Building Trust With People That Have Never Heard Of You, With Frannie Wilson

She is the co-founder and chief visionary officer of Ampersand Studios , a full-service branding agency and photography studio based in Boise , idaho , serving small businesses in the Treasure Valley and beyond Folks . She has been running business since 2009 .

That would be 15 years back in the past up through now , and has had many different business experiences Quite a few of which we talked in that previous episode , where you can get to know her and see how she built this one , but in this episode , frannie's going to share misconceptions and the biggest mistakes that she has seen when it comes to branding a company

or personal brand , because she's branded over 300 and over 1,000 have worked with her in her online programs . So , frannie , welcome back . Aw , thanks Kwejo Good to be here with you , still Still right , that's the thing We've been having the greatest of conversations and it is now going on 45 minutes since we finished recording the previous episode .

And Seth Godin has a quote that we absolutely love and I always fall back on to answer this question , and it is every interaction , in any form , is branding .

And I just love that because from the very first time somebody hears about you , whether it's social media , whether it's an ad or being referred to by a friend , or trusting somebody else that they trust , whether it's , you know , stumbling upon work that you did for somebody else or whatever that is that is the very first touch point that you have with them .

And then does that line up ? Is it aligned with the next interaction ? and the next interaction and the next interaction , and do they all fit together in a cohesive little nice package with a bow ?

Like if we have this first impression and then somebody decides to make a purchase and then they show up and they get a service or a product that doesn't match what that expectation was that they were given at the beginning , then there's an incongruency with the brand happening somewhere in that space . What's the ?

I mean , I've experienced things with companies where they think they're over delivering but I'm like , yeah , no , that's actually not what I wanted , right , so we have to deliver what the customer wants , what they think they're getting , and then follow through on that all the way through to the very end and then nurture it enough to where they become a loyalist .

So the customer journey is from the very first time they found out about you all the way through becoming a loyalist and then , hopefully , it being on repeat so that they come back over and over again and tell their friends .

They need to come out like with a punch . You know , they need to make a splash , they need to get some attention , so they want a new brand to release this whole thing . So a lot of times it's a rebrand or they're like okay , this isn't working and kind of .

What I attribute that to is let's say , you have a new business , a small business , like a solopreneur or somebody kind of bootstrapping everything , doing it themselves . I'm not talking about like a startup with like all this funding and stuff like that .

Right , we're talking about your , your mom pop like , or somebody doing a side hustle or somebody like quitting , leaving their nine to five job to start this thing and like everything's riding on it .

So you're kind of doing it yourself and hiring out a few little things here and there , but we have all these tools at our fingertips that promise it's so easy that you can just go in Canva and make this yourself . The barrier of entry is so low . There's all these templates everywhere . There's like Squarespace and all these like websites . You can just .

All of them are giving this promise of have your website up and going in an hour .

They're like , they're like that looks good , love it , let's just fill out the , the copy and publish it , and then they go to Canva , they create some graphics , maybe they hire somebody on Fiverr . You're totally just we call it flavor of the week like jumping on design trends based on what's trending right now and what you're attracted to , and it can work .

You can get your business up and print some whatever packaging really quick and everything can just be so fast . The turnaround time is just crazy . So then you end up with this sort of piecemeal together brand that works at the beginning , because what happens is a lot of times these businesses will launch and they'll have a lot of excitement around the launch .

Their friends and family are sharing it . You've got your network , your people that are on your inner circle , and they're going to support you at the beginning and they're going to help lift that up and share it with their friends and maybe buy some stuff from you or join your program or whatever .

And then , after like a little bit kind of start , so you get excited , you get this dopamine hit . You're like , yes , like I remember our grand opening for our store .

When we first opened our retail store six , seven years , whatever how many years ago it was and there was a line out the building down the street , literally the grand opening day , we did more sales than we ever did in one day , ever again .

It's it's figuring out a way to build trust with people who have never heard of you .

And the only way to do that is by being really clear with your message , by being really consistent with your visuals so that it can be memorable , recognizable , and they have to have , like you know , something like between 20 and 30 interactions and hits by your brand before they actually will recognize it and take action to go check it out .

I mean , it used to be seven , they used to say seven . Now it's like who knows if we can even measure that and if you are putting out content all the time and running ads and doing all these things and it all looks different .

It's almost like when we're driving around town and we see all these different cars driving by , but if you see that one bright yellow Range Rover in your town and then you're going to see it all the time and you're like okay , I see that same car . That's got to be the same person . How many times am I seeing the same car ?

That's gotta be the same person . You know how many times am I seeing the same person every day and not realizing it because there's nothing remarkable about it and there's nothing memorable about it . So that is really , yeah , in a nutshell , what a brand can do for you , and it's not a slap it up in five minutes process .

It has to be thoughtful , has to be really intentional , and then you have to stick with it and follow through .

So getting people to commit to something that maybe doesn't feel so trendy to them in the moment that they want to do because they're so excited about that thing that they are into like , really like vibing with a certain color right now or something .

Let's think about why we're choosing that color and then is it going to still , is it going to live up to the test of time ? You know , it doesn't mean that you can never add some more colors or change things up a little bit , but we don't want to do it just because we're like attracted to something at the moment .

So I maybe this is a biased thing , because I have a branding agency and a photography studio business , but I believe that the fastest way to elevate your brand and build trust with people is by replacing stock photography with photos and video of you and your actual face , voice , people , processes , products , all of that proprietary content , not stock photos .

And not only can you control the visual aesthetics of it , like whether it's moody or bright and airy , or whatever kind of editing you're going for , it's you , you know . So , like , how could that not build trust with people ? And I think people can really suss out stock photography , you know , and I think there's a time and place for it , yeah .

I mean , yeah , like the guy with the , the Britney Spears microphone like customer service like . No , yeah , I don't like the computer and I think there's a time and place for stock photography , like maybe in your slide decks for a keynote presentation , and you need a picture of something that , yeah , but on your website to showcase your products and services and

on your social media .

I really feel like everybody could benefit from a really well-executed brand photo shoot where they have a library of assets and obviously digital assets that they can have in their back pocket all their logos in all the different colorways , separated out , different color schemes , like in a Canva brand kit , so that you have parameters and rules to kind of like guide

what you're doing , so that you aren't starting with a blank canvas just like oh , I'm going random template today okay , hold on .

So we always separate our teachings into and we do a service called brandstorming , which is brainstorming for your brand . Obviously it's like a full day session and we dive deep into all of these things and really the voice part of it , the brand messaging . It has to happen first and then you can create the visuals , but anyway .

Everybody's like so obsessed with this , like elevator pitch that is , I help and then fill in the blanks , so that love it . That's step one . Step two that's something I can explain to my mom and anybody . That is super valuable and we need to be able to explain it that way .

But then our messaging is taking that statement and thinking about how our ideal wants to hear that message . So when we I like a good example is like Amazon . So I could give you an explanation of like what Amazon is .

It's an online marketplace where there's lots of different sellers that come together to one website and they have really , you know , two day shipping .

If you sign up for prime blah , I could explain what amazon is right yeah well , the messaging of amazon is very clear and specific for the type of person who wants to shop on amazon , which is somebody who wants something really fast and they don't necessarily care about quality .

We maybe a little , but we're gonna look at the reviews , we're gonna pick something , but I'm not going for this . Like artisan custom , really well thought through product Right , it's okay . So Amazon's messaging is all about convenience , speed , variety . We're never going to hear Amazon putting out messaging talking about quality .

We're never going to hear them talking about luxury or any kind of like concierge , customer service or help or anything like that . Right , they're just going to hammer in quick variety . That's pretty much it . Right , what are those other ? Like , all of their advertising is going to be about that . So , on the other hand , like maybe we have Apple .

Apple's going to talk about innovation . They're going to talk about the form and function of their products and everything being the latest and greatest . They're never going to sell you about price . They're never going to talk about price . Right , they're not playing that game , you're never going to see an ad from Apple .

That's like talking about a sale or a promotion . So that's because the customer who's purchasing Apple isn't necessarily out there looking for deals . The person shopping for Amazon is looking for deals , so I don't know is that am I going off too far Like so I mean what I'm hearing .

So , like we have done brainstorming sessions with many different restaurants and you could describe a restaurant the same way like five restaurants , like it's a place where you go and sit down and order and they sell Italian food or they sell Mexican food or like whatever .

But there's a different reason why you go to every restaurant and you're speaking to a different person . So if that person is a college student and they want a place to come in , chill and like play cornhole and watch the sports games or whatever , our messaging is going to be directed at those motivations .

So it's about tapping into what yeah , like what motivates them to go to a place and how their best friend would explain it to them .

Like we've been all this and putting all this money and energy into developing this menu and bringing in the right wines and all this stuff and it's like okay , whoa , we've got a lot of different people that you're talking to here and so when we're not clear about who that is and what they care about it , it just it's really hard to see that when you're the

business owner , you've kind of accumulated all these things and what , like I said , like the people have so much stimuli , like stimuli all day that we're like you're talking about all these different things all the time . They can't pinpoint that you're the one that talks about this over and over and over and over again . So , yeah , it's powerful .

People have these aha moments in our brainstorming sessions and I'm like I just repeated back to you what you just told me about your restaurant , but I'm hearing it with fresh eyes and going oh , oh .

So I , what I'm hearing you say is people come here for like a chill , fun , vibe place to play corn hole and hang out with their friends , the watering hole for the local college kids , like they don't really care about , like the Gruyere cheese on the you know like that's a bonus . They like that .

You can highlight that sometimes , but your messaging that's repeated over and , over and over again . That one thing that you always come back to needs to be the motivator that they're looking for . And when we talk about ideal customer .

I have a different definition of that as well , in that we like to invite people to think about their ideal customer as the person who will most benefit from your product and service , because it kind of just like reframes it to be really thinking about how we can serve the customer the best , and that will be the person who obviously becomes the most loyal and

who loves what we give them and who we can help the best , and that is the most fulfilling and also going to create the most success in them referring you to other people like them . So it's really a win-win when we think about it that way and I think it kind of helps inform the way that we speak to those people .

So we have an or a photo shoot and video like all of it we can do any and all so on . That discovery call . That's where we really just ask them questions and we try to find out what's going on in their business and then what the problems are that they're having , and then we will suggest a course of action .

Basically , okay , it sounds like you definitely know that you want a new visual identity , but do you already understand who your customer is ? Do you understand what your messaging is ? And if not , then we recommend a brainstorming session . And a brainstorming session is called that because it's brainstorming .

Like we're not actually making anything in brainstorming , we're just getting a lot of ideas out . It's a full whiteboard , is filled up Lots of post-it notes . We put it all together into something that is a like they walk away with a deliverable from that , but it's not like here's your brand . It's just a brainstorming session .

Just the misconception is that your brand is just the visual representation . So if I took the visual branding of Coca-Cola and put it on Lexus , something would like , something would feel wrong .

It's one or the other they're like well , everybody else in my industry is doing this , so I should do that . Or everybody else in my industry it's one or the other they're like well , everybody else in my industry is doing this , so I should do that . Or everybody else in my industry is doing this , so I should do something completely opposite .

And both are problematic because why depend like it kind of ? I need like an example of like , a type of like a let's see , I don't know like a men's deodorant company , okay , why are you talking about deodorant ? So we've got our classic Old Spice and then we've got all these other ones that are very masculine looking , I imagine like the Dove men's line .

They're like dark , masculine colors . I imagine , like the Dove men's line , they're like dark masculine colors and these kind of or maybe they're earthy , but they're like usually black , gray blues , greens .

So if you wanted to go against the green and launch a hot pink men's deodorant , men would probably see that and be like I don't think that that is trying to target me . I don't think that I is trying to target me .

So if I see an ad for like something from like Cabela's that's for outdoorsy men in camo , I'm immediately going to be like keep scrolling . That's like not something .

So a lot of times you might have this brand that kind of looks like it's for me , but it says something maybe a little bit more shocking .

You know , like these brands like the , a lot of like the cool men's brands that are doing like being kind of edgier with their , with their messaging , like I don't , I can't think of all the birdies for dogs or I don't think I know any either .

So , oh , that's a little different than what I'm used to , but not so much that I'm disqualifying myself from the audience . So you got to find that sweet spot .

Some of the larger businesses that I work with , though , they do actually have a voice brand guide , and they even go as far to say , like you know , on this social media platform , like this is how we show up , and on this social media platform , this is how we show up and that's the kind of thing that you put together for people .

We're like you don't really need this , this isn't going to suit your business , so we just will delete those pages from the , from the brand guide . But that template that we sell is actually a tool that we created for our clients originally , so , and we have it for ourselves as well , that we send out to anybody creating on our behalf .

So , like it'll have , but ours even has goes as far to say like this is what we , how we dress for shoots on client facing days , non-client facing days .

So there , there's a fine line there and there is a way to define that . So , but that is a little bit deeper , like you don't have to necessarily have all that behind the scenes stuff documented unless you have a bigger team .

If you're a personal brand , your brand is you , then your own voice and the way that you talk is something you should start paying attention to . You should listen to the way that you apologize to people when you mess up .

Would you you say , would you , would you go to your friend , like if you stood them up for lunch , and say , like , we apologize for the convenience ? Your friendship is of the utmost importance to us .

And then I'll kind of like put on my brand goggles and be like okay , how would I really say this , how would ampersand say this ? And kind of like go back through , comb back through it again and put some personality in there .

What would it be ? Is it Converse , is it a high heels ? Like that tells me a lot about your brand .

And , as kind of trivial as that sounds , if I'm sitting in a brand storming session and I I haven't actually ever asked somebody like that before , but I might try it now Okay , if your brand were a pair of shoes I haven't actually ever asked somebody like that before , but I might try it now Okay , if your brand were a pair of shoes , what would it be ?

And if they say , like you know , prada stilettos , I instantly have a new association created for that brand . If they say barefoot , I have a very different brand in mind and a different audience

. So our quiz asks questions like that and then also some word questions . There's some picture ones and some word ones and you kind of like get to find out what that personality is like how professional , how diet , like dialed in does your verbiage need to be ?

Obviously , if you are working in some kind of industry where we work with a lot of businesses that have compliance issues , like they can't be too fun .

They have a lot of compliance where they have to be really careful what they say like financial institutions or insurance , like anything like that where there's like a governing body over them making sure that everything they say is aligned with the industry , then it's a little trickier .

So this can help figure out where you can infuse some personality , where you can't , and then it spits out a little PDF guide , depending on the personality that you got , to give you some tips on how to lean in and how to avoid the pitfalls that some of those personalities can fall into .

Like the energy that you put out through whatever you're putting out for your business can be felt , and so often people want it to be all buttoned up and so they make it kind of stuffier and they're not having fun , and so nobody else's either , and that just doesn't attract people .

So I think , if you're having fun with it and you aren't making everything so precious like I know I just went through a lot of things that I'm like this needs to be , like a way , more intentional . Intentional , yes , but like precious , no . Like put it out there , test things and have fun with it .

That's going to attract the people to you , especially if you're a personal brand . So that that's my biggest thing .

And you know and my mom is a real estate agent and I work with a lot of real estate agents she has a personal brand that is so well known because she's been an agent in Boise for like 30 something years and she's known as being this like kind of pit bull , like nothing gets past her .

She's super thorough , she can be a little cutthroat , she's , she's like this hard ass . But she's this like sweet , little cute , blonde , doris Day looking woman and that's what she thinks that she needs to be , and she wants to be very sweet and professional in the verbiage , in the wording and the all of that stuff .

So then I'm like just be yourself , like have fun with it , like that is actually going to attract the people that you know , and so . But in her day of building her clientele , she didn't have to use social media to do that .

So so she's fine , she's got a clientele built up , but I think that's what I see a lot is , you know , trying to kind of put on a mask or a different , more buttoned up version of ourselves , which makes it less fun .

And then , yeah , our podcast , which you mentioned , Something Businessy podcast , where we're just sharing weekly about anything businessy all the things that we've learned , all the things we've been through , lots of branding content and interviews similar to what we're doing here .

notes below . Check out franny's instagram account . Well , I guess it's ampersand studios instagram account . When I go there it's like I want to be a part of the party . Like you can tell , they know how to have fun and their instagram account is fun and it's engaging and that's why I want to use more of it for ads .