Learning Curve w/ Ernest Waddell

Of the law and Order franchises, SVU is considered especially watchable.

We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the vicious felonies.

These episodes are based on. These are our stories.

Done done, Yay.

Hello, Welcome to That's Mess Step, an SVU podcast.

My name is Lisa.

Hi, Hi, my name is Kara, and you guys know the drill. Every week we dive into an SVU episode, the true crime it's based on, and then we chat with an actor or a person involved with the show. But first we catch up, We binter, we gab Lisa up.

Well.

I don't know if anyone saw on Instagram, but I did find the Maloney Men's Health in person at the Walgreens in Old Town in Chicago, and I'm happy to have it in my possess.

It was hard to find. Yeah, he looks great.

I was at airports, I was at jewel I was like running around and I couldn't find and I was so happy.

To have found.

I should have bought a few more maybe I will, but happy to have him in my presence.

I think that's awesome. I think it's really impressive. How I mean, everything on the internet or like on Twitter last for it feels like two days and Stabler and like the SVU hype has been going on now for like a couple of months. He just keeps doing photo shoots, the butt, the earrings. I mean, it's just like it just keeps feeling like he's really riding this wave, like

I want it.

That's the thing, Like these people could want whatever they want. I want better for Benson. I don't want a man who like toyed with her emotions for decades, ditched her ass, no call, no showed, and yeah, finally when his wife dies is like, fine, all right, I'll give you something.

I don't want that for her.

I want someone who's going to go out of his way to be with Olivia Benson knows the prize that she is and support her in her lifestyle. Maybe a man with money who can just take care of Noah while she's at work or something like. I don't want a man who won't go to therapy to be in Benson's life. That's not what I want for her.

And I feel like if they were real people, they would be they would they would just like fuck one time and it would like not go great, Yeah, you're what have we all been talking about for twenty years? Like they would it would be too weird. They'd be like I felt like I was with my brother. It would be weird.

You know, you're right.

If this was real life, he would have definitely cheated on his wife and they would have fucked in the back of the car one time for sure, and then he would have felt guilty and then she would have switched partners. Yeah, if this was real life, there's no way there wouldn't be cheating.

Yeah, I think it's definitely hotter to leave it up in the air forever, and I think that's what Neil basically has alluded to with us. But anyway, I wanted to get your take on it because it feels like every we were getting many many tags. We need you to weigh in on this, We need you to weigh in on this, and like I, I just I think it's very clear. I don't mind your ships and who you guys are obsessed with, but I just am not, Like I'm really not a huge like Benseler forever kind

Don't need to see it was it was a hot little photo.

I'll say that.

Yes, of course I like people having fun on Instagram, you know, like yeah, yeah, but it is wild they are.

It's like, bro, you're sixty, get off the ground.

No.

I love a troll, I love a trick, I love a kiss. I like it all and I'm here for it. I just would love for our character Olivia Benson to get a bigger love story then you get, you know, any.

Because also our our Marishka Hargatea is with a much hotter man in real life, so we don't need to worry about her. We're just talking about Benson the character.

Yes.

Also, I just wanted to really quickly bring up just to follow up, because a couple of people wrote in to us about the woman that Lisa met at the store who went silent when Lisa suggested, oh, do you love to paint?

So I get a text from Kara with a photo of the employee, going, is this the girl? And I think I've been drunk. Okay, I have to be honest with the listeners. I have been drunk. I've been drunk for days. I something happens to me in Chicago.

I know because I've texted you a few times and been raided silence. And it wasn't until I sent you a picture of the daughter girl that I got you to write back to me. And I was like, she's in Chicago, She's in her Chicago bubble.

Oh yeah, there's I've not been checking emails truly. Nothing. There's nothing. But then what happens with drinking is everyone knows. Then the next day you got to start drinking immediately or you're not going to survive. So it's like, you know, it's like chasing this hangover Wild Beast, and I love it and it feels I feel lucky and perfect, but I don't know if I will survive the week.

Well, thank you for confessing. But I was excited for this text, and so she said, I send her this text because I'm at the same store and I'm having a weird interaction kind of with the girl that works there, and I'm like, this has got to be the girl. So I and I don't like to take pictures of people when they don't know. I don't like when people post those on Instagram and stuff like look at this guy's fucking outfit on the subway or whatever. But I

We are frequent shoppers.

Yeah, our printers broke it. I mean, there was all this kind of stuff going on, and but what was funny was that a couple of days earlier, I had checked the That's messed Up email and a couple of people had written in their theories about this girl. What interesting theory was maybe the minute that Lisa spoke to her, she recognized her from That's messed Up her voice and

Painting scene here in Highland Park.

Listen, Yeah, I mean I know one of the bartenders from what is it Junior?

He makes rugs. I saw him on selling some cool rugs.

But if she was a well known painter, I don't know if she'd be working the register, but maybe not, you know, maybe because I remember the you know, the guy from American Pie that like accidentally ate the pubes or something like he was like the creepy sherman.

In that movie American Pie.

I read somewhere that like he's been a server and people are like, wait, I know you, and it sucks for him because yeah, he's like day jobbing it. But I don't know. I don't cut all this. No, I don't think she's a good painter. I don't think she's a good communicator. And I think she's a maniac. And we'll see her again soon, hopefully.

I'm more up lad.

I'm so glad that I like did some investigative journalism and found this one, and now I can put a face to the weird mess.

You know, I have been complaining for a while.

I know, I'm not even at my home, but my air conditioner's been broken for so long, and then finally someone came this week.

To fix it.

Finally, and I'm out of town. They're like, we need someone. I go, someone has to come. I don't care if I'm not in town. But the guy calls me and He's like, I can't see it. I don't see the address, and I'm explaining the building and I go, I don't know what you want from me, sir, And it's like, I'm so close to getting this new air conditioner. What

I'm going to go home to a brand new, nice cold apartment.

But I just couldn't believe being so close to it and having this man just be like with very we had a language barrier situation, but I have a foreign father, so I'm like able to push through and really understand. But like I was like, I don't know, I don't know how to tell you how to find the door.

There's a building, there's a pay I don't know. I don't know what to tell you. Somebody easy.

If you have the right address, your place is not hard to find.

It's like, so I'm so fucking frustrated, but so happy.

I Also, I'm in the news some topic that's interesting to us, so we talk about a lot. But I'm the only fans. There was some controversy and they took it back.

Yeah, happy to see their you turn on that.

Yeah, And they're making it seem like it's it's I wish businesses were more upfront where it's like, yeah, I guess the bottom line, we need you guys, Like I wish it wasn't like for much time. It's like bullshit, fluffy language on how they've changed their minds, and it's like, no, you don't care about anybody but money, and you need to admit it, you know.

No, And it's like you're only fans. You're not Cameo, you're not Patreon, Like you're trying to turn your platform that was built by sex workers into like a place where celebrities can do cooking shows or some shit, Like we have other places for that. Like that's just not what you are.

Yeah, it's all very very frustrating, but I'm I'm glad it's back in action.

I think it would be be fun if only fans could also incorporate non sexual stuff so that like all that stuff can live side by side, and sex work online wouldn't be so stigmatized, you know what I mean, Like, let's get I don't know who Am I thinking of some random celebrity Jennifer Aniston to do a cooking show on OnlyFans that's completely non nude and it's side by side with someone that's doing.

They are kra.

What do you mean?

Are there are people on Only Fans just.

Doing regular I know, but I'm saying, like more mainstream it, like people don't really know that it's really associated with the sexy stuff, right yay? Yeah, I was saying, like, I know people are doing that, but I just think it would like.

Or the idea what I is in the culture is very much like, oh, now you got to get a real job.

I guess you got to get a real job. And it's like, what is not real about it? Yeah?

What makes uh sitting somewhere in an air conditioned office more or less of a real job?

It's like fucked up.

The way people think about everything is wrong and we're all right and it sucks to be better and smarter than everyone.

I just had to have I just had to have a sex work is work conversation with my husband, who I usually considered to be pretty woke, but sometimes he's on the wrong side.

Of things, and I had to talk to him about it?

What was his point of view? He was for only fans to get shut down.

No, he wasn't for only fans to get shut down. He was just kind of like, I don't know. He his point of view was crazy, and I was like, but he also has a cold right now, And I was like, I think you're talking out of your ass and you're not making any sense, and I think the dake will is getting to you, like sex work is work and it's not there's nothing wrong with it.

What was his point? Are you to tell us?

Yeah?

Honestly, it was so crazy that I was like, no, you're you're wrong. I like talked to him about it, and he was like, Okay, you're probably right.

Yeah. I mean the fact that you didn't tell me about it even off there means it was probably something very crazy.

I know, I've always struggled to make sure that lee'sa and my husband's stay friends.

Well, No, because I actually just saw a post someone shared it that I liked and I'm opening for my friend Jared Freed, and a lot of his materials, like dating advice in his podcast is mostly dating stuff, and so I saw something that was really interesting where it was like, it seems like, are you okay?

I just I was trying to do a quiet sneeze.

Sorry, Well, from what I saw, it looked like you just puked, So I was more worried, sorry to interrupt you.

And I interrupted you even more by trying to do a quiet sneeze. No, I'm just glad you're not puking.

But basically this tweet that I saw, it was like, men want unattached sex so often, that's what they like. If you were a man that wants that, why aren't you hiring sex workers? My friend just sent me this meme today twe minutes ago. Yeah, so it's like, men, you want no strings attached sex, and there are sex workers that provide that service.

Yeah, yet you don't do that.

Instead, you manipulate women who you know want a commitment, and then you act crazy when they expect a commitment, but you are tricking them to get what you want and ignore what they want and then calling them crazy. And it's like, obviously you can find women that want no strings attach sex as well, but especially listening to the advice that Jared's like fan base wants, it's mostly like this guy's treating me like shit, but he keeps taking me out and I don't know what to do.

I don't get it.

Yeah that said, I mean, if you want to have if both sides want to have casual sex, like you know, nothing wrong with.

That, But that's not what we're talking.

I think the point, the point of the meme was the hypothesis of that Twitter thread was men enjoy the manipulation and trickery to fus someone.

I'm getting away. I'm getting away with fucking somebody and not putting in any of the emotional work or the.

Commitment instead of finding someone that also just wants to fuck. Yeah, whatever, we're let's start that episode before I fully generalize everyone.

I mean, my sister's husband's a great guy.

Okay, oh yeah, you're like naming the one good guy, you know, that's so funny. All right, Yeah, let's get going. We've got a great episode for today, and lord knows, we could fucking talk forever about whatever. All right, we are doing learning Curve Season thirteen, episode twenty one, A

You didn't sing?

Ali han lahandro a lajanro No? But I love that song.

Yeah, that's why I'm shocked it didn't go into your hair.

I'm sorry it didn't even come into my mind. Thank you for putting it together for me, because I do love that song. So this scene and the scene of them in the restaurant is kind of like cross cut with the scene that's happening. We're at a Rundown apartment where a young pregnant woman is like asking her man where he's going and he's like, I'm going to work, lay off me, and like then these dudes show up. It has, you know, an air of gang to it, Like I don't want to judge anything too quickly, but

I'm here, so.

We're already, you know, there's a lot of clues that this is a gay bash incident, and he obviously doesn't want his family to know or to be involved. Ken admits to Finn that Alejandro is more than a friend, and Munch breaks the news about the engagement. Finn does look a little shocked, but then immediately jumps into cop mode to try to like find out who did this

Yeah.

Cragan's at a conference by the way, and Munch seems to be like filling in as like Daddy for the day. At the hospital. Amorrow goes to see Finn and so clearly people are still helping Finn get information even though he's not in the case anymore. So Omorro goes to Finn and is like, you know, I think one of these guys had a tattoo that matches this gang called b X nine, and Finn's like a gang a bus route they named this gang named themselves after a bus route,

Is still hers.

Next thing we see is all these purps being brought in. Alejandro and Barry Flocco the first victim, id all of them. Szar says he'll testify. So this whole piece of the episode is kind of wrapping up. But it's only the end of act one, so what's going on that We're definitely gonna head somewhere else, as we usually do on these s few journeys. Next thing we see is a

Also, maybe I'm wrong, but I feel like Tony Hale's an SVU fan, Like I think this was a big deal for him.

Oh maybe we maybe we can find an interview or something and see.

I just get the vibe that he is into Benson and is paying attention to what's happening. I just get that because that's just that's how I feel. Yeah, and you know he's a Sex and the City person.

Do you know that? Oh? Really? How do you know?

Well?

I saw him in the show.

But wait, he was in the show?

Yes, who is he?

When Samantha is feeling good about her body and does a naked photo shoot, he is the assistant to the photographer.

Oh, Lisa, these are the things about Sex and the City that you clocked that I well.

I mean because he, like the photographer goes, we'll put music on to make you feel comfortable, and she goes, I'm comfortable, and like strips down and puts her leg up, and then Tony Hall makes a face that we can imagine of just like you know, raw, you know jaw drops and he's googling her when he should be working.

Oh wow, see I must have seen that before I knew who he was, and I have maybe I haven't revisited that episode. But nothing gets by you with sex and the city. So I bet you he does love Benson, if that's the vibe you're getting. Anyway, he's in the hospital, He's like, I wasn't sexually assaulted. They were calling me like, you know, homophobic slurs, but I'm not gay. And he says the van smelled like dirt, okay, and he and weirdly,

Wow some kind of you don't want people to know you're gay, you might not want to pressure charges. Sure, Also, what does dirt smell like?

Like an earthy, earthy kind of thing.

I don't know, Like I think if you got into a van that like like a guard was like a gardener's van or something, or a landscaping van, you'd be like, I smell dirt. I don't know, but good question. He doesn't want to press charges. He just wants to go home, So yes, you could. That could make you think, oh, this is like a guy that's closed.

We talk about this all the time that pressing charges and going through the court system and the cop sometimes isn't.

Worth it to people, you know, like oh for sure, for sure.

I just like, no, I don't want to testify and fuck all of you.

Yeah, yeah, I just feel like I thought that was like more kind of prevalent with sexual assault because people just don't believe women as much. But if someone like most men would probably be like, oh, somebody beat me up out of nowhere. Yeah, press charges. But you're right, everyone has their own story and their own feelings towards the cop. So who knows?

Because I also bet he was sexually assaulted. Maybe not?

You think he was, Maybe not.

Said they kicked him in the balls.

Now we're at the hospital and Finn is with Ken, who tells him Alahundra doesn't really have any family in New York. I guess besides this, like gangbanger cousin's boyfriend, his father stopped speaking to him when he came out, So that's probably why Allehandra was like, don't tell my family about this. So now the cops are kind of brainstorming, and they're like, maybe this is totally unrelated to these

Yeah. I saw that, but it took me forever to put her.

I just can't believe what a powerful actor such a small role to get nominated for.

She's in like two scenes the whole series.

Yeah, I want to make Salter nomination.

Where's that?

Yeah? Really, where's that? Yeah?

Gurly, they're not ready. They're not ready for Megan. That's good, collect I just I don't know so I caught. No, I'm not pittying actresses against each other. I hope they all win.

My favorite line of Meg's when she goes coming up with ideas for emails my job.

Yah.

But I love this actress. This actress is so good. I first saw her in the movie Happiness, which is like an extremely fucked up movie.

I love her. In Hacks, she was in Atlanta.

She had an amazing episode with Donald Glover, and she's.

Just like one of these three character actresses. I gotta find out where I know her from.

I'm sure you know her, like her IMDb is extensive. I feel like she's just a very good actress. She's the head of the upper school named Joanne Parsons, and she's you know, she looks very like sort of startled by the whole police presence of it all, and like talking about this teacher and the headmaster says the circumstances of Sims's departure are confidential.

Wait, she's in your favorite show. She's in Claus.

What is she in class?

She's Gladys Coleman Perett. I don't know how many episodes does it say?

Four?

Huh.

What's embarrassing is when I'm like, where do I know this person from? And it's like from SVU, you idiot, That's like, that is why you're doing this.

It's not from anything else. It is a CEO.

You don't recognize her from anything else.

Orange County. She's in Orange County.

That's my favorite movie one of We were just talking about Skyler Fisk, isn't it.

Yes, Mike White, you know we.

Were just talking about it, Yes, Colin Hanks, we were just talking about it. I think she's just one of those people that, yeah, like pops up in all kinds of like things, because she's just sort of like, she's very good. She's very unassuming and very good. I think so. Anyway, the headmaster is basically like, I can't talk to you about this lawyer's YadA YadA, And Joanne has a face like, uh, like she clearly wants to talk and no one's letting

I'm a huge Betty Gilpin fan.

Yeah, yeah, And I love we love Glow, I mean I love Glow.

Do you love never seen glow?

Oh? I feel like you'd really like it.

I would, but it's hard to commit. Sometimes there's a lot. There's a lot out there.

But if you don't know by now, you got to google her because we just gave you twenty of her credits. And she's kind they're kind of playing.

But I'm not surprised by her because when I saw her in Nurse Jackie, not that I thought one trick pony, but I'm like, okay, hot, beautiful, whatever, get it. And then with every role she just like blows me away and does something different. And you know, not just because she colors her hair sometimes, like truly does so many different types of acting and I like that well.

And I also think the cool thing is that even in Nurse Jackie, where she's kind of like a full bitch, you do like her, like there is something likable about her even though she's like this very selfish bitch.

In that show.

Yeah, I don't know.

I don't because when you said bitch, I'm like, she's not a bitch. She's but yeah, she's like.

A I mean, she takes advantage. She's always like can you do my shift?

Yeah? Like you know, she's like spoiled and like you know.

From what I remember of Nurse Jackie, which I watched a while ago, So they kind of play her the detectives. They played Betty Gipen's character a little bit. They're like, yeah, we know about the thing that happened, and she's like, oh, so you know about the thing, and like then she kind of gives them information, but they're just like bluffing her basically, and she's like, as soon as I found out what happened, I went to the administration. They said they would take care of it.

So she's definitely like she's like, I can't say anymore.

I'll get fired. So they go back to Rick and they know some allegation has happened, because now Natalie has sort of let that out of the bag. Rick's like, I didn't do anything. I love being a teacher. He's really sticking by his story. He's like, three weeks ago, Joanne called me in and said someone had made an accusation.

It's kind of nice.

So they got out to Jersey. They talked to Ray Gaberdelli at his produce distribution warehouse thing and he basically admits to it immediately. He's like, I did it, and I do it again.

My favorite, that's my favorite. I love that.

I love a confident criminal that's like, yeah, I'll do it eight hundred more times. That's maybe a dream. That's another dream part of SVO. I would love to be someone that's just like, uh huh, yeah, and what did it?

And I do it again? And he's like, I didn't want my son to be humiliated in public, so I took care of it. So they go talk to his son, whose name is Luca.

Yes, this is an issue for me.

There's no way a working class Jersey family is naming their boy Luca. They're scared of him being a little gay. They're calling him Luca.

That's it is very popular name in Italy.

I don't know. Oh, it's an Italian name. Okay. To me, it's like Hillary Duff's kids name.

You know, it's like a Hollywood there's Skyler, there's Pippin, and there's Luca.

The newest Pixar movie is called Luca, but it's set in Italy.

Oh okay, Because to me.

Do you remember the present you bought for Rosie.

Yeah, but there's spell different in my brain. I understand everything now it's Italian. I rest my case.

I am rong.

Okay to me, I was.

Just like I thought it was just such a hipster name that I'm like, there's no fucking way his name is Luca.

But now I get it.

But you're right. But you're right though. This episode is from like what twenty thirteen or something, and I think, oh, no, it's from twenty twelve, this episode, and I think that's pre the name Luca really having like the hipster moment that it's been having.

Yeah, so it's an Italian name. Yes.

Oh and I just saw Goberdelli and I thought giored Elli. I'm like the chocolate company. They should Why is he doing manual labor.

He's the heir to the Jiared Chocolate fortune, but he's just randomly selling vegetables.

I just want to be an heiress. Okay, I would be great.

But you recognize this kid who plays Luca. Did you ever watch Thirteen Reasons Why?

Absolutely not.

Okay, He's a major character in Thirteen Reasons Why, and I've seen him in a couple of other little things. But that's I think his big thing. I stopped watching that show because I literally hated it so much. It made high school look like a full nightmare all the time. He asks for his mom to leave so he can like talk to the cops about like what happened to him, and he says, I don't want to talk about it, like I'm over it. He's gone from the school. That's

He seems genuinely blindsided.

And Cabot's like, go back to the school, bet the details of Luca's story. So they all go to the school. We find out that Luca disclosed to Natalie. She said she was teaching a lesson about human sexuality and Luca got all read and started tearing up, and that she later asked him about it. He confessed that mister Sims had unzipped his pants and asked Luca to put his hands on his penis. When Luca said no, he started

Like?

Are you gonna put on an APB for a guy with a huge boner? Like I don't understand why that's important, but I guess in this situation, it is important to trip up a kid that you think is lying about being molested. So Amara is like badgering him a little bit, and I feel like if you talked to a female victim like this, Benson would have shot him. In the face, but she kind of lets him go because she knows

He was just an absent father, So like the gay thing is like, I think it seems like Ice was more hurt that Ken didn't come to him to talk about it. But Ken's like, you were never in my life, Like why don't I even know who you are?

Why would I ever talked to you?

And so that's kind of the case where like with this episode with Munch and then like Ken has a close relationship with Benson, like he has close relationships with people around his father, but not, Yeah, no, it took a while for them to get tight. Like he would help with case anytime there was a gay case.

I is showing it. You know, I need your gay help.

So now the detectives are shooting the shit about Luca with their checking their theories against each other and everything, and they're like, wait a sec Like if this all happened with him getting molested a month ago, that's one thing, but his grades have been slipping for a lot longer,

She's like, why do you have to come in?

What's happening? Like she's very breathless and like nervous this woman, and they are like, her house is kind of amazing in New York. It's in Brooklyn. It's like, I don't know, a huge, like it doesn't even seem like a brownstone. It feels like a free standing maybe one of those green Point houses or something. It's like multiple floors, lots of woodwork. She's got a huge, hot pink bedroom and everything in her bedroom is as Luca described it.

The bed, the pillows, the book, it's all there.

And then we get a scene of Joanne in the precinct with her leg up on a chair and Olivia is taking photos of her inner thigh and it's like, can you inter skirt up a little bit?

And I feel like a lot of our viewers are probably.

That was a really crazy scene for NBC. She's like fully spread eagle.

Yeah, And I've never seen Benson ever take a photo of like injuries or of anything before.

So it's just like someone called in six so she had to do it.

She's like, I'll take the pictures, and then in the next scene she's holding the camera. So the next scene she's interrogating Joanne and she's like, Luca's lying. She starts to get overwhelmed while she's defending herself, and then she fully keels over and faints, So it's very Jane Austen. At the top of Act four, Joane Parsons is out on bail. Her rich aunt, who apparently gave her this big house in Brooklyn has gotten her out on bail,

I was excited to see her.

Yeah, And she gives us a lot of great insight about Joanne. She's like Joanne never left for anything sketchy, she didn't molest anybody. She's just very emotionally vulnerable. She had a nervous breakdown when a fellow teacher got married. And like Rollin's like eyes are like okay, red flags, like this woman is a lesbian. But of course Martha Stewart's from that like older generation where it's like she was very sad that her friend was unavailable to her

Girl, do you know? This off topic?

But in my head it all tied together while you were talking. So because thinking who belongs in a different era? Do you remember in the Hills there was like a girl that came from New York that worked. That was another intern from Vogue who was like killing it and made Whitney and Elsie feel insecure about herself. She knew the names of every flower and seating arrangements and was so professional.

What was her name? It doesn't matter. She's the creator of Glossier.

Whoa.

Yeah, so maybe she belongs in this era.

But when she knew the names of all the flowers, that's what like when you said people who belie at a different time, I'm like, maybe this home ach girl, but yeah she is. I learned that she created glossy. Wow, not that impressive. She's a rich kid. Her parents saw her. She's like a hair finny girl. But glossy packaging is nice, that's true. The products I could give her take, but the packaging is beautiful.

Interesting. I've only used a couple things.

Oh.

Also, I was at a party and someone was using Thrive lip gloss and.

I went, oh my god, do you have a podcast?

I have the same lip gloss And they go, we found this on the floor. It must be yours, and it was mine, but they were using it.

Do you have a podcast? I think you should ask that to everybody you see wearing a Harper Wild bra, like, oh my god, you have a podcast.

But also in the era of COVID, who's picking up a loose lip gloss at a party and putting it on their mouths?

They were putting it on.

Yeah, A group of three girls were like this girl. Mind is like, yeah, we've all been putting this on. I go with a lip gloss you found. I mean I took it. It's in my purse. I'm using it. But I just think it's like, while they all used it, my mouth is on the phone right now. I think I missed that detail when you first said it. What Yeah, fuck, okay, anyway, I really through you for not really through me.

I cannot believe that anybody is picking up lip glass off the floor and fucking using it.

It's like a wand but then I put my purse.

But when we went went to like walk around the party again, it fell out of my purse again, and they're like, keep your thrive in the bag.

And wow, Lisa, you're what if you were just at that party just letting girls use it and being like the code, the promo code is SVU, like trying to get trying to man on the street, get us more advertising dollars. So Rollins and Benson leave that school. Basically, Okay, Joanne is into women, So what's going on? Like why wouldn't you have just said I'm a lesbian? Like why

And is like, oh who is she Virginia Wolf?

So like very much connected to another era, and they could at times they couldn't let anyone else say.

The line, you know what I mean?

They were like, well no, no, Rollins isn't reading, you know, Like, yeah, Munch is the only one who would know that.

And that's no shade to Rollins. I'm not, you know, I'm not. I don't think she's an English major.

Yeah, yeah, So Munch tells Olivia, here's a hint from somebody also from another era. Bring her some flowers or a sachet of lavender when you meet her. So interesting, and they go and now we're at the hospital and Olivia does bring her a bouquet of lilies, and she's fully delighted, and I mean, I feel like she's every romantic lesbian's dream is to have Olivia Benson bring them lilies to their mental hospital, right, Like that's a lovely gesture.

Also, it's like this motherfucking Luca ruining adult after adult after adults lives. Yeah, with lies, crazy pair. I mean, come on, I mean no, he's victim.

He's the but he's the victim.

It's tough, he's the victim.

But I hate this. Yeah, no, you do think he's like because he is kind of just like finding random people to pin things.

And the guy Tony Hale got the shit beat out, not only fired all these accusations but beaten up physical harm. You know, this woman's getting arrested having to show her coach to Benson for a photo shoot, and you know it's it sucks.

Yeah, yeah, no, for she's in a mental institution right now.

I mean, it's not going great for anybody that's been in contact with this kid anyway. She basically is like she saw Luca and Natalie doing it basically in the rare book archive, and she's like, she looks so sad.

She promised she would stop, but she didn't.

So it's like, obviously her feelings for this woman are clouding her judgment because she didn't go right to the authorities. The next week, right after she discovered them, she is brought into the headmaster's office and that's when they accused Rick Simms, and she's like, Luca's clever, he came up with this cover story. So she is so blinded by her crush on Natalie that she can only think that Luca is the mastermind behind all this, when like clearly

No, I just know what's gonna happen. I'm annoy it.

So in the next scene, Finn is rushing to the hospital because Alejandra had emerged to see surgery and is now in a coma. And when he gets there, he finds out Ken can't go in the room because as a courtesy, he called Alejandro's homophobic dad, who came and then flipped out when he saw them holding hands, declared himself next to Kent and got Ken kicked out.

Actually, this is so I wish I remember the exact wording, because Pat Reagan is so funny. But I listened to his podcast with Kat Cohen and he was saying, like, gay rights is just being able to get into the hospital room, Like it's so sad. It's like such minimal thing where it's like the goal is just to be able to like go into the hospital room with someone you love, like, it's so fucked up there people committed to making sure people cannot be in a hospital room.

With your loved one.

But he said it really funny, but the sentiment is important.

Yes, No, that's what I say to people about my brother and his fiance. I'm just like, to you don't think they should be able to be in the same room together, like if anyone is against gay marriage, and like, you don't think that he should be able to go visit him in the hospital or have access to any of his assets when he passes away after a forty year relationship.

And what do they say?

They say, Oh, well, of course I want them to have those rights, but they think all those rights should just be folded into civil unions. It's crazy anyway, I'm dealing with ill people. Finn wants to talk to Alejandro's dad. He's like, where's the dad? I want to talk to him. Unfortunately we never see this conversation, and I would have loved to have seen it.

I really would have loved to see Finn an.

Alejandro's dad man to man having a conversation where it's like, look, our sons are in love. What are you going to do about it, but we don't see it. We find out that Luca's dad is like, doesn't he's not really remorseful about having the guy beat up, and he's pretty like happy that his son is banging a hot teacher.

Like it's a very different sentiment than that's why I signed earlier.

Yeah, yeah, it's a very different high five sentiment when your son when a female teacher as a relationship or assaults excuse me, a teenage boy than the other way around.

Well, yeah, because I feel so often when you know, my night's at comedy club's like arguing about rape, fun past, but it's always.

Like, well, men get abused, what about boy?

And I go yeah, And usually I have to convince men it's a problem. I go, Usually, like the guys that try to bring up that men are also abused are also the same men that are like, hell, yeah, this teen fucked a hot teacher.

You know.

It's like you guys are actually not the ones taking it seriously, and you're the ones who say it's different, and you're only throwing it in my face because of you, you know, you want to prove something. But yeah, it is interesting where I'm like no, I usually feel like I'm the one convincing people it is still a crime, you know.

Yes, yeah, Okay, So now a huge twist happens where Luca Munch gets a call that Luca's gone off the deep end, locked himself in the biology lab.

With Natalie as his hostage.

Oh my god. Okay, So now in the next scene, we're close up on Luca and Amara is just trying to talk him down, and he's just like, she did this to you. She's the perpetrator. Luc's like, I bought us train tickets to go to Montreal. I told her I could speak French. I said we could get a place there.

She said no, she.

Said we had to stop and not tell anyone. So then as the camera like moves out, we see that he's holding a scalpel in his own hand and he's covered in blood. And then we spin the around and we kind of see that Natalie is lying dead on

I just looked up the director because I was like, that's pretty interesting. We've not seen that on SVU, and he actually is. He's a camera operator. So he's been a camera operator for tons and tons of stuff and for SVU ninety three episodes camera operator, and they.

Let him direct an episode more than one. He directed six episodes moving up. Wow, So he has like.

Two directing credits SVU and Criminal Intent, and then he's done some cinematography.

But he's a camera operator, So that's really cool.

I wonder if that happens a lot, if camera operators move up to director, if that's like a thing that happens in the business.

Or if that's even I didn't realize that was even the plan at hand. Yeah, you know what I mean, Like, if someone's a production assistant, maybe they want to produce later, yeah, or if you're I don't know, I don't know too many jobs.

That's why I'm saying, that's why I'm wondering. I'm wondering if that's like a jump that gets made a lot. I'm thinking of the cameramen at drag Race that have been cameramen there forever. I don't think that they're ever going to like do directing, but maybe they want to, who knows.

Yeah a nice union job, but yeah, so I just you know, as a camera operator, maybe that gave him extra to the bits of directing, knowing how to total voice thing.

But then this is very interesting.

Luca goes, basically in response to the whole plan about them away together, she laughed. Why would she laugh? And that reminds me of that famous saying men are scared that women are going to laugh at them. Women are scared the men are going to kill them. So obviously being laughed at by a woman set this kid off. But also she had been molesting him, so there was a lot of emotional stuff going on there. She told Luca she was getting married in June. I want to meet her fiance.

Who's this fool?

Yeah yeah, And he's like, I loved her, I really loved her. And then Amaro gets close enough where he can get the knife from him from Luca, and then the final scene is Finn at Alejandro's bedside and Alejandro is still unconscious and Finn's just talking to him and he's just letting him know, like the guys who did this are booked for federal hate crimes. They're never getting out. And since you're going to be my son in law, I just want to say I'm sorry we didn't get

Yeah, star studied twisty, multi victim, multi perpetrator, lots of stuff.

Because Luca, it's like, your.

Parents are bad parents and now you're going to jail for life, so have fun.

Have fun in prison, not jail prison. I finally remember that.

Yeah, I remember when I find that found that out. I was also shocked.

I did not know there was a difference between the two and Betty Gilpin.

That's a Bingo SVU moment, laying in a pile of your own blood bingo.

Yes, well, I'm interested in what terrible Oh god, is it really value? Okay, Well, if anyone's gonna tell me about it, I'm happy that it's you.

So this crime happened in New York City. So I'm assuming Kara, you remember, I know you remember it.

No, I don't really.

I was gonna tell you this is one of my only ones where I'm like, I don't know about this one.

Okay, I'm shocked, shocked, I know.

So it sucks like they I don't like it.

It'd be weird if I love the crime, if.

You were like, this crime is really tickling me.

Yeah, can we just have a bank robbery one time? JK it's sbu Okay. So basically there's nine attackers in this story. They range in age from sixteen to twenty three, and they're all part of a gang that's called the Latin King Goonies. Okay, so these are the Goonies. Okay, Wait, so do.

You know what is the difference between this and the Latin Kings, the regular Latin Kings and the Latin King.

You would be an amazing investigative reporter. Did not even cross my mind. I just I took I took it at face value and went all right, subsect of the Latin Kings, maybe it's West Coast, and then this is the East Coast contingent or Bronx in Brooklyn. Maybe there's I have no idea, but I'm sure Hannah's looking up.

Hannah will figure it out.

There's one article here that says the Latin King goonies aspired to join the real Latin Kings, but honestly.

I'm not one hundred percent sure of the difference.

Okay, So, and they all this attack happened in a home in the Bronx that was vacant for a while. So this group of guys moved in there as squatters, and they.

Hosted loud parties.

And weirdly, the house was across the street from a public school. I don't know how they got how that happened, and they called it the gooney house. The neighbors called it the gooney house in the neighborhood. And there were a dozen piples guarding the place. Yikes, which I like.

Put. You know, I love pipples. I love pipples. I just think you have a dozen until two nothing good is going on. Yeah, yeah, you have one or two rescues. I love you.

Yeah, just breedy.

I love when Cardi visits her pit bulls and she's just like in a head to toe gown and there's all these dolls. Yeah, so one weekend in October of twenty ten, they attacked one thirty year old man and two teenagers. So one of the teens knew the thirty year old man and wanted to join the gang, and another was just a loose teen. So they grabbed the first teen on Sunday at three point thirty in the morning and took the teen to the house, slammed him

This went on for hours.

It sucked, so then the gang members just let him loose and told him to keep quiet or they would hurt his friends and family, and since they knew each other from the neighborhood, he took that very seriously. So the teen walked himself to a nearby hospital and said he was just jumped by a bunch of strangers and

When he arrived for the party, I was not a party.

So he shows up at Osborne Place and Morris Heights in the Bronx to the goony house and he brought to the party ten tall cans of four Loco with him. Obviously, we know what's going to happen is not funny. Nothing is funny about this, but this part is funny. And I just for Loco. He's ready to party with ten tall boys. It was already ten tall boys baby, and the witnesses say he cleaned out the store of its

Fucked up.

They sodomized him with a small bat, they burned him with cigarettes, They whipped him with a chain, and this was because he was gay. And then they made the second team attack the thirty year old. And so while the teen was attacking the thirty year old, they all like shouted gay slurs at them while the teen hit him in the face and burned him with cigarettes. And then they made and then they made them have sex.

What are you?

I also just can't imagine any any part of my being. If five people came into my home in the middle of the night beating me asking for money, that I would go, nah, yeah, I'm keeping this money.

Like I don't I take it, you.

Know, I just I don't understand why it's one against fi Fine, one guy, you're gonna fight him five against one. It's fucked up. And that's like kind of the vibe of this whole crime. You know, it was nine against one, nine against two. These are cowards, These are it's a gang attack. These are like a group of people beating the shit out of someone that can't fight back in any fucking way.

This is really disgusting behavior.

I do think about what people would take if they came to my house, and I'm like, there's not that much. I mean, maybe our laptops. I don't have. I never have cash. I just don't have much.

We have a lot of technology TVs. They would take your TV's laptops.

They would maybe go to the garage if they had an inside scoop.

Please, I don't told about the treasures in my garage. I have some of Liza's clothes in my garage. Those are up for grabs. Yeah, if you live in la and you want some clothes, I have it. Well, Kara has them, but yeah, I can't imagine fighting. But they didn't need much. That's that's the weird thing.

Like one of my old friends, she got pistol lipped in Lincoln Park in Chicago and beating the shit out of They broke.

Her jaw all of it.

It was like a brutal attack, and they went to McDonald's. They like took her debit, like the first charge was McDonald's. Like they've ruined this girl's life, her whole Josh, she still like you know, has gaps in her teeth for McDonald's.

Wow.

So some of these robberies are weird when they're not Like I understand you want to steal a Picasso, some diamonds, right, a Kardashian necklace that I understand, but beating the shit or.

Yeah, I mean, like I understand like if you're stealing to feed your family or something, but if you're just like teens going to McDonald's, it's like kind of not the same situation.

Yeah.

So the brother finally gave in and gave them a thousand dollars in cash to debit cards and a fifty two inch television. But then things get kind of strained with this brother. He handles everything after this poorly. And I know, I always say, we can't expect people to acknormal when abnormal things happened to them, but it's weird. So like they tied him up and everything, and then so the brother freed himself three hours later and called the cops, but didn't mention that his brother was being

Wow?

But yeah, they keep getting tagged and it's it's scary. But there's more bulletproof glass than ever before. It is scarier. Yeah, So that's the only thing I can think of why this brother would only mention the robbery. So Monday morning they go to the house to investigate, and they saw the thirty year old man passed out on the landing from alcohol he consumed. But the cops had no reason to believe he had been a victim of a crime,

An address to someone.

He told the cops he was robbed near nineteen ten Osborne, and cops tried to get a warrant, but didn't have enough cause to get the warrant. Then late on Tuesday, the second teenager walked into the Bronx police station and gave a version of what happened. And none of the three men in their first interviews with police told the whole truth, not one of them, and so that kind of plays into the episode, a little bit of like why don't you want to let people know you're gay?

It's all by age.

I don't think they wanted to release any of this information, which is.

Sad, but everyone is allowed to have privacy.

But once the second team gave the same address, they were able to get a search warrant, so they go Wednesday morning. The officers enter the house and were surprised to see it was immaculate, fresh coats of paint, the smell of bleach. They covered everything up, bleach every down, like bleached the fuck out. They said it was one of the most clean crime scenes they had ever seen. Rugs were ripped out, linoleum was ripped out like they fucking went at this house. But the detectives were able

Those pubes are basically invisible.

Yeah, But the most crucial clue for police in this case happened Wednesday when a note was slipped to a police officer by someone outside the crime scene. And this is always my favorite because it's not even like good police work or detective work or when you watch forensic files. This happens a lot where it's like a case is dead and then eight years later someone is like, I have information, and then that's how it's solved. It's very rarely the cops JK, I don't know. But someone gave

And this happened.

So one of the suspects mothers told ABC New York station WABC TV, so I'm assuming a local news affiliate of ABC. In quotes, she was like, this cannot be my son. He could not be involved in such a heinous crime. And it's like he is. But I just found that interesting that like a common thread is this. So seven suspects were rested right away. One suspect confessed.

And then the.

Rest of the guys, like the charges were all mixed back. Some burglary, some robbery, some attempted gang assault, stuff like that.

So that's what the charges were.

And the shortest sentence was two to six years. And like I said, the leader got fourteen years, So everyone's in between there, some four years, some you know, thirteen years. I think you guys all know what in between means.

And so they went to prison.

Some are you know, there's a lot of local news stuff of like this person tried to get out on bail, this person's getting released, this person's that this person had a hearing.

But yeah, that's that, damn.

And now we have a guest that is a regular, So I think you guys are in for a treat.

Okay, our guests today were so excited to talk to him. You've seen him on the Wire One Tree Hill, CSI Miami, but you've been seeing him for decades regularly on SVU as Finn's son Ken Randall, played by actor Ernest Waddell. Here's our chat with Ernest Perfectest.

I'm Liza Highness, I'm Kara Hi.

I mean, you've been on SVU for so long, but your first episode, you were not finn Son, you were not Ken, you were a man named Terrell. Yeah, so how did it come about that you came back as Ken?

Did you audition? Did they ask you? And how did you feel?

I was when I played Terrell, I was literally like in an.

Opening of an sview episode, like playing basketball, Like I don't even know if you could make out my face. It was just a quick scene, you know, playing basketball. But after that, I just saw audition. I just went in for finn Son and I booked it and that was that. I mean, it was it was It was your typical you know, acting job.

I don't know if it's typical being iced sy sid and like it's this part that's like been sort of recurring over the past like fifteen like for the space of fifteen years or something.

Right, we've seen you grow.

Yes, yes, a long time. Many changes.

That's one of the cool things that that's that's been cool about coming back to the show is just throughout the years, I get to see the different ways people make television, you know, all the little changes, you know, companies buy up different companies, and there has just been so many changes.

Over fifteen years. But it's pretty awesome.

Anything noticeable, like on the set, like from your first episodes in like the early two thousands to like now in more recent years.

I mean, so many things.

I mean when I first started, they were shooting on film and I you know, I remember specifically, like this one time, getting in trouble because they said, oh, you know, if you if you need another take, just go ahead and take it, just let me know.

And I asked for a couple takes and they were like.

Oh, these are costing you know, ten to fifteen grand a take.

Let's let's pick it up.

Yeah, you know, And then we've talked to Neil bar a couple of times, and we do love him a lot. He knows everything, and he was telling us about how we created your character and the purpose and all that. Did you guys chat about that?

Were you?

We chatted a little bit. He probably told you more than he told me.

Oh, Neil was just saying that he gave Finn like a gay son to help him grow as a person and become better and more open minded than you were, like the vehicle to make Finn a better person. Yeah, so I was wondering if you knew like you got you knew that up or maybe not?

Or was that just Neil gossip?

I got that impression from the role and you know, I see he gives off that kind of you know, the swag. So this was a different shade of him and it was cool because I felt that for ice, like every time I would come in, just like I think he was very aware that Okay, it's time for me to like give it a different side of myself and right like not.

Just mister tough guy all the time, Like this is a full the softer side of Finn, the soft and Ken is an incredible person.

Like we uh, we like jam packed watched all of your episodes and he's like helping dig up a body. He's helping me. He's like he's a social worker. He's helping this kid like work with his ish. Such a good person? Was that always the plan to make you an angel on the planet?

Hey, I get the scripts, and but it's great. I mean, yeah, I'm going to fight crime next right.

Well, speaking, since you have been on for so long, do you have a favorite DA or defense attorney? Where if this was the real world and you needed a lawyer, who would you be hiring?

Probably Barba Wow, okay.

Just because you know, like I got to sit and watch some of his scenes and I was just I just thought, Oh, this guy's a brilliant actor.

I just you know, I think I just like.

To work with a movie Our listeners want to have sex with him.

I can see that.

There is number one? How was it working.

With our favorite probably our favorite guest star?

Ludacris?

Ludacris. Ludacris is fun. You know, It's just fun to be around rappers, that's all. Yeah, just bigger than life personality.

That is a rule.

That is a definite rule to life. It's just fun to be around rappers.

True, does he does he come to set with a rapper? Like what is the rapper energy? That's fun? Is he getting high on set or no?

No, no, just you know, just supreme confidence. I just remember saying, oh, you know, where do you live? Or I was just trying to chat him up, make conversation, and he was like, right now, I kind of live everywhere.

You know, I'm a citizen of the world.

He's a citizen of the world. Yeah, and Ice kind of has that too. But like, I love just coming in and just listening to ICE's stories. He's got a story about everything. I mean, he's lived such a such a long life, you know, such a crazy life.

Have you gotten to know Coco at all? Or Baby Baby Chanelle? Who is?

I've met them.

I haven't talked to them too much, but I've had a couple of conversations with Coco.

Yeah, but because I think technically Chanelle's like your half sister.

Right, it looks just like Ice. I've been seeing these memes, the memes. She's glowing up right now. Do you have a favorite episode you did? I really I love the one where I'm you know, digging up the body and I'm arguing with Chris Maloney and he's kind of like interrogating me.

That was a lot of fun. I mean, all of them were fun.

I think, you know, once I branched out of the uh they had me in a swayed jacket for years. Once I branched out of that, you know.

Well, no, that's so interesting you brought up the jacket because I've recently noticed as we loves to put people in three layers. Yes, like it's always and you wore three layers a lot. Is there a secret or is that just like real, Like did you talk about.

The wardrobe war and every time you had to put on three shirts?

No?

I think that they just I think they just had a had an idea of what Ken was supposed to look like, feel like, you know, the affect of his persona. I don't know if that's how you say it, but he, you know, Ken is very endearing. I think all the clothes they wanted to put me in were very endearing. You know, there was a little element of like maybe that swayed you know, maybe because Ice was in leather jackets they put me in a I don't know.

Yeah, that's a good that's a that's an interesting observation.

Yeah, because like softer versus hard.

Interesting. How was the most recent episode you were on this past season. Weren't you there for Finn's non wedding.

Yes, I loved it. It was great. You know, I got to work with Jennifershposito. That was cool.

Yeah, you got to come back.

The whole cast was there, so it was a lot of fun.

It was the end of the season, so it was I think everybody was just in a great mood, and you know, it was just kind of like a like an end of the school year sort of vibe.

So yeah, it was just a good time.

Also, such a tough season with COVID and everything. I'm sure that they were like happy that they made it through, and like you know.

Lots of tests, you know, tests right before you shoot, tests, three days, you know, test before the so yeah, it was it was pretty intense, but everybody was pretty chill.

It was.

It was a it was a nice time for sure.

And then we noticed that you right produce direct like a lot of your own projects and act and so was there anything you've learned with your years on SVU on such a like big, long lasting show that you've taken to your own projects and your own process.

Absolutely just how to move quick. I think that that's one of the things.

That SBU really shines at, is like they know that process so well, you know, and the timing of it. Okay, we're going to rehearse, Okay, we're gonna do this, We're gonna do that. Okay, we're gonna shoot you guys, come back in five minutes. Like it's so you know lockstep that I learned a time.

That was fun. He's such a nice guy.

It was really incredible to talk to him and someone that has spanned the show for such a long time.

It felt very special.

Hopefully in future episodes they'll be a little there'll be a little ken Allehandro family moment.

I want to see more of their like fam.

Yeah, take a little baby out of the carrier, have a little shake it, Caries Careesy make a cute comment. Yeah, maybe have Rollin's daughters an earnest little baby play together.

But Noah's not invited. We hate Noah.

You hate Noah. I hate Noah. You hate Noah.

Hates a strong word. I find him annoying. Let's get into our post mortem. What did we learn from today.

Lie, don't lie, don't ruin people's lives, stop it, don't false accused teachers. Yeah no, don't gay bash. It's like, oh god, the world's a nightmare. Don't slit your teacher's throat. You know a lot of lessons in this one.

Yeah, I don't know. I have. I have like sort of mixed feelings about all the Mary kay Leturno stuff that is like always put in the media, because I know, we talked about this on another episode where I was like, why are they making that show a teacher, Like like, that's sorry, it's a teacher, but I'm saying a teacher on Hulu, And then a Budge whole wrote me on our Socials and we're like, no, that's actually a great show that shows about how they traumatize the boy. So

She did marry her student, but I don't think.

Anybody was happy they got a divorce. They ended up getting divorced and she actually passed recently. But she's never going to come to Montreal with you. It doesn't matter that you have two years of high school French. It's not gonna work.

Well, I blame his father, Yeah, I blame his father. I blame him, I blame everything.

And yeah. Also, if you know.

That someone like this unrequited lesbian crush on, you don't try to make it look like they committed a crime. I mean, I don't know. Yeah, it's just a lot. But this is star studded. So I did enjoy that.

In terms of episode, Yes, I also learned that schools have rare book archives. Congratulations. If you have a rare book archive in your school, you are going to have a good life.

The Bari yesterday there was all these people wildly from my old high school. Really yeah, and we got to chatting and we were talking about the theater department, and the people that were not from our high school were shocked.

And I did have really cool stuff at my high school.

But we had an incredible theater department, like costume shop, set design thing, like we did eight shows a year.

I was in a kabuki production. I did a show.

I did a Charlotte's Web where our set was like a book and we traveled with it and went to schools and performed the party like you've told me about that, Like we just did some. I took a sports marketing class in my high school. I did a weightlifting I did rock climbing for an elective in gym, like I think you know.

And I was a.

Public school in the suburbs, but not rare books. But I guess I came from a really great place.

And one night, have you not been highlighted on their notable alumni?

Not famous enough yet?

I don't know. I don't know what to do, but they're, like you know, are from the degenerates class of two thousand.

Well, I think I've talked about how we do.

We do have a former supermodel from our high school who dated Leonardo DiCaprio, So she'll always be number one no matter how many Oscars anyone wins once you date Leo.

That's the topic.

What's your name?

Our name is Aaron Heatherton. Oh that is she was a victorious secret angel.

I mean she was. She's incredible.

I think she's back in Chicago and open like a Pilates studio or something. And as far as my stalking goes on the internet. But little Esther is a comedian who also went to my high school. We were in Godspell together. I think that's a fun little connect.

Yeah, you know, I only went to high school with Catherine Heigel and Madison.

For million Dollar Listing, I think that's huge.

Oh and oh yeah, I like that the Yeah, I wonder because we repeat in our personal lives, we repeat the same things over and over again, and I wonder what's going to happen with the future of this podcast, like in a few years. They're like, we know about Aaron Heatherton. You don't have to talk about her again.

Hannah already does that.

Hannah's like, I try to cut it out.

She's like, how would I know about your high school Charlotte's web production if you hadn't already said it on the podcast.

But it was wild meeting all these Skoche girls.

But it also I've actually I also at the park ran into like all these people that walk dogs recognize my sister's dog and they're like, Bai And so I met up with this dog walking community in the suburbs that all knew my dad and my brother in law, and so I'm talking all these dog Walker people, but they all went you know, one of them went to my high school too. But like we're old, I'm old now they're graduating twenty twelve, twenty thirteen, twenty ten.

I'm like, don't call yourself old, because if you're old, then what am I? I mean, everyone knows I'm a couple of years older than you.

No, no, no, it's not about old or not. Everything I know. I'm a young human. I hopefully have decades of living to do. It's not like a self deprecating thing. It's just suddenly a thing where I see myself as twenty three. Always like yeah, even though I have gray hair, I'm just like kind of chillin and living my life. Especially being in Chicago. Now it's like, oh, I'm regressing. So it's just a shock to be like, oh, whoa, Okay, I guess.

I guess I'm a grown woman.

Okay, Well, let's hop into our what would Sister peg do? Segment where we give you guys resources organizations that can you can donate too, or you can go to find more information about the subjects that we touched on in today's episode, and this week we're highlighting an amazing organization. I love this organization, the Trevor Project. That's www dot the Trevor Project dot org. If you watch Drag Race,

Thank you so much for that, Kara, And because I've heard of the Trevor Project, but I didn't know all.

The full details about it, So thank you for that.

Get involved, bitches, And then next week we will be covering Signature. That's season nine, episode twelve, watching on Hulu, VPN, Stix, Amazon, No, what's the other one, Peacock. The episodes are out there. Find them. We are thrilled you guys. Listen it's a joy to do this podcast, and we'll see you soon.

Bye.

That's Messed Up as an Exactly Right production.

If you have compliments you'd like to give us or episodes you'd like us to cover, shoot us an email at That's Messed uppod at gmail dot com.

Follow the podcast on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod and on Twitter at messed Up, and follow us personally at Karaklank and at glitter Cheese.

As always, please see our show notes for sources and more information.

Thank you so much to SBU super fan and our incredible producer, Hannah.

Kyle Kraton, and to our sound engineer and personal hero Anali Snilson, and to Henry Koperski for our theme song, to Carly Jean Andrews for our artwork. Thanks to our executive producers Georgia Hardstark, Karen Kilgari, Daniel Kramer, and everybody at Exactly Right Media.

Listen, subscribe, leave us a review on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're an advertiser interested in advertising on our show, go to midroll dot com slash ads Done Done