Will Packer on Beyoncé Telling Him No, the Biggest Career Mistakes & What Makes a Star

We'll see how I'm going to run down these movie titles because these are your movies.

Okay, ready, yes, girls.

Trip you're thinking too much. You already think sequel.

Yes, sir, think like a man paid Steve Harvey a lot of money. No Good Deed, Yeah, it just had seven accents in that movie.

I have to I have to give context. We shot that movie. That was one of the hardest movies ive ever made. No Good Deeds. It Elvin to Roger Hinson. It just was coming off a movie where he was a space alien. Would give me Gyerma del Toro and about to go shoot a movie where he was gonna be playing I think Mandela or a South African you know dialect, and so he can. And in my movie, he was supposed to be a Southern convict, right, and so his schedules crazy to write.

Schedule was crazy. It's nights and raining the whole movie.

We had to shoot six day weeks, right, So we literally shot Sunday through Friday every week at night with rain.

We had these rain towers and interests.

Every day would show with a different accent because he was coming from one movie going to another one. He was all over the place and we end up having an eighty R that whole movie.

Sorry, but that's the cond Wow, the whole movie, almost the whole movie that he says, that everything, every line he says. The definition for the is when you.

Go into a studio at the end of a movie post production. Sometimes you look and you're like, that's not what he said. The actors lift, don't line up like. That's eighty rs called additional dill out recording.

And it's really hard and you can usually tell when people do it. And I didn't know you did it.

The whole movie. The photograph ooh la, Keith and Lisa, that's just what comes to.

Mind, straight out of Compton f Gary Gray Born to make it Stop.

The Yard, my first hit, Proud Takers.

Nobody wanted to wear suits, and then later they all thanked me for putting them in suits.

Right along.

Oh ten years to get it made.

They were looking for the right white guy and I had just done things like a man with Kevin Hart, and I put and I sold them on Kevin Hart being the right white guy.

We have only three more.

Yeah, obsessed, obsessed Beyonce got her about last night, Oh underrated, love that movie. Go see if you haven't seen about last Night. It's one of my movies. I'm most proud of it. I think it's underrated, beast. You know what, As we talked about CGI and all that, we had to put Idris's whole body in a computer right because the lion was computer generated, and so we had to do a body scan of him because there were things that we could not do with an actual real actor.

We obviously didn't have a real lion. So as people talk.

About AI like, we've been doing this for a very long time, and I remember because he fought me because he was like, I gotta do this, but I just acted it did the whole movie. I was like, yeah, but there's certain things I need and it takes time. It's like uncomfortable for the actor anyway. So if anybody wants it, I got Yourselfew's whole body in my computer.

Holler at me. I got you. What's the going rate on that?

And finally, who better than you?

Coming movie? Health is a dreaming big will packers in the building.

Ladies and gentlemen, I'm here, I'm here, I'm here, I'm finally here, and I'm never leaving.

You're not leaving because this has been a long time coming. It has and we don't have a lot of time today because Will is on a very tight important schedule because he has movies to make and books to promote.

Books to promote.

And the first time you can ever say that it is my first book ever, I'm an off you are.

You're part of the people. Tired me really because.

Me and and he's a film we go way way to go back and and I remember your book, and I remember that you said it to me early, and I remember us talking about that. I just remember thinking like how incredible it was to like tell your story.

Now mine's not a memoir, but I've been in the game. You know you got stories. I got some story. By the way, I love the way.

You did your quotes in the back, because if I didn't know just I live on another planet. I didn't know your film career, I don't know anything about you, this would make me, just this alone would make me want to write a book. And sometimes we see celebrity comments, but they're like, Okay, it's extraordinary insight to the person's.

Like, you know, that's usually what it says.

No, this is not that I wanted to be honest, did these people really write these?

Seve Harvey said, by my book first, and then by and then by his it's good, it's yourself. I did not authorize Will to use my name in this book. That tells you all you need to know about Will.

I totally to be honest, it'd be real, you know.

Kevin Hart said, all of Will Packard's stories about me in this book are false.

Well, maybe some are true, but they are funny. Well, they're pretty funny, but I don't.

Have to like them. Kevin Hark, He's the Ray Steve Harvey is, but Kerrie Washington because you know the thing I was thinking about you on your way in here, like what is your magic? Right? Because you've had a lot of success? So what when people like is he? Like? Is he because he's creative? Is he's a director? I know what I think your magic is it, but I'm curious about what you think it is.

What you think it is?

I think your magic is knowing how to create a package that cuts through and that will be culturally impactful. That number one, what will be culturally impactful? But but also it's you can sell it? Yeah, yeah, so you know how to put people together. You know how to create a package. To me, that's from the outside. I don't know the inner workings of your day.

Actually right on point, I would absolutely say that's one of my superpowers for sure. And it's about I talk about in the book Who Better Than You, right, because I talk about how if you want to be success carry on that you have to get other people to buy into your goals and your vision. I am a very staunch believer in that, and especially in Hollywood right, a very big egotistical, adversarial industry where everybody is all about what's in it for me? Was send it for me?

Which then cut through that I'm able to sell to the culture. Like you said, yeah, but.

Even if you think about the beginning of your your first movie.

Was famed you. Next movie was twy rodic thriller How Far You Want to Go?

No, No, I was going to like, what's your first hit movie?

You didn't want to go to the to the to the mud.

A certain amount of time today. Otherwise we would have done when you were a child then you first picked up.

You watch your first film.

We'll do that on the next SI. Okay, come to the podcast and we'll talk about your childhood and what we create such a person to want to make all these types of films.

Say this though, yes not the book isn't about my childhood. But the book is about how from the time you're born to the time you die, you're creating your brand. That is something that I think, what is your brand not put enough value on?

And what is your brand?

My personal brand?

I think it's being a great connector of people and a packager of projects.

Exactly what I did.

I not say that.

I told you that's why you ring the bell the bell feel like the bell just ringing ring, feel like you all the way agreed with my taking.

Okay, yes, you absolutely were spot on.

But I think I think people underestimate the value there you go.

I'm like, does the bell mean something or not. I need to know. Okay, it's my first time on show. I need a bell? Do I not do? Guess? Not get a bell? How does it work? Okay? Next to your producers like sir, this is your first day.

You get the bell, Next time you get the bell.

I think people don't put enough value on the fact that whatever you're doing, people are always like, you know what, I got to find my passion. I gotta find the thing that I'm supposed to do. But anything you're doing, if your name is on it, you gotta go hard. I really really believe that because you are creating your brand all the time, you're always selling yourself. Everything is so you're always trying to get other people to ascribe

Word, there's a lot of those jewels in this book is come on, you know.

This book my first book. I had to go hard.

I know you have your talking points about the book, and you're so good at that. So you're gonna I'm sure you've been doing.

Them, Martinez.

Thinking is the reason why I said I already have a little bit of time because I'm not gonna cry. Because the thing about and Martina is is she gets so deep and emotional. I would be here on this microphone, I can't do my talking point and well, you can do your talk because you're so good.

But number one, yes, your mom is here, and how cute is that?

Yes?

Are You're very closer and your wife is.

Saying, I got my family and Shaye, let's hear you got.

Good women around you.

Absolutely, because I'm a smart black man, I understand you get.

Into that in the book.

I just got the book today, otherwise I would have read it before.

It's there.

It's there for you, and it is absolutely about who you surround yourself with, right because we have to understand we all have a finite amount of energy and the people around you can either augment your energy or they can drain it. And I'm a big believer in that, So I try to put people around me that are going to boaster and augment my energy. We got people around us all the time drained.

How how do you okay? So then somebody sneaks in.

Yeah, what do you do? Yeah? And it could be somebody that you really.

Like, yeah, or that you can't out of you they need you, you know, or they come with a package of maybe something that you need, so you kind of have to them.

You have to put them in the box that they need to be in.

You have to prioritize, right, you have to understand keep the main thing, the main thing. That's a big thing for me, right, keep your eye focused on the prize. Somebody comes into your world. They got a package, they got something you need to got finance, they got whatever. But they are negative, they are toxic.

Right.

Is it worth it?

Do a cost benefit analysis?

Is what you're getting from that person worth in the long term? The fact that you're going to be up at night not feeling good about yourself. They're going to be doing things that are gonna be detrimental to other aspects of your life. If you're honest about that, you'll probably see it's not worth it. Seriously, have you ever done that?

Have you ever said it?

Did it?

And I have absolutely had wrong people around me. I make mistakes like everybody else. This is me learning over a thirty year career.

All the mistakes in here or just something no.

Biggest mistake, oh, biggest mistake character like.

A learning personal wise not necessarily like well, whatever whatever you whatever, you want to share.

You know, I here's the thing.

I really feel like the things that I've done that I would do differently, I needed to do them right. Like when I made the movie Obsessed right, and I went to Beyonce to try to get her at it right. I already had it yoursel Bob was trying to get Beyonce and she told me.

No, flat out, really absolutely. She told me no. Why five times?

Why she was scared or.

No, she was scared.

She said that there were elements in the project that she didn't like. And every time she told me no, because when somebody tells you no, you either go into a ball and cry or you say, oh forget them. They just hate him, right, And what you really should do is like listen to why they're telling you no. Put the emotion out of it. And so she was actually telling me things that was making the script better. And so each time I would go back, she was say, Okay,

Yeah, do you still get them or do you get a lot of yes's? Now?

I get both. Yeah, it's something Hollywood right now.

Right now, Hollywood is tricky because a lot of people don't know that because it's like, oh, it's all these streaming services, all this content. Now, a lot of your favorite actors aren't working a lot of people in Hollywood are having a tough time right now.

And I feel like people are just like they're like, I'm seeing remakes or.

Yeah, everything has to be ip based on something sequels like Forrest Gum. Hollywood always like I want to take risks because Forrest Gump is a risk, right, somebody take that.

Wear that movie reference point.

But that's a great one though, because it was you know, z A Mechas and obviously Tom Hanks, and it was a very original concept.

It's tough to get an original concept made. I mean, big.

Stars, big producers, you're you know, you're truly included, have a tough time getting our projects made right now in Hollywood.

What about AI?

What's happening with that? What do we what does that look like coming?

What's today? Because this you got? You got another week? I hope you did.

You save up and I'm trust me, I'm I'm.

Show without you. I got everything.

And you know what's funny, I actually can't and I believe, like like I'm joking, But the reality that I tell people is that AI is absolutely one of the most powerful tools that we have seen throughout media.

Right.

I don't care if you're talking about print, radio tub it doesn't matter, but you cannot duplicate the human element. The human element of artistry is so powerful and I really believe this that it is a tool and it's absolutely affecting people. It means that a lot of people don't get jobs on a movie set because I don't have to like build an actual set. I can do it in a computer like that. Stuff happens and will continue to happen.

Are you leaning into that or are you what I have to I mean, I have to use the tools that are available to me, but I would never replace the human factor.

That is the key.

Ultimately, I really do believe consumers can tell because we're talking about art. At the end of the day, even somebody like meet us on the business side of it, it's still art.

It's going to be so interesting. No next thing it's happening. Oh no, it's here.

Yeah, it really is. Has been around for so long.

Yeah, but this is different. Well but you know people say that, but like, you know, isn't there people aren't there people like learning how to make full films just ai like, well yeah, yeah, but I mean.

That doesn't worry people have been It's not that it doesn't worry me. I just still am am very optimistic about what artists will still be able to do and that they will still be a different right. I'm not the person that's standing in front of the train like screaming for it to stop. It's coming, right. You know there were people that were like, I'll never shoot on digit I'm only filmed, And now everything is digital, right,

That's the key.

But that's with anything and anything. Life is constantly changing. We live in an unpredictable world.

What are you gonna do? Crawl to a ball and die. No, you're gonna adapt.

We are the most adaptable species God has ever created.

Yeah, one of one. Yeah, we're gonna be okay, well you gotta figure it out. But it's gonna be rough, you know what I mean.

Everybody's painting the picture of the world right now, like it's terrifying. Y.

Yeah, the government it's tough, going down every five minutes.

Yeah, no, I saw that. I'm about to jump on one right now.

Sorry, what can we.

Ring the bell? What happens that? What happens?

I don't know what's happening in the universe. But with this's like weird ship happening around.

But you know what, other times that have been very unpredictable, Right, And so I just think that at the end of the day, what can you control?

Spend so much time giving energy?

We all have a finite amount of energy, and we give so much of it to things that don't really matter that we cannot really control.

We do.

Everybody does that, Right, you're on here, You're supposed to be focused one thing, your notifications going off on your phone, something on your TV.

That stuff doesn't matter, but you're giving it energy.

So I choose to give energy to the things that I can control. And when you do that, I think you live and manifest your best life, no matter how crazy things are. Right, Yes, we're in a crazy world. But what can you control?

Right?

Can you have a better relationship with your significant other or your mom or your child? Right, doesn't matter what's happening in the White House or happening in you know, in Europe or Africa? Right, Like, what's happening in your life that you can control? We don't focus enough on that my opinion.

You know what, I just remember I don't know where this came from it yourself, but when he did during COVID he did the quarantine actors where he had there was like one second trips, like yeah, they were on Instagram live and actors were like doing things and it was like commenting on how auditions and stuff.

Yes, yes, I.

Remember you.

I think you were in the comments.

I just remember being part of it.

I don't know if it's just we spoke what I just remember you saying something about that there was something interesting, there was something to learn, and even me watching it, I was like, oh, because interest is so talented that his feedback was so insightful to see even from the outside of somebody, And I just wondered from you like one of those things that like, because you've made so many stars and you pick you don't.

Know if I've made them, but I definitely put people in position to succeed. That's how I would say. I think that, yeah, but you you spot them, Yeah, I definitely. I think I have an instinct for talent, but I put them in the right position, in the right medium, at the right time.

Who's Who's who are you most proud of of all of those.

Kevin Hart, Tiffany had even Chris Brown. I mean, I don't think it's Chris Brown did a movie that I didn't produce.

Akers was genius.

You like that?

Yeah, of course that means that's what I say, your gift that like this person extraordinarily talented.

So like I joke about, you know what I mean having made those people, I really didn't, but I am.

Nobody was putting Chris brun in a movie like that like that.

No, and his first one was Stomped the Yard, right, but I liking it to Steve Jobs. Steve Job was not a colder, right, He was not somebody that knew how to get in and actually program computers. But he was an innovator. He knew how to put the best coders around him.

So you can't act at all at that. A mean, you know, I saw you. I saw you in I saw you when you didn't wash your hands in The Best You remember that scene now two people watch you when you come out of the bathroom.

I got to see it with Kevin Hart. I come out and had him on the back, didn't wash my hands. I got shipped about that for a long time.

But can you act really though? I mean I can do.

I would never go in and be like, I'm going to be the star of this film, but for thirty seconds a scene or two little back.

At home my own, I'm around them enough.

You know what makes a star?

Oh? So many things.

It depends because I am somebody that definitely believes that a star is specific to a certain project. I'm not one of those people who believe that you can put anybody in anything and they win.

I don't.

I think certain people are meant they Everybody has a toolbox, everybody has a skill set, and you have to put people.

My job is to put people in positions.

Where their best skill is utilized in the best platform and best medium. So you'd have to ask me, like, what makes a star in a particular movie? In my opinion, right, their skill set has the lineup of what that project, that narrative, whatever, whatever.

Who best demonstrates that, Like of all the people that you put in a place in a movie and thought, Wow, this shows why this person is magic.

Timmy Haddison Girls Trip, Yeah, right, Like she was very specific, her very specific bag of tools lined up with that character. Dina Right, I had Regina Hall Queena TV Jada Fingers.

From I mean that cast rolls right.

And then I needed my wild card. I needed my spontaneous person who made bad decisions and you know, was wild and loud and all of that. And she didn't come in and act the part. She embodied the part. She became the part. So for that project, and I'm not saying she can't do a lot of things, but for that project, she was the right person at that time.

That's what it took, and that's what that project needed.

Did you know like when they when I know you have, we don't have. You know, this is not okay, by the.

Way, listen, and you know it's not me.

You know, I love you, No, I know, but there's so much I just there's so much nuance to what you do. It's like, you know, I could we could do this for two hours. We should do then I would make you cry.

See That's why I'm not doing it. That's what I did.

That's why where's my being? See, that's why I'm out of here because I know you what is the.

Little thing there that makes you like? What is the thing.

Even if we don't have to get to it today, but what is the thing that like you know, we all are like motivated by like I like to do things that people like. I know, the thing that moves me most is like when I do something that somebody genuinely affects it takes it in their life, whether it's an interview on the podcast or something that they say, whatever. I know that that's the thing that gets me. Like, what is the thing that drives you?

Probably when people talk about my legacy, because it's even hard for me to say I've been in the game thirty years because I still feel, you know, like I

Right?

But then I also say, not a talking point, but I say who better than me?

I really do?

I say, you know what, I've worked hard and bust my ass I'm supposed to have it, but I don't like having it just like put in front of me, because that's probably where it listens to the most emotion.

Yeah, but where did you get that? Who told you that? Your mother?

Yeah?

Yeah, my mom and my dad. They literally they they lifted me up like sim and the lion king. Right, they took me to the highest rock. So everything the sun touches, it's yours. That's how they did me. And I think everybody should do that to their kids.

Absolutely. Yeah, do you go into kids here?

Do we learn things about my kids?

Yeah?

You know what? It's mostly it's really stories from Hollywood. It is stories from my life. It is stories I've never told. But it is really all about.

How do you take these lessons?

It's not Will Packer was born here and then he went to this school, and it's not a memoir, but it is very much my philosophy around being around some of the most successful people in the world and what do they do, what are the traits that they all have? What if I learned from navigating their world? And what do I think that I can pass on to other people? That's really what the book is there.

It is congratulations and thank you New York Times bestseller.

Well, you know, we'll see it feels that's not up to me.

We'll see if people go by it, Andre Martinez show anything possible?

Do you then make a movie about your book?

Somebody else asked me that, you know, I did not make the book to make a movie. I made the book to influence people. I didn't think so, but you know it's crazy. Steve Harvey was like he never ever thought thinking like a man.

I like a thing like a man would have been.

A movie because he was like, as an advice book, how do I make it into a movie. You know, so anything's possible, but I did. I had no intentions of that.

You have the rights, of course with me.

I will packer, I will pack her. I'm gonna do a book ring a bell. Come on now, stop playing who better than you? Will?

Yes?

Pack everybody? Who better than you? Healthy arrogance The key words healthy.

Arrogance and dreaming big. We'll pack of go get the book, guys.

Thank you,