Talkin' Cowboys: Setting Sights on Detroit

this your James con look from the Godfather? That's right, you better watch out. As I was thinking maybe with Sonny Sonny of the godfathers Ny the sunny with the vest, saying dot was he adopted? Was Sunny adopted in god was? He wasn't originally a quarter? Oh? I don't. I don't remember Tom Hagan the lawyers, lawyer kind of their guys. Sonny was the Yeah, Sonny was thank you. Yeah, that's the World Billiards Finals. I don't know which one. You're well,

we'll see what we can do. We're bringing back to vest. I wish I had that, wish I had that kind of style though it is very Chicago Heights, John Gotti, thank you. Yeah, it's fantastic. Yeah yeah, absolute plastic. You wouldn't you would be surprised how many Mafia people were residing in Chicago Heights, Illinois. Okay, yeah, way back in the day hunts. Yeah, that's we could do a whole show about that. We really could. Parcels used to send me somebody, he would send me those ones before he's

New Jersey. I'd have to go visit. We can go back into prohibition. How they were making wine in the basements. Yeah, probably really good wine. Yeah, probably that's probably the best wine, really good wine at that time. Brian brought us welcome in. Thank you, appreciate that. KENK. Garrison producing as always, and Bill Jones might join us during the show. He's got some TV obligations. They'll never start on time as per usual on Wednesday. Not ripping our TV people. No, they won't.

But no, the traffic it was awful this morning. Me twice as long to get here. Yeah, you can't pedal that, yeah, just cross, I might have done faster. Have you ever come to work on a ten speed no paper out as a kid? Oh yeah, okay, there you go. It wasn't the ten speen though, it was just an old pedal bike. Yeah. Mber, he did the push lawnmower too with the big basket. Did you have the card and the spokes? Yes, there's baseball cards. Probably something bad, little

Hopscotch mode, hot kid. Sorry, are you dropping a hint? Yeah, we're gonna get to football, and I think we're gonna move on today. We can talk about how the Cowboys can try to shake loose this rut they're inoffensively. Yeah, we can get back into that. But we're gonna mix in some Detroit Lions because they're back to practice today here at the Star and Frisco. They are getting ready for Detroit Sunday noon kickoff at at and T Stadium.

And I think it's about time to look at the next opponent and see how they can match up with those guys Detroit coming off a big win, a huge win, their first win of the season, beating the defending AFC champion Patriots. I think that shocked everybody. Oh yeah, I honestly, I don't know about you, Mick. I thought they were gonna be owing three rolling in here. The Patriots on the road usually pretty good, but Patriots saws two in a row, by the way, haven't yes, yes, so okay,

so that puts them where they're at. But one and two, yeah, one and two. But you know, with Detroit, there's kind of a mixed bag with them. You watched them against the Jets, they were awful. You watched them against San Francisco. They did make some improvement and then they found Carrie on Johnson running the football in that New England game,

so they had a little bit better balance. But defensively, if you want to focus on that, rob mean, what they're doing to you that, Because everybody seems to have a question about the Cowboys offense and how this is a defense Bill talked about. It was a defense that had plays very well in pass defense, but they're bad against the run, which is funny because they've got some really big inside guys. Now here's Matt Patricia, who is

a you know, supposedly a three to four guy. He could play hybrid, you know, four to three, and they list him as a four to three team and a lot like the Pats. Yeah, a lot like the Pats. So you're gonna get but you're gonna get some big inside players and they've drafted a couple of them here the last couple of years with a Shawn Robinson and Sean Hand those two big inside guys they're missing right now. And we don't know, Mickey, have you heard anything, I

know you'd like to read. You read the Detroit Free Press that they said anything about Ziggy once at all. Yeah, I haven't seen anything confirmed. If he's shoulder problem there, he's been out, Yeah, last couple of weeks he's missed with a shoulders probably by far the best pass rushing by far, the best pass rusher. So yeah, they've they've had to kind of work around not having him in carry. Hider has been back. He's a guy that you have to kind of be a concern with. And then the

guy they traded for Eli Harrold from San Francisco. So they've got some guys that have the ability to rush the pasture, but it's those big inside guys. So if it's if it's about trying to kind of move some bodies, big bodies on big bodies, that's what you're gonna get this weekend from this Lions matchup. You know, they're linebacker Jeron Davis that was a first round pick in the twenty seventeen draft. He's a he's a fine linebacker. He's

a big linebacker. He's a physical linebacker. He fits in what the what you know, that kind of that New England system, what they're trying to do in Detroit. He can really really run. You better make sure you account for him. He's a guy that used on the Blitz quite a bit. So cowboys in the passing situations have to be aware of twist stunts up front, a lot of movement, and then a linebacker like Davis that can that can bring a little pressure that way. You know.

The weird thing about that team is the first two games they give up seventy eight points. Yeah, and then they play Tom Brady and the Patriots and they give up ten. Yeah. So I think their offense really help helped them in this way. They turned the ball well. They also they held the ball for thirty nine minutes fifteen seconds. That was running the football. Yeah, they had they they really found some balance there. But defensively, yeah, you know, I'm going back to they still have Darius

Slay out there at corner, Diggs is at safety. Gwinn uh uh Glover. Quinn is still that, you know, so the safeties are not there, they're they're better. I don't I'm not gonna say they're great athletes. They're really banger kind of guys. If you think about the days of Okay having Cavon Frasier play, that's really kind of what I look at. You know, Diggs I think is a little bit better of a cover guy and with Quinn is more of a just come down and hitch you

kind of guy. So they'll put Digs in more coverage than they will Uh Darius Slay still playing at the corner. They've got some questions what they're gonna do at nickel. They went with this kid named Tabor who was a second round pick early in the season, and then now they've gone to this Tavon Wilson who they got from New England. That's a general manager general managers from New England,

so probably a guy they picked up there. But there's some questions about who will line up and play nickel for you there for the for the Lions, So kind of keep an eye on that if that means to get Cole Beasley kind of back going in, maybe Tavon Austin kind of match up some guys that that might be a little bit shaky with their with their coverage.

Mickey said it Tom Brady fourteen to twenty six for one thirty three, lowest total since Week seventeen of twenty fourteen when he only played one half, missed some throws, miscom guys are open. They tried to attack the middle of field what I was talking about with they try to attack it because of the safety play. The safeties are playing deep, and safeties were playing deep because they were worried about Grenkowski and they're worried about the deep

crossing routes. But they were able to get some pressure on Brady. They are able to get a little big I had to move a little bit, and then it kind of made him have to move, and so he was making some throws over the middle that they were just way way too high, really out of characteristic for the types of throws he generally makes. But that just shows you, though, a lot of pressure on the Patriots because they got down early in this game, like ten to nothing, and then and then the Lions just kept

they stayed in balance, ran their offense. Finally, it looks like for Matthew Stafford's sake, looks like they've got a legitimate running back now. They haven't really had that since a Reggie Bush, if you want to go that far. I was at Kyle Field last November when Carrie On Johnson shredded my aggies'. He's that type of guy. He did that a lot last year For Auburn, they play a lot of different backs. I mean that's their thing that they're really big on trying to use a lot

of different backs. But to me, I would just play carry on Johnson because he can he can catch the football. You know, he's the one guy you could use him out of the backfield. Uh, theo Riddics involved. Look, Garrett Blunt, I think he's seen his excuse me, I think he's seen his better days. So, but I wouldn't be surprised if you just see a steady diet of Johnson here in this football game. So why were they so bad against the Jets? I mean, I know Stafford threw four interception.

Yeah that that that turnovers really bad and plus they gotta turnover the first play of the game. Darnold throws it. He's sprints to his right and throws the ball all the way back across the field, he goes for a pick six, but the game was close to a point. And then the Jets the turnovers were just too much from what I saw with with watching that game. Well, they had trouble stopping the run against the Jets too. Yeah, I mean Crowwell kind of lit them up a little bit.

And uh yea, they gave up forty eight to the Jets, gave up thirty to San Francisco. Yeah, lost both those games. And then look, it's the strange, lady nature of this NFL. No, that's the team. Yeah, maybe it's the O and two teams where two teams did great last week. By the way, we all could we all could have retired making money bet and the uh the O and two teams last week? So you want to go with the O and three

this week? I think maybe three left Houston, right, it's one of them, Houston, Arizona, Houston playing Indie, Is that right? Something like that. I don't know. Maybe maybe I'm making the third team that I'm trying to keep. I'm trying to just pay attention to this team out here. It's got figured. They got one win, so they're not dangerous. Yeah exactly. Well, yeah, and you mentioned it, Mick. Even

in this last game against New England, Detroit averaged. They gave up four point seven yards per carry to the Pats. So I mean, look, maybe there's opportunities for Zeke and this game saddle them up. The Cowboys need more than forty plays on offense though, that's all New England got. They never got in a rhythm. Forty plays. That's extremely, extremely low, especially for a Patriots team. How do we get this team in a rhythm? Mean, it's where I was going between us. How do we get this team

in a rhythm? Do we have a you know, let's try and find some solutions here. You know, I'm I'm I'm the big proponent of trying to get number ten more involved in the fence. I wrote about that yesterday and I snapps up again. Yeah, just give me a little juice, Give me a little juice running the football, are throwing him the football? I'm you know, he you know, if Troy Aikman's telling me, this guy's better than just a toy player, I'm gonna buy Troy Aikman what he's

selling there. And I see it myself. I think we all see it with our own eyes but if we went off of what we saw in Oxnard, we saw him line up on the outside and make plays. Well, we saw him make a big play in the Giants game. I mean he's capable. I mean he made a couple. I mean the comeback or out stuff like that. Does it it mean? Does it mean can you go no huddle? Can you force? Can you force the pace here a

little bit? I think he is that a I don't know if that's if that's the answer, because I used so much like a personnel. Yeah, and I kind of liked what Zach Martin said yesterday. Yeah, it's like a lot of times when you get into ruts, maybe you're doing too much, and you pull back and say, okay, let's do a little bit very well instead of trying to do a lot mediocre. And that's and I know

that's that's counter what everybody's saying, because it's true enough. Yeah, exactly, Well what about just getting back to basics and and and doing a better job? Now? That was his point, and he said, you know, my time in the NFL or my time in college, when you struggled, maybe you pull back and just say, okay, let's reduce what we're trying to do and make it a little bit simpler

and do it well. Well, that's to Rob's point yesterday about four wide receivers, you know, find your find your best for, find what really works, find who ever Dak Prescott's comfortable with, and go with that. And I don't disagree with Zach Martin. But you're right, Mickey, Uh, you know Vick and Ventura is not going to be too happy with that. Now. It's gonna be calling us, but probably calling Zach Martin right now. What heck are you talking about? Vic, And give us a call, by the way, Yeah,

we're not exotic enough. And maybe you're trying to do too many things and you're not doing And you know the same thing with the receivers. Just what you said, Oh let's get them all involved, and you're getting nobody involved. Yeah. Yeah. But what I brought up yesterday though, is like do they know yet? Do they know have enough guys separated

beyond the two that we've talked about. We know Beasley, we know we want to get Tavon Austin more involved if we're if if we're in charge, but beyond that, like I think you brought it up yesterday. Is there a lot of separation between the rest of the group, Well to say, okay, there there isn't, but maybe you create separation by I mean I don't. I don't. I didn't bring my game stats. Did anybody have more than five targets wide receivers? Who had the most targets of

the wide receivers? Was it Thompson Beasley? The team was eight targets? Seven? Okay? And how many catches? Seven? Seven? After? No, hang on after I'm looking at the wrong game book. That was you know, I got like Mickey right now, I got way too many papers going on. I don't have my game and I didn't bring enough. Yeah, but I just off the top of my head, I don't think anybody like Michael Gallup one or four. I think

three or four. Yea one mistake and it's glaring. And if you get eight maybe, okay, you you dismissed the one mistake. When you're only getting four, you don't have an opportunity. Same thing with Blake Jarwin. Yeah, you know that was one target right turned into a hot potato interception, right, you know, So that's what everybody remembers. But if you don't get enough opportunities. You know, the who was the guy that said he was Was it TiO that he

was a volume receiver. Yeah, you have to throw him a lot of passes to catch a lot, catch a lot. That's that's nothing wrong with the volume opportunities. I got it. Beasley led all receivers on the Cowboys with five targets five three catches. Yeah, there's my point. Swim had the most. No, I'm sorry, Zeke had the most eight three catches. Swam seven targets. A lot of short stuff in that game, obviously, and some of that's the way Seattle plays. They play

like Dallas. They try to they try to shrink the field, funnel everything inside. Absolutely, but you got to take advantage of deep shots when they're there. I mean, ze Seattle targets. Yeah, yes, I know you hate and you hate the target rule. I mean where they throw aways. I mean I remember him dropping one three catches for eleven yards, stepped out of bounces, two out of bounds. That doesn't count as a target. Yeah, he caught two out of bounds if

you want to count that. You know that would have been and out of bounce on one time, and they threw him the ball on the sideline, that's right, and that should have been explosive play. The touchdown that got nullified, Yeah, that should have been one. But that's not a deep shot. That was a sense of where you are? Yeah, for sure. See when I first looked at that and I saw the play, he ran right past the is the line judge? Yeah,

whoever the dude is on the line of scrimmage? Right the dude, And I said, well, no, wonder he got called for it. He probably stepped on the guy's toes. But it was ten more yards downfield where he ran out of bounds before he caught the ball. So it's like, what are you doing? Yeah, you know, I'm just weird. Is it is? It? Really? Is it? The big place is that? It's that what's hurting us, the explosive place.

I think he's just not enough of. I mean, yeah, I think you know, I'm asking a question I already know the answer to. You need some here and there. You know, you don't have to throw nine routes all day long, but you got to be able to do what Seattle did. I mean, cowboys trying to shrink the field too. But all of a sudden there's a bust in Weston Wilson hits a fifty two yard touchdown. I mean, that's that's something you need every now and then, don't

you think? No, No, I don't disagree with you. I can't remember the last time we've seen a receiver catch a ball on the move and and really go you know that that you know that we've seen, you know, the slant routes and stuff. It seems like they catch the ball for nine and it's that's it, right, there's no there's no extension. You know, and say what you want about Dez Bryant. That was a violent runner when

he caught a slant. You don't get that extra seven, eight, ten, fifteen yards that a lot of teams get when they throw slants a guy who can break a tackle. Yeah, yeah, that's been a that's been a big problem for them. But I also you go back, you know, there's so many things, but Mickey's right about the protection. He's been saying that from the word go. You know, this offensive line has struggled with that. And when when he when they struggle, it seems the quarterback struggles, it seems the

receivers struggle. They can't get everybody playing together. They cannot get everything to work right altogether. The finish has been just horrendous. You said that Monday morning, and it was interesting that Jason Garrett I thought he echoed what you said, and you know, a different way. I mean, he said, Look, there's not one thing wrong with this offense right now. I mean you go back and watch it, and there's

something different every snap. There's something where you go cod well, oh, you know, Mickey's right, the guy goes out of bounds, the receiver drops a ball that's well thrown. You know, it ends up being an interception. You just can't. This team just can't survive any of that stuff. And when you and when when those things happen, it it leads to the fact that they're converting third downs at twenty three point five percent. Yeah. That is just like awful

second worse than the league, behind only Arizona. It's awful. Yeah, and you can't. You can't win that way, especially when it's manageable and they've had some man and now the one game, I'm okay, Carolina, we're behind the Chaine. Right to me that they weren't that much behind the Chaine, not this last not at all. No. I think they had maybe six point third downs where it was third and five or shorter. Yeah, and I think they only got two or three converted. Might be the only three

they did converted. They caught a huge break on third and six with the twelve men on the field penalty to make it third and one. This team converts third and one in their sleeps handed to Z. But what happens they don't block the mic linebacker that that they just can't have that. It's just it's it's it's those

things where it's so fresh. I'm sure that you know that Joe and Flower Mount is also disappointed watching the game and going, you know, gosh, they just don't do any You know, they don't because we're the same way. You watch it and we go back and watch it again and we're like, oh, man, I didn't notice that. I didn't know, you know, and you kind of just and you're thinking, Okay, now I understand why they're twenty

three percent on third down because they just don't. They just don't do enough to even give themselves a chance to convert and say and then the other thing is is everybody makes a mistake. All teams make mistakes. They have plays, but you have to be good enough to overcome your mistakes. And they're not there yet. No, I don't know if they get there. You know sometimes on defense they're over there. It's they can overcome their mistakes, except when you don't cover a guy on a fifty

two yard touchdown past. You know, that's kind of hard to overcome. Absolutely. Hey, guys, by the way, too, if you go back to the lines real quick. I think it's gonna be tough to sacked Stafford this week. I really do. Why that he gets the ball out of his hands so quick. I mean, it's something I was watching Mickey just made me think of that with with the way they play the receivers, you know, with a bunch formations and stuff, and they scatter and the ball,

I mean, it's coming out of there in a hurry. There. The only way that I think the Cowboys sacked this sack him is if in fact that there's a mistake on the outside or they get him, they get him to hold the football. I just don't. I just don't. I wouldn't go into this game thinking, okay, pass rush, pass rush, pass rush, because Stafford's not gonna let you rush rush him, that will and they're not gonna let

you come after him that well, So be careful. This might be one of those games with a secondary's really gonna have to hold up, you know, for them to get any type of pressure. Are you gonna have to force a jailbreak? Like if you blitz, I mean, it's got it. It can't be a blitz coming from five yards back. It's got to be linebacker up the middle that no one blocks. Yeah, there there's your there's your off the slot. There's your Jaialen Smith. For sure, there's

your jail smith. And you know they're gonna have to get vander Esh used to come in that way, but they'll get him there. They'll get him there. Probably steady diet of LVE since Sean Lee likely not to play in this game. Not sure exactly how long he's gonna be out, but I would think that this week is very doubtful. History will tell you three yeah, I mean,

especially when you've reinjured something. Now, apparently this is the other hamstring, the one that bothered him last year and had him sideline multiple games, not the one that he had a little tightness in a week ago. But it's just it's a recurring deal and we know how it is with soft tissue stuff. So linebackers got to step up in this game. They got they got the guys to step up though. Yeah, they've got they've got the bodies. They've got talent enough bodies. It's just not okay, we're

gonna throw numbers at him. They can throw numbers at him with quality there. So that's one of those positions you actually feel pretty if you lost a tight end, you'd be going, well, who's gonna you know, who's gonna step up here? You know that's well, they've got positions that They've got some positions where the quality of the position is not as good as let me see you. I say one more thing real quick, Mcam sorry port Jeff Swain in this regard, he is getting so beat

up having a run block. You know, if you're asking him to make plays down the field, I think it's going to be difficult for him because he is in a train wreck every single time he has to block. I mean he does. He's not big enough, he's not strong enough. But he will fight to the bitter end. Yeah he will. He's just he gets beat up a lot, and I think that affects his ability to get down the field and make plays. And if that's the case, then Blake Charwin and those guys need to step up

and help as well. If we have to take a break, we do. How was he going to talk about the ramifications of leaning not being in the game. Okay, let's do that. We've got one caller waiting two on the other side. Let's grab that when we come back, and then we'll get to Mickey's comments on the other side on talking Cowboys next has been helping Cowboys fans seed better since nineteen seventy two. He said, they don't miss

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you crave to talk in cowboys. Here in Cowboys Country, we always ride with our boys, but when it comes to your underwear, you definitely don't want them riding up on your boys. That's why we always wear Tommy John, the revolutionary brand of underwear with state put waste bands. They keep you everything, keep you keep everything in place. Okay, Tommy John, No adjustments needed. Shop exclusive cop But he's underwear at Tommy John dot com Forward slash Cowboys for

twenty percent off your first order. That's Tommy John dot com Forward slash Cowboys. Kind of swerving on the road there, Mick, Well, you'll do better next time. There was a lot of swerving on the road this morning. All right, let's get back on the road. Anthony and Miami. You're up first on talking Cowboys. Help us out. What's on your mind? Hey, how y'all guys doing it? We're great. Thanks. Hey, I'd like to say something. I have two comments economic that's

opening statement. Besides cowboy media and our fans, the hate for the Cowboys, the dislike this thing, and the real listening when we're doing bad is real. I just wanted to put that out. There is no question commentators say, oh my god, it's just real. But anyway, my worry is I've always been a dack. Apologies. I think I've talked to Make one time a couple of weeks ago on hanging with the boys or something. He kind of agree with me on some things. So I'm not gonna

get off that. But I have two worries the health of Sean Lee and Lawrence Man. As it appears to me they're declining a little bit, like moving forward and the fact of signing our own free agents. Not the Earl Thomas thing. I'm talking about guys like DeMarcus Lawrence, maybe a Barron Jones who after that fifth year thing. I don't know, Maybe you can help me out brought us with that. Um, I think it's time to sign him now, actually or whatever? Can we lose those guys?

Do you think because you know, if I'm losing or something like that, because of that attitude or whatever, they might not be willing to sign with the Cowboys. I'll go here and listen to you guys on that. Thanks for the call. I don't quite understand the question. No, he's asking. He's saying he'd like to sign Lawrence and Byron Jones if he could, He'd like to You liked it.

He's worried that the fact that the Cowboys are not playing well enough and there might be some change, you know, going forward, and we again, we got to play the season out and see what happens. But he's worried about you know, do you try and get these guys done now or did they just say, you know what, We're gonna wait and see what happens with the team at the end of the year. See. I think that's why you don't go crazy signing toys that maybe are as

portent as keeping your own guys like DeMarcus Lawrence. And if Byron Jones continues to play the way he has, Yeah, you want him back, sure, sure, you want him back, Now, what's the market value? And you know the same thing that happened with Hitchens. You let him go out and test it and you found out, oh, somebody valued him financially a lot more than than we did. You know, give him a five year, forty five million deal with

fourteen million guaranteed. And you're sitting there going, well, I can't do that because I've got all these other things I gotta take care of. So yeah, I think that's why you don't go crazy and say, well, I got salary cap money, now I can spend it. Well, do you have it next year in the year after that? That's what you have to look down the road. App Can I ask a question I'll try and give an answer to with this question? Do you think this? Do

you think this? The spending of the offensive line was premature? Is that something that's gonna hamstring them Mickey for coming contracts? I mean, if for Lawrence or for a Jones. I mean I understand trying to do Smith. I understand trying to do Martin Frederick. You know, but you got three guys. Should the thought had been one guy? Should the guy have been two guys? It's a lot sided up in

one position. But they you know, they originally did it because they had Tony Romo and they wanted he mentioned Smith, Yeah, he mentioned Smith. He signed that one years ago, didn't long that was a long, long term deal. Yeah, Martin's the only one. I mean, you're weren't going to let him go right whatever? To No? Uh, I thought Frederick's

was a reasonable one. Right. And when when they signed Smith, it was like it was such a long deal, it was so spread out that I don't know that hamstrung you and they when they really did Leo Collins, he didn't get a heck of a lot. Sure, and it is a lot of money in one area of your second round pick doesn't get a heck of a lot, right, So see, I'm just I'm just wondering about and again, they all have money to do what they need to do next year. Okay. If that's the case, then do

do you feel like do you feel like that? Do you feel like that? I agree with you, by the way everything you said, I agree. Uh. You feel like though, that with the they'll be able to Well I'm trying to think about this. Does it make more sense to go for one or the other. That's what I'm saying, I mean, do you go for the pass rusher or do you go for the guy that can cover? If you had to do one and you say maybe, Mickey, you're right. I'm not going to dispute what you're saying.

But if you think you have enough money to do both, I know that's always an option. This crew figures out ways to do. But if you if you had to do one, which way would you go? I think I would lean towards the pass rushers. But the pass rusher is going to cost you north of probably seventeen million? Am I right about that? Mickey? Probably? And the corner is going to cost you siwhere prim in between eight and ten you have to be Yeah, and again which

one you don't want to find a chance? The pass rusher because you don't have anybody to take a spot. See you thought maybe that, Randy Gray, But you can't. You can't hope, you can't do that. You can't do that. Which, by the way, we got a little more. I don't know if it was accidental clarity on his penalty. Evidently they were talking to him the old the whole game, okay, making fun of him. They drew him off side, and he finally said enough, He finally busted. Yeah, he said enough.

I think Crawford mentioned it. They were in his ear the whole game. He said. It wasn't just one thing, he said, they were really going after but off the field stuff. And so that's my assumption that makes sense. He'd had enough. Still, man, gosh, just hold yourself together there. Yeah, it's not worth it, you know. But but you know, and I told I told I guess I could say this, right, I was telling Rob yesterday. When we were in high school. You know, our football team, our enrollment in our high

school was twenty five percent African Americans. Sure, we played in my sophomore year some all white teams. Oh yeah. And the head coach, it's tough for the games, would point out, they're gonna use words that you don't want to hear. But you better control yourself. You just play harder, don't react. That's fair. And that was that was the message before those games. And you know, I know what you know what happens on a football trust me, right

and all the sports. I mean, it's it happens in the NFL, and you know, and it's one of those it's it's and there's no there's no boundaries, right, no boundaries everything. Everything's game. It's extremely competitive and whatever it takes to get an edge. Sometimes there's lines crossed and

that's that's a huge fishing yards. But again on that on my finishing my point, yes, better off, but no, no, you're okay, better off finding better easily to find Jordan Lewis, Anthony Brown, someone like that as opposed to finding another Do you feel do you feel okay? Just talk about backups real quick? Yeah? You feel better about Anthony Brown and Jordan Lewis as potential starters for Byron Jones? Or do you feel better about Taco Charlton being that you're

starter at left defensive end? That's that's what to avoid it. I have to see more. I like what Taco's done so far. Yeah, he has not shown that he's DeMarcus Lawrence. Yeah. Yeah, And I although they're both Marquis positions, I think the pass rusher in this game is more in this day and age is more value. I don't disagree with what you guys are saying. I gotta have the war daddy, Yeah yeah, and it's gonna cost me north. I know it's gonna cost me North to seventeen. I just know that.

And you could franchise him again, but I don't think anybody's happy doing that. So I think that I think things would be a lot worse for him. I think he accepted this one, right. I don't think you might have a situation that happened with it's going on in Pittsburgh right now. He wants, he wants a long term security. Everybody does. Yeah, well he's got to have now. And if you franchise him, it's not what the franchise tag is. He's got to have. What is it's I thought it was.

It's an incredible more than what he made exactly exactly. So you're looking at North of seventeen again, so you're looking at in the twenty in the twenties. Yeah, to me, I man that I think you have to if you gave me a choice, you said, between him and Byron Jones, I'm signing the defensive end. And I love what Byron Jones has done through for three weeks. I think he's the one guy that has bought in completely to what is going on in that secondary. You know. Yeah, he's

a different technique. Yeah, Chris Richard's asking him to play, and I think it goes with his game so far. Yeah, now we're going to find out, oh, this weekend, this is the best quarterback Dave played. That's right. Yeah. But rodn Arronelli said something interesting last week. He said, you know, asked about would you ever consider moving him back to safety? And he said, he's an a player where he is right now, you move him again, That probably dips a

little bit. Yeah, Like that's they feel like this is his spot, and especially in this style that Richard is bringing here. Yeah, I think that's. I think that's clear that he, like I said, he's the one guy that really has bought into Hey this is you know, I need to play this way. I'm going to play the technique. And you know he's he's it's shown that he's how much he really does care. A good question by the way by the guy from was it Miami? Yeah, Yeah,

good call, good call. Keep keep those calls coming. Two nine seven. Back to the defense, Mick, you had a Sean Lee discussion. Comes So I think they're much more prepared from a physical standpoint to play without Sean Lee because we know what happened last year. Absolutely it was Owen six in the games that he either didn't play

or didn't finish. Um, my concern is somebody, Jalen Smith has to step up and take over the leadership role, right, Somebody has to help make the adjustments, help get everybody lined up. And I don't know that you can put a value on how much Sean Lee does that. So I wrote about that yesterday. The communication aspect alone. Part of it is the play, but a lot of it is just him being out there letting everybody know here's what's going to happen before it happens. The instinctual player,

and I don't think Lv's he can play. I don't think he's ready to take that on. So now Jalen Smith has to step up and be that guy he's had. He's had really three years in the system now it played for but because he diagnosed things as well as Sean Lee, that's what you lose. I think when he's

not in there, that's what worries me. You lose that third and three and they run the waggle and everybody's flying out of there and Shaun Lee just on his own just goes flying through the B gap and makes a tackle for the loss of four, you know, like it happened in the I remember this in the Philadelphia game one year where they they try and run. They're trying to run a play where Carson wentz that he runs the waggle of the boot and he gets the outside.

They are a flip or something where all of a sudden, the plays going sideways. Chaun Lee makes a tackle and it knocks him out of field goal range. You know, that's the kind of That's what you're probably gonna miss right there. I always ask for you know, I was trying to get Mickey to trade for for that guy in Seattle. I was trying to get him to trade for him, and and but because I wanted somebody to help when this all broke down, I wonder if Chris Rochard is the guy to hold this team together, to

hold this defense together. And the only reason I thought about it was is because I remember the sideline rant he hadn't it in preseason where he had everybody around him in the second half the game, the backups weren't doing very well and he just went off. I mean, he went off on everybody on that bench. And when at Kinston a great job this is producing on the fly right here. I'm sorry if you're not watching this today,

but this is what I'm talking about. That is that is that my guy holding this thing together for Sean Lee from an accountability standpoint. I you know, I asked you guys the other day, who's the most important you know, with Sean Lee being out, who's the one guy that's going to make everybody accountable for the for the how they played defense? And I wonder if that guy that we just saw on the screen again, I'm sorry, as Chris Rashard just losing his mind on the sidelines, but

is that the guy that you know? Okay you is? Mickey said, yeah, you need you need those linebackers to play well, but you also need somebody else to kind of make sure that everybody's playing well. Is that? Am I? Am I stretching now? Am I stretching it there? Or am I? And there's only really two guys that I think have enough cred on the defense to do that.

Crawford maybe Crawford DeMarcus Lawrence. And DeMarcus Lawrence can be a little more out spoken than you know, but again, it has to be somebody that's on the field playing playing, not a rotation, you know, and they take DeMarcus out and then bring them in, and same thing with Crawford. You know, I think you're right. I think you both are right. I just don't know if Jalen Smith has

got that perceptible doing that. Maybe this it would be a great question for him, you know, asking hey listen, I mean, you know, leadership role, and so sometimes I gets what's the identity of the team, you know that question. The guys in the secondary are all kind of still trying to make their way. See that's why like Earl Thomas to me, makes sense for that for that perspective.

But maybe it's not Earl Thomas. Maybe it's Earl Thomas's former coach, that's the one that every time they come off the field that he's in somebody's face about, Okay, this is what we gotta do this, you got to you gotta hold this together, you gotta you know, because Sean Lee was kind of the guy. But to your guys point, the person on the players on the field are the ones. Ultimately they're gonna be the ones to you know, make the plays and be accountable for what.

Neither of the neither none of the safeties. You know, I don't think they have the personality, neither one of the yell and scream. The corners aren't going to do it right. They got enough problems on their own on the outside. I mean, it has to be one of the linebackers and you know, or the defensive tackle or the tackle. Yeah, yeah, I mean maybe he has to be the guy. But but somebody's and it's not yelling and screaming, it's right, just making sure everybody knows what

they're doing, diagnosing things. Yeah, and yeah, I'm with Brian because Mickey talks about this like there's a playbook of reporter questions to ask sure leaderships one of them and accountability. But tv TV loves the what's the identity of the team coach? You know, and you're like, oh, god, dang what we're scrambling to save our butts from being bitten off? But how many times have we seen it? Though? With Sean Lee, if he's been out the defense falls apart,

it's a valid question. And so you know, was he on the field when the when the protection broke down on the one touchdown pass the second I don't think he gotten hurt yet that he was when they went on the long drive. He missed some of them. He missed the long drive they had in the second half. But I think he was out already in the second quarter. They had taken him out. I think I would see when I saw his helmet not in his hand. The first thing I thought it was concussion because he'll wear

his helmet on the flat. When I thought they if they've taken his helmet, I'm thinking concussion. And then you reported Robert wrote from the press box that that he had the hamstring problem. And I'm like, going, okay, this is concussion. You could kind of and I'm not trying to play with somebody's brain, but concussion you can kind of say protocol one day, two days, three days, Oh, okay, he's okay, ready to go. But these hamstring with Sean Lee is just we we know it's it's gonna be

something that's going to cost himself. It's going to be at least I've bet two games. We're going yeah, and I and I was told that, you know, we're gonna have to be more conservative this time. That's always the way when it happens again, and you can't listen to him to force himself back on the field. Can they be any more conservative with him? And that's the thing, and that's the shame. They're just saying, Hey, Sean, they have,

but they might have rushed him back this time. I don't know if they rushed him or he rushed himself back with the opposite. Because it's hard to test a hamstring, isn't it. You gotta kind of stand Yeah, But I mean, here's a guy who brings his own bed on the road, you know. I mean, basically, he does everything he can to get ready. They kind of bubble wrapped him in preseason. It's just it's unfortunately, something he's his body deals with now as he's moved on through his career. And it's

both hamstrings, unfortunately that he's had to deal with. It's not just one. And it's not something you go in and surgically fix, yeah, unless it's torn. Yeah, And I don't think it's to that ox now, I don't. But that's the reason why they spend a first round draft pick on a lineback. Absolutely, And that's what they're gonna have to do continuency wise this week. See and I and I you know, if you follow along in the

Draft show. We talked a lot about DJ Moore, we talked a lot about Calvin Ridley, we talked about all those guys. Yeah, those would have been great picks, but they, in my opinion, did the right thing. Knowing the situation with Sean Lee, like Mickey said, they were oh in six and games that he didn't what didn't finish or was not a part of you have to you can't let your defense fall apart like that, And they did

the right And I think this guy can play. And I think the more he plays, the better he plays. I think we've seen that, and I'll be interested to see because thirty three snaps that was the most he's played so far in the first three games. How much that helps him going into this game because we see his ability, his lateral movement and and maybe what Brian was saying about how they like to get the ball out quick and you know, okay, well you need somebody

to close on that stuffquickly. He seems to do that quickly, So be interesting to see what if he takes the next step. All right, let's take our final break eight eight eight, five five two two ninety seven. If you want to join the show and we'll be back in a moment on talking Cowboys. If you're like me and you love I mean, if you have a thing, then cutting the court is scary. But then I found out I could switch to direct TV Now and still get

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us a little help. You don't need it in your vest? Could you look great? But I need a lot of help. We're gonna use this Jack Black stuff. Do you want to use with the pros? Use? Jack Black is official mens scare brand of the Dallas Cowboys. Get your Jack Black playmaker. When need some playmakers, Jack Black, maybe they can help them with some offensive playmakers. Four JB Favors says are Jack Black Faves plus a full sized lip bomb for just ten bucks for free shipping at get

Jack Black dot com. Use your code Cowboys to save you on your Jack Black product. What do you say about it? Brian? If you got old man face, got yeah face, you've got old man face. That Jack Black will help you a lot. I think I used four of the products this morning. Oh yeah, na, what do you got shampoo? Used the four faves? Yeah, Nicky's a playmaker. Yeah, what do you use? Shampoo? Shampoos, soap? There was I ran out of that there was a facial scrub that

works beardlube, beardlube, and then a moisturizer afterwards. Yeah, it's great. Yeah. I used the three and one every day every day. They've got like a lot of product though, a lot of different product. The point where you're going, I'd like to try that. You do, and it's coming on and then and then they have something else. So the next thing, you know, you have to have in your your cabinet a whole jack black section just of stuff I got by spread out all over the place. You're not Bill Jones.

Don't be that bad. Yeah, tidy up a little bit. Yeah, don't be Bill Jones. I'll have to do that tonight quickly. One roster move yesterday or a couple actually. The Cowboys played Dayton Jones, defensive tackle on injured reserve. He was coming off a knee injury in the game string had a hamstring in the game. Had a knee injury early in the season. Karen read his back. They liked him. Yeah, had a nice preseason finale showing a couple of games he played pretty well for him. Just getting him off

the street. So no one picked him up. No, he's a five year guy. So I'm surprised nobody gave him a shot, but boy, he was super active. Now they gotta figure out what they're gonna do because I don't I wonder if he's gonna play the one because that's what they use with Dayton Jones. Now because remember next week, yes you know, and they have to make a roster move. Yea, they have to make a roster at him eligible to play. But for this week at least, you know, MALIEK. Collins status,

we're not sure if he can get back. This week, he was on the field working with the associate athletic trainer Britt Brown day hopefully to trying to get closer. He traditionally doesn't miss games, but he missed one last week. Yeah, he usually plays three. That was his first one. That's his first one. Yeah, you're talking about an MCL. Those can be kind of hamstring type things. Multi deals. Oh, it's usually two to four right, yeah, right, So we'll

see you on his status as well. Jason Garrett's coming up in about fifteen minutes live on Dallas Cowboys dot Com after our show. For guys like us, it's three butts. Yeah that's right, Boots and yeah, all that kind of stuff, right, Crutch, All right, let's go back to the phone lines and visit with our good friend coach John and Lufkin. It's been a long time since you joined us, coach, welcome back. Yeah, a long time times. I can get out, oh we need more line that means that kind of means business

is good for us. But it's still good to hear from you. Yeah, thank you. I wanted to say, I'm not as worried about the offense of a lot of people saying to be by need to get this kind of a round pretty soon. But the problem is not talent. You can't fix talent. The problem is execution and mental mistakes, and that can be fixed. Now they're gonna have to fix in a hurry. But that's what I wanted to say. Okay, okay,

appreciate the call. Coach. Oh, Darney hung up. I was going to ask him about the offensive line, but he's got a good point. I mean, just think of the plays we talked about. Had they been right, you know, have they not made mistakes? Somebody picks up Bobby Wagner, No, one step out of bounds, don't drop a ball. Those things just change everything. So dramatically, you know, and even

I mean this didn't affect the offense directly. But if if you don't get the BS roughing the passer call on the first series, they're punting from the end zone, yeah, and you're going to get the ball at the fifty yard line instead of them punning at the fo forty nine in getting the ball at what five ten? It just changed one play like that just changes so much. I use the example of Byron Jones on the you know at that hole, the whole that was a thirty

three yards wasn't a good hold. Please tell me he held him. He got knocked down, He got really run over, is what happened. So you know it's on the opposite side of the field, No need to do that. And you're right, make you even just fair catch these things. But if you got Tavon Austin back there, why not

give it a go? I understand that was thirty three yards of field position right there, and that's think about this team just trying to get thirty three yards on a drive, you know exactly, that's three first downs at the right they're going so in anything, you know, and you know, I think coach is right you know, we pass a lot of blame, a lot of judgment. I'm guilty of that, I really am. Stop talking about. But also but I also know that the execution the finish

has just been horrendous, horrendous for them this year. You know, And there was some defense you saw with the defense didn't finish the other day. Give up, they give up two bad plays. But other times, you know, that's but in a game, that's sometimes that's all it takes. Yes, these games are so those were really two evenly matched teams the other day. It's just that one team had had better breaks in the way the way it worked out for him. There were a couple of picks off

tip balls, tip ball picks. You're talking about a guy going out of bounds, you talking about a drop, you know, you talk all these kinds of things, you know, busting coverage. You know, they busted the coverage of the guy wheeling out of the Backford pro sides for nineteen yards. And that play and then the next play where they do they hit you with a dagger down the middle, you know, with in a single high look. So they blitzed on that play. Yeah, did they get caught or was somebody

supposed to peel off because there were no linebackers. And it was funny, Mickey, because when I wrote about it on Sunday night, I thought that maybe it was one of those fire zone bits where they blitzed the inside linebackers through the A gaps and then they dropped the end, which just means it was Lawrence. But when you go back and watch it, they were in that special front where they had Lawrence at tackle and on the outside of him as Taco, And so now you're thinking, and

here they are there, they're Russian linebackers. They've got Taco playing the left defensive end, they got Lawrence playing inside at defensive tackle, and Procis is in a wing. And as soon as they as soon as they as Russell Wilson saw the blitz inside, he knew exactly where he was going with the football, and everybody else was in man coverage line. There was no linebackers there, and it might have been one of those things where they, you know,

give them credit for calling the right play. It's like got you, yeah, and they led it up, they dialed it up and it worked. That was their answer for the blitz. You know, get the ball out quick they you know, and nobody was there to make up for the and some I'm thinking, okay to Taco, not drop in the fire zone, you know, but we've seen him blitz everybody and just take a chance on getting on. That's that's a bad break right there, because if you get home, maybe he doesn't get the ball out to

that game. Because Taco came free. Yeah he did. As I remember, Taco was trying to run. Looked like Mickey a twist, looked that they were trying. He was going down inside. He came inside, but lords didn't move. So now it made me think, oh, Taco, Tacco, you find it busted a couple there, Yeah, because the linebackers couldn't get there and safeties were too far away. Everybody was in man carriage on the back end. Yeah. So but that's you know, okay, you got me, yea. You know,

they need to dial up some gotchas on their own office. Yeah, and maybe dial up some some takeaways. You can't dial those up. Sometimes you got to be in the right spot, like Earl Thomas was a couple of times in the game. That's one reason why he is as great of a player as he is. For Seattle, sure, but they've had some chances in the first three games. No pick yet.

I think a couple of fumble recoveries. Talking about you know, like you said, thirty three yards makes a big difference, A short field makes a big difference for this offense. Right now, Well, yeah it is. We talked about the thirty three yards and what happened. You give them five more back your balls on the nine yard line and then and then you get the tight end jumps off side. So now you lose. Now, now you've lost thirty seven yards a field position, you know, because of the half

of the distance to the goal. But yeah, it's just it's it's unfortunate the turnovers. I think the turnovers will come as long as they could keep the pressure up. You know, you just haven't. Eli Manning didn't. I was surprised he didn't throw you at least two. You know, he's always good for two interceptions a game. You know, this cat, I don't know. I mean he now the last time they played here, they got after him pretty well. But I think this is a different team they like,

I say, they have more balance. The receivers, I think are the way they run them with the bunch formation stuff make you have to chase you know if I don't know if you'll get turnovers from this guy, but if you do, man, it'll be a huge bonus. But he threw, he threw several game and maybe he got him all out of his system. But you know they passes down the field too. Yeah. Yeah, some of them

were like, huh, well you did what. Hopefully you continue the pressure because I think if you keep the pressure up, you keep the blitzing up, you'll get some interceptions. You will get some interceptions. What you got, Mick, I was gonna look up what their turnover deal was? Who the Cowboys? No Detroit, Detroit. I mean, I know they had the four, But what happened in the other Oh, it should be in this little stat right here, turnover margin Lions minus

four tied for thirty first in the NFL. Right now, Cowboys or minus two. Either they didn't get any or they haven't made anymore. The first four I don't remember looking at any on tape that were any Yeah, they had a oh other than the first game that they had to pick six. Yeah, that was the only the only one I remember seeing that was that was a turnover someone through them, So we'll see good comes the game. It will. I mean again, I think you look at

this early and I think it's probably evenly matched. Both both tasks have strengths and weaknesses, and you know who plays the more efficient football game. We'll find out on Sunday. What's the line? I don't know. I don't worry about those I don't either, but it just occurred to me. We're all we can now, bet can't we not us? Not us that everybody out there listening, Ken, Yeah, let us know and and keep hearing from us or you know, calling us in this week. We've got a few more days,

two more days of talking cowboys to break this thing down. Bill, we'll be back tomorrow and we'll have another good show. Let's go in there and see if he's working. Yeah, I'm sure he is. He's a busy He's a busy TV man, can't Thanks for producing. We'll see you guys on Thursday. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club.