Breakwater

Of the law and order franchises, SVU is considered especially watchable.

We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the vicious felonies.

These episodes are based on.

These are our stories, done.

Done, Happy New Year, Thats messed up an SVU podcast.

I'm one of your hosts, Kara Klank.

And I'm Leeza Trigger.

We talk SVU true crime and we don't have guests, but we will soon.

The strike is almost you know, it's over. Whatever.

Also, if you're checking in, I'm on a flight right now back from Mexico City back to La Hopefully I had some you know, outer body werele experiences there or just ate some good food.

I think you're gonna eat great foo.

Everybody says Mexico City is like the new hot spot for cuisine, Like, yeah, a lot of bachelor parties go there, Like the people go there for I'm going.

On the later and you know, Mexico City kept ramping up.

It was the cool place to go.

And you know, I am now one of the basics that are Yeah.

One of the one of the executive producers of Drag Race went when we were working on the show, and he's like a cool like gay man that went with his husband, and I was like, this seems like a really awesome trip. Like when I saw the pictures, and that was twenty nineteen, you're not that late.

I mean three or four years. But it's like, I know what you're talking about.

A few years ago, Prague was like the hot place, or not Prague, the Dalmation coast, Croatia, the Dalmatian coast of Croatia, like everybody was going there because it was like it.

Was like Game of Thrones was filmed. I said something to my sister. I'm like, let's go to Croatia. She goes, it's over. We're going to Albania. That's the news place. I'm like, I love it, but it's like I never want to go.

Like everybody was going to Tuloom at one point, like fifteen years ago, and then like, well then it's it's like, you know, there's these little towns like Sayulita in Mexico, which everybody goes to, and then too many people go and they ruin their fucking sewage system and their shit running through the streets because they can't handle that many people. So I love that we can just pick different locations to ruin every few years, I know.

But you know what I didn't think about.

I was hanging out with someone and they were like, you know, it is illegal to be gay in like seventy five countries, and he was like, that's why all the gays always go to mikonos or the same places over and over because it's like there's only a few safe places where you can actually be like super gay and out and about. And I was like, wow, because we make jokes about the gays and miconos, but now at.

Like I was like, oh, yeah, you can't fucking go everywhere. And my brother, my brother and his husband had to think about that. For their honeymoon. They were literally like, we only want to go somewhere that's like gay friendly, and they went. They ended up going to Saint Bart's and Saint Martin, but they were like there were a couple places on their list that they were like, now we can't go there because we're gay. And I was like, oh fuck, Like that's why Portavarta is like a huge

For sure, it's.

Horrible, but like it's like you we don't think about that that like you know, well.

Yeah, it's like yeah, we like make jokes about like ah, you're going here without like thinking about what.

The Yeah, Like I definitely thought, oh wow, they're going to Portoviarta again, and then I'm like, oh wait, like yeah, you can't just like go wherever, and why not go to a place where like you're you're celebrated and like everybody love, like you're.

Not just well, they're not that bad to gay people there. Like I guess we could go and just like not kiss each other ever in public, you know what I mean.

Like, no, you're gonna want to go to the places where they're like super welcoming, so there should be fucking more.

It's kind of crazy that there's not.

No, it's like straight up illegal in so many places. Yeah, where like you know, people could go perform certain places, and my friends were like absolutely not.

My cousin who's gay, has gone to Russia for like fun trips while and I'm like why and he's like whatever, Like he just like is very loves history, loves international stuff.

You know, I don't know, I wouldn't go there.

I know, I know I could speak the language, I would not step foot there in ars.

I mean this is pre this was like pre Ukraine and stuff that he went. It was, you know, years ago, but like, yeah.

I'd never gone back either, there's no way. Yeah, I don't know. But outside of travel, well, so this is a little outdated. Maybe I've posted some photos by now, but I did get a VIP back lot tour of the San Diego Zoo and I did pet a zebra.

If you, if you know Liza or you've been to our live shows, we've done a lot of talking about zoo's I had. I didn't really know this until about you until like a few months ago that you're like.

Think it was a zoo person.

I know, but I didn't think it was.

I don't know if I'm I enjoy animals, but I guess I've had more opportunities lately to go to zoos than I haven't, but I'm you.

Know, I like animals.

I know, I know you like animals, but like this, like this, getting this tour, I feel like, was it was a top moment in your life?

Like it was really it sounds amazing.

Cool, and it's just it's really awesome to be around anyone that's really educated and smart and something they're really passionate about. And so like to be with these young people that are working at the zoo. And if you're at the San Diego Zoo, you're not a schlub. You are the best in the country. You were the best one of the best zoos.

Yeah.

Yeah, And so to learn about the conservation and how much they've done for animals and how much thought goes into animals and like we just kind of are like, oh, how sad they're in this thing, and just like the amount of thought goes into the space the animals in and the diet and the friends, like they were bringing a donkey to hang out with the zebra and like you know how different cheetahs have different personality traits and so one likes to run for fun, but most don't

Yeah, we're going to feed these camels. Sorry for the IP.

Experience, It doesn't matter. You just love a VIP experience, And.

Who does love passing a line for sure and being on a list. But and then three out of the four of us did go to the did buy stuff at the store, which I love.

But it was just cool.

And the one thing I really learned was, you know, at the Pittsburgh's who I was really sad for this red panda because he was so alone. And then I brought it up and our tour guide she was like, oh, well, we're putting human emotions on animals. These are solitary animals. They are alone in the wilds. They don't want friends. It's more food for them. And I went, whoa, and she goes, yeah, the only time they're together is mom and baby, and the dad is gone.

The dad's in a different place, the mom. Yeah.

Nothing to do with.

Hack animals, I guess like wolves or something, but yeah, and they don't have wolves.

Well they have wolves in behind the scenes and like in the hospitals, but wolves don't want to be seen and so they're not put out it to be seen.

Did you ask about pandas at all?

What's going like about like the implications of like the pandas all leaving?

I did, Yeah, so you know, it was like a fifty year lease, but she said that China's gonna like bring them back. It was just part of the lease, and it actually in twenty nineteen, but the pandemic made it difficult, so they knew it was happening. The pandas are back, and she said they're probably like broke her a new deal and get the pandas back, Like she's not really worried about it.

It seems like they'll come back.

That it wasn't like a geopolitical like well, because that's what people say that like the pandas are a symbol of how relations are going between the US and China.

So who knows, because it.

Was worldwide, it was I or maybe it wasn't, but she didn't see. She said like that they're probably coming back, Like it didn't seem like she was that we about it. But I also did ask someone about SeaWorld and because they in their animal hospital, they help SeaWorld, and I tried to get dirt and they were not.

I don't think they were allowed to or they really believe in what they were saying. I don't know, but that they're for them, because I think.

That's the one animal that makes me sad is like Orca's Like, I don't think orcas should be and I.

Never saw that, doc. Did you see Blackfish?

Of course of course you did.

Yeah, like my octopus teacher, like you, you are into animals a lot more than I thought I've been discovering.

Yeah, they're cool, they're cool and cute.

Yeah, no, I.

Want to put a thing.

So anyways, once you put a zebra, it's really hard to go back into the regular world and act like you're not better than people.

But Oscar just got a zimber sticker at the doctor today and I go, you know, Lisa got to pet one.

He goes, can I do that one day?

Like he was?

He's My kids just want to do what you're doing all the time.

I want to go to Mexico.

This zebra is special because I learned that zebras are actually like pretty aggressive and defensive because they're prey for so many animals.

This zebra is special and she's the fame whore.

She's a little fluted, she loves hang oh my god. So it's also like we got lucky with this one, like cutie zebra who likes attention, which is rare, I guess. And then the giraffes was five girl giraffes and they were like eating off one bush and I was like, it is it's just so cute.

Are they gossiping?

You know?

But it's just too much human emotion. Whatever.

There's like a new giraffe at the La Zoo and they're gonna they haven't named it yet. It's like two or three months old and they still haven't named it, and I was like, oh, they have to like wait till some like rich Donor pays the most amount of money to name it. But apparently there is like a name contest happening and they're figuring out what the name

That is cube.

Well, So I went to Shane Tours and I go, guess what, I went to the zoo, you know, and he goes, I was at a zoo too, and I pet a rhinoceros and I.

Go, are you fucking kidding me?

Rhyo?

Yeah, he was. I forgot what state he was in. So I was like, I can't. I guess that's like a cool thing comics can do when they're in town, like add it to the list of things that we can do. Well.

Yeah, I mean, because.

Like you guys are posting and getting people, getting the zoo in people's brains and stuff. It's good like marketing. Let a couple comics pet your zebra and then they'll post about it.

Yeah, being with like famous people that get special privileges is fun.

Yeah, it was thrilling.

But also so at the show, someone heckled, did I tell you this? No, So someone was heckling, going, I work at the you know, yelling about the zoo.

And then the next day we go to the zoo.

We're talking to one of the trainers or and I don't know if they're called trainers, one of the workers, and she then shyly goes my sister in law screamed, yesterday, I'm so embarrassed, And it was oh so it.

Was her going, my sister works at this, Oh my god.

Yeah yeah yeah, so people are well, I'm glad she got I'm glad she got to sort of like share her apology with you.

So that you were like these fucking wild and out zoo keepers.

Well, no, it's all really thrilling.

I I don't know.

I'm trying to think if like I have a like my sixteenth birthday, I got, you know, membership to the aquarium. I went to the aquarium in Lincoln Park Zoo all the time. I didn't realize it was rare. But I like art museums. I guess I just like things. I guess when you're traveling alone, you need other things. Enter ta Yeah, yeah, that's for sure. On art, an animal, a movie, you need something. I wonder what Taylor day for New Year's Oh yeah, baseball game. I wonder it was like things.

Oh my god, this is like becoming a Taylor Swift podcast. What do you think?

But one of the time things was a fun article.

She goes, Yeah, people think the first date was me going to his game, Like that would be psychotic to hard launch on a first date.

And I was like, yeah, Taylor, you're like normal and when whatever.

Well to also be right next to his mom on a first day like that would be that's crazy.

Like no, she said.

They started talking immediately after the podcast in July.

Yeah, and I'm sure, like yesh, like they had him like slipped in under the cover of night to some her house or wherever she wanted to.

I like her being more free, I like her being out and about.

I like enjoy it more well, because the last guy she dated didn't like the attention, right, So now this guy's like, let's get out there.

Let's fucking go.

This is so, this is so dated. I bet they're like married already or something, and it's wow, what if.

Oh my god, Well, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm just gonna say it right now. If they somehow get engaged like this holiday, we're gonna have to do some kind of emergency episode on our cell phones or something. There's just like no way that you're gonna have like keep this in the time machine and all that shit.

Like, there's no way.

I do get super obsessed about things. I think the tailor might be a permanent fixture.

You don't know.

I apologize, I'm sorry, I'm a broken record. I'll try to get a new personality soon. It's a new year, new year, knew me, new year, knew me, So.

New year new So with that, I'd say happy New Year everyone. I hope you're giving yourself kind achievable resolutions, let's not get too crazy, and that you're ready to start twenty twenty four off right. I mean, I am terrified for this year because of the presidential election, but I'm trying to put a good spin on it and say that we're going to have the best year ever. It's going to be the year that Trump lost a second time.

So I can't believe it's I can't believe you're bringing this up on January.

I know, I'm so sorry. I'm so Sorryry.

I truly wasn't mentally at all. I am still in the days of full I know.

I can't believe, you know, but we have to stay we have to stay woke. We have to stay on this. We have to postcard, we have to do everything we can. This cannot happen. But listen, we are starting in our episode. We've got a good one for you guys.

Today.

There was something going on with my recording equipment or something on this day where my recording sounded weird. So they're using a recording from my zoom and it's going to sound a little bit different. Just in case you're like, why does Karra sound weird. You don't have to send us the DM we're telling you now. Okay, So now let's get to this week's episode. Okay, we are finally getting around to doing an episode from the most recent season,

The most powerful lifeguard in New York.

So we open on an indoor pool. A girl is swimming through that water. Lisa, you could probably comment on her stroke and her speed, because I'm not a big swimmer.

She seems like she's going fast. To me, I don't remember the stroke. I'm sorry you really put me on this spot.

And no, you're just like a swim team gal.

But like, yeah, no, the pool looks great. I could smell the chlorine in my room, like you know, I was. I was brought back there, but I could. I did not judge her stroke, unfortunately, Well, you already disappoint the masses.

Were you a lifeguard?

No, that's too much work. I was a slide attendant and so I would.

Grab people in an inner tube and like throw them down the slide or in the tube slide. I'd be like next, and then I taught swim lessons and you got paid more. So these like lifeguards are lifeguards in the Skokie Park District take it very seriously and they do like lifeguard games every summer and they have this like ten second head thing. Like Skokie Park District is very I've always been very impressed with their lifeguards.

But they got paid worse than me.

Like I taught swim lessons and I got paid double than what lifeguards got paid. Damn and so and they it's really hard work and training and stuff like Skochy pride itself from great lifeguarding.

No, it's crazy. I mean I was a lifeguard for years.

I became a certified lifeguard when I was fifteen at my summer camp and like it was hard, like I thought it was going to fail, Like they were like having to give me extra not because for us, it wasn't about like the swimming fast really thing.

We weren't getting timed and stuff like that.

It was like getting a spinal injury onto the board and getting it out of the lake. I mean, to train to be a lifeguard in a lake is pretty terrifying because you can't see the bottom at all. So they would basically just randomly once a summer blow a fog horn and we would everyone that was lifeguard had to run down to the waterfront, stripping their clothes off, form a line and jump into the water and start

I don't even fucking.

Know, but like, oh, I was raised on Baywatch, and I think a lot of America so they agree with you.

We love a nation lifeguard.

Like I mean, to me, that's like you're not letting some fifteen year old girl who's like kind of got the spinal down and maybe isn't doing the right taps of her CPR at the right like rhythm, you know, Like I.

But I but I've also been to a hotel pool where the lifeguard's really slouchy and has a cell phone, you know what I mean, and the signs are like we don't really care.

Yeah, but well.

You've been to my pool with me that I go to where famously there are no lifeguards and the children are just running a book. So I but, like, I remember, it's cool that you even got paid, like they keep talking about in this episode of Luke rid Of it is.

For me, it was like a badge of honor.

Like people just it was cool to get your lifeguarding and then you did not really get paid more like maybe when we got old, you got paid one hundred more a summer for being a lifeguard.

Well, camp's different.

But also these are young, like as these are teens, and these are early twenty somethings, So for them, like as a teen, if you're I mean, we'll see this is like updated. But if you're getting like mon, you know, if you're not working at a dairy queen, it's like cool, Yeah, you're lifeguard. You're in the sun bathing suit, You're assuming everyone's in great shape, hanging out like it's exciting, Like for a youth, what's more cool than being a tanned,

Salts and you can't see anything.

Yeah, and I got recertified. I would get recertified at home, like in a pool. And I was like, this seems a lot easier because we would have to get a spinal board out of a lake, like up onto the dock. It was like it was it was a lifeguarding was like traumatic for me. But back to the episode, I'm just saying, I know where these people are coming from. They're trying to qualify to be lifeguards. This girl gets to the end of the of the lap and this guy is coaching her.

He seems happy with her performance. She gets out.

He hands her a towel and goes cover yourself up, like he's shirtless, but he's like, okay, here, cover yourself up. So an older guy goes nice swimsuit. It's literally just a plane one piece, but she does have a very hot bod, so this already feels like it's heading in an SVU direction. And he asks her name, and it's Martina Rodriguez. She's the little sister of the guy who was telling her to cover up.

His name is Diego.

The older man makes a comment about Diego bolting bulking up, and he goes, yeah, I'm taking jiu jitsu, and then the older guy turns the combo back to the cysts and he's like, yeah, I haven't seen your times yet, but you look like a real fish in that pool. So you're already getting like lecherous vibes, like why are you talking like that, and like, I don't know, it's creepy.

Upset, and her brother's like, what were you doing in there?

And she goes Greco wanted to go over my scores, and then Diego sees Greco come out onto the pool deck immediately rushes him, knocks him down, starts punching at him, and he's like, if I see you near her again, I'll kill you, bro.

So that's dramatic because she didn't. She had like tears in her eyes.

Which I don't know because he said he was gonna help her, so I don't really know why she's crying. But at their house over dinner, Diego is pounding beers and his sister is like, what is your deal, bro, She's like, nothing happened, Like he was just trying to help me pass and now he probably won't after you attacked his ass. And then the mom gets home and she's like pissed that he's drinking. They argue, he walks out.

It's like okay.

Finn's like, you guys don't live together yet, and she goes, he has a drawer, and keep in mind, they get married four episodes from now. He has a drawer in this episode and they are not living together. So but you know he's Catholic. So Finn says it seems like a waste of gas, and then he gives Rolins a little gift and it's like, I can't tell if it's just a charm, if it's like a little key chain, but it's a bullet, and Rollins is like a bullet and he's like, it's the same caliber of the one

Leave us for you.

So anyway, Finn's like, you got to own your trauma or your trauma will own you. And it's like put it on a decorative piece of driftwood. Baby, He's so good, he's so quotable. Live shows up and it's like, hey, we got a call from the one one. You guys want to take it. And then Finn tells Rolins like you had out, I'll get it, and Rollins is like, nah, I'm in, but I'm driving.

I guess.

She's like, I'd rather solve crimes than go eat my feelings and watch like a UFC fight, which is probably what she's doing. The UNI when they get there, explains that they picked up Diego drunk and starting fights, saying something about a run in with his sister, and it's like, you guys called sbu based on that, like what happened?

Like what did he say that make you like have to call his view? It seems like a weak connection. But fine, Diego's in a holding cell. He's wasted.

He's saying, how his when his dad was dying, he promised he'd take care of his sister and protect her, and they're like protector from who? And he's like Paul Greco, the head of the lifeguards. And Finn's like, so, did he rape your sister? And he goes, no, he raped me. Twist credits. Oh y'all wanted a twist there. It is so at the precinct, Rollin's and Finn tell Diego that his arrest was voided. That's powerful of them. They got him food. I guess he was just dry. It was

Everybody blows into Spu, going where's my wife? Where's my brother?

Like there again, no receptionist, no one's doing crowd control, and he's yelling, I told you not to come here, and he's like, just tell her. I'm all right, everything's good, and so Rollins goes to take care of Martina and Finn's trying to have a one on one with Diego, like about what's happening. He's still denying it, but then he's like he opens up to Finn because how could you not? And he's like, I heard lifeguards make a ton I needed money for college.

I apply.

Greco brings me to his office, says I don't qualify. Meanwhile, we're talking to the sister and Rollins. She's like, I left his office in tears because I didn't qualify, and then my brother went into roid rage and she doesn't even get why her brother is there.

Back to Diego he goes. One day.

Greco tells me that he only gave me the job because of my and he doesn't finish. But Finn's like, knows what he's talking about, and he's like, that's before I learned how to fight. That's clearly like why he's taking jiu jitsu. And he says Greco forced him on the desk, faced down, and he quote did it to me, is what he says. So after that he cleaned up. He got all the posts and overtime that he wanted

So Velasco is the new cast member who's.

In the picture at the beginning during the credits, and he's kind of like a I think he's like Danny Zuko, kind of like a modern like John Travolta from Greece.

And then Munsey is this.

Boy got shot tomboy name who's like, she's still a special guest star. She she doesn't ever make it to full time regular spoiler alert, she doesn't. She leaves at the end of the season. This is who they were trying to replace Rollins with and it didn't work because they just thought they could replace one hottie with another. But I think that Kelly Giddish does a lot more than Dick Wolf gives her credit for.

So or maybe I also wish that cat to Mean and what was the name Barnes had another season, Like, I think kicking them out so quick was a mistake, huge, especially just like a random tomboy. I just it was uncomfortable both of them. It's uncomfortable to watch their like accent work. It's really uncomfortable. I don't believe it. Yeah, yeah, I don't believe it. They're cops, Like she's.

A cap cat.

You want to go check it out, Like yeah, it's like they're they both have Like she's.

Wearing like a platform sneaker too, like she's just crub.

I don't know.

Well, there is a part of the season, and I don't know if it's before this episode or after this episode where live goes go get some other clothes, like you dress like a ragamuffin, like you need to be in like a smart blazer and slacks like I've been since nineteen ninety nine. So anyway, months he's there, She's like I looked into it. Everybody says Greco's friendly smart single has a rap as a player, but nothing about

Most powerful lifeguard in New.

York, right, So Live's like, okay, let's go right to him and see if he blinks.

This is the strategy.

At the pool, Live and Finn are talking to Greco and he's like incredulous about Diego's accusation and they're like.

So you didn't do it, and he's like, of course not.

He didn't report the physical assault from the day before, because he's like, I like the kid last year, he was all sweet. This year he's all jacked up and wants to start fights. I wouldn't be surprised if he's on steroids or something. Finn's like, those muscles are armor, and Greco's like, Alma, for what end? The Finn goes, you tell me, So he tells them nothing happened with Martina, And you can ask my second in command, Ronnie Volpi.

So now we're at the beach.

Munsey and Velasco are talking to Ronnie and he's saying he had to pull Diego off Greco at this fight and that something's happened since last year because Diego is like a different person. And he says, but nothing happened with the little sister. And he goes, so, what happened when he showed up for work today? And he goes, well, he looked like shit, and he's I could smell the booze on him. So he's out there swimming laps between the buoys and he says, it's Pinsky's rules anytime someone

Like, are you going to go in there and do something?

You're a lifeguard and the guy goes give it a minute, and that's not something I don't think a lifeguard should really say.

So Velasco takes let's.

Just see how it pans out. Let's just see this.

Could go a couple of ways.

Uh, so Velasco takes off his leather and his shoes and starts booking it into the water in full denim.

This did remind me.

I did delete TikTok off my phone, but for a while I was getting shown it was like people trying to take photos near the ocean where they shouldn't, and then the water kind of like snatching them, or like someone jumping in thinking they're gonna have fun, and then all of a sudden they're in like a current in the rocks, and I'm like, why is my phone showing me horrors that I didn't think of yet, you know, But it's just like people trying to take cool photos

Yeah.

Well, because I also started sending there's like a boat that goes from Argentina to Antarctica, and I started sending it to our friend Julia, and she goes That's when I knew you really hit TikTok because everyone's been talking about Antarctica for about a year and I had just and I had just gotten a part of the boa. I'm like, should we do this when we're older? And songins? But the boat is crazy, Like I've told you about this.

But then you do see the penguins. I don't think it.

I don't think what if you just take drama means xanax and pass out for two days? Yeah maybe yeah, drug me up and then you wake up just with a penguin.

Yeah, could happen.

Sure, I'm sorry I interrupted with that, but it's just it seems like probably a.

Lot of money for a cold vacation, you know. I like to pour my money into hot vacations. So I don't know, but let's.

Stand much about it.

It's more of an adventure than a vacation.

Sure, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely a life experience.

It's something I would do in my fifties.

I'm sure that's what I mean, Like, yeah, I don't need to do it, like first, I'd like to go to the sey Shells.

You know, I have other purls, the.

Say shells, Bali something. What's the other one?

Where's the one where I owe them mal Daves the Maldives.

Yep, that's what I was thinking of. You got it.

So the other lifeguard, Frankie, starts running into the water with his baywatch booye to help, and fucking Pinsky's still standing there doing absolutely nothing. People are like yelling, Diego, Diego, Diego.

He's like, I.

Observed a rip current and I feared for my life and safety, and then Velasko gives him a dirty look.

So now we're at the precinct. Finn gets the call.

Diego did not make it, so this is tragic, and Finn and Live and Rollins all agreed that Diego was being taught a lesson and it wasn't about being hungover. Finn thinks that means that the allegation is credible, but how can we make it stick now that, like our only witness is dead, And they're like, well, there's no way that this guy's only struck once. He's a predator. He's been in this job for ten years. We got

Sad I didn't want him to die.

I know, I know.

I thought they could at least like have him in a coma for most of the episode and then he wakes up at the end.

I don't know, but you know, we have.

To have steaks, so they wouldn't have kept looking into it if this hadn't happened. So at the Rodriguez house, the mom is like tearfully telling Finn and Rollins how much Diego loved swimming that had healed him after his father died. Martina tells her mom go lie down so she can talk to the cops, and she tells Finn and Rollins, I drove Diego to work this morning, and he confessed the whole assault to me, but he didn't

And Danielle was like, I thought Greco was just into girls.

So this guy's a bisexual offender and that's probably what's making him harder to catch.

I guess, I don't know.

She explains how Diego pulled strings and got her an interview. When she got laid off, he had to qualify her privately, took her into the office and pinned her down. She's like, I had no business being a lifeguard anyway. I can barely swim. I don't even know why you show up and try to qualify. But she says she reported it to the precinct and the Bronx and they're like did you do a rape kid?

She goes, yeah, but they never called me back.

And so at the pool, Greko is caressing the flip flopped foot of what looks like a fifteen year old girl as Live and Finn show up, and Finn goes pools clothes and Live arrests Greco for Danielle's rape.

He has no idea who that even is, and Live goes, well, she knows you.

So then we open up with Greco in court, still in his little lifeguarding jacket, which has to be kind of embarrassing to stand in court with your lawyer just like wearing a little zip up lifeguard jacket and his lawyer. I had to do like a double take because his lawyer is named Sandy Braun and he's played by Jason Kravitz, and he's giving me Michael Kostroff vibes, and then I

This character also defended the kid in the.

Ballad of Dwighton Arena, the guy who kills his mom's abuse boyfriend by like putting a hair dryer in the tub or something. It's the Ricky Lindholme episode, so he's been in an episode before. Caresy requests seventy five thousand dollars bail as this man has the means to flee, and Sandy argues he's a respected civil servant with no record. The judge goes for it and grants roar Cariesy and Benson are doing what I'm calling a chit chat and chill.

It's like one of these ones. They just want to get it kind of wrapped up.

They get interrupted mid convo by Assemblywoman Diane Garcia. She wants to put in a good word for Greco. This is how powerful this lifeguard is he's got politicians on his side.

He's a good guy.

And she says, so, there's definitely no way he's a sexual predator. That's just how the real world works, you know, and she goes, I just think you should think about it before you ruin a respected city officials reputation and put the city in danger of civil litigation. And then she just kind of like stalks off, and it's like, on this show alone, there have been so many civil servants arrested, like nobody is innocent because of government.

By this point, there was a whole sex ring of judges and legislators that were carried on the courtroom steps like what.

Yeah, Like remember Paget Brewster, she was fully involved in a section, Yeah, in a prostitution ring. So anyway, Coreesi explains that this woman who's just gone to bat for the lifeguard oversees judge appointments, bail reform, court procedure, and the DA's budget, so she's important. And then they go, how much you want to bet Greco's a campaign contributor.

He's a lifeguard. I don't understand how important he can be. How much can he be contributing to a political camp.

That's where you lost me, like most powerful lifeguard.

I was there.

I was there. And then it's like he's a major donor what.

Like, and they keep talking about his political clout throughout the episode, and I'm like, as a lifeguard, I mean, I know he's the head lifeguard, but it's it's it's wild. So liv says Danielle's rape kit came back and boom, it's a match.

And guess what.

The Bronx sview has not been helpful. They don't do anything by the book, especially their SVU. At this point, I don't even know if we've met Kevin Kaine's character yet because he's Bronx SPU. But maybe they're maybe they're teasing it, like how they're going to start interacting more because I know in past episodes, I believe Annabella Siora, the actress, is the head of the Bronx SVU.

But and they you know, butt heads or whatever.

But it's wild because I guess his DNA wouldn't be in the system as a civil servant, just his fingerprints. So yeah, I was wondering why they wouldn't have matched the rape kit, but it wouldn't have been DNA so ran.

They probably didn't want to. There's been tons of more shady shit with the Bronx there, you know.

Yeah, because also she would have given his name. She knows who he is. It wasn't like it was a random stranger attack.

Because there was that case where there's all these underwear on clothing lines, like that's the gang, that's the gang. And then it was wasn't it the DNA stuff like going into rate victims. DNA wasn't out the Bronx with orphae with orphe is she bronx or is she Queen's I think she's queens?

Yeah, but you know, everybody besides Manhattan SVU has gone bottom line. So at the grand jury hearing, it's five minutes till it starts, and uh oh, the classic SVU trope.

The witness is nowhere to be found. Daniella has not shown up.

Rollins calls it, calls her phone, it goes right to a beep, no voicemail.

You don't see that a lot. But she she goes, I'll send Muncy and Malasko over to check on her. At Danielle's apartment.

She's like, sorry, I didn't tell anyone, but I'm out, I can't testify my father's on parole. Greco must have gotten to his po because he threatened to have my father violated, Like I don't think that means violated, like attacked.

I think it means like that have him like framed for violating his parole.

And it's like this guy has ends with parole officers, he's a lifeguard.

I don't get it.

We can all, we can get this all strained out, they tell her, and she's like, look, I can't risk my dad going back to Rikers like sorry, no go, and Belasco goes for the heart strings about Diego dying in his arms, and she's like, I hate Greco, but Diego's dead. Nothing will bring him back. I have to

Greco's like, what are you talking about.

They're like, you want us to open a witness tampering case because we're also looking into Diego's death and Greco stops his lawyer from talking and goes, I am devastated by Diego's death. Any drowning is a tragedy, but a lifeguard that's a supervisor's worst nightmare.

And Benson's like. Benson's like, but a nineteen year old is.

Dead because of your sorry ass, and he denies giving that order, and Greco says, I'm not the monster you think I am. I've devoted my career to saving lives, not destroying them, and Live goes men like you become so good at lying, even start believing the ones they tell themselves. And then there's a stare down between a captain of a police squad and a head lifeguard and he walks off and lives like, we cannot let this guy back on the job. But now the rape cases out,

That he's fucked to.

So now we're in interrogation and it's cement bars, so they're not fucking around with these lifeguards. They're laying out photos of the drowning victims and Frankie is like manslaughter, like he's panicking. He's like, I tried to help Diego, Like he thinks he's in there because they're going to charge you for manslaughter for not rescuing Diego. But Velasko and Finn are like no, no, no, no no. This is about the lifeguards and Greco fixing their scores, Like what

Sting, which we love.

So when we come back from commercial Careese's questioning a witness named Anna Kallis. She's an investigator for the New York Department of Health. They investigate drownings at public beaches. She identified the ten victims whose photos are being shown to the courtroom as victims who have drowned during Greco's tenure. With a lifeguard attempt. All the lifeguards were qualified and

Would or wouldn't happen with a different lifeguard.

But I kind of I can't believe they're not objecting another case where the guard was on his phone, which slowed the rescue. He said, again would not have occurred with a qualify lifeguard as if all, no qualified lifeguard has ever looked at their phone to check a text. Another case where the lifeguard.

You know, if you were a good lifeguard, you would not be checking your phone.

No, you wouldn't.

But it's just it's like to act like this is all part of a conspiracy, like these are teens in early twenties, Like I do think it's possible for there to be like human errors.

You know, I think this guy's a piece of shit. Don't get me wrong.

This lineup questioning is just as a lawyer myself, having graduated from SVU, I would be objecting. So there was another case where the lifeguard headed into the water and then turned around. And then they get the camera on Pinsky, who basically did that to Diego. And he's in the gallery and his face looks nervous, he looks a little puky. And now Frankie Volpi is on the stand. This is Greko's like right hand guy. He's on the stand talking about how he records the times. But he came to

You were offered a deal in exchange for your testimony?

Which they always love to point out that people are possibly, you know, giving false testimony for a deal. So cuts a late night at Carisie's office, and you know, Amanda SLINKs in like, hey, babe, a, you gonna be working late, and she's like, you know, I saw tears with the jury, so I think you are getting to them. Like, so you're doing great, and he's like, you slept like a baby last night, first time in a while that you

I love that.

And he tells her he's going to be late because Greco's on the stand tomorrow. They have a little smooch and she's like, you got this back in court. Greco's on the stand saying his job takes discipline and integrity, Like how how do you even put this man on the stand after the phone call we just heard him talking about like fucking people for assaulting people for you know,

It's also funny to say this Sacarsi who was an officer, so he knows about it pretty well.

We've seen it one handed pull up and get himself up and save girls that were being trafficked.

Okay, he's helped save lives.

So he goes, so did you send Diego into the water because he lacked common sense? And he goes, Diego was a drunk who showed up, showed up hungover, and Creasy's like really laying into him, so you gave the order for him to swim laps in a riptide and his lawyer tries to object, but Greco goes, you're damn right, I gave that order, and you cannot tell me that the fucking showrunner of the show does not have a

Did you get order? Did you order the code blue? It's the same fucking thing.

Everyone in the courtroom is stunned that Greco's just admitted to this, and Greco says, I didn't know. He goes, yeah, I gave the order, but I didn't know there'd be a rip anymore.

That I wanted that kid dead.

So like, he admits that he was making the kid like kind of get punished, but not that he wanted him dead. And he's like, that beach and all the lives on it are my responsibility, all mine, my ass on the line.

I'm the boss. I'm the boss at all my lifeguards.

No way.

He's such a little boy, this man.

So yeah, if you are taking responsibility, then you're guilty.

Okay, yeah, yeah, great, and that's it, great, done and dusted.

Yeah.

So at this point we see Pinske, the little douche guy get up and leave the courtroom, which is kind of a big move, Like the courtroom is quiet and silent, and he's like up and leaving. So then Live tells Velasco figure out what's going on with Pinske. So Velasco approaches him and he's like, my lawyer says, I shouldn't talk to you, and I will not be following his advice.

It's like he.

Immediately starts talking.

Velasco asks why he's been showing up to court, and he goes to show support for Greco. He made it clear we all needed to show up and he didn't. But I don't see the other lifeguards, Like there's like a girl lifeguard on that board. I don't see her in the gallery. But maybe they just couldn't pay for the extra that day. So he didn't know Diego was going to go under. He was a strong swimmer. He goes, are you He goes, I'm all right, but that's not why I didn't go in and Greg he goes, Greco

We know what he did to other guys.

And so he's like, okay, he's got pictures of me and him and a couple of other guys doing stuff quote unquote, he goes, and I didn't do what he said. He was going to show them to everyone. He's right what he said in there. He's the boss. He's got all the power because you know, he is.

The most powerful lifeguard in New York. That might be the last time I s get to say it. But so then the Lasco goes, so take it back. Okay.

So now in a private conference room combo, it's Greco, his lawyer, and Careesy and Greco's like that Pinsky Punk is lying, and his lawyer is like trying to cool things down. But Greco's like, what am I paying you for? And Sandy's like to tell you when to shut the fuck up because you had lost and Greco is cocky as hell, and he's like, the jury's ever gonna convict if they do, I'll appeal because like that is the

And so Cariese's like, dude, it's over.

The political clout you bought has run out with your massive political donations. Pinsky has the photos you used to blackmail him, Like yeah, I mean if you knew that the photos are out there, why are you so confident? And Cariese's like, I'm giving you the chance to serve time without everyone knowing the truth about you, and he goes, oh yeah, what's that? And he goes that you're a manipulative little big man. I don't really get that insult.

And yeah, he was really fucked. He had nowhere to go.

Finn points out that consecutive sentences would put him in jail till he's seventy.

So then Live tells Alaska on Muncie.

Good job, guys, and they're like, we're gonna go tell Martina, and then Velasco mentions there's a memorial on the beach for Diego, and Lives like, well, I will not be attending, but please send my condolences and then lives like Velasco. You lost someone and it's easy to take that personally, so you feel sorry, but not for yourself. You did everything right. And then he thanks her and she's like I need it, and then you know, she gives her signature sort of like terse stare as they walk out

And powerful, the concierge.

Yeah, yeah, I mean this is a hokey, silly thing, you know, lifeguards, but it is based on real crimes.

It is Yeah, it is.

Here we are and I cannot wait to hear you talk about it. So listen to our messages and we'll be right back.

This episode is based on two crimes. One is based in the Chicago Park District. It's a sex abuse scandal in the early two thousands in Chicago at Lakes that I have been to at beach as I was there, so apparently I had no clue.

You know, I'm more of a skoche girl.

But the aquatics department in Chicago had a misogynistic, toxic, and abusive culture that has pervaded them for decades. But unbeknownst to the young victims that just wanted to be lifeguards, you know, just young fun teens that wanted to be tan and cool. Like as a kid, I looked at the lifeguards as cool when I went to the beach, like I it's Baywatch. I mean, babe, Baywatch yeeah.

Like babe, I mean Nicole Eggert from Charles in Charge, so gorgeous, Pamela Anderson Yasmin Bleef, Carmen Electra. I mean it was like every Maxim babe was on that fucking show.

And the men were hot. The men were hot too, I mean, who were the men?

Yeah?

Who?

I think it's like a lot of now Republicans.

But go on, yeah, so young women, you know, like on the show, it's the first jobs are coming in. They want to make friends, experienced camaraderie, get nice paychecks, you get to work in the sun, sand water. But instead they were truly preyed upon their males by their male supervisors, with impunity in a workplace that was rooted in a culture of sexual harassment and physical abuse. Sexual harassment was the norm during this time. It was daily

And that's a direct quote from Wbez.

And she said a male lifeguard slammed her into the wall of a guardroom and called her misogynistic slurs while he was high as hell. There was like a hazing situation where this woman refused to drink vodka and that led to a lifeguard grabbing her and trying to force a bottle of vodka down her throat. Throughout the summer, she said her coworkers called her slurs that became her

Yeah, that's tough, and I'd love to see someone have to get little dick you know, I'd like to see someone accept that award.

That's fun.

We would definitely be the women that allowed the abuse of the lifeguard group. We'd be like whatever, relaxed. Bitch of the Beach is funny. But Kelly waited nearly six weeks before four this, so this is where it all comes. So then Michael Kelly gets this message early twenty twenty and he tells this girl, I'm going to report this immediately to the Inspector General.

He does not.

He waits over six weeks and to send the letter to the park districts like internal watchdog.

Now, if we're talking money, and.

You know, in the episode, we were like, how is he affording anything?

This guy?

But he's head of the park district.

But he was making two hundred and thirty thousand a year, and a lot of these guys were making between ninety and one hundred something thousand, like one twenty.

I don't think you're making.

Any meaningful contributions to a political campaign with that kind of salary.

But yeah, it's not nothing.

It's not nothing, not in early two thousands. That's in Chicago. I mean, that's a nice living. I never paid more than four hundred dollars in rent when I lived in chip but I lived in rooms with people. But anyways, so he said no, he denies being relaxed. He's like, I always treated this with the utmost seriousness, but that's not true. And this investigation dragged for seventeen months. So like when the woman first wrote to him, she was seventeen,

Yeah, when she no.

So, so he got the email February seventh, twenty twenty. He did not send it till March nineteenth, twenty twenty. And that only happened because a second female ex lifeguard sent a complaint of sexual misconduct to Mayor Lori Lightfoot's office so I mean.

Kelly legit.

Instead of sending it to the Inspector General like he said he would, he sent it to just like the managers within, and he's like, I think it's totally normal to poke around first before it, like taking it outside the department, Like he just thinks it's not a normal or like to tell your bosses first.

But also like bulshit, when he finally sent it, is it coincidence that that's.

Like literally when COVID hit, like March nineteenth, twenty twenty, is like right when COVID is like shutting everything down, so he's like, maybe this will just get buried. Damn, you know, just a thought.

Damn.

So then Spector General for the park District at the time is Elaine Little, and nobody seemed to be on the same page. So like then Spector General office said that they didn't have the resources it took to take on such a big case, and then Kelly and Lightfoot said, no, we do. But then nobody is doing anything, so like they just weren't able to get on the same page. Everyone had an excuse of like why they weren't doing more. So the letter to Mayor Lightfoot stated that she was sexually.

But then also Carmen Christopher.

Has a funny joke that like on January sixth or like, some sort of tragedy happened and everyone was right or someone had just died, like something happened and everyone was tweeting about the tragedy, and she tweeted Chicago's the Home of House Music, and.

I just like just laugh about it. But she got made fun of a lot.

Okay, So.

It is the meme just like her making that serious face like this, yeah, but in all different places.

Yeah.

So the letter to Lightfoot stated that she was sexually assaulted by an employee with a more senior position than her, and then learned there was a huge number of such incidences after she told three coworkers about the attack and about the manager's mocking her when she tried to speak up. So this letter writer asked her coworkers if they filed reports, and they did and nothing was done about it. By the end, there were a dozen complaints by workers at

The evidence showed that there were.

At least three male lifeguards that got in trouble for sexual assault, harassment, and retaliatory threats against their subordinates, including one incident involving the sexual assault and attempted rape of a sixteen year old girl. In another instance, investigators found an aquatics department employee sexually harassed two junior female lifeguards and later sexually attacked each of them in public swimming pool locker rooms twenty sixteen in Portage Park at one

Ugh, so he got fire.

So he was put on the no hireless for the school districts. But I guess that doesn't make it to the park district. Computers make it make sense. Yeah, So one woman was sexually abused by her boss at a house party and then had to work with him as her supervisor for two more years. And then so three female women said that they didn't report because he said what.

Well, three female women as a face.

So these ladies did not report because he said the supervisors would take his side, and that one said he didn't trust the supervisor because she thought he would tell the lifeguard about the complaints and then there would be more issues to deal with. So then another lifeguard, she worked with the park district for seven years with assignments at North Avenue Beach, Foster Beach, and Wheels Park.

I don't know if that's the thing. And Portage Park.

North Avenue Beach we were at together when we did Zany's that long time in the summer, so that's like where we were. Foster Beach I used to go. They used to have moon ceremonies like full moon dances that I had been to So this lifeguard worked there for seven years, and he was found that he locked a girl in his car, forced her to perform a sex act on her, and then attempted to rape her and then threatened her, knowing that she was sixteen and he

Her to a tree, Oh my god, near the.

Lake shore against her will, and then tickled her while she was confined.

I hate that.

Yeah, there are.

So many Tickling is so fucked up.

It's so fucked up.

And you've obviously seen the documentary about the forced tickling that.

I haven't thought I've heard, but you haven't. Wait what's it called again?

It's probably called tickled, right, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, it's called tickled.

Yeah, you're right.

It's about mysterious tickling competitions. But then he digs deeper and deeper and then it ends up being like this dude who forces not force it, Like he has all this footage of these ticklings, but he's like a rich guy that owns everything.

It's like wild.

It's this tickle monster who's like really into pain, who is into what happened to him.

He's a culture for he's just a rich guy that could sue.

We have to rewatch it whatever, But there's this tickling subculture and then evil people that are involved in it.

If you want to.

Watch it, it's from twenty sixteen called Tickled, and it's weird. You haven't watched it, and I think you should. Yeah I should, because it all it's like it goes to the courts and this guy, it's just this powerful tickling maniac.

Yeah.

I'm like really really sensitive about like when I'm tickling my kids, if they say stop, I stop like right away, because I just like to be tickled.

When you don't want it anymore. Is like I hate that. Yeah, and you could die I think from the stress.

Oh really, go ahead.

Well, someone was just telling me a story of like this dude accidentally got stuck at his job in like a sub zero freezer and he when he was found, he like dug so much that is like like into the ice and stuff and snow that it was all these marks trying to get out.

But he just died from the stress.

And actually the freezer was unplugged and he would have been fine and the temperature was warming up, but because he was so stressed trying to get out, he died of like oh my god, something else not, like he tricked his body into thinking he had hypothermia but he didn't.

Type of thing.

Wow, And that's how I think about with tickling, Like if someone says stop, you just have to. I always remember this, Like fucking girl from my school had a little snake and I don't like snakes, and she like chased me around with the snake and would not stop, and it's just like, go fuck yourself. But she had a rough upbringing. So anyways, there's a lot of pools

It's just like a lot. It was huge.

You know, I've told jummy beaches and pools there were, but you know, I'm trying to keep it as straight as possible. So one lifeguard declined to talk to the Inspector General's office because he had already resigned from the park district and so since he didn't work there, he didn't have to be included in the investigation. But it's like, then call the cops, excuse me, so you quit a job and so they don't have to investigate you.

It makes no sense to me.

So yeah, he resigned, and he resigned because he was already under investigation and suspicion. And this is according to a report in the case like to WBZ, and he is on the do not rehire list, which we've seen earlier. Does not really work.

Yeah.

So April twenty twenty one.

WBZ reported that despite the inspector finding that illegal or criminal sexual misconduct likely took place repeatedly, neither the park district nor its inspector General would reply when asked if they had referred any of the incidents to law enforcement. So they had evidence but refused to get law enforcement involved, and a spokeswoman for the mayor at the time also declined to comment to WBZ and referred all questions about the investigation to the park district. So no one really

Oh he's poor girls.

Yeah, he would pick up girls from high school and help them study and do act prep and stuff like.

He is a creed.

But he pled guilty, which is awesome because it's also better to get money. It's easier to get money when people plead guilty in civil cases, and that the girls didn't have to testify. He legit in court in quotes, he said, full responsibility for my actions, and that's according to the Chicago Sun Times, he apologized to his victims in court and said he had nobody to blame but himself. I mean, the bar is set so low. I'm like, okay, I'm like admitting. I'm like, oh, okay.

At least he's taking accountability.

I mean.

He was sentenced to three years of probation, forty hours of community service, electronic monitoring, and a lifetime sex offender registry. Hector Cause is twenty five and is another lifeguard who was charged with felony criminal sexual assault and aggravated criminal sexual abuse for assaulting a seventeen year old in a locker room in Jefferson Park in twenty eighteen. And I think he's the one that like left and refused to

Her in all of our private areas.

And prosecutors also said that he penetrated the girl with his fingers twice even though she kept telling him to stop. So according to the Cook County Lockup, he was booked on May fifth, twenty twenty two, and had a court date December seventh, twenty twenty three for bond information. So hopefully by the end of this episode we will have an update on how his court date went and if he's still going to be in jail or not.

But that is interesting.

So the Chicago Park District ended up paying out more than one point nine million dollars in legal settlements to three lifeguards.

The Sun Times.

Wrote, who allegedly that these lifeguards are who allegedly suffered from sexual misconduct and hazing but it's not alleged. They wouldn't pay one point nine million dollars if it was alleged. The Sun Times thank you very much. So the park district said, three claims in nine months and guess what the settlements were expended by taxpayer funded agency.

Yeah.

I mean, this is like one of my biggest beliefs that I think. I think if cops embark all these people, they need to pay out their own like things. It's like so fucked up that our money goes to pay for crooked employees. It's insane, Yeah, because I think they would behave a little better if they actually had to pay out of their pockets and pensions. All the settlements include a clause prohibiting the former lifeguards from disparaging the

But whatever.

Michael Kelly resigned after twenty seven years working in the park district in October twenty twenty one. Avis Lavelle, Yeah, Avis Lavelle was the president of the park's board. She also resigned, But she's a dumb bitch anyways, she worked for Mayor Daily and worked at the private parking company that Mayor Daily sold all Chicago public parking too, that his cousin owned and gave him one hundred year deal. So this motherfucker on his way out from becoming mayor

Like truly came oversight for that. How is there not? Like you can't do that? Like I don't.

It's so crazy, motherfucker. And obviously he owns like a part of the company. And this bitch double dipping working as the president of the parks board and then also at this parking company.

So she fucking got go to.

In June twenty twenty one, a woman named Julie to Twitterich came forward about her summers as a teen spent as a lifeguard, where her supervisor cornered her in a park office and sexually abused her twice. That was in the seventies, So this has been going on for decades. Whoa so at the time of this interview, she is a sixty year old grandmother of e and the recent news brought back a flood of memories and she wants

Well, it's like, you know, we've talked about it before.

It's like people that are supposed to help people, like lifeguards, police, like they get put on a pedestal and then these guys think that they're above.

The fucking law, you know, and they get a big head about.

Oh, I got people's lives in my hands, and blah blah blah, I can do whatever.

I want it's bullshit.

The other case that I think helped inspire this one not about lifeguards, but it is in the pool, so I thought I would include it. It's the Paul Hickson rape case. He was a British Olympics swim coach. He ended up being jailed for seventeen years total for sexually attacking teenagers on his elite squads.

In nineteen ninety five.

My god, yeah, he was convicted of fifteen of seventeen charges at Cardiff Crown Court. He was found guilty of raping two teenage swimmers and in decently assaulting others. He was arrested in nineteen ninety two when he was the chief swimming coach at Millfield Public School in Somerset. So thirteen complainants came forward who were aged between thirteen and twenty. So before he was famous, So before he was famous for being a rapist, he was known for the Sole Olympics.

That was like the big thing.

He coached a lot of athletes who meddled and he was just kind of like the swimming hero and they gave evidence that he assaulted them after swim lessons or while carrying out fitness tests. He of course denied everything and said that the women just fantasized about him and this was dur and he said that to the jury, like he said this on the stand. He goes, no, no, they just fantasized this. That's I could see Grouco saying something like that. I mean, that's like the kuy He

They looked up to you.

But I understand the judges trying to build him up, to drag him down in this speech, but it's like, fuck that he's not known for that anymore. So then he continues, but you had a great duty to them too, in particular the girls you committed these offenses against their parents. Entrusted them to you, and they also looked up to you. I regret to say that you have thwarted their efforts and blighted the careers of some of them.

And that's from the Independent.

So and this is like amazing to have someone say this in the nineties because I'm thinking about the US like women's gymnastics team and the lack of like compassion we had for someone Biles needing to take a break, and like just all of these young girls that were abused for decades and like we now are not even kind to them and understand the scope of how abuse

It's also just so fucked up, because it's like, you know, you're under a micro you know you're you're You're not just like US swimming coach, You're like the swimming coach in your country. Like you're not just on gymnastics coach, You're the head of the fucking.

US best team.

You know, like people are looking at you, but they don't think they I don't know what it is, like the compulsion that they just like are like I have to abuse these girls or like cause it's like you're gonna get caught.

And they did.

But they I mean after decades though, you know what I mean, it's decades.

They get away with it for decades.

It's not that like, it's not that shocking for them to think they would get away with it.

They have been.

Yeah, the gymnastics organization in this country abuses its gymnasts for decades, like and allowed it to happen.

So whatever.

The judge continued, called him a pathetic creature and this abuse, like I'm saying, it went back twenty years, and not only did he coach them, but also him and his wife, Kathleen were appointed assistant house parents to the girls.

So it's wild and three to just go backwards.

He joined the University College Swansea as an assistant director of pe. It was there that a lot of the sexual abuse was carried out on young swimmers who joined his advanced training squad. He then left in the fall of nineteen ninety one to become head of pe at the top Millfield Public School in Somerset. One year later, he was suspended from the school and then arrested by South Wales detectives investigating indecency allegations made by eight former

I had to get my thesaurus out for that.

So he left quickly to northern France and held a job teaching English to businessmen. I really am confused for this all. You gotta be fucking kidding me.

This guy was at another school where he did this before he got before the British swim team.

Stuff.

What do you mean he's teaching English to businessmen?

No?

I but but you were saying he was convicted in Cardiff for like all these squad. This is like his first squad of girls that he's that he's attacking.

He went to Success, so he went to the second school and that and then that's when the girls that were abused in his first school all came together and they made the claims got it okay?

And that I thought he was Like I thought he had eight eight allegations and then went to another school and had fifteen allegations, and I was like, what the fuck?

How did they let him into that school?

No, the allegations didn't come out till he was at his second school. But then this school is like teaching businessmen. But I also don't know. I mean, he absconded whatever, he ran away, But how even with an ID do you get to go to France. You can't even leave the state if you're arrested in the US. Like, I just don't get how he got to France and was able to get a job.

It's confusing.

Yeah, maybe they weren't extraditing yet or something, because I feel like if it's European Union, there's probably extraditionals, right, I don't know.

So detectives made appeals for information. They showed his photo on bbctv's Crime Watch. It was a show, and then other swimmers began to come forward. So once his photo was shared, so many allegations that led to more charges and then South Wales Police made worldwide notice to trace him and he was re arrested in Sherwood Forest.

I think that's what robinhood is from.

It's like what yeah, So.

He was arrested, but after being on the run for fifteen months while holding down a job in France, but he was rearrested. So this dude's escape, recapture, trial, subsequent imprisonment all came after a South Wales police officer was attending a social event and he heard rumors about the coach's perverted behavior. So gossip is good, thank you very much. He wrote a report to the senior officers naming four

Wow.

So after the report, the detectives got to work and they were discreet but extensive, and they found so much stuff the Herald called a grotesque catalog of indecency and sex attacks spread over fifteen years, starting in nineteen seventy six. The trial was three weeks. Thirteen women came forward to accuse him. Nine complainants gave evidence to his indecency. He did tests where he ordered the swimmers to take off their bikini tops and bras before touching their breasts and

Which you know, to a fourteen year old.

Is a lot.

So another top swimmer was fifteen when he tried to rape her on a changing table before committing a different.

Sexual act against her.

Another woman said how he would rape her at his home during school lunch breaks, and the first time was when she was thirteen. These coach then persuaded her mother to put her on the pill, saying it would boost her swimming performance.

Oh my god, don't want to get caught.

So this dude was convicted September nineteen ninety five. He tried to get parole in two thousand and two and he did not get it.

He is dead.

He died in England in two thousand and eight, and like, so I couldn't find.

Where he was.

So I looked at Wikipedia to just see if he's dead or where he's serving his time.

And it bothered me.

So, like you go on Wikipedia.

In the first like little paragraph is he was a swim coach and Olympics and then the rape and it's like, no, the rape takes priority.

Yeah, Like are you fucking kidding me?

So I know all you Wikipedia changers are listening, and I hope you guys fucking change this. I think if you commit rape, that takes over your career stuff. It should be convicted rapist formerly known as a coach, like to have multiple paragraphs about his like coaching experience in life before the rape is fucked up.

He's a rapist. That is what he should be known for.

And it sucks that like the swimmers had to work under him, and like hopefully their medals are not fully tainted. I mean, I'm gonna talk about one woman who like threw away all her medals because it fucked her up so much, and her friend took them out of the trash and that's how she still has them today.

But like, it just bothers me.

So anyone that's a Wikipedia sleuth fucking change it. And there's just so many examples of this at high levels. We've talked about the US gymnastics team, but we also have like, from two thousand to twenty ten, the USA Swimming Network whatever, discipline thirty six coaches for sexual misconduct. In nineteen seventy seven, a famed Canadian junior hockey coach pled guilty to three hundred and fifty charges of sexual abuse.

Jesus, that's what.

That's why when you're like, oh they get caught, they don't.

They don't. And then and the Cripps, who is now known as Catherine Star. She had British parents but was born in Wisconsin, and they shipped her off to boarding school in London when she was eleven to train with the British best coaches, and her coach was Hickson. And she started a nonprofit advocacy group based in Santa Monica, California called Safe for Athletes, which we'll hear more about for what would.

Sister Peg do?

So she shunned her swimming past for so long but now is able to discuss it freely and she wants to help young athletes, and she just really talks about the effects of abuse, and you know, she turned to drinking and was addicted to alcohol for many years and unable to fully even like delve into her trauma until she was sober for eighteen months, you know, like that

And she says that.

Like she's just trying to expl like she works, she's a contributor and helper to save for athletes, and she just talks about like the power and balance with coach and coaches are gods and you do anything the coach says. And for Star, she said, yeah, he went to jail, but he never admitted guilt and that it's like really hard for her. She was not one of the people

And she said that to the London police. And then when she finally.

Called the police to file a report all those years later, is when she learned that he was already dead.

Oh my god.

But yeah, I all these brave fucking girls wait for a host smortom and talk more.

But like it's so I.

Just feel like these guys need to have like female assistant coaches that are like checking in with the girls like.

Every day, being like is he doing anything? Like I don't know, I mean.

Not sure there's ways that they get around ever getting caught.

But also how many s of youse have we seen where the women help their male cop partners get away with crimes.

You know, it's like.

It's really messed up, and it's just the pressures, you know.

I went on that deep dive with.

About Sean Johnson on the balance, our balance being queen and just like, you know, these girls are fucking young, these gymnasts, fourteen fifteen years old, international competition, the hours, the pressure, and like the coaches are your home, you're there forever, and to exploit that relationship is so sickening. And the fact that these like leets are still able to perform at such high levels is I don't know if impressive is.

The right word, but yeah, it's really Oh my god, I can't imagine it. I just like everybody abuses their power whenever they get a fucking chance. But okay, let's get to our post mortem.

So listen.

When we first saw this episode, we were like, this is hysterical. The most powerful lifeguard in the world, Like, what is this nonsense? And then once you read the real crime, and.

It's so real.

Every industry is just like dominated by predators that protect each other. And this job is even more susceptible because it's young people. It is teens, it's people's first jobs.

And it's people like wearing bathing suits, and like, you know, there's a culture around like beach and lifeguards where everybody, I think, thinks this is where I'm going to party, this is where you know, like that's I don't think that's necessarily how like nurses all act together, for example,

Well, and it's also maybe a little bit connected to comedy where it's not as well, not really because it is a job, job, but like the lines are blurred, like you're on a beach, you're at a venue, you're you know, they're like the environment adds to this like relaxed vibe when it is still professional.

Yes, yes, but right, like there's so much.

That happens in comedy that you just don't even think about that.

You.

She was explaining about how all the zoos have a program of like breeding where they do all these genetic tests and then they like ship the animals to different places to like, and they don't force it.

If the animals don't want to breath, they don't breathe.

But so I went, wait, you're telling me you just ship an animal to go fuck at a different zoom and bring them back.

And she seemed shocked.

And then my friends were like Lisa, and I was like, yeah, oh fuck, we are at this person's job. This person's probably younger than me by a law, like, and it was yeah.

But no one would think twice about saying that, like at a club at a boy even.

If you.

Like, oh, I feel like that's normal or like like that's normal discussion or you can like say things. And then when I knew, I knew a girl when I was a salon receptionist that broke up with her boyfriend because he called her a bitch.

And maybe it's like that's her.

Limit, that's her boundary and she didn't want to be spoken to like that, and that is absolutely fair and normal, but like, I can't even imagine me clocking it. I can't even imagine me clocking that.

It's an issue.

If someone said stop being a bitch, I'd be.

Like, whatever, you know, well yeah, well, I mean yeah, context is everything, right, because it's like I'm always like, what's up, bitch, Like I'm obviously not saying that in a mean way, but if your boyfriend said it to you with like venom, like you fucking bitch, like that might be a reason to get out, but but.

It is idiot better, I'd probably be more mad. I'd be like, I'm not an.

Iteat you're right.

Well, yeah, It's also like that's not the only reason they broke up because he said one He said that word like no.

But she had like Disney adult vibes where I just remember she was like an innocent type girl. She loved the cubs like I. She had cool highlights. But I just remember being like, yeah, I'm not putting up with that. Like it was we were also very very young, but it.

I've remembered this now for fifteen years.

Yeah.

That I just the way we speak is I think looser than people get to speak at their jobs. Like sometimes on my social media and YouTube, there's videos of like women that help professional like how to speak in professional like in professional settings and set boundaries and like that you don't have to tell someone what you're doing on your life break or not working over time without getting paid. And it's like how to say and people be like, how do you say this in professionals speak?

Have to ever really worry about that.

Yeah, yeah, I get to just say and and the things that I have to be professional about I pay people to do that, right, Like, if there's something that needs to be professional, I don't need to speak there's like a lawyer, right, you know, And so I there is, but there is no charge, there's no there's no protections. I guess like if someone just doesn't like you, they can And.

There's been a fair share of horrible shit that's gone on in our industry too, so it's not like we're not we're not immune to it at all.

But not immune to the issues.

But I think it's like a perk that but I like the perks of like you can say, I don't have to send the threshold were what I want Yeah, the threshold is higher for inappropriateness for sure.

Like it's not it's not verbal, it's not like in clothing. It's exactly. It's like it's pretty much an action. Like if you do something, then you're gonna get repercussions in our business, but almost anything you say is probably not gonna hurt you that much, unless you're Kathy Griffin and you hold a picture of a bloody you know, president's head and then you get canceled for a year.

But now she's back and she's on tour.

But I think this episode also, you know, you.

Go a little bit of power helping each other, and then I guess the donations really get favors.

Like yeah, like the political stuff was so was so wild, but I mean that's like anything like removing the lifeguard funniness of it, Like yeah, just people being like think.

Twice before you ruin this guy's life and stuff like that.

It's like what about the lives of the people who are dead or the people who have been like you know, a sexually assaulted to stay in their jobs or whatever.

You know, Like that's not that you need to get over that. You need to why didn't you report it sooner. You should have gotten it together try like processed it, gone to the authorities and been fine for core and saved all the evidence, immediately paid for your own rape kit to be tested. Like what the expectations on victims is? It's wild if we were just a little bit nicer. Just I wish the patriarchy wasn't so strong, like just having compassion.

I just hate the like suck it up, tough it out. I did it.

It was worse when I did, and I'm fine. Like that attitude is like can it die already?

Yeah, hopefully it dies with the boomers because that's a real boomer.

Attitude, because I feel like business culture took over. Hustle culture is the new boomer culture. Nothing matters. There's a reason a Porsche's only two seats and the bus fits everyone. Cut people out. You know you're not the smartest person in the ruby. Better move, bitch. Like it's like this weird attitude where I guess, yeah, just no emo, like, no.

No reflection on yourself, no growth. Yeah, the hustle for the hustle above all else. I guess, like nothing else matters besides what wealth.

I don't know.

It is hard though, because then sometimes you see people and you're like, fuck, that is so cool your work. Like I watch all these Kobe Bryant clips and it's like listen algorithms and so uh and he was so intense and it is inspiring to see someone working out harder than everyone, pushing everyone to the max. But then it's also like I would rather have friends and be nice to people around me.

I don't know, But then, well, we can't all be Kobe.

Yeah, we're not destined to be one of the greatest NBA athletes of all time. I think that's probably you know, that's a very specific person it is, and it's yeah.

But those are the people we look up to, and then it's hard not to feel inferior at times.

Yeah, and then I think, also those people get power complexes. And then that's where like I think some not not him specifically.

But like him he is what he did commit a crime.

Yeah, he definitely did commit a crime. But even with the Geordan like, I'd rather be Shack that I think that, I think I have to go get some Shack posters.

I don't remember.

Shaq is a funny like a funny piece of merch.

I want to be doing commercials with the General.

I don't care.

Get me that little cartoon general and let's roll, Like, let me.

Just buy people shit at Target and hang out. But like Kobe and Shaq had a lot of issues which I didn't know about, because Shaq Shack would be like, give me the ball, and Kobe would be saying, you don't work hard enough.

I'm not giving you the fucking ball. Oh, he goes.

If Shack worked harder, we would have had twelve championship rings. He's like, it annoys me, Shack doesn't work harder, and Shaq's like.

I'm chilling.

Yeah.

And it's not like Shaq wasn't one of the greatest, you know what I mean. Like that's the thing.

I don't know. It's your work to live.

You live to work. You know, there's different.

But also like maybe Shack had more like inherent nate, like like inborn talent, and Kobe had to work harder for it. You know, who knows if we're talking about basketball, I certainly don't know.

Like I'm not the answer.

This has become a full sports tailor.

This is a this is a sports philosophy podcast.

Now, all right, just certain people's work ethics are so inspiring, and it's hard if there's this hard balance of like, no, I want to be in the moment and content and enjoy stuff.

And then what's the other balance of.

Like you are you're not actually working hard enough and you are coasting and you're not taking the the opportunities you have in the way you have. It's like, I just wish all the voices weren't like so loud all the time of like what you're doing now, And then I guess that's also being like self involved. Yeah, I find other things to think about. I wouldn't be thinking

People do it well.

It's also a little bit of eyes on your own paper. Everybody's do everybody does things in a different way. You write and come up with comedy in a very different way than other people who sit every morning and write seven pages a stream of consciousness writing, and then they see what they can get out of that and like that's just not you, and like, you know, that doesn't

That's the way your brain works.

Should I have a new bit. It's just like I want to hang out with the chill people.

Yeah, but you can still look over us, the hard workers once in a while and go, hey, great job. I love what you're doing. I'm not gonna do it, but I like I see I see how you're hustling.

You know. I know I want to be maybe pushed against the corner where I feel someone scheduled me the whole day.

I would do it. Yeah, I'm if you were to schedule myself.

Yeah, if you were called onto a set, you show up, you do your work day, You work long hours when you're when you're filming something.

You know, we're just we.

All, we all guess what.

I begged my people for what I said, where's my white Lotus audition? I go, where's my white lotus audition? I go, I don't think i'd get it, but where's my audition? Bitch?

And a tape?

And they were like, we're trying. There's really not a lot of parts for it's just she's like it's in. She's like, don't worry, we've been on it. And I go, well, there's not one diner somewhere in Thailand.

No, you're right, he's just working at a Thai diner.

Man.

They didn't get me the breath. They didn't get me the Thai waitress audition.

But also like the top show, the best show ever.

But I am like, I think, if someone's gonna play a dumb bitch, let me get a show. Let me throw my hat at totally. This audition I did this morning was for I guess we're not allowed to talk about it, but it was for like a cute lizard, and I was like, I would love this too.

Oh my god, Liza, I want you to become the new guy Goo Gecko. Okay, let's move on.

Well, I would be so rich, we would be on below debt, we would be everywhere.

Oh my god, we'd be having so much fun.

If I was the Geico Gecko.

I mean, we need one of us to get that flow progressive job where you never are going to work again doing anything else, but you're just gonna make those commercials for ten years.

Oh yeah, we would. We would really have fun. Because some people don't know how to spend their money. Yeah, you don't. I think I spend what I have. But Kara's wild. She she did help me clean out my car. It was very nice. She did it so fast. It truly has been eating at me forever. But then you did grab my jean jacket and you're like, I can I can sell this for you if you want.

I'm like, put the den down. Put the denim down.

I was going through and I was like, okay, beach towel, pair of underwear, whatever.

And then I was like this done them.

You know I could get good money for this on the market, like on the on the mom market in Northeast La. Okay, let's move on to what would sister Peg do? Speaking of, you know, spending money or donating money. It's a new year, hopefully for the holiday season, you can.

I want to know how many homes Marishka has.

Do you think about that? Oh?

For sure, because yesterday one of our friends texted us while we were recording and said, I just passed marishka har husband on the street while I was listening to your podcast, and I was thinking, Oh, I wonder if they They definitely still have a place in Manhattan, right.

Manhattan, La Long Island. And then for me, it there's no way maybe a yeah, yeah, you're that rich, Like.

What do you do?

I don't know, there's like full TV shows explaining how rich people spend money. I don't know.

I'm acting like I've never.

But yeah, I'm clarious.

Well, because the thing is this is that she continues to work, and she could stop working tomorrow and still be a millionaire for the rest of her life just on residuals. And how much like that show gets played on ten different channels all the fucking time.

You know?

Oh, I know, because she's not only like she's an executive producer of some of them or like a director of some of them, you know, So it's not even just acting anyway. Let's get into our what would Sister peg do? This is our weekly segment where we direct you towards a resource, blog, post book, podcast, episode something to give you more info about what we talked about today and maybe an organization that you can help. And this week we wanted to point you to the organization

Thank you so much for that, and next week we will be doing an uplifting episode called baby Killer, Season two, Episode five. Join us on this amazing journey. Thanks for coming in with us into twenty twenty four and we hope to do this for as long as s few keeps churning them out for us. So thanks for everything, and I hope your new year starts on such a high note. And if you want to be depressed, Baby

If you have compliments you'd like to give us or episodes you'd like us to cover, shoot us an email it That's Messed uppod at gmail dot com.

Follow the podcast on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod and on Twitter at Messed Up Pod, and follow us personally at Kara Klank and at glitter Cheese.

As always, please see our show notes for sources and more information.

Thank you so much to our producer Casey O'Brien and our associate producer Christina.

Chamberlain, and to our mixer John Bradley and our guest booker Patrick Cottner. And to Henry Kaperski for our theme song and Carly gen Andrews for our artwork. Thank you to our executive producers Georgia hard Start, Karen Kilgarriff, Daniel Kramer and everybody at Exactly Media down the dn

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