How to Break Into Health Tech Without Any Experience

[SPEAKER_02]: businesses lose millions of dollars on from health care fraud and, you know, with incorporation and ER and adoption of ER, so a great security engineer, they think like a attacker because we have to solve things correctly. [SPEAKER_02]: So in the information security will, we will follow an oblutee. [SPEAKER_02]: You have red team, red team is going to be like your pin testers, your hackers, ethical icons, things that I mentioned.

[SPEAKER_02]: So we have to think, we have to think like, proactively, how do we stop this threat before you have it, before you be matriculated into something that could tell the business out? [SPEAKER_02]: You always don't verify. [SPEAKER_02]: You always don't verify. [SPEAKER_02]: So we go back to the CIA and try it, right, integrity, integrity is the eye in the CIA and try it.

[SPEAKER_01]: looking probably never security plus maybe even a security clearance and nobody taught you how to write poems or how to test a security control or submit a ATO package on Chris Arkpala a few years ago I was in your shoes all the five on paper but completely lost when it came to our map I had a degree I had to serve so I had to drive and what somebody said how to test an AT2 control or gotta date stick bias I had no clue what that actually looked like

[SPEAKER_01]: Fast 4 or 5 years, I worked across DOD and federal agencies, led control assessments, RINATO package, and past orders. [SPEAKER_01]: That's why I built our NF Academy to teach you the real world execution. [SPEAKER_01]: They don't cover in certification books. [SPEAKER_01]: Inside, I'll show you how to write a poem. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't get bad as bad. [SPEAKER_01]: Test and validate security controls, Translate tech jargent, and navigate lists 853 and horror map with confidence.

[SPEAKER_01]: If you're in IT support in the government systems or stuck on edge of the security, this is your way. [SPEAKER_01]: The people who go through my training don't just get hired, they hit the ground running, because they practice the work before they win. [SPEAKER_01]: Go to horror mapercatemy.io and let's get the work. [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome everybody to another edition of the Tech World Podcast. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm your host Chris of Bride Palo.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm an information assistant security officer inside the Guptex space. [SPEAKER_01]: And in today's podcast, we're going to talk more of the young to the young generation in the cyber security space. [SPEAKER_01]: I met a young brother. [SPEAKER_01]: His name is Donovan Sergic. [SPEAKER_01]: He's in a health care tech space. [SPEAKER_01]: He's a mentor. [SPEAKER_01]: He's a community leader. [SPEAKER_01]: He gives back and he knows a lot.

[SPEAKER_01]: And when it comes to cyber security and how to get inside the space. [SPEAKER_01]: And without further ado, doubt about how you're doing by doing great. [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for having me.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, there's no problem like when my girlfriend today introduced me to talk about you, he was just talking about the things you've done in the past, talked about like, you know, you'll be a good fit and talk about like, you know, and tech and how you took the different power to get into tech. [SPEAKER_01]: So, [SPEAKER_01]: Now, I appreciate you coming on the podcast. [SPEAKER_01]: You know, those on the side of this are I appreciate you, okay?

[SPEAKER_02]: No, I don't want you on shot any kind of connected us. [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, I was more than willing to do this. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, opportunities don't come off them. [SPEAKER_02]: So, when you have that, you kick in the door. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I appreciate you taking it really, really serious. [SPEAKER_01]: Because I know like, you know, I know it would be not too long.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's not, it's just that I wasn't expecting like you to have this like very lacks the minimum, like talking about like these hot objects, but I appreciate you, you know, sometimes in tech, you talk about anything like IT related, sometimes it just gives real black and white, so I feel like with with with your demeanor and just how how you approach this, like you just add the color. [SPEAKER_01]: Now I appreciate you.

[SPEAKER_01]: Because this is something, this is stuff is not no joke. [SPEAKER_01]: It's really high level style. [SPEAKER_01]: And I'll be here sometimes confused. [SPEAKER_01]: And that's why I kind of created it. [SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes I ask questions that I don't have a note. [SPEAKER_01]: So we're just going to go straight into it. [SPEAKER_01]: So tell me about your, when you was in high school, tell me about your early life to the, did you always want to get into tech?

[SPEAKER_01]: We'll start there.

[SPEAKER_02]: Ah, so I'm pretty sure like a lot of, you know, younger, younger folk that's going up. [SPEAKER_02]: The U.S. video can relate to what I'm about to say, but I've been using computers for as long as I remember, I think my mom set up.

[SPEAKER_02]: Some young computer like two and a half years old or something like that so from there Then playing video games growing up Xbox of my favorite So playing Xbox just playing the video games just kind of already just being comfortable like more technically and client Then others would And then I want to actually look at the McKinley type. [SPEAKER_02]: Are you with McKinley too? [SPEAKER_02]: I literally want the McKinley type.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, okay No, that's just cool to get you got to write assay to get it now [SPEAKER_02]: You know, we had to go a lot, so, but I had this class. [SPEAKER_02]: I want to say he was the my 11th grade of 12th grade of year. [SPEAKER_02]: My teacher misses her here. [SPEAKER_02]: He actually told me how to use HTML to see us as. [SPEAKER_02]: So that kind of, that was a pivot. [SPEAKER_02]: Like my introduction to that was like, you had a lot of pups.

[SPEAKER_02]: My introduction to what I'd do right now, it was just like a journey like ups and downs, pivots doing one thing, trying up and trying out a few things, but that was a very pivotal moment. [SPEAKER_02]: And I will say as a cannon moment and how I approached this right now. [SPEAKER_01]: And I love what people say, Cannonball, it was a huge spider-man, man. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: So even learning that in a young age, like it could grow your mind. [SPEAKER_01]: Because even when I was in college, somebody taught me the fundamentals of hacking. [SPEAKER_01]: And it was teaching, and I was like, don't even have to brew my mind. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, some like, and there'd be dangers with that beauty. [SPEAKER_01]: And you could change your whole life with it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: So, for with that knowledge from going to McKinney and McKinney is a good school, shout to McKinney. [SPEAKER_01]: You went to college, I know you went to Howard, no, you went to UDC and you said, UDC. [SPEAKER_01]: So, what was your major? [SPEAKER_02]: So, I actually did want to go to Howard, my original plan was just to do UDC for one year and then, uh, to transfer to Howard, you know.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I think I state because why go to how or two study information technology when a lot of the coursework is going to be the same, you know? [SPEAKER_02]: So I study information technology to answer your question. [SPEAKER_02]: And actually now I'm five years of moving from EDC. [SPEAKER_02]: They actually offer sub-security as a major now. [SPEAKER_02]: That's right. [SPEAKER_02]: This is great.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so it's just, it's like, [SPEAKER_02]: And I believe the reason why they do that now is because sob security is such a hot topic now in today's time, 25 while you can't go without inner sob security. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, even with schools now they try to offer sob security. [SPEAKER_01]: But the only issue is I have with some schools offering it, this information they have is so outdated. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah, or like you don't get no serves.

[SPEAKER_01]: But even the search is getting too many serves I think of.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think Weston and I think Weston and I think Weston and I think whatever they offer like, yeah they are, they are like 20 surge, I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no

[SPEAKER_02]: Um, because that has saved you so much time and it saved you so much money. [SPEAKER_02]: Especially if you're not already in the role. [SPEAKER_02]: So where a company can actually pay for that certification for you. [SPEAKER_02]: So now you're looking from anywhere from like 200 to 300. [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe like six hundred dollars. [SPEAKER_02]: You've heard certification. [SPEAKER_02]: So what was the major? [SPEAKER_02]: I thought I didn't catch that information.

[SPEAKER_01]: So what did you learn in that major? [SPEAKER_02]: So it really so my first few classes in my major when I started doing coursework in my major It was mainly they actually my first language I learned was Seclus Plus. [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, so they actually teach you programming. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: He taught our program, but I didn't Hate it, but I got to learn myself. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, C++ was in my that's the hardest one C++.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was in my 410 [SPEAKER_02]: And then, you know, you go through more, it's like, you got your cool classes, you know, electives and things that I make sure I eventually came across like a security or networking. [SPEAKER_02]: And that's where I kind of fell in love with. [SPEAKER_02]: That was another pivotal moment for me. [SPEAKER_02]: That was another cannon. [SPEAKER_02]: We talked about candidates. [SPEAKER_02]: That was another cannon.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay. [SPEAKER_01]: I said, okay. [SPEAKER_01]: I see you. [SPEAKER_01]: So you learn to network in and you got all that. [SPEAKER_01]: So like, when you was in UDC, like, how did you like? [SPEAKER_01]: When did you start to make your pivot? [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, a question you need to drive like when did you get your first job or opportunity? [SPEAKER_02]: Ah, so, half of my first two years in UDC, I was actually working in a student center, and I was working in a student center.

[SPEAKER_02]: It wasn't to, I was doing that, and then I was also working at the Department of Employment Services. [SPEAKER_02]: So, like, I wasn't doing anything really tech related at all. [SPEAKER_02]: Get that though, Yoko, and then make you feel bad? [SPEAKER_02]: It kind of, I realize, like, it's a journey. [SPEAKER_02]: It's going to be a journey to get to where you are. [SPEAKER_02]: And back then, I was just trying to get a help-dust rule.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and that's the thing people don't tell you about. [SPEAKER_01]: And now you do all that. [SPEAKER_01]: And you can't even, you get a degree you spend like 20, 30,000 and then you get sad because you might, what did I do wrong? [SPEAKER_01]: Because I was in your space for me. [SPEAKER_01]: I was in college. [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't think I was even smarter enough to even major in that type of stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I, and I know what I say like that, but it's just what my environment like grew up and so you continue on that path. [SPEAKER_01]: What happened after that? [SPEAKER_02]: So I was just, you know, at the Department of Employment and Services, I would, you know, just try to just talk to as many people as I can and I'd use as an opportunity to network. [SPEAKER_02]: Like, you work any job, you got to learn something from any job, even if it's not a job, you want to work.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like, you can pull something from, from where you're working. [SPEAKER_02]: Somebody else something.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, like I tell people and I talk, people tell me you know what I'm gonna do with my homies man Yeah, I'll tell you they'll tell you something I just a little bit, I just a little bit the best people to teach you are the people you know I'm not saying that the homies man fell yeah, well they fell there Like the press people the best teachers are somebody that's actually going with something

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so you found some mentors there and then they helped guide it to another world, so through networking at the DOS and just talking to people in my studio, yes, I do. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, okay. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, you see you did a summer job program. [SPEAKER_02]: I saw I was I was one of the people that like went to the summer sites and then went to go talk to the site leaders and seeing how everything was going and they went. [SPEAKER_01]: But I'm glad I was doing that.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's summer jobs so many years they put me on a situation. [SPEAKER_01]: I was like [SPEAKER_01]: Man, what's going on? [SPEAKER_01]: They put anybody on these times, right? [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, but a baby, so you check it off these sides and things are good. [SPEAKER_02]: Check it off the sides. [SPEAKER_02]: I think working working in, but eventually, like, you know, you at school, you had to work with any program.

[SPEAKER_02]: So at a UDC, they actually let you work in the IT department. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, you can work and I see the farming and I was good. [SPEAKER_02]: I was doing stuff and like I was like Helping repurpose computers that those don't like some active directory work. [SPEAKER_02]: That's not did you That's more people. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, you know, they couldn't know that you obviously it's uh It's easy to go so I'm not don't have a clearance.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm still in school So I'm just they can they can show me what they can [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to have to show them that they can't even go. [SPEAKER_01]: So you just took what you've got, but they make something like that. [SPEAKER_01]: They make you feel like, like, sad or anything. [SPEAKER_01]: You just, like, just taking, you just taking that as to what God's giving you. [SPEAKER_02]: Or I'm taking it as what it is.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm taking it with whatever die put me in the opportunity, right? [SPEAKER_02]: The previous years before that, I wasn't even known it. [SPEAKER_02]: So the fact that I'm sitting here, I'm behind the desk. [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm studying IT and I'm actually a line of my soul with my purpose. [SPEAKER_02]: Like that, feel all the better right there. [SPEAKER_01]: That's a very humble and answer. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't really get that too long today.

[SPEAKER_01]: Because it's like, when people begin to agree, and they assume, like, I need it all, you know, like, but that's a hummus, so you just taking it as a cow. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: And then eventually you just got an opportunity with the government, or with this. [SPEAKER_02]: So from that, it came internships. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, they came to get a clear student? [SPEAKER_02]: No, I didn't get the clearance. [SPEAKER_02]: I actually don't have the clearance.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, you don't, yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so you're part of the circus. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm part of the circus. [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, okay. [SPEAKER_01]: So how did that go?

[SPEAKER_02]: So, yeah, so my first internship, I was working in the defense base, so I'm traveling an hour on a train to get my internship. [SPEAKER_02]: I go day one of my internship orientation, I'm the first one there, because I knew I was coming from a long way, so like I had to, like, I'm, I'm gonna go ahead with my major impression, because I want to, like, see what this goes, so I was, at that internship, I was working as a business, so they're showing the things like Salesforce.

[SPEAKER_02]: sales was big and good just on the sales yes you get served came to like sales was served yeah so they're teaching us how to build dashboards on business analysts so that we're working to like the strategic partnerships so I'm sitting there I'm sitting in the meeting as I'm taking notes

[SPEAKER_02]: While my managers and stuff that are working with the vendors that are trying to make acquisitions, so I'm just taking notes and through that, that was another network and opportunity right there, because at the end of the insurance action, they actually patent business calls. [SPEAKER_02]: So I'm taking business calls, I'm something to learn about these companies that they're working with.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then like in our internship, they're just, you know, they're showing you software, they're showing you what's the next thing. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so back then it was that was like what twenty-nine seeing we're talking like our was up for RPA I know already yeah, the broader process automation is I don't every well talking like RPA you I've had and it's big now like you I know you have had you have had big if you learn that skill back then like you

[SPEAKER_01]: I know there was a couple of info, so I think his name is Cyrus, he talks about RPA every now and then, but that's a big one, because, yeah, I mean again, it's trending now, but you got to get on it back then. [SPEAKER_02]: So like, like I said, it's 2019, it's just 2019, RPA was just kind of like an emerging technology. [SPEAKER_02]: You look at the Gardner, Magic Quadrant, it's like the businesses.

[SPEAKER_02]: all the organizations that have like a staff as a relationship or just the leaders of that space that you are path is like top three top five at the time. [SPEAKER_02]: And I was in 2019 so you can only imagine what they are with the RPA space right now. [SPEAKER_01]: It's a billion other companies. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that CEO is all over anywhere. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, all the conferences, everything. [SPEAKER_01]: And then, so, so you learned that skill and that's how you are.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, it's 2020, let's skip the 2020. [SPEAKER_02]: Summer of 2020, obviously it's COVID. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm still, I'm going into my last semester. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm actually working to celebrate internships right there. [SPEAKER_02]: Right then, one is with the place I'm at right now. [SPEAKER_02]: And then, so there's, I'm just no software development.

[SPEAKER_02]: And my second internship, my own going both of these internships and the same summer. [SPEAKER_02]: My second internship was actually doing some RMF work with a local company. [SPEAKER_02]: So, I actually wanted to stay with the local company just on the RMF work because I had better connections there. [SPEAKER_02]: I felt like I was learning, I was learning like the RMF stuff a little bit better than just doing, you know, [SPEAKER_02]: It's awful development.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think at the other one, I was going to like some squarming ass to work, just a little bit of development, also a short, we go into the fall, amidst the middle of my semester, middle of my last semester of an unbreak, and I get a call saying I got a physician open. [SPEAKER_02]: So just with the dedication and determination I had through those some of your internships I was going to leave. [SPEAKER_02]: I was able to land my first role before I even graduated from the school.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, for once you tell me, so you went through the hardships, you know, you got it, you got your degree, you know, you did some interest, but the main thing I keep hearing you say is internships, yeah, so that's very about you, so what's the audience just make sure like when you in school just make sure you take advantage of those internship programs because if you not, you know, you might not even, from what you was telling me all those opportunities for internships connections, somebody was like, I know doubt of a new skill in this, so that's what happened.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, taking a bet show, doing two injuries, it all paid off. [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, how you did it, because you didn't really force it. [SPEAKER_02]: But you just did the work, I had it, you know, you know, you just got put the work and you want to get to a certain point in life, you got to put the work and we got to do that mindset though. [SPEAKER_02]: I just, it's nothing really like, it's only, if I'm a, like, if it wasn't college, it's a military.

[SPEAKER_02]: I wasn't giving a lot of options coming from the city, no. [SPEAKER_02]: So, like, if I was going to stay in school, I was going to lock in. [SPEAKER_02]: I always say lock in, like, I'm a lock in and I'm a figure to talk. [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so tell me about your first job, what it was, and then tell me about like high transition to health care tech. [SPEAKER_02]: So for jobs, it was always okay to always have a nearer.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I've been with the same place for since I graduated. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so tell me about like, what is the role? [SPEAKER_02]: What do you do? [SPEAKER_02]: So when I first came, when the first came to the business, they actually put me in this rotational program and in our rotational program, you have a year, six months, one team, six month or another. [SPEAKER_02]: So through that and I landed the role on I'm left now, strictly to never do.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, okay, yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I came in as a software developer, as I said. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it was a software developer.

[SPEAKER_02]: like the security place so that and at least the automation right because now you understand how the developed scripts and obviously you work with Python you sit in it you work with the project and then I get to my role because at that point this is 2022 we're trying to put a Afro take I heard about this Afro take conference I was like what is this and I started on my research about it I was like this sounds great I want to go

[SPEAKER_02]: Um, so I'm trying to get the company to sponsor this. [SPEAKER_02]: Um, and I meet, uh, I meet, uh, you know, a few people are never working in like the, the woman, um, that was supposed to speak at the conference day. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, she actually works. [SPEAKER_02]: She, she, she works with me and that's all that. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah, this is all. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: You have to take me to show the Afro take.

[SPEAKER_01]: I know everything. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: So you're basically doing GRC engineer in a way, RPA automation. [SPEAKER_02]: I always thought that was the matriculation, but security engineer. [SPEAKER_02]: Is security engineer still care to get in there? [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, like what is your day-to-day as a security engineer in the health care space? [SPEAKER_01]: It's a little different of all. [SPEAKER_02]: I'll say, it's quite a few things.

[SPEAKER_02]: So in my role, we served as one of the highest points of escalation and a security in the IT room. [SPEAKER_01]: So when you, let's say, do you explain with any digital audience that don't know what that name can kind of evaporate with their highest points, you know, escalation too and we, yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: So your baseline, when you with something goes wrong, [SPEAKER_02]: you have, you have just, is anything, anything and anything can happen at any time.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I think something's going to go wrong. [SPEAKER_02]: Nothing's ever 100%. [SPEAKER_02]: Something's always going to break. [SPEAKER_02]: So anything from like a email, now working like, I'll look all the way to like this particular application. [SPEAKER_02]: I just can't get to it, like it's on available right. [SPEAKER_02]: So we talk about the CIO, try it, and we can get it. [SPEAKER_02]: That's the basics. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, we can get into that later.

[SPEAKER_02]: Um, like, yeah, so somebody puts in a ticket if that if the IT can't take care of it, they escalate right. [SPEAKER_02]: So now you're getting not like you would just worry about, okay, it's a hardware thing. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, it's not a hardware thing. [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe it's a software thing. [SPEAKER_02]: funnel it up to your other T, right? [SPEAKER_02]: So by you get it to the output T, there's the output T, then if the output T came figure it out, you go to the next team.

[SPEAKER_02]: So is it this particular software that's causing this issue without look or without the issue you're having? [SPEAKER_02]: So that's escalation. [SPEAKER_02]: Sorry, 10 or 3. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so you start from tier one tier one is like, yeah, I see hub there So then you come all the way up. [SPEAKER_02]: So like your how your points are tier three. [SPEAKER_01]: Basically if it all all things went loose You did last person to kind of figure it out.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, amazing me. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so like if you like it's like this like you know I won't feel football guy. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, like no it's safety you safety is the last one defense. [SPEAKER_02]: Let's do So like we're like the safety's okay, huh? [SPEAKER_01]: So I got it now. [SPEAKER_01]: So you got to make sure you protect it. [SPEAKER_01]: So you're doing that. [SPEAKER_01]: So you've had a more on the IT space, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: So you're kind of like fixing issues and things that's going on. [SPEAKER_01]: And that's what you're currently doing. [SPEAKER_01]: And you're kind of doing software engineering and all that stuff. [SPEAKER_01]: So, okay. [SPEAKER_02]: So there's a component to it. [SPEAKER_02]: So, um, I don't know if you're familiar with the information security will, right? [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, bread about. [SPEAKER_02]: So, I'm a security agent now.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, a great security engineer, they think like the attacker, because we have to solve things proactively. [SPEAKER_02]: So, in the information security will, we will follow an obluteer. [SPEAKER_02]: You have red team, red team is going to be like a pentastos, your hackers, ethical hackers, things that I mentioned. [SPEAKER_02]: So, we have to think, we have to think, like, proactively, how do we stop this threat before you have these?

[SPEAKER_02]: Before you be matriculated into something that could tell the business out. [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, now I got you, so like overall like like what are you like when you come into your job like like what are you Particularly doing like are you coming in looking at emails then look at the tickets or y'all going to meetings on out of Protect against her and shouldn't threat. [SPEAKER_01]: How does that work? [SPEAKER_02]: So in my team, I work with a CASB team.

[SPEAKER_02]: So CASB team, so I explain how tickets are being escalated. [SPEAKER_02]: So when you get to like the tier 3 or like the higher escalation levels, of those security teams, okay, now like we got to talk change a bit, right? [SPEAKER_02]: Change management is like you go through a process, you get all the, you have like a committee, a board.

[SPEAKER_02]: the board or right you have a board you have a committee and within that committee you bring it to the team okay this is what needs to be done how do we go about doing this you put in the you put in the change and changes they can't happen during business out of it so they have to happen all business out [SPEAKER_01]: And I know you got certain days, and then too, like you got to create, are you, do you use remedy?

[SPEAKER_01]: Mmm, no, that's all, you're creating tickets, yeah, this server's not, yeah, so yeah, server's not either way.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you got to make sure it's process. [SPEAKER_01]: Even when they take it, sometimes a number of people, they, you got to really make sure, because some of the, some of the people don't know, they'll just put anything on them sometimes, yeah, but that's, that could be an issue because it's like, okay, we really need to get this to care. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so I'm not understanding.

[SPEAKER_02]: So like when you was doing the role, did you have like any mentors or anybody that was kind of like guiding you to do this as a little bit Um, I like to I like to there's this quite a few people there's there's there's there's there's people within my organization Um, that the mids are me. [SPEAKER_02]: I have my team right.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm the youngest on the team Currently, so I'm the youngest on my team everybody single up on the engineers [SPEAKER_02]: And I know with you, you try to get back as much as you can. [SPEAKER_02]: I can't, I can't, because there's always an opportunity for somebody that wants to be in my position, and I don't get keep doing her. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, with, you know, zero tries and how does that, how does that pertains to your role now?

[SPEAKER_01]: Because that's the new things that's coming up.

[SPEAKER_02]: So the euro trust essentially is a never trust always verifah you always never You always never verifah so we go back to the C.I.A.Tryout right integrity Integrity is the I and C.I.U.Tryout so You don't give access to So applications or systems or processes to people that have no business need there Right, so you don't give access to a HR function that the finance team only needs to have all right [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so on zero trust, yeah, so we there's there's tools.

[SPEAKER_02]: There's a lot of tools out here on back in that the handle that specific function for you. [SPEAKER_02]: And and zero trust is so big today like you hear about a lot this was what is what is, you know, the direction of where security is going because you when you when you transition from like hardware to like software.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm like post 2020 that was like a real big thing where I did cloud cloud cloud is a big thing to cloud It's a like big thing so some money is interested in and in this understanding more about the security Engineering look up the cloud look up the different technology used all the companies that have like a full hold in the cloud space

[SPEAKER_01]: So like you were zero trust now like you would AI right you got a verify not use this analogy too I've been kind of looking into it myself. [SPEAKER_01]: Are you got to make sure it's authenticating make sure there's you know two you know two sub factors things is in place So you can verify that there's a human element in it.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that's I get with that perspective [SPEAKER_01]: But my opinion, I don't think Zero Trust is, it's good, but if you do it too much, it's going to slow everything. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, even in the air space, they're going to stop everything. [SPEAKER_02]: I definitely agree with that, and I run today to show a lot, we talk about latency, right? [SPEAKER_02]: If everything has been locked down, that makes the access to whatever application process becomes lower.

[SPEAKER_02]: So now we got to think about, so when I talk about change management, [SPEAKER_02]: they're probably talking about this doesn't work the way it's supposed to. [SPEAKER_02]: It's slower now. [SPEAKER_02]: So in our tier of security, we have to figure out why it's slowing down. [SPEAKER_02]: Is it something that's needed to happen? [SPEAKER_02]: You got to think about that, too.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I know from your perspective, in my, I know, my people like, it's those, I know you know, you really did with like, [SPEAKER_01]: GMC people, you probably may ask them on me down. [SPEAKER_02]: There's a lot of cross-collaboration. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I know you ain't, I know you have no meetings, yeah? [SPEAKER_01]: So, yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes they don't know, and I know you're probably on this spectrum, like you actually know, like, this is, because a lot of system engineers, they don't care. [SPEAKER_01]: You just want to put it out there, yeah, so. [SPEAKER_02]: But there's a process, right? [SPEAKER_02]: Like, we could talk about, yeah, no. [SPEAKER_02]: So, AI comes with this own rules of regulations. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so I'll shoot. [SPEAKER_01]: But is it regulated?

[SPEAKER_02]: It's not, it's, it needs to be. [SPEAKER_02]: If it's not regulated and well, I will say this in the health care space. [SPEAKER_02]: It has to be right. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it has to, it has to be. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it has to be. [SPEAKER_02]: So health care health care is a little bit more. [SPEAKER_02]: There's a lot more tedious work than there's to be done, whereas another industry wouldn't have to be as heavily regulated on it or should be right.

[SPEAKER_02]: When you talk about health [SPEAKER_02]: on PIA, on many things, and anything that comes within that room, we have to think, okay, how can AI affect this? [SPEAKER_02]: How can AI affect the health information, the public health information? [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because thing about it like this is data. [SPEAKER_01]: The biggest thing with AI is data.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, the hemp regulations, you know, people got issues that they don't want to get out to the public, and if it gets out, people can sell that or use it for bad purposes. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: So I understand then, y'all follow the headbub, serious disorder, so like what happens if like a big breed happens and it's something that stuff gets out like can y'all you could somebody get in trouble? [SPEAKER_02]: Well, it's a little bit.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so it's on that and it happens all the time. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, fraud is a big thing. [SPEAKER_02]: Businesses lose millions of dollars.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm from health care fraud and you know within corporation and you are an adoption of AI into some of our processes like That's why it has me regularly because You just when you think about like the the number one threat to an organization is human human That human and then for all using AI more and more each day like that that needs to more human there

[SPEAKER_02]: because if you train your AI model to use a specific thing, like, okay, now I'm like, you're training it to essentially somebody else, a bad eyeker can manipulate that. [SPEAKER_02]: So you can manipulate data and with AI, it's more rapid now. [SPEAKER_02]: So I've been faster.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because I got some boys that use AI and they like, hey, they have a, like a software, like to break into a bank. [SPEAKER_01]: Like it's like, yes, you're talking to a bank, but they configured it in the way you can kind of like hack it. [SPEAKER_01]: If you exit the right question, if you know how to like the right script, you can get everything you want. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: You know.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then what you say with human error, that's why you move the bottom. [SPEAKER_01]: We ain't perfect. [SPEAKER_01]: You know. [SPEAKER_01]: Like, look at the all the AI videos coming out. [SPEAKER_01]: You know, they just didn't come out. [SPEAKER_01]: It's not. [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of people say AI and the images they come in out, you know, with different races. [SPEAKER_01]: But you got to understand, somebody had to get trained or something.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: Who put that out? [SPEAKER_01]: So, nah. [SPEAKER_02]: I didn't go by myself. [SPEAKER_01]: Like, we did this. [SPEAKER_01]: How would somebody get into the healthcare space because I noticed outside of the government, that's one of the most secure spaces that get into. [SPEAKER_01]: How would you do that? [SPEAKER_02]: So you don't, so one thing about sob security, sob security is in the entry level.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's not, you have to, you quite literally have to have, like, use of experience. [SPEAKER_02]: So it'll just experience in general, just understanding processes, like, the regulations, like, hippo, you have to understand hippo. [SPEAKER_02]: See, also, it's a framework. [SPEAKER_02]: It's an entire thing that, that's its own beast.

[SPEAKER_02]: Do, yeah, cause I. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so this is something you don't want to play with and then to him and that's but you know when the government's Plants is again if you if somebody's personal information get out there That's the even worse, you know, so yeah, like so like would be coming to like an engineer like if somebody was trying to become a Sopper security engineer or an engineer in general like how would you do it like if you was to redo it?

[SPEAKER_01]: How would you do it to kind of kind of to kind of help the better the audience?

[SPEAKER_02]: So you can take this from my tradition standpoint, like myself, or you can take it from a non-traditional to do both. [SPEAKER_02]: So I know a lot of people, you know, a lot of people when you talk about breaking in the tech, right? [SPEAKER_02]: And you break in the tech, you're coming from a non-traditional background. [SPEAKER_02]: So you're probably, okay, like, [SPEAKER_02]: want to get to this role. [SPEAKER_02]: I see this information security engineer.

[SPEAKER_02]: I want to get to that work. [SPEAKER_02]: What do I need to do? [SPEAKER_02]: Projects. [SPEAKER_02]: Start with projects. [SPEAKER_02]: Start learning. [SPEAKER_02]: You need to use AI to give you projects. [SPEAKER_02]: Use AI to become your mentor and AI can give you projects while you can give you things that you need to look into and study. [SPEAKER_02]: And I think getting into the space now is going to be a lot better than what it was when I started in 2020.

[SPEAKER_00]: You think so? [SPEAKER_02]: I think so. [SPEAKER_02]: I think it's a little harder. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so you you you you put in the work for what you want to do. [SPEAKER_02]: That's a good answer Yeah, put in the work for what you want scary now. [SPEAKER_02]: So use AI my use it a lot of people You know, we get worried when we hear about artificial intelligence all the use of generate of AI [SPEAKER_02]: Use it to assist you in your goals, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: Like I said, you can use it in mid to you. [SPEAKER_02]: Use it to help you put a portfolio we've gotten. [SPEAKER_02]: So when we talk about getting into the War of the Security Engineer, figure out, okay, you can work on some project. [SPEAKER_02]: Let's talk about log analysis, right? [SPEAKER_02]: Figure out how to use a, to teach you how to look at logs [SPEAKER_02]: And there's just as so many things that you will have to do.

[SPEAKER_02]: So that's one of the key things to do. [SPEAKER_02]: You all probably want to have some code and experience as well. [SPEAKER_02]: So I talked about Python. [SPEAKER_02]: Python is one of the users for automation, right? [SPEAKER_02]: And with the user, yeah, we'll talk about AI again. [SPEAKER_02]: That makes it easier for you because AI is so much of a tool you use. [SPEAKER_02]: All of that can be used to even help you build our scripts.

[SPEAKER_01]: Because he would probably burn myself in and I found out recently Python is kind of wanting to newer languages Yeah, yeah, like somebody living created in my food Well, it's not as old as, you know, like a C++ [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's easy for us, plus it's easy. [SPEAKER_01]: You go, you go, you have a job for a long time, you know what I mean? [SPEAKER_01]: It's like little a cobalt. [SPEAKER_01]: You've said it. [SPEAKER_01]: It got familiar with cobalt.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, we also talk about, so we talked about automation. [SPEAKER_02]: We talked about just technical skills in general, right? [SPEAKER_02]: But after it's attended, text given this past week, I'm Sonne and Brilla and I actually grew with this. [SPEAKER_02]: As much tech and cool experience that we want to have, you hear about getting these certifications, you hear about using these tools and technologies. [SPEAKER_02]: You should also have soft skills as well.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: I think for me, I've been doing this part here for a while. [SPEAKER_01]: One skill I learned among, I can talk to anybody. [SPEAKER_01]: You know, just listening. [SPEAKER_01]: This is skill. [SPEAKER_01]: I can listen to somebody, people tell you everything. [SPEAKER_01]: They need to help them from what they do. [SPEAKER_01]: So listen as a communication communication.

[SPEAKER_01]: But even dressing like, you know, how you present yourself, like, what do you think, what it feels that you think that it's the best solstice as well? [SPEAKER_02]: I would say, as a person who is a security engineer and an information security engineer, communication is going to be talked to here, right? [SPEAKER_02]: You need to be able to understand, and so if you're working, you're working cases.

[SPEAKER_02]: you're talking to technical people, you're talking to non-type and people. [SPEAKER_02]: You have to be able to explain at a high level to technical folk that understand at least a little bit about what's going on. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, this is what's going on, this is how I want to fix it. [SPEAKER_02]: So somebody doesn't non-type and cool. [SPEAKER_02]: You have to be able to make them understand that.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is what's going on, this is how we can fix it and don't do this again. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because even me, I make them a stay every now and then I got a, and that's why I like so I do get that would I be like trying to correct because I know in our field, we say the one like for example, I says from all of the other day, I was like for for for for for for for for three for for for three. [SPEAKER_01]: I was like the only protocols on mine for TCP, but that's nice.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's many other ones, but I was just thinking in a different light. [SPEAKER_01]: So they was confused. [SPEAKER_01]: And then they said, that's like, everybody came, you know, so, or you can say, hey, they told me, who told you? [SPEAKER_01]: You know, even that, that's the slightest word. [SPEAKER_01]: And you got to really slow things down. [SPEAKER_01]: And that's how burn it. [SPEAKER_01]: Just slow it down.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: Because when I used to think that's like, the faster you move is the quicker you go, [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so that's how I would do it and like would you think about like do you think like getting in the space now you got to have a personal plan Like you think that's I will say it helps. [SPEAKER_02]: I will say helps.

[SPEAKER_02]: So obviously you want to have technical skills We also talk about soft skills as well and having a brain just get your foot in on door faster So utilize link them. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, no you got your hip repository. [SPEAKER_02]: You can contribute to projects that's already out there

[SPEAKER_01]: So, well, like the thing I, I'm noticing too, a lot of people just want you to help them. [SPEAKER_01]: But you can help them, but sometimes you just don't have the time. [SPEAKER_01]: I prefer people to just like, hey, I already know what, what do you need? [SPEAKER_01]: I'll wait, you know. [SPEAKER_01]: Like, even though the day those, somebody hit me up on LinkedIn, it was like, [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, can you help me, I have an interview, you know, I need help in the cloud.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not the best of the cloud. [SPEAKER_01]: So since they told me what they needed, I just referred them to somebody and I think she's good now. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: That's what she best, it makes a lot, it makes the whole process a little bit better for you. [SPEAKER_02]: If somebody, if you actively see somebody put in the work.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I know how, and then if they see you put in the work and they see you [SPEAKER_01]: internships, work and sometimes I was like literally somebody just called you, you know, I don't think you're the part for it. [SPEAKER_02]: I literally, you're just, you, like I said, you want to get some way you got to put the work in, even though even if you've got to, you know, if the, if you're typical, I was a duty of nine or five.

[SPEAKER_02]: If you're not worth, you want to be right now, when you don't, at that far out of the night, you should be learning something. [SPEAKER_02]: In this space, in this space, you've always got to be learning technology changes each and every day. [SPEAKER_02]: I know only talk about like every two years, but essentially like in sub security, you're patching. [SPEAKER_02]: They can be a patch next week, they can be a patch tomorrow.

[SPEAKER_02]: You've got to figure out how that affects the whole system that you're working on.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like, like, even I think an opening I has at least, I don't know you for me with at least, like, they had something happen with it recently, and basically, you had a CVE or vulnerability, and a lot, you got to make sure you don't wear on that, and you can now go, so you don't have to stay on 100%, and that is an adventure, I might just start a company that just talks about trends and topics, and I know a majority of them for the come. [SPEAKER_02]: I think that'll be a great idea.

[SPEAKER_02]: When you talk about, when you talk about the CBE's critical vulnerabilities and what of the years, like that's just a part of your all-encompassing technologies or security professionals, so like a technical skills. [SPEAKER_02]: It's the soft skills that you would need, and it's also just your own like air hot research. [SPEAKER_02]: So you should always be privy to like, you know, what security is in this that just happens.

[SPEAKER_02]: So when we talk about, uh, was a cloud foot? [SPEAKER_02]: Air, often just happen. [SPEAKER_02]: You should be, if you're, if you're interested in to get into soft security, learn about somebody's security, isn't it? [SPEAKER_02]: So I actually made a video about it. [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of people say it was a cyber security attack. [SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't really a cyber security. [SPEAKER_01]: It was just a patch. [SPEAKER_01]: It was a side ramp just a patch.

[SPEAKER_02]: But it shows you how how one company can be the backbone of everybody else. [SPEAKER_01]: Because if you look at like you want a website, it says PowerFair. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and yeah, so you gotta make sure you know and that kind of mess that they brand for a lot, they good now. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, also when you attend networking events, how would you network? [SPEAKER_01]: Because that's what a lot of people trying to do now.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like, say, if you see somebody, a lot of people like to talk to these speakers, you know, I mean, even you would to test given how would you network in that space?

[SPEAKER_02]: So I'm not, like, I would say I'm not a speaker, but like, I'm talking, I'm going to you. [SPEAKER_02]: So when you go to conferences, right? [SPEAKER_02]: You, there's obviously going to be a schedule of events. [SPEAKER_02]: You pick out the particular sessions that you [SPEAKER_02]: that will actually give you some body. [SPEAKER_02]: A lot of these, a lot of conferences, you can probably just find something on YouTube right there.

[SPEAKER_02]: But like if you're intentionally looking for the specific topics at the discussion, you go there and then maybe the speakers have a little bit of time after they finish talking and they they offer you that time to go go talk to those speakers because they have the rules that you want on also raise your hand

[SPEAKER_01]: because like earned your leisure was there and all right you know I know how I don't know if you're familiar with the note or I don't know if you know but uh he's a good bits of big person in uh in this end-to-text base. [SPEAKER_01]: The one thing I respect about him I think you like 23-24 um he always raises hand he always makes sure he's known he don't care who it is. [SPEAKER_01]: So you never know that person might help you on the future too.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, so I respect that because that's how I do it when I'm trying to and I don't do it. [SPEAKER_01]: I already know who I want to talk to before I go to any event. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, I know I'm going to talk to this, this and this person I'm going on. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, if you don't want to waste, you don't want to waste your time. [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: Like, be intentional when you go network and it's just a conversation.

[SPEAKER_02]: So like, you know, that person has the off and knowledge. [SPEAKER_02]: Like, we keep off of that person. [SPEAKER_02]: What are you working on? [SPEAKER_02]: It's the way projects are you working on? [SPEAKER_01]: And it wasn't like, personally, how does your network have benefited you?

[SPEAKER_02]: I was my network benefited me. [SPEAKER_02]: Honestly, I'm a real big one community knowledge, right? [SPEAKER_02]: So somebody always has something to offer whether you're into level, whether you're senior level, or if you're like C-suite, somebody always has [SPEAKER_02]: something awful, so you type into you community, type into your resources. [SPEAKER_02]: Even if that person that's sitting right next to you, they're not working in a technical job, they know somebody that is.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right, that teacher knows probably knows somebody in tech and through that partnership or that relationship that you have with that person. [SPEAKER_02]: You go and now you move into the next step of your journey because you just cultivate that relationship with that with that other person. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and then too, you know, they see doing the work, you know, a lot of people have no somebody, but they don't want to put you out and then you make them look bad.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, even that I had that in the past, I would first somebody and then it would be like, well, Chris was going on. [SPEAKER_02]: You put your word out there and then like, you didn't really, like, you, you wrote that relationship. [SPEAKER_02]: So, it's not working, not working, it really helps, man. [SPEAKER_02]: So, yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: OK, so we're going to slowly close it out. [SPEAKER_01]: So we're working on the audience behind it.

[SPEAKER_02]: So you can follow me on LinkedIn. [SPEAKER_02]: There's Donovan, Surgeon, the ELN of the A and S U R G I C K. You can follow me on LinkedIn. [SPEAKER_02]: You can connect anytime. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm pretty open and available over there. [SPEAKER_02]: If you want to schedule a session with me at 30 minutes, you can do that. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'll send LinkedIn. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, okay. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm working on the other social media.

[SPEAKER_02]: You can follow me on Instagram as well But I'm a lot more intational with what I talk about the link then think then is where is that? [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I tell you LinkedIn anybody hey, in LinkedIn is underrated. [SPEAKER_01]: I tell you straight up You can find a lot of it and that's where everybody's at you know believe it or not so What is something that she want to leave though? [SPEAKER_01]: No, actually let me go back What is your goals for the next five years?

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, my those for the next five years, so I'm obviously want to, you know, grow and not only grow in my technical expertise, but I also want to tidy up on my own soft skills, I know I say you should, you should be actively working to something like I want to, I'm right now I'm going to tell some answers, sorry, I'm going to tell some answers, I'm pretty good at it.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I thought I was going to post messages and like I'm working on like that communication aspect being able to talk in public. [SPEAKER_02]: So that's one of my goals. [SPEAKER_02]: I obviously looking to get some certifications up in my A.I. [SPEAKER_02]: Let us see. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm actually working on a few personal projects as well at like the agency. [SPEAKER_02]: I work for local. [SPEAKER_02]: I do that. [SPEAKER_02]: That's going to be big.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, especially it's not scary. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: So I'm just just taking what I know right now and trying to elevate that and also just know, get my name on that.

[SPEAKER_02]: What is one thing you want to lead to audience work because you know a lot of people trying to get in this opportunity or just keep pushing to take it Queer on more knowledge and just push to do what's one thing you want to lead on this right Yeah, so when you when you get the opportunity because I know somebody's going to take with the value that we we discuss On the call and they're going to take this and they're going to run with it, right when you get that role

[SPEAKER_02]: stagnation needs that elimination. [SPEAKER_02]: This is technology. [SPEAKER_02]: You always gotta be working on something so I don't don't sit there and think that okay Like I'm two years in my career like I'm good now. [SPEAKER_02]: I know you're not like figure out what's the next best there? [SPEAKER_02]: Figure out what the industry is going and take that around with it

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because and I love that you said that with a lot of people don't know a lot of people say Oh, Chris you're a bit of a podcast on Chris you know how to you know build stories And put it together with they don't know it. [SPEAKER_01]: I go on YouTube watch these videos and I watch it for hours There's always one piece of information.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'll take it around with it So you got to take that information and run it with it somebody saying something a hundred times [SPEAKER_01]: You gotta at least add that point, God, and if you can pray to God, I'll ask for, uh, what a sign. [SPEAKER_01]: That's more of the sign. [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, Frank, that's your, that's your palm, that can be your palm. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so, now thank you, man, for coming over to all of you guys. [SPEAKER_01]: I appreciate you.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, especially on the Saturday, so. [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you, thank you. [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so. [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you everybody for watching the Techwork Podcast. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm Chris Freppala from Number That I Like The Video, Subscribe to the channel. [SPEAKER_01]: Say something in the comments if anything resonated to you. [SPEAKER_01]: Check out armfacademy.io if you want to learn anything about armfacademy.

[SPEAKER_01]: We'll remember everybody, get 1% better every day. [SPEAKER_01]: Peace out, I'll see you on next one.