TechStuff Rides the Vacuum Train

talk about that. We you know, if there's a gimmick, we wait and find out what it is. It's more fun that way. Yes, so we're today we're going to talk about It was something that Chris actually suggested. He had seen an article that the BBC had published upon their website about pretty cool concept and it's not a new concept notes, but it's um an interesting one. Vacuum trains. Yeah, I um, I've always loved trains. I don't know what it is exactly about them that I love you. And

Disney that's true actually a lot of it. Early Disney engineers liked them and um yeah, they showed up a lot in those uh and the Disney UH Wave of the future sort of things and and others too. You know, Jonathan and I have talked about this. Cartoons that talk about what's going to happen in the future usually, um, they throw in some funny twist about it, but um, uh yeah, tomorrow Land. This is kind of a tomorrow landy concept. Too far off from the whole monorail, although

different different method of propulsion. Yeah yeah, And um, you know, I've been interested in in magnetic levitation trains mag lev trains for quite some time. Um. And it's one of those things that, uh, you know, it's not that it's so complex that it can't be done. It's more that it's so expensive that it's just really hard to do. And and vact trains or vacuum trains or another they're

actually related. They're pretty closely related in some ways. You don't necessarily have to have all right, Maglev trains are not vacuum trains by definition, but necessarily that's right. And vacuum trains do not necessarily have to be maglev trains, although they can be vacuum trains that are maglev. Yes, yes, you can't have you can't have both, but they're not necessary for this. For this is not necessarily the same thing. Yeah, so what is a vacuum train? Well, you know, the

name kind of gives gives it away. What you do is the ideas you take a tube, you pump the air out of that tube, creating a vacuum, and then you allow a train to go through the tube. And because you've pumped the air out, you have removed the problem of air resistance. Because when a train travels normally above ground or even below ground, if it's not a vacuum, it's pushing air ahead of it. Yes, that that requires work.

That air even though air does not feel like we don't really necessarily think of air feeling like, there's a lot of resistance there. If you've ever been outside a heavy wind, you know that it takes work to just stand up right. Yeah. Anybody who's skated or written their bicycle at a brisk pace, Um, you know you feel the wind in your hair and on your face. Or somebody actually was written in a convertible, especially in the back seat, you're gonna feel, um, the wind pushing on you.

It's it's like it's it's creating its own little wind. So you know, you know wind rest, Yeah, you know that of course, there are their companies that dedicate themselves to finding new ways to reduce air resistance so that uh so that various things can move faster with less problems of the air impacting them. Well, well, bullet trains, you know, we we've mentioned him a couple of times to think on the the podcast before. They you know, if you've seen one of these trains, they go very

very fast, but they are also extremely streamlined. The engine is you know, and then that's I think why they call them a bullet train is because they have a pointy nose on the front which is designed to cut down on wind resistance. Yeah, it's all, it's all part of the plan. And so the by using a vacuum, you remove the air so now you don't have to

worry about air resistance. There's also, by the way, a tendency when a train is pushing air in front of it, it's also creating the sort of um vacuum effect on its own. There's there's because it's pushing air out the way and then the air has to rush into fill up that space again. It actually starts to pull a bit on the train. So the trains pushing air ahead of it and being pulled by air behind it, So

it's doing work that way. By pumping all the air out, you have removed that, um, that that force acting upon the train, and it can move at a faster rate than it could if air were a factor because all that work that it would be putting towards pushing the air out of the way can now just be put towards speed and acceleration. So even if you had a standard electric train in a vacuum, it could travel faster

than it would normally travel. Yeah, and that was one of the things that it was interesting to me when I really grab my attention when I read that article on the BBC website was because, um, they were suggesting that if there were a vacuum tube track from Europe to the United States, you could make the trip and a vac train in about an hour a little bit more maybe, And and then that imagining that versus you know, flying across even Yeah, that's the thing that got me

was the idea of leaving say London and arriving in New York four hours before you left, Thank you times owns. Just just because the time zones, you're not literally time traveling, you're traveling through time, it would seem because it's still progressing as you're sitting there on the train. It's just

that you're going back through the time zones. And so because your your speed is faster than the uh than the time zones can account for, you would actually you know, you leave at nine am and you would arrive at at four am or five am actually because it was four hours or so five am, and uh, so you have the whole day ahead of you. You know, it's

all relative, it is all relative. Um. But yeah, there were a lot of experiments that were conducted over the years to see if this would actually be the case, and it did seem to be so. And it did seem that they would have that speeding up that would cut down on wind resistance and make it a lot faster as what you're saying right, Yes, yes, there were there were researchers with M I T that did some tests.

They created a vacuum tube and then they shot things through it, like down the tube, not through the tube, not by secting the tube, but down the tube along the length of the So they said they started with the most um I think logical thing to shoot down a vacuum tube. Ping pong ball No, hamsters would be the first. No, no, no, no, you no, you don't want to put an animal in a vacuum tube. It would die. That's true. Plus natures a vacuum. Yes, yes,

that's true. That's true because I have never once seen a shrubbery do any darn vacuum anyway, So we both love animals. Question, they don't do that? They started, yes, do not build a tube an air steal tube and then pump the air out of it. I think we're all I think we're safe on that one. So guys that m I T don't do that, don't um. But yeah, they shot ping pong balls down the tube first. Then they started creating these little mechanical models to travel down.

And what they do is they would, you know, measure how fast the mechanical model could travel in a in an air filled environment versus the vacuum environment. And they figured that if they had a standard train, they could probably you know, well actually a relatively fast trained they could probably get up to about five hundred and eighty miles per hour, which is about nine d and thirty kilometers per hour. That seems reasonably quick that's pretty darn fast.

And they said that it would be about twice as fast as it would be if the tube were filled with air. So that gave the suggestion of why don't we look into this further, Why don't we look and see, you know, what could the upper limits of this be? And theoretically, according to the BBC article, those upper limits would be about twenty five hundred miles per hour or four thousand kilometers per hour. That's what allow you to get from Europe to North America in an hour. Um,

and uh yeah, that's super fast. Now you have to do a couple of things. You need to remember that even in these super fast systems, you don't accelerate to top speed quickly because that would squish you. You would be undergoing such tremendous g forces that it would be

at least uncomfortable, if not uh deadly. So the way these trains tend to work is they have a nice gradual acceleration so that you feel the acceleration, but it's a steady acceleration, so it's not increasing on you as time goes by, and then once it hits its speed, you coast at that speed for you know, top speed for however long you need to, and then you do a gradual deceleration. So in most so not like if you you know, stopped from ludicrous speed then you end

up smashing into the console screen or whatever. Yeah, I know. The way it works is that, Um, typically in most trips, you're you are not traveling at top speed for very long because you're spending most of the trip accelerating and then decelerating. It's you're only at top speed for a little while. And because you're not accelerating at top speed, it doesn't feel like like within the confines of the vehicle,

you don't feel like you're going that fast. Now you look outside and you see stuff whizzing by, and a holy cow, we're going fast. But without that outside uh indicator, you feel like you're more or less staying still. Um. Same sort of thing with this. Now, to get to that incredible speed of twenty miles per hour or four thousand kilometers per hour, you would need a special kind of train. You know, you wouldn't necessarily be using a train that has wheels, or at least not relying solely

upon wheels to get to where it's going. Where we're going, we don't need roads, um, and you do need track and uh in a vacuum. In that kind of environment too, you'd have to it would it would be very critical to have a form of um propulsion that would work

within that. I would imagine in a vacuum. Uh, it would be very difficult to operate a combustion engine, yah, since you would need air or well, you would probably use an electric engine, and you use like the third rail type system that of subway trains and a a lot of electrical trains used. I'm speaking from a you know, it couldn't be like a diesel train. Um, couldn't. You couldn't use You'd have to have it completely in. I can't imagine how you would take care of the exhaust, Yeah, exactly,

because you would have to expose it. I mean you'd have to have some sort of air airlock system where you could pump exhaust into an airlock h unloaded to the vacuum without compromising the whole system. Yeah, it would be complicated. What we're saying so electric. Just for my own thoughts, I can't imagine how you would do that, wouldn't It wouldn't be easy. Those steam engines would be terrible in a vacuum. Yeah. Um. So anyway, the it's

more likely that you would use electric or electro magnetic propulsion. Now, plus I'm sure it'd be a lot more fish. Yeah. So so that brings us to the maglev trains. Magnetic levitation trains. These are super cool and sometimes they're literally super cooled. Cuts down a resistance, So the concept here is pretty pretty interesting. The idea is that you use

some combination of magnets. They might be electro magnets or magnets, magnets magnets, They might be electro magnets, or they might be permanent magnets, or there could be a combination of the two, uh, and you use them in such a way as to make the train levitate so it's actually off the surface of whatever the track is, and that way,

when it travels, there's no uh. It reduces all that resistance as well, so you've reduced the friction that you would have from the track, and so it also cuts down on things like you don't have to worry about maintenance as much because you aren't having that wear and tear. You know that the train isn't rubbing against the track. The there aren't wheels that are starting to wear down over time. It's not wearing down the track over time.

So once you get the system in place, maintenance theoretically should be pretty routine. You shouldn't have to worry about wear and tear so much. Now there's going to be somewhere in tear depending on the style of the train involved, but we'll get into that. Yeah, the the magnets themselves will be put in in something called a Halbach array. That's that's if they're using permanent magnets. Yeah, that's one method. Well, and and that's very cool. UM. I didn't really understand

exactly how this was done. UM, but apparently that the scientist it's named after the scientists who came up with it, and he was actually thinking about it in terms of a particle accelerator. UM. But if you place the magnets in a certain position, it pushes, it concentrates the magnetic field on one side of the magnets. UM. And instead, so you know how you have a north and a

south pole. UM. If you line up the magnets in the way that uh, the good professor came up with, UM, it would concentrate this force on one side, thus enabling the to keep the train up. And that's so it's it's uh, you know, toward the train and it it pushes the magnetic field that way, which is a really interesting application of a technology from one purpose to another. Yeah, and there there's a couple of different ways of doing this.

Um you know. So so like pole repels like right, So north pole and north pole push push push against each other. North Pole and south pole opposites a track pulled together. So depending on what sort of train you have, um that will determine you know, what what sort of magnets you using and how you use them. So for example, there's a type of maglev train called electro magnetic suspension trains.

So the way these work, uh So imagining you have an elevated track and you have a concrete um guidance beam that goes down the middle of the track, and it looks like if you were to cut it, cut that track in half and look down the length of it, like look at it from the cross section, you would see that that that um that guidance uh beam is shaped kind of like a t. There are edges that extend out over either side the train itself, wraps around that track, so it keeps it at the optimal distance

away from the magnets and keeps it from you know, going too far away from it. And the magnets in this case are set north to south so that they attract one another. So the magnet are on the underside of the tea all right, So the you have magnets that are along the guidance rail that are on the underside of the T, and then on the train, the magnets are at the point that wrap underneath the T,

so those magnets are attracting each other. And what happens is the magnets on the T are pulling against the magnets that are on the train, which lifts the train off the the rail. So you've got a floating train. Uh. The big advantage of this train over um other systems is that you do not need wheels for this train. It'll it'll just pull the train up once you start it. And then you use an electro magnetic field to push

and pull the train down the track. So you know, you use a opposite opposite magnetic field to pull the train towards the front, use a identical magnetic field to the train along the back to push it, and you alternate the the pulsor the electro magnet magnets in order to maintain this wave and to accelerate the wave because when you first start, you wouldn't start slowly. Ah, it tends to be pretty christi um so yeah, you've got this traveling field. That's what moves the train down the

track and U and it's it's pretty cool. I mean, that's a neat way of doing it. It's um not that you know. Some trains in Europe use this. And then there's another style called the electro dynamic suspension train e d S, and these are suspended above the guide way, but instead of using the attractive force of magnets to pull the train toward this guidance column, it's using repulsive the repulsive part of magnets. So it's north to north

yet not like that, but north to north. So so in other words, you don't have the t there anymore. You still have the guidance rail, but now the magnets are set along the the side of the track, so on either side of the guidance rail on the bottom. And then you have magnets along the bottom of the train and they repel one another, so the train will

float above the track that way. Now, and these you tend to need a uh wheels, And once you reach a certain speed then you start to see the train actually lift off, so the wheels are needed at slower speeds.

And in fact, the companies that use this suggest that perhaps this is a safer system because should the entire system lose power, then the train would come to a gradual stop with these wheels, so you wouldn't have a jarring crash, which you know, in general terms as far as we're concerned, and travel is a bad thing, yes, it's not so much the traveling, it's stopping at the end there you go. So uh yeah. They the older

electrodynamic suspension trains used cryogenically cooled super conducting magnets. And the reason for that is what I was saying before. When you cool down an electro magnet, you reduce resistance, so you make it a much more efficient system because you know, resistance means that you're losing a lot of

energy due to heat. So by cooling this really really low, you've actually reduced the resistance within the system itself, makes it very efficient, does make it very expensive is not cheap too super cool stuff because you have to get hold of pretty rare elements in some cases in order to get the electromantics really cold. Now you're not getting them as cold as say, in a particle accelerator like

the large Hadron collider. They use liquid helium to get those electri o magnet magnets as cold as they possibly can, So they're just they're just a little bit over zero kelvin where you have no molecular movement at all. Um, they don't need liquid helium in these systems, doesn't need to be quite that cold, so they probably use something moral on lines of liquid nitrogen, which does not get

as cold as liquid helium does. Now. Uh. Then eventually that system started to get replaced by the permanent magnet system that you were talking about, the the the Halbach array and uh, but it's using the same general principle where it's using the repulsive force of the magnets in order to make the train levitate as opposed to the attractive force. And um, yeah, the that's the main difference between the various kinds of maglev trains. The end result

is the same. You get the train levitating above the track, and your speed is really limited just by how quickly you can manipulate the the magnetic wave that pulls and pushes the train. Yeah. So the faster you can do that, the faster the trains going to go. Uh. And if you eliminate air resistance by putting it in a vacuum tube, then you've suddenly created a really really fast means of

transport which could revolutionize not just consumer travel, but also shipping. Yeah, you know, you can imagine, you know, you've you've really cut down the amount of time it takes to get goods from one part of the world to another, assuming that they are connected by these these um, these tubes. One would imagine too that the this mode of transportation would be more environmentally efficient then using you know a lot of fossil fuel to make this happen. It just

depends on how you're creating energy for the electromagnets exactly, exactly. Yeah, if you do have to figure out, however, how the the electro magnet magnets themselves are powered. Um And you know, if you're using the halback array, then you've taken some of that out by using a lot of permanent magnets. You still have to create some sort of propulsion, so you're probably still using electro magnets at least to propel

the train. But but yeah, you would you know, you're not using you're not necessarily burning the same amount of electricity that you would need or creating the same amount of electricity you would need in order to power us an electric train. Um. Now, there are other things that we need to talk about as far as vacuum trains go, like how do you create the vacuum? Uh? Now, you would need some sort of pumping station in order to pump air out of the tube. And the longer the

tube is, the more pumping stations you would need. Now, the because you can't just have it at one end, well, you could depends on how the length of the track. If you're talking about something that's transatlantic, I can't imagine a pumping station on one side of the Atlantic that's going to pump all the air out of a transatlantic tube by itself. That would take an enormous amount of time. That would be very inefficient. Yeah, it would take an

enormous amount of power as well. Uh. Yeah, in general, from what I've read, it sounds like you would need a pumping station every I'll say twenty or thirty miles

along the tube. In order to maintain the vacuum at a reasonable rate, you would also need to have an airlock system in place, because you're going to have every time, every time the train pulls into a station, assuming there are people on board who want to get on or off, you can't have a vacuum unless unless everyone has some sort of environmental suit on, which does not seem terribly efficient as far as travel. Yeah, so you can't have a vacuum at the destination or the origin of this

this trip. It would be uh, it would be antithetical to the way we live life, mostly the breathing part. Uh. So, what you would have to do is have an airlock system in order for these trains to pass in and out of the vacuum. Moreover, you would likely need to have a series of airlocks so that the train is passing through decreased air pressure over UM over a series of airlock transitions, not just you know, full air pressure

to vacuum. I would have to go through a couple of different um airlocks before it was into the true vacuum. So that is another limitation you would need to have that in place. Also, there's a real concern about safety. You're talking about. A vacuum is not, like we said, not a good place for a human to be in, you know, just without without some form of protection, you

would you would die. So there's a real concern about things like you would have to make sure that whatever the train was, that it was made out of a material that could be pressurized properly and that would be really um resistant to wear and tear, because even the smallest fault in so device could mean disaster. He had a crack open up in one of those things, then suddenly everything would be blown out into the vacuum, not

sucked out, blown out. Sorry, I was thinking about a movie, um, and so uh that that's what we call catastrophic failure. That would be terrible even I'm sorry, go ahead, I was gonna say, even though that uh, from what I understand that these vactorines would not necessarily be in a full vacuum, um, it would it would be close enough to cause you know, concern in that department. And uh, you would also have to have, um, a concern about

the propulsion system. You would want there to be plenty of fail safes there so that if you're if you're traveling at something like per hour, Uh, you need to make sure the system is reliable in that it's going to accelerate and decelerate at a reasonable rate so that anyone inside is not going to be um harmed by that.

And also you need to have a good way of making sure that you're not going to have some sort of catastrophic failure where, um, perhaps the power is lost halfway through and then you have a train stuck in a vacuum between Europe and North America. Yeah, I'm I'm sure that if this comes closer to reality, there will be disaster movies in which people get stuck in the train or a terrorist. They'll they'll talk about a terrorist plot to blow up the tubes or something like that.

People will be streaming. Can you imagine traveling in a tube where you can't you don't even know where you are. It would have to walls would have to be very thick, right, Yeah, you could theoretically have thick walls that are also transparent, but if you're traveling through a tube, odds are there's not a whole lot to look at. So um, Also that speed you'd be like, hey, look, it's a never mind,

you just missed a whatever that was. Um, I mean you could set it up so that, you know, you could design the tubes so that they play out some sort of animated scene when you travel by a certain speed. It would be really interesting to do that. Um. But at anyr rate. Uh, yeah, you're probably not gonna have any windows, um, at least not traditional ones. You might have like some sort of screens that could display whatever you want on them, so that you would have, you know,

the facsimile of windows. So it's very for the claustrophobic among us. It would be a terrifying ordeal. You're in a tube where there's very little, if any air. Uh, you are in a train that's not moving. You have no idea where anyone else is. I mean, you might be able to I'm sure they would have communication systems on board, but it would be a pretty harrowing experience should something go wrong. Uh, and you know it's it's It's definitely one of those issues where the more you

think about, the more you like. There is a lot of points of failure that would need to be addressed before anyone would feel comfortable writing this system. Now that being said, a lot of us travel by air a lot, and the more you think about traveling by air, the more you realize, Wow, we really had to overcome a lot of problems in order to make this safe and reliable. And yet we've done it. And so I'm not saying

that's outside the realm of possibility. I'm not even saying that it's going to be uh as difficult as say, figuring out how to get a person into outer space and back safely. But it's it's one of those things where you know, I could see why people would be nervous about getting on one right right. Well, you know, if we've figured out how to travel by air, you'd figure out that we'd be able to figure out how to travel by lack of air. Um and uh your breath.

It's actually interesting that you should mention outer space because one of the apple cations for this technology. There There already are maglev trains out there. They're not predominantly maglev trains, but you know there are there are some, and there're people who are predicting that vacuum trains will be along within the next ten or so years, maybe a little longer. But they're also talking about the possibility that vacuum trains

could be used to launch space missions. Um, which would mean that you need to point them vertically instead of horizon only. Let's see, here's the thing about electro magnets. They can work that way. Yes, it doesn't matter if it's horizontal or vertical. It just needs the magnetic force that you're generating, just needs to overcome whatever whatever forces are holding it back. So you know, in in a regular maglev train that would include things like air resistance,

and a maglev train that's vertical, it would include gravity. Well, it would be sort of like a giant vacuum train gun into space. So so there'd be a solid too, extending from the surface of the Earth up into at least the reaches of low orbit. Dr James Powell has a group called Star Tram. It's the Star Tram Project and uh, you can visit their website. Um, look look it up, thinking I think it could have their their picture. I'll show I'll hold it up to the microphone so

that you all can see it. But yes, he is proposing that they create a giant launch system, and you know, there would be a tube it wouldn't be exactly vertical. Okay, it's it's actually at an angle, as you know, I'm showing Jonathan right now. But yeah, they're they're saying that it could be proposed sort of a space elevator with a vacuum train. That would be the weirdest thing to

see in the distance. Oh, I'm sure it would just a lot stretching up into the sky, even if it's even not necessarily vertical, but what a weird I imagine it would be very expensive fan and can you imagine a tube that heavy being supported by you know, there would be a lot of structure underneath it to hold

it in place. So clearly that would also be another one of those things that you can imagine being a target for someone who wants to cause a lot of mayhem, or or a target for someone who is flying a plane nearby, an unintentional target watch out for this sort of thing. I mean, I would imagine it would It would definitely affect things like like flight routing and things like that. But yeah, it's also, um it's similar to our our episode on space elevators. Yeah, well you had

a very similar discussion about that. But they say that they proposed that it could be able to launch three thousand tons of material into orbit for less than forty dollars per kilogram. That's um and you know, and we've talked about how that's a big deal because fuel costs for getting a vehicle into orbit is um. I mean, they're they're really really expensive. So that makes it very uh expensive to get any any particular material out into space.

You know, you figure a craft is able to carry x amount of tons of material and it and it costs x amount to get the vehicle into orbit. Then you figure, you know, you divide it up and you're like, wow, that's really expensive freight right there. Yeah. Well, and and it takes all that preparation time, it takes fueling up. As we know very well that that uh you know, can cause explosive problems if there are any flaws at all,

um risking life and property. So you know, the idea of space elevators or vacuum trains to get things in orbit might be a more efficient and more reliable way to do that. But uh yeah, that's there are some serious technological challenges there to be overcome, but fascinating to think about. Nonetheless, yeah, definitely and you know, it's whether we'll see this or not. I'm a little more skeptical.

And the reason why I'm skeptical, can't imagine why. Here's the reason I'm skeptical at least that we'll see it in the United States. Uh. And the reason being is not because of the danger, but because it's a massive undertaking that would cost lots of money, although according to some analysts, not as much as you would imagine. Some are argue that it would be more efficient than other versions or or as the same expense as it would

be for um, other kinds of high speed rail. Well, the United States has not been very good at at implementing high speed rail in general. I mean, the fastest train we have is slow compared to the trains in Europe and in Asia. Um and and it's just one of those things that it's sort of become an afterthought. I mean, trains built this nation into what it is. You know, before the trains, we had very little unity as a nation, and then the trains really brought us

together in a way that no other technology had. However, they're they've sort of haven't changed in the last century or so. I haven't there haven't been a huge number of developments. There has been the switch over to electrical trains versus coal powered trains or things like that, but

but in general, they have not really advanced that much. Uh. And the fact that I it's been so, the fact that we have not seen a lot of movement in the high speed train, yeah, well, the we haven't seen a lot of of development in the high speed train arena tells me that while the interest is definitely there, and while there are people who are crying out for this sort of thing, it hasn't reached the critical mass necessary to put it into action. There are a lot

of political issues at stake, economic issues, um. And it's just one of those things where I don't see that clearing up. I see the political process taking longer than ten years. The technology, I have no doubt up by ten years we would be able to do this. We could, We could implement something like this today if we dedicated our resources to it. Politically, I just don't see it

happening within ten years now. It might happen in Europe and Asia, where train travel has become a very important way of getting around and it has been that way for for generations. But they have continued to invest in it and to continue developing and innovating in that space, whereas in the United States the focus shifted dramatically toward automobile industry. Well, yeah, the Americans love their cars. Yeah. Now if we were uh, I mean, I would love

to be proved wrong way this. I would love that in ten years we have high speed trains that connect the various uh staies together. For one thing, it could help reduce air traffic congestion, It could make you know, it could be a viable alternative to taking a flight somewhere. So the more choices of consumer have has I maintained that the more choices you have, the better off you are. Um and and I just think it'd be kind of cool.

I still don't know that I would be a volunteer on the first first manned trip of a maglev vacuum train. I don't know. Um, I guess it would depend on what I had planned later in the week. Yeah, just something really exciting. I'd be like, you know, no, I just don't put a lot of rold coins in there, you know. That was that was one of the first things I thought about when I thought vacuum train. I was thinking about the pneumatic tubes that they used the

bank drive through. Yeah, um, which you know, it would be sort of a similar effect, you know. The first thing, the first thing I thought was the tubes that the characters travel around and in Futurama. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, although clearly you wouldn't be able to use a complete vacuum because you know, that would just be yeah, i'd just be a corpse delivery system. Really, once you get down to it. Yeah, not not pleasant. So, um, I

hope we didn't bore you, Steff with this podcast. Uh this, uh, but you know, it's really kind of a last time. He's gonna let me pick a topic. Yeah, you're dead right about that. Um, So we're going to wrap this up. Guys. It's a really cool idea. It's a neat way of thinking about transportation in the future, although we may never see it come to pass. But if you guys have any topics you would like us to talk about, whether they are transportation related or has something you know completely

disconnected from transportation, let us know. Send us an email or at this this tech stuff at Discovery dot com, or send us a message on Facebook or Twitter. Are handled. There is tech stuff H. S W and Chris and I will talk to you again really soon for more on this and thousands of other topics. Is it stuff works dot Com brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray. It's ready. Are you