Can we have a one time proper welcome for Thames in the building today? What's that baby? It's good, I'm good. This is Thames is only her third time in New York and you have not done New York properly. From what I understand, that is such a shame. You know why, because I feel like everybody I always meet from Nigeria, different places or whatever, but there is a synergy of they like New York and there and there's a vibe. So you you, you have to be a chaperone the proper
you know, the right way. I really love New York like it reminds me so much of like back home. It's the pace is the same. Yes, quick quick, you have hit the gate crazy. It has been insane, like mind mind bl I bet how much as your life changed in the past few years? Oh how much has my life changed? Well?
When I released my first song, I couldn't afford to upload this song and my Auntie helped me upload my song how much as that was twelve dollars and I didn't have like an international card, so I called her to help me. From America. What year is this? This was twenty eighteen, five years five years and now like everything I wouldn't even say that I wanted to do. This is just beyond anything I thought. Yeah, like I'm just going along for the adventure. I'm just like, Okay, you know,
I guess this is happening. This is but you wanted it so bad. I have read things what you said, Like I remember in your interview I think it was the Interview magazine. You did an article and you said that you was like you would have died for this, like you really wanted to. Yeah. I would have died to make music, not necessarily to be big or to be famous, or like I would have died to just make music for a living. Because back home, music isn't a profession that is
respected. Is that right? Yeah? I know when you're doing music, is like why are you doing music? Like no parents wants their child to do music because they think because it's not going to go anywhere. It's just not exactly. And it's like and then there's so many talented probably musicians everywhere. It's like, go to school, be a doctor, be a lawyer,
be a profession that we recognize. And when you say music is like what and so that's that's how people look at you know, music, So you had any at any point that you consider being a lawyer, doctor, any of those things. I tried. I really tried. I tried to, you know. I went to school and I tried my best, and I got a job after I got like a I got like a little job trying to make something of myself, and I just after a few months, I was just like, this is not I'm going to die in this job
on it like and it's going to kill me. So I need to do what I should actually be dying for, which is my passion exactly. Wow. Yeah, and then it happened, and then it happened fast. And if you even think about the past five years and then everything, and then the additions that you probably didn't even expect, the Oscar, the Oscar you are, the Oscars, the Grammys, the just all of it. The charts, the it's crazy. Yeah, it's crazy, it's really actually crazy.
I didn't I didn't know or pay attention to charts. Like before I released music, I didn't know what I didn't I was like, okay, playlist, I didn't know what that meant, like it's all new, it's all new, good for you. And then what about the fame part. How's that going? How are you dealing with that? Well? I find it so funny. I'm I'm I'm learning, you know how to just like I don't find the fun in it. I guess yeah, yeah, yes, that's good. Yeah, because people could get it, could weigh you
down if you let it. I guess. I guess. I don't really, I don't really pay attention too much to like things. I just I just find it funny when like people take things so serious I do, or that I say, or that you know, anything happens. It's like a whole thing. I'm like, Wow, you guys are really serious. Wowybody, everybody's typing think pieces on there for wow. I don't like wow, not a think piece, Yeah, I'm so serious, Like wow, I
feel well, it's just chilly. And you know that happens to artists though, as they get more famous and famous, some some people like lean into it, and then some people like even if you think, like Rihanna, she used to be wild with say anything, do anything, And I feel like as that fame creased, she you have to be like a little people. They get more protective of there because everything you say is it comes, and so then some people handle that a little bit differently, like whatever.
So it's interesting to see how you're gonna I think you're gonna be fine. Yeah, nah, should be fine. So far, so good. Take me to some of those big moments, those times. Take me to like to like lift me up. You make this song? Yes, I made this song. I wrote this I mean, yeah, that was insane. Was there? You sent it and then she did it right? There was no where you weren't together in the studio doing this song or you're not supposed
to say not this song. This song is just really crazy. So they came to Legos and I was told I was doing the soundtrack, and but how did you even get picked in the first place. I was told that the actor and the actresses on set or like playing my music, and they were telling Ryan the old times has to do it, turns has to do it. Have you ever ever wrote a song like that in your life?
Like, I mean, that felt so big and so like international. I think it felt big because of, like you know, I mean, because of what it was for, because it was Black Panther, it was the return and it was you know, the memorial of Chad Boswick and you know it's Rihanna, and you know, I think it was big because of that.
But like I have many songs, it's not your favorite song. It's not my favorite song I've ever written, No, but it's it's definitely like it was a moment for sure, Like did you feel it in the time, Like did you? I don't know. Sometimes when the world and I sang it, so I didn't feel it. I mean I did feel it.
I did feel it, like in terms of like the writing aspects, yeah, yeah, and when you know at the Oscars, I did feel that, like, wow, this is something I'm part of, which was was the big outfit at the askers of the Grammys was a little black black and the poor people behind and first of all, I'm so misunderstood, like literally people, and first of all the people behind me. It was so it's a sweet old guy and before we sat down, he was like,
you're so beautiful. Can I take a picture with you? And then we walked to our seats and realized he was behind me and he was like, no, I'm fine, I'm actually okay. And after that whole thing, he actually wrote a letter and he posted it on Facebook that oh, this sweet girl actually loved her dress and we could see okay because he was trying to like calm everything, and I was like, oh, this is so sweet. But also I was supposed to change and I didn't have my phone.
I didn't have anything, so all I could do was just sit like pay attention because I had no phone, So all the things that were going online I didn't know until I left. So that was like, how many hours of things coming? All I could do? Wait, are you telling me you're sitting there? It didn't even occur to you that nobody could see behind it? No? No, it made I mean what could I do? No, you can't do nothing. Once I sat down, they were like you're going to be on TV, so you can't get up, Like
you have to sit down here. You can't go upstairs, you can't. I didn't have my phone, We couldn't get my stylist to quickly go to the bathroom. Literally everything that was supposed to happen just like it. It was great but ended up great, Like it was such a looking beautiful. Yeah, it was really good, and just you know, being there seeing Rihanna performed Lift Me Up at the Oscars. That was great. I was like, wow, this is crazy. You know where I was four years
ago, Like so, yeah, that was really lovely. But yeah, I just thought the whole thing was funny. People were like so angry. I was like, are you guys? I really upset? They're not really upset. It's just people who have nothing to talk about online. I just want to like a big deal about nothing. I found it so funny. I was like, oh, okay, well, how are things back home? How is the fame translated? Like when you go home, do you
have you experienced? Yeah, you've been traveling so much you haven't even really I have. I mean every time I go home wherever I'm staying, people around me or people around just always know I'm there, like, oh she's here, she's landed. Yeah, I kind of. I mean I can't really go to the grocery store here either. But I can't go back home. Oh my goodness, it's no grocery store. You can't. You can't go anywhere. You really can't, Like you can't you can't hear no,
not with this coat in the full gland. But like if you put like maybe I have tried that, and I was still spotted. But I don't. I don't like to. I'm not disguising anymore, so I'm always going to be dressed up when I'm going out. You're like, I'm not going to down. I'm not gonna like try and hide, you know, unless it's absolutely necessary. But yeah, back home, you can't go anywhere because you aren't you cook. Don't you cook like a cook? You cook right
because you have to go to the supermarket. I mean, I mean sometimes you know, it's not for cooking. It's just like maybe we're going out and we're stopping somewhere to get something and then it's like, oh, okay, what's you know. Nigerians are very like what's happening here? They're very like interested in drama and things like that. Is it like a big tabloid. It's like you know what I mean, it's like here's this TMZ or this was like I don't know, is that is its? Yeah, the
Nigeran blow. But they're like mostly online. They're not it's not crazy like paparatz like ruthless, That's what I mean. They're like showing up at your house and things like that. No, no, no, that's good. They're not hardly yeah, because in La. No, it's not it's not that crazy. It's not that even today was crazy. Like we came out of like I did an interview earlier and we came out of the building and
TMZ was there, and like there's people, you know. They started asking questions and I just I found it fascinating, like this is what y'all do? Was going on? I didn't know about what did they ask you? Did you answer? They were like, do you feel pressure to to release two top what you've done or something like that? Oh you know, did you feel any kind of way that they said you were pregnant? Or do
you feel it's because you're famous? And I was just like, I don't know any kind of person that I smile every time, like things are like that's good. Yeah, Like I just find it funny like things like that. I'm just like like, are we is? This is good? Am I in my playing prank? Like? Where where's the prank? Like? No, that's real life. The The TMZ will jump out on celebrities any if you're any of those shows in New York, Yeah, sorry, no, in any of those Like if you're do any of those talk shows,
they're always outside they wait for you. They got cameras, they got questions, they're gonna ask you to be pregnant. Why people think it was pregnant? I have no Was it a shirt a bad shirt day? Did you have like a bad you know? I went to a fashion show and I think the top, the top I was wearing was talked in to leather. That's so disrespectful to a woman. And I was holding the code, how
like I was holding the code. Maybe I forgot to suck my to, you know, to hold it. Maybe for a second I forgot to. It could have been a food baby, because because we were eating so much that day. Yeah, so I just I think there was like a two second clip. I mean, that's why I gather that. I saw like one clip and I was like, this is still not enough. But I didn't know what's happening until like two days later. And it was because my cousins and my mom like messaged me like, oh, you know, this
is definitely a lie. I'm like, what's going on, what's happening? What's this? And then what's this? What's this like? And then I went online. I'm seeing pregnant, pregnant. What's happening? What's going on from where, like from where it's just like now you guys are joking some things I read about you. I'm very curious about well number one of the dress. We talked about that number two you got locked up, You got arrested. I got arrested. And there was during COVID, right, you
guys broke some role to be what happened. We didn't break the rules, but it was basically like set up. It was. We went to Uganda. Yeah, I had a show in Uganda. It was during the COVID year, but they had opened things up. They had just had like a rally in Uganda and people were going out. It wasn't on lockdown, but it was just like the aftermath. It was just just after like they had opened stuff and the organizers said they had the permits. They sent us the
permits. Everything was cool and we went there and there was this particular artist. I'm not sure now what his role was, but he was just basically threatening Nigerian artists that they shouldn't, you know, come And after the show, the police came. They weren't unif they weren't in uniforms. They just
knocked on my hotel door. We were eating lunch or dinner. My manager and I and they just came and said we should follow them, and my manager was like, okay, he'll go with them, so he went with them, but they came back upstairs to pick me up, so it was like who called them? So later on I just found that there was some like weird, something weird. That's scary though. That was so scary, like I spent like two nights in prison and Uganda. That's horrifying that I
thought I wasn't going to come out. I thought I thought like that was going to be my Maybe I was seeing this for a reason, like maybe this is for me to help these people in this prison. Like it was crazy. I'm not gonna lie that's what you were thinking. Yours were settling in. No, No, I was settling in because for me, I'm very adapt real quick. And as I was walking in, I started to cry because I was thinking, they gave me my uniform. The uniforms stunk
and they don't wash it. I like an outfit too. Yeah, I mean this is after I'm this new swag of mine is after I did that, because before I was I was calm with my dressing. After I was like, nah, I'm gonna wear anything anything I want. Oh so that changed you, That changed it really did. It made me stop caring about so many things because there's so many other women in there. They were there
for nothing. Oh my husband and I had a fight. He called the he called the police on me. Oh my brother didn't want me to inherit the land, so he called the police. And he's keeping he's paying them to keep me in prison. You know you were in there building with the women that was inside. I mean it was a small room. It's a room maybe as big as this, and there's just there's nothing. There's just it's a floor with you. They give you a blanket, they give you
tissue, and you're just on the floor and sad. No bed. Wow you're there two days? Yep. Do you know for sure you're going to get out? No? I didn't. I couldn't. I didn't know. I didn't have any ears on ground. Nobody told me anything. I just I mean outside people were like free terms and free or my layor you know. Inside I was just I was just hopeful, you know, I was just like waiting. There's no like my phone call. Can I make a call. There's no, cause that's crazy. There's no cause you can't make
a phone call that's money. And it's Uganda in Africa, so it's different. It's different out there, you know. So the best thing you can do is, well, I don't know how long I'm going to be here, I might as well make friends. You know, there's there's always a leader of like there's always someone in charge of the girls. Are you trying to find the boss? What? They found me? Because it's a small room, you know. Once I walked in, everybody just turned and looked
at me, and you know, everybody was whispering. They don't speak English, like lots of them don't speak English, so they're just looking at me. And I was like, god, what if I don't I can't cry, I can't cry. And I just started winking. Like I would see people like looking at me like so intensely, and I would just start I just started winking. That was my way of adapting, Like that was my way of you know what, I must show these people. I'm confident.
I must show them that actually you're not doing anything to me. So I I started winking. I was like hi, Hi, being extra like hi, Hello, yeah, yeah, I see you. Yeah, they're just laughing. They were like, who is this person? I made such a noise, Like I was so confident, Like I just walked in. I just started winking at everybody. I start. I sat down in my corner and I just started like people who like point at me and point at them too, and wink at them. And I was like, no, like
cases. And then the leader, the leader of the person that's in charge of the girl, she came to me and she was like, okay, so this is my name. I've forgotten her name and I shouldn't have. And she was just like these are the rules, Like everybody has to abide by them. If you don't, they lock you up. There's this toilet stall where they lock you for days without food, without water. They just every every evening they will be pouring water on you. They just lock you
in this store. Like if you if you like, you have to kneel down. If you're walking, you can't, sorry, you can't stand up. If you're unless you're going to the bathroom, you have to kneel down to to talk to any officer, any anybody must kneel down to speak to them. You cannot speak to them face to face. You have to kneel down. They do it search every morning. You can't. You eat only once and you eat porridge, oh my god, like porridge like your rice
porridge type thing. I didn't eat in prison. And I was sipping water, pour water like in a cap and sleep it. That's what I was doing for two days. Like you must have been when you got How did you get out? So they came and you you must go out, so diplomatic, like my my manager's dad had to go to Abuja to meet the president. He had to, like everybody was calling. Everybody was calling Uganda,
the Ugandan president. He knew about it. It was and then they just kind of like the day after, two days after, they just one day in the evening before they closed, they just said, oh yeah come and then I was taking I was even I was carrying a child because the women have their babies in prison obviously because nobody's good, so their baby. So I was taking care of a child. We were playing and I was even going to carry the child out because you can, you can take you
can have you have play time. So he said no, I should drop the child, no with her mom that I'm not coming back here. So I was like, okay, everybody bye. That was my god. Those poor women that I still kept in contact with some of them after. But it's hard as well because there's some that I don't know where they are. I know all of them are out now. The ones I spoke to, including the person that was in charge of the girls, she's out too.
Wow, that is a traumatic experience. That was crazy. That was I think after that, I stopped caring too much about what people think. Everything happens for a reason. It does. It does, even though you know sometimes you'd be like why, but it usually shows sometimes at some point. I remember them though. It makes me, It gives me context every time I'm enjoying water, every time I'm enjoying bed. I remember when I came out and I saw it. I said, wow, this bed. People
don't have bed. People don't have a bed to sleep on. They're sleeping on the floor. Day. When was this How long this was in twenty twenty? Yeah? It might have prepared you for this next round twenty twenty one, twenty twenty, okay, yeah, it might have prepared you for this next round of like fame and you know, this big life that you have now just to keep it into kind of perspective. And I think so because after that, not that I wish that for anybody, but after that
incident, things just started moving. Wow. Yeah, that's wild. That is a terrible experience. Does anybody ever apologize? Do you ever get like an apology? Oh? No, I mean I think where I am now is enough apology. It's in reward for me, you know. I see it as something that was meant to be. You're flying all over the place, flying, man, I'm a bird right now. Honestly, I'm just doing whatever. I feel love for you. How How does I know that
you made this? And then there's the Drake lunch or dinner that you made this? You made this? People? Bring this up, right, listen. We have to bring this up because I find it fascinating that you were in that kitchen. I wasn't cooking for him. I was cooking for my people too. I was cooking in any way. But it's in Drake's kitchen. No, no, oh, I thought it was at Drake's house, my house. I was cooking. How is that chicken rice? So is
there a recipe? Because it seemed that that it was good. It's good. I have. I love chicken stew. It's almost like a brown stew, but it's spicy and it's like fresh. It's like with raw, like you fry tomatoes, you blend it, you fry. Then there's a lot of there's a lot of things, a lot of things. You fry. You boiled chicken, then you fry it, and you used to stalk and you it's a lot. It's delicious, it's so do you think that I
had anything to do with the feature and then all the stuff? Do you think that if it was bad, it might not have gone the same way? No, it was already locked in, right, it was already locked in. You know, girl, anybody you can't Drake is such a savage. The story can't come out that there was any kind of association with Drake without people assuming that he was in savage more. But I already know that you have said that he was a gentleman, he was a Yeah, I
mean I did. Yeah, he knows he's a savage too. If he's watching Drake, I'm not saying nothing about you. He doesn't know. He knows he's a savage. But you have no fears of that. How are you guys like, are you comfortable around like you a girl's girl, like, are you comfortable around guys? Because I'm sure they all at some point try to shoot shots, right The guys problem is, I don't really I don't realize when they're doing it because I assume the position of his sister friend.
So I'm very like when I speak, I'm not flirting. I'm not trying to be like, oh, so, what you up to tonight? I'm just like you know, when I when I see why w y D, I'm just like, oh, well, I'm just about to go to bed, or I'm just you know, in the studio working, okay, I want to check you. I'll be like cool, you know, well, you know, I'll bring my producer, we can work. I don't.
I don't that you're dodging all the shots. Probably like I feel like I've been dodging it for so long that I genuinely don't know when it's happening until like it's in my face and it's like like they want to look. I like you, Okay, I'm telling you. I like you. I've been telling you since that I like you. Don't you I'm like, oh, really, I didn't know this. I didn't know you were liking me or well, you know, for me, you're a friend. So oh
your friends on them terrible? They hate that. Yeah, I know they don't like that, but I do want to be a friend unless I don't, unless it's like yeah, or actually like this person. So then I'll be like, well, you know, I call everybody my G. But if I call you my G and I feel like I'm feeling something, I'll still be like, oh, yeah, my G, but you're not my G. How the hell are they supposed to know if your signals is mixed? Well, because I will tell them. I'll tell them. My G
is just how I talk. I like to I like to aeo you I like to ao. So then how do you flirt? Do you have a flirt game or you're terrible at it? Like if you do like them, what do you do? Like? My problem is I am zero one hundred. If I'm flirting, it's like woof, it's like it's like we go together. It's like it's like too much. It's like really intense, and it's either that or I do nothing. And if I'm doing nothing, it's
different things. So that's why I like to do that zero two hundred because I always feel like I accelerate things too much or over maybe I'll look someone to like, you know, in the eye, and there's that thing. Oh my goodness, we're having a moment. Meanwhile, I just I was just playing. I'm just playing with you. I didn't mean to like over like, you know, look at you. Yeah, that's really funny. I don't know why. I'm always gonna have the image of you in the
cell winking at everybody. It's totally funny in my mind. I'm like, Wow, to me, you're actually crazy. What's what's happening? Now? We have a new song. You're direct directed the video, which is exciting. It's the first time doing that right, first time? What even makes you think I could do that? I have visue for that. For me, I feel like there's nothing in this life that I should not be able to do. Life is short, and you know, I've I met with
a couple, you know, directors before I did that. And with directors, they take your vision, but they have their own vision in mind because it's their work. They want to show what they want to show in your video, so you can't they can't really like put your vision to life in the way you want them to because they have their own like agenda. So that's the problem with direct. You know other people and there was no time. They always take long back and forth. I said, you know what,
I woke up. Let's do it. I will write the treatments. What do you need? I've research, Like, it's not easy. How do you How do you begin to write your first treatment? You have to like Google writing a director, I just closed my eyes and I write a story like I play the song over and I'm in a dark room. I play this song over and over again. I close my eyes and I did dream a video. Wow, and then I write it as I'm daydreaming, okay, on the water, looking out talking to the sky, writing it
down first scene, second scene, when this song's come. That's how I do it. Yeah. Wow, you think you'll do that more? Probably? Right? Probably it's better when you're that, when you have that much vision so you can control it. Yeah, But is it more work because then you have to also like watch the footage direct everybody, tell everybody, the lighting, all that you do all that. Yeah, it is more
work, but you have help. You have like producer, you have like the creative assistance that like show like they're looking at the screen, so if something is off, everybody is looking at it like, nah, this lighting is not good. Let's quickly switch and I'll see it's okay, cool, Let's do it, you know. So it's like I'm doing everything myself. But it's hard. I'm not gonna lie. I've been all I could. I didn't sleep for like a month. Wow, I'm up with the editor
every night. It's because you love it. You clearly love it. I do love it. Yeah, I love work. I love like art. I think that's why I do this more than anything, more than fame. If I'm if I'm not able to make my own art, I would rather not have all this. That's that comes first. Yeah. Wow, So where do you go with that? Like what do you'd see for yourself? I don't know five years, Like do you have like long vision for it or you're just kind of creating as you go. I mean, in five
years, I I will still be releasing music. But I'm also one of my goals is to expand. I own a company called Leading Vibe, and I'm trying to expand into an enterprise that supports people from Nigeria and people from Africa and female producers like me, and I really want to be in the studio with with like people coming up, young young girls coming up, young guys. I want to help people write. I want to help people,
like feel like I want to be in the studio. I want to be a helping hand because I feel like, especially in Nigeria, you don't have training. There's no such thing as vocal. I mean, there's vocal training now, but nobody taught me how to sing or taught me how to write this song, and sometimes you need that. Yeah, so how did you? You just figured it out as you went. I just loved it so much that I was, you want, like an ask, just doing it
without any I didn't even know if it was wrong or right. I didn't know if I was singing wrong or right. So I was just singing. Even like formatting a song and things like that, nobody's ever taught you how to do that. That's wild. I just thought, Oh, there's a course I don't. I don't sing in choruses and verses. I sing in freestyle. And then I noticed, oh, so this is the format everybody's using. I'm sure there's a chorus somewhere in here, and I started realizing,
Okay, this is chorus material, this is course. So when I freestyle, I allow myself to feel and experience the freestyle, and when I'm done, I play it back and I realize, that's the chorus, that's
the verse. That's pretty great. But do you have like vision for other things, because even directing I would imagine, like I don't know, I would, you know, I would love to direct other people's videos for sure, really I would, because I think, I mean, at some point I think it would be an exclusive thing maybe for someone I really really like, who is that person, who's the biggest, Like who's your biggest Who's the that I would love to direct for? Or just that you're a fan
of who's bigger? Oh? In life in life, in life, Shadday, Shaddy means everything to me because she's also Nigerian. Yeah, and I mean she's British b and and she's Shadday. Yeah. Well I could see that now, I can see her influence on you. Yeah. She and she don't come out a lot too, so she out that's the life I'm trying to be living. Like she's making her music, like she there's a studio I was at the like two months ago. Shadley records at that studio
and she still records there. But she's just I mean, well, maybe I don't want to. You can't speak on her behalf. I know I'm not speaking on her behalf. But I heard that she still records there and she's still making music. I could see that though she does come out. Your attempts shot day collaboration would be fire fire, That would be insane.
Do you have goals for collabse Is there people that you'd like to work with that you haven't yet like that, you know, Yeah, Frank Ocean, he's one of my like very challenging people to get a hold of, because I do, I do. He's one of my He's one of my inspirations. Frank Ocean, Kendrick, you should have probably that at the interview magazine thing. You didn't know, you know, no, no, no,
I mean, you know he knows. You probably learned from a lot of the collaborations you've done, right in terms of being able to talk, how to put songs together, and just the business. And I mean the more you you collab with people in studio, I feel like when you do that, you learn yeah, because you see another artist process and it's like, oh, so this is how you write. I don't really like see I don't I don't tap into that, but like it just does something to your
mind just opens Are you ever amazed to it? Like just with when you think about how many artists from africar are doing so well and afrobeats and the explosion of all of that, your timing in the world and being an artist, like you couldn't have picked a better time, you know, because if you think about people older than you, maybe who even had who had talent and just couldn't Like it's not weird that people think, maybe you say in
Nigeria that like being an artist is like why it because history tells you that it's you can't have this type of success and it's like you came at the right time and the right when the world could accept it on this bigger scale. I don't know, do you ever think about that and the timing of it and how long will this day forever will it grow? Because then there's always speculation of is this just a wave? And then the wave is going
to go away? And then what happens to all these amazing artists, which would be terrible and unfortunate. I mean, I don't see it to be that, but that is a thought. I mean, with the labels and people spending money on stuff, it's like, is this a moment in time or do you think what do you see? I guess with the future of it, and do you think aphrob Beyeah, I think it's taking a shape of its own for sure. Globally. I feel like just the way the
world is, the way life is. Eventually, at some point in life, there's always going to be a new a wave wave. But I feel like aphrobeasis is strong enough genre too. It's like, just because there's aphrobeats doesn't mean R and B people stop listening to R and B. Yeah, people are still very much listening to R and B. Like in The Billions, you know, it's always there, It's always going to be there,
and I feel like the same for aphrobeats. It's just, you know, I can't predict what's going to happen specifically, but I see an evolution probably. Yeah. I don't feel like it's a genie that you could put back in the bottle. I feel like it's is now. It may evolve into different sounds. Yeah, the same thing where hip hop firs came out. It was like they were like, Okay, this is great a couple of years, and then it's fifty years later, still here, but obviously different
evolutions. It'll be interesting to see where that goes. But then also what happens is that then you know, I see they compare you to other women sometimes or they could only be one who's the hot one, or to do you feel like some of that energy coming at you from like the world, I guess, or the blogs or I think there's always going to be comparison in general when it comes to like women, especially women, especially because of
just the dynamic with women. But I feel like that's only if you work according to the law of industry, and that law is that there can only be one person. But I don't really I'm not doing what I do to be number one. If somebody else is doing it to be number one, do that number one go ahead my head, because that's not what makes me happy. I would rather not be with number one and be miserable and be
having to keep up her parentces. Like if I get to number one, sure, but that's not why I'm doing music like That's why in that interview I said I would die for this. That's what I mean. It means that whatever people see as number one is not. I don't mind losing that as long as I get to keep my passion and my outlets, because music is an outlet for me. If I need if I don't have music, I'll need therapy. So if I can't do what I do, if I can't be true to myself, then it's not worth it to me. That
means I'm faking everything. That means I'm becoming a whole other person that isn't me, just so that people can say, oh, she's number one, and nobody ever asked the question. Okay, if everybody in the whole world said you are number one, you are the good, you are the legend. Everybody, we we hail you, we acknowledge you as the number one, and that was your life every day? How do you feel? Would you be happy? Would you would you feel satisfied that now everybody knows me,
everybody has acknowledged me, we bow down to you. What what then? Joy is that is that? And that was your life every single day? Yeah? For some people, I don't know. I mean, I don't. It looks it feels like you wanted, but I can promise you you can never handle Nobody can handle that like nobody can handle that because what you're the The innate desire to be number one is stemming from a desire to
be God. You want to be God. You want to be the one and only in the world, and only God can be good or human beings naturally feel that desire. That's why there's competition in every industry. It stems from that human humid that human thing that we love to do to compare ourselves because we want to be on top of the pyramid. But this is not a pyramid. The world is not. There's a hat, there's a there's a role somebody being a billionaire and you being a millionaire. That person is
a billionaire to do what he does. What would you do if you're a billionaire and would you be happy? Like? Would you would you would it help you being a billionaire? Would you? Would you be fulfilled? Not even happy? Like would you be fulfilled in your life? Like? Okay, a billionaire, what do you do? A lot of people that would say I would be a lot more fulfilled, like he said, yes, yeah, you will. You say that, but you say that, but
it would drive you crazy. And that's the truth, because because then what are you chasing. The billionaires that yeah, the billionaires that a billionaires have goals and dreams they're doing, they're in the future. That's why they're billionaires because the way their minds think is different, and it's for the reason that they are there. So be the best that you can ever be. And
that's how you're number one, because there's only one of you. But for you to be number one in the world, the number one like the music on the charts, the number one singer. There's so many great singers better than like better than me, and the singing standard. I didn't learn how to sing from a trainer or from church. I was just singing in my house. I was singing again and again and again because I didn't have access to that. It's not like America where you can go somewhere, you know.
So there's people that sing so much in so much better tonations than me. But it's not about whether you can sing better or not, because nobody can be me and nobody can be you. So I don't subscribe to the law of the world, Like I subscribe to the law of grace, and the love of grace states that you are you, you are only one, and you are on top of your want to rule your kingdom because it's yours. But stop trying to rule the world because it's God's Oh that's good,
that is so good. But it's so easy, oh gosh, especially for like when you come into this world and you come into this business and people are showering you with things and telling you what's important and agendas, and very easy for a young person who's not grounded, so easy to get lost in the chasing of something that doesn't even really matter. How did you how, I mean, where did this come from? Where did you get that like
understanding or that you know? I think it's I think I had to be at the bottom, Like I started from a place where, like lots of people that I met after I became terms, I had already met them before I was TEMs. They just don't remember me. I met them as a normal you know, artists that will be hopping in studios and be freestyling that they just don't remember me. So I've seen human beings, I've experienced them from all angles and I understand that. Okay, it's not that I'm better.
I just am me. I'm unapologetic about being I'm not trying to be something. I am who I am, like I am terms I am Timula day so like I feel like for me, it's just always having the right people around you. Once you meet someone that also thinks like that, you can just tell all my managers, the people that work around me, I can just tell, Okay, you're someone I can learn from. So I put people around me I can learn from. I don't want to be the
top. I don't want to be the teacher. I want to be this then, please, I don't want to be the one that I say and I'm going to show everybody. No, I want to learn. I want to learn. And that's what makes me feel good when I feel like I have learned something new today. Have you learned anything today? Oh? I have? Would you like to share any of your learning today? What do you learn today? Life is not that serious. That's why I learnt because
of the TMZ thing. Oh yeah. And as I was experiencing it, I was really so present in the moment, and I was looking at the woman's face as she was asking, and I was like, wow, this is crazy, Like you are You're here asking me this ridiculous question. Yeah, But like she's doing something though, and that's her, that's her passion. Maybe maybe, but I mean she's passionate about something enough to get a camera and stand all day outside the building. That takes a lot of resilience.
I mean, you keep coming back. Wow, that means you must be passionate about it, about something, And it just made me like, it makes me appreciate life more every time I'm That's why I just be present. You know, I'm just even here. This is crazy, this is amazing. Well, I kind of love it. I'm so happy you came today. This is a gift for everybody to remind her to be present, because it is very easy to not be present. But you seem like you're
handling it very well. I can't wait to see what's next. I know you know what is next? What is it like right in the front. Now, that right in the front is all the music I've been working on for the past year, which is exciting. It's also nerve racking, why because I know what's I know, I know what's going to happen after and I I'm someone that likes preparation, but I also I have triggers, and I think it's just going to be interesting to see how I apply everything I've
learned in this new stage of my life. Like if you're going to be able to maintain, if I'm going to be balanced, yeah, Like, but I'm learning, though I know I can't do it. It's your fear that the music's so good that it's just going to blow up and your life's going to change even more. Is that part of the fear. Oh No, I don't think that's I think I don't know. You know, the music is is real to me, and that's what gives me solace, even
if you don't like it, even if nobody hears it. I needed to release that because that's my If I don't release it, like I said, I'm going to need therapy. That's where I release my thoughts, my feelings. So it's not it's about you. But I need to do this. Even if everybody said I'm never listening to terms again, I still have to release that music and I'm going to release it with my chest because I have to. I have to release it. I need to take it out and
put it out there. It's my gift and my gifts I need to multiply by sharing it, and whoever takes it, takes it, whoever doesn't. It's cool. Do you really like that? Don't care where it lands? Like you're okay, I can't control it. So if you can't control it, why brother caring? Like? Why brother like worrying? Just do your best, you know, do everything you can do your like, be your best. I love that. Yeah, So when do we get to hear
it? Do we have data and stuff we're not allowed to say? Yeah, she said, don't look at me somebody again, team's gonna spell it? Is it soon? Is this coming soon? It's coming soon in like a few months, a couple of months. Exciting. Yeah, I can't wait to hear it. Baby me too. Congrats on everything. It was so nice spending time with you today. I hope you keep this hope. I hope you are able to maintain this spirit in this space that you're in
as you go out here in this world and do all this press. Yeah, you start dumping on you. I have my I have a shield of protection, right, Yeah, what do you do? Is it prayer? What is prayer? Is knowing that you know, when God is behind you, nothing can stand against you, even if they want to. It's just
unfortunate that that they want to. Why do they want to? Yeah, some people just some people don't know that they're protected to so they feel like they need to attack something that they don't understand because they feel threatened by it. Oh that's good, but you're also protected. You're also here. You just need to wake up and realize so that you can join me and we can shine together. There is one type aretects everybody. Some people don't know they're protected. It's crazy.