Ep 35: Anna Apel - PRESSURE and Expectations as a Young Climber

Yeah, after China I definitely get a lot of pressure. Because I kind of saw what was possible and... Weeks or months where nothing is going in the right direction and you kind of get weaker and weaker and don't really know what is going wrong. I think the weirdest part was that I was climbing next to Janja and she's one of my role models and yeah, complete idol. We are having stricture BMI rules here in Germany than the IFSC. Welcome to another episode of the That's Not World Climbing podcast.

I'm your host Jinni and I'm excited to introduce my guest for today, Anna Apel. Anna is a boulder and lead climber from Team Germany and one of the younger athletes I've interviewed so far as she still competed in Youth World Champs last year. In this episode we'll talk about the differences between the youth and senior circuit, the pressure of expectations after flashing all qualies boulders in Innsbruck, and we get some insight into Team Germany and BMI testing.

I hope you enjoy this episode with Anna.

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This is the first time I've gotten to wear their shoes for an extended period of time and I'm actually super impressed with the grip of their in-house rubber and of course the famous drone heel that everyone says is the cheat code to heel hooking small edges. Feel free to message me if you have any questions about the shoes or sizing and you can use the discount code notrealclimber for 10% off your entire Mad Rock order. Info will be in the description. Back to the show. How are you doing today?

Good. I had a rest day today, so it was a very chill day. It was very snowy in Munich today, but yeah, nice day. Do you like the snow or no? I like the snow, but it was a lot of traffic on the road, so that was a bit problematic. Yeah, I do not miss the snow. I moved away from that a while ago and I'm happy to not experience it anymore. Yeah, so you're just spending time at home in Germany? Yeah, currently we're like in our training, just doing our normal training in our training center.

So here in Munich and in Augsburg. Yeah, so right in the depths of winter training. Do you spend a lot of time traveling during the winter season or is that just reserved for when it's World Cups? Currently I'm more or less all the time in Munich. Sometimes I'm traveling to Innsbruck or also to Bricsen or Brunach just to see some other settings and other gyms. But the main traveling will be during the World Cup scene and all the comps.

Do you find it helps to just stay in one place during your big winter training season? It helps you stay focused or something like that? Yeah, because here is like my training days and the people I know and my coach and it makes it a bit more simple for me.

Cool, so let's get right into it. When did you start climbing and then competing? I started climbing very early. So at the age of three, my parents took me to the rock and yeah, I kind of started to get in touch with climbing and climb my first routes and also had a lot of fun doing that. Do you actually remember climbing when you're like three years old? No, I can't remember climbing. I know what my first route was.

It was called Binna Maja and I got my first climbing shoes because I topped the route, but I don't really know how I felt. I just know from like tellings and stories that I really liked it to be outside and climb. And then I also started competing here in Munich on like smaller comps and I was not immediately on the top, so I needed some time. And yeah, then from time to time and more comps, I also got better. And yeah, I always enjoyed climbing and training.

So that was kind of what kept me on the comp climbing. How old were you when you started doing competitions? I think I was about like six or seven years old. Oh, that's super young. Wow. Yeah. And then those were more fun comps. Then from the age 10 on, I started to compete in like the Bavarian scene and then on the national scene and yeah, then also some international comps. Do you remember like, did you feel pressure when you were doing even like the fun competitions or?

No, I think there was never a lot of pressure on me also. My parents never told me to get like any specific results and I was always happy when I got, for example, into finals because I was always kind of a person who wanted to be on the big stage and I really enjoyed, for example, the presentation for finals. So that was kind of my goal to be like in the spotlight, but I never put me under pressure to get like completely specific results during like the early start of my career.

And of course, from time to time and from, yeah, also with better results, the pressure got bigger and a lot of people also kind of put pressure on me, but I always try to like stay in my bubble and still enjoy the training and climbing process more than just putting myself under pressure to get good results. And since you started so early, did your parents also climb? Yeah. So my parents also climb and that's why they took me to the rock. Just outdoor? Did they also compete and stuff too?

No, no. They just climbed for fun and still do it for fun. And my brother is also still climbing, but no comps. Do you feel like you're generally a very competitive person? Is that why or what like draws you specifically to competing? Yeah, for sure. I'm a very like, I'm a competitive person and also compare myself to a lot of other people also in like other areas, not just in climbing. And I also always strive to like get the best version out of me.

Yeah. So you're definitely one of like the younger athletes that I've interviewed so far and you're still competing in the youth circuit right now? Last year I still competed in the youth circuit, also climbed on Youth Worlds, but in this season I won't be competing in the youths anymore. I'm too old. Okay, yeah, I guess you're just on the cusp of aging out of it. So like last year you were still competing in the youth circuit, but you were also doing the senior circuit as well.

Why did you decide to compete in both? It doesn't seem like a lot of people do that. They kind of just like graduate from one to the other and then they don't go back to youth. It was not really like a decision I made. It just came like that. I also competed in World Cups already, I think three years ago. But at that time I don't know, placed 16th or yeah, just not near the semis. And then like over the last two years I competed on some World Cups, but just on the ones here in Europe.

And yeah, then just last year I started to climb more on the World Cups and in the senior scene because I got stronger and saw that there's potential that I could climb into semis or even finals. And that's why the German coaches decided that I can start on World Cups as well. As well as in the youth scene. But they still wanted you to participate in the youth competitions? No, I wanted to compete in the youth competitions.

I also just won European Cup and the Youth World Championships because I wanted to compete in my last Youth World Championships. That was just my decision because I wanted to go there. Like the location specifically or did you want to, like were you hoping for a specific result? Yeah, I was definitely hoping for a specific result. And yeah, my chances were also very good.

And I feel like in the youth circuit, I mean, I know all the girls who climb there and yeah, it was just a nice comp, I would say. And also a comp where I could just kind of enjoy climbing. Yeah, how did it end up going? Was it a good time? Was it everything you hoped for your last Youth World Championships? Unfortunately not. I messed up lead climbing in semifinals because just of a stupid mistake. And in bouldering, I was feeling strong until finals and then in finals, I felt super weak.

And after the third problem, I just couldn't get something out of my body anymore. And then I placed third. So it was a good result and I wanted to have a medal, but it was not the color of the medal I was aiming for. Sure. I mean, yeah, that's not bad at all though. In terms of, is there like monetary prizes for the youth circuit as well? No, no, no. So it's just for bragging rights.

And so then how does the youth circuit compare to the senior circuit? Do you feel like the competition is just as strong in youth or is it easier? So of course the setting is kind of different. Often in the youth circuit, the boulders are set differently than in the world cup circuit. Can you sort of articulate what the differences are? I don't know. It's just kind of a different style sometimes.

And in the bouldering world cup, for example, the qualification, the boulders are often kind of straight ups because of the like not that much space. And in the youth circuit, often they are more like coordination boulders or yeah, a bit more variety maybe. And last year I didn't have that much crush on the youth circuit because I knew that I was one of the stronger girls. So it was maybe a bit easier for me, for example, to win.

But of course there are also more expectations when you're kind of the strongest. So the people also expected from me that I would win. And when I'm going to a world cup, the people more likely don't expect me to win the world cup. Of course, I'm also aiming for a very good result on a world cup and want to climb into finals. But if I miss finals or even the semifinals, not everybody will look at me and say, what did you do?

Because I'm still young enough and there will still be a lot of chances for me in the world cup scene.

Yeah, you also did a couple of senior comps in 2023. But the results were definitely not as good as your 2024 season. What do you feel like changed for you between those two years? That's an interesting question because I don't really know. So of course, I graduated in 2023 and then I kind of had more free time and more time to train. And the time I had, I think I trained a lot. So from 2003 to 2024, I started to make more double sessions.

And I don't know, I think I kind of doubled my training pencil. And I think that was one of the main reasons why I just got stronger. Yeah, and I really, really tried hard because I knew that when I give everything in that year, I can also get very far. And then I already saw at the nomination comps that I'm like one of the stronger girls. We also had some simulations with the Slovenians and the Austrians. And I was kind of shocked because I saw, oh my gosh, I can really, I can climb very good.

And then when the first World Cup came up in China, my only goal was to make my first World Cup top. And yeah, then I did my first World Cup top and then I told myself I want to get into my first semifinal and then I was super happy to get into my first semifinal. And yeah, I think this comp kind of showed me that I really grew into that World Cup scene. Like from over the years, I gained more experience.

And yeah, in the last year, I could kind of show that I'm already having some experience and because of the training, I got stronger and then I could also just bring it to the wall. Yeah. Was your first semis also in China, like where you got the first top? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Awesome.

So you like greatly exceeded your expectations for that competition. I guess after that moment, did you kind of feel like pressure start to come in now that you've kind of exceeded your expectations and you want to recreate that kind of moment? Yeah. After China, I definitely get a lot of pressure because I kind of saw what was possible and that it could even be possible to climb into finals. And then I thought I also have to climb into semis in Salt Lake.

And then I kind of got sick in Salt Lake and nothing really worked out. And it was just not my comp. And then I placed I think 24th or 25th, 5th, I'm not sure, but I was out of semis and it was very, very hard for me. But then I kind of told myself, okay, it's a world cup. It's not just small competition where you just climb into semis like easy peasy. I mean, if you're also sick, like... Yeah, yeah, for sure.

And then the pressure kind of fell off because then I saw, okay, you can climb into semis, but you don't have to get into semis. It's the goal, but it's not kind of my duty. And then in Innsbruck, I could just climb how I wanted and yeah, was completely free in my mind. And I think I had the best mindset I ever had in my whole comp career in Innsbruck because I didn't have to overthink anything.

I was just warming up before a normal training session and told my coach I just want to have fun in the mats and that was also what I did. Yeah, I think you mentioned that that was maybe the best moment of your climbing career so far. Yeah. Did you say that you flashed all the quali boulders in Innsbruck? Yeah. I flashed all of them and I looked at my coach and was like, am I dreaming or what is going wrong here? Yeah. What was your coach's reaction? I don't know.

I think they just looked at me and were screaming and were the happiest people ever. Yeah. I think they were also kind of speechless. Yeah. No, that's super awesome. I can't even imagine how that would feel. I guess how does it feel going out into summies as the last person going out? Weird. Very weird. I think the weirdest part was that I was climbing next to Janja and she's one of my role models and yeah, complete idol.

And I couldn't really concentrate on myself because of course the crowd was behind Janja and not really behind me. But it also kind of hyped me up because it was very loud and it was also very loud for me and that was kind of pushing me and yeah, it felt good. And it was not really putting me under pressure that I was the last person going out because I knew that I won't flash every boulder in semis.

So it was, yeah, I still just enjoyed it and enjoyed climbing in semis because that was my goal and I already, yeah, achieved it. Awesome. Yeah. So would you want to be in that position again or would you prefer a different, I guess, starting list in semis? I know some people prefer to go out sooner or later. I think it doesn't really matter for me. In Prague, I was kind of starting, I think, in the middle into semis and it also felt good.

So in China, I started as the first person, in Innsbruck as the last person and in Prague as the middle person and everything was good. Okay. So it doesn't matter for me. Awesome. Okay. Just having a good time climbing. You also mentioned that you feel like a lot of young guns are breaking through the comp

scene right now. Do you feel like, is there something about youth climbers you feel are better suited for the World Cups right now? Is it just a style thing or is it an age thing, do you think? I don't know.

I think at the first World Cups, maybe the youth climbers can be kind of more chilled because when you're climbing, for example, on your first World Cup, not everybody is looking at you and you can be a bit more relaxed in your mind and that's maybe sometimes helping you because with expectations, the pressure is also rising and then it's sometimes harder to get you climbing to the wall. And for sure, I think the youth scene is also very strong.

So there are a lot of strong people climbing and yeah, maybe also the style from the World Cups, which is often very new school. I think a lot of the younger climbers and youth climbers trained this new school style from a very early age on. So I did double dinos also already five years ago and I think a lot of the older athletes sometimes struggle with dynamic boulders or very coordinated boulders because they didn't do it in the early age.

Yeah, I've also heard some people say that they're kind of like bringing back power boulders or like maybe old school like crimp moves. How do you feel on those growing up like doing all the dynamic stuff? I like both. So I also really like old school boulders. I mean, I started on the rock and rock climbing for me is also kind of an old school climbing.

So I really like both styles and I feel like the mixture of like new school boulders and old school boulders would be perfect when you're having like one very hard and powerful old school boulder but also maybe a fun coordinated jump. Yeah. Okay, sounds like you're an all-arounder then. Okay, so then let's get into what it's like on Team Germany.

I think you're like the first German athlete that I've interviewed. So yeah, you mentioned like training camps and like a national training center. Do you guys generally train together as a team? Please excuse this brief intermission but if you're interested in deleted scenes from this episode where we talk about her preferred boulder style and her training routine, do consider helping support this podcast on Patreon.

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Yeah, so the German national team is having its training center here in Munich-Türkirchen and they're also group trainings and sometimes training camps and special setting but I'm also still training with the Bavarian squad in Augsburg which is also kind of a regional training center and there are also very good training facilities especially for leap climbing and that's why I'm training with the Bavarians and also with the adults from the German team

and yeah there are also still some people who live in Cologne and training there but that's kind of a different group. So is it like your five days a week, is that with the whole team or is it a lot of that like by yourself too?

So it's a mixture on Tuesday and on Thursday I'm training with the Bavarian team and on Monday I'm training with the adult German team and the other days they are very like sometimes I'm training alone, sometimes I'm training with some people here in the gyms and some friends I just know from climbing so that really depends on what my mood is and what my session will look like.

And then in terms of like training with the German team, is there anyone on the team you really look up to or you feel like you have either like a really similar style to or really different style to that really helps with your training as well? So I think I have kind of a similar style maybe to Hannah Meier but we are not often training together because she's living in Cologne and I'm living in Munich and that makes it sometimes a bit harder to train together.

But I feel like in our German team we're all very have very different styles but yeah and maybe Lucia we also kind of maybe having more or less similar style. Yeah I mean I guess there are also a lot of like strong women on the team. I guess how's the dynamic there like do you feel very competitive against them or is it more like a friendly vibe?

So in training it's friendly-wide because we train together and we all know each other and also I think we all want to kind of get the best out of ourselves but also want to support the others. But of course we are having nomination comps and we are more girls than we have spots and yeah then on the nomination comes we for sure are competitive and everybody wants to have a spot and yeah then in the comp we're yeah of course comparing each other. But I think that's also very normal.

But after the comp and before the comp we are all very good friends and yeah. Just not during.

Also support each other. And you mentioned that you recently finished taking tests to get the sports soldier I guess what would you call it? Position role like nomination? So it's kind of the support program from yeah the German military and it's supporting us like some special athletes so they are not a lot of spots. I'm also currently the only girl which is supported by the military.

It's a very good support system and it's giving me a lot of time for training and also I can be financial independent and yeah it's a very very good program for me and I'm very happy to be supported by the German military. Like with the tests that you have to take for it like what does that entail? We have to be on a specific kind of team so there's the national team but there's also the Olympic team and the perspective team I don't know.

And I had to be in this specific team and need to have a chance to get to the Olympic Games and a perspective to get better in the next years. So they have like specific requirements I guess based on like your results? No they're not like specific requirements but you need to be good over a lot of years and otherwise you will be kicked out. Oh yeah okay. Does it manage to like support you full time or do you also have to take on like other jobs at a gym or anything like that?

No no they're supporting me full time. Of course I won't be getting rich but yeah it's enough to live. Do you have any like plans of school or other work in the future? Yeah. No no I would like to study and thinking about psychology or maybe also get a teacher. But I'm still deciding I'm not sure.

In terms of like timelines since you do spend a lot of time training is that something you would want to push off until after maybe you're like done with your climbing career or is it something that you kind of have to like do at the same time?

I think maybe I will start studying like next year or in two years also to kind of get something next to climbing because when you're always concentrating only on one thing it will also yeah kind of be stressful maybe and I think having something besides climbing could also help me from time to time. But of course I will still do climbing as my full time.

Yeah okay that makes sense. How are you feeling for like the upcoming 2025 season? I'm really looking forward to the 2025 season and yeah I'm already very very excited. Of course I have a bit more pressure than I had last year at this time because I know that there are more people who expect something from me but I think I'm currently very very good also mentally and also training wise I'm on the right way and feeling strong.

So yeah I feel like I'm ready and also ready maybe to get better results than last year and yeah I'm excited. Do you have any like specific goals for the season or any world cups that you're particularly excited for? I would really really like to get into my first final on the world cup because it was so so close on two comps last year to get into the world cup final. Yeah you had like some eighth places right?

Yeah I had two eighth places because of one try so I would be very happy if that goal could be achieved and I'm also looking forward to the world cup in Brazil because I've never been to Brazil and I feel like that's very it sounds very exciting a world cup in Brazil and apart from the bouldering world cup scene I'm hoping to get some spots on the lead world

cup scene next year to get some experience in lead climbing because I really yeah also like to climb on the rope and yeah that would be great if that could work out next year to climb on both disciplines. Yeah I guess that's like kind of surprising to hear because I feel like a lot of people would prefer to just do one or the other and they kind of only did both because they had to for like the combined format.

If they like get rid of the combined format and separate out boulder and lead would you still want to do both? Yeah I would still like to do both because I can't decide what discipline I prefer but I think in April it will be decided if in LA it will be a combined format or separated so yeah I think then maybe I still have to decide but we will see. Well I mean you could still do both and be great at both but it's good to know that it's in April I didn't hear a date about that.

I'm not completely sure but I thought in April. I'll have to keep an eye out. Is it like do you know if like your coaches are going to kind of try to force you to pick one or the other so that you have like a better chance or will you be able to continue doing both? I think I would still be able to do both but maybe not like I think I would have to maybe stop competing in one discipline because doing both disciplines all World Cups is too much.

That's yeah too many comps but I still feel like when I'm training lead I'm also getting better in bouldering so I don't feel like I'm stopping one discipline completely which helped me. I think I still need to like to train both disciplines to get stronger. Yeah I would be really interested to see if they break it out who ends up competing in both and if they're successful in doing trying to do both at the same time.

Yeah I'd be really interested to see that but yeah earlier you mentioned that you are just doing like climbing and training full time now but it is nice to like have something

on the side to not always be focused on the same thing. I mean I guess right now you are always focused on climbing. Is there anything else that you're doing outside of climbing right now that you like do to take your mind off of it? Yeah for sure there of course when I'm having a rest day I'm doing a lot of other things.

I really like to be creative and I'm sewing a lot so and sewing clothes and yeah I'm also often baking or cooking or yeah I think I'm having a lot of different hobbies which I'm doing yeah and I also like when I'm for example having some time where I'm not climbing for example in my season break I really really like to just go to the mountains and be outside do other things than just climbing. I'm also sometimes doing downhilling or other sports. Wait what is downhilling? Like with a bike.

Oh okay like mountain biking or is that different? Yeah yeah no it's kind of mountain biking but you're going up the hill with the lift and then just driving down. Okay okay so just the thrill part. Yeah just the fun part. Or in winter I'm going skiing often also sometimes on the weekend or yeah. That sounds good. Something I don't hear about too often is there like anything that you've made recently that you would want to show? Oh yeah I have two things here. Oh perfect.

I put this one here and this little shirt. It looks really tiny. Yeah it's also for a baby. Oh okay okay it's hard to tell because when we're recording the quality is not very good. I think it'll be better once it's downloaded but okay. I couldn't tell if that was like supposed to be for you and it was just like a really tight shirt. No. Okay awesome. Is that like for like a family member or like?

Oh we will see we will see no. I'm just just doing stuff and then I'm giving it away to other people when I see them. Yeah what's your like favorite thing to sew? I don't know. I do everything. How long have you been doing it for? I think my grandma showed me how to sew so I think I was five years old or something like that. Glad that you have something else to take your mind off of climbing.

Were you gonna say something else about the sewing earlier? Sometimes when I'm also like not training for for comps I'm also sometimes just going on the rock so I'm still trying to find some time to go rock climbing especially in the off season. Yeah are there like any projects that you're working on? Currently not specifically.

Also just climbing on a rope outside so I'm not really I'm doing bouldering outside just rope climbing but I still have an open project in Niciapek in Slovenia and one at Hotachberg it's in in Kempten here in the Varia. It's not very well known I don't know. Okay that's something you're working on.

Well I think those are all the questions I had so we can move on to some of the discord questions and Instagram questions that came through. The first one what do you find to be the hardest part of being an athlete?

So I really enjoy being an athlete so I feel like it's not super hard for me to be an athlete but of course there are some things you also struggle as an athlete so it's of course there are times where I'm not motivated to go climbing but yeah it's still kind of my duty and I yeah I always try to go climbing still and always giving your everything and trying to get the best version out of yourself is also not always easy and of course there are sometimes

yeah weeks or months where nothing is going in the right direction and you kind of get weaker and weaker and don't really know what is going wrong and those times are of course hard where you don't really understand why nothing's working out but I'm very glad that those times are not that often. How do you get out of those slumps I guess or have you ever figured out afterwards like why something was going wrong for a long time?

Often it's just for example when I'm over training so maybe doing too much and then yeah maybe one rest day or two are helpful and then often the things are also again going in the right direction and I'm very happy that I have never been injured but I think that's also kind of a very bad part for an athlete and hard part to be injured and when you're not able to do the thing you're normally doing every day and thinking about in every second but I'm happy that I'm injury free.

Yeah definitely and I hope you do stay that way. Then another hard part sometimes with being an athlete is of course being under pressure all the time and also the traveling for me sometimes so being away from home sometimes really for months and living out of the suitcase and being in hotels it's sometimes not that easy and sometimes you just want to lie in your own bed. Yeah that makes sense. I guess what do you find to be like the most difficult part about traveling?

For me it's flying and going in the airplane. I don't really like to fly. Oh really? Yeah. You like it scared of planes or? I don't know I just don't really like it I also don't like to be at the airport it's just not my favorite part. And just being for such a long time away from home and often sometimes being in a country where you don't really enjoy being and sometimes you're not in a beautiful city or in a nice hotel sometimes it's just not super nice it's not like vacation.

You still have to kind of prepare yourself for the camp and often you also don't really see much of the place you're going. It's very often just going there maybe going to one of the gyms near the hotel and being at the venue. Yeah I guess like do you feel like you don't really get a chance to travel because the competition is on your mind or you just like really don't have the time?

Sometimes you really don't have the time and sometimes of course you're also just too concentrated on the camp but I also always try to kind of experience as much as possible from the city and from the people there because that also kind of helps you to not overthink the competition sometimes seeing maybe something of the city or just maybe strolling and I don't know going to this grocery store or something like that it's sometimes also very

helpful to not just think about the camp on the next day or. Yeah that makes sense. I feel like I would kind of get stuck in the mindset of like okay I'm here I'm not allowed to do anything else except for think about the competition. Okay so next question I don't know if this one is like very specific to you or if this

person just wants like to know in general so let me know if you feel like you have like a specific I don't know expertise in this but the question is just tips on improving arm strength. I also don't know if it's specific for me. Do you feel like that's like a big strength of yours or? Yeah I think it's one of my main strengths so I think I have stronger arms than legs and I also really like to train arms.

What I'm doing in training is pull ups so weighted pull ups and I'm doing a lot of campers thing so campers thing on the campus part but also on the spray wall and that's also one of my favorite parts of training sometimes because I really like to just yeah campers and boulders and swing around on the spray wall and I feel like that's also very

very very helpful to gain muscle strength. Perfect and easy. Okay next question curious about this too where can I buy the Germany down jacket? It does look very comfortable. No I don't know. Is it comfy? It looks amazing. I don't think I've seen any other team jackets that look as puffy and comfortable as the German one. Yeah I really like our German team clothes and also the down jacket but I'm not sure if it's available for sale and I think it's not it's not buyable but I'm also I don't know.

Yeah it looks super comfy. I wish I had it. Okay another quick question so we did go over your like goals for the next climbing season do you have any like non-climbing related goals?

Maybe get time to go on vacation without climbing because that's like one thing I didn't do now for a lot of years all of my vacations were always going somewhere and training there or going on the rock there or it was always kind of climbing related and I think next year I would like to do one vacation without climbing that would be very cool. Where would you want to go? I haven't thought about it but maybe something like Sweden or Norway.

I feel like those might be locations where you would still want to climb a bit. You might be like a beach or something that just doesn't have like the option to climb. Yeah we will see but otherwise I don't know I don't have any specific goals just have a good year.

Yeah I feel like your best bet is maybe going to like a resort where you just like stay on the resort and you don't have to think about anything and then probably won't think about climbing either because they don't have climbing at the resort. Something nice in like I don't know Thailand or like Mexico or something like that. Would be also nice yeah for sure. Okay last question hopefully you might be like hopefully you're comfortable speaking

on this. What are your thoughts about the minimum BMI requirement? This person mentioned that there are former top German athletes who stopped competing due to the stress of weight loss. So I feel like it's very good that there are BMI regulations and I'm also very happy that they are stricter now and that the IFSC is trying to get like yeah this problem we are having in the climbing community yeah can solve the problem.

I still feel like especially in the youth circuit there are not enough regulations because it's not like in the World Cups that there are a lot of testing and rules about the BMI but I feel like it's already a good step in the right direction that there are those tests on the World Cups but maybe the rules should be stricter and yeah there should be a bit more yeah problem solving.

I don't really know about how there have been other German people having problems with the BMI tests but I know that the DAV so our federation is doing a lot against eating disorders and also we are having stricter BMI rules here in Germany than the IFSC so we need to have a higher BMI than the IFSC is having requiring. And also at our training camps and national comps there are also a lot of tests. Yeah I didn't know that there was no requirements or like restrictions for youth athletes though.

The only restrictions we had was at Youth World there were some tests but they were also very randomly and not everybody was tested and also when the people have been under the BMI rules they were not really kind of stopped from competing. It was just tests but there was not really somebody doing with and doing something with this result. It was just a random test and then it was over. Is it like a warning or? Yeah I don't know.

I think it would be very very important to do something in the youth circuit because that's where the eating disorders are most often starting. It's not starting when you're 25 it's starting when you're younger and yeah that's why I think they should start with the BMI rules or also other rules in the youth. Did you ever feel like pressured when you were in the youth circuit to eat a certain way?

So as I said in Germany there is kind of a very good support system and that's why I didn't really struggle with that. And so that started in youth as well? Yeah so at least for me I don't know how it's working for the other German athletes but

I was supported very good. Yeah that's good to hear. Okay awesome well I think that is all the questions that I had then. Is there anything like last minute you wanted to talk about or like words of wisdom you want to share? I really know. Okay yeah no worries. I think it was a very good talk. Okay great awesome. Do you want to let people know where they can find you? Yeah so I'm on Instagram on the apple move 050.

Great okay well thank you so much for joining me today and it was great to talk to you. Thank you for inviting me. Thank you so much for making it to the end of the podcast. Don't forget to like and subscribe if you enjoyed otherwise you are a super fake climber. If you're listening on a podcasting platform I'd appreciate if you rate it five stars and you can continue the discussion on the free competition climbing discord linked in the description. Thanks again for listening.