Tunnel Blind w/ Allison Elaine

Hi guys, it is post election. Kara here to just give you a little note that we recorded this episode before the election. Obviously we were in the time machine and so it does not reflect our feelings tonally of how things went.

That's it.

Of the Law and Order franchises, SVU is considered especially watchable.

We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the vicious felonies.

These episodes are based on. These are our stories.

Done done, yay.

Another episode of that Smessed Up an Sview podcast.

My name is Lisa, my name is Kara, and you know we talk about an sview episode, a true crime, and we interview somebody from the episode. But first we chat, we catch up. We've been doing things, but you've been busy. What's been going on?

Well?

I do have uh, well, I have a lot of Halloween stuff I guess written out okay, I thought.

But.

Well, and we you know, we wanted to give a shout out to everyone that wore costumes came to our live show. It was fun. I guess we'll start there. Loved it. That was like a dream. In San Francisco. Someone was like a moving Scott fully killing.

A woman with a hammer.

In a TV screen with a DVD player and then with Casey Novak and the or no Sonya Paxton and the DVD.

Yeah, it was amazing. We had mixing up the wigs. In my mind, we had an Amelia Chase in San Diego, which was Diane's character.

We just covered that episode recently. We had it. It had like in la it.

Had like makeup on on the rope and the rope burn from her sexual sadism exactly detail Sokky Little Murderer.

Yeah, it was amazing. And then and in Denver a couple of people were us like it was.

It was.

It was really cute. I've that's never happened to me before anyone stressed up as me for Halloween. So I really loved that.

No, I loved it, and I thought there'd be more Chimp Crazy costumes out in the wild. But what I noticed is the top costumes in terms of my feed, what I've been seeing is ray Gun the breakdancer from Australia, and a lot of Lana del Rey and an alligator guy.

See.

I saw at least two or three amazing chimp Lady Chimp Crazy.

Cos I just thought there'd be more. I did see a few. I did love them. I just thought there it would be chimp crazy all over town and it wasn't. But I guess Lebron just wore the scream mask. And someone wrote that he just keeps being such millennial, and I really enjoyed that kind of post. I do want to tell you my vibe at the moment, if I have to be honest. I finished, so I landed from a flight, and then my place. You know how you're

I'm glad you liked it. Wow.

I liked it. But it was scary. But it's right up our app well. I mean, yeah, I'm shocked that you watched. Honest, you can watch the substance if you could watch Barbarians.

I know that much.

It in a movie where Jared came home and I go tell me what happens, like I go, tell me the whole plot, and he walked me through the whole movie like ruined style, and I so I know what happens, but I obviously can't watch it. But then I also since I last saw you went to the Ruined live show in LA that was the Substance, So I do know what happens in the Substance, and I have questions, Okay, I like this all right, but I don't know isick are we going to ruin it?

If I ask, well, people can fast forward. You can fast forward thirty seconds at a time, or word fast forward fast forward. But I went to if you don't know Ruined.

It's a podcast that like our friends, we've shouted it out on this podcast before. It's like Halle Keefer and Alison Liby. Halle does the research and like reads everything, watches the movie and recaps the entire thing for Alison, who's like the me and too scaredy cat to watch a horror movie.

So I went to go to the live show of the Substance. It was really fun.

They had like funny little slides and I guess, like what I don't understand? And I was with my friend, and I was also talking to this with Alison afterwards, like I don't get why Demean Moore takes it, like in like what is she.

Getting out of it?

Like if it was if if yeah, if Margaret Qually was young to me more and it was like, oh, she just like a younger version of herself was born to like carry on her legacy so she can keep being famous. I would almost understand that, But Sue's her own person, so I'm kind of not understanding what Deman was getting out of it because it seems like she spent seven days eating.

And being miserable, so she wouldn't because her big thing is like she wants fame and attention and needs the validation of the people around her, so like she can't go into secret. The whole thing with death becomes her is then you have to disappear, Like she can't just pop out as a younger version of herself, right continue. But also I think it's a twisted thing and she didn't know exactly what was going to happen going into it. It's like, right, you're a per you know, and then

I think she didn't. She didn't want to be seen.

Like yeah, made herself so gross for just the feeling of because she is they are one one or the other, like part of the substance, like the saying that makes you behave is like you need to treat both parts correct. It's seven days on, seven days off, but like you are one and one without the other. So that's why you can't do less or more time. But it's so addictive that the young one is always doing too right.

I guess I was.

I'm using and using and using the olds, and again it's like I didn't see it. It was explains me, So I don't know. But like I guess I wasn't understanding that they were like adjoined consciousness as much.

I just thought they were like separate people. And I'm not like she getting out of it because when she wakes up, it's like she doesn't know what like they're gonna wake up to.

Because like the nurse that goes, you're a perfect candidate, like why why are why are you spreading the substance?

Why like, what's the point. Well, that's what's fucked.

But because I was thinking about that, and what I kind of uh figured out is he doesn't say this is great. He said this changed my life and it did change his life. But it's a little evil. Yeah, And then I saw there a theory that like he's in charge, but it's evil. I mean that scene in the coffee shop is groundbreaking, like it is so cool to see that's that, but like.

The eyes right like she yeah, yeah, wow, maybe I don't know. Once it was described to me, I was like this, I think I don't think I could see it because it seemed like so goryous.

Yeah, I guess yeah, answering the questions, I don't know if that was satisfying to you. Still not have seen it, but it like did it made sense watching it to me?

Yeah? I think that's the thing.

I think it would make more sense watching it because like Allison was described it too, and she was also kind of like, yeah, I don't really know why she's doing it, and like why this guy is like is like out there telling people also to do it because he's not even his young guy becomes a male nurse.

He doesn't even get to be like a celebrity. That's like running a.

You know, like yes, but I feel so yeah, but I don't know, Yeah, I don't know.

Yeah, anyway, that was fun. It was fun though.

It was fun to go to that and see a little a little I mean, nursing can be his passion. Sure, I just didn't really get why he was spreading the word why are you proselytizing the old substance?

It's fucked up. It's crazy, it is a fucked up thing. And yeah, saying the time, maybe he wasn't being as abused, but he probably knew it's really it's really cool. But Barbarian just pretty much shocked me. I was so scared. I deposit a few times and put on drag Race and I was just like walking. I was like hanging up dresses coming back being terrified. But it's like so many twists and turns. I would say, it kept not

She was like, you, I've never thought that was weird.

I go no, we just accepted it, like I never it was Odafin Tutuola.

And that was that, Like it is so funky.

It's a fine They Yeah, they do talk about his last name at some point, like I think it's Nigerian or something, because someone else recognizes his last name and is like.

Oh yeah, at some point I remember that.

Yeah, But like that is wild for nobody to have, like ever seen a nice tea meme or like anything. I feel like he's out there. We know him from this show. Even if you were casual. You've seen two episodes. You know, iced teas in it.

You know, some people are just like not watching procedurals at all. I don't know. It's like, but I know things I don't know I have.

Yeah, it was shocking, but then I was shocked that I had never questioned it. But I also so, I was in Houston this weekend doing shows. Thanks to everyone that came, but it was so wild. So the first show through crowd work or threw a joke and then it happened in real life at the show. But someone did have an orgy the night before, and I did see photos of.

The orgy at photos.

Yeah, But then later I said to someone gay, I was like, yeah, I was like a ten person orgy, and they're like, oh, that's it, and then when I told a straight person, they were like ten people and it was like it happened within hours of each other.

So it was pretty exciting.

Then the early show Saturday, a giant man started screaming and fighting in the middle. Well, first he was moaning and then causing all these problems and he had to leave.

Like it was wild. He was so loud.

But I was like, I'll probably post that on the internet. I'll be honest, but it was a commotion. And then the last show there was a guy who was forty years sober and something happened. The sun pointed to the wrong thing and he did sip alcohol and he was upset.

Oh no, like a like a drink swap or something like something bad.

Yeah, well because I saw him walk out with the margarita shaker, like you know, a souvenir style cup, and so then I when he came back without it, I go, where'd your little shaker go? And he goes, I've been forty years sober and they gave me a shaker, and it's like, well you should have known with the shaker.

But it was fucked.

I did feel kind of sad for him, So that's like my Houston, Rundown. I am curious how the Halloween went in your neighborhood.

Oh my god, the costumes, that was the parades. Oh my god.

Well the parade was drama, but the why because of the pta, well not really like.

This like one dad popped off because like, okay, you went to it last year, right, Yeah, So this year was eight in the eight thirty in the morning, which is better because it's too hot, Like it was like by one thirty it's boiling hot. So the kids like go around the track class by class, and they were going around twice and it was taking forever. Like it was just like each class going around twice, and the parents were all like, we're all.

Joking to each other, going, Jesus Christ, this is going on twice. We're gonna be out of here. We're not never gonna be out of here.

We're all like we're all like laughing about it, like but like talking shit quiet under our breaths and like not not in a real way. And then this one dad was just like, well, I tried to go talk to the principle and she said this wasn't the time. And I was like, oh my god. I just started to walk away. I was like, this guy's too heated for me. And then he called a bunch of the parents cowards and pussies and walked away.

I wasn't, so he was mad that they walked twice too. He was mad that it was taking so long.

He thought it was incompetence, and he went to go talk to the Principle, and the principles in the middle of m seeing the event, she's not going to be like, okay, let me stop down and talk to you about how to change it. So she didn't, and he was furious. You know, I know this man and I know how he yets, so I just like walked away. Then I heard him say cowards and pussies and I went, oh my god. So then he had to leave. It was like the most dramatic Halloween.

Of all time.

Everybody's like, what the hell because he swore at the Principle. You went up to the Principle, it was like, we're gonna be here for fucking hours.

Like and like you can't. There's kids around, like it was crazy.

So then that was like we're all like chatting ab everyone's texting me all day about that.

Then the night was fun. Well, you know what I found out about. Not a school I know, but not a person I know. But I do now know of a person that is a teacher that got sent home because their costume was too slutty. Oh no, what costume we taught seventh grade and I guess it was like a sexy Cinderella or something like that. And she was like she was sent home. Wow, that's scott ating. Wow Okay,

Like it was kind of Oscar's first year of like he trick or treated last year, but this year he was like so into it and like really got it. And they stayed up late. They got a lot of candy. They loved it. It was great. There was like one fireman. No, like, I didn't go to this one house because it was like up a big hill and the kids were all

That was it in terms of trauma.

But yeah, oh I bought something online and then someone that worked at the club in Houston did this. It's an idea to do with your Halloween candy. You chop it all up and then you bake Halloween cookies with the chocolate.

You have in the candy.

Oh and this bit like everything melts. You have like the TwixT caramel in this cookie, a Snickers and Monette.

I mean, it was so good. The Internet's magical.

We just went through it last night and took out all the like sour too chewy like stuff that they don't want, so I'll be giving that away probably on the buy nothing group. And then and then there's so much like I don't I got to give some of it away. It's like it's so much fucking candy. It's gonna last theme for like two years. But they got They just went to ice skating today and got more candy. It's like November third, like we got a the candy train has to stop.

Well now it's a sale, so it's kind of a thrill, right right. But we had a blast. It was fun.

It was a fun little Halloween. I was gonna go see our friend, but I didn't want to drive. I stayed in our neighborhood and it was great. We never got in a car.

It was nice.

Yeah, go to did go to her old house. Did go to her old house where we spent a lot of time in the pandemic. But because my new my other friend lives there now, so I did spend some time there on Halloween, which was wild.

But uh yeah.

I also want to give a shout out to Jason Kelsey defending his family.

Have you seen this? No? No, no, tell me what happened.

So they're in I guess they're in Pens at Penn State, and they're known as being dicks, but some students and hoodies. He had his phone out and was just like taunting Jason and then finally said, how does it feel that your brother is a F word? Because he's dating Taylor Swift and so Jason, while holding like a twelve pack of beer and then an open beer as well on top of it, just went over, slammed his phone on the ground, picked it up, and walked off. And it was cool and I watched it.

Oh wait, now I'm like I saw that really quickly, like scroll by me on Instagram and was like, I'm sure Leasa will fill me in, but like, what are people but to fuck with someone that's that physically strong is also just so weird you think you're.

Just like I don't know. Oh my god, I keep thinking about Barbarian and just so long.

Was so good.

It was all so good and smart and amazing and I can't believe it.

And our friend kurb Brown.

Oler, isn't it. Yes, Oh my god, that was so exciting. I should message him. That was like a thrill. He's so funny. Oh my god, that was so cool that. Yeah, I forgot spooky, spooky. Smart men are so bad. I just like subtle, obvious. They just handled the difference between men and women so smart.

It's so good.

Now that I know the full peak of horror, I can maybe watch it again more relaxed, but maybe it's like it follows and I can never watch it again.

Like I don't know.

Who's to say, but all right, well guys, oh oh yeah, it started right, yeah, And I mean, okay, people are so thoughtful on the road and everywhere we go, and we do have to shout out that we in Portland each got a box of treasures that was like myself personalized and cool, and all the magnets are on my fridge.

They're there. So I just wanted to.

Say, every magnet for my little movie, Yeah, all the film personal This person made us a gift box of like every movie we've mentioned on the podcast. Like I have a magnet of the movie Stella that I just talked about with Bette Midler that's like a huge part of my life with my sister her that it's not a popular movie, and now I have a magnet of it, The Chipmunk Adventure, Fucking Clifford, the movie where where Martin Short is like a creepy little kid, Like so many

I mean, it's just it was so top tier, incredible and specific.

It would be an amazing business to be like here from how do you specific?

And then you source it like yeah, I don't know, like just because I don't have the time to Like.

She also but she also has the skill of like listening and connecting and doing not everyone's brains work.

Like that too.

Yes, absolutely, you might someone someone's favorite stuff and they might not know, right, but.

Huge shout out, huge shout out. And I met a.

Really cutie couple in Houston, Sabrina Kale, what's up?

A lot of people listen. It's like, who do I choose?

You know?

But yeah, it was fun.

It was so fun to see all of you guys on our dates and keep and go to Lisa's go to That's Messed Up live dot com and scroll down to Lisa's website and that takes you to her links of all the shows she's doing for the rest of the year and probably into the fall. And uh yeah, you can also on that same website you can see our promo codes.

You can buy merch.

Oh I should announce we've got a Christmas ornament in the shop. Everybody in the shops ornament in the shop. So get over there and get your little hope you have a messed up holiday. Hope your holidays are messed up. Christmas ornament from us, it will be will look like holiday, your Christmas tree wherever. All right, let's get started. We've got a good one for you.

Okay, we are doing tunnel Blind, season twenty five, Episode one. Okay, cool, cool, cool. So we are in studios. That's exciting. Yeah, you have a full fat can of coke. I have a diet coke.

Cheers, our classic, our classic Yin and Yang.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, one of our biggest fights, I would say. Yes, you guys have heard her many times bring up that. Basically the worst thing I've ever done.

To her was ask I didn't know if you want to diet or regular, And truly just the biggest brain part of my life because.

I've never seen her drink a regular cocus. That was like so much of my personality. But we're in the studio, so that's really exciting. And I was peing and I was like, I don't even know what episode, Like, I know it's tunnel Blind, but it could be anything.

I was like, is it the air?

Like I was just like, I truly was sitting there, like there's a lot of episodes swirling around our heads, right, And then once I read season twenty five, episode one, I knew exactly where I was. Yeah, baby, it's the season premiere, milestone, quarter life crisis. Yeah, I think, a great time to be alive twenty five. Yeah, I had a great time in twenty five. I don't know what was going on, but I was loving it.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, So it's Benson through the years. It's a really kind of an ode to Benson, every hairdoo, every nice little outfit and inspiring voiceover that I'll be honest, I didn't really pay attention to you. I mean, she's just saying, there's these moments with the victims that make you realize why you do it. It's very yeah, brave, deaf. And then there's one in the professional hat outfit. And finally it's her in the final present moment and she's

And we cut to.

A store and it's a different cute family and they're getting along. They're walking past TV's kids suitcases. They're making jokes. The dad's on the car, the mom's holding her baby girl and by baby girl, I do mean a teen.

She's a teen but she is I don't know. She's texting on her pink phone.

She needs to get some paint, and we hear the dad go, you saw this right. Her and the dad go to the paints right, remember he didn't use it later and it's like it drives me insane.

Oh he's a fucking piece of shit.

Not really, but yeah, like okay, so anyways, it's just like classic. But so she goes, great, i'll meet you at the register. The mom goes off, the daughter and the dad go to the paints. Mom says, divide and conquer. So now we're back and the godfather is still trying to fuck Benson and she's.

Like no, and.

He won't leave her alone and he also it's not even fuck like he wants to marry her. Yeah, and she goes, you might as well put your heart in a wood chipper.

It's a while Benson moment.

Because I'm like, I don't really think of Benson as the kind of person that like choose people up and spits them out. I just feel like she can't focus on love because she's been in love with one person for a long time. Maybe, But also, yeah, it's not like when she was with Dean Winters. Why am I blanking on his fucking name on the show? You know, Mayhem Cassidy. When she was with Cassidy, it wasn't like she fucking took his how hard, un stopped on it.

He betrayed her with with I A b and her son and telling her what are you kidding?

He's a monster.

I know, but I'm just saying, like, but I love him and he is the hottest, and I think he's the one for her.

I just like, don't I don't get why she is saying, uh that she's this like man eater.

I don't know.

It's just like it was like it bothered me. I was like, give yourself a little fucking credit. You've just you're been busy saving fucking lives.

Yeah, but so Crasy goes over and goes, oh, you're talking to my cousin.

I love it, and she goes, shut the fuck up. I don't want to fuck your cousin. Oh so, Chrissy, are you a dumb look at this? This guy's just not Benson's type. Yeah, she needs like.

A chill, rich dude who's hot, Like, are we forgetting she's hot? Finn's there, Finn and Benson are having red wine. Chrisy's having a beer and Fann and this is so cute. He begs to hold the baby. He's in a gray plaid suit and I love him holding this baby, and Benson's like, okay, uncle. Finn and Chrisy and Rollins go off to have a private moment and they're having parent chats. They smile, they're kissing. The cousin still wants to talk to Benson. I mean I can't. He's like, what's that

And I think that's pretty fucked up. I think stayble dave it to her. He did.

It's just like so bad, and obviously I want to know the fourth letter.

It's literally the jewelry version of like live laugh Love written on driftwood in your Home, Joy Come Back.

But the thing is Benson wants Benson loves this. This is a thing. Yeah, like from Marishka. My sad thing is that her first date with her husband was at church. Yeah, that's always really hard for me. And then it's the you know she is a live laugh love girl.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, she's one of those live laugh love girl.

She's a copy. Oh she's shopping it like you know, and then like she's just I don't.

But then she knows La Perla, she knows like she's always like those Proda boots, Like doesn't she say you owe me another pair of Prada boots after the guy licks us to like lick her boots in that amazing scene. So Benson buys designer when she I think of Benson is probably having a very curated, small wardrobe where everything's like pretty expensive but it doesn't have a lot and yeah, like a capsule wardrobe.

Yeah yeah, but why do you think and then now go in to the fearless or is that Marishka I think you like, I don't think you have to have something to fall on because like because she doesn't have church, and like this is like Marishka's church, this like believe in yourself, compassion joy like, like because if she stopped to think about really what her life is like and every day she would not.

Be she would sink. You know, I didn't know, but I guess. I guess she needs.

Just what she sees day in and day out. I'm not saying her life is pathetic or anything. I'm just saying what she sees day in and day out, what she's gone through, like what she's personally been through, like held hostage multiple times, like you know, yeah, yeah, yeah.

She's wistful, she's looking for love.

She's watching Christie and Rollins make out at the register and mom and dad meet up. Maddie is not there, that is the daughter and the Dad's like I thought she went with you.

No, we saw it. We saw it. You're not gaslighting your way out of it.

Yes, we can rewind the you walked off with your fucking daughter to the paints. So he's on the phone casual. The mom is flipping out. She walks past the paints. There's a green residue broken glass on the floor. We cut to Noah and Benson driving from the baby shower and they.

Love the coreasy baby.

It's right out of the tunnel, and Noah keeps yammering on and I feel like you might relate to this life, but it's just like, shut the fuck up. They never stop. They never stop talking. They never stop talking. I seeyammer city and then sometimes I just have to go, We're just gonna have to have a quiet moment in the car.

We have to.

It's gonna be quiet for the next minute. And they don't listen to that either. It's a lot of chatting. I mean, you need to get a partition.

Like a limo driver.

He just just keeps talking. At the red light. Though she's staring at a.

Girl in a van.

She feels worried for her. She looks out of it. This girl she has a tailor swift beaded bracelet. We see from the distance or I just know this, okay. So she watches as a man drives in a big, colorful van, decorated people honking. Noah's asking for pizza. So we're back at the parents. They're fighting outside looking for the daughter. The dad's like, oh, maybe she just like left and took the quick ride and the mom's.

Like, why would that do that? Same? Why would she do this? Hop it an uber? Bye? What is? Oh you knew what a quick ride was? Yeah, that's what they call uber on this show.

I don't think I ever caught on to that, And I was like, what the fuck?

Yeah, it's like uber, But like that would be so insane. You're shopping with your parents and you just hop in an uber and say nothing. That would be the wildest move. Oh God.

So he's like, oh, I'll call her. She's like, yeah, no, I have you know the g and the GPS is turned off. The cops are on the way, and the dad's like you called the cops and it's like, will you just shut up?

All the GPS is turned off? Like that's an immediate Like what the fuck?

I mean? This dad? I hate him? So the yellow tape is up.

We have Octavia of Velesco and we're talking to workers Benson and Finner on the scene. Maddie Flynn, fifteen. She's been gone an hour. They did find a gun in the bathroom, not good, could be connected or a loose other gun. The parents were fighting, so they're separated. The mom is pleading with Benson, like please find my daughter, and the dad is de lulu. She's like, he's like, you know, I have a Metro card. Maybe she's just

Yeah, she wandered away from the store, got on the train like.

You guys were like if she was a one, But you guys are like a family that was hanging out, Like yeah, I don't know why she would.

Just peace out.

I feel like I didn't remember that they were separated. What do you mean, oh like up top?

Yeah? Oh the parents were Oh I'm sorry, I know, I know there was a yay.

Yeah.

Yeah, no, they were just like separated the store. I think they're gonna get divorced. Yes, there's absolutely Oh were they just on like let's do it for the kids shopping trip? Like my mind was like totally racing. Sorry I misunderstand. So the mom shows the photo to Benson and it hits Benson, like that is the girl she saw in the van earlier. This is awful And in my head, I'm like, after all these years, you're not gonna follow your gut.

And I get it.

We all like slip, we all do like the thing we don't do. We don't listen to our gut. But like it's so crazy, like you're right all the time, ninety percent solve rate, Like you knew something was up and if you, Noah would shut his fucking mouth.

She don't have to sell.

And she could have done a nice three point turn and fucking you know, I just I just don't know why we have to keep playing this game at season twenty five of like and I'm not gonna trust myself and I'm not going to go for it because.

I didn't want to be Yeah, I didn't want the job to like own my life, but girl, it does you need to follow your instincts. But at the same time, but she was with her kid, but she could have called it is guy, this guy kidnapped her, lets her sit in the front of the car when it's a van. Well obviously, but we know scale what's the drugs? It could be anything we know about Scapolopin. That's like, okay, it's Benson's mission now to find this girl. She feels guilty.

I'm like, yeah, everybody in this episode canuck scratch.

So they find her cell phone and the parents confirm, like, you know, that's her phone. So it's on the Brooklyn side of the battery tunnel is where we find it. Missus Flynn's so so sad. Kevin Kane, I don't know his character's name. He's the cop who won a lawsuit and now is rich but still a come no right Bruno, we don't talk about. Yeah, that's so good to be

What is this?

San Francisco does have like a like a bit of a crazy crime problem, like not crime, but like also like an unhoused problem and everything, And like the way San Francisco is, it's just like, you know, I hate to say it, in La like a lot of unhouse people are just shoved to a certain neighborhood, a certain area,

Crime than New York. It does.

But still if your focus is less crime, yeah, wouldn't you go to Palo Alto if you're living in Francisco. No, you don't want to be with those tech free You don't want to be with tech free city where you can do your work. But you're living in the burbs. I think the Chicago suburbs is where these people belong. Okay, this is where they belong. Yeah a suburban, no, or like a sub I don't know, Yeah, I don't know. I just it's like I want to find an analogy, and it's escaping me.

Really, they really moved out. They would have lived in Westchester or something.

They would live proxicity, like me moving from Iowa to Nebraska because I just wanted more space.

And it's like, what are you talking about?

They're like the same, Like, yeah, it just doesn't make sense to me. But it does kind of feel like a conservative things. People are always shitting on San Francisco because they like they want to shit on how the cities of California, the liberal state, are like falling apart.

That's fine, but leave us out of it.

Like, if you hate us, I have to get them to New York so they can interact with Benson. Like if you hate us and you hate the way we live and it's terrible living here, Like why are you mad about it?

Yeah? You know what I mean? Like cool, you want? Our lives are bad?

Leave us us alone, Leave us alone. But let's be honest. Cities are the way that like small communities can even survive.

Like that's where the money comes from, is the cities. Yeah.

I was literally reading a thing about the huge percentage of people that live with at least some part of government assistance, and it's almost it's a lot of people in rural areas where their cities pay for those rural areas.

Yeah.

Whatever, it's just a funny thing, and I'm curious this would make sense. Oh, we moved to New York for because it's great. I don't know, I don't know. It's just funny to me. Yeah, so she could go to painting school. It's just like, I love New York and I don't like I get it, but this is just silly to me.

They couldn't.

We have to get off of it. They couldn't just say yeah, that's the There's more. There's more notes about what the fuck is going on here with the San frand to New York move.

You can't.

Okay, the mom is a great actress. She's upset. She's screaming, you know what the hell are you even doing? All you did was find her phone, get to work, you losers, and.

You know it. Bensonce upset for sure.

She turned STI look at her husband, who's in the vending machine bricks and blind's room. And also there's a lost and found sign. So it's vending machines and lost and found and I've never seen this room before. So Finn and Alasko are with him. Could it be daughter's friends? No, they're all good kids. We don't really know anyone here. He sits on a couch and is like, fuck, I think that my wife thinks it's my fault, and maybe

Yeah?

Because he stopped to like watch the game on TV or something in the store, I don't know.

All I remember is the two of them walking to the paints like that my eyes so like yeah, but why are you thinking? Of course, the wife's pissed at you, like what are you talking about? So they're brainstorming dry erase board, work, chill room. There's no evidence of grooming older boyfriend. She seems really innocent. Finn Is like to Benson, you need to take a break, and she goes, if you say that again, we're gonna have a problem.

And I love feisty.

Fucking but he stares at her like a fish with his mouth open.

But he's not scared of her, but he's like damn.

So he says, you've had a long day because he is caring, you know, And she goes like I need to let you know. I let him take her, and Finn is like what you saw her face for a few seconds like it's okay, And then so Vealesco's like uh oh, and Kevin's kine start questioning her like listen, like are you sure.

It was the energy drink van?

Like why would you kidnap someone and be in such an attention grabbing van to abduct children?

Like isn't that strange?

And she has to be like I'm not imagining it, like I'm not like why are you guys all questioning me, like, I don't.

Get this either.

Twenty five years on the first episode, they're like, don't you kind of have hallucinations all the time.

Isn't this like a thing that you do? Benson like, I just don't get it. It's crazy. I don't.

I don't understand. So she's fucking pissed. None of them believe her. And I want to kick Velesco's teeth And how old are you twenty seven twenty telling Benson what to do if your goddamn mine is possible.

It's like Danny Zuko thing that he does.

I really don't like him unless he wants to be in a guest on the podcast and is su sure but not. His phone vibrates and guess what? They found a bright green energy drink van in Pennsylvania and it's abandoned. H oh.

Guess who was right?

Was a reported stolen yesterday stolen car? The camera is broken on the bridge a few weeks ago, so that sucks, and the boys are talking and Benson's getting into it, like with the flashlight, and she digs in and she finds the Taylor Swifts bracelet and it says Maddie on it. She left it behind and she goes smart girl and we're gonna fucking find her.

So Finn is like, wow, you were right, Yeah, no shit, and so then because like we're both swifties, we'll find you.

I mean, it does make me so happy. And if you're wondering where we are in Taylor history. As I record this, she announced the book, The Eras Tour Book, and they were at the Yankees game. Oh yeah, I liked that blackout. The guy likes their out. It's an outerwear I really like.

I saw them at dinner or something where she was wearing like a cool gold outfit.

I liked the shoes in that it was like a it's a Versace mule.

Oh yeah, I remember the shoes too now yep, I like those good.

Yeah.

Okay, So and we're back to a missing teen and Mattie was there.

And it's so funny when I do telp people.

So when I met I was talking about this on an intro a while ago. But when I talked about meeting the podcaster that I like, and I explained the podcast and we're like, and so is it fun?

Is it comet?

And I'm like, listen, it's a really complicated layer and it's very last but I think we're doing.

We get a couple of laughs.

I would say, yeah, but like we respect everything.

But yeah, we are back up the teens. But the crossing state lines, that's scary. So back in the office, Benson's chatting with Creasy and Velasko and Finn full House hair and DNA and the van is Maddie's so but because it's a work truck, there's too many prints to know what's going on. And they're still looking into the Prince on the gun in the men's room, so there's nothing but the visual idea of Benson. There's no DNA. We're looking at for traffic cams, and Kevin Kane has entered the chat.

Out of the tunnel.

There's a few grainy shots of the driver and Benson's staring and she's like, oh my god, this is the guy I saw. I'll call it in the parents, show them like maybe they know him. So in two employees of the energy drink delivery company said no to DNA tests, but everyone else is cleared, so obviously we're going to go talk to the DNA deniers. Benson's looking at photos of her and she's like very very pained by all this. Criesy tells her to stop beating herself up, and she's like, yeah,

She's really smart. She left the bracelet. We're gonna get her.

So we cut to the dad with Avelasko and Finn and they're looking at the van and he's getting like hostile and annoyed, like fuck him. But so then the detectors are like, what about soccer?

A coach?

A pervy And then the dad goes, wait, you think it's sexual and it's like that didn't even cross his mind. Oh my god, this guy is quite dumb. But like, I hope it's not. You would hope it's not.

What do you think a guy wants a fifteen year old blonde girl for? What do you think somebody took her for? If it's a new baby, maybe it's black market. What do you think they want your daughter for her painting? They're gonna keep her and let her do acrylic paints in a little basement, it is.

But you think it's sexual?

Yeah, Like, aren't you worried about your daughter? He's still just like, my wife's mad at me. She's such a bitch.

Like that's what he's thinking. That's what he's thinking, King right now.

Yeah, So we learn they go to the store every week and like the person who did this really new the store and cameras and like not being targeted. And then the dad is like, it's like there is one old man that watches soccer practice, so maybe it's him. So we go to this creeps house Gordon Franks and I'm not the first complaint he's ever had about being a PERV soccer fan.

He opens the door and.

Yeah, he doesn't know why the cops are there, and it's like, but you know, you're a pervert, you know what I mean, Like, why are you so shocked? And he's a hoarder and they enter, they're like, are you a pedophile?

And he's like, I just like sports and he has a cat. I support women in sports, women's athletics. It's like totally fine.

But it's like if even if you love women's sports, like they're not good. These are children. Unless you're going to like a high level championship. I don't know, maybe that's rude. Travel travel teams unless you've given but like unless you're like invested in a child on the field, I just don't trust.

I think it should be unallowed.

It should not be I don't know, like if I was living like I don't know. I like the idea of going to a high school football game. We live near a high school.

Yeah I want to go to the game.

Yeah yeah, but that's a huge event and a lot of people are there. Not as many people go to like watch a girl soccer game. And you can't be at a girl swim me yeah alone. No, it has to be like sex parties. You need to have a plus most park, you have to be brought by a woman. Most playgrounds are like, you have to be with a kid to be here. There's signs there are yeah, like there'll be rules. I've seen it in New York and I've seen in LA. You have to be accompanied by a child.

So either who's watching pedophiles are not going to be beholden, I know, but they could stand across. I guess it would give somebody the right to go, hey, the rules of the park where you got to be here with the kids?

Scram or I'm gonna call the cops. Yeah you know, yeah, yeah, a scuffle? Would you do that? If somebody was looking really fucking creepy? I probably would like somebody sitting on their phone, I'm probably I'd be honest. I'm not matching up kids with parents when I'm at the playground.

Yeah, but you know, if the someone not paying attention, that's a parent. Yeah, if they're looking get the hell out of here.

In pervert? Yeah all right, So this guy's a cat? No, all right?

Kevin Kane goes to the backhouse work, you know, the hut, and inside is like a ton of pictures of Maddie everywhere, and so they're taking him in and he's like, I don't even know her, and they're like there's fifty photos of her on the wall, like what how are you still lying? And he goes, she's really good at soccer, she's my own mia Ham. Finn says, get him out of here and let the dogs back here. He's in cement room bars Velasco and Finn are in there while

They're clothed, I don't know, Like if it's not in a sexual scenario, I don't know.

I don't know.

What are the surveyll like illegal surveillance or like that's gonna be where I testify in Congress. Everyone has their mission. I'm gonna be that'll be my.

Mission protect the young soccer players of America.

Finn says, yeah, get them out of here, YadA YadA. Okay, So yeah, they're not good photos is what CARIESI is saying. So there's tons of noise. They run into the hallway a giant man. Is this not the biggest man you've ever seen in your life? Like he is so tall he is he's like gold, He's like that wrestling gold. And yeah, it's really a presence and crazy decision making skills for him to not have called ahead, maybe been like, hey have something in my car, Like the method is wild.

So, and like, in case you're one of those people that doesn't watch, you, just listen to us. It's not like Batchelor party sex doll. It's like Lars and the real Girl sex doll.

Right, it's like a full those lifelike dolls that you get to be like your wife, your companion. These people that have them, Yeah yeah, these are thousands of adults. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Well so then this is okay. So now we open back up and we're at a butcher shop kitchen situation with an arm and there's blood in the meat slicer, and there's a person in scrubs and a hairnet and blood and lugging body parts. There's a meat cleaver, and then we hear a cut. We're on a movie set.

Wait, hells she kills kids and feeds them to kids. Yeah, and they do that on the Simpsons for the Treehouse of Horror. Yeah.

Well, like, you know, they don't have a budget. So then she's like, you know, there's not very much meat in this meeting or that's the PTA disbands episode. Listen. But yeah, they like kill the kids and eat the kids whatever. It's like a fun Simpsons Halloween episode. I think you should watch. Honestly, I think you should. My kids, Yes, yes, we should do that. That'll be their way into the sun. The Bart Simpson Raven one, the Raven one I watched when I was a kid.

Yeah, the one I always think of when you bring up the Treehouse.

That's amazing. Ever more, never more so, I think it's criminal Simpsons. I follow a few accounts on Instagram, but they're doing a like March Madness style bracket of the best Treehouse of Horrors and we're at the final two

We're taking them all. Hangl. Hat's like, what the fuck are treat me like a perp? I'm a hero.

As soon as I saw the girl on the news, I brought the dolls straight to you, and fing goes, well, if you're a hero, tell us where you got the dolls. And it's like you didn't even ask him once before? Why are you being aggressive? Like he's keeping a secret, Like I don't know why you haven't asked him sooner. I just like don't know why they're being mean to this guy. I mean he entered fucked up.

Like I would.

Actually, yeah, yeah, Benson Stone creesy back up the office like jish. I thought, I've seen everything, and this is the first for him to underage sex dolls created just for pedophiles. This actually doesn't seem new to me, though. Has this really never been on SBU?

I mean there's We've definitely talked about how there's see sam images that are created of not real children, like there's ai kind of like children that are created for photographs.

But I yeah, I don't think I've seen that. This might be the first time we tackle kid sex dolls. Oh okay, we got to find I just know that they sell them in Japan, Like that's like a fact. I heard that you could buy like limbless. Oh God, Sorry, that's just something I've heard and maybe that's not true. And I don't mean to offense everyone, but I heard their sex stores are crazy.

Okay, So we got.

A fuck cause I've been to Japan and I did see some wild like anime when you just walk into like stores that they'll just be like some porn stuff like mixed in with regular stuff, and you're like, oh.

Wow, but I don't remember seeing any of themless babies. Well I have to have to head back. Okay, so it's we gotta find the cellar. But I spelled it like a wine cellar, not like sellar, like a cellar of something.

And so that is why I.

Was just confused reading something simple like that, And what do we charge them with?

You know what I mean?

Right, So it's not even a crime, but it is a teen girl and Creasy's like, yeah, but if it was made before the kidnapping, they're gonna claim it's a coincidence. And it's like, the bracelet's on the girl, it's not a coincidence. The doll has a bracelet, like this is it might be fresh? How did they have the bracelet? They just moved to New York. They're new in town, but the sex dolls are ready the bracelet.

Yes, but it was a.

Gift from her friend and they just moved to New York. Yeah, yeah, I'm sorry. This episode, I mean, I love it. I love the Maddie storyline throughout the season.

But this is there's a lot of weird things this we should be doing continuity on this show.

That doesn't make any fucking sense. She just moved there.

You think she's got a friend good enough to give her a friendship bracelet after a month in town. This guy must have discovered her for the photos like day one of when she moved to New York.

Right, Well, no, it's a San Francisco friend gave it to her to the move to No, I know, but the photo guy he started to take pictures of for the first day she was in school.

He got fifty photos of for how long she been there? Yeah, a lot of practices. Well yeah, yeah, yeah, this is why.

Well, I just watched a clip of like I guess Martin Scorsese's editor at the Wolf of Wall Street, there's like continuity, errors, NonStop over she.

Just doesn't care.

But they said she's the best in the business and has all these oscars because it's all about like the way things feel and like you don't even notice it. But then they showed a clip like he throws money in the air but it never flies down. But yeah, I don't know. It's interesting to think about, like what is well technically being bad at it or what is good you know, like, yeah, interesting. Yeah, So the parents walk in, that's not good news, and she has to

This is they're.

Gonna ruin her life probably Okay, So Benson want, I mean killing is ruining a life too. Benson wants to go through the mom's instagram. She's like, no, I have a private Instagram.

I know everyone there.

It could be nobody and Benson's like, yep, we're not ruling any of your friends out, and she goes, what And so now Benson's like, we're gonna go and research every single person that liked that picture and we're going to go in, so knock at the door. We're also finding the cellar and it's Golden Rabbit Importers in Chinatown. They enter a you know, like as a big group, lots of flashlights, huge warehouse. The dude's like, what the fuck and you can't be here, and it's like they can.

And then they asked the dude like, where did this doll come from?

And he goes Taiwan, where all of them come from, And she's like, I don't give a fuck about all of them. I care about this one. He goes, that's the best seller Birthday Girl. Benson says, take everything and arrest him, and Rollins is now teaching at college. Whoo. So the Maslows hierarchy of needs is behind her on the whiteboard and.

That wild we only ever heard of Masw's hierarchy of needs from you. I do love it, so that's cool that it's behind Rollin.

Yeah, criminal motivation she's talking about was to satisfy basic needs, and then the basic need got corrupted around Jack the Ripper and that was the dawn of sex crimes investigation. But I don't but I mean, if we're going to just maybe sex crime investigation but definitely not sex crime, right, And I still like, isn't judas like didn't kind like

Your back light it. I'm sure that, Yeah, they're in there.

Yeah, Rollins says, are you tracking other buyers that weren't using the doll as a prop? And then Benson seems stunned, like a case of criminal sexual escalation. This doesn't seem like that wild of a breakthrough to me though, Like why wouldn't you go look at who bought the doll?

Yeah?

But whatever, Rollins is like, yeah, porn whatever Benson ads or like smokes, you know, like one day it's one and then the next year it's two packs a day, and you need to get that high. And pedophiles can't always control themselves, so they're thinking, like, you know, the perp might be on the buyer's list. The doll wasn't enough for them anymore. Benson screams our perp, and they smile, and Rollins offers to help, and Benson's like, ough, don't

There, Benson rawlins shipping you think there has to be, especially after the tower, Yeah, especially after the towel.

Yeah. Right.

So they go visit all the buyers with their dolls, and we meet a guy who has two dolls because one of the dolls got lonely, and he has this little tiny bun on the top of his head and he's so sad they're getting bagged up. He knows nothing about a missing girl, and Benson goes, good, give us DNA, bitch, and then it's a montage of dolls being taken away

He tries climbing a fence.

Benson's like, you're going to hurt yourself, just like, please come down and tells where this doll is. So he says like, it's not what you think and he can barely get down the fence and they're pretty nice to him, like so then they go into the dump and they find the doll in the dump and he's cuffed. Benson asks why did you throw her out? And he's like, well, I had to. She's the reason all this happened. She does prey hands to him and says, do you know where Maddie is?

And he says no.

He notices the bracelet on Benson's wrists and says, but I know who took her.

Okay.

So we're in cement room bars and this guy bought the doll but didn't know she was real until his friend Mark saw a picture of the doll he posted in a chat room that he's in and so there going through like the tech right now, we're going to like see all this and Cariesy's curious how Mark knew this was a real girl, and he goes, well, Mark is smart and put it all together. So then the guy with the bad Haircut's like, you know, knowing she

You orchestrated a kidnapping for money trafficking. Finn comes in.

They got a number off this scumbag's phone and they're able to track it through the carrier. So they run to a motel and the guy that works there thought it was just like her father all guns are out there going into this motel room there, but there's water pouring out of the room, so that's terrible news. They opened the door and Sin leads the team in yelling for Maddie. We hear the bathtub running. He dumped a sim card on the floor and then they open the door.

It's a different girl. So it's a girl with a nose.

Piercing and fin Yell's for narcans.

She's alive. My eyes are barely open.

Makeup did like an insane job, and she's such a good actress. It's really scary and really unnerving this scene. She's in like very rough shape. And another hot cool girl detective comes over to thank Benson for finding her missing girl, Tanya, and she's s View Detective Sloan Parish from Bergen Hills Prosecutor's office.

They shake hands and she is the actress is Amber Sky Noise and Noias or Noise.

She was in townhouse incident. She's the redhead in townhouse incident. Whoa yeah, yeah, fuck yeah. She came back after like many seasons. I bet Benson really liked working with her. Yeah, okay. So she says that all the.

Guys on her squad thought she was just a runaway except for her, and she's so sick of shouting into the wind, and Benson's like, obviously gets understands that. It invites her back to the city to interview Tanya together, so girl power and then thunder rumbles. So they're chatting with Tanya on a leather couch. There's so many couches in this episode. She lets Tanya know that Sloan has been looking for her for a really long time, and she she but she had so much fence and all

Who is that man?

She says, it's George from Canada, and that's all she knows. They met partying on the train a few months back. It was a cross country Amtrak situation. He likes to ride it for days. She met him in Jacksonville. Nothing good happens there and he could tell she was an addict from all the burns on her hands. But she thought it was just rock, but he gave her fent instead.

In that bag. He was leaving her there to drown. Though, like she starts to cry.

It's like really sad, and she's sobbing, and Benson says, you're safe now. Benson walks out and tells the men like, well, now I know why she seems so out of it and calm.

He was drugging her.

He drugs the victims, So we got to get this guy and he likes to be on the run, which means he knows how to stay hidden. And so now we got to go to Amtrak, and we got to figure out send the descriptions out, and we got to find Tanya's mother. So Sloan is going to try to call the mom. And then now McGrath is here with of course idea. He wants a press conference. They found a girl who's missing for over a year, yay, And Benson's like, this isn't a win, bro, They're still a

Right, so let's move on to the true crime. All right.

So I'm not gonna say you're gonna be like, whoa same crime? But the crime is has moments of similarity, and some people think it's based on this because this was kind of a publicized incident. So September of twenty sixteen, Karna Page Slusser is a senior in high school in central Pennsylvania. It's like sixty miles from Scranton. Previously, she'd run track been a cheerleader, but she quit that her senior year and she starts, you know, falling in with

She's going to online school.

She's not going to those classes either, and the sad thing is one of the articles I read said she's.

Only one class shy of graduating.

But on January third, my sister's birthday, Karina tweets screenshots of texts that she sent her mom that are like, there's a lot of Twitter in this. It's like when people still use Twitter as like a normal place to express yourself.

It's weird.

It's like a time capsule because now it's just like a healthscape. She wrote, quote, I need things to change. I need to be happy. I lost motivation and goals because of how unhappy I've been. I hate myself and I need to teach myself to love me and you. I want us to do it together. I don't want to be your disappointment, but I'm sorry. I need you, mommy. I want you to help me.

End quote. This is like so heartbreaking.

In April of that year, Karina does attempt to take her own life by swallowing fifty tile and alls.

She gets taken to the er.

She survives, but she is held in a psych unit for three days and a friend of a lot of this that I'm getting is from an eyewitness news which is a New York which is like Channel seven New York Eyewitness News investigative report. There's aecial segment called Missing that a one reporter started doing when Gabby Patito went missing, and so now she does this missing segment, and so this is like a long story that I that is

Right between her boobs.

In June of twenty seventeen, she moves out of her mom's house and in with a friend and she's working at Applebee's. Her aunt is Julie Anne Becker Kalfa, who told Dateline that she didn't like her mom didn't want Karina to go out of the house, but she was eighteen so she had to let her go. In August, Karina moves out of the friend's house, but apparently the friend kicked her out and wouldn't give her any of

And a few days later he writes back, Hi, how are you? Are you all right? I miss you still so.

Around this time, she tweets about getting her first apartment in New York and it's in Jerome Park in the Bronx. It's really wild, like because you can go to this girl's instagram, Like I went to it, I saw these photos, and you know, she's just like a cute girl that's like so excited. She writes, never been more happier in my life. Forever dream accomplished end quote. Like she's so happy. And her apartment looks really nice in the photos, like cute kitchen. Like it's like looks like a cute like

Queens, early in the morning.

Prosecutors do believe she was with Ishi Woni at the motel, but it did not have working cameras at the time. But also the same day, she messaged Peguero, the original guy who assaulted her, saying, quote, please please let me come. If not, I could be locked up. She said, I'm the man left her at a motel, quote with no money in food, and he tries to call her through the Facebook messenger but she doesn't pick up, and no one knows if these two ever connected or linked up

But then she called.

The next she called and said, according to her aunt Julie, she told her mom like, oh, her license and security cardbin social Security cardban stolen, so she can't fly, and Julie told dateline quote she said she wanted to come home to Pennsylvania, though, and she'd be home the next day end quote. So the mom is in Florida for a week, keeps calling Karina, but it's going to voicemail. When she gets back, she still can't reach her. She's trying all of Karina's friends, none of them have her

Can you believe it?

Can you believe you can't just email people who have been missing and they won't just right back and go all good? Thanks for checking. On the twenty ninth, Facebook messages her saying, Hey, I miss you. Can you just hit me up and let me know you okay? So no one has seen or heard from her at this point. Now in six weeks, it's early November. Her mother goes to the media. She's on the cover of the Daily News with the headline gone girl missing teen got order

Please.

He apparently said, I don't know where your daughter is. I don't know if she's dead or alive, but I'm praying that she is.

He says.

So the mom seems to be doing a lot. So that's similar to like the mom in this story, Like she's obviously very frantic and she's feeling very hopeless. The mother in the real life situation in the spring of twenty nineteen, the mom does a genius thing. She buys a phone and connects it with Karina's number. All of her photos, apps, calendar reminders, and emails load onto the phone, probably just like Apple ID or something, but her texts and calls don't. So then the FBI goes, can we

You know.

So in November of twenty twenty one, somebody goes into Karina's Facebook account and they search her mother's name. So is that Karina Is that somebody who has access to her account? Her aunt told Dayline when she initially went missing, quote, we have no idea where she is now. Unfortunately, Karina is a text bookcase of the trafficking epidemic. She is one of thousands of in NYC. People may be envisioning

Oh my god.

I know, And like, yeah, I could have been either one of these guys. It could be a totally separate person, like who fucking knows. But that is the scoop on the Karina page slesser story.

It's really sad. Yeah, but we're going to cheer you up with a great interview. Don't go anywhere.

Our guest today is an incredibly talented young actress who recently starred in the Future Beyond the Lake. But you know her best for her arc on the most recent season of SVU, season twenty five, as the kidnapping victim who Benson just can't quit, Maddie Flynn. Please enjoy our chat with the very lovely Allison Elaine. I can't believe we're talking to Mattie Flynn, Olivia Benson's biggest obsession season five.

Arc, Like, what how did this all come about?

I mean, yeah, did you know it was gonna be like this big four episode thing that stretched across the whole season.

No, no, are you hitting me? I didn't even know I was going to be a sex doll.

I think I was the last know about everything in our podcast or did did you?

Did you play the sex doll? No, it was okay.

On your Instagram there's a photo of you being like, yes, that's me the sex doll.

So I'm kind of like, wait, my mind is blown out in the explanation, So maybe we need to start a sex doll.

Let's start where we were at the beginning, which is always the sex doll.

No, yeah, I did not know.

I was going to play sex all because one would just assume that they would have a sex all play the sex doll. And no, I'm sitting in the makeup chair and the very talented makeup artist, Michael Harvey, he comes and he rolls out all of this stuff, right, that is not your normal everyday makeup, And I was like, what do you do on, buddy?

And You're like, we're turning you into the doll today.

I am You're shocked.

You're gonna go on as soon as we're finished, Are you ready? And I was like, uh, nobody mentioned that to me.

I will be ready.

So yeah, it took three hours every day to cover they can mean like seven layers of latex.

Yeah, because it looked like a dolt.

When Kara even asked you, it's like, that's obviously adult.

Wait so you had latex on you seven?

Wow?

Wow? Yeah it was.

It was obviously a wig and you know, the the lashes and the all the they painted my whole body essentially.

Yeah, and so I.

Really quickly had to learn how to not breathe or blink.

Did they get nominated for an Emmy for makeup?

Like?

I mean they should, they should.

That should have submitted.

That's incredible that but you can't. But then you can't blink, right.

Is that?

No?

It? Uh? Yeah, I would say it was hard because you can't like, you know, the walk by you were rip open a garbage bag and all this light comes in and your eyes just sort of start watering and you can't do anything about it. Yeah, And it was hilarious the amount of text that I got being like, oh my god, I'm dying that there's a sex doll of you in a warehouse somewhere and I was like, no, it's.

Me, it's me.

I would have thought that would have been the prop master's job to like make a sex doll. But I bet you that they were like, this has to look exactly like her, so let's just get Allison.

To I think so.

Also, I think there was like maybe a legal thing where they didn't want to have to figure out how to dispose of an identical to me. I don't know, like what do you do afterwards with that?

Right?

Like, oh my god, you're definitely the first human sex doll.

Well, and I think they're expensive, yeah, brand, especially the royal dolls, like the ones that are like yeah not just like blow up back party sex dolls, you know, like you were.

You were on top of the line sex doll. Oh yeah, I was.

I was high end so many turns.

And that's the story.

Well from just your Instagram and the actress who played your mom so fucking talented. I looked on hers and it seemed like you guys had like a vibe with Marishka.

Seemed like, oh my god, Marishka is in love with Leslie, Like they had Leslie's who play my mom? They like are our besties. I don't know how it happened. Somewhere there was just like a romance that was born between the two of them. Oh my god, and like Mariushka text her all the time and it's so and I love Leslie.

Leslie is like not old enough to actually be my mom.

She's only like seven years older than me, so she's gofte me like my big sister or opt green.

Yeah.

I definitely was like, are you allowed to be in a hotel room by yourself? You're only sixteen? Like I I did not realize that you were like a full adult until I like went on your Instagram and.

Was like, oh yeah, no, care about that.

We have to do it later in the day because that's when school gets out.

I think she has school.

And then we started researching and I'm like, she's a grown one's full grown one.

Yeah yeah, I get mistaken all the time, though, Like TSA, I stumped TSA every time I got through.

Well, I mean that's I mean, you look, the people that were on nine O two one oh back in the day were all like thirty playing high school students.

You want a young look, you got to. I will take it as long as I can.

They don't. They don't make me take my shoes off, they take twelve and undergo.

Thanks very much, perfect, you don't have to pay for TSA pre or clear.

I love that baby. So like, you must have auditioned.

They must have auditioned like dozens, if not hundreds of girls to be this like Mattie Flynn arc character. How was your whole audition process? Was it like on tape and then a callback? Like what was the journey?

It was so back So initially they did want Maddie supposed to be, but initially they wanted her younger, and then I guess for safety purpose, you know, La had come back. Was like maybe with where the storyline is headed, we're gonna go older. Yes, for the sake of you know, user audiences, not right, the ickiness, yes, the heroine of it all.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

So yeah.

I all I did was I sent in It was the scene in episode one where she's walking through the supermarket with her parents or the whatever store, and uh, that was it. That's all I did. I didn't do a callback or anything. They sent me the offer right off of that tape and uh yeah. Then like four days later I was I was at Chelsea Piers, Oh wow.

Are you?

And that's what I'm saying. I went in so blind, like no idea where this was headed, no idea about the sex doll or the teenage boy bit of it all.

Like I was just like, great, here I go.

I'm just gonna get in advance.

And you obviously made a giant impression because you would think they would see like, oh, can she cry or can she do all these things?

But they knew I will say, yeah.

David was very sweet, the head writer, and he was like, oh.

No, we're glad this worked out because yeah, we're we're going to keep you on. We're going to keep it going. And I was like, oh good. They were like yeah, we weren't sure if you could act, and I was like, lass, I didn't disappoint.

Well, it's interesting, yeah, because I bet you, like they could have still had that whole arc happen with like less of the you turning into like the boy or being a boy in disguise and like and being all that. If you didn't know how to act, they could have just been like we're still looking for Maddie. You would have just been like a disappeared person. The whole time. Oh yeah, and because you can. They were like, all right,

Like you look like you're on a Metro North train No, or like an.

Amtrak in this studio?

Oh wow?

Cool? It was crazy, like yeah, they and they built it, took it down like within a day.

They're speedy out there.

They they're no, well, what about the store. The store was a store a set.

Yes, the store was real.

That was I think like a shopping say in downtown Manhattan.

Yeah, that one was real.

But like that scene where you have to be like your like is drugged up.

You're talking to this guy, then he goes to the bathroom and then you have to like in a heroin induced haze or whatever he has you on, you're like scribbling this note and leaving it for the guy behind you. I mean, like I didn't even recognize that was you, and I'd been watching the whole like season, Like I was like, is that supposed to be Maddie Flint like it.

It was crazy.

I got so humbled. I'm got so humbled by the internet.

Are you kidding me? They were? My friend showed me. I guess there was.

Some Reddit thread where they were like, Maddy's been recast, that's the boy, like there's no light.

Okay, another another shout out to hair and makeup. That's right.

I mean really though they're the real heroes. But yeah, there was.

They would press that train bent null high costume every day with continent packets because the director, Bethany, she was so talented, but she was like uglier, dirtier, nastier, Like I couldn't get like nasty enough for her.

And at one point the head.

Of costume, I'm eating an egg burrito that's what like nine in the morning, and she's like, no, I want chunks, like and I've already been covered in relish at this like they just are throwing things on me, and she goes, are you done with her burrito? And I was like yeah, she just takes it and just smush his egg Oh my god, down my.

Shirt like all over.

And it was like such a comfy costume too that I would.

Forget I was looking the way I looked, and so I would be like, oh great, thanks everybody, and like.

Go to hug somebody and they'd be like, don't touch me. Yeah he oh god, I forgot.

I probably smelled you. I smelled like egg and ketchup.

Because he was also a unique criminal.

I don't know how much you watch this for you, but we've never had like a nihilist on I don't feel before, or like cold one.

I don't know.

He was a very unique guy. And then it kept twisting, like when the mom goes to me. I mean, there were so many twists throughout the episodes, and then the trial with the mistrial and the juror, I'm like, are you fucking kidding me?

Get this guy out of here? You know, I know he was. It was I was really hoping that my mom was going to kill him.

When I was reading that was.

Like yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.

And then obviously you know Benson is not going to let her best friend go down for go down murder.

No, Leslie, yeahh.

Don't do it.

I feel like they're going to bring you back in like a couple of seasons where like Maddie goes to college, and like something happens to like your friend, and you're like, I think I know someone, and you like bring Benson into it. Let me call it, because like, yeah, you end up going to college in the city because you're traumatizing, can't go too far from home.

You know, there's a lot, there's a lot, Maddie.

I'm that then Maddie, after her experience with Olivia Benson that she then decides to also become a detective.

Okay, that's what I'm hoping for.

That's what happened with another The famous episode that Marishka won the Emmy four is nine to one one where she helps this little girl and then they just had it in the last season that the little girl grew up and graduated from the Lace Academy.

I love that.

So see Olivia Benson like finishing school for young cops.

That's what it's going to be.

Oh my god.

It was So we were filming one episode and I think it was episode five. It ended up being AT's birthday, and so one of the days we were on set, we stopped filming and she came in with her family and.

It was this really cute thing that I guess they do every.

Year where they had like a I don't know, would you call it a quartet.

Of bagpipe players. I don't know what was called a group of bagpipes.

I don't know what their connective collective noun is. Yeah, but there's a bun they like announced her. But then they had probably a dozen real life of Olivia Benson's from the NYPD there, and they each like brought their own gift for her, and they each you know, like thanked her and had this whole speech planned and obviously by the end we were all like crying.

Because those are the real heroes that are like doing the actual work to save all of the people who have experienced terrible, terrible sex crimes. But yeah, and they they gave her like an honorary NYPV jacket and wow, the flowers, and it was so so cute just to see like the impact that it has on I mean obviously on the audience, but also just like on the officers themselves. And it was all these women in positions of power and that were captains or high ranking detective.

Yeah, it was just so it's amazing.

I wonder if it's because it was a milestone birthday for her I think it was.

Might.

I know that every year they do throw a little party for her.

But I don't imagine that they like, well, I feel like Bagpiper is unique and maybe you know last year was a drug queen.

They've had a violin like I feel like through the.

Yeah a mariachi band.

Yeah, started with a yeah. But did she know?

This was obviously a surprise, Like did she know any of these detectives or.

She didn't know?

I mean I assume for obviously they do something for her every yarm chirt because it's.

Lurshka right, like you got it.

Yeah, but it was she was very new, like she was also crying, like you could see how much she cared, which was really kind of obviously would send everyone over the edge.

And we were all like, love a rank bite the en, that's amazing.

Well, I'm sure they're like very like thankful that like the show, even though I'm sure like a ton of it is unrealistic, Like we read all the time in the news about people that like leave evidence because they saw something on SVU or like scratch someone to try to get DNA because they saw it on SVU or like yeah, and then like what she does for like rape kit backlogs with her like nonprofit organization.

Yeah, well, that's what I'm saying, like the awareness that it generally brings to the whole terrible topic.

Right, things that happen were people? Wow?

I feel like we were we just got a private invitation to that birthday party.

I'm very excited to hear about it.

I know, right, and toldly I had been dressed better, but I was looking like a drugged.

Out Were you a heroine a boy at the birthday? Yeah?

No?

Wait?

What was your the pictures? Yes, it was What was it?

Matthew, Matthew, Matthew, Mattie, Matthew close. In case they call you Maddie by accident, we can be like, oh his name is Matthew.

Wow?

Got it?

Yeah?

Wow?

Any any other like nuggets from the set?

Did you have to interface with Iced Tea or anyone else?

Fun?

Says I See and Coco are so fun.

They're they're actually maybe the most down to earth celebrities I've ever come in contact with.

Like, they're they're just genuinely so nice.

I think we ended up sitting in like the hair and makeup trailer probably like four or five times, and wed just talk for like an hour, just about like random self. Like he was moving at one point and he was just like rambling about the movers. He did just give like a rundown of the show, you know of like they have like what's called the creep team because they have to go out and like so for the like the picture of me as a sex doll that they put on the website or like there.

Was one up was it the first episode where.

They had a wall that was just pictures of me from the men that were docking me. So they like call that the creep team because they have to go be from the perspective of the creepy people.

Of the creep team. Of course.

Yeah, and so he told me all about that, and I still.

Caught up that you were just in the trailer with ice and cocoa for hours, days at a time.

That's cool.

I mean, he's just so nice. If you get him going on something, he'll he'll go. I think it also helped that some of the time I look.

Like a boy.

So he was just like just.

Vibing with me.

Pandom man maandam man listens, Sonny, let me tell you how this showler.

Yeah, I love it.

I love I love them being described as down to earth because just like them on Instagram is like Coco with like her butt out and like a g string and they're just like living a fabulous life. And then everybody's like, but they're in a down to earth.

It's not like they're in the Maldives.

They're in Arizona in their bathing suits, like they're not caring anywhere they're at. Like they're like at Atlantis with Damon from Shark Tank, Like those are like they're nice vacations, but they're like they are regular people in their choices somehow still because he likes on crustables.

You see Coco and she's like gorgeous, you know, she's like a sports illustrated model, and so I don't really know what to expect because she's not gorgeous, you know.

Yeah, so they see everywhere.

Yeah, yeah, she's everywhere. So sweet, she's on stage. And you went to like a performing arts high school as well?

Yeah I did.

Yeah, I went to uh Douglas standers in School of the Arts.

It's the performing arts high school in Florida.

Yeah.

So I've been doing this for quite a while.

Not that there's ay it's in Jacksonville, Florida, and not that there's a ton happening in Jacksonville, but yeah, I've been in the industry for for a bit.

I'd say, what's the most theater kid thing you ever saw in college or high school?

Oh?

My god, not by can of worms.

I feel like, I mean, like I went to a high school that was sometimes I think you run across theater teachers in particular that got to be a little.

Full of themselves, I would say.

And so I remember this is when I was in high school actually, but it was like, if you're not reading a play a day, you're wasting my time and we need to get out of my classroom. Like it was like we would have like workout Wednesdays because you had to be like where we would just spend the whole day work.

Now you had to be super fit so you could dedicate your body to the work.

Like.

It was just a lot of that, I.

Would say, and just the most ridiculous thing. Yeah, just like sacrifice everything a play a day.

It was a play a day.

It's like such bad advice too, because I feel the whole thing is like you need to live your life to be able to get material motivation, the emotions of things, like you know, use for your scenes.

I would say most of my professional life has been sort of learning the boundaries between like I would taught to just give everything to the industry versus being like, okay, some some things are for myself, like I can go on a vacation or do things that don't necessarily that I'm not going to put on my special skills section, but just because I like to play tennis or what

Yeah, the work life balance, baby, yeah, exactly, so.

Coctic stuff anymore.

Oh and the vocal res I remember.

I remember being in middle school because I went to a perform our middle school too, and like the girls would carry around whiteboards the week of tech for the musicals because they were on vocal reth.

You were like dwelve but like so funny.

No, yeah, their steamers. They would be walking around at lunch with.

It's like, You're vocal words are so new. I don't think you need to be on.

Not like, yeah, tell people where they can see you, find you.

What you're doing next.

Yeah, we were talking a little bit. I can't announce certain things yet.

People can follow you on Instagram to follow your journey from Mattie Flynn and beyond.

Yes, I mean he really killed it as Maddie.

I can't wait to you in the future.

So exciting.

Yeah, it was so fun, I would say.

The only other TID that I have is so the reason that because I feel like so many viewers are like, why it's this a big arc where because you've never.

Really done that.

At most they do like one maybe a part two, right and the gry Townson Show and our David Gratiano he wrote it originally from what I understand, don't quote me, I guess, but you wrote it as a movie, like an ask for your movie.

I know it's pitched and it almost happened.

But then they decided to work it into the season so to preserve it, like the uh split it up throughout the whole season.

So it's essentially if you put it together, that makes a lot of sense. That's a good tid, thank you.

That's a really good good bed because it's the first time that like they've done things where they've gone and revisited old things, but they've never been where it's like, why will Benson not get off of this Maddie girl. It's like we've ended so many cases with people missing or not happy endings that like on the show where

Honestly, the whole time I thought it was my dad. I thought my dad was going to come count as a villain somehow, but he didn't. He made it through unscate well most except for family drama, small suicide.

Oh yeah, but yeah, like I was like.

Oh, he's guilty, He's got to be guilty.

But yeah, wow, it just goes to show there's a twist for everybody, even the people in the episode.

That's right.

This has been so fun. Thank you for talking to us.

Thank you, Yeah, thanks for having me. You guys are so funny.

Oh man, she was fun finding out that she was the second guess. That's exactly what the words right out of my mouth. Fucking blew my mind, blew my mind. Yeah, it is so funny.

So, you know, I've been shooting this ultra low budget movie and like it is just like a wild physically what you have to do or like you're just kind of like messed around with in such a funny way. And I watched this Anne Hathaway life and outfits and costumes for one of the magazine youtubes, and she's talking about how she like tried on the astronaut outfit and for Interstellar and was like, oh fuck, And then she bought a forty pound vest and then was jogging in

Yeah, so crazy. No, Actually, Jared and I just shot a short last week. We would a married couple and it was a stretch are you dressed as theirselves or no, it was our own wardrobe. So this so it was basically like we're a couple. It's I don't I don't want to give anything.

Away about it, I guess because like, oh my god, look at all themis is kind of silly, but we are married.

We use our own wardrobe and our own wedding rings. Actually, but it's just so crazy.

It was.

It's probably six minutes long, and it's a full day of work, like it was. So we were so tired afterwards, and we were like we were mostly sitting around on barstools, you know what I mean.

Like, but it is like tiring.

And how many people have we talked to that We were like, how long were you lying in that puddle of blood for? And they're like hours, Like when we were talking to Anthony Rapp and he was like, yeah, Christopher Maloney like let me lie in blood for hours.

I know.

But I'm usually annoyed when people talk about it, you know, because it's not that bad, but it is, it's like more annoying. And the way Anne Hathaway talks about it, I just liked more than anyone else. I mean, yeah, yeah, yeah, No. Shade to our guests. I guess that was rid of me, but well, you just have to be a little bit, yeah, can't.

She just was cute. She's just such a theater kid. I guess Anthony rap is too. I don't know.

I guess I just really love Anne Hathaway and I love that she so many people are dressing like the Princess Diaries.

It's coming back.

You know, people hated her for a while, and I think she's all blast beloved again.

She has had one of the biggest rebounds in terms of image.

Well no, no, you're we're in the era of Lindsay Lohan two point oh yes.

So I don't know if you can even fucking say.

True, But I'm talking about like Lindsay Lohan kind of earned it a little bit, like she was a wild party animal like Anne Hathaway was. Just no one liked her. They just didn't like her. She didn't really do anything wrong. Everybody was just like speech. It was just like one speech and everyone was pissed.

Yeah.

So, but she talks about that Oscar outfit on this Vogue thing.

Oh really, Yeah, I guess I just mean, like for people to just wildly dislike her for very little and now everybody loves her.

It was just like a big pendulum swing.

Lindsay Lohan to me has actually had like some tumultuous personality things go like personal life stuff go on.

But yeah, well do you remember that Anne Hathaway also was like raw, like her ex was a criminal. Yeah, her ex was like a fraudulent maniac and like something. You know, So I think it was during that time too, or that doesn't coming back to me because she was like a lot happened during this time and I don't want to get into it and it can't just be like people didn't like you, and I'm like, oh, this

Yeah, we got some good girlies.

We've been when we've had them for a long time and we're gonna have them for a lot longer. But what is our I mean, our post mortem? Obviously this is just the first episode of this arc, Like there's obviously more Maddie going on after this episode, but it definitely made a lot of sense that she explained to us that it was like supposed to be a movie kind of, you know, because a lot of times you

But well, I think it's also because she let her go. Yeah, but you drove by her on the street. It's kind of wild, like now learnt to follow your wild moment.

Oh my god, Barbarian is crazy.

Okay, I cannot wait to lay in bed tonight and read all the articles that came out what a year and a half ago. But seriously, you know, things come to you when they can. I was finally brave enough. I've been watching so many horror things lately that I finally got brave enough. Yeah, you really had like a spooktober. You really like went for it with a lot of these horror movies.

It's great.

Yeah, you know, I yeah, yeah, I'm in the spirit. I'm in the spirit. Well, see when it shifts. I mean, I'm excited for Christmas as well, Jared just told me. He goes, I have a thriller for us to watch that I think you would like. I go, okay, he goes, First of all, it's Dutch. I go, ah, like, I don't know, Dutch. You're losing me.

I will watch foreign films, but Dutch. I don't know. Sorry, no offense to my Dutch because of the down the language or what. I don't know.

Yeah, it's like it's it's kind of like a German sounding language. I don't know, it's like not but I'll probably watch it and get used to it.

Who knows. Let's move on to what would sister peg do?

I am a justin long fanatic, like I am, It's it's I am. I've I finally is he still going? Is he still with Kate Bosworth? Yeah, they're engaged. Just you also Sean White, you know, I went through that snowboarding moment.

He is engaged to Nina Dobrave.

Okay, Princess Vampire Diaries. Yeah, finally they're finally engaged. They've been together a long time and I follow their relationship.

They're they're both like Daredevil's They're always just kind of doing something fun and wild in the nature.

And she used to go out with s v alum Ian smolderholder as you call him. Yeah, okay, let's get into what would Sister Peg do? Our weekly segment where we direct you guys towards an organization, an article, a book, a documentary, something to give you more info about what we talked about today and today this week we wanted to point you to towards the Polaris Project. Polaris Project is a survivor center, justice and equity driven movement and

Amazing, Thank you so much.

It's a fucked world out there, and we will be doing Guilt from season three, episode A eighteen classic, A classic Cabot in hermost Cabot can't wait.

Thanks.

Oh and someone that I met on the road said that they missed the way I said Peacock, so shout out and I can. I'll bring up Peacock more often.

You've got to be watching on Hulu and Peacock everybody. Thanks for listening. Guys, We'll see you next week.

Bye.

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