Of the Law and Order franchises, SVU is considered especially watchable.
We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the vicious felonies. These episodes are based on. These are our stories. Done done, yay. Hello, Welcome to That's Messed Up And As for you podcast. I am Kara Klink and I'm Lisa Traeger and every week we talk about an episode of SVU, the true crime it's based on, and we have an amazing guest from the episode. So that's our show. And in the beginning we each a chat. So welcome, Cara. What's up? Not much?
I mean, Lisa, last night you did my show in Los Angeles and it was magical. I like, I was literally like fangirling over Lisa. I was like, I know, I've obviously seen you do stand up a million times, but I haven't in a while because of pandemic. And I was just like, you were you barely breathe in between jokes and people are just laughing, laughing, laughing.
It was so fucking good. I know, it's not really a great quality of mine. I think it's great. I's honest, I'm just from the school. It's like, you know, you learn the patterns from the people you first look up to, and for me, it was like a tell in Nikki and so it's like they don't shut up. You just keep talking like you never shut up. Yeah, no breaks. I don't give them a chance to think if they like me or not. I just keep it moving. Wait
a telling who else? Nicki Glazer? Yeah, she's pretty quick too. And then I looked up to Hannibal Burres but obviously not his cadence just as we're right, and Tom Sigora on how to treat people. But yeah, those are my four people that I feel like I learned the most lessons from as a young comedian. Interesting, I didn't know that about you and Nikki. Yeah, we did a show in a Mexican rest staurant in Springfield, Missouri, and I Megan was. I just thought she was the coolest person
in the whole fucking world. And she came and hang out, hung out with us and gave us all the tidbits. And then I opened for her on New Year's and I thought she was a queen and she just like was really. She got me a gig to open for Amy Schumer in a big theater once like she was very nice to me as a young comedian.
That's so funny because I just met Nikki like in New York and always just like felt like first I know, she was way like ahead of me when I met her, but I've always just felt like we were peers, even though she is much more successful than I am.
Well when you're all. But then when we visited New York, she was at the same open mic as us. I mean, that's the greatest thing about comedy.
Yeh.
Like I remember I was a few months in and I went to see Hannibal at Zany's, paid to see him, and then I went to an open mic and he was there. Yeah. That's when I was like, okay, so this is okay. You perform at paid headlining gigs and then you have to keep like I learned very young, like okay, five spots a night. Okay, great, You're not good for any room. Like Hannibal had that lure like Thanksgiving he performed in someone's laundry room, but knows how to have fun.
You know.
I was at a jay Z Kanye concert and I ran into him and he had a great seat, So it's like.
Yeah, you gotta do that. No, that's really funny that you say that, because a guy literally came out to me after the show last night and I was, you know, a couple of wines in and he was like he was like this long haired he looked. He reminded me of like Spacoli from Fast Times at Ridgemont High.
He was like, so like, how do I do this?
And I was like, do what, like get on the show and he was like, I was like, just send me a clip. He's like no, but I mean like before that, like how do I get the clip? And I was like, oh, you want to know how to do stand up comedy?
Okay.
I was like, here's what you do. You just got to start hitting open mics. I told him about Comedy Bureau. I was like, here's how you start. But like you're not going to be on the show for a few years, but I know you can do it.
Just start like doing this, you know.
But it's just it is funny how you kind of learned, like, oh wait, this one is like I know so many people that were like yeah, I did my cone and set and the next day I was serving salsa. Like you don't just like blow up from being on TV. One time, like, and that's not even like the main you know, no.
And even that's why Hacks was so good when she's like, even if you're fucking great, that's not enough. Even if you're the best, you keep have to fucking clawing and clawing and coming up with new hours and new material. I mean, yeah, never ends. But the greatest person I met last night was you in high school. Another friend of yours from high school was there and you two were what is it salutations? What is the thing? I know?
Are superlatives from high school? Superlatives? We were biggest gossip.
I met the two biggest gossips from fucking Connecticut high school. I don't know the name of my high school. High school to me, the biggest well because he stood there for a while and I was like, I don't know who you are, I'm ignoring you. And then once I found out, I was like, walk me to my car, like I couldn't get enough.
Yeah, Jed is the best and he listens to the pod, so I'm really happy you guys got to meet.
Oh yeah, he was awesome and he loved That's why, like these intros are becoming hard for me. I'm just rewatching drag Race over and over and ready for conn Oh Today's thirsty. Yes, okay, sorry, I got that a new drag race. But yeah, he was really a fun time. The show was packed. I mean it was like one hundred and fifty people in an alley. I saw an overweight pug. That was a blessing.
Oh my god, Candy Lawrence has the pug of the century.
Also a very funny comedian.
If you guys are interested in, uh yes, checking her out.
She's really great. But I love her and I love her pug. His name's Buster Well, because it's also weird when you see someone on the internet for years, like you've been just I've been looking at this dog for months, right, months and months. Suddenly he's there and he's like meeting a celebrity. Yeah, he's like a ho ho. His body shape is a ho ho. And we have bigger you know. The show is obviously a huge success and it was a great time and I can't wait to keep going back.
And your producer she brought snacks a cooler of Oh my god, thank god.
I had no dinner and I eat all I drank all this wine and I was like, I need to eat something, and she had all these fucking snacks because she works on TV sets and she just craft serviced it up for us.
I mean watching her put away the chair and the lights, I was like, what she why are you doing this?
She's like an incredible workhorse, and she just like loves comedy and like loves doing the show and she's like the best producer I could have ever had a comedy show.
Yes, that is she is incredible. I'm glad you guys have each other.
Shout out to Shannon Cloud if anyone knows her.
But outside of the show, we got a DM that yes, it's huge.
A couple of weeks ago, I don't know if you guys saw on our stories, we shared a story of a listener was like, this is my good friend's dad.
He went hiking on this mountain.
I think it was in Utah and Nevad, I don't actually remember, and he's gone missing, like they can't find him, And they did find him.
She ended up writing me.
Back and said we shared it on our stories and then she wrote me and said we found him, and I'm like, oh my god, I'm so happy.
And then today he messaged us and said thank you.
So much for sharing. That means so much. If you ever need anything for me, just ask. It was so sweet. I feel like I'm part of a beautiful humanitarian story and all I did was share a story on our Instagram.
I'm glad he was found. Yeah, no one wants to get lost hiking. Well, I feel like.
Those stories usually don't end up great. You know, Yeah, I feel like there's usually a cravass involved.
What's a crevass? You know, it's like a crevis. There was a.
SNL sketch called Unfrozen cave Man Lawyer and he always says I fell into a crevass. Sorry, it's like, oh this guy anyway, Like, I feel like there's always some like there's always like you fell into some small spot where no one could find you and then you die. But let's get started because we have a super great episode today and it's jam packed and we should just jump right in.
Okay, So let's get into the episode. Intimidation Game, Season sixteen, episode fourteen. It opens up on Benson with her therapist. I guess Kara was telling me there's some mixed emotions about this guy. I could care less.
People have asked us what our feelings are we don't really have any.
I don't I could. He could die in a fire or live forever and become syndicated. I don't care. I just he's just.
An off show with the Therapist. You're not watching it, I mean maybe.
I mean, if I'm not watching organized crime, I don't think the therapist show is going to get me. I would watch that Uzu Adubo in treatment, I would maybe watch that. So she's wearing a collared professor, sexy chic look with a tons of layers. We've learned the costume department just really loves layers. And then Benson's basically like, oh my god, lack of sleep and worrying about Noah and juggling my own schedule, and then it's like dun, dunt done, It's
been amazing. So she loves it. She loves not sleeping and being stressed out. But she's scared that, like you know, the DNA with Noah's dad, Like could it affect Noah because he's breaking tea pots and breaking shit and roughhousing and you know what if he grows up being a rapist as well? But it's like, you're not a rapist, like I don't. Why would you be scared when your
dad's a rapist? Yeah, yeah, I understand the fear. Whatever, but like it's also like you're an example of it not affecting your character in a negative way, so whatever. But yeah, you're not a criminal. Your kid's not a criminal. He's just an annoying kid. Get over it. So show, and then it cuts to the detectives on a day off.
They're hanging out casual I SE's in a hoodie, he's playing video games, Rollin's and Creasy's there and it's a giant like video game convention, and I was thinking this, this is like a giant budget, Like that's hundreds of extras, TVs, video Like, was this at Javits Center? What the fuck?
Like, yeah, unless it was a New York comic con and they just shot there, which also sounds like it would be a nightmare. Then I think that, yeah, you're right, it is like an extravagant and set up for the.
Show, very expensive. And then Careese is like, this is awesome. This is better than comicn So okay. But Finn uses a lot of video game lingos, so we learn that he loves video games, and we know that he loves them in real life as well, and Rollins is like just a girl and she's like, I don't get it, which is rare because she loves MMA and football and gamble. You'd think that she'd.
Be like, oh, yeah, I have a high score in fucking Halo or something.
I was wondering which game you would mention. I was like, I wonder what Kara's gonna say. My brain was working overtime, I felt it. So they panned to young women talking with lanyards around their necks. They have credentials, and they're in a booth and then these like trash scumboys come in and lean into the booth and they're like, go home. Girls don't belong in gaming, get out of here. And the girls like super sassy and she looks cool and
fun and she has a lot of comebacks. And they say that her boss, Raina Punjabi, was only able to make her feminazi game because she's a slut. And for me, this might not be everyone's perspective obviously, but like, if you fuck your way to the top, I still respect you. Like it's not easy, right, I mean, however you want.
People are faking it till they make it in a lot of different ways out there, you know, Yeah, like sex should be any different. I think if you're in a power position, you cannot demand sex for business things.
But if you're just if you're a slut on the go, I think you can fuck your way to the top. I'm okay with that. No, And I like this girl.
I think this actress is like funny, like like I don't know, I don't think that the like the people that do sort of guest stars on the show are always like super fun Like I don't know, she's really funny when.
She's like, oh, do you want to kiss me? Oh? Is that it? Like? I just think she's got a good top comic timing. Oh yeah, she is great the whole gam or gay everything. I mean, you're gonna lead us into this, so I'm grateful, but it makes no sense to me. I can't imagine in a million years, like not being like, Okay, I'll play my game when you play your game. I just can't imagine being so upset that something's not for you, like when there's hundreds of other games to choose from. But you know, we
all have hill to die on. Some people are like for religious freedoms or like abortions for all. Then some people are like, women shouldn't play video games, and that's the biggest moment in their lives. It is a wild hill to climb to the top of and then die of. Well, it's also proof that your life's pretty chill if the worst thing that happens to you is like a female Ghostbusters, you know, or anything like. This is just so confusing to me. But yeah, so they have a little scuffle,
the boys go away because she rebally slay them. And so then we see a friend, Leslie from Glasgow man. He's the babysitter guy who dresses the graphic novelists. Yeah, and so he's wearing a bow tie and a dumb hat, but not a douchhat, like it's a nerd hat. It's wild how they are able to balance what the hats portray when they are so annoying. I hate all these hats in public if I see them. But I can't believe he's back, And I'm curious, like, did they love
him so they wrote him in? But this is the same season, I think, So it's like, was this already this was this pre planned reoccurring or were they like, we got to get Leslie back here, but I love him, and so basically he says the trail created a lot of buzz. So they have a new video game that is based on Glasgow Man, and he said that the developers are going to make it either way, so might as well make some cash. But the cops are kind of like but hurt about it, and Rollin's in a
perfect messy Bun is skeptical about virtual reality. She's just confused by everything. She's like, why am I here? So then they are like panning to a public restroom and I get the sense that something not good's about to happen, but nobody can hear anything because it's so noisy on the convention floor. And so the young woman from that works for Reina Punjabi that was like in that scuffle,
she's getting attacked. So she's attacked by the two dudes that said women shouldn't play games, and she's yelling stops up, stop, and they're violently attacking her and she's fighting so hard, but everyone's just going wild watching video games on a big screen, so no one is helping her. And then Leslie runs to them and goes something bad is happening to in the bathroom, and Finn and Creasy don't care which is it? You are police like it is so wild.
So then Amanda is like, Okay, I guess I'll go. Well.
I feel like they maybe it's like playing Devil's Advocate for them right now. I feel like it's like someone's like there's a girl in trouble in the bathroom, like, oh, she needs a tampon? Is that what these guys think is happening? Like that he came running up to you to tell you about a period emergency.
But yeah, but Leslie would never do that. Leslie can talk to someone else about Leslie. Leslie wouldn't have or do that. I one time was eating fuh in Cleveland, but I had just gone off a plane bleeding through my tampon, and I asked the server, I go, can you see if there's any women you work with that have a tampon for me? He couldn't handle it. He
got so shy, he was so uncomfortable. And then the woman like she came over and gave me tampons in a little makeup bag and like snuck it around and it just like really, uh threw a loop for these in these young people's minds, like they couldn't. I'm like, listen, I'm bleeding and I need this. Yeah, they got so uncomfortable.
Love it, Lisa Trigger just fucking removing the stigmatization of menstrual issues, one fuz server.
At a time. Yeah. I might have even said this before in another show, but yeah, that is a passion of mine. I like to talk about bleeding through things as often as possible, and if you see me do comedy, it's a theme that runs through myset. It is wild that we're supposed to like not talk about bleeding from our pussy's constantly.
No, and we're supposed to like palm our tampon so nobody sees them, and like everything has to be so quiet about having a period.
And it's like, yeah, Wolf had a funny joke about it. She's like, the only technology with tampon's is they make them smaller, because you know, we've just been so like loud with taking our trombones to the bathroom with us, and she does this like trombone act out whatever. I think I just butchered her joke, but I haven't seen her in years. Okay, so Rollin's you know, she gets it, so she's you know, going over there, and so she's helping our girl and then ra the girl says, yeah,
they leveled up. So she's doing video game lingo to describe this attack and she's bleeding and it's not good. And it's the credits. Okay, they make us sad, and then they go to the song. And so then we come back to a busy Benson office. Everyone's getting the scoop, Gevin the scoop. We find out our favorite girl's name is Sarah Keller. She is twenty two and she works for Rena, who's a game developer. And then Rollins calls the convention march madness for gaming. So I'm glad.
It's like that's like a metaphor that only that doesn't help anybody that doesn't know sports or male things.
No, because I think video game dorks might not know about sports, and I don't know if sports know about video But she's explaining it to Benson.
Oh yeah, Like I guess Benson probably knows what march madness is, of course, but like it's just funny.
I think to be like, what did you want her to say? Saie?
At Barney's we know Benson loves a brand. That's a good one, thank you.
So she explains to Benson, who is confused, as she rightfully should be, that men are mad that women are in gaming, and Finn says that guys think that game developers are gods and they're not ready for women to be god. Okay, So Benson and Finn go in to talk to Sarah and she describes them her attackers as fi al and Finn explains it means failures at life,
which I kind of love. And then she describes them as young, white, pale and skinny, and Finn is like, that's eighty percent of the crowd, girl, And we get the scoop here. They touched her breasts, they pushed her down, and then she fought them off. So I think she got like it was violent and she got attacked, but I don't think there was like a you know, a full full attack. I don't know how to describe this.
And so we learn about this thing called cobs Kobs, which is killer be slaughtered, and they're a type of video game person and they don't like that her boss is making a game that's not the game that they like. It's just like I don't know. If you don't want a big Mac, you can get the quarter pounder. I don't understand this. Go to Del Taco.
If you don't even like burgers, go to a totally different restaurant.
It is wild. So yeah, so Cobbs is like first person shooter games and they hate games that are non violent, and then she goes and they're stupid. I don't know whatever. I hate how dismissed if I am of all this, but I am so the game long. I do love. I do love Mario. I love Super Mario three. I love that definitely not a Cobs. I mean that's not a Mario is not murdering anyone except for Chupa Choops or whatever. What are they called Koopa Troopers whatever. I
don't know, but this is my thing. I love the little ghosts and I would get a ghost tattoo, but I don't want people like this coming up to me and being like, how well do you know Mario? And it's like I don't. I just like trademarked items on my arm, but I really want the Mario ghost tat But like I said, I'm just scared of people being like, are you Mario enough I also love when Mario wore a little raccoon suit in World seven. Oh yeah, when
he flies the raccoon tail. I love that. That's Mario three. I think no, in World set that's like that tale with the feather. But then in World seven there's another outfit that he wears that's a full on, like brown, little raccoon outfit that is at the feather.
That's more than I know, Liza, I like, I fell off after I fell off around Yoshi or something.
Okay, So we find out that this game launches Tuesday, and so the people are getting crazy online and Rollins is having a hard time going over the footage because it looks she makes a joke that is so bad and she said it's like George Costanza. She says, it's like looking for a geek in a geek stack. And I wonder if this is a Seinfeld callback about the Jerk Store or not, but that's what it sounded like.
So Finn says there's more to this story. That all of these nerds are all so mad because they think Raina slept her way into the business and she's engaged to a venture capitalist named Stephen Kaplan, so they don't like that. She like, is with a guy for money and he backed this game, and Rollins with a statement I enjoy says just because her fiance has money, that means she doesn't have talent, and Finn's like, I didn't
say that. I you know, I'm on her side. So Benson asked the question if this is about Raina, like why are we attacking Sarah Dundum? So they head off to the Amazonian studios to talk to Raina. And that's what the game is called. And Raina is walking, she's talking, she's with Finn and Rollins, and she's wearing a Steve Jobs style black turtleneck vibes but like fun hoops. So she's business but loves successories. And she's just like, I don't get why they're mad at the game. It's choose
your own adventure. You can choose war or piece, matriarchy or patriarchy, environmental or industrial like chill like you could even in the game. They hate you can be violent, like it is so annoying. They don't even like that there's an option where you can just like plant corn and chill out. So they ask if she's had any threatening or fucked up messages or comments online, which is
the dumbest question I've ever seen on this show. She's a woman that's trying to do anything, so yes, there are mean things said to her on the internet for no reason. She's like, I'm too busy to be pressed, you know, and like in the words of RuPaul, She's just like, what other people think about me is none of my business. So they launch in two days. Have said this before, and they're going to say this eight
hundred more times. This launch on Tuesday is like, this is if you want to play a drinking game and you haven't watched the episode yet. Every time they mentioned that the game launches Tuesday, take a shot. You will be passed out pretty quickly. So Steven, the fiance, walks up and he explains that they gave Sarah the week off, but she wanted to come to work because it's such an important time, and Steven tells him that he will give them all the security tech info wel Raina works
on her career changing launch. So he's a great supportive guy, and I think they really do like each other and she's not using him for money, but hey, so then Benson still does not understand video games, and Careese is like, don't tell Finn that. Why would finncare I just don't get why fincares of Benson likes video games or not. But anyways, so then he says, we Leslie has scoop for us, and that's the bow tie babysitter guy. So Caries has a weird, geled back look. It's like really
grease ball and I don't like it. So Leslie comes down to help, and basically his scoop is he's on the message boards. He's on all these video game things and he he caught some people talking about the attack, and these guys are like bragging on this reddit forum about attacking her, and so they're like, Leslie, go trick them and say you want more information, and he's like no way, and then they threaten him. He's like, okay,
I'll do it. So he starts typing to them and really like being like, yeah, that girl was such a bitch, I dox this other girl. Like give me more scoop. Let's meet up. So then Careese undercover in a trucker hat and Converse is acting like a programmer and is with Leslie and they're meeting the attackers outside to get the details of the crime and like her tits and this is my who is going out of their way to gossip. It's like the I mean, I like to gossip, but this is so let's meet up in person to
talk shit is so weird. It makes no sense because it's also not a long composed so basically, like you know, the guys, they chat, they give details, but the conversation is less than thirty seconds, and then the guys are like, Okay, we good, Like, yeah, just wanted to hear about how you touch that girls tits? We good? Is that why I just said? It's like you took a train or an uber, you walked miles in New York and like, I don't understand this. But then Careesi, of course, has
a fun little reveal. He's like, hey, I'm the police. One tries to run away, but we know Finn is there to grab him and say something sassy, and so he says wrong move player, nice try no reset button in the real world. And I feel like Finn has the most scenes like this where he's just around the corner ready to snap someone, Like he's always there to
punch someone. I just feel like he's always the backup that's there d to like hit somebody, Okay, So then they go back to the precinct and it's the quickest lineup ever in the franchise history. I would say, like Sarah's just like that guy. That guy got him fuck that, Like she just knows who they are, and she calls one of them that slope Brow, son of a bitch
number two. So that was fun as well. But I think slope Brow is like rude, but they attacked her, so she could be as rude as she wants to be. I think it's like I'm playing somebody.
Somebody has like kind of near underthal features, right, yes, yeah, rude, Yeah, Oh for sure.
It's a read. It is a read. So then she says she wants to keep things quiet and not make a huge deal about it. Dunt dunt on. Obviously there's memes already, so the restco public, the memes are out and the guys are being treated like heroes, so everyone is just like, you know, this isn't fair. And then this masked man makes a video that says, do not go where you're not wanted, bitches. Those guys are sacrificial lambs, and there's gonna be payback. Sarah, You're a slut. Everyone's
a slut. Everyone's a slut. Okay, we get it. But the squad can't do anything with these threats because it's just a video on the internet. And then my favorite, I love when they eat. I love when there's a lunch break Rollins has an egg roll in her hand, and of course she doesn't understand video games. Again, it's like, I don't know you gamble. He plays video games. At least he has his problems under control, bitch. Okay, So she just doesn't understand how he goes from work to
like shooting guns on a screen. And he explains, well, there's no rules, there's no one pp, there's no barber, there's no one telling him what to do, there's no gray area. I get to just shoot people. And so I like that he's not you know that he's doing
that and not just shooting people in his job. Finn is like on a live stream on his phone and it's a video of Raina doing an interview and a white girl boss outfit, not like a white girl boss, but like a white outfit that is a girl boss outfit, not a white power suit, a white power suit.
Yeah, and I actually really related to the scene and the guy is like baiting her and she says, hey, like, I'm here to promote my game and you keep roping me into a feminist debate.
And I feel like this happens to me when I do podcasts. We're like, guys will just try to argue with me about something, and I'm like, this isn't fair. I'm obviously going to argue. I'm passionate about these issues, but everyone else gets to come on and just shoot the shit and be funny with you, and I have to like
debate my like humanity and it really sucks. I go on so many guy comedy podcasts and I always they always try to like loop me into something and then I speak my mind and then I get death threats for like weeks and I so I really relate it to this where it's like, just because I have these points of view doesn't mean you have to bring it up all the time. When we're on a fucking funny show and now I have to explain to you what
rape is. It's like so annoying. Yeah. So, mid stream of Raina's interview, though, the place gets raided by police. They throw her to the ground, point guns at her, and then the cops see the stream and they're like what And then I think this is where they would cut to commercial. Kara, you watched this with your Hulu with ads, so you can maybe confirm or deny that, yeah, I think that, yeah, there's her getting swatted.
Is that's when you go out on commercial brand, That's when I have to watch forty five minutes of bad ads.
So we're at the scene of the crime. And if you watch this live, this must have been so stressful to be like, what happened? What happened? But Finn explains that three separate numbers called nine to one one to report a hostage situation and this is like a hoax, and the cops played into the hoax, and he's mad at the cops. But I don't I mean, if everyone I don't know, I don't know, I don't know who's
saw it. I'm on. But Rollins is in a trench coat that looks so fucking expensive, like it looks so fucking good on her, and Raina is of course disheveled and pissed because she was attacked in her own home with swat teams and guns. Okay. She says, they're trying to humiliate me, and it worked. They just swatted me in the middle of an interview. She's like, it's over, and Stephen goes, it's not over, Like they keep sending you threatening messages and they want to see you on
your knees. She goes, I was on my knees, Like what do you want. He's like, the Reddit sub brand, sub red red Chance, the red Chance. I don't know. Everyone is like, they're like, it's not just online harassment. She's like, I'm used to it. I'm used to it. I don't care, And so Raina says, it's not a big deal. I don't understand. It's like, of course it's a big deal. They knew your address and they swatted you. Like,
I don't know how she's so relaxed about this. She's like, I'll change my passwords and move to a new apartment. What's the big deal.
I think she's trying to like play, I don't know, tough, tough guy. You know, I did watch this episode with my mother and had to explain dosing and swatting to her. That was tedious and not as fun as it sounds.
Well, I've this whole episode. I feel like Benson Rawlins and your mom are right on the same page. Fully so Steven, the loving fiance he is, is just trying to plead with her, like please, can you not die? And she goes, I only care about the launch. So the nerds do say if the launch goes tomorrow, that her raped and mutilated body will be on the front page of every feminist blog. And it's like, just.
What, Jezebel is not going to put a picture of a raped and mutilated body on any article, let alone the front page.
Oh they would, They run on clicks the photo. Yes, it's all about the clicks, Kara, I don't think people have morals anymore. Okay, So then the masked guy that keeps showing up and he says the game is derivative. Who cares it's bad? Who cares she used sex to get where she is? Who cares? They must leave gaming or we will make them. It's just I do not understand the psyche of these people on any level at all.
They're the same people that like write into advertisers to cancel shows that say like you know, or the people that are like women aren't funny, you know?
Like women shouldn't be in comedy, you know, like it's like, yeah, feel free to not attend a female comedy show.
Feel free. They're also not as violent. I don't I don't know about any comedy thing that's as crazy as gamer games. Oh no, no, no, they're definitely not as violent.
I think that that's just because most of this happens behind screens. So the violence you can just get away with saying whatever the fuck you want.
Yeah. So they're all begging her to reconsider and like just postpone the event, and she goes, no, it's happening, and they're like, can we maybe do it, like tape it and stream it later. She goes no, that means they'll win. It needs to be live. I'd rather be a bitch than a coward. And then he's just like okay, but can you just maybe get She goes, no, no cops,
no dogs. I don't want any police presence. And it's like you are making it really hard to be on your side, Like I don't understand, Like won't you won't tape it, you won't have cops there, you won't take any precautions at all. I do know a comic we both know her, but she got so many bomb threat that she had to pay for her own security at every single show she did, and have her own bomb sniffing dogs and they came out of her paycheck because
Republicans have problems. Again, it's like, it's just not about you. So after this like back and forth, back and forth, she says, listen, I appreciate you have a job to do. I came down. I'm cooperating. You've officially warned me, and I accept all liability, but I do not want a visible police presence. And that's that. And so okay, and so Benson and I have the same point of view where we're like, well, okay, it's not fully about you. There's people at this launch, Like we have to protect
all these other people that are coming. Like if you if you want to take a responsibility for yourself, that's fine, but we need to help. And also everyone likes dogs, Like what's bad about having a bomb sniffing dog. No one has seen a dog and been upset. Carreese straight up offers to pull favors to get the event shut down for violations. And it's like your jail hair is showing, you know, Like we don't need you playing little games.
Please follow the laws. You are a police officer. And then Rollins is on the side of Rayna and says, but then the cyber bullies win, so no, we have to like let her do it. Benson says, Okay, let's just have a chill police presence, like we'll go, we have enough money to cover this, we'll wear chill out clothes and like just make sure shit's okay. So they're at this event, it's like popping. Lots of people are there.
Everyone's really excited for this game launch, and there's like a plan where they're like, oh, shall we see all the credit cards for tickets? And Finn says a great quote where he goes, anybody up to no good is not using a credit card. Yes, that put that on a shirt I feel. I think about Teresa from Housewives of New Jersey here paying with her furniture and cash, you know.
What I mean, for all her marble and onyx with a stack of hundreds.
Yeah. Yeah, nothing good happens with cash, baby, except tattoos. I like to you know, but my shop now takes credit cards, which is like revolutionary. It's so nice not having to take hundreds of dollars out. Yeah. Oh, am, I in a new wait list for a new tattoo. I am okay, So I can't stop Krees. He's with the security team and he's insulting the quality of film, and the security guy's like, all right, motherfucker, we're not Steven Spielberg. We've had two hundred events a year here
and there's no problems. We're good at our job. Stop the motherfucking shadea. Okay. The presentation starts and it's about like the game is about farming and building homes and like to have people this upset about it is so funny. Okay. So she comes out, well, won't be funny soon, Okay. So she comes out and like on brand, simple business, casual shakeout fit. Very Bethany Frankele and I don't think we agree on this, but to me, I think Bethany
Frankel is the best dressed housewife. But I mean she's the top for me. Yeah, okay, good. Yeah. I have friends that try to argue and I'm like, no, we don't have to like her in her slight. I think most of them dress badly, but she's tours the top for me. For sure. Yeah, not her home decor. I would say I don't want red walls. But in terms
of outfits, Raina and Bethany are similar. So while she's presenting, there's red laser pointers popping up on her body and face, not faces at all, Like, okay, there might you might get shot in the head. Can you maybe sweat? It's so confusing, but the cops are all really stressed out, so they're looking what the lasers are and basically it's just like a prank with like a bunch of the people just brought lasers and it's not violent lasers. And she makes a joke about like, ah my mom's cat
likes laser pointers. But now you think it's okay, it's not okay. Blackout lights, turn out, everything is lighting. It's just like really fucked up. And then like there's an audio and it's like no social justice and gaming. So someone hacked onto this live board thing. People are rushing out. They've lost Raina. In the pandemonium. Kriese's on the security footage. He sees her with a security guard in the back hallway being dragged out the back exit. The squad runs.
They're trying to get her Carisy has a little stumble running in dress shoes, but then you know, gets the guard and then on a giant screen outside is live footage of Raina being tied up in the back of a van and the masked man is saying game on. And then the fake security guard says, this was all done by this group called Acid Rain and he thought it was just going to be a chill prank. He didn't realize it was a full on kidnapping. And they're like, you're gonna go to jail by bitch and that's it.
You guys know, Naomi k Pergin, I'm saying bye bitch with her essence inside of me.
Please look up her Bye Bitch song and buy it as a tone. It's amazing, Yes, And then I says.
See something, say something, which is a We talk about that a lot, and then they threaten him with murder chargers. So he starts talking and he says he did see the van, and the news are like, the cops are inside and this still happened. That's embarrassing. So the white van they find out was stolen from a garage yesterday, but the security cameras went out so no one saw anything, and no one has seen this van on any bridges or tunnel, so that means they're still in Manhattan, which
I think is a good sign. And Careesy has a hit and they're off to like go on location. So they find the van and it's outside of like a wood, sandy bricks, boulder type place. I don't know what this is. I don't know, but there's a lot of different materials,
so many boulders in Manhattan. It could be anywhere. Yeah, the van is empty, but there's a tiny dark hallway and Finn and Rollins go in there with their team and it's an abandoned building and there's a calling car there and a mattress which does not make me happy, and there's a blouse and a chair with ropes tied to it. And they left a video behind on a phone and the video is her begging and pleading and crying and they're slapping her and taking her shirt off,
and then it says level completed. So then we're in this like messy bedroom. There's messy bookshelves, and Reina is there and she's bloody and she's in a bra and she's with Logan Paul, one of the brothers who's you know, likes to pull pranks in Japanese suicide forests and beat up NBA players for money. I don't know what the like. Usually when we speak to the young actors from SVU, we're like so inspired by them and we're like, the
future will be good. And then when you find it out about these Internet brothers, you're like, maybe gen Z has some problems, so these are like problematic YouTube boys. It was shocking to see his face in this. I don't did he audition, did they want him? I'm so many questions, but he tells her to shut up, and it's bad. And then there's a man with a coat on and it's like a furry lined hood, which like for video game rapists, it's just like funny to have
a fur lined hood. But you know, maybe it was on sale at Costco and his mom got it for him. So they put masks on to make another video. And I know this This is like one of the Kelly Who moments where you're like, this is bad and I know it's tragic, but your body is banging. I'm like, oh my god, I know you're being attacked, but you
look great. Yeah, your abs are looking good. They're looking great, and the boyfriend's at the squad and he's like, we tried to tell her, We tried to tell her, and he's fucking pissed, and I'm with him, like I would be annoyed. I know you're more worried, but it's just tough. It's tough. You don't want to play a told you so game when someone's being attacked. But right, of course, no,
nothing she did not. Yeah, so Carreese steal Benson in front of Steven, and Steven's like, wait, what's going on? And then they like shut the blinds so aggressively, and it's like he's already worried, why are you shutting the blinds? Like you're really ruining this man's brain. Correese shows Benson the video of a mass man and he's dragging her around and throwing her and she's crying and this is
so sad. And the man start taking off her clothes and you know, nothing good's about to happen, and they're like surrounding her and this is very upsetting, very great acting, and a really graphic episode for SVO And we've seen a lot and this one is like hard to watch.
So the next video is Rayna and she's bloody with messed up hair and in a T shirt with their calling card on it, like it's it's like a grenade with letters, and they make her do a forced statement and she says something like I realize now that gaming is no place for females, So all you bitches should get out now. You are not wanted and you are not safe. And I have a message for Stephen Kaplan. I never left you, and I only slept with you to back my game. I am a slut and I
am a liar. And then like I understand, they're making her say and she has to say it, but like people know, she doesn't really mean it, so like I
don't get what the point of this all is. And then the tape is geotagged, so Rollin sees this, and that's like pretty weird, like why would they be like secret, secret secret, And then all of a sudden, like let us know where they are, so they think it's a trap, and then they the house that is geotag belongs to a public art teacher and it's in Staten Island, and so the squad heads out to Staten Island and it ends up being the mother of one of the gamer criminals,
and her son's name is Anthony. He plays video games, and they go to his room and it is the set of the rape. So it's in this basement room. The camera is still there and the guns safe is fully empty, and the mom is doing the classic he's a good boy, shy, you're making a mistake. No, no, no sexual ascent. He would never, And they're like, your basement is full of it evidence and it is him and he's harassed her for weeks and this is the account and she's like, no, he would never, he would never.
My little baby, Uh yeah, don't do this with Oscar. Well, hopefully Oscar will behave but it's always it is always crazy that mom's Even Derek Chauvin's mom just like did a statement where she's like, he's a really good guy. It's like we watched a video of him murder a person slowly. So I know you're blinded by motherhood, like Jennifer Lopez says in Hustlers and motherhood is a mental disease, but you gotta know your son's suck. Listen.
When I was growing up, like if the school called, my parents were like, what did you do. They were never like you've got the wrong kid, like they were constantly like that was.
How I grew up.
So I'm I'm usually like Rosie, what have you done? You know, like I'm not like I'm not like she's an angel, Like I don't think it's gonna be a problem for me to blame my child.
So CARIESI is trying to like convince the mother to help them find them because they're violent criminals, even though she's like delusional. Sochrisey's connecting with her like I'm a stann Island boy. I grew up right around you. And we find out that like her husband died and like after his dad died, you know, like whatever, he's been
fucked in the head. So now she's like even if he wrote the messages, he wouldn't rape, Like this isn't what he is and and it's like, okay, but he did stand and watch a live stream of a rape happen and helped the technology, like he got the bluetooth going to make this happen. So so then something made me want to look up this mother, and I'm glad I did. Her name is Juliet Printer. That's a funny
last name. But she yeah, she doesn't have a photo for our IMDb, so if her representatives are listening to this, get a fucking photo up for your client. But she has fourteen credits, and she has been in some episodes of SBUs. She was in Perfect Tortured and Vulnerable. Wow. Yeah,
and she's in two episodes of Veep. And then obviously then I looked up our favorite girl from up top that worked in the booth, that works for Reina that you really enjoyed her acting, and I looked her up and she's now filming Life and Beth right now, and she's a regular. So that's like the new Amy Schumer show. So maybe she's gonna blow up and be a huge going to know about that? Cool? Yeah, filling you in. So we really like her. She's had credit, she's been working,
but hopefully she blows up after this new show. Hopefully it's a good time. Also, it's weird saying I hope someone blows up while we're listening to this episode in particular of just like all of this chaos and violence.
So then he basically is as blunt as he can be with this mother and says, we need to end this peacefully, lady, And that's I think a threat of just like if you don't help us, like we will shoot your child, right, And so she spills the tea on like the guns and what's happening and where everyone is. So Benson's like, what's next, what's next? What's next? Finn has the scoop and he says, well, next in this game is killer be slaughtered. So shit's about to go bad.
And then Raina calls them and they so basically Raina says, they have me in a garage. I think they're going to kill me. Please help me, Please help me, And there's a gun pointed to her head and someone's holding the phone to her face, so it means that her arms are tied up and busy if she can't even hold her own phone. So Finn does warn the Squat. He goes, this could be a cop ambush and a trap and like, we have to be careful, but we
got to get our girls, so let's go. So they go to a factory warehouse building and the swats starts screaming she's got a gun, and they go in and she is taped up to like a sauce style contraption like a hell thing where her hands are tied to the gun and so she can't do anything. But like to the untrained swat eye, it looks like she's holding this gun but she's crying and she can't do anything
about it. And there's a speaker that plays noises of gunfire, which I think would have made them like, I'll shoot her dead, but thank Goddess, View is there saying hold fire, hold fire, hold fire. So it is so fucked up. But they were gonna get her killed while she like had the gun tape for her. It's like really scary to think about. So then they feel like everyone is
still in there. I don't even know I don't even remember how, but Christian Rollins are on the roof doing choreography and then some gamers on the roof shoot at them, and the fur coat lined guy is like, I never wanted this to get this far, and Rollins is like, shut your fucking mouth, and he goes, no, I geotagged for my mom's house so you can find me, like h and she doesn't care. It's too little, too late, my friend, too little too late. Yeah, he's acting like he just got roped in to like.
Do the tech, but like he didn't think that these guys were going to go through on any of that shit.
But yeah, this is a giant operation. Like you shut down a huge launch at an event center. Yeah, multiple stolen vans, multiple locations, like you're going to jail.
Yeah, planted a security guard, like you were able to like hack into the mainframe and live stream your own kidnapping.
Like it's a lot. Sochriesy has like a showdown with one of the other gamers and shoots him, not dead, but shoots him and is like, see, this is real life. This isn't like a video game. And then the Logan boy comes out, not Oscar Paul Paul or what is it, Jake, Jake.
Logan Paul like Logan, his brother Jake is equally bad, but this is Logan.
He there's like he hags out with some porn stars that I'm a fan of, and I'm like, yeah, I don't like this, okay, But for his birth this is kind of cool. For his friend's birthday, he got his favorite porn star to come meet him, and now they've been dating for like over a year. Oh cute. Yeah, So I don't know, I don't know if this is good or bad. But they're all young and not and so this logo, so Paul, God, what's this? So logan Paul comes out with the gun and says, actually, video
games are the same as life. Okay, okay, buddy. So Carisy starts talking. I mean, I did spend over five hundred dollars on Simpson's tapped out and then I had to like close my account, and so I understand how the lines can blur. I don't want to be fully judgmental, but I did build a whole city that looks beautiful. Yeah, but then did you.
Like kidnap Matt Groening and say, like make the game do what I want?
I mean, like very psychotic when he's going on, but we should we should start writing that script. So Carries starts talking and he's like, don't talk and prepare to be slaughtered. But he sees Rollins and is like, drop the gun to Rollins. So Rowlins has to drop the gun. Caresy doesn't have a gun, and the the guy with the gun goes on a long speech you know, rain as a skink and a whore, and the guy on the ground, who's already been shot, calls Rollin's a bitch,
and it's like aren't you bleeding? Like how are you still having time to call women bitches? So Finn comes up from behind and says like drop the gun, and then you know, Logan also has moments. There's a back and forth like Finn's like it's not a game, yes it is, blah blah blah. So then the guy tries to do a spin move to kill Finn, but Finn shot the shit out of him and is like, fuck you, You're dead, so dead to them all Wendy Williams' style.
Finn explains he knows the difference between video games and reality, and those guys didn't thank you, Finn. So Benson now says that he has to be an administrative duty for a few days. But keep your gun, dude, it was a clean ass shot. You're good, Like, enjoy a couple days off. You're fine. She pats him on the shoulder and tells him to go home. Rollins is now with Raina and Steven at the house at their apartment and one of the video gamers just took a plea deal.
The other one's going to trial, so now she has to testify, but Rollin says, she has like a lot of time, don't worry. But it's like so traumatizing to like, since we saw everything she went through in such graphic detail, it is like hard to imagine her having to go on trial. And she's so sad and traumatized. She's like such a good actress. And she says, women and gaming,
what did I expect? And she starts to cry and she says whatever, I'm out and Rollin says, no, no, if you give up, they'd win, and she goes, no, they already did. And it's like Rollin's this isn't the time to push her into making video games. I'm sorry. She was just like gang raped and beaten the shit out of So can you not like give her a pep talk to get back to work? And yeah, and
then that's Dick Wolf. And honestly, this was a graphic Wild Chase episode, and I really am curious to know about the real information.
Kara Well, I was going to say, I feel like this is really graphic episode and very scary, and I remember that from when I watched it originally.
But I do think that it kind of conveys the sentiment.
That is online towards women, and we'll get into that with this next part.
And I'm very passionate about this because I lost a friend to Gamergate. Like I had a friend who was so into Gamergate, causing chaos everywhere he went, like started posting videos where we're like, what's going on with him? But you want to see the best in your friend, and so I kept kind of forgiving and seeing and then he became a full on racist who legit was like, I don't get what's wrong with the white supremacist, Like, we cut him out. We uninvited him from Thanksgiving like
years ago, wow, like twenty sixteen. We cut him out of our lives because he became a full blown, like racist.
Well that's kind of when a lot of things happened for people. I didn't know that about your friend. That's nuts. Tell me more as I get into the real stuff when we come back. Okay, let's get into hashtag gamer gate.
Gamergate was basically a clusterfuck even within itself, like it was supposed to be this big movement, but then there was never any official mission, statement or leadership of any kind, Like they never had a manifesto, they never there was just nothing that ever defined it specifically, and so it just evolved into like a culture war on the Internet, and it's basically like a microcosm of the whole like alt right versus like leftysjws shit that blew up in
twenty sixteen around the time that your friend revealed himself to be of one side, and like, I think that argument is still happening, raging on message boards and shit right now.
That this was kind of like I think around when it started.
But essentially the part of gamergate that people might think was like legitimate is that guys, which I don't think, but I'm just saying, like this was like the nicer version of gamer gate, which is that they suspected unethical collusion between the press and feminists and progressives and social critics. Like so they were like thinking that women gamers and developers were like sleeping with press or like figuring out
ways to collude to get like more favorable treatment. So it started out as an ethics in gaming thing that was like the crux of it, but it just never was that really because all these guys glombed onto it and it became like all these shittheads who just wanted to like launch smear campaigns and online harassment of women in gaming because they just didn't like the idea of any progressive ideals living in the gaming space at all, Like because there were no leaders and there was no
real like succinct messaging. The whole thing was like the movement was like a clusterfuck from the beginning, just like all over the place, and ended up being becoming defined by the harassment of women. So all these guys gathered and communicated on like four chan, in at relay chat rooms, Twitter,
and Reddit. Eventually four chan bands talking about about gamer gate, and that's when eight chan develops, which eight chan is now called eight kun or kun eight kuhn and is just like a full neo Nazi racist like Wonderland on the Internet. The gamer gate term comes from this actor Adam Baldwin.
I don't really know who he is.
He's been in a bunch of stuff, Like he was in Firefly, he was in a show called Chuck. I'm sure you're all gonna DM me and go. He was so and So's father in this movie. I don't know who he is. I don't really think I've seen him in anything, but I think he was in like Full Metal jacket like old movies, and then he's been like in some newer stuff, and he thought about it as
like corruption in gaming. You know that journalists were you know, taking like bribes or person having personal relationships and stuff that influence what they covered in the gaming industry. So he is the one that coined the term gamer gate. But he also endorsed Ted Cruz in twenty six So that tells us everything we need to know. I think. Let me get to like how it really went down.
So it started in twenty thirteen when Zoe Quinn, who was an indie game developer, released Depression Quest, which is a text focused game designed to convey the experience of depression through all these fictional scenarios and it was based on their own experience with the illness. So it was really well reviewed by gaming media. But these fucking loser in cells in the gaming world didn't like that it wasn't a violent skill based game exactly like what happens
in this episode. They just don't like that it's not a shoot him up game, and they think it's bringing politics into gaming and they don't like that. So Zoe was already getting a lot of shit in twenty thirteen just for developing this game. And then in twenty fourteen we get to the Zoe Post, which is a post on a blog written by Zoe's ex boyfriend, Aaron Joni Jony.
It's one of those GJ situations.
I don't really know how you say it, but in twenty fourteen, he wrote this long, detailed post about Zoe and his relationship with them and their breakup and like he put in personal text emails chats, I think possibly no, not nudes.
But all bad.
All this like personal shit he included in this post, and the post falsely accused Zoe of having a sexual relationship with this journalist named Nathan Grayson from Kataku, which is a you know how Gawker has like Jezebel, They've got Jalopi, They've got like all these different lifestyle based websites blogs. Kataku is their gaming one. Yes, exactly Dead's been. Kataku is their gaming one. So he accused his ex Zoe of having a sexual relationship with this journalist at
Kataku so that he would review their game favorably. This is what a lot of people think gamergate is about. These two people colluding for good game reviews and it's wild because this guy, Aaron who posted the blog later said that this was a typo and that he actually had no proof of their relationship at all. And then number two, he never reviewed their game, like he never
reviewed Depression Quests. So the entire backbone of Gamergate to me that if you're claiming it's about ethics and journalism there is completely dispelled. So Zoe gets docked their Tumblr, Skype and Dropbox gets hacked, their nudes get leaked, and of course there's like rape and death threats up the wazoo, and they ended up fleeing their home for their safety.
So not a great situation for Zoe.
And I just want to clarify that currently Zoe identifies as non binary, but at the time of Gamergate, Zoe identified as female, so that's why I am using the correct pronouns now. But Zoe was targeted as a woman back in the day. Then another target who I believe
that Raina Punjabi's character is based on Zoe. And this next person a little bit because this is a feminist media critic named Anita Sarkisian, and she was kind of the biggest face of Gamergate, like because she just was very vocal and received a lot of hate, but is not actually a game developer herself.
So I think that's like it's an amalgamation of the two.
So Anita had previously been the target of online harassment because she has this YouTube series called Tropes Versus Women, and she did this one called Tropes Versus Women in video Games that analyze sexist portrayals of women. She does it all about pop culture, but then she did one
about video games. She also started a nonprofit called Feminist Frequency that makes a lot of content like videos, and they aim to quote analyze modern media's relationship to gender, race, and sexuality, and they advocate just treatment of all people offline and online. I'm sure even that description would make all these gamer losers go fucking nuts.
Like I'm just sitting here thinking and maybe arcade is different than video games, but it's like do they hate Miss pac Man, like you know, you just have to shoot people? Or you like, why aren't they mad at Madden? That's about football? Like you know what I mean. It's just like even there, it's obviously hatred towards women, but it's like their fake cover story isn't real because they're not mad at any sports games or the boxing or jaws. I don't know.
Well, I think like what I in what I was reading, like what some people are saying is like these are people that feel marginalized, and they feel like gaming is a place where they're accepted and they.
Get that little like they get that.
Little dose of acceptance that they're looking for, and they feel like when like women and like people of color and like other people come in, they're taking something away from them in their space.
But they keech bullshit. Well it's just silly because it's like, well, don't you feel that they these other people also find a home in video games, Like it just seems exactly so strange to thank you, a white man in a country built for and by white men, feels out of place, But like this black woman who likes video games would not feel out of place and want refuge in a thing.
Well, right, I mean you're describing white privilege. It's like fully on display here. Yeah, Like it's it's terrible. These guys are not right. So, like, while the original goal I think was to sort of critique the representation of women in pop culture, it ended up being about ending abuse in the games industry. That's like what the focus is now of feminist frequency, and a lot of her videos have been viewed a million times.
It's pretty successful.
So she did an episode of her show about the whole Zoe Quinn thing, and she received rape and death threats and private information about her was released, including her home address, and she also fled her home.
And that's the thing because all these people, like maybe I'm combining them and they shouldn't be, but I'm assuming they're just like right wing lunatics that want freedom and it's all about your freedom, and yet with these actions they try to like fuck up other people's freedom, you know what I mean, Because like the point of this is to make sure these women never speak again or never want to go public or never do anything because they're put in danger and like all their private shits
put out. So it's like they are constantly going against their ideals too, where like this feminist frequency is her safe space, and now you're mad at what she says, and now you're trying to her up for like being her own self. It's like enraging. I'll shut up.
No, no, no, you're you're exactly right, And it's like that's basically what people started to realize that Gamergate became Gamergate became shutting down any opposition or any critique of the gaming industry in vis a vi women, you know, or minorities, or.
Like anything political, but mostly women.
Actually, someone created a computer game called beat Up Anita Sarkisian where you could just virtually beat up Anita with your mouse, like so pretty fucked up. Anita had said, kind of like what we say all the time on this podcast, but she said, one of the most radical things you can do is to actually believe women when they talk about their experiences. The perpetrators do not see themselves as perpetrators at all. They see themselves as noble warriors.
So that's like these guys, I think put themselves like, you know, they are video game characters in their own minds.
Like one time, Anita was set to speak at Utah State University in October of twenty fourteen, like a few months after Gamergate had really had started, and she had to cancel the whole thing because they were calling in bomb threats, death threats, saying there was going to be a mass murder, like comparing it to this mass murder that happened in Montreal saying like, this is what we're going to do at this place, and they couldn't do extra security at this venue because Utah's opened carry laws,
so they just canceled the event. And this got a lot of media attention, and then the FBI started an investigation, which ultimately went nowhere because all these people are anonymous and it's like very hard to track people down. Another victim of gamer Gate was Brianna Wu, an independent game developer and co founder of a video games studio called Giant Space Cat. She was doxed on eight Chan as a retaliation for just a mocking gamer Gate.
She wasn't even like because she was making games. I don't but I had something to do with that.
But she mocked Gamergate and got fully docksed, rape and death threats as she contacted police fled her home, but also said that she would not allow threats to intimidate her into silence, so she did offer a reward for information leading to conviction of people who were harassing her, and she set up a legal fund to help other
game developers who had been harassed online. So very cool person, Brianna Wu, And like, I don't even know, I think one time I tried to go on four Chan, like I'm talking ten years ago, just to see what was up, and like I slowly backed out of the room. There's also Felicia Day, who is an actress and gamer that my husband kind of knows and some of my friends know, but I've I've heard of her more than anyone else
in this story. She wrote a blog about her concerns over gamer Gate and her fear of retaliation if she spoke up against it, and almost immediately her home address, her phone number was posted online. She got harassing letters, phone calls. But then then like the actor Will Wheedon and an NFL player named Chris Klue also posted criticisms of gamer Gate and surprise, surprise, their phone numbers addresses
are no to be found. And Stephen Colbert talked about why are men not being threatened by gamer Gate?
It's like completely targeting women.
So if it really is about ethics and journalism and it's about all this other shit you claim, it's about why are when people critique it that are men, why are you not going after them? So it's insane and it's it was never about ethics. It's about shutting women up. Which we've said, and it's anyone who criticized the patriarchal, male dominated culture of gaming gets, you know, their lives ruined.
One article I read, and I just want to mention this said, these threats the women were receiving were quote, not just run of the mill internet nastiness. In many cases, these women received highly graphic, disturbing threats, the stuff of SVU episodes. So I like that somebody agreed with us, and then SVW was like, hell, yeah, we're gonna make an episode about it.
And this is again just an assumption on my part, but I bet these are the same men that say I'm a good guy. Why am I getting friend Zone? What the fuck? I'm such a good guy? And girls who want to damy like, these are the guys. These are the guys. I think they're nice people. Yeah, these dumb bitches don't want to be my girlfriend. Fuck? Okay.
So, according to the Entertainment Software Association, forty eight and this is this is actually this data is from about five or six years ago, from when gameror Gate was happening. But they say forty eight percent of game players in
the United States are women. Game developers are mostly male, I mean, apparently there was a survey of game developers in twenty fourteen that found only twenty one percent of the respondents identified as female, So almost half of gamers are women, you know, And it's just so insane to say no women in gaming. It's the same thing to me as when people go women aren't funny, and I'm like, but fifty percent of audiences are women, like going to
see comedy. Fifty percent of the world is women. So yeah, Eventually, like they there wasn't, you know, an FBI investigation, and I'm sure local authorities tried to jump in at some points, but it's very hard to prosecute these offenders that were all operating under pseudonyms on the internet. And then, yeah, like I said, eight chan became this gamer gate hub eventually after four chan band discussion, and eight chan is where QAnon lives no surprise here, it is where conspiracy
nutbags go to hang out and party. The whole gamer Gate debate obviously brought Nazis, Men's right activists and other losers out of the woodwork, and mainstream gaming critics and gamer gate supporters kind of like this actor at Adam Baldwin. They insist that the trolls are just a small vocal minority, that it's actually a very small group of people, but they're all very tech savvy, so they create these sock
puppet accounts to appear like a larger group. It's kind of like how I think during twenty sixteen election, when you would look under Trump and you would see all the peppet, you'd see all these bots and stuff, you thought that there were a lot more people supporting Trump than I think actually do.
So.
Anita Sarkisian talks a lot about how women and men are attacked very different online in a lot of the ways that these websites, like even Twitter or Readit, whatever, the way that they're set up to deal with reporting, Like when you report someone's harassment, it's very focused towards the male experience.
It's not focused towards the female experience.
Like she says, men are usually embarrassed, it's an insult, it's a one time thing. When women are attacked, it's violent threats, it's sexual harassments, and it's sustained over time.
So we can see that reporting on social media is created for the way men are harassed because users can send abusive comments to women and then get reported and get taken down and they just set up new accounts and it's up to the person receiving the vitriol to keep blocking them, you know, like it's up to the women.
Yeah, and they're you know when you do get fucked up shit written, Like the people that are in charge of deciding what is abusive and what is not are white tech boy nerds that were probably a part of gamer gate. But Marshabelski has a whole thing. There's like
a pod documentary about Facebook and everything. But like Steph Tolov just posted it like it never ends where you can just like repost something horrific a man wrote to you, and wright men are trash and you will get in trouble and taken off a site for a month, and that is deemed abusive. Like if you repost something a man sends you that you will get in trouble. But so often when you write to people like race, like we have multiple friends who have been a part of
this where they get like I'm gonna rape you. You beat beat beat beep, and yeah the sits right back, so I'm going sorry, We've we've decided this isn't abusive, and so anything towards white men you will get in trouble. Any thing that's like I will rape you. It's like, sorry, this doesn't work. But if you retweet the posts of someone threatening rape, you will then get banned. So it's like, not only are they building the sites for dudes, but like the people in charge of deciding what's abusive or
not are also dudes who are probably abusive. Yeah. So oh.
Anita also said women are still afraid to go to the police with stories of rape and abuse, and now we're afraid to go to the police saying I got this death threat from email or Twitter because police will look at you and say what's Twitter? She said, I've had a cop say to me, why don't you just quit your job? Why don't you just stop doing what you're doing? Like, which is you know, not surprising that cops are not either with it or smart about their suggestions.
Yeah, she should have been like, cool, give me your pension. Yeah, I'll take your pension. I'm gonna need some time, I'm gonna need some money to get me started. Okay.
So basically what Anita says is that game studios, developers and major publishers need to kind of speak out against this harassment of women and say that this behavior is unacceptable. And some brands have, like I believe EA Games and Stuff has said something, but like Blizzard, other game companies like haven't. And that was at the time of gamer Gate. It's possible now they have, but a lot of places
like that. That is kind of where it starts, is like just in the whole gaming culture being like, Okay, this isn't it, Like this thing against women is not it? Like why don't you have problems with like this character can't run fast enough, he doesn't have enough fireballs to shoot?
Like these are gaming problems? Like stop? Who? Why do you care? Who plays?
What? It's really I mean, what we've been saying the whole time. So that's basically the story of Gamergate. One good thing that came out of it was in twenty nineteen, Anita founded the Game and Online Harassment Hotline, which is a free, nonprofit service for people that are being harassed
in gaming or online. So that's Gameshotline dot org. And I'm going to talk a little bit more about what Anita does in our what was Sister peg jew segment, but that is Gamergate in a nutshell for now, Kara, I have.
A reveal for you. You say you don't know who Adam Baldwin is.
Oh god, he's CNSFU, lost reputation, Gonzel Delia Craigan gets in trouble for US allegedly killing a sex worker. Right, yes, And while he's being investigated, in comes Captain Stephen Harris for three episodes played by your man Adam Baldwin.
Oh and he's like a dick, right is the next sucks?
Yeah?
Yeah, he's like an asshole that's like on yes, Oh my god. Okay, that makes sense.
Okay, well, so they who started so as a button on this episode, the guy who started Gamergate played a total dick in SVU, of course, and he's like a full libertarian, right wing kind of guy.
Let's get him on the pod. Listen. I don't want to talk to this bootleg Baldwin, but can't wait for everyone to listen to the interview we do have coming up next.
Baby, Okay, let's get to our interview. We're so excited we got to talk to this person. She has been a regular cast member on ABC's The Fix, n NBC's Champions You might have seen her on Vampire Diaries Bones American Horror Story.
I mean, she stays working.
You might recognize her from SVU as Dara mclaonnie in more recent episodes, but in this today's episode, you know her as Raina Punjabi.
Check out our interview with Mausam Macar. It's exciting that you did amazing in your episode and then you were asked back for many episodes and you were a fan of the show. So since you were a fan, how did it feel when you first got booked or like the audition or any of that. I was very.
Excited, obviously, and I think, I know, I.
Know, this was the first show that I booked that I was a fan of, that a show that I actively watched everything else I had done. There were a lot of new shows, so they hadn't been on air for that long. So when I got to set, I mean, first off, I was I just had the biggest shit eating grid when I saw Mershkah, Like at that point, we hadn't been introduced because I was coming in, you know, I think she was finishing up a previous episode, so
we just passed each other in the hallway. So she didn't know who I was, or maybe she did, but she probably didn't, you know, put two and two together. I think she was just walking to set and I just had the biggest smile because I couldn't I couldn't believe I was there.
And then.
On my first day of filming, I had a scene with everybody, like the entire cast, and I just.
The time.
I was like, oh my gosh, I used to watch this from my like dorm room in college.
And I'm here and and I don't I and Murushka tried to talk to me, and I really.
Made the stupidest and like I could not think straight. And that was the first time I realized.
I'm like, because I'm usually a person that's usually not nervous on set or anything, I'm like, oh, this, this.
Is this is what it feels to be nervous.
Because she would ask me very simple questions that had very simple answers, but I would just overthink it.
I think.
I think at one point we had filmed something and you know, and she and there was myself and another guest actor on my very first episode that I did, and he was from New York. Fantastic actor that I've worked with him again since and she looked towards two of us and asked, oh, where are you guys from? And I'd been flown in from LA and I was about to see Oh no. She asked me, are you
guys from LA? And I was about to say yes, but then I was like, oh, maybe maybe she maybe she she means from LA, but I'm not from LA. I only moved to LA a few years ago. But then as I was answering, I said, oh, no, no, she probably doesn't need to know all that. She probably just wants to know if I came from LA. So it came out of my mouth was.
Yeah, no, no, yeah, yeah. It was literally the response I came out of my mouth.
The first things I said to Mershcaggerty as myself, not in character, and of course my guest. I was like, yes, I'm originally from New York, but you know, and he just had such so much more composed answer.
I just looked at him.
I was like, wow, I sound like an idiot. I sound like a truly crazy person. And then she had an yeah. And then she had another question at some point where she has, oh, I don't get to watch a lot of TV. Have you guys done a lot of TV, and I just I didn't want to come across as an experience. But I also didn't want to pretend that I'd been doing this forever. At that point, had done several guest stars, you know, but nothing, nothing too much.
And I just blurted out, oh.
The usual amount, which I don't know what that means.
I have no idea what that means.
Well, we checked out your IMDb and you are booked, you are you are working. It seems like you are busy. Yes no, thank you.
I've since then, I've I've gotten a yes, no thank you. I appreciate it, but at the moment I could not make a one.
Full sentence in front of Murshia.
It is kind of like, I mean, I like I was. I was a Paige at Conan and I would meet famous people every day.
But it wasn't until I met Tina Fey that.
I was like and I had met like all these Jennifer Andison, all these big stars.
But like when it's somebody.
Who's work you really like admire you've been watching for so long, it's such a different kind of tongue tied experience. Really, I like to you just ran through a full conversation with mercer Harget in your mind that wasn't happening, and you were giving the answers out loud as you went.
And then how did it feel to be asked back after your first episode?
That was? That was fantastic.
I had such a great time on my first episode. And you know, because I've been a fan of the show, I knew it's like, oh, people come back as different, you know, different characters.
Sometimes that would be so great.
But my first episode was such a wonderful experience and I had so much fun doing so many different things for just for that one episode. I felt truly fulfilled from that experience, so everything else just felt like a cherry on top. So yeah, when they asked me back, I was like, sure, but I was only add a couple of years ago. They're cool with that, and I'm like, yeah, yeah, they're cool with it. I'm like, great that, I'm cool with it.
Yeah, it is pretty cool. Close.
You guys did not give the audience much time to forget about rain Now before you re emerged as a new person.
Right exactly.
But and who's to say, I mean, you could always come back again, right this character could be back many many times.
I shot my final episode a month before COVID, and at the time the talk was, oh, we're planning to bring you back, et cetera, et cetera. So there was definitely talk of that. Of course, COVID hit and then it didn't make sense to fly in people from town with quarantine rules. So hopefully I would love to come back. It was the new character is also so fiery and feisty and you know, spunky, so it would be really fun to do.
Wow. So Raina was a badass. But while she kept being like, don't give me security, I'm doing what I want. I'm not canceling the launch where you like, shut up, rain Like, were you frustrated with your character that she wasn't listening to the pros?
Absolutely, for me, i'd be like, yes, give me all the precissions.
I don't trust anybody out there. I've seen too many SVU episodes. I know what's going on. Yeah, but I understood.
I understood her her desire to be with the people and everything. I definitely worked that in my my character homework and everything. But absolutely, when I was like, when I make a list of things, I make a list of characteristics whenever I get to play a character of you know, uh, these are the ways the characters very like me, and these are the ways that the characters are very unlike me. One of the things I definitely noted was maus of maccarr would have definitely asked for
all the security possible, right up. Ajabi doesn't, you know, doesn't feel the need for this, So that was definitely one of the differing points.
Wait, so did you know anything about gamer Gate before you film this? Yeah?
So, I from from looking at the sides, it looked like it was inspired by that, And then as soon as I got the full script, I figured that that was going to be the inspired by true events piece of it.
So I definitely looked into it a lot.
And I also figured out from some of the costuming choices that they were trying to go for maybe, you know, inspired by a certain I can't remember the name of the woman, but the depth, the hoop ear rings and everything with a tied back hair.
I forget.
I forget the woman that it was kind of inspired by.
Oh wait, I know exactly who she is, Anita Sarkisian. Yes, exactly, that's exactly it.
So when we were trying out outfit looks, you know, and they're looking at earrings and outfits, I'm like, oh.
Yeah, I know. Yeah.
They were also definitely giving you, I feel like a young female Steve Jobs vibe some of it.
Like yeah, absolutely absolutely so yeah.
So going into filming, I had read up as much as I could about what the real situation was, just to figure out what doxing was and things like that, because at the time it was sort of like fresh as to what was kind of happening that was kind of happening.
All across the country to people.
So I remember looking up all these things at the time, So I definitely knew what was inspired by.
Are you a video game person? I'm not.
My husband is, so I you know, he would fill me in on some of this stuff, but even he is not like super into it. Right, I do not play any video games.
He's not threatening and harassing women.
I know, maybe he doesn't when I'm asleep, but from what I know, he goes to me the same time I do, and so I don't.
Think he's doing that. I loved your wardrobe. I loved the white outfit so much, and like business ye, and then at the end when you decide you're going to step out of gaming. It was like a loose sweater and I didn't know if that was on purpose, like professional to lounge wear, but I liked that. Absolutely.
The costume designer on it is the same woman that I've worked with throughout all my episodes, and absolutely she's fantastic. And when she brought out that first set of right outfits, I'm like, oh, Raina's going to be cool, Like yeah, it was really great. And even the hair that they did, like some when I'm doing the speech with the black jacket or vest, like I don't remember exactly what it was, but I had this awesome break down my side.
It was Yeah.
They were really really made her very much cutting edge cool for sure.
Yeah was it hard? I mean it's one of the more graphic episodes. I would say, even it's scary, it's intense. How was it shooting such intense stuff? Prepping for it and then watching it? Was that hard? Yeah?
I think it was very hard for my parents to watch. I think they were very proud of my work, but they were.
I actually got a lot of like actual phone calls for my friends afterwards because I think they.
Were all just very disturbed by seeing me like attacked. So, like you said, I think it was a little bit more graphic than other episodes, and I think I had a lot of friends who were like, I just needed to hear your voice and just make sure you're actually okay.
Yeah, I mean, I.
Know this is a show, but that that I just needed to hear your voice voice and just just make sure you were cool.
Yeah.
I mean at the time, it was again, you know, there were everybody was great on set and everything, but yeah, it was it was definitely long days of you know, and having to get into a mental space of like.
Okay, now I've been great, now I've been kidnapped. You know, It's just it's just a lot.
And I would I.
Remember coming home every night from filming, I would always just get some room service of ice cream and just wash HGTV.
Because I was like, I just have to like physically.
Shut my head down and everything down and just watch remodeling shows just so I just could just kind of wash away the day.
So yeah, it was definitely.
Intense, and I even remember at one point, you know, at some point it does become technical, because I remember one point I was in the I was in the hair and makeup and we were trying to figure out how how much injuries I needed because we were kind of going back and forth and I and I make a list of everything, and they were like, wait, so have you only been kidnapped or have you already been
raped yet. I'm like, no, I haven't been raped yet, but I haven't I have been beaten up, so it shouldn't be as much as have been raped like we did yesterday, but it should be a little less.
Like we're just going kind of going through all the timeline of it.
So I just remember kind of having those conversations with the hair and makeup team trying to figure out the extent of the injuries as we go back and forth because we don't film, you know, chronologically, so those moments are kind of funny. But then you know, when you're in the space and it's like dark, and you know, and and and you're working with a sun team of like, okay, they're going to push you, and I'm like, oh right, yeah, okay, yes, yeah,
let's get into this. So it just yeah, it takes a lot of like mental energy, but this I feel like this was the I don't think I've ever ever had.
The chance to do so much in one episode.
So that was also kind of very gratifying to be able to like really stretched myself as an actor of just like being able to present in front of a crowd like that was an amazing experience. It's like, Okay, here's a room, here's like a filled out auditorium, and you get to make a speech and all these people are cheering for you for this character.
But it's like, oh my.
Gosh, I bet there are actual people who have fans like this.
Like it was just like, ay.
There are several moments that were like I can't imagine walking into an auditorium and having like thousands of screaming fans and I'm like, and you know, my character has that, so just kind of the rush and the power and like trying to it was just like as an actor, it felt like a very full experience of like playing a powerful woman who didn't want to seem intimidated, a woman who was able to enjoy that power but then unfortunately, you know, the world getting in the way and.
You know, having that power taken away.
And it just it felt like a true journey for a character so that was very gratifying.
What a journey, and then like the when your hands are like taped to the gun, and then that final speech, it's just like it's so power, don't I don't know powerful zword's scared. Yeah, it's very good.
Yeah, I mean my mom had a hard time watching you, So I can't imagine how your mom felt, like, yeah all that.
No, my mom was like, oh, I mean she just felt like she was like, you did such good work, but oh, I don't. I don't want to see you like that, get honey, And I'm like, I understand, I don't.
I don't need to do that.
In every episode of every TV show I do.
Now, the important stuff was careesy hot in person. He was charming.
He's super charming.
He's so so such a sweetheart, a lovely, lovely guy to work with, so great, you know we yeah, we totally got along.
He was lovely.
Did you eventually warm up with Mushika and we're able to have some like normal conversations, Yes.
Thankfully, thank you for asking that I did because the second the second time I came back, So the first time as a new character, all my scenes were with were in the courtroom, so I didn't have any scenes with her. But then the third time I came back, the episode was directed by Mrshka Oh yes, and it was really yes exactly, and I was so grateful for that because I really feel like I needed to redeem
myself in front of her. And I was like, man, I'm true, I'm really not that, I'm really not that big of an idiot, and I'm really not like that, you know, unable to speak in front of celebrities, because up until that time, I was totally.
Fine, and since then I've been fine.
And so I was so glad I was able to come back for an episode that she directed, because she loves directing and you could really see the joy and excitement in her eyes when she's directing, like she it just feels like a it feels like a new adventure for her, I think. So for one, it was great to be directed by her, great to see how excited she was doing that. And then she's you know, because because she's an actress, she's such a kind and giving director.
Like just the way she directs actors and everything is just very encouraging, very just very warm and loving. And so I finally did get to have good conversations with her and got to take selfies with her and everything, and so yeah, and so it was a much I was far more normal that time around.
And we obviously looked you up online and saw that you had a career transition. So you used to work in finance before you started acting, And I'm just curious as to how that whole transition happened, And is finance as terrible as it seems to us people who do not work in finance.
Sure, So I had done acting all through high school, so it wasn't like a completely new thing. But when I got to college, it was very much like, Okay, that was nice, I'm going to set that aside now and now I'm going to do something reasonable. And it wasn't, you know, the typical stereotypical all my parents told me I couldn't do acting.
I was just a very logical kid who was like, you.
Know, that's a hobby, and now I'm going to go into something that will make me money or you know, or just have like a stable life. A finance So I did investment banking, which is very long hours. I worked eighty to one hundred hours a week, barely saw family, and friends.
I did like the job, and I liked.
The people I worked with.
I did it in Chicago, so I'm sure my experience would have been different in a different place.
But I worked.
A lot of folks I worked with in Chicago still had that like Midwestern nicety to them, so it was actually and maybe.
That's the stereotype. Two.
I've heard of other.
Investment banks in Chicago that didn't have as good of experience as mine. I worked at a boutique bank, so my experience with them was good. It was just a tough life to keep continuing, and I realized that I couldn't imagine myself like when I thought about my life.
Twenty years in the future.
I just didn't see myself doing finance investment banking. And I lined up a private equity job right after. But I took a few months off to kind of find myself because there was just a lot of pressures in my life at that point, and I was like, I need to get away from every single human being I know so I can think for myself for a minute.
So I took.
Off for a trip to Africa and I hiked Malcolm.
Njaro and did a camping Safari through the SERENGETI wo, So I had.
Wait, what are you already an out doorsy person? Like they just want to know I just went.
I just I was like, fuck it, I just need I truly.
Was looking away to get away from everybody, from from my parents, from my coworkers, and for my boyfriend at the time.
Who is now my husband. So it's fine, but there was just you know, my my.
Family was pretty traditional and they wanted me to get an arranged marriage. I had a boyfriend who was not my culture or religion or anything, who was like, when what's happening with us? And then my coworker's like, oh, you should be you should be going to these business schools. And so there was just like, ah, I'm just going crazy. And I was like, where can I go where no
one can reach me by email or cell phone? And I was like, if I go, if I go in the middle of the Serengetti and I'm camping, there's no internet access. But it was during this trip that I finally got a chance to just sit back and think. And there were just a couple of people I met during this trip that kind of asked like made me think about certain things for the first time and just finally made me take a step back and be like, man, when when was I just feeling truly creative and fulfilled
and et cetera, et cetera. And I thought about all the times I was doing acting in high school. You know, I did like summer acting programs, And so when I came back to Chicago and started my new job, I kind of started actively figuring out how to bring that back into my life.
And it started with taking Second City.
Classes and doing every student film that was out there. Like literally, I was doing one every weekend because I was like, I just need to learn, gain enough experience, figure out this is what I want to do. And I got to a decision point in my life where it was I either apply and go to business school and kind of go down the finance path, or I quit.
And just try acting and see what happens.
And I figured if if it was awful and I just crashed and burned, it would be an interesting business school essay and I could just kind of divert back.
Wow, And it paid off, and now you're you have the tools to invest your money as an actor and make it. Yeah, like you know how to turn those residuals into something to write home about.
That's awesome exactly.
No, yeah, that that is one of the things that I've I've noticed just from you know, because they from what a lot of a lot of my friends who've gone through acting, you know, like a college acting program. And I think it's changing now, but just like sort of like the financial tools and like how to handle your life isn't really taught two actors, you know, and hopefully that's changing now. But yeah, absolutely I didn't know what to do and I kind of had all those tools everything in place.
And yeah, save some money for taxes exactly, and then you know, and I make sure your business manager is not stealing all your money. You know. Yes, it's awful.
Do you hear stories like that?
Yes, yeah, no, I yeah.
And it also gave me, you know, I had savings, so I was able to like get coaching for things. Because I was so raw and new, I didn't have a formal training program, so I got I worked with acting coaches and then finally did a conservatory. So yeah, it gave me, gave me the ability to just learn and everything while I was still working. And so yes, I'm very grateful that I And it also gave the
work style of investment bankers just so intense. So I pretty much just tried to apply that into my acting world.
What was the first job you booked that you were like, Yeah, I'm this is it. I'm killing it. I'm going to be able to like work.
Oh sure, Well the first TV that I booked, which actually is funny. So my episode, my first episode of SVU was directed by the same director that directed me for the very first time in television. They're both Dick Wolf. I did Chicago Fire. Oh so Chicago.
Fire was my very very.
First episode of TV.
And so it all felt very full circle because SVU was such a big get for me because at that time that was the biggest guest star i'd done.
I'd done a bunch of smaller guest.
Stars, but that was sort of like the biggest main you know, guest star. So and to have it be directed by the very first director that I ever worked with on TV was was really lovely.
And then since you are an SVU fan, I would like to ask, like, what are your favorite episodes or das or like what yeah, stuff like that, Like, what are your favorite SVU characters and episodes.
Right, Well, I I don't watch it as regularly as I used to. I think when I was in college and stuff.
I used to.
I mean, whenever there was an SVU marathon on, I would watch it. I'd get I didn't have cable in my home. So when we go to a hotel room, if there was an SVU marathon on, I'd be like, I need to set aside a few hours.
Just for this.
I know we're on vacation, but I'm gonna need to watch a few hours of SVU.
But oh, what is it?
Novak? I love Novak?
Oh yeah, I love I mean, I loved all the female das I loved. I'm trying to remember. I think Novak was probably my favorite one. I love the new crew that they have now too, and also because that's why I worked with, so it feels a little bit more like, oh, I know them, They're so great, They're lovely, you know. All the others are just more like, oh, I just you know, I just admire them.
From Afar, do you have any episodes that like stick out to you as like we like to say haunting, because I feel like your episode is like it's like very fucked up. So I'm like, what's your version of like watching this episode?
Sure?
Sure, I think there was an episode where Novac played I can't remember the actress's name now, Yes, did she initially come as as like an attacker?
Yes? Oh yeah she could killed a stripper.
Yes, that episode because like where like the tables are turned, that always like sticks out in my mind. It was like, oh wow, it can it can happen, It can happen to anybody type of thing. And I remember that episode also because of Novak and I was like, oh, she came on the show before she was da so and she was so great in that role, Like it was just it was just nice to see that, like, oh she's kind of rotten in this one and not. And so that episode is always the one I think.
Yeah, she actually she actually rapes a stripper and kills one of her friends.
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
I'm sorry, No, I just you know, I mean the fans will tell. So, yeah, but what are you working on right now? We saw you're doing a project with Ava du Verney, which is it sounds cool called Naomi.
Yes, yes, what we got So it's a brand new show. It's a CW show in the DC World comic books. It's it's based on a brand new comic called Naomi that came out in twenty nineteen, I believe, So it's a whole new world, but it is in the world of Superman.
So it's in that world.
Now.
I don't know if it I don't know if it's in like the Aero Verse world of the CW, but it is in the world of Superman. And so we shot the pilot in March, and we got the series pickup order last month or yes, last month, No, this, I don't.
Remember one of these months.
And we're going to start shooting the first season, hopefully in August, so that will be the thing that I'm doing.
It's a great, great story.
It's about a black girl who starts to discover that she has power. So she's she would be one of the youngest superheroes out there. She's a sixteen year old girl going about her life in this ideal like little, tiny, sort of like army based town and then things start happening to her, and it's the story is kind of about her journey of discovering who she is and how she fits into the world of Superman and you know, just that whole coming of.
Age story, but with superheroes.
Wait and what's so what's your role?
So I play Naomi's adoptive mom.
Oh okay, whoa huge Yeah?
So yeah, so it's pretty it's pretty exciting. So myself and Barry Watson from uh Seventh Heaven, baby seventh Heaven exactly, So he and I yeah, we're her parents.
Yeah, exactly. That's fun. You guys are like a hot couple.
Yeah.
I appreciate it. I can see it.
So yeah, it's going to be a spring show on cw' so it'll air early twenty twenty two.
Mouson was awesome. I mean, the fact that she has anyone with a Chicago story or two always catches my Yes, I know that.
That's a heartwarmer for you, a great way in for the Lisa troupe anyone wants to know Liza Trup.
But also just you know, anything about following your dreams, hiking a mountain, ending up like serendipitous moments of like working with someone and remembering them and having moments like I liked the thoughtfulness and all of her stories.
Yeah, she seems like just so genuinely nice person and that's seems to be paying all for most of the people that we interview. Sorry, bad news, assholes. But let's get into today's post mortem. What did we learn from intimidation game? Lisa, I'm just not going to go anywhere near video games because I'm not interested in them, but not because I'm a woman.
Yeah, I'll I guess I learned that people that like shooter games can't have any other games or they s been out of control. Like I guess that's what I learned, That everyone's out of their fucking minds. It's just it's interesting because the idea of.
Corruption in journalism is like, there's so much corruption in journalism and to focus it on video games is so bonkers to me, like ethics and gaming, Like there are ethical breaches happening all over the fucking world, Like there are people abusing institutions, abusing their power. Like it's just crazy where people are taking their stand. But that we learned today that they are very serious about it and they have a lot of tech savvy to make your life a living hell if you enter their world.
Yeah. Also, if the police offer extra protections for a giant event that's gotten death threats, say yes, yeah, take yeah, take it. Take some playing clothes officers and a couple of German shepherds, you know, for the safety of everybody, some free security, and turn it down. No. I wouldn't never turn that down ever, ever, ever. Also I don't know Logan Paul, get out of here. Also, your kids are creeps. You don't know everything about your kid. Your
kid doesn't tell you everything. Yes, your kid is a rapist. He's going to jail. Stop protecting him. My son would never Well, guess what we have proof? I don't know. That's a screen name, that's a screen game. Raise your fucking kids better. Yeah, oh my gosh. And also, don't ever try to play games with any of the detectives because guess what, Ice teas around the corner and he's about to shoot your ass. He's about to add light
your ass up. People forget they ad all cocky. Guess what Iced Tea's waiting, he's behind the corner.
His t should do that, he should do like play fucking whatever Skyrim with iced Tea for charity, like or something.
I bet that would make a lot of money. People would love to game with iced Tea.
I think he's a shit talker and a half in those little headsets, those little Madonna headsets gamers use, and yes, gamers, I'm calling the Madonna headsets. That's my frame of that's my point of reference for a front microphone.
But it is wild because video games everyone plays. It's so is this outdated? I wonder or is this still a real thing? Because you know, Tricksy Mattel, she's she's twitching all the time I'm playing games, and I guess she is a guy. But and then like this porn star. I love Adriana chechick. She's always she's always twitching. She did a twenty four hour twitch stream of a video game. And when sometimes she'll beat a game and she'll cry and be like, I can't believe it. That took me
sixteen hours. So and but I don't know if it's just perverts watching her play or game addicts, Like, I don't know, Probably a mix of both. Probably a mix of both. Yeah, yeah, her house looks great, Adriana, if you're listening, let me swim in your pool. Let me swim in your pool. I'm ready. Do you think if I DM her she'll let me swim in her pool? It's a great question, like can I dog sit for you? I want to be in your backyard.
Yeah, to have like a verified on Instagram dog sitter sounds like, you know.
What could go wrong? We follow each other? Oh yeah, I.
Think you can slide into those dms with your dog pool requests.
Be like, remember me, I waited in line to meet you at a pornhub pop up in New York. We've done some professional work together, but that is not porn. No, that makes it sound like you've done porn with her.
Oh no, I did a Brasser's roast. Yes, I remember that. That looked really really fun.
I did work at the Avens and it was like I was in a room getting makeup done with all these like naked porn stars. But she was like, what do you want for your makeup? And I was like, I don't want other people to think that I think that I'm a porn star. I was very carry Bradshaw in the real episode where I'm like, I don't want people to think that I'm a porn It's like can you?
And then they made my makeup like I was a porn and I'm like, I just don't want people to think i'm deluged, like I just I don't know what you want for me, Like like I'm here to get can I just look like a comic? But and what was crazy? I mean, this has nothing to do with gamer Gate. I very apologize to anyone that wants a full on post mortem. But the funny a funny tale was all these girls that was getting my makeup done with. They were talking shit about this one porn star and
they're like, she's so fucking ugly and annoying. And I had masturbated to her that morning, but I didn't want to say anything because I was like, I guess you guys fucking hate her, but I don't think she's ugly. But I just like sat listening to them talk about her.
Wow, Lisa, you just stood idly by while someone who had just given you pleasure moments earlier is getting raked across the calls by her coworkers.
Well because I'm in their space, you know, so I'm like, of course, shll I joke. I wouldn't expect that. I should have been like, you know what, I like her, and you guys are all bitches, Like I don't know, see you on the red carpet. I hope you talked to me like that would have been crazy? What else? Oh, the first thing ever is getting your hands taped to a gun? Oh god? Yeah, So if you're a book an officer, maybe look out for that. I don't know.
Anyway, let's move on to what would Sister Peg do? Segment, which we are going to highlight this week, which every week, you know, what would Sister Peg do? We highlight an organization, give you a piece of reading, an article or a book or something that can give you more info on the episode that we talked about today, And today we're going to focus in on Anita Sarkisian's organization, which is
called Feminist Frequency. It's Feminist Frequency dot com and their goal is to end abuse in the games industry and they also establish, i think, as we mentioned, the gaming industry's first games and Online Harassment hotline, which is a tech based support resource for people who struggle from abuse online.
Yeah, the website has a weekly podcast, tons.
Of resources, so go check that out if you are interested in any more info.
Thank you so much for that, Kara, And next week we will be doing at Charisma for all you sick fucks out there. Season six, Episode seven, check it out on Hulu, Peacock, or wherever you steal some SVU thank you so much for always tuning in and being such great listeners, and we'll see you next week. Bye. That's Messed Up as an Exactly Right production.
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