P.C. w/ Kathy Griffin

Of the law and Order franchises, SVU is considered especially watchable.

We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the vicious felonies. These episodes are based on.

These are our stories, done done.

Yay, that's messed up.

An SVU podcast coming to you live JK I am Lee's.

A Trigger and I'm Kara Klink and we're always in a time machine of the little of a small amount, you know our podcast. Guys, Unless you're tuning in to today's episode, our two hundredth episode for the.

First time, you know you might be.

This is a huge day for us, actually runner at the episode.

Huge guests, I'm sure you can assume, yes, if you're just tuning in. We talk about we recap an episode of SVU, talk about the true crime it's based on, and we talked to an amazing guest from the episode. Today's no different. But up top, we chat, we rant, we talk about what's going on in the world, in each other's lives.

Well, I don't even think we talked about this yet, but this is like a fucked up way to start.

But we are in SU podcast.

But you obviously heard about this woman that her husband was drugging her. Oh, I'm letting the whole town raper. And one of the rules is no condoms. People at HIV seventy two people in the neighborhood, her neighbor.

Everyone just was this in France or another country? It was in another country? Yeah, yeah, yeah, good yeah, And she said, fuck a private trial.

You see my face. This needs to be like public. And I hope they all go to jail. I hope he gets the firing squad, and I hope that Why isn't this a bigger story?

Men really need to.

Like sane if this isn't the most evidence you can find of, Like, yes, all men, the whole community was against you.

This man married you and drugging you and let it. I just can't. I keep repeating it to try to make it make sense. Yeah.

Sorry, No, a bear is not inviting its friends over to take turns on its wife. We're picking the bear again, We're picking the bear.

It's so crazy, it's.

So great, Like, yeah, I saw that story and that was like fritzl level to me almost where I was like, oh no, I need to be in a certain space to be able to like fully dive into the story.

It's too grow it's too horrifying, like so bad.

Yeah, well I'll change the topic just to quickly. But I did have I've been waiting for a long time. I'm going to go back. I think it's going to be my new obsession. But I try to diet coke slushy.

Ooh yeah, I think I saw that in your story.

Actually a little DC slush It's perfect.

It's perfect because I feel like with slurpy is in a lot of slush, it's like too overpoweringly sweet, you know, uh huh. And this isn't because it's fucking die. I had coke and it's not super blendy, so it's still little chunk.

It would like I.

Am taking the train and walking just to get this, like I would do that.

I love that.

Wow, a destination diet coke slushie? Where is it? Like, I'm sorry, is it like a chain place or just some little place you found that hasn't.

No, I don't know if it's it is little, but I think it's doing well. It's called Edith's, okay, But I asked when they opened, which was like twenty twenty, and they started popping off in like twenty twenty one. Is okay, because I lived in that neighborhood for a long time and that was not around.

Got it all right? Yeah, get over there. So excited, Ashy, that's exciting. That is exciting. What's going on in La Boots on the ground. What's happening here? Well, my birthday was last week.

Oh my god.

For the b day messages, I wasn't really gonna do a big thing or anything because we had just gone to Palm Springs for our friends forty and that was kind of like the big thing for the month of September for me.

And I was like, you know what, I'm not really doing a lot for my birthday.

But Lisa sent me beautiful flowers in that's messed up colors everybody, which I will take a picture of it.

There was the story you see one hot pink thing in there? If I'm going off the photo, but I know you like hot pink. I was trying, well, no, there was when I saw the picture, Oh okay something. Honestly, I feel bad that I said something negative because I do. I think the the local floorist in your neighborhood is incredible and I was happy I thought they were, And honestly, I'll tell you without I'm not complimenting you to for any kind of brownie points.

Rosie goes, this is the best one, and I go those are Lisa's. She was definitely weighing in. Although my brought me some beautiful flowers my parents. But it was nice. But like, so my friend and I we swapped days where I watched her kids. So her and her husband go out for her birthday a couple weeks before, and then she was watching my kids. She knows my kids. My kids go to bed. There's the same shit every night.

You know that alicorns or unicorns that can also fly?

Like He'll come out with some dumb little thing and then you walk them back to bed. He maybe does that two or three times, and that's it.

I go out.

First of all, you were in the car with me when our friend recommended this restaurant to me. She goes, go to this restaurant, a Pasiting and it's so fod.

I'm sorry, Kara, you told me ahead of time that there was no reservations, and I know for a fact this is not something that you can handle.

But she got it.

No, of course it sound like she made it sound like, even if you have to wait for forty five minutes, you go across the street and get a drink.

It was a two hour wait, two hour waight that's Friday night? Yeah, I know. So I was like I should have wait.

Honestly, I should have been a better friend and been like, are you sure you don't want to make a backup preservation?

Because I know you're right, not for you. And I can't believe I did it.

I think I was just like I didn't want to think about anything for the birthday, did it.

I was just like, yeah, we'll just go try this place. If it doesn't work whatever. So we go.

They're like two hourweight. I'm like, all right, never mind, we'll go somewhere else. So I'm on Rezie, I'm trying to find another place to go. My friend is texting me, going, hey, So they're both screaming for you and it's been fifteen minutes.

Is there some kind of trick?

And I go what, like they never do that, They're never like, you know, I go out of town. I go out all the time, Like they don't. They don't ever do that. So I go, let me FaceTime you. So I'm on the streets facetiming my kids in.

The book going we want you? Where are you?

I go, you, guys, this is my birthday. This is not fair. But they're three and five. You can't really reason with them like that. And I'm like, okay, I don't. They won't stop. They won't stop to listen to me. They won't stop. So I go, all right, I guess we're coming home. So we go home and the minute I walk in the door, I can see them on their little cameras. They're asleep. They're both asleep. So I walk in the door. My friend is like, I'm so sorry.

Did you eat? Was this still Italian? What did you have? An impossible?

Yeah?

So we went to Marco Polo.

We went to Marco Polo at the Silver Lake Hotel, Silver Lake Pool and Hotel or something like that. Yeah, and our friend had been there before, so I was like, I think, I know, this place seems like pretty good. And they had they had vodka pasta. You know, they had vodka sauce pasta, and that's kind of my my kryptonite. So I was like, we'll go there. So it was nice and we were able to like kind of reset the night. But I was like, I was like cursing my children on my way to the car. It was like,

Like, well, I thought it. I mean, this is your friend doing you a favor, so it's fine. As a former professional child's care tape, I would never have called the parents after only fifteen minutes of screaming. So I hope she's not a listener, because that's my opinion.

She's not and I was a little bit thinking that, but I was also like, I was.

Here to tell you as a professional. She is there like.

Her daughter and my daughter are friends. I was kind of like, maybe she's being too nice.

I don't know. I was like, you got to just tell them to shut the hell up. I don't know. That's obviously not how I disciplined my children.

Everybody, but like, well, no, because there was one time where you had to go, you know, to the Christmas pageants. You know, Jared had to be a work something was happening. So I stayed with Oscar and everyone was like, I don't know, can you do it? And I'm like, yeah, I'll ignore him while he screams and he will stop and yeah did.

And he did, Yeah, and he did.

And I ate my you know McDonald's as I watched him scream for a little bit and then he stopped.

He was quiet, and when I got home, he was just sitting there watching TV and glancing at Lisa once in a while and having a time.

It was fine. Yeah, I was totally fine. I just feel like if it was an hour, maybe.

Yeah, I'm sorry, Like, especially because they're three and five, like they're verbal It's not like it's like I wouldn't let a little tiny baby cry for an hour because you do, something could be wrong or whatever. But like they're verbal, they can be like my ankle's broken, you know, like whatever. So they were just putting on a show for her because the next day, you can better believe. We had a little family meeting first thing, and I was like, that will not happen again, Like you will

What the hell? They also had a babysitter while we were out of town for I know.

They love that babysitter. This was them putting on a little show. They were just kind of like when they realize I think that she was gonna FaceTime. Maybe I shouldn't have even done the FaceTime, like I just felt because it was supposed to be easy, Like when I do it for her. Her kids are five and seven, I don't even see them. They're not even around. They're in bed. When I get there, I watched them and I don't know who this is. I don't know if you've met her.

She's like, yeah, I was thinking of a fully different friend this whole time.

Oh yeah, Now I would have told you if it was somebody that you know as well. You don't know this person, and I don't even think I met them in passing, but we do swaps every now and then, and.

I'm gonna have to. I'm gonna think I'm gonna have to give.

It a little break. She seemed traumatized too. When I got home, I was like, are you okay if we go back out? She was like, yeahs long? Are they asleep? I'm like, they're asleep. I can see them on the camp sleep. It's like maybe for birthdays. I only do now paid babysitters where I can be like your problem, I'm paying you to deal with it.

But well, because I had a big pasta moment, I finally made it to chat Chelsea Cafe. I'm part of the Chelsea Hotel and I wanted to try this flat ravioli.

She saw it on your fucking story and was so, I guess so good.

I guess this is like mac and cheese for kids in France is what I heard, Like, this is like an afterschool easy dish that the kids eat, but it's a ravioli. She and I would say, it's like it felt it was the comfort of a buttered noodle.

And it's a cheese filling. It's a cheesy ravioli.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then I was so good I was getting hammered. I had it looks like it has like a catch to a pepe sauce on it or something.

Yeah, it just looked awesome when I saw it.

So basically I had an insane Saturday where obviously, oh no, it wasn't Saturday. Was it was Friday? Not that it fucking matters, So like's no Friday. I go to soul Cycle in the morning. For some reason, it just took to me. I was so tired. I was just like I had to nap. So I ended up napping after soul Cycle. By the time I woke up in the afternoon, I had plans to meet a friend at like fourish, so I was like, well, I'm just not gonna eat. It's two we're gonna eat in a couple hours. I'll

I had to run to my first spot at nine.

So in between like my earlier and my later, I had this buttered noodle ravioli coucio Pepe, sheet pepe, whatever.

I guess.

I had a food video and I was people are saying, I'm misgendering the meat. I didn't know how to say Mortadella. I kept saying Mordidella, Mortadello, and I guess.

Yes, mister hearing the meat Mordandella.

Yeah, I kept like switching it back and forth.

I don't know that would tickle you.

So that's so funny. I'm sorry, that's really funny to me. Yeah, you're like, what is this? This sa Salamo Like we're just making We're just changing meats here and there.

I love it, okay, so but yeah, so it was like a wild Friday. And then I finally I think got home at like two something three in the morning from all the spots.

Wow, and all your spots went well and every day because I've been not that you were too too drunk because you ate and everything, but like I always remember being like, oh god, no, I'm like you get on stage and you're like, fuck, I'm drunk, Like, id No.

I wasn't drunk. I was tired. I was just like tired, like yeah, I don't know.

I was just uh and I was smart and we it was just like, uh, my friend I ran into that night. He said that I lived my life like a teen who just won the lottery or something, or like they're like, parents are out of town, it's time to live it up. And I'm like, no, I've been recuperating for days. Oh god, oh my god, I love it. I went to a backgammon night last night.

Oh you did.

I finally did. I went by myself. Yeah, I did it. You know, I'll go again. I'll go again.

Backcamm In, you tried to briefly just show me how to do it at at the Palm Springs.

Well, I was like watching you and my ohone.

You guys were kind of like, well, you just have to do this, and I was like, it's not computing for me. So I'm like, maybe Domino's is my thing that you're gonna actually teach me. And I'm gonna get because I don't think. I don't know if I see it for backcammon, I see it, I see it. But what were you gonna say?

Cause I don't have actually any fun like tales from backgammon. Well, actually it was it was like in midtown it was very impossible to get to barricades. Everywhere, cops are everywhere. I don't know what's happening. And then afterwards, I was a little sauced, called a friend and they figured.

Out that all the UN world leaders are meeting. Oh and I had the UN fuck it.

Yeah, I was you in General Assembly and there's all this stuff about how it's the worst traffic week in New York. And I was almost like, I'll text Lisa and tell her, like, by the way, it's you in General Assembly, Traffic's gonna be bad. And I was like, she's gonna be like, she's gonna be like you think I don't know that.

So I didn't text you. No, I had no idea.

And I had just gotten stopped a few months earlier or a month earlier, I don't remember. Time is weird, but for Biden's motorcade and we weren't allowed to cross or anything. So I was like, no, we're allowed to walk on these but it's it was like three full blocks.

I take the train anyways. But yeah, I was finally, yeah, I was.

It's a crazy weekend in New York, like I remember, or days in New York. I don't know, it's like how many days it is, but like it's crazy. Oh no, I was just gonna say, last night I finished Secret Lives of Mormon Wives. Oh wow, So I finished shit And yeah, I was really fucking hooked the whole time. And I'm still making my way through the Bear. But I'm not interested the Bear. I don't think I'm gonna watch season three.

Maybe when season four comes out and that's really good, I'll be like, Okay, I have two things to like power Through. I didn't like the trailer. I didn't like the direction they were going. I'm not interested. I'd rather be in the fantasy of season two of like wow, they did it like I like that.

I don't need him becoming a freak. But oh, I don't even know. I haven't even seen season three's trailer. Wait, what's my watching?

I don't know. I feel like I've said too much.

No, what season in my wa not like City premiered like that was a big I know when I haven't watched it yet.

It's staying on my DVR, but I'm going to watch it. Watched it twice.

I'm pretty happy I did call Spectrum to quit cable. I want everyone to know because everyone's always like, wow, you still pay for cable, and I did. I was able to, through my threats to quit, talk them down to where I'm paying like thirty dollars a month for cable now, So I'm staying with cable for a while. So I have my own Bravo and I've got my DVR so that I won't like lose track of Bravo because that is what keeps me on track. That they're

No?

No, no, coming up, coming up right. Yeah, we'll give you a full lowdown once. Yeah today, Yeah, yeah, I guess we can get into our a.

Yeah, this is our I mean, I don't know what else like. I mean, well, thanks everyone for listening.

Yeah, you're you know a lot of people we meet on the road say they're day one listeners. They heard the ad on my favorite murder. Some people have just joined to some people you know, are watching us to be with us starting from the beginning. Let's yeah, it's all great. I'm babbling because I'm empty by the listeners. Yes, we love We're on tour, come see us live.

Yes, Yes, it's this episode is coming out on October first, and in two weeks basically we start our Spooky season tour where we're going to be in Denver, Phoenix, San Diego, San Francisco, LA, and Portland. So if you live in any of those places, go to That's messed Up live dot Com. We just ordered a bunch of very cool tour only merch, so it's really fun stuff that you

Go away, guys.

Today we are doing for our two hundredth episode, Bear Bear Bear Beer. We are doing PC a fan favorite. You guys have asked us to do this one. We were obviously holding out for reasons that you can imagine. We're resolved and we've done this episode at a couple of live shows, So if you saw it there, I would say, still listen today, we've probably got new takes,

Probably.

As the guy corners the guy in the back of the alley behind some gate, the purp actually comes out and he goes, okay, okay, I stole the phone, but I didn't do that. He drops the phone on the ground, and he takes off the cop like has his flashlight, looks and he sees a ton of blood splattered on this like linoleum floor, and it's leading to the body of a dead woman, and he goes, holy god. And then he calls for a bus, and just as he tells dispatch, I think she's already dead, she gasps for air.

So that just always reminds me of the sloth guy from seven.

Oh god, yes, when you're like, there's no possible way this guy's alive, and then he's like, yeah, oh my god.

Yes.

So the guy asked the police officer that with the flashlight, who was about to shoot a phone thief, was like.

Who did this to you?

And she goes Mitch, Mitch, like she's spattering out the word Mitch, and then you know, she can't really say much because her throat is fully slashed.

I don't know if I mentioned that.

So now we're at the hospital and the cop is beson is stable or white, female, mid twenties, no purse, no id, panties are gone. Sorry I said that. She was found in an empty restaurant, bruising on her thighs. Her throat is sliced. And they roll up to uh, surfer doctor dude. We've talked about him before. He is a doctor who clearly looks like you should be hanging ten in Malibu instead, he's a doctor in like the

She is dead.

So the victim has passed and the detectives all look stunned and sad.

This job never.

Gets easier, and Marishka does have a long bob, which Lisa has mentioned might be one of her favorite hairstyles of Marishka's, of Olivia Benson's time, and I'm, you.

Know, against the patriarchy, but I like most of her more feminine hairdoos.

Yeah, I like it when the locks are flowing and highlighted. And yes, I even like a sumher of some hare with bangs. You know, I'm like in those days too. So top of act one, Benson is Stabler head to the scene of the crime. They're looking for the murder weapon. The cops couldn't find the underwear. It's literally hanging from a chair across the room. So I don't know why

Bary Hail Satan.

So now we're back at the precinct and Finn has done some legwork to track down the symbol and it's linked to a singer of a.

Death metal band.

Like they're like, oh, it's just like heavy metal, and he goes, no, like death metal like Black Sabbath or Judas Priest, but sicker and more violent. And this is kind of a fun little tie in because I see is, of course the lead singer of a heavy metal band called body Count, so he gets to have a little

Want to poke me?

Like?

What a weird fucking thing for Craigan to suggest.

Also feels very old, like let's start a face union page and hope it goes viral. People's social media pages don't really go viral. I mean, like you know what I mean. You get a lot of followers or friends, I guess, but that's not the same thing.

So then Benson says, and Elliot.

And I will go track down count Chocula, which I do think is funny to call this wanna be vampire count Chocula. So now they're at Trey Greenway's place in Brooklyn and it's a candle explosion, there's candles everywhere, white sheets draped everywhere. Benson comes in with another killer line. This guy's single handedly keeping Peer one in business, and I love that as a former Peer one devotee Rip

That's funny.

This guy thinks he's like a vampire prince and he calls Stabler a human like, very disdainfully like.

He keeps going okay, human like, it's so.

Funny, and Stabler goes, all right, ask clown, if you were a vampire, you couldn't see your reflections and he stands him in front of the mirrored glass. Then the guy waits like a beat and then he thinks fast and he goes, I do not see a reflection, and it's like sure, jam. So Benson is with the goth

I forgot?

Benson is like, so, what was going on? And she's like, well, he wasn't attacking me. I love it. He's helping me transition from CI to sang. Benson kink shames her a little bit, and she like, is like, what are you talking about. She's like, well, I feed off psychic energy of others. But Trey has already elevated to a Sang vampire. And Benson's like as in sanguine, which is you know, having to do with blood, and she calls him her

Is my master and I'm willing. I'm willing.

No I want to do this, Like she definitely feels like she's like, I'm in too far, but whatever, and then in amazing editing, Benson throws down the photo of Jane Doe and then it opens up on Stabler like also throwing down the photo of Jane Doe, and the vampire goes, if you must know human, and then he's like, I've never even seen the victim. I wasn't even in the building that night. I was auditioning bands for my upcoming tour and I was shredding with them in the

It turns out it's not even her blood. Dude.

She works at a blood bank and she steals bags of blood for this dude, so blood that people are donating to give to victims of like car crashes and blood.

Yeah, I'm giving blood.

I'm trying to get blood on the rag and if some stupid bitch is giving it to her vampire boyfriend, I'm pissed.

The Red Cross better have safeguards against that.

So Benson like hates this and is like, yo, bitch, this is a crime and she's like, I know, but he can't bite Randoms because he's really scared of getting HIV. And plus the sex is super hot, So we're getting to the bottom of why this girl is in this situation. This guy, apparently, this vampire has good dick. So back at the office, this all checks out and has been a total waste of time, except for the fact that

Now. This is something I mentioned in last week's episode that we.

Were talking about. We were talking about kind of older language. A is stands for a sexual in LGBTQIA, but I remember also thinking that it was allies, and I was like, oh, did I make that mistake or did SVU teach me that? When did I learn that? And so apparently in the eighties A stood for ally among other definitions like a sexual agender, so that closeted people could attend rallies, meetings,

We're a marginalized community.

You don't get to be part of our acronym just for being nice to gay people. So it apparently no longer stands for ally, but a lot of older generations still think that. So here we see the beginning of a beautiful enemy ship between Babs and Stabler. Okay, Stabler said, yeah, I have a tough time keeping up with political correct and then Bob goes, all I'm getting from you is

Okay.

Then they get back to the victim, Melissa. Babbs explains that she is the latest victim in an epidemic of attacks, rapes, and murders of lesbians in the city. Craigan and Liver are like, well, we have the stats and this isn't an epidemic or even a pattern that we've noticed, and Bab says, well, I'm here to open your eyes. But Stabler wants to cut to the chase. He's like, did you know this woman? And Babs goes, oh, yeah, because all lesbians are lovers. Because if two lesbians know each other,

So well, my thing is it's Kathy. It's Krathy Griffin success.

So it's like, but it's as to you, it's a serious Yeah, so I am curious at the improverse all writing. And did Neil Baar play a heavier hand than normal in this episode?

Yeah?

I have a lot of questions for sure, And yes.

I have a lot of questions, but going down like the Titanic is like a really to me. It's a very clever way of being able to also get it on NBC because you're not saying going down on each other, You're saying going down like the Titanic. Like it's a clever way, I think to get talking about oral sex very graphically on network television. So Stabler cannot believe this woman, and Babs is just staring daggers at him. She says she wants to come with them to notify the next

She doesn't.

She denies knowing anyone with that name, and she's like, I don't know many men. And Sharon tells Olivia that she works at a lesbian bar called The Kiddy corner and Alyssa stopped in Tuesday night at eight o'clock in a great mood. She had some drinks and she left, and that was two days ago. And they're like, weren't you worried? And she's like, no, because sometimes she would just get struck with an idea for a piece of jewelry and go to her studio and stay there for

It's just like it's just hit after hit and I'm really enjoying it and.

That unpacked bits. I mean, yeah, it is like it changes the genre of SVO. That's how funny this episode.

It's so funny.

This is this was actually I know, we said we've done this as live shows. We did this as our very first live show because we were like, this has the laughs that can sustain a live show. This episode absolutely, And so Babs goes, Okay, what's our next move? Like she's on team cop now, and they're like, go home, Babs, and she's like, what's your problem? Stabler? And he goes, have you looked in the mirror lately? And she goes,

Like I'm obsessed.

She starts going in on Stabler's ass until Benson interrupts and Babs is like, look, I don't expect Asi mcbig pants over here to catch anybody. But Benson, you seem pretty on the ball and like they're just getting in the call at car ignoring her, and then she pulls out her like final card to play that she's been working closely with Brooklyn Bias Crimes. Go talk to Omar Ellis, He'll back me up. So now Benson and Stabler are at Bias Crimes task Force talking to Detective Omar Ellis,

Still there, But the Kidie Corner, it's Andy Cohen's favorite bar.

Oh the Cubby Hole. Oh great, yeah, I actually one time I made out with a guy at the Cubby Hole. I don't know how that happened, but I was not planning for it. I was quite drunk. So he recommends going to check out the Katie Corner. So the next scene is we run into Babs's assistant, whose name is Rosemary, which is my mother's name, and she is played by

Originally not originally on.

Broadway, I don't think, but the TV version had Sarah Jessica Parker as Fred, the lead character.

That's who Sutton Foster is playing.

And she also was the lead of the show Younger, where her romantic interest was personal laundry spokesperson and mister Mersca Hargate Trevor Langan.

Aka Peter Herman.

Excuse me, So she's very connected to the SVU universe in this way, Sutton Foster, and she's handing out flyers going kill her on the loose, Killer on the loose. It's very like it reminds me of like Newsies being like extractra come get it, there's a killer on the loose.

She explains that.

Chris Bail hated being in Newsies to the point where they'll have they'll have like a screening or something like. He doesn't go to the reunions. He doesn't talk about it. If it's brought up, he like is pissed that it's brought up. Like he's really as upset about his Newsy's past.

I mean, I didn't know that, but he so seems so difficult that like, yeah.

It's like you were young and you did a fun movie. Stop but he.

And it's like a movie that a lot of people love and a door and it became a musical that people love and a door. I don't know, like, get over yourself, go lose a million pounds or gain a million pounds for your next role, sir. So she's kill her on the loose, Kill her on the loose, and then they're talking to her. They're like, what's up, Like, give us some background on, like how you're involved in

Looked her up?

Went toy Instagram, figured out my, figured out the real mystery. And so she's like an actress and a Broadway baby and played like the female lead in Spam a lot this past year. She says she doesn't know Mitch, but have you guys talked to Sharon And she looks like she's just making like a perfectly good, little like not normal face about Sharon, Like it's a little bit scared a little bit, just like if you guys talk to Sharon, because she's definitely gonna be someone you want to talk to.

People is always so wild.

She goes, look, I love a strong woman, but Sharon Harris as scary as fuck. She goes, she scares me, and you gotta go check her out online. She runs a gang called Big Apple Aggressives. Okay, then, of course, q doctor Huang to break it down for us. Just like any other culture, there are subsets of cultures, and aggressives are a specific subset of lesbian culture. They adopt

So put it on a T shirt.

They also found out that her last girlfriend, Janet Burnell, got an order of protection from her last year. So obviously we're hopping in the Ford tourists and we're on our way to go talk to this ex girlfriend and they've got a picture of her with a black eye, and they show it to her and she's like, yeah, that's me. Sharon did that to me. But you know black eyes heel. The real shit happened after we broke up. She goes, Sharon was fucked up. She hacked my email,

It stands for my bitch. I mean, it's just getting better and better. It's so funny. Okay.

So they show up at a protest Babs is organizing, and Babs is a yelling at a local print shop owner nearby because the flyers say Bab's daffy, and she thinks it's prejudice, and she's screaming at this guy like I want a refund, I want them redone and this guy is a bigot, And then the cops are like, listen, babe, a typo is not a hate crime. But Babs can smell the cameras and jumps right in with a message

They see Sharon, but I also love.

At one point, Kathy Griffin's character was like, you would not fuck these up if I was straight.

Yeah, I wrote it down somewhere. Yes, yes, she's literally like she's just like a.

Straight person's flyer.

I doubt it, like she's really over the top, but you know it, and it's it's hilarious. They're like, Babe, typo is not a hate crime, and she's like, actually so. Then the cop sees Sharon in the crowd watching and they approach her and Sabler makes the mistake of calling her Mitch and then he gets straight up punched in the face. And if you've been to some of our live shows, I do do a super cut of all the times that Stabler has gotten his ass kicked, and

So now post.

Punch, were at the precinct and Benson's trying to like, I don't know, dab the wound. I can't even see what's wrong with him, but he's obviously resisting.

Yeah, think about the right and like that that's who they They think we're all Babs Duffy, like Republicans.

We are all Babs, yes, yes, yes, and we're all like this wouldn't have happened to a straight white man. Absolutely, that's what I see us, says, that's why we're so annoying to them.

We're just a bunch of the Babs.

Also, just the name is so crazy, and yeah, it's so perfect.

Yes, Babs Duffy, it's that's for Barbara. Babs is Barbara. Yeah, Babs is Barbara. Uh hello, Barbara Streisand I guess yeah, Babs.

Olivia says.

When the cop asked Alyssa who did this, she said Mitch and Sharon says she must have been scared. She was asking for me. She loved me, And so Sharon starts to cry like she's very upset. Finn interrupts and Benson is like, give us a second, and he goes, nah, I can't purp struck again. So now we're at Mercy General Hospital and sadly our victim is Rosemary aka Sutton Foster,

She was alone. She passed by an empty doorway.

You should imagine like going home from the and doing more rally paperwork at like, I know, take a load off, girl, I know, go have a light beer somewhere.

Girl, it's cool.

You can update the flat like the website later tomorrow morning. Yeah, so wild to rush showman to update the site. Yeah. So she was alone, she passed by an empty doorway. She was dragged into an empty building. The guy put his hands over her mouth, like from behind. She didn't see anything. Rosemary doesn't remember anything about the purp, but heard his voice saying, quote, you dykes have ruined my neighborhood. So she blames herself for not grabbing evidence or DNA,

Like what did I just say? No internet?

And she's like, hello, I have to work on my blog. She's hilarious, very twenty ten. She's like, I have a word press blog. I need to update. There's a rally tomorrow, she says. And Benson's like, there's no rally until we catch this guy. And there's no secret tweeting either, because Babs is like over on her phone kind of like surruptish, trying to type out tweets, and Babs is like, I'm going crazy, and Benson's like, why don't you just relax?

And she goes, I never relax.

I'm always picketing, marketing, I'm always well Marketing's probably right, she says, I'm always picketing, marching or planning and marketing basically, And she goes, I don't do alone very well.

And I can relate. This is me. I don't sit down and relax very much.

You know, this is I'm a bab stuffy on the scale of you know, virgos. I guess She's like, I don't like sitting here while this prick is out there attacking my sisters. And Benson says, Stabler is out there and he's going to get the perp. He hates when people hurt women. Bab says, that's Stabler's got the hots for you, and Benson's like, excuse me, like it gives her, like gives her like what that thought has never crossed my mind? What the fuck are you talking about?

Face?

And she goes that's never gonna happen, and then Benson changes the subject and is like, so you've been marching and active for a while, like, and they start looking at a bunch of framed photos of Babs, like all over the wall, like at marches, in newspaper articles. She's like, yeah, I've been tear gas like she's been a fighter for the cause, you know, of lesbian rights. If not a little bit closed off, but lesbian writes, at least that's why it feels weird to her. She wants to be

They're working on it.

Benson gets serious and asks Stabler question. She's like, hey, ell, can I ask you? Do you ever get a gay vibe from me? And Stabler goes, would it matter if I did? And she's like, don't avoid the question. And he's like, well, you haven't had a luck with guys, and she's like, it's called being married to the job, dumbass, And then the phone rings, Benson answers and Stabler figures out.

So it's like Stabler thinks she's a lesbian. It's very confusing.

She knows he's she's he knows she's dated many many guys over the course of the last eleven seasons, so maybe he's like, I don't know, maybe give it a shot.

I don't know what he's saying to her, but the phone rings. Benson picks up.

Sabler's like, okay, Sabler basically figures out because of her asking that question that Babbs must have hit on her, and he goes, you get hit on I get hit So yeah, bitch, that's the dynamic, Like, no one wants to hit that beautiful face. People want to hit your people want to wipe that shitt, eat and grin off your face. As my dad used to say to us children. Uh uh oh. Olivia hangs up the phone. The purp just got shot at Babs Duffy's apartment. Bump, bum bum.

I shout it for him to stop.

He was holding a tire iron, so I shot his ass and she literally shot his ass, like he got shot in the ass, he fell down and he got knocked out in the fall off the fire get again.

Yeah, you're never gonna keep me down.

Benson says, good work, and then Babs is wearing a coat. She's stressed. She's being consoled by Rosemary. There's a huge mob of people yelling and a gurney with.

A shot perp on it.

Sharon has been released aka Mitch and is blasting through the crowd screaming you killed Alyssa. She starts shaking the gurney and then flips it over basically as Babs looks onto this whole mob scene, very shaken.

So shit is getting crazy.

So now we're at the hospital and we're with the dude who's and he's been shot in the ass, and Stable's trying to sort of finesse the surfer doc into giving away this guy's DNA, like how about we just take a swab, right, And the guy's like, yeah, cool, as soon as I see a warrant and you know, he's.

Like worth a shot. So they are kind of trying to show how police.

Do go around the rules a lot of the time if they can, but there's some checks and balances, like Surfer Doc who don't let them. So they find out that this the purp that has been shot, does not have a tattoo, which, by the way, they've cleaned up and found out it's of a spider. So they examined the man's personal effects. They find a license. His name is Larry Luft. Plus they find something interesting on his phone.

What a twist, What a twist? Bab's a glace, yes.

Babs is like, fuck, all right, listen, I still totally love women. Larry is my secret male lover and I just developed feelings for him. He came to one of our Lesbie Strong meetings and I liked that he was an ally I guess and I you know, I it's wild that she would even let herself like have a conversation with a man, but she ended up, you know, getting feelings for him. Stabler's like, I think this whole Lesbie Strong thing is a shtick to cover for you

These lesbians have jobs.

Geez, Seriously, there's so much poster making going on at all times. They have so many different rallies, posters and flyers, et cetera. Rosemary's addressing the crowd live is scanning and looking for a guy with a spider hand tattoo. Babbs addresses the crowd now and says, listen, I have to tell you guys something. The man they caught is not the rapist. She explains, he's someone who I know, and I'm in a relationship with this man. So she comes

You know?

She promises to now fight for everyone, gay men, trans people, by people, and then as she's you know, trying to get the crowd to not absolutely kill her, Elliott spots the man with a spider tattoo and it's done.

Done.

The print shop guy the right. Babs was right, believe women right.

She was right.

It wasn't a typo, not a fuck up, another flyer the type.

I wasn't hate crime.

This motherfucker was giving himself away with his typos.

They go after.

Him, being like just like an angry fly I maker. Seriously, they go after him. He tries to run, they arrest him obviously. So now he's in the precinct to This guy's name is Ronnie Watley. He's got He's like, I got nothing against lesbians. He's acting very innocent. Cabot and Olivia are watching this interrogation and Stabler's trying to get it out of him, and Cabot's like, why isn't he

Move things along.

So Olivia walks into the room like fucking Sandy from Grease leather Jacket, basically smoking a cigarette, going what's up stead, and she's in like full lesbian cosplay, like swagger in her step. She and Elliott immediately go into their sexually charged hate play that they love to do, where he's like, what do you get out of here?

And she's like, no, come on, let me let me have a shot at the guy.

And she's like and he goes, this is too personal for you, and she goes, big, girls, don't cry, come on, let me have him. So then Stabler leaves, Benson takes off her leather jacket throws it on the table. You know, it's like very hilarious, and then Live starts antagonizing Ronnie going, oh, you just like never get any action because you're kind

What's between your legs, it's really weld.

She's like, she's like very sexually coming on to him kind of in a way, and then he finally cracks and pushes her hand onto his Dick going and you love it just like those other two did.

Every moment of it.

Boom, there's a confession and she goes goodbye, Ronnie, and then he calls her a bitch a bunch of times as she just like sashe is out of the room, and it's kind of one of the greatest Olivia Benson scenes, I would say of all time. So then Babs enters the squad room happy for once, and she's like, you got him, and Stabler goes, she got him with one hell of a performance, I think.

So he's still like, I don't know, you might be gay.

Benson like, he's still like, I guess that was a performance, but maybe you love women. And I know you know she's a lesbian icon Benson. So it's I think it's never too late. We're about to enter season twenty six. Make it happen. Benson asks if the lesbians are still furious with Babs, and she goes, well, about a tenth of them are still cool with me, but Lesbie Strong

It's very sexual.

But Larry unfortunately is no longer an ally and getting shot in the ass made him rethink his commitment to Babs, so they are no longer an item. And Babs also, why are you She couldn't send him a text that's like, hey, by the way, there's cops on my door, don't try to sneak up my fire escape or whatever. So Babs thanks Olivia for making her come clean about who she really is.

She always apologies.

She also apologizes for the awkward lunge and says my gadar must have been off lol, but also tells Benson you are incredibly hot and it's like, duh, the show is kind of built around that concept, and Benson is like, Benson's like, no problem, Babs, We'll see you around and Stabler cracks every time we turn on the TV. And Babs is like, okay, I guess I owe your huge

Well and not reverse because she did do it to Olivia Benson.

She tried it on Olivia Benson. Yes, that's true, she tried. She did it for both of them, yes, but I would say with Olivia she thought it was more of a she was actually hitting on her, And with Stabler, I think she is doing it to a nerve him, like she is doing it to piss him off. So like, you know, I wouldn't want like some asshole to do that to Benson, but I am laughing that it's happening

So amazing, say, the funniest performance on SVU, Like because even the comics that go on the show, it's serious performances. Yeah, serious things didn't happen here, but it was the last things happened.

And I do think she is good in the dramatic parts where like she's scared, or like she finds out that the rapist has a message short. It was very funny too, but in a different in a different way, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. Or we just had Nicol Sullivant and we talked to her about how funny she like she was still bringing humor to the character, whereas I feel like

I'll get to the crimes. I'll get to the crimes. That's that's what we're here for.

I know there's people that only listen to our podcasts and don't watch the show, but like I would watch the Cathy Griffin episode. Yeah, PC because that little goth girl in the beginning, which like the sex is really good and she's amazing too, like they're all like very very good. This is one that if you don't want the girl, you know, obviously there's a murder and so it's just a little less graphic then.

Yeah.

Considering our last episode, dick Wolf even said to Nicole Sullivan, so.

Okay, and that guy should go down by the way for murder because he left her bleeding there, like not even an anonymous phone call to nine one one to help her, like she was just bleeding, Like he didn't mean to kill her, but she just left this poor woman like bleeding out and she has a clotting disorder.

Yeah, he will be charged with murder maybe like second degree or something, you know, but I don't think a manslaughter.

It's like you did want to know her.

When you kill somebody in the commission of another crime, yeah, it's pretty bad.

Yeah, well all right, now it's time so mean some crimes.

Baby.

Well, this isn't crime.

This is about the Lesbian Avengers feminist organization. So I'll just give a quick little overview before I get to a little bit of a c the crime, which is more about the satanic of it all than Okay, you know, a flyer guy flying off the handle.

So a bigoted man who makes posters, okay.

So the Lesbian Avengers began in New York City duh, nineteen ninety two, and they were as like a direct action group focused on issues vital to lesbian survival and visibility. The founders were six longtime lesbian activists who were involved in a variety of different LGBT plus groups. Anna Simo, Sarah Schulman, Maxine Wolf and Christine Dudeski, Marie Honan and

Protest and fiery, and it became kind of a symbol.

And there's a documentary if you want to know more, called The Lesbian Avengers Eat Fire Too, made in nineteen ninety three, so it was about the first year of it coming together. So yeah, cool, cool, ahead of its time. Group of people that wanted to positively impact lesbians and society as a whole. And I think that's what the Apple aggressives were based on. And then this next case is the case Elise Paler and the related lawsuits against

This is the red Herring.

So Elise was a young girl who was murdered in a quote sacrifice to the devil, and then her parents tried suing the band's Slayer for their contribution to her death. Oh my god, I know, but grieving does things to people. Yeah, I'm kind of okay with it. David and Lisa Anne raised their daughter in a royo Grande, California, and she attended a Royo Grande High School. She was described as a wonderful person who was loving, vibrant, enthusiastic, encouraging, and gentle.

So, wow, this priest or something must have like or none or whoever it was, must have convinced him to come forward, right, yeah?

Or did it? I found conflicting things in the same paper. Actually, but some said the clergyman went to the cops, and then multiple sources said that the boy did on his own.

So I just said that, you know, together they went, you know what I mean? Yeah?

Yeah, interesting, Yeah, I'm not sure about their enter car. Usually one of them just calls Elliott stable or because they know him. Personally and then he does some investigating. Yeah, so I'm not really sure how it like exactly went down. But he also gave up the other two teenagers who committed the crime with him, and that was sixteen year old Jacob Deli Shmat and fifteen year old Joseph Farrella Casey.

I don't know. It's so it's eight months. It's like, what they fuck?

So the boys were arrested in charge with murder, gang involvement, raped towards sure and conspiracy. According to Casey. He and this is according to him and his testimony. So he made a plan with Fiilla and Delishmid and they all claim that they did it as a sacrifice to the devil to give their newly formed metal band the craziness to make.

It big, the craziness.

Furilla denied Casey's version of events, but admitted to being the first to stab her. And he's quoted by The Tribune, I wish it never happened. Since it's happened, I always wish that God can bring her back to life. I can imagine how her family must feel.

Well.

I wish she thought of that before. Doug odom from the DA's office. He's the chief investigator, he said. When he asked Casey why they committed the murder, he said in quotes, it was to receive power from the devil to help them play guitar better. By making this perfect sacacrifice to the devil, they would gain more craziness or nuts that would make them play harder, play faster, and by making this perfect sacrifice to the devil, it might

Yeah, they picked you know.

There was I don't know if we talked about this, but someone was talking about Wayne Gretzky and how some dad went up to him once was like, hey, can you give my son advice like how to practice and blah blah and do this and that my son's being going to like give advice Wayne grett And then he gave some bullshit advice and then when the kid walked away, Wayne Greats, he was like, wa. Wayne Gretzky was like, when I was a kid, you'd have to pull me

Like is this for you?

Right?

But I just think about this, like they really wanted to be musicians, but they didn't want to practice and put in the work.

I hate them. Okay.

They picked a Lease because she was blonde haired and blue eyed virgin, and they thought those characteristics would make her the ultimate sin against God, which doesn't make sense to me, but neither does anything else that they thought.

You know, I don't know.

Yeah, And again this is according to Casey's confession to the police, that they lured her over there to smoke some weed to Nipomo Mesa eucalyptus grove, and then Dela Schmidt attacked Elise from behind with a belt wrapped around her neck and he began to strangle her while Faiella began stabbing her in the neck with a hunting knife.

This is really very graphic and terrible and.

It's really sad, and she's so young, and like, oh, the other boys got into the stabbing as well, and then it didn't end there. So while she was bleeding out, the three of them beat and kicked her body as she prayed to God for help and called out to her mother like so many victims do. And then they just watched her slowly bleed to death from the twelve to fifteen stab wounds.

And then, according to I know.

And then, according to court records from the San Louis Obispo Tribune, it's called the Tribune, and it's like, honey, there are other tribunes, and just do that. Can you give it a little flare? I have to fucking Saint Louis Obyspo the Tribune. As Paler moaned on the ground, Casey stomped on the back of her neck. I mean,

Means nothing to me, yeah, yeah.

Then appear from school told the cops that del Schmidt was actually like bragging about it and said that he returned back to the to do necrophilia again. And according I know, and according to court document, said that Delischmidt started to pull off Paler's pants when it was clear she was dead, noting that the boys had already chatted about having sex with her corpse like that was part of the Plano Casey even though he is a monster, did tell them that they should leave instead of raping

It was thrown out.

As you can imagine, the judges quoted by medium dot com saying there's not uh, there's not a legal position that could be taken that would make Slayer responsible for the girl's death. Where do you draw the line. You might as well start looking through the library of every book on the shelf.

And it's like spoiler alert. We are as a culture. They are not. They are not reading.

But I wonder if they might be maybe also fired file the lawsuit to get more eyes on the crime, Like maybe they knew like that it would just bring more press to it, and maybe these kids could not get away with it. I don't know, because that does seem but also, like you said, when people are grieving, they do wild things.

But also that didn't deter The parents were not deterred, and the Paler parents filed a second most lawsuit that claimed Slayer knowingly distributed harmful materials to miners, and it was dismissed again. The teens actually also tried to blame their crime on death Metal and that that's where they got the idea to sacrifice the virgin as part of a devil worshiping ritual. And if no one, if you have not seen Jennifer's body, I was suggest watching it.

But the parents did receive justice for their daughter's crime.

Casey pled no contest to first degree murder and was sentenced to life with a minimum of twenty one years with an opportunity for parole. Deli Schmidt also pled no contest to first degree murder and was sentenced to life, but with a minimum of twenty six years possibility of parole, and Fiorella reached a plea agreement in which she pled guilty to first degree murder in exchange for a sentence

Wow.

David Palor, Elisa's father, said at the court hearing that it's a parent's worse fear and lifetime plan to outlive their child. It's even worse knowing she was murdered, tortured, and raped as a virgin's sacrifice on the altar of Satan so that you can earn.

A ticket to Hell. I just thought that was poetic.

Damn.

There's a photo of Joseph Ferrella looking back at the Paler family before walking out of the courtroom March nineteen eighty seven. And he looks so young, like babyface, but all shackled up and an orange jumpsuit, but also dead in the eyes. But it's an intense photo because he

And that was March twenty twenty four. So he's back in jail and I don't want him to go.

He's still at Valley State Prison and chow Chilla and knew some in quotes said in this Tribune, mister Casey must better understand the internal processes that led him to commit the crime and hone the skills he will need to manage them beyond the controlled environment of prison. And that was in an open letter that was sent to the DA's office. He found him that he still he knew some basically thinks that he still poses an unreasonable

And change and when you're young and andre or whatever, like I unders I believe in that so much, but I just don't trust all the stuff.

He said everything correct, He said everything correct.

Yeah, but.

It's hard to it's hard. But his next hearing is from March twenty twenty five. And then fear Ella's still at the High Desert State Prison and his next hearing is June twenty twenty six, and that'll be a parole suitability hearing.

And then.

And then Dela Schmidt is at the Correctional Training Facility in California and his next opportunity for parole is January sixteenth, that's my dad and your husband's birthday, So that's in twenty twenty five, so that'll be a parole suitability hearing as well. So those are two pendings, so in the next couple of years they'll be up for parole again, all of them.

Damn.

It is kind of like it is kind of like, yeah they were teens.

It was they were young, but like it's pretty violent, like and going back and raping the corpse. Yeah, yeah, just zero zero what is it called, like respect for human life? A fitted like oh horrible, horrible, Well, thank you for researching that. I'm I'm glad there's not a bigoted copy shop owner, but not happy to hear that there were psycho teams really listening to.

Metal and like her, she looks just so young and.

Yeah yeah, yeah, well you know it wasn't going to be our two hundredth episode without a crime. That kind of makes you very sad. So let's get to our iconic guest. Our guest today. We don't need to even introduce her. She is a comedy legend. She's a stand up comedian and the star of I would say one of the most influential reality shows My Life on the d List, but you know her today as lesbian activists and recently out bisexual bab Stuffy. Please enjoy our chat with the legendary Kathy Griffin.

Hello, what a dream?

Right?

Oh my god, bab.

A dream so like for our listeners, like, we obviously have been wanting to get you for this episode forever, never thought it would be possible, so excited to have you. And then as we're doing our research, we're like, oh my god, there's a full My Life on the d List episode which both of us watched. That is a behind the scenes of you talking to Neil Bhart, who's been on our podcast twice, talking to Noel Bear, him

Yeah, Like so was it a lot more serious than you really anticipated?

So it was, to this day the hardest action gig I've ever read.

Wow, I was.

I was fearful because as any fan of the show, you know, they have like these Tony winners on week after week and these highly trade My god, you know, Carol Burnett won an Emmy and Margaret had done the show, Robin Williams had done the show, and so the legacy was there. And I still say it was the hardest eleven days I ever worked. Wow, curious Gary, I don't be hard like they weren't nice to me. I mean, it's really freaky intoity and.

They work fat so how much like on the deal List there was a thing where they kept being like cut, cut, cut, and the light and all that. Was that editing or was it really like oh fuck, I'm like I'm taking too long and they're mad at me.

Oh oh no.

No.

First of all, what was happening was my Bravo show, very low budget, non uian cable show, My Life on the d List had get permission. First of all, I remember it was a big deal. My agent had to call Dick Wolf, the creator personally and beg bright the Ding Ding, beg for it because there's a whole thing where we weren't allowed to use it and they don't

That episode, that's you could not tell I'm not even I'm really like not giving you just a compliment because you're here.

You could not tell like you're great in that episode.

Like, I was just watching it because I haven't watched it since it came out, so I thought i'd better bone up a little bit. Yeah, I'm gonna just say because it's been literally decades, you know, they they gave me what's called a really good editor.

Yeah, I am.

I haven't watched the episode in all these years because I thought I would cringe too much. But I was just watching and now they really covered my ass, like they somehow. Well, first of all, the director, I'm to win an Oscar an Oscar and he okay, So I have to tell you something. So there's a scene I had with just Chris and Marishka and I just kept screwing it up. And it's the scene where I confess that I'm not really just a lesbian bisexual and I subbed the guy.

Okay.

So I can't remember if the scene had crying or not. I just know it was a lot of lines for this lady right here, and I kept screwing it up, and then I was improvising a lot yes, and Chris kept stopping, going what what'd you say? Like he would he was started cutting himself, going what are you doing? And then finally I was confused by his reaction because I had run into Robin Williams in real life about three weeks earlier, and I said, hey, I'm going to do an episode of Law and Order and I know

It was funny the first time, but I also love that this like also informs the relationship you guys had your characters on set, Like you guys were like banging heads the whole time.

You know, Well, he obviously was attracted to me and didn't help to handle it. And that's his problem because I have a sex appeal that regardless of I've I'm playing a lesbian or you know. But it is funny as I rewatch you know the episode man that Inning team, Well, how they made my shitty acting come together and I'm watching it now going, how did the other actors even keep a straight face? Oh wow, they just start laughing at me.

That's a big thing because in my life on the D List, you said, Neilbert wrote this with you in mine, but we assumed you improvised so much because it was so funny and great and okay, so yeah, we're yeah, we did not like.

You said, for a while.

I wore them down, you guys, Okay, yeah, Look, seriously, this is a union show. And I remember one night I think they had to stay like an extra two hours because I kept screwing up. Sure enough, the director came over in that scene where I had described how Robin Williams said, go ahead and improvise, and the director said to Chris Maloney, look, I'm going to do a couple of takes where just to calm her down, I'm gonna let her improvise. And remember Marishka was my rowling

Like there's a scene where you meet him on this you meet them on the street and you call him Assi mcbig pants, And I was like, that just feels like something that Kathy Griffin came up with as opposed.

To take credit because people love that line, but it was written by Neil and Dan Truly was the other writer. And I don't know which, either Neil Bayer or Dan Truly wrote that Assy mcbig pants. The first scene that I shot was an outdoor scene with Jess Benson and Stabler and they were getting out of a car or about to get in a car, and I come out of the building and I do the scene and they say cut and they say, you know, back to one. So I'm like, of course, we'll do take two. And

Gosh, I'm upsessed. Oh my god, I named my.

I named two of my four dogs Olivia Benson, Elliott Stabler.

Oh Benson bracelet right here, right there, always ready. So people come on the show and they always say like, Marishka's so funny, Stablor so are like as a comic, are they really funny?

And oh they're not coming?

Yeah funny, because that's the one thing.

People are like, she's hysterical, and I'm like, I bet, but yeah, thank you.

They're definitely funny for dramatic actors because it is it's amazing. It's dazzling to see how soon they go from hut after like a very serious interrogation scene to coofing around with each other. And you know, the kind of cool thing about the back stuffy episode, as I call it, is they really went there with the are they or

We didn't know until we saw it on the d List episode. You were watching it with your mom and you were like, they cut out the.

Kiss, and Neil bar was very upset and Dan Truell and they wrote the episode. And to this day, I only ran into Dick one time after that, but I would love to ask him because I heard that. He personally said, no, it's too far, and I was like, not for bad to Duffy.

Yeah, but also not for SVU and also I may.

Be the only guest star in the history of the show who got to make out with both of that. Oh yes, because they left the kiss with Chris Maloney in, but they cut out the Chris with Murcia Carte.

It's so good. It's the kiss with Chris where you're like, call me some John, it's so good, John.

I mean, okay, wait, you were talking about Marishka and Chris being part of your show. Well we have to talk about Ic being part of your show. He's in there a little bit where you guys do a full reenactment with a body and you talk about anal tearing or something.

I mean like I fell in love with him. I fell in love with him because first of all, I know him more as shit, So it was almost I had to adjustice seeing him in the acting environment, even though he I would argue, was on that show longer than he was putting out records, But he was so gay to play on My Life on the dal List.

Yeah, it was. It's an amazing button to that episode.

But I just remember thinking, like, what a pro, Like he's so used to doing this coming from a wrap background, and he's just on the job and solid, take after take after take. That's what I still can't get over. How every crew member, whether it's the person you know, the grip who's carrying the wire or the gaffer who's putt in the tape here, every person was so on their game from doing it week after week after week,

He did not mention that he's in the episode.

Do it do it dummy? Yeah, And so to tell it to this day, I walk around, go do it dummy, and that's just look, I'm not I know comics.

I don't know like real actors yea.

And so it was just fascinating for me to see like hardcore actors day in and day out. But like I said, the way Chris Mushka, I have to deal with the personality of me right where I'm like, oh my gosh, I can barely keep my line straight. And then Matthew Lillard preps in that very unique way. Guess who was the guest star after my episode. Sharon Stowe.

Oh yeah, she did a little arm Harlowe.

So I tried to scare Maloney and this was so much fun. I told Schery later. I was like, you know, I know Sharon pretty well, and trust me, you are going to work around her and her schedule. And I was hitting him so hard that by the end he was like, well, let me tell you something. When she shows up on that she didn't go real fast. Then we went up with a movie star behavior, like I was so evil, Like any chance I could get to fuck with him, I had to.

Oh my god, I feels like it works. It seems like you really knew how to get his ass.

I mean I was doing it for the character natural, yes, of course.

Well the thing is is, like I know they you're like they gave you a good editor or whatever, but I really did think you did a really good job of Yeah, you're this bossy bitch.

I'm sure like that. You know, you can channel the comedian.

In you to do that. But then there's like a part, like the part with Marishka, where you're like really scared, Like I really felt that from you, Like and in the Dalist episode, I was.

Crying because, like I said, I was crying because I was thinking how over my head was. So you're right, the crying scene I was nervous about. But then when it came time to do it, I had planted to cry a fall.

Yeah.

Well, like because even the way that Liza Manelli, by the way, iconic that you just for your what you call your dinky little non union reality show, you get Eliza Minelli to come on and be your acting coach for this episode.

That was like, was amazing. First of all, she was also on lawng Order. You know that, Yes, and so we when we got to go to Liza Bonellie's freaking apartment and she's she's smoking a city. She changed clothing. I remember I changed just well. And I remember my assistant, who to this day says, like, of all, she was my assistant for seven years. Their name is Tiffany.

She was on.

Yes, and she's like, I've seen Liza ben Ellie's vagina, and I was like, that's my girl. Because Liza and I being old timey show folk, when it's time to change clothes, we're just like used to be assistant being there or whatever. And it was so funny. Liza changes her clothes pants off, there's Tiffany like do I turn away? And I'm like, no, he's one of us.

No amazing, but.

Yeah, getting getting acting advice from a freaking Academy Award winner who also had been on the show was like chef's kiss.

I do have a question. You know this set you were in pulp fiction, one of my faves. You don't want to I carried pulp Fiction.

I pulp Fiction won the palm door I can because of my three lines. But go ahead with your insults.

Oh no, I was just gonna say, you know, he seems very serious, and I was wondering, like what set was more serious, I guess, or maybe I don't even know what a Quentin set was.

Like.

You know, first of all, the Quentin set, he is very LetterPerfect, So thank god I only had three lines. So even though I met Quentin because he was really close friends with Julia Sweeney, who was It's pat On snl and in the Cings comedy Troupe. So one thing that's a weird fun fact is that there are five groundlings in pulp fiction. Like the guy that plays the game, the little scene I'm in where Marcellus bing Raims wakes up after Bruce Willis hit him in the car, and

Wow, that's amazing. I honestly want to talk about you know, we can. We want to talk about more about your career outside of us to you, if that's okay with you, we are I mean, I'm tour now.

I know.

I'm so excited to see your tour. I mean I think we're both like very excited to see how great you're doing after all of the bullshit, after.

Seven years of shit. Yes, like I after the former president of the United States opened an investigation on me at the best of the Attorney General of the United States put me on the no fly list, the Inner Polist, and the Five Eyes List, which is the terror watch list.

Oh my god.

And I was interrogated under oath by two federal agencies within the DOJ, the US Attorney's Office and the Secret Service, and they were very seriously considering charging me with the crime of conspiracy to assassinate the President of the United States. So when I hear all these other comments, especially the guy Kromits bitching about maybe I was canceled. Okay, first of all, you probably have it coming, like whipping your dick out, and don't be a Holocaust denier or some

I talk about this and arguments all the time with people. I go all these freedom of speech bros. Did people have your I don't remember all these guy comics. Really, nobody happen in your back? And I'm like that everybody turned on me. Let me like, people think only the right wing turn on me. No, No, it was left right and center. I mean when I was fired from CNN for New Year's I read it on the ticker. Nobody even bothered to call me, and I lost about

I crack up when people are like, oh, but they're all apologizing now. No.

No.

A lot of people think, hello, well, if you've had it coming and to be out of work for six and a half years because of Donald's right.

I know it's not they only have at me.

I'd be I'd be heard, but I know, so it was crazy.

And then these canceled comics who are still selling out MSG even though they're canceled. We have to be like when are they allowed backs?

Like thank you?

I always say, the only person I know that's ever actually been canceled is you, Like there's no one else I can think of.

It was you and the boys.

When it's one of the boys, they start call the wagons. And I'm sorry to say, it's still as bad in stand up as when I started and my dear departed. Joan Rivers and I would talk about this all the time because Joan would say, Kathy, it's as bad as it was for Philip still, or when I used to talk to Phyllis, and Phyllis would say it's as bad as it was for Tony Fields when I would talk

Cunt.

Yeah, all my death threats where I'm gonna shoot you in the count for your count got you in the Kant countymin count down, You fucking con't. I'll put your continent's place. Your cont is a terrorist. That's like their favorite word. And remember this is the religious right. Yeah, so yes, I've made enemies. And although I will say in my new tour cadey girlfriend, my life on the PTSD list, where I'm playing Carnegie Hall, which I thought would never happen again. I don't even mention Trump in

I've never been to Carnegie, so I'm exciting.

Oh, Carnegie is magical and people don't know it's a great place for stand up because the acoustics are so amazing. The audience just they show up in a more of a theatrical way than a club, and it's just magical. And it will be my sixth time playing Carnegie, which is the record for a single female comedian to play Carnegie, not as part of a charity show, not as part of a musical lineup, not even with an open I have no opening act. I write all my own material

Wow, what not only like the Trump thing? I Oh, I'm a shit talker. I love that you say everything And it was so cool. I didn't even know this that, like, after you worked on Seinfeld you talk so much about him, they had you back and I'm like, what an icon for a shit talker that instead of.

Losing a job, you got another job, Like what a hero?

I just yeah, I really they wrote the episode for me. I'm Seinfeld because I did the episode when I was a total unknown. Then I got my first HBO special, which back in those days was a really big deal, which is now Max and I told the story that Jerry was like kind of an asshole on the Senate and I said, look, I'm just this little medium level guest star dealist. But you know, like I was like, really, couldn't it be nicer? And never in a million years that I thought he would see it. So he saw it,

I have to just tell you I watched every episode of Life on the D List when it came out, like I was watching it in real time. I was like a best I thought it was so funny because you know, there's other reality and it's just regular people, and this was like a funny person doing a reality show that wasn't like stand up, you know last Comic Stand. It wasn't about the stand up. You were just a funny person living your life. And I just think it's like it really it was a revolutionary reality show. I

I mean, it was so sweet.

I loved yours were just so naturally funny. I was lucky because a lot of people would be different than lot as soon as the cameras were and I really enjoy taking real people that are naturally funny, like my mom and dad. And when we would put the camera on,

I totally did, especially Maggie, like, yeah, you know, and what a beautiful thing for you to have I had.

I'm so proud, and I'm so proud of them because I get a lot of gay people to come up to me and say, watching that show with my parents made it easier for me to come out because they saw how tolerant your parents were. And I say, well, first of all, they were drunk, and second of all, I think you know. The great thing about my parents on the Dealers show is they never got on a soapbox and talked about gay rights or whatever. Well I

Amazing. I don't know, I don't know if this is just out of nowhere, but so much of your stuff with celebs, I like hearing about celebs. Is there anyone that you thought was gonna be the worst and then you ended up being shockingly surprised at how great they were?

Well, I can tell you the thing that gives me a ton of gratification, and it's now at the age of sixty three, it's happened a lot, and it's kind of one of my favorite things about doing stand up all these years, which is I really love it when

I'm sure you got so much wisdom from Joan.

Is there something that you think about all the time, or like a piece of advice that has, yeah, that you've thought of.

For a long Yeah.

Business. It showed business. So we talked about finances a lot. And you know, Joan was loaded, and people underestimated her at every turn, and she had so many lives she had, you know, after her own husband took his life, she took time off and then she did a Broadway show and people were like, oh wow, she's a really good actress. And when she was kind of blacklisted from nighttime, she went and had a daytime show and won an Emmy.

Wait, as we were talking, a message pops up from Pam Lowshack, saying, how you do two and a half hours with one and a half lungs?

I had lung cancer even though I never smoked, and so they took out half of my left lung. And so I should actually say I'm not just the only female comic to play Carnegie Hall six times, I'm the only one and a half lung female comic to do a lot of things. God damn, So, I don't like the way you two girls are flaunting your two lungs in my face right now.

I get it.

You're so superior.

Well, I'm gonna see you at Carnegie Hall. I opened it up, please please do so. I can't wait.

This was all right, I'm not, by the way, I'm not thumping you. So this is a hint. No, I.

Feel like you're no.

I can tell the look on your face, the answous No, Pam, Pam. It's a hard pass. These bitches can pay, just like it comes out of my back end. And god damn it, no comps, no.

No fucking comps. Thank you so amazing, Kathy. This was a dream, so amazing.

Tells you guys are awesome.

That was insane. I did have to grab a white claw, like I didn't know how to handle. I have to calm down.

I mean, I want to people that are sober handle all their emotions and energy, like I truly don't even know.

I couldn't even sit still.

I it really is just such a pivotal moment to meet her because we missed I didn't meet Joan Rivers. That's someone that I always thought I would meet or you know, there's these icons, and to be able to meet such an icon, Yeah, that gave so much. I mean she she gave us all the bits. No, not one person we've ever interviewed just straight up has all the all, like just.

Had at it.

No, and like I love that everybody that we talked to, I mean, I love every person we've talked to. We've had great interviews. She's an amazing, well oiled machine. I had a great time on set. They made me feel welcome. Kathy Griffin's not afraid to be like, No, I was fucking up, actually, Like it was really intense. It was I was out of my depth. Here's who helped me,

Fucking telling the truth. She really is one of our best. And yeah, I love it.

Even when she's talking about her photo, the photo that she got in trouble for, She's like, it's a protest photo. Some people thought it was funny, some people didn't. She's not like I wish I never did it, you know, she's like she stands by it. You know, she's a fucking icon.

Of perneerance and integrity and integrity, and.

While people don't think she does because like reality d List like all of that at the time didn as huge as it is now. And just being there for the gay community without like painting a rainbow on your head, you know, it wasn't the goal as like I'm gonna do this for the gaze, but it was very much like a safe space for a gaze.

And I'm sorry, Like, as a woman, I grow and like I've always been into celebrity gossip.

That's mostly what her material is about.

And I think she gets discounted because of it because people need you to do a full hour about I don't know, fucking pizza roles or whatever, like people need you to do a full hour about something else. I think it's great that that's what she focuses on, but I think it's like why a lot of people have discounted her because she talks about quote unquote like female and like gay stuff, which celebrity gossip falls into, you know.

Yeah, and it also felt I mean not positive, but validating and be like, no, stand up is still filled with misogynists and you know, assholes everywhere, and that it hasn't really changed, even though I do think it has in terms of there's more women, you can wear what you want, you can talk about what you want.

Yeah, not.

But definitely still Oh I mean no sexist. Yeah.

I think what I'm saying is like, the reason why I think that people don't put her up there with like the greats as much as they should is.

Because sexism and her sexism.

Yeah, I've always loved her. I cried when her mom died. I don't want to tell her that in the interview, but I cried when Maggie.

And she's so cool that I forgot about the lies of Menelly. When you brought it up, I go, oh my god, I can't believe. Yeah, she's so powerful that I'm like, oh, yeah, you talk to Liza Menelli and.

What I mean?

I think, honestly, we've all been waiting for the phrase Liza Minelli's vagina to be on our podcast, and we may happen today, and that's what I'm really excited about. But I mean, let's move on to a post mortem of the episode, because I'm.

Just going, wait, no, I do want to say one more thing. Oh yeah, so you know how Robin Williams set her up? Yeah, I was set up like that once.

I did not read.

I think it was of my cement, but I didn't read the chapters you were supposed read. And so I asked this guy Dennis, I go, fuck, did you read it? He goes yes, and there's a worksheep.

I go, what kind of dog? What's this? What's that? What's He gave me everything? Fake?

And I failed the assignment, but I didn't read. But I just trusted this guy. And then at lunch or wherever I come down, I'm like, what the fuck And he was just like laughing. I was like what kind of dog is it? And he was like a white, little fluffy, fun one and it was like I think it was on a you know, like an Old Yeller style dog situation or something like please. But I did get fucked over, But I love that Robin Williams fucked

Can you do clean? I go no, why would you? I sure I can't. Why would you want me to do that?

Right?

I'm kind of surprised that she was saying that too about Maloney being so stiff about the improv because like he's done Wet Hot, he's worked with all these comedians, like he likes to do comedy, so I guess it's just he compartmentalizes, Like when I do comedy, we can improvide, but when I'm on SVU, we stick to the fucking script.

But I love it, And it's the extra direction from Marishkatz, like it is just so formula, like you have to move and hate your marks and like do exactly what they need because they're on a time crunch.

Yeah, Yeah, they have a dramatic story to tell. I thought she did great. I thought she's I think she's excellent in this episode. Babs Duffy is maybe a top ten guest star character for me for sure. Okay, should we move on to this the post mortem of the episode. I mean, I don't know what my thoughts are. Don't be pissed that lesbians are moving into your neighborhood. They're

The best podcast ever.

Let's move to we wouldn't give as much space possible for the Kathy interview because it's just the fucking best and we talked to her for an hour.

Uh So, this week's what would Sister Peggy Go?

And just to reiterate, do not steal blood for your boyfriend from the blood bank.

Are you kidding?

He's worried about getting HIV.

I guess he can't be a fucking vampire, then don't yeh, don't risk your job for a fucking man or a vampire.

I did watch Abigail again and it is so good. It's so good.

You have Oh I see the picture of the little girl in her tuto and there's like blood splattered on it.

That's like the thumbnail. Okay, So for this week, what would Sister peg Do?

This is our weekly segment where we direct you to some kind of resource that will give you more information about what we talked to about in the episode today. And we wanted to point you this week to the documentary The Lesbian Avengers Eat Fire II. The film covers the first year of action by the Lesbian Avengers and it is only fifty six minutes and it's on YouTube, so we will link to that in our stories from the day this episode came out, and that will always

You so much for that, and next week we'll be doing that episode blinded from season nine, episode seven. So get on with your fine selves, live a great life, do a good deed. I'll see you later.

Thank you so much to all of you who have been listening to us, some of you since episode one, some of you more recently. We love you guys. Thanks for celebrating our two hundredth episode with us. Bear Bear Bear, Bear Bye.

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