BariNation-PYP-25-0228-EP 239
Jason Smith: [00:00:00] Hi, welcome to BariNation, where we support the bariatric community with humor, humility, and honesty.
April Williams: You've just tuned into a podcast that welcomes you into a community, a resource center, and a safe place that powers your [00:00:15] journey towards personal wellness.
Natalie Tierney: Our goal is you leave us today feeling hopeful, inspired, and ready to live your best bariatric life.
April Williams: Hi, [00:00:30] welcome to the BariNation podcast. Today we're going to talk about a subject that sometimes goes unsaid, addiction. After bariatric surgery, we are joined by an addiction therapist, Sarah Smith, who's also an expert in the [00:00:45] barination community. And today she is going to talk to us, teach us about process addiction, what we need to be on the lookout for why it's a little bit more prevalent after bariatric surgery and what we can do about it.
So, before we [00:01:00] dive into this conversation, Sarah, will you take a moment and introduce yourself to the people that maybe haven't met you before?
Sarah Smith: Sure. So, like April said, my name is Sarah Smith. I'm a licensed alcohol and drug counselor in Oklahoma. I've been in the field for, [00:01:15] um, you know, pretty close to 20 years now.
I am now I'm in Florida and I'm working on getting my LCSW because the states don't play nice with each other. I'm I have been, uh, doing this work for quite some time and, uh, [00:01:30] I'm also a bariatric patient and so when I was going through my journey, I started noticing the people in the support groups that I was attending through my surgical center sounded a lot like my client.
But they were talking about food, and [00:01:45] that led me to doing a lot of research. And then, you know, when you guys launched Berry Nation, I was like, hey, we have to start talking about this inside the community, uh, and it has been actually one of my favorite groups to host, uh, even in [00:02:00] my, you know, outside of my day job, because it really has been an opportunity of bringing people together and giving them the information and the support that they need to get on a recovery journey.
After surgery.
April Williams: Absolutely. And we are the first to say there is [00:02:15] no shame when it comes to struggling with these things. I myself even experienced a moment of struggle when it comes to alcohol. After my bariatric journey, we have quite a few members of Barry nation who are sober or who are [00:02:30] looking to get sober because the numbers can be a little bit staggering and we're going to share some research linked here in the show notes.
But, we're The research is showing that depending on surgery, you have up to a 30 percent increased risk of transfer addiction, process addiction after [00:02:45] bariatric surgery. So if you are experiencing that, you are not alone. There's no shame in it. We are here to, to help you understand what those kind of red flags could be.
And Sarah's going to talk to us about what we can do if we're noticing those things. So let's just get [00:03:00] right to it. Sarah, what is. Process addiction.
Sarah Smith: Sure. Um, well, process addiction is really just another way, uh, uh, to describe what you hear mostly in the community is call it transfer addiction, uh, but it is really when [00:03:15] someone is substituting one addiction.
So for example, they may have been using food in an addictive way prior to surgery. We, you are physically removing your ability to do that when you have bariatric surgery. A lot of people are [00:03:30] unaware that that's how they were using food prior to having bariatric surgery. So they're not prepared for that loss that they're experiencing and they will shift it to another behavior.
So whether that is [00:03:45] excessive alcohol and drug use, excessive shopping, gambling, it can really just be any. Compulsive behavior that is filling that void that you're losing with food. You know, one of the things that is just mind blowing to people is like, it can be working out. [00:04:00] And so when we think about, you know, really getting pushed into the gym and pushing ourselves into the gym post surgery, but when you realize that that's starting to take over things and you're [00:04:15] starting to have a lot of guilt related to not being in the gym when you had a valid reason like an injury, you know, you're working out on top of injuries and things like that.
That's when you, you might be aware that, that it is becoming [00:04:30] more of a process addiction.
April Williams: So when you're talking about these process addictions, it's not necessarily kind of those vices that we're thinking about. It can even be things that are healthy to a point that we take to excess and it becomes unhealthy.
Sarah Smith: Anything that you [00:04:45] begin doing where it becomes compulsive and you're noticing, um, emotions tied to that behavior. So you're going to be experiencing shame and guilt. Uh, either [00:05:00] over the fact that you're, you're doing the behavior or over your inability to do the behavior. So it's going to become very emotionally charged for you.
April Williams: So what are [00:05:15] those things that people can be on the lookout for if they're listening to this and they're going, Oh, I wonder if I'm kind of stepping in the direction of, of this process addiction.
Sarah Smith: Sure. Um, one of the things that you hear a lot is people that were [00:05:30] never really drinkers before surgery. You know, that's kind of, that's a key phrase is, yeah, I was never really a drinker.
To me, that's saying, okay, now you think you are. Um, so, you know, why, how has your consumption changed? What's [00:05:45] going on with your, you know, with your alcohol consumption? Uh, the same thing with, you know, medical marijuana is huge across the country, so it was kind of the same thing. I never really smoked before, or people would say they'd never taken an edible before, [00:06:00] uh, things like that.
And then, it could also be Um, you know, the feeling that I need this thing to manage my emotions. So you have a bad day and you're stopping at the store and, you know, [00:06:15] purchasing something because that new dress or that new top makes you feel really good and that's how you're dealing with. Your stress and if you pause and think about well, how did I deal with the stress before?
That it was probably a [00:06:30] favorite meal a favorite drink stopping at Starbucks Like I remember Starbucks being a huge reward for me Like if I was having a crappy day at work, I was like, oh I deserve this Starbucks And so we're, but we're losing the ability to do a lot of that. [00:06:45] So we're adding other things in there.
And then you're also going to look for escalating negative consequences. So, you know, you might be a person that never charged, I don't know, like items under a hundred dollars. Like you may have had [00:07:00] some rule related to your spending with like, when you were going to put things on credit versus, you know, making yourself save to pay for cash.
A lot of people will say like. My credit cards are for large purchases, and the next thing you know, you're [00:07:15] charging shoes, you're charging a dress, you're charging makeup, and things that, you know, you'd always made yourself, like, wait until you could afford to purchase. Uh, and then it is also going to be tied to that, you know, I deserve it.
[00:07:30] This is going to make me feel good.
April Williams: Jason, Nat, have you guys experienced this along your bariatric journey? Have you seen this escalation of certain behaviors?
Jason Smith: I guess you could say my escalation for purchasing shoes, [00:07:45] but I've always kind of been that way. So I don't know if I can attribute it to that because I don't have to be having a bad day to buy shoes.
So I'm just saying, I'm just throwing it out there. I think mine may be more travel. [00:08:00] I'm so excited, like, I'm just so jazzy, like, to go places now that I never cared to do, like, before, that I will, I will try to find ways to justify traveling to places, even when it would put a strain [00:08:15] on what we're, like, Sarah and I are trying to do.
So she has to reel me back in a lot of times on stuff like that, because I'm like, nope, we can do it, we can press it, like we can just do this and do that, and she'll have to be like, realistically, how, because for a minute, because she likes to travel [00:08:30] too, so for a minute, she may be like, I mean, we probably could, and then she'll have to turn back around and be like, but not like, this is why we can't do that.
So,
April Williams: yeah, but why I think that example is so powerful is right. This, this process addiction, this, this, this [00:08:45] learning to deal with our emotions in new ways is, It's not all related to these negative things. And that's a really great example, right? Because if you're Sarah, you're saying like, it's this escalation of excess and it's this negative consequence.
There can be negative consequences for doing good, fun [00:09:00] things. It's just okay. Now what about you?
Natalie Tierney: Definitely, I would say, I mean, I've, uh, partaken in, uh, like, marijuana and things like that prior to [00:09:15] surgery, um, but I would say for sure I've used it more for sleep. I would say, like, oh, to wind down, I need, I need this, I need it, and when I don't have it, Um, I feel stressed.
I feel like [00:09:30] my routine is off. Those types of things. Um, and I, I've since gotten a lot better with that. Um, and, and retrained nicely, but there was definitely a period of time post surgery where [00:09:45] I was like. More reliant on that because I couldn't, um, because I couldn't be in the way that I did before, for sure.
April Williams: I think all four of us on the screen have experienced this escalation in certain behaviors. [00:10:00] And I mean, truly, thank goodness we are all, we're closely connected to one another, but we're very closely connected in Berry Nation. And we've been able to go to those safe places and go, um, I've been noticing this.
And we're not met with shame and guilt. We're met with. [00:10:15] Curiosity and with help and with the safe place to kind of talk it through. So Sarah, what, what do you recommend people do if they're thinking, Oh, I might be traveling in this direction. What, what would be the next steps?
Sarah Smith: You can really start there.
So [00:10:30] anywhere, there's multiple places to start, right? You could just talk to your surgeon about it. I remember one of my, you know, Last follow ups with my surgeon, you know, it was kind of like, how are things going with you? And I said, you know, I still have a little bit disordered eating [00:10:45] happening. And he laughed at me, I think, just because I was that, you know, transparent about it.
But, you know, starting at your surgeon's office, if you're familiar with a therapist in your area, of course, you could, you know, Seek out a therapist and start therapy to have [00:11:00] the conversation. I would try to find somebody that is familiar with addiction, uh, because they are going to be looking for things that are a little bit different than a therapist that really specializes in mental health.
There's some things around like isolation, hiding [00:11:15] habits that would be a warning sign for us. And then, uh, you know, definitely within our Berry Nation community, you know, I mentioned in the beginning, I do a support group for people that are experiencing transfer addiction every Monday at, uh, [00:11:30] let's see, 7 o'clock Eastern, 6 o'clock Central, 5 o'clock Mountain, 4 o'clock Pacific Standard Time.
So, can't believe I figured that out, but.
April Williams: And the wonderful thing about right, exploring [00:11:45] what you're maybe going through in very nation is our support groups are confidential. So they're never recorded what shared in those groups remains in those groups. And we strive to ensure member safety. At all levels, so if you think [00:12:00] that this might be something that you are struggling with, and you don't know where to turn, we invite you to join us in very nation and a vast majority of all of the supports that we offer in our community are.
Sober opportunities, so you're not [00:12:15] going to see people engaging in any type of drinking activities drug. Like, no, we, we want to make sure that everybody feels welcome because we know the struggle can really be real. And Sarah, you have even worked on some on demand educational content, right? That our [00:12:30] members can tap and tap into anytime they need or want it.
Sarah Smith: Yeah,
absolutely. It's really just a basic educational information where you can get a little bit more detail about the things we've talked about today. Some more, you know, definitions, things [00:12:45] like that to really help you, you know, kind of weigh what's going on with yourself and determine if, you know, you do need to seek help.
April Williams: I think that's the most important part, right? When you're experiencing something new and you're really worried because you know that it feels so [00:13:00] different for you and you just don't know where to turn. You want to get that basic understanding of what is this is, could this be transfer addiction? Could this be process addiction?
And that on demand content that lives in very nation is designed for exactly that. It is a way for you to toe dip [00:13:15] into. Could this be and what is it so that you can make the best informed decision for yourself? So, if you are struggling with that, we invite you to join us in the community. It is there for you to get that support that you need.
[00:13:30] Sarah, what's the one thing you're hoping people are leaving this conversation with today?
Sarah Smith: I really hope that they leave understanding that, you know, this early intervention is key. Like, you don't want to wait until this becomes a problem and, uh, you know, like getting [00:13:45] help is, is, like help is available and recovery is possible and we are definitely here for you in Berry Nation.
April Williams: Sarah, thank you so much for joining us today, and thank you for sharing your expertise in this. I mean, we know [00:14:00] how challenging it is, and we're just so thankful that not only do you offer, right, your help and support from the patient perspective, but from that professional perspective. It's just amazing.
Thank you. Thank you.[00:14:15]
That wraps up another empowering episode of the BariNation podcast. If you enjoyed today's episode, keep the conversation going by joining the BariNation membership community, where you can attend live support events, access. On demand [00:14:30] resources and find a caring community.
Natalie Tierney: Join us at barination.mn.co. If you found this podcast valuable, help us produce it by becoming a 5 monthly supporter at barinationpodcast.com.
Jason Smith: And just remember at the [00:14:45] end of the day, you've got this, we've got you, and we'll see you next time. Bye everybody.