accomplished a lot and a lot more than
the others. I think the latest one was, oh, he's like Clay Thompson at at Clay Thompson's peak, well slightly better than like get out of here, just just just get out of here, like just stop it. So anyway, I've screened us much further than where our agenda was supposed to be here today. So I apologize. But I came in a little ownery, a little bit spicy, and I needed to get that off my chest.
Especially we should we should have seen the signs. Bro, you you are you're wearing traditional Celtic green. You gotta you gotta glowing green going on.
Man, I feel like, you know, they have that black and that lime green one. Yeah, so maybe it's a it's a little lean into.
Yeah, man, I mean, you know, I don't know what what leper kin you got got ready for this Saint Patrick's Day run. But I'm saying I don't know if I want to be running into you and in Boston streets now feeling some guy way.
Just let's keep it positive. NBA just can do that.
Good luck with that good luck I mean in this day and age. Man, you know what I'm saying, he Lebron, Lebron about to step to some people, not gonna name no names, but Cali Warrenshaw baseline NBA podcast got a great show coming up, man. Obviously we're gonna talk a little bit about things going on with the New York Knicks losing Jalen Brunson. What that's gonna mean, and it's not always Sonny in Dallas. I will let you know
what that actually means as well too. And then we got a quick little you got were carrying this over from our previous episode because you know, Shaw the the the mind warp that he was able to transport our mentalities to in the possibilities of who would you choose would you choose to you know, to start your franchise? Would you choose A K. Cunningham? Would you choose the
Tyrese Haliburton? I was not letting that go, and we're gonna make sure we get that in and you who you got, so as always be sure to get in my Manshaw, Ash Sports, NBA, Get at Me a Gay Face Leader Shows, Twitter, NBA based on available on all the major platforms. You can go to www dot the Baseline NBA dot com to nowally check this episode episode out, but also the puff ther of episodes that we dropped
for your listening pleasure. And if you see us on the bloom and white logo because you're catching us on YouTube, remember that is the nineteen Media Group Family. Nineteen Media Group you running these content streets, so be sure to check out the family of great content creators at www dot nineteen MediaGroup dot com. Coming up, seaw and I go over some some really really good juicy stuff that's been happening in the association off the court, and we'll
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miss it here on the baseline. We're back Cali Wonnshaw based one NBA podcast, couple of things going on in the association. Wanted to make sure we highlight, so sew the The interesting thing that has been going on now is is the the post i guess interviews and the after math interviews that take place after the fallout of the big trades that have take that have happened so
far this season. And one that was pretty interesting to me is now the reveal about where de Aaron Fox was with the Sacramento Kings organization and everything that led to his eventual move movement to being sent to the you know, San Antonio Spurs and I just I guess to me, I find it very interesting because it's definitely feels like I don't know if the Aaron Fox with somebody is somebody that likes to keep things, you know, kind of private, doesn't want to speak ill Obviously, you know,
this was the organization that drafted him, that this is his starting point is now he's moving forward or to Sacramento, but he is revealing some interesting things about what led to him eventually being traded. Obviously he requested, you know,
to be traded. To me, I just find it just kind of interesting that, you know, the Sacramento Kings allowed certain things to be leaked out about how he is or where he is, and then now Darreon Fox is on the defens of saying, look, I wasn't on board with the fact that, you know, you guys let go of Mike Brown. I wasn't even told about it, and you know, I just felt like the organization didn't have
my back. And so I don't know if he's hedging, if he was hedging his best, if he outright just really felt some kind of way about what took place there. But clearly he wants to make sure that he's like, Yo, I don't want to be coming into any situation where you guys think that I'm the reason why I asked to be moved. This is really all on them. What were your thoughts about, you know, d Aaron Fox and him laying these assertions down about what led to what happened with him with Sacramento.
I think there's the old adage that hey, there's three sides to a story, and so I don't think Fox is squeaky clean and everything that's that's happened here. But we also know the Sacramento Kings organization is not has not always been the most well run, and that they have had some faux pause and we we as media types, haven't always agreed with some of the decisions that they've made and the things that I'm going out there, But with current ownership and previous ownership was well even going
back to de Marcus Cousins days. So it's it's a really really strange situation. Fox kind of going on this acquittal tour, if you will, maybe not a tour, but again he's making these comments and at this point it doesn't really matter that both both both parties have moved on exactly.
I in my head, I'm like, why why is it necessary now? Like when you I felt that there was a window where if you really had to say something about this, you could have said something about it, and you chose not to say anything about it, and it
obviously didn't help your cause. Now you're it's almost like you're revisiting this because so much there's so much more that's going on right now that I don't think anybody really would have cared because of the fact to your point, show it's the Sacramento Kings, and it just doesn't feel like anything that they do any longer has like a genuine level of longevity in in in it being like
an organization that knows what they're doing right. So for now for him to have to come out and say something, I feel like it feels like you're trying to say face to something that there actually is some truth to what was going on that we weren't a privy to it, we weren't aware of.
Yeah, it's it's it's water under the bridge, or at least it should be. He's moved on. They moved on. He's in a situation that's going to be better for him. Long term, although the Wemby injury obviously impacts the short term viability of this season. But Sacramento is listen, you don't need to throw them any more on the ground based on everything you kind of just said, like, hey, we've we've seen how they who they are. We understand
to a certain degree how they operate. So it's not just like you're not throwing any more dirt, you know, in the grave here, just like all right, cool, we know it's not the best organization, so you moved on for whatever the reasons are. Let that be that. Let that be between y'all. And I just hope that darn has whatever closure he needs and the Kings do as well too, Like we don't need to be reviews of this,
you know. And I want to say the person the victim in this is Mike Brown, but some way, like Mike Brown's wounds get reopened as a result of you
know whatever. Fox is here saying as well too, and by Brown is, yeah, he's still getting paid, but he's out of a job, right so you know whatever whatever that means for him now, like he's not having the same piece that he'd like to have at this point, you know, after being let go what it gets about two months ago now, so hopefully Sacramento and Darren Fox whenever Fox comes back in the sack too, you know, in future seasons, you know it's still well received and
they can give them, you know, love, and they just can forget and say, hey, it's a time. I spent eight years there, But now I'm a San Antonio spur and let's kind of keep it pushing from there.
Absolutely, all right, So let's shift our focus now to it's not always sunny in Dallas. With everything now that is happened at the Dallas Mavericks, you could not have scripted a more disastrous turn of events. And look, I can understand why people are very much adamant about, you know, Nico Harrison should be on the chopping block. You know, he's he's got to be ready to go, right. I
get that part of it a little bit. I kind of don't get that part of it in the sense that if you are an executive and you have a player like Luka Donkic, and I understand the idea is, no matter what you do, you cannot let that guy go or whatever the case may be. I've been more on the side of saying, what do you expect this guy to do?
Right?
Obviously, Luka Doncic is in a position where he's probably going to command a far greater demand that the Dallas Mavericks are not going to be able to hold or handle. Right, this is not something where you can franchise tag a player like in the NFL out with someone like a Luka Donkic, and if he's doing things or exhibiting things that is really counterintuitive to the longevity of that franchise's viability.
What do you expect him to do? And I just find it interesting that, like now, especially the comments that are being made by Klay Thompson's dad, Michael Thompson out in LA And I'm not saying this to disrespect him, because obviously he's protecting his son and he's protecting his son's interest in what he was trying to do when he signed on to be with the Dallas Mavericks. But I think it all lends itself into the chaos that has occurred with this season. But I think everyone's focus
has been more about the trade. This to me goes a little bit even further before that that obviously has not surfaced in the kind of way that we would have thought. It's so easily like we see it as it is. It's now all just happened at one one time, and it has just completely spun itself out of control. I was just curious about what you thought Michael comments.
Michael Thompson's comments were, you know about saying Clay's been you know, Clay is in purgatory, you know, with what's happened now with the Dallas Mavericks, with this sediment by people saying that, you know, the Mavericks really should just tank the rest of this year, this that and the third and everything going on with the hatred, the vitriol that has been shifted to the way of Nico Harrison and him being on the chopping block.
I think Michael Thompson's comments are in defense of his son.
Right.
He'd left the situation, a very storied situation in Golden State to come to Dallas where he could hopefully have a new beginning with what he thought was going to be a championship run the finals last year. So it's not impossible to think that he could have been a nice fit and should have been a nice fit, but it just went left immediately. You know, Luca wasn't wasn't really healthy for the beginning part of the year and missed so many games, and then you know, the block, blockbuster,
monumental historical trade happens. Since Luca to La, Kyrie goes down it, he goes down, Godford goes down watching it. Like if you turned your two k sliders up to one hundred, this probably still wouldn't happen. In the same fashion. Nico Harrison has had an unprecedented run, unprecedented run of bad luck, you know, with injuries in this organization, following what was a pretty by most people's account, poorous trade and where he at least should have extracted more and more and more.
Actually that you don't need to yeah to that part you're show. That's where I wanted and I appreciate you going there. If you want to knock him because he did not get more from the trade, I get that, you know, and you can, and you can, you can, you know, chop him down as much as you want to on that. But I still am and maybe I'm just the only person who's dying on this, on on this hill about this, I don't know what you expect
any organization to do any gm to do. When it comes to having the kind of player that apparently Luka Dancic has been, it seems like, you know, he was running that ship or that assign, like they allowed a lot more than I think we're giving credit to him. Maybe because he's just such a great player, we all let it slide. My whole thing is, how are you gonna not Miko Harrison for that? Like, what do you expect him and that organization to do. They're not the Lakers,
they're not the Celtics. Dam they're not even the New York Knicks. They're not one of your original teams. And you've got a player who's arguably going to command much more than what their market can actually harness or be able to take in.
Well, I mean, I think that's debatable, right, you know, because it's easy for I think Luca supporters and you know, people putting stuff out about Luca from his camps like, hey, he was never going to leave Dallas, he would have stayed there, so forth and so forth. And then you take a franchise like you know, the Cowboys are in that place as well too, in that state, and hey, like they're a big name organization. So the MAVs again, the new owners, whether or not they want to move
the team or whatever the case to be. I'm not really buying any of that. It's just I think they would have I don't think I know they could find the money, they could make it work, but if they didn't want a histor wagon there. But I don't want to relitigate all that because I think you're talking about the Nico stuff now. It's hey, that was one thing and we are having we're forced, if you will, to kind of put it all into one kind of one situation.
And because Luke who traded, that's why Kyrie got hurt, That's why eighty Like, that's these are not things that are related, right, They'd happened in the same season, but one did not cause the other. And that's where I think at this point it's a little unfair to Nico. But at the end of the day, he started what was like this absolute crap storm of you know, kind of vitriol surrounding the MAVs organization. Then they have a thing where they're going to raise ticket prices as well too.
So there's been missteps every every whish way, but injuries is not Nico Harrison's fault. However, the MAVs are in a rough, rough situation here now and ironically, and I know again it's funny because I'm not I'm not the tank king here at all. But I think at this stage, from a public perception standpoint, losing games now would make sense.
And again I'm not telling them to go do that, but if they could somehow fumble their way into a top five draft pick as they fall out, that could salvage some of the just discourse that has happened here within the last month and a half, like that, to me could be something that at least MAVs fans could hope on. It was like, all right, well we went through all this crap, but at least we have a chance that you know, Ace Bailey or Cooper Flag or
something like that. And I'll see if Jason Kidd and company have the chops in essence to do that, because I don't think that this is not where the maps expected to be. We all know that. But life comes at you fast, and now what are you gonna do with the information that you have?
Look, I hear where you're coming from, shaw I me, you know me and I'm just I just don't buy into that crap. I think just the idea of just going out there and losing, I think, is it not to to go and lose. But let's just say, if they win any more games, we're saying that it's not going to help them. And where I beg to differ is that is why you have fifteen men on a roster. Okay, I don't know how you expect to even only win
with just the five or six guys you've got. You clearly have seen that if you don't have a complete basketball team, you're not winning, point blank period. You ask the Dallas Mavericks, ask the Denver Nuggets, right, And if you're lucky and you keep the guys that got you to where you weren't expected to get to the year previously,
you should be actually better. And then with some of the guys that you draft or you bring in through the G League, wherever you're getting your players, they should be inspired to go out there and play above their minds in order to put you in a better position or a better spot. I said all of that to
say this Shaw. While I appreciate the greatest of intentions of what Michael Thompson said, I also feel like it's a slap in the face to all of those other players out there that are going through what apparently he's protecting hisself. I'm not and I'm not dissing Michael t. What I'm saying is sometimes some things how they're said and the way that they're being said, while they're only great, like they're good for their intentions for what that's supposed
to say, it also could do damage. Because I can just make the same equal argument, nothing about Klay Thompson's season this year has benefited neither him nor the Dallas Mavericks, right like, if not, if anything, he is so dependent on those other two guys that make him look great that why didn't you just basically for the lesser money, stay with the with the with the Golden State Warriors,
Right Like. I'm just saying that sometimes the way that you comment those things can actually prove to be an indirect level of disrespect. And you look at guys like Naji Marshall right now and Williams and those guys who are going through it just like Clay and in many regards are outperforming what we're getting from Klay Thompson. So that's the reason why I'm just like, damn, you know, if I'm Jason Kidd and I gotta put guys out there that I know is gonna go out there and competing.
I'm not saying Clay isn't competing, but he clearly is going to be at it. He's gonna put us at a disadvantage leaving him out there and he can't defend anyone. You know, there's no matchup that's really making him favorable and stuff. I'm just like, man, this this, it would just go all wrong. I just found it interesting that I get why Michael Thompson was doing what he's doing, but I also felt like, damn man, Guys like Marshall, who is not even getting minutes at the beginning of
the season. Now they have to depend on him, and he's going out there and he's actually putting up good numbers. He's actually a great contributor. Like I would hate to see that those guys are working their ass off just for the idea that they should really be losing. They they're not good, they're not good enough team. But they got to get those guys to perform.
It might it might happen regardless right, So I think you know what you're saying where it can marry. What I'm saying is like, it doesn't mean that they stop developing the guys that they have, right. I don't think these guys are good enough to compete for a playoff you know spot, really, I mean, we're not a playoff spot.
But again, and if they were to stink in based on what they've already done the season, and then I know they're just gonna get Bunce in the first round anyway, So is it worth that that level of pressure, that level of exposure versus, hey, you know, these last fifteen games, we really get an extended run on them, then they
get into the playoffs and lose anyway. I think you can debate the merits of that, but I think either way they're going to be in a development phase for whatever whoever is available to play.
Would I would say Shaw to that point of what you're saying is if your intended you're trying to rush these guys back from their injuries. You're trying to rush Daniel Gafford and PJ. Washington and Kyrie Irving, you know, in these guys back from their injuries, like Kyrie obviously not because of this a torn acl but I'm saying you're trying to rush these guys because you need them for the playoffs. No, like if these guys have had a have had a storied past of injuries that have
piled up on them and stuff like that. No, I'm not advocating that you rush these guys back in there for the sake of them getting bounced. But I do think though that the guys that you have out there, This is on Jason Kidd to get as much as you can out of these guys, because guess what, unless they're on one year deals, they're gonna be on your roster. You're gonna have to figure out a way to get
them to help contribute somehow, some way. And by doing it in the midst of telling people, oh, you know, they you know, I'm not saying you but they should go out there and they should basically be tanking and losing and stuff like that, I just think it's counterintuitive because it's basically saying, no matter after your first five guys, or if your first six guys, everybody else can just
be replaceable. And again, name me where in the last five, six, seven years that has constituted a team who's fresh off of getting to the NBA Finals has been able to repeat that same task without having the bulk majority of your roster from the previous year a part of that roster for the current year in order for you to make that actual run.
I mean, I get it, right, I do, And so Dallas has some decisions to make here in the short term. I ultimately think I'm gonna stand on I said, it may not really matter. I agree with Michael Thompson's statement, is like they're just not gonna be good enough with whoever is there. I mean, they signed Moses Brown and then he promptly got hurt, so it.
Was just like cursed.
It is not even cursed, it's just it's it's a wild situation. So I think even guys who are both you know, long term fits and short term ones, uh, they'll they'll take looks at them and see whether what they'll be able to do. But I don't think this is going to be a competitive basketball team where it's really going to matter in terms of the playoffs, and they may uh intentionally or unintentionally end up tanking through the remainer part of the season.
It's gonna hurt when we have to put the MAVs on the slab Broy.
They're coming up for sure, absolutely all right.
So finally the Knicks nicked up. Jalen Brunson suffers an ankle sprain, so he's out for a few weeks. If you're the New York Knicks, right, how do you approach where you need to be in order for when Jalen Brunson is ready to return or set to return, that you're going to be able to be competitive enough for the runs that you're gonna make.
Well, the real answer is it is not going to happen because Tims is just gonna all right, Well, I have to play one and more guy now too, But really those minutes should be split up, and you're diving into more aspects of what that Knixt bench and roster is. You talk about the MAVs being bagged up and being forced to Tibbs is not going to be forced in
anything if he'd go out there and play himself. I guess before he plays some of those guys on his you know, thirteenth or fourteenth man, he's he's just really rooted in kind of that methodology. So share a guy like duce McBride may get some more minutes, Hart will probably do some more play creation he are now and handle the ball on a more regular basis.
In the beginning of the year, Ducee McBride was getting a lot of you know, a lot of press time.
He still gets run.
But is it just me or has it has it just kind of dissipated like I would have figured at some point. Now we have this rhythm of talking about duce McBride being, you know, kind of like the emanual Quickly for that team. And you know, when there were numerous injuries, even when they didn't have Jalen Brunson, Emmanuel Quickly had always stepped in and it had always been a spark plug, had always been, you know, the kind of guy to really kind of help, you know, elevate
the knicks in certain points. I mean, clearly, he's not something that he's shown you he can do it through the course of regular season. But I'm just a little surprised that that Deuce McBride is not He's not he's not elevated himself to a level where it's it's something that we're talking about a little bit more constantly.
It's like I mean, I mean, I would disagree. I mean, get twenty four minutes a night, so I think that's gonna but it's not the.
Minutes though show. I guess it's not so much the minutes. I'm talking about this. I guess the impact, the impact player that he is, it just seems it's muted in other words, like you know, I don't know.
I mean, well, I think there's there's an opportunity now for that to shine because they're cleanly gonna need offense, right, you can have heart handle as much as you want. You can even have campaign and give him some warm minutes God for God bless. But I think where the points are going to come from are guys like Duce McBride, you know, specifically. And it also opens up for an
opportunity for Bridges who's been black for a better phrase. Yeah, he's averaging seventeen a game, but like like you talk about something not feeling impactful, it really does feel like he's been kind of going through the motions out there a lot of times.
Especially empty calories.
Yeah, it's just it hasn't been great, and then the defense hasn't been I think what the Knicks would have expected, so OG I think has been a one hundred times more impactful than the Bridges has been, even though Bridges averages more points per game than OG does. But anyway, McBride will have an opportunity, campaign will lot for an opportunity, and hopefully Jayleen Brunson is back on the court soon.
Ironically before we transition, you know, Brunston's injury happens in the Laker game, in an overtime game that you know, either way one of those teams should have won, probably in regulation, and it doesn't go that way. Just injuries happened when they happen, And then you know Lebron now is also going to be out one to two weeks with the growing injury. You know the Lakers side too, who talked a little bit about in the beginning too.
So hopefully both of these major stars can return to form and return to forms quickly as both their teams need them here heading into the playoffs.
Absolutely your tuned to the baseline. Cali Warrenshaw discussing the hot button topics of the NBA coming up. We got a quick little who you got can't wait for this one man. We're taking our man kill a cade Tyrese Haliburton. Oh, this is a good one. You do not want to miss out here on the baseline, we're back Cali Warrenshaw basedline NBA podcast. Time for a little who you got shout outs to our man dress from Black Sheep. You can get with this, you can get with that, So
we can get with this. Our man Kate Cunningham right, cornerstone player, building black player. Now for the Detroit Pistons, we can get with that. Tyreese Halliburton, Sacramento Kings had probably wish they still had him. Sacramento Kings had him right, moved him over to Indiana. He's essentially a building black player for those Indiana Pacers. I've at it, my man, Shaw, what you got?
Yeah, So the conversation is one of those where you try to pick one but not, you know, just completely dis thegether. It's like, Hey, I'd be happy with either one of these guys, you know, on my roster, you know, being one of my lead guys. I feel like, you know,
and Kate is what he came in. A year after Halliburton, I feel like trying not to be a prisoner of the moment in terms of how great Caids season has been and where he's led this Pistons team from the underbellies, if you will, of the lottery into now what should be almost a secure spot in the Eastern Conference playoffs. But I like Kid's size. I like his ability to score a little bit more with with a little bit more uh versatility offensively, whereas I think Tyrese is not
necessarily limited. But I just like, again the size that Kid has is going to allow him to be able to do some more stuff, including posting up other and smaller guards. Halliburn's going to shoot the three probably had a higher clip traditionally of Loki to shooting it really really really well this season. But I think Halliburn still has the vision on him in terms of, you know, of diming and diming other guys. And I'll even give Tyrese a slight edge in terms of what his leadership
qualities are right now. But I think if you're paying attention this year and even how veteran guys are rallying around Kid and saying, hey, he's our guy, we need to get him the ball, we need to have him lead us, We're starting to see those things really truly developed and what he's doing from, you know, not only a leadership standpoint, but also obviously the satistical standpoint. You know,
those intangibles are starting to skew more towards Kid. So last year, this conversation is probably open and shut for most people because Halliburton was taking the world by storm, and I think Aliburton is becoming a little bit of an afterthought here this year, although the Pacers are you know, right there and thick of things in the Eastern Conference.
But for my money, where I am right now here today, I do like Kate Cunningham slightly better and I'd pick him over Tyrese Halliburton simply because of the size and I think the versatility that could be able to give us offensively with comparable stats, you know, assists wise, he's better rebounded than Tyree is currently at this stage as well too, And I think those leadership qualities as alluded to our are magnifying and coming into full, full, full view.
And like I said, we may get this as a first round matchup, so we would really be amazing to kind of see if these two guys go against each other and who would come out victorious.
Who you got up until I was pretty certain I was going to stick with Tyrese Haliburton. You know, Mishaw, I've been a Tyrese Haliburton fan since the draft. I've said that he was one of the most slept on players that the New York Knicks should have had, and I said that, you know, he would have been a perfect fit for what the New York Knicks needed at
that time frame as the point guard position. I will give you the nod on everything that Kate Cunningham is exhibited so far in his early career that I don't know if whether or not Tyrese Haliburton has had the opportunity to be able to exhibit those same type of qualities at a high level. I think we saw glimpses of it in Sacramento, and then suddenly part of that
narrative shifted when he went to the Indiana Pacers. And then now he's catapulted himself where he has become this explosive score because he is capable of, you know, of exploding. Whereas Kate Cunningham in a way reminds me a little bit like SGA. He subtly gives you forty points. You know what I'm saying he's not. His explosive game doesn't resonate the same way as a person like Tyre's Halliburt.
Maybe it's the demeanor, maybe it's his style of play, but I will say that Kay Cunningham, and I am a person of when it comes to the game of basketball and you're at that level, brutal efficiency to me speaks and resonates loudly. And I think that's why I've become a fan of Sga is because the way he goes about scoring that basketball is with brutal efficiency. Right.
He is true to his ability to shoot the mid range and kill you to death with it, and then he'll sprinkle in shooting the three, but he does not have to be dependent on the three, whereas with Tyree's Halliburton. It's interesting because I thought that a lot of it was more about his size and the effect that he could take advantage of smaller guards. He doesn't really do that.
And his explosion last year was because of his ability to just basically shoot the lights out from the three, Like he was taking ridiculous three point shots, like from anywhere, and it was just like, oh my God, like you know this guy, like he suddenly has become effective three point shooter and stuff, And I feel like now that
part of it has kind of gone away. I think that they have defended him a little bit better, and he had gotten off to a slow start, and so now you're beginning to see a little bit of the chink in the armor, Like, is there a lot of versatility to his game if it's not the way that he dictates, Whereas Kate Cunningham has been an amba bro, Like he mixes and matches and finds his way to get the points necessary while also leading his team to
those victories and stuff. So I'm gonna lean on this in the sense that I see more versatility in a Kay Cunningham. Who knows, if I was talking about a more explosive player right now, I would definitely still give it to Tyrese Haliburton. But I think for the all around game, I lean more to Kate Cunningham because you're seeing all that and you're seeing how all those other things outside of assist to your point, rebounding the basketball,
you know, the defense of fifty to fifty playballs. There are there's certain other things that he's doing from a statistical standpoint that makes his game resonate a lot more than what I'm seeing from Tyreese Halliburton. And I'm not saying that to say that Tyreese is not capable. I'm saying that, like, clearly, what he's doing in Indiana has afforded him the ability to not deal with the level of consistency that I think is needed for them to
be as good as they were supposed to be. And you can clearly see that that part is because there's still weaknesses to Tyressee's game that we still need to see evolve as he continues to become that lead guard for the Indiana Pacers.
Yeah, I think where Tyree still now, I don't think I know where Tyree still has kid is instill the overall decision making. They have slightly similar, well not quietly slightly similar usages, Like Caid has more usage than then Tyree does because he's just asked you more. He truly is like the offensive hub for the Pistons in the way that Halliburton is just not burdened with I think at this time because he yat comes a little bit
well established and so forth and so forth. So Kate averaging like four and a half turnovers is pretty absurd, right, like, that's that's that's that can't stay. And that's why I said earlier, I think Halliburton has the decision making and you know, ahead of him right now. But that's not to say that won't change and can't change and won't
change here in the upcoming season. So again, without being in prison of the moment, Kate is having a more impactful season even statistically speaking turnovers aside than than Tyre says. But the huge Gott premise is really like what no, who would you who would you rather have? Like moving forward? And that's why I think because of Kate's versatility offensively and then you could you would at least think that he could apply some of that because he is trying
defensively under JB. Bickerstaff here now as well too, that that can be something where you know, he could really be a perennial All Star and an All NBA guy. And Halliburton is going to be right there, you know, nudging alongside and for some of those things. But I'm more skeptical about Halliburton's long term prospects as a defender and his long term prospects, you know, to be able
to really really score at different levels. He's got the three, he can shoot the floor, he can obviously get in, get in and drive and get passed by some guys, and maybe some of the hurricue jerkiness and maybe some of the awkwardness of even the release, you know, the aesthetics of Halliburton's game, Maybe that detracts for for me some But that's not a real that's not a real situation, right,
Like that's just a preference, right. But I think Halliburton is still very much on track to be right there behind Kate. But I would just take Kde long term because of all the reasons I lied, especially with the size and the Bruges toly Offene.
One thing that I will say, shaw and again I lean to this because when I look at Tyre's Halliburton, he really should have an advantage over other guards because of his length and size. But he does not play
below the rim. He doesn't, you know. Now, maybe that's just because of scheme, maybe that's because of the fact that he has Pascal Siakam, But I think that lends to the point that I was making earlier about his struggles this year has been masked by the explosiveness of Pascal Siakam and his offensive presence, It's kind of given tyre. He's Halliburton a little bit of cover. Had we seen the same numbers replicated from what he was doing last year now, we still would not be taught. We would
not be eye highlighting. Where if he was struggling as he's been struggling shooting the basketball beyond the arc and everything like that, somebody would be like, get your ass down in the block and start taking advantage of some of these smaller guards. He just refuses to do that. And I never worry about that With a guy like Kay Cunningham. His game was built like that when he
came out of is It Oklahoma State. I believe that he had that game even when he was in college, and so like that to me shows me when he doesn't have his jumper, you know, working for him, he'll go down there and he'll find advantages in other ways.
To your point, Halliburton's headiness as a guard and his ability to facilitate and get guys like Siakam off, Turner off, Nate ne Smith off, you know them hard and those guys off, That to me is what resonates with me in the type of you know, leadership qualities that Tyrese Haliburton can exhibit, but the all around package, to your point, Shaw, I lean a little bit more because it's not like Kid doesn't have that. He just doesn't have those kind of players on his roster, so he has to come.
I mean, I think you can make I mean, the argument could be made, right because if I was going back to what I was just saying in terms of usage, you know, it's it's it's more significant than I was even going off of my brain. Right, So Caid's usage is like thirty percent, thirty two percent, Haliburn's only at
twenty one and a half. Right, So if you flip flop those right, Halliburton does is he a twenty five point per game guy probably, you know with that level of usage, And he's probably a thirteen or fourteen as this guy you know with that same some level usage. Their teams are set up differently currently. But I still still still think that I would I would choose Kid over Tyree's long term. And again that's not to downgrade Tyres in any capacity, because I think he's been a
he's a great player and has a great future. But yeah, you know, I think we and we've seen tyres On on the big stage and he's done. He's done some things right, you know, even from last year in the NBA Cup and then getting all the way to the Eastern Conference finals last year and given the Celtics all they could handle. Yes, it was the sweep, but it was a competitive one, you know, to say the least. And then he went out in that series. But what he did in the Knicks in the garden, you know,
to close out that. Like so I'm anxious to see where Kate And maybe it's a more fair conversation after we see Kate in the playoffs to kind of figure out what that would look like. And so maybe it's premature, but I think for where we are right now, I'm pretty comfortable in my selection of kid cutting him.
All right, Well, there you go. It's a it's a sweep, you know what I'm saying, killer Kay being taken, But it's it's a sweep. But it's very narrow, very very narrow. I don't think I don't think we'd be completely disappointed. It's put of like this, if there's a if Kate Cunningham came on ten years later, I think we would be putting Tyreese Halliburton up against a lot of other guys that we'd probably be taking Tyreez Haliburt and more so than we you know, more so than we we
have someone like Kate, you see. But that's why we have you, Shaw, because you got to make those tough decisions to put those guys in that box for us, for us to make that selection.
My friend, listen, I'll just I'll triple quadruple down on this. If we can get those two teams to somehow meet the first offs, that would be that would be the thing right where we could really see those two great guards going up against each other. So it's a very real possibility.
Now.
Uh, they are separated I think by a half game or so between four, five and six. So right now today it's Bucks versus Pacers. But again that is basically a half game difference. So let's see and morewards a black sheep and you can get a scoop.
Awesome show this week. Shaw. A lot of stuff we covered, man, but man, some good, good, good discussions to be had, good fought a foot of for the ear lobes and stuff like that. Man and you know, this is why we we like this stretch of NB being happening, man, because it's not just what's going on on the court, brother, it's also what's happening off the court as well too.
Absolutely, so kudos to you for taking the lead here to help us get through the latter part of this NBA season in terms of the content that we're going to cover. Been loving you know, the vibe that we've been having, the vibe that we always have too. But you know, you've been do an amazing job, I think as a lead content credit here for the baseline here the last couple of weeks, so I want to give you your flowers in that space. But yes, the NBA continues to give what it gives and we will be
here throughout the course. Special guests coming up for the latter part of the season. I'm sure, new collaborations we do what we do here on the baseline through nineteen Media group. Man, it excited to be here with you and here what our fans have to listen, what our fans listeners have to say. So let us know what you think about you know, the who you got Kate Cunningham versus Harry's Haliburton, thoughts on Jellen Brunson, thoughts on Lebron being out as well, two thoughts on the MVP race.
Joker SGA it's all bubblings and.
Jason Tatum you were bringing fire, my friend. You know what I'm saying.
I do appreciate that. Yeah, yeah, give us thoughts to Are you tired of the JT slander? Or are you and the JT slander? You know, boat like you want to say, no, he deserves all this hate that he's getting it. If you are, you can probably know it pretty much. Man, Listen, at the end of the day, we'd love to have a conversation.
Hey, listen, I'm all for I'm all for having hal Jordan on our podcast. You know what I'm saying. You know what I'm saying, my man, Green Lantern people right about that, loving.
It absolutely Shulman that movie right now, I can't wave.
All right man. Hey, as always, man, thank you for listening in for the baseline, Gollie Warren shall We appreciate you guys, you know we do, and we'll catch up with you next time.