Talkin' Cowboys: Roster Battles Take Shape

presented by American Airlines. Is Training Camp twenty twenty one rolls on here from the West Coast alongside Mickey's Bag Nola, Rob Phillips, I'm Kyle Yeoman's where we are just thirty one days away, gentlemen, one month pretty much exactly from kickoff of the twenty twenty one season and that Week one matchup with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. That's a Thursday

night football game. But we have Thursday night football and a little Saturday afternoon football to talk about for the first time here on Talking Cowboys, because the last time we had a show, we were leading into the Hall of Fame game against the Pittsburgh Steelers, and then we haven't had a chance to catch up since the Saturday practice against the Rams, and like Mike McCarthy, said Rob. It was a week one and a half really of preseason football for this Cowboys team, and it was a

beneficial one at that. Yeah, I mean because of that in part, you know, they're they're giving the guys basically three days off. You know they're going to have a walkthrough tomorrow, but mostly just kind of weight room work and film work today to clean everything up because it's I mean, that was a quick forty eight hours when you think about what they had to do going up against two teams, not live against the Rams, but but

some good work. You know, Mickey and I were at the twenty fifteen joint practice out here against the Rams and that was like a barroom brawl at time. This one was like a pillow fight compared to that in terms of some of the skirmishes. But I think you said it before we went on, like it was just the right amount of physicality. You know, there were a couple of dust steps and all that, but it wasn't anything where anybody I think was at risk of getting hurt.

And when you go up against the team that's been to the super Bowl and the team has got some swagger, like that's that's a good little test early in camp, and I think we forget sometimes that we're early in camp. They've had five six padded practices. That's it. One preseason game. Yeah, they're wrapping things up here in Oxnard this week. But there's still a long way to go. Yeah, Mike should have get have named a movie. Right, forty eight hours.

He kept talking about forty eight hours. And it was a good forty eight hours. Eddie Murphy. Yeah, and uh, you know, and and I thought, I like what he said. He said, this team improved a lot over the last forty eight hours, and I'm really excited about that. And I think, you know, it was a quick turnaround from as Rob said, you play on Thursday night in Canton, Ohio. You show up here Friday at five in the morning, and then by Saturday at three o'clock you're practicing against

the Rams. So they content they put a lot of stuff into a short period of time. And you know, I thought it was good. I thought the guys responded. I thought he regulated their snaps very well, didn't use the first line offensive guys that much on Thursday. But they played on Saturday. So Tyrn Smith's out there, Leale Collins out there, Zach Martin's out there. You know, that offensive line looked the way it was supposed to look. I thought that was huge. It's huge for Garrett Gilbert

to get some protection and actually operate the offense. And then defensively, I thought, you know, they kind of held their own against the Rams. They played their pop quarterback Matthew Stafford was out there slinging it around. We weren't sure how much he was gonna do after he kind of irritated his thumb that had been bothering him. But he was out there and he was slinging it, and you know, he completed some passes, but they broke up some passes, uh, to the point that at one point, uh,

DeShawn Jackson got p owed uh because of um. I think it was Jordan Lewis like broke up a pass and and he came up and he swung at the air and it's like, oh, okay, I guess he's pissed. And then he plays later they connected on about a forty yard touchdown plays, you know, and and he got all fired up about it. But that's good. You gotta go against guys like that. And I thought it was

really good work. Uh, and as Rob said, they were off yesterday, but they're just basically doing meetings and weights and stuff today and then the walk through tomorrow, uh and and more meetings and so really just one more practice here, right, they're supposed I think they're supposed to do something maybe Thursday before they actually leave. Correct. I think it's gonna be like a we won't be able to we won't see it. Doubtful it's much of anything, because they got a game the next it'll be a

meeting on the field. Yeah, and they've got a mock game walk through tomorrow, which I think we get to take a peek at, yes, which we have not done so far in camp. So that's it's not excited about that. Yeah, it's something what are we gonna do with ourselves for three days? Right? The cards and the bonnuts will come out. But yeah, I mean you said, oh boy, I guess he's pissed. I said that about Aaron Donald about three or four times in that practice on Saturday. So how

about Connor Williams, the People's champ. Yes, fans are loving this, like, you know, not backing down from two time Defensive Player of the Year winning some reps against him in order to get him to kind of the edge of being a bit frustrated. Yep. And I think Donald was trying to say, hey, don't you know who I am? Well, I mean, if you if you go back and watch some of the times they've played the Rams, he he's

done some good things against him. And I know, you know the knock people knock Connor Williams for maybe his strength and sometimes he gets overmatched a little bit physically at the guard position. But I thought that was a good example of him holding his own in some of those reps because you know, Jalen Ramsey, Aaron Donald, those are two of the best players you're ever gonna go

against the season that their respective position. So, like Mickey said, like that, that is good quality work against somebody beside your own guys early in camp. And kind of to add on to that, it wasn't even just the offense that got great work against defensive players. I mean, outside of Tom Brady and maybe Aaron Rodgers, Matthew Stafford is up there in terms of quarterbacks that can pick a part of secondary no doubt, with the way that he controls a game and he throws the football and his

talent level and his IQ of the game. And I think that was a great task for guys going up against Robert Woods, Cooper, cub Deshaun Jackson with Matthew Stafford throwing then the football. I think the Cowboys secondary really grew a little bit on Saturday, Mickey, because that's not necessarily what they've seen with guys like Garrett Gilbert and

Ben di Nucci a quarterback. Maybe with Dak in the middle of practices, but Matthew Stafford and those three guys were a great new challenge, and I think the defense grew from it. See, and that's one of the downsides of Dak being out. You know, you look at all he's not working with the offense, he's not working with the receivers, while the defense is not getting to work against the top notch quarterback. And you would like to see that. And yeah, and I thought they got some

good work against him. They made some plays. He got them a couple of times. You mentioned a cup, they lost him, tracked of him a couple of plays, and it's like, yeah, number ten, you bought it might pretty good cover him, right, But but other than a few times like that, I thought the secondary played well at times. The defensive front got a little pressure on him, and the Rams offensive lines pretty good. So it was good work for Randy Gregory to go up against somebody else

door AND's armstrong. Uh So yeah, I just thought it was a really good day of work for them. And like Rob said, other than the little dust up with Aaron Dontal and Connor Williams, Yeah, it was a yeah, it was and it got competitive and that was good because that's what you want to see because this team needs to gain you can't be like swagger confidence. You got to gain confidence that you can do this right. And I think that helped. I think it helped playing

the game on Thursday, and and it helped again uh Saturday. So, as Mike McCarthy said, good forty eight hours, it was. We were laughing about the picture on Dallas Cowboys dot Com of the of the dust up with Connor and Aaron Donald and there's it's a wide shot and you can see Dak like ten yards away in the end zone just kind of watching kind of look at it was like, oh, it's like yeah, just stay stay over there, stay over there. You guys, don't go anywhere. Guys take

care of this. I'll just kind of go go stand behind the porta patio over there by the fence, and you know, everything will be okay. Actually, see the lamp said the same thing. He's like, I just go the other way. If it's two linemen going at it, what

am I gonna do? You know? So, yeah, that was good. Um, but that Rams till I'm telling you you look at this early projection of the NFC, and obviously Bucks Packers, Aaron Rodgers back, the Rams are gonna be in the conversation with no doubt about it because they've got you had Matt stafford to that group and what they have defensively, They're they're gonna be in the mix if they can stay healthy, even though they're dealing with an injury at

running back themselves. And that was a good point about Dak because if you look at the it wasn't a dust up. It was a brawl amongst themselves, the giants. Daniel Jones jumped in there, did he? Oh yeah, he was one of the headlines, and and and and and that was some of the backlash after It's like, okay, yeah, I understand, I'm the quarterback. I'm not supposed to go get involved in it. It's like, yeah, you think, it's like, what are you gonna do? It was almost like what

we saw later in practice. There was another little scuffle. It never got nearly to the point of the Aaron Donald and Connor Williams dust up, but Tony Pollard, with a carry to the near sideline, was kind of in a tussle with Kenny Young, the young linebacker from LA and Young. It looked like they got a little tangled up on the sideline after the play, and Young actually threw hands at the face mask of Tony Pollard, and

Pollard of course reacted accordingly. And Sean McVeigh was the one that got in between and that one, and so I thought that was kind of interesting as well. But you know, and they they they roughed up Pollard a couple of times early in the practice, and it was uncalled for because they had already thudded up. And then somebody came from his blind spot and just blasted him. There were a couple of those ladies. See, I don't think he decided, okay, that's enough. I was on set

with Kyle for most of the broadcast. When I got out there a team. There were times when we were watching kind of the red zone seven on seven stuff, it didn't seem like it was just full competitive. It was I'm not saying half speed, but it wasn't as

as live or close to live you might expect. And then the team's drills though, were really good, really good, and there were some times out there where there was maybe a little more excess physicality from the Rams in terms of the thud that Mike and they chose who they were going to hit because they didn't do that to Zeke. Yeah, right, but when they saw twenty and thirty four and thirty seven, it was like it was like open game, right, and it's like, okay, I know

what's going on. Defense had their fair share of licks on guys like Darryl Henderson as well, and I think they did a nice job of covering Robert Woods. But I do want to stick with the offense here. Going back to the offensive line, I thought the work from the offensive line and what they showed against a good Rams defensive front, especially with Aaron Donald in the fray, for the most part, held their own with Aaron Donald out there, and if Aaron Donald was out there or

was not out there. I felt like they were pretty good, to say the least. It wasn't even just average or holding their own. I thought even some of the second and third string offensive lines really showed out on Saturday, Rob What did you see from the offensive front and the reps that you got to look at? Yeah, No, I thought it was good. Um. Like you said, I thought, once you get once you get them the group whole,

they can be very productive together as a group. And and so they've they've kind of been missing that full five at times. In practice. They've been holding Zach Allison reps. They've been holding h Tyrn Smith at times. And Connor Williams we mentioned him earlier. He got some center reps with the first team, and that's that's gonna help him get better at that position, even if he's not projected as the starter there. I know that people are talking

about what does this mean. They're trying to find depth at that position, They're trying to find a backup plan with Tyler Biadis, you know, going into a second year and Joe Looney not being here. I thought that was good work for him. And so, you know, offensively, they did a lot of good things Ceedee Lamb carried over what he's been doing out here to this practice with another team going at him out here in oxen Hard and I thought it was Michael Gallup's best practice a

camp as well. I think, you know, if if if people want to know what does that mean, all they need to be asked is who's the backup center? Because they won't have an answer. But you know what I mean, No, I know what they're thinking. You know, I know what they're thinking. See it in practice, be honest. Is really good by the way, Yeah, and he's doing nothing wrong to the point they need they need a backup center.

And if they can pull this off with Connor Williams, then not only do you save money against the salary cap, you save a roster spot on the game day roster because you don't have to have one guy a backup center and another guy the backup guard. But if you can get somebody to do two things like they got spoiled with with Joe Looney being backup center, backup guard, and you only have to keep seven offensive linemen up. Uh, yeah,

it's it's beneficial. Now will it work? And they were not going to find out if it works until they give him some first team reps against a first team defense. Uh and see if he can if he actually can pull this off, because we saw in the in the in the Hall of Fame game, he had a high snap one time and it's screwed up to play, and then another time he threw a knuckleball back there. I didn't think that the snap was ever gonna get to

Garrett Gilbert. Right And and speaking of Connor Williams, he's walking towards his room right now, conn And uh so, yeah, he's gotta you know, he's got to get used to keep yelling about those high snaps. Yeah right, yeah, come and squash me right, Oh goodness. But yeah, so he's got to get those reps and see if he can do it, because if he can't, then who's the backup center? Well, if Arni act doesn't at times look like he's ready physically to do this, I think it's safe to say

he's not physically ready as a seventh round rookie. Would you expect him to be? Now he was playing guard. He played a little center at Nebraska, tiny bit, Yeah, and they moved him over there, and we'll see if you can do it and then Braylon Jones is an undrafted rookie from Houston, right, I thought it would be potentially Connor McGovern just based on how much he played. He played center at Penn State way more than farni Ac or Connor Williams had one year though, I know,

but he's done it. And that's why last year I thought, you know, if Joe Looney's not resigned, he's the natural fit to slide in as kind of that swing interior backup, and they've just kept him at guard and let him worry about that and try to progress there, because when you think about it, for him, he's had this is his first full offseason as an NFL player. True, maybe part of it is just let him focus on getting better at that position. I thought it was gonna be

Joe Looney. I still thought he would come back and they would have to sign him to be the backup center. And then he goes to the Giants and realize, I don't like dude this anymore. I'm gonna retire, And it's like, oh, any media retire gets your thirty Come on, gosh, So Joe probably didn't like all the running Judge makes him. Yeah, that's true. What do we do? He was like, you know what, I'm good. It's like, JG, what are you doing? What? I gotta run here? I thought I was just coming

to be the backup center. So, I mean, this has been a conversation throughout the time in OXNARNT, throughout the off season about the potential of Connor Williams making that switch to center. But I don't know if I've ever asked this question, and both of you can answer, but I'll start with Mickey here. How tough of a transition is that? From a guard who has played sole guard the entirety of his career, college, high school doesn't matter. Now he's in the NFL, he's gotta make a switch

from guard to center. That seems like it's a tougher switch than a lot of people might look at and see you on paper. Well, I think the tougher part is is now you've got to control everything you know. You gotta know what the defense is doing, and you gotta make the line calls for everybody. So you really got to have a good concept of what's going on. And then you know they're gonna line somebody right up on your head and hit you as soon as you snap the ball and you got to be ready to go. Now,

can it be done? Mark Stepnoski was a guard at at pitt And and the Cowboys turned him into a Pro Bowl center, so he was it can be done, but I think it's not done overnight. Um. As a matter of fact, you know step was a Pro Bowl center. Well, his rookie year, he didn't start a game until they were probably one in ten, and they put him in. They put him in at center because they knew that was kind of where they were going to go with him.

Well what a year. Yeah, thanks, it was. It was eight and nine before they won that game on Sunday night, and of course they would win the only game of the year on Sunday night. Uh, when we were right on deadline, right and in an old RFK with a press box that was so crowded, we were sitting like this right too, because so there wasn't enough room to stretch out because my shoulders were so big. You've told me many times you were for an O and sixteen.

I wanted history. I said, well, I'm gonna cover history here the first year I have this team on my own. And then they win a game and I'm going, now, it's just a bad season. Rob. Would you think about the switch? Mickey nailed it. I mean it comes down to your the quarterback upfront, pre snap, you make all the adjustments, you get everybody in the right checks. And I don't think that's a difficult transition for him, because

Mike McCarthy spoke about it the other day. They train the guards in the centers the same way, so and he's been in this system for three years, so he knows what's going on. It's not like he's coming in. It's not like Matt Farniac's trying to do this. You're one first camp. I don't worry about that so much. I think what Mickey said, it's also it's it's the added element of having to snap the ball and then

you've got somebody right in your face. I'm sure that's an adjustment as well, but I don't I think from a pre snap standpoint, I think it's something he can handle. He's been around for a while. And think about from a physical standpoint, there's a reason why, unlike snaps for kicks, that they've changed the rule and you can't line head up on the on the deep snapper. Yeah, you know you got to beat to the side, and why are

they doing that for safety? Well, on defense, they can put a four hundred pound guy on your head, right right on top, and then it just pound the heck out of you as you after you snap the ball. So yeah, it's this and then you got to come up and do this, and it's not easy. In terms

of the timing. I feel like it's a it's vastly different compared to what it looks like on paper, because I mean, whenever you're watching film and whenever you're actually looking at the play, it looks like a guy just doing the same thing, except you have to snap the ball. Then you have to readjust yourself and then make a block immediately with a one technique or a zerotique technique right over the top of here. So you're you're concerned

about that position. And then once again it reared its ugly head in the Hall of Fame game, you're concerned about who's that swing tackle. I was just it's a bigger question. Didn't come in. Can't play that left tackle position or the right side. We have a fan question about that. Okay, So we're gonna take a break and on the way back, we're gonna answer the question I was trying the question you were trying to get to when we come back with more talking cowboys here on

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You can see every exciting play book, an appointment at your local experts and see what selor can do for you. See more, do more, slur on Talking Cowboys, Mickey Spagnola, Rob Phillips, Kyle Yeoman's with you. Special shout out to Chris Beam and William Boykins also in our podcast tent holding it down and doing a great job throughout all of the shows over the course of training camp. Some of the hardest working people here. I would say, absolutely

without question, they're earning their three square meals. There are they square? They're squares? Where pretty square? Okay, So we've got some time now to answer some fan questions here on fans on the fifty, I was complimenting Keen. All right, here we go, going right into your question. Jake asked, have you seen Terrence Steele on the left side at all? Reporting on Inseci and seeing his limited snaps against Pittsburgh is troubling in his opinion, hashtag Mickey who is the

swing tackle? Way don't know yet. It has not emerged as a definitive person. Uh Nasecki struggled at left tackle in the game against Pittsburgh unlimited time, Unlimited time and you know, he's he's out there and you know he's a veteran. They're not going to overdo it. But they got to first and goal at the five and second down and third down he missed his blocks. Uh, and it's like, okay, don't tell me, we're we're still here with the camms, right, Cam Irving and Cam Fleming that

they've both hammed out. And so Steele has primarily played right side on the second team at tackle, but he did get some snaps on the left side. And then the other problem there is you drafted a guy in the fourth round, Josh Ball, and it sounds like he must have a high ankle sprain because when McCarthy talked about his ankle, he said, yeah, he'll probably be out a couple of weeks. So normally, if it's just a regular ankle sprain, usually it's not a couple of weeks.

So he said maybe Houston, Yeah maybe, but it didn't sound he didn't sound hopeful. He said multiple weeks. And he's he's been out for about a week now, yes, so, and we haven't seen him. It's not like he's walking out there watching practice. So he's getting you know, rehab therapy. So the odds of him winning this job is pretty remote at this point. And you know when and what you're hoping is if they have to bring in another tackle,

that they protect that guy. And I don't just say okay, you got the job like they started last year and it's like, no, you got to put a tight end over there. And then, to me, the answer I can give the guy is, in my books, if something happens to Tyran and else, Zack Martin's going out the tackle immediately, immediately. I ain't waiting ten weeks before I put him out there, right or however long they waited before they made that change.

And I think the reason they somewhat waited is they still hadn't had confidence in mcgoverning to take care of the guard spot. But once he came along and they said, okay, look he's a better guard than whoever I'm putting out at tackle, and so we can move Zach out there. And so to me, that's the answer to the question right now. I want to disagree with you, but my answers in stone. It's on the website right now. That was the mail bad question today and I said, same thing,

Zach is the best option. You know, if you especially if we're talking about a long term absence, God forbid at one of the tackle spots at some point in the season. McCarthy didn't want to do it. Last year, he finally did it, and you know what, the line played its best that it had at any point in

that season. In the running game, there was about a three game stretch where they were getting about one hundred and fifty yards rushing per game before Zach got hurt again on Thanksgiving, So that solid thinks because and give credit to Connor McGovern because he stepped in it right guard and did a nice job. So Mickey's right, it's about kind of trying to get your best five out there, and if you do have to change out two spots,

then fine. If we're if we're basing it off of the current backup swing tackle options, I would still have to give the edge to tightness sec he just based on experience. You know, he's thirty six years old, he's been doing this a long time. Tarre Steele, I think is getting better. I think we've seen some things signs that he's improving. But I would have to give the edge to the veteran there but yeah, it's it's it's

not setting Stone by any means. And then the other guy that they've used is Brandon Knight, but only because they were down a tackle. They needed another tackle to help out, so they've moved him because he was getting them, getting the majority of his snaps as a guard. They were trying to give him a chance to make it as a guard, and then when they lost ball, it was like, Okay, we're short on tackles. You're gonna have to take some snaps second or third team at tackle.

And so yeah, I mean, gosh, you know, last year was just unbelievable that you were trying to exist at the tackle position with an undrafted rookie and a second year guy who had played basically two games in the NFL previously gotten one start. Yeah, one start, right, and it's like, oh, that's almost like throwing your hands up. And a backup quarterba and a backup quarterback, and the backup to the backup quarterback. It was a nightmare, a

nightmare for Kellen Moore. I'm sure I will I will say, you know a couple of those two red zone trips that Garrett Gilbert had a couple of those players. You might you could nitpick and say you got to have a clock in your head and get the ball out. It's true, but yeah, the protection was not cleaning that game, and it, honestly it got a little bit worse. I think as they went down the depth chart at quarterback

in that game. One extra thing to Jake's point whenever he said limited snaps for Tian Saki during the Pittsburgh game, And I kind of mentioned this in passing, but I looked further into it, and I know how we all feel about Pro Football focus in their grades quote unquote because they're not normally the best, but I still think this says something about the game that Tian Saki had.

He had seven pass blocking snaps. His grade at the end of the game was a zero point zero grade, which means out of the seven snaps that he had, he had the worst possible grade that you could potentially have on PFF, which is saying something, yeah, yeah, that's a struggle. And teren Steele, by the way, was a sixty six point four in terms of and there was one I think I think Gilbert took a three step drop. But even if it's a three step drop, the guy

was on him steps. I agree, And then the other time he didn't pick up the guy that was blitzing. It's like, you're a veteran, you should know what you're doing. Got to know to be able to slide out. Then you see that blitzing linebacker. I believe is what it was. Okay, And you know when when you look at those things, all you gotta do is look at to see how much they got paid, because the contract will tell you

what they think. To the guy, I'm sorry, and he's basically on a veteran minimum and he's thirty six years old, so it's not like, Okay, he's making so much money. We gotta keep him right. It's the same thing at the safety position. Not to stray away, but most of those guys they brought in, they're all on one year deals for basically minimum with a minimum signing bonus. Look just as much as they stuck with Terrence Steele last year, you gotta think they feel like he can do this

eventually and get better and better. So you know, maybe they may be crossing their fingers that he can just continue to get better in these practices and win the job. You know, as a second year guy that they've invested in. We'll see. I mean, na Seki has way more experience, and there they will keep an eye out. I'm sure once the final cuts happen. The problem is, if you've got a good backup tackle, he's not going anywhere. They are hard to find, just you know, just off the couch.

I go back to Michael Irvin talking about the backup tackle and he goes, can you just stand there and let me count? One? Two three? That's all you gotta do, right, One two three? Like that? And they couldn't do it. And I don't know if he was remarking about Chaz Green, who, by the way, he was on that Pittsburgh roster. Is he yes? Okay, Mickey, you mentioned the one year deals for some of those guys in the secondary at safety.

Our next question, John asked, do we see Malie Hooker in pads this week and potentially does he get some snaps against the Cardinals on Friday. I can't imagine that he would get one practice in pads and they'd throw him in the game on Friday, because all they only he hasn't done it yet, right, and the only chance

you got is Wednesday? Agree and he's coming off a torn achilles so um, which, by the way, I was watching Keyan O'Neill and Demante Kazy warming up for those the practice against the Rams, and they were doing their achilles stretching things. Still out there three guys that have had that injury. Yeah, yeah, I mean he may they're

ramping him up. He didn't practice against the Rams, but he's he's doing more field work and so if he doesn't practice Wednesday, I would think he's back in there on some level by the time they get back from Oxnarn But yeah, I don't. I don't expect him to play against Arizona. Sticking with the secondary Bluff City Cowboys who always ask great questions. By the way, with the close battle at the cornerback position, does special team's ability give guys like c J. Goodwin an advantage over guys

fighting for the fifth and maybe sixth spots overall? CJ's on this team as a special teams guy. I mean he's listed as a corner but and he does take some reps there, but he's he's basically a captain on special teams. There is talk though, of Maurice Kennedy being just as talented in terms of special teams were Yeah, but you know, Maurice Kennedy has started games in the league. It's a good point at cornerback, and I think maybe people forget that a little bit. You know, he's been

mostly a reserve. But that being said, he's probably the biggest surprise of camp. You know, take out CD and just how spectacular he's been. I mean that doesn't really not really a surprise, that's no expectation, but I mean the level that he's been has been as unbelievable at times. But in terms of a guy who's really jumped out at you, yes, he's got to be right there. And I think to answer the guy's question is don't coin CG, CG, CJ in the number of corners you keep. He's in

a category of his own. It's special teams. You know, you put him over there, uh, and then find the next corner. So if you're looking at corners right now, you know, Kennedy's probably the fourth guy in my books, if you're looking at it from way, he's performed in the slot, and he does have some special team skills. Uh, you know, Calvin Joseph is coming along. But I don't know that he has shown out to the point where, uh you know, he's the next man up at the

cornerback position. Who is one, two and three? You said he's fourth. I just wanted to ask that, see who you're one. So I still think it's it's it's uh Dick Brown and George Lewis and and no challenge from Canna. Well here's a well a little bit. But I think this. They didn't play Jordan Lewis in the Hall of Fame game, not at all. And he hasn't practice a ton either. Yeah, but there's a reason he wasn't out there because I

think they just like Donovan Wilson. I think they think, Okay, we know who they are, we got to find out to find the next guy. Uh and and so um, I think they're still And Jordan Lewis was back out there working with the first team during the practice, held his own and held his own so uh you know, and they paid him a little bit of money, so they got to see that one through. Um from a salary cap standard, here's thirteen and a half million. Yeah, so seven's trying to make this team as maybe the

next guy that can go in the slot. You know, and Anthy Brown can play in the slot too, by the way, he has started games there. So if somebody gets hurt, you know, they can they can put him in there, or Kennedy in there, or they can put Brown in there if one of the other corners steps up. But I don't know that Joseph or Nishan Wright have

stepped up enough to suggest they're the next guy up. Mickey, Mickey, you're looking at it kind of what the depth chart should look like week one, Yeah, September ninth, And I don't disagree with you, but if I'm ranking just based off our eyes out here the cornerbacks, it's Trayvon Diggs and then it's Maurice Kennedy for me, just in terms of the plays he's made. And you know, if this keeps up, I don't know how you keep him off the field. And that's not to say Anthony Brown has

had a good camp. He's done some really nice things out here. We haven't seen a lot of Jordan Lewis because you know, he's been dealing with a little bit of an injury. But you know, and Kelvin Joseph has flashed, Nashan Right has flashed a little bit. But Maurice Candy makes a play in every practice. If it's not a pick, he makes a play on the ball and from that slap position. But they haven't played him outside. Well maybe they don't have to, you know, maybe that's his role.

But what if one of those What I was looking at is what if somebody outside gets hurt, who's the next corner that's going in. It's probably Kelvin Joseph. Yeah, but he needs to pick it up. You know, he looks like a second round rookie right now. And Nashan Wright it looks like a little final pick in the third round rookie. Um. So the game, yeah, because this guy was catching passes. It's a good point that we

kind of pulled that up during draft coverage. I think when he faced Simi Phoko, it was like, oh, he led the led organ state and tackles against Stanford. Oh wait, it's because Semi Fajoko kind of torched him on multiple occasions and he tackled him down the field a little bit more, got to the end zone, right, yeah, tackle game right? He performance in that game? Yeah? Uh, any surprise veterans that need to have a big next couple of weeks before roster trimmed downs surprise veterans. I mean

that's kind of I don't know about surprise. We mentioned t a job is up for grabs based on what we've seen. Um, that's a good question. I mean there's no veteran that I mean, it's like, oh, if they don't do this, they're getting cut. You know. The only the only place I would think they're could be some competition is the fourth and fifth wide receiver just from a cap standpoint, and neither Noah Brown or Cedric Wilson

are making that much money. I think they're both at like two million two point one, Yeah, two point one. So it's not like you're gonna save a bunch of money. You'll save a million, But that's not worth cutting somebody for a cap reason. I just think there's been a gap between four and five and then six, right, I mean they've both been productive in camp, in the game, special teams. Yeah, because the league turner will show up and many you'll disappears appear the same thing with those

serious Mitchell. Yes, I mean overall those two have continued to be consistent. These guys are chasing. Yeah, it's hard to see either guy not making this team. So that's other than that. I mean, there's no veteran on the offense that's going to get knocked out of there, right, Well, you've got all your starters returning, Yeah, I mean they're I mean you go down the depth chart, there's some the backup quarterback position, what you know, Yeah, but they're

not really veterans. Garret Gilbert has been around. He's still competing against the rest of the league, right, you know, and and I think he's had some good days lately because somebody else would have to show up on a waiver wire that got your attention, and you know that's that's a couple of weeks away. With their budget too, Yeah, with their butt their budget, which you have to factor in. Um, I'm trying to go down the roster and see, I mean I think, you know, the safety position to me

is still interesting. You know, they signed Curse in the off season. Yes, somebody in there is not gonna make it. You know, what what do they do there? Israel Mquamu. You know, I would think makes this team. But how many safeties can you keep? You know that that's an interesting spot too, Yeah, because think about it. I mean, if if you went low on safeties, Kean O'Neil can

still move back there and play right good. But can you keep Kazy Curse and Malite Cooker I guess, and then Donovan Wilson and Mukuamo who I guess you can? He can flex, he could positions? Is that five that I just yes? Read off five? So you can keep five safeties and they got to wait on corners. You keep it, and they're gonna have to wait on Hooker to see what he can do. I mean, it's no

joke coming back from that rupture Achilles. No, after taking time off and not really having an offseason working on your own. Yeah, I mean coming in and having training camp would be nice. But like you said and we answered in the first question, it's not really uh not really possible for him to maybe get out there at least during the camp portion that's in Oxnard. And obviously the numbers that inside a defensive tackle are strong. But Tristan Hill, they have that option to just keep him

on pup to start the season. I think they're gonna keep him in there hip pocket, so you know, it's not a situation where, oh he might get cut they can, they can keep him on pup um. I don't ready. I don't know why. And I want to bring this up because I don't think this would happen, But I feel like a lot of people listening would maybe initially their first thought would be a guy like Jalen Smith. There's no way that happens until later down the road, I mean, if it ever happens. Yeah, I mean, he's

a starter. I agree. Okay, was he perfect last year? No, but he made one hundred and fifty some tackles and and I see him more engaged this year, meaning he doesn't look like the independent contractor I would I thought he was. He's he's mingling with the team, he's he's patent guys on the back. He's being more of a leader instead of just being out there. So yeah, and now the only thing he's got to do is when they're down thirty to seven and he makes a big

tackle and he does his little swipe thing. It's like, don't be celebrated your tackle in the context of what's going on with the team. There was an interesting point in the practice that we saw against the Rams, and we had actually had a replay of it because I thought it was so intriguing, but he made a really

nice read on a run play. Darryl Henderson was rolling out to the right on a little sweep and Jalen Smith blewed up at the line of scrimmage might have been a tackle for loss, and he kind of kept running and he looked like he was gonna do the whole swipe. He even I mean, oh, he stopped and then even he just paused. He put his hands out, and then he walked away. I don't know if that's a sign to come or if that's just him thinking, oh,

it's practice. But at the same time, maybe it was a sign of saying, maybe the swipe is in the review, and he's playing way of saying selective swiping, selective swiping, and and he's playing the position he should be in. It's middle linebacker. He's not a weak side linebacker. Well, look, can't run and cover a running back or a tight end. I could be wrong, but when they opened up in their defense first snap against the Steelers, they had three linebackers.

US did yeah, and he want three plays, Laden vander Esh, Jalen Smith, Michael Parsons, And they're not going to do that. All the time, you know, and they've got enough enough versatility with the linebackers that they don't have to use him on the nickel if they don't want, like if it's a just definite passing situation, you know, he doesn't have to be out there now. If they want to play nickel and and it's still like second and you know, short or something, they can leave him out there against

the run. I want to see him going forward. I don't want to see him going backwards like a middle linebacker. That's where you can do that. One other position. If we're talking about veterans, you know, what do they do at tight end? You know, Jeremy Sprinkle they signed him to be, you know, kind of that belldozer role. Sean mckun continues to make plays and he's no belldozer. Well,

I'm just saying that. You know, the thing is, if Sean mccun steps in, is the third tight end, because that's the way things maybe progressing based on what we've seen out here, how do they use that? What does that mix look like? And and a lot of Louit at fullback could be an interesting fourth tight end slash extra running back h back do a little bit of everything. Now, if indeed that neck injury is not significant, go ahead.

And we just found out that he's got a neck injury and it looked like it was going to take some time. So we'll find out maybe more about that. That cropped up when Sunday and we hadn't I asked Mike McCarthy about it. It came out of the game. But yeah, yess he wasn't. I didn't see him out there against the Rams now, so I don't think he was. And Sprinkle, you know, for the body type he is, he's not what I thought he'd be, you know. And and he's he doesn't look like a guy that's going

to do a lot of blocking for you. And your third tie in has to do some blocking and be able to get down the field and McKean has showed some ability to do that and he benefited from the time he got to play last year. It plays down the field as a pass cat. Ye, yes, a couple different times. So yes, And I don't look at I mean what year Sprinkle he was signed as a as a run block. That's that's really where he's made his money in the NFL. Six year guy, Yeah, something like

that fifth. Yeah, it's your guy. I guess that makes him a veteran. Sure, I mean it's more of a veteran than Sean mckin. But I'm sure what did he sign a one year deal for millium? Yep, not a ton of money to trying to throw some names to

get some guys to be surprise cuts. All right, let's take our second break when whenever we come back, we're gonna take a look ahead at the week that is in store in Oxnard, the schedule for the Cowboys, and maybe even peak a little bit at the Arizona game in weeks or week number one, I guess officially of the NFL preseason when we returned with more talking Cowboys. Hi, I'm Clint Tullison with United Aggin Turf. Before you can park yourself in front of the game, park yourself in

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Jackie Flash, Jackie Flash? It's not complicated at AT and t our best smartphone deals are for everyone. Restrictions apply. Is it att dot com for details to talk in Cowboys back here on Talking Cowboys and Dallas Cowboys Training Camp returns to the Star in Frisco starting with Cowboys Night, presented by American Airlines on August sixteenth. Watch the Cowboys practice and enjoy free activities at the Star beginning at

four pm. Fans have the chance to catch the three additional practices August twentieth, the twenty seventh, and the twenty eighth. Admission and parking are both free. Visit the Star in Frisco dot com for details. So the Cowboys returning to Oxnard starting next week after they take on the Arizona Cardinals in preseason Week one return into Frisco. Oh did I say Oxnard? Yeah, okay, I'm in Frisco. See Oxnard's on the brain because you want to stay here. And

the weather is so fantastic. I mean, I'm wearing long sleeves and pants and it's for or what is it eleven o'clock now. So my friends took me up to dinner last night and we ate outdoors. Nice downtown Ventura. Wow, tells you how nice it. I didn't get an invite. That's fine. It's been cold at night too, fog rolling it there was there was a little heat lamp above us. I'm just saying, it's been. It's been not Texas. Did you know? Did you know have you been to Ventura

yet this year? No? They have blocked off main Street. It's a it's a pedestrian walkway now because they have allowed sort of like they've done other places, They've allowed the restaurants to move right into the streets and put outdoor seating. That's great. That's a great little area. Yeah. There. It reminded me of how cool it is out there because Ventura, by the way, I'll give you a little travel report here. Uh, it's like we're going to a full hour today. It's like it's like in a it's

like in a nineteen seventies time warp. That old downtown there, which they should not spoil. Uh, just kind of keep it that way. Don't bring in a bunch of condos. And uh, they've got local business. This is their places. Daughter. Yeah, and it's not fired like it's three blocks from the water and it's just it's just a great little downtown. Kevin Costner's hometown, is it really yes? Wow, he came to practice a few years ago. He had a place, and I think it was in Carpentiera, which is right

next to Ventura before you get to Santa Barbara. He had, as a matter of fact, I think one year. The Joneses state that at his house. One year he was in town with his band playing while we were out here. Kevin Costner, Yes, it might. It might have been at the county the county fair. Yeah, that's so cool. And they didn't have a county fair this year. He's robbed Phillips on Kyle Yoman's this is talking Ventura here on Dallas couch dot com. Um, what are some of the

things that we're looking forward to this week. I mean, of course, the preseason game is Friday. It's a really slow week compared to what we have had here in Oxnard. Just the one padded or we think it's going to be a padded practice on Wednesday, and they've only had five so far, correct, five or six? I bet if it is padded it'll be a lighter one lighter playing

on on Friday. Um, what is something you need to see from this team this week going into well And we haven't talked about this except for him being a pedestrian watching Um, just where Dak Prescott is. Um, you know, I got a better understanding of his injury, how it occurred, uh, and where it exactly is. And UM, so I could use Rob for my my model here today, don't it? But it's I'll do it on his left arm instead of his right arm. But the muscle he heard is

right here. Okay. So there's a back muscle that comes up like this and there's a little ring of it and it ends up underneath your armpit. And evidently when and I remember seeing the throw, he had a weird like hill Mary throw where he threw the ball sky high,