Talkin' Cowboys: Patrick Crayton Edition

a little bit different in that final segment. Patrick Creighton, former Cowboys wide receiver, joins us, a good friend of Isaiah stand Back, our resident Super Bowl champion and Isaiah, I don't know you've got You've got some trash talking to do after some bowling last night, so I'm looking forward to that. But alongside Isaiah, you got myself, Kyle

Yeoman's Rob Phillips, heck my Harrison. We're glad to be with you and guys before we kind of dive in and get into the Dallas Cowboys, which we're gonna have plenty of. Like I said, Mike McCarthy, linebackers. We've got plenty of cowboys to dive into. I wanted to address something really quickly, and much like all of you who are probably listening or watching this podcast, either live or after it's recorded, you're just like me. You come to

these podcasts for a little bit of a distraction. You come to hear about the Dallas Cowboys, you come to get away from the world. And I promise you'll get all of that, but that'll come in about five minutes. But first, we simply wouldn't be human if we didn't take a second to speak from the heart about some of the events that have tired over the past couple of days. And I wanted to start things out by

saying I have family and law enforcement. I pray for them every single day because of how dangerous and how unpredictable that their job could be throughout the course of any given day, over the course of their career, and what they choose to do for a living. But now also because of just a select few people, a very select few people that are also in that line of business, I also have to pray for friends of mine, and this is something that I've been really thinking about over

the last couple of days. But They're not necessarily people that I'm friends that I'm praying about because they have dangerous jobs, or because they're maybe in front lines of a potential pandemic that's been serving our country or our world over the last couple of weeks, but rather because they also have to go out into their daily worlds, whether they're going on a job or they're going elsewhere, fearing for their life just because of the color of

their own skin, because of the way that they're perceived by a different race. And in a country that's founded on its principles of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, that's not what that is. All three of those things are not into the definition of what I just named, because at the end of the day, all of these protests that are happening throughout our country and even throughout the world in some parts, it's not about black versus white.

It's not about cops or citizens. It's not about democrat or Republican. It's about finally seeing each other as God's children, and if you're not religious, if you're not religious at all, just seeing each other as humans. And that's kind of the biggest thing. It's to end racism finally, and get rid of all of those voices that have been crying out for years and years by hearing those voices first. And that's what these all are about, so that no man or woman should have to live in fear solely

because of the color of their skin. I just really wanted to say that, if you're still listening, thank you for sticking around. I hope you speak out as well. It's really scary for me as somebody who doesn't know that struggle and doesn't always talk about their political beliefs on air. I don't. I try and stay away from it as much as possible on air, but we live in crucial time. Secmo. Yeah, Kyle, I think what you said was was spot on. I appreciate that what you said.

You know, I am just like everybody else when I've been, you know, staring at my television watching a lot of this unfold, and I just want to be completely blunt and honest with you. The Floyd death was heartbreaking. It was heartbreaking to see that play out over and over and over and over again over the last week. It breaks my heart as an African American. But I realized and just having this platform, I think it's very important that we address this issue and say something about it.

And I believe that there's a perception problem. You know, I want her the term, you know, perception is reality. But guys, a lot of times, as an African American, your perception isn't my reality. And those are the things that we need to gather and talk about how you perceive African Americans. If I'm walking in and a parking lot and there's a you know, white woman ahead of me that rushes to her car to lock her doors because she thinks that I'm going to do something to her,

that's not the perception. I'm just walking to my car. And it's not my responsibility as an American to make you feel comfortable about walking to your car, walking into an elevator with you, and making you be say hello, how are you, and be extra nice to you so you feel disarmed by my presence. That's not what's That's not what I'm gonna do. I'm an American, I'm a taxpaying citizen just like everyone else. I expect to be

treated fairly. I expect for my children to grow up in an environment where they don't have I don't have to worry about their life, but that's not the reality of the city. And so this perception that people have, and especially when it comes down to law enforcement, and I don't want to paint this with a broad brush, because it is police brutality that needs to be talked about, and the perception that I could possibly be an enemy to them is something that we all need to sit

down and we could talk about. It is who we're blue in the face, but there are policies and things that need to change to that regard so that we feel protected just like every other citizen. Yeah, heck, I know. I'm always very outspoken when it comes to divide and when it comes to mistreatment, abuse of power, all those social issues. I am never want to be quiet. So I shared something on my personal page, on my Instagram

page on Facebook the other day. And I'm usually really strategic when I decide to speak, because it's hard to really channel emotions um that that you that you that you feel that you take on at a response of seeing something like we all saw um you know, you know the other the other week. And unfortunately, this isn't the first time that we're seeing these things. Unfortunately, this isn't the first time that these things are happening. They've

been happening for a long time. So, um, as I mentioned before my personal page, these actions that you're seeing from like like like how I said a select few, it's it's it's built up, right, It's built up. It's been accruing for years. UM. I have it, others have it. You know, it really depends on on how mature you are or how you decide to UM. I can't say that one one way of of of releasing your your anger is better than the other. Right, I can't say that,

because emotions are emotions. But you know, I choose one route, others choose another. But I've seen these things happen, right, I've seen it in the neighborhood that I grew up, and I've seen the abuse of power. I've been profiled more times and I could even sit here and tell you I've been followed. My family has been followed. I've been pulled over. I've had to have these conversations with my daughter, asked to you because of how she looks, this is what goes on. I've had to have conversations

with the school board. Why don't you recognize the African American History Month. Why is that? Oh? The response, Oh, we just didn't think about it, right, So there's so many things that have to be peeled back. Um, Cole, I appreciate you taking the time. I've received many phone calls, many text messages from from others that don't look like me, right, UM and um and just expressing um after viewing my video, expressing just there their sincere heartache. Um. You know, a

neighbors bringing stuff over and just just sharing that it's important. Right. We need people to speak up, We need people to go out and vote. Right. There's a lot of things going on right now. Right now, there's the thing on social media saying blackout right, blackout Tuesday. Hey, listen, I'm all for certain things. However, let's not be let's not

be silly. And I think that you know that that there's there's not initiatives on the back in our people that are putting things out there that they're they're all for the same mission. They're not. There's blackout Tuesday just so happens to be on the same day that there's a primary election going on today in Pennsylvania, a DC, New Mexico. So in other states, let's not let's not be fod and think that this is just happening so

cause and let's all right for it. Let's let's let's take a step back, take emotion out of it, do your research, do your homework, and let's make some strategic decisions that we've all come together. I'm angry that there's a lot of people that are angry. Um, let's just be you know, let's be smart about how we respond to these things. UM. I can't tell people how to how to respond, but we can. We can have this. This could take a whole hour, and so let's um,

let's cut it there. I just I just uh, you know, we're tired of it. I can tell you I'm tired of it. Emotionally drained and um you know, I pray and and and hope that we can get through this and get beyond this. But there's gonna These are generational curses that we have to break in. We have to start now. I totally agree with what you guys said

as well said. And you know, for me as a new dad, when I'm reading about George Floyd over the weekend, and I didn't know that, you know, he has a six year old daughter that lives in Texas and as a new father, it's like it's haunting to think about how she's got to grow up living with how her father died publicly, and it's it's just it's heartbreaking. As Heckma said, it's wrong and something's got to change. And

you guys said it so well. I mean, as Kyle said earlier, it's it's not just a challenge for the African American community, it's it's this is a human issue. This is something everyone who's got a moral compass should look at and say something absolutely has to change. And you know people out there trying to affect change peacefully and in the past few days, and I stand with that cause because it's it's definitely needed in our society.

We're better than this, very well said by each one of you, and it's just time to move on from racism and to finally look at each other for what's on the inside rather than what's on the outside. Now, that's it. We're gonna put it in the review mirror. We're gonna talk some cowboys. Now, we're gonna move on and dive in because there's still plenty to get to. Even though it is the first week of June. Guys. First off, it's June second, which is just wild to me.

The fact that we're already in the sixth month of the year and we're already just kind of barreling toward what training camp could be here in the next month and a half. We're about six weeks away from the scheduled start of training camp, and Mike McCarthy had a chance to talk about what training camp could potentially look at. He had a conference call this past week with the media of the Dallas Fort Worth area and Rob, you

were on that conference call. What were some of the highlights that you kind of took away from that call and we're able to at least dive into what this virtual offseason looks like. Well, he was. Mike McCarthy was pretty candid in that he wouldn't flat out say, look, I feel like we're behind, because every other team in the league is in the same situation. But he's realistic about the fact that if they were able to have a normal offseason, they probably would be far ahead of

where they are right now. It's just the nature of things. One thing I thought it was interesting is the way he's approached this, he talked about just relying on his own instincts and experience because he really doesn't have it despite being a head coach in the league for almost twenty years. But one thing he's done with the virtual

program is kind of reverse things. And he started off having players in position meetings right off the bat, diving into schematic material and getting caught up with the volume of that, which is it's more of a challenge for a team like this because it's new. It's a lot of new stuff and more of the big picture stuff saved that for later. Let's just get ahead, start and get as fast as quickly as we can get acclimated

this for when we can't get back together. Isaiah, that seemed like it was kind of flipped a little bit, but he felt like the volume there that they have to absorb, especially younger players rookies coming into league, it was important to get right into it with the position groups and get going. Yeah. Absolutely, I mean yeah, I just doubled back up and gets shooted over to you. Heck, no,

it's and that is the most important thing. And I'm glad that he took the time to mention and that that's where the focus is because that is where the weight of this offseason really lays right now, It really really lies. And the amount of information I wish I could show you guys a playbook right now, but the amount of information that has to be consumed during this period of time with the new with a new staff and a new system, is it's a lot. It is insurmountable.

And and and these guys really needed to dive directly into that because there's there's a there's a classroom aspect, right. There's classroom where you where you sit up there and you're studying, and you're and you're in you're consuming information, hundreds of plays per day, right, and you're just digesting that.

You're just just old school board work, right. And then there's an application side of things, right, And so you go from the classroom, you do a little film study, and then you go straight to the field and you apply it. And that's what really makes it stick. That's what really makes it resonate with you and allows for you to really digest it it so that you can

then move on. Right. So the issue that I see that these guys that the Cowboys an't going to encounter is they're having a classroom sessions, right, they're having they probably have some film sessions that they have homework to do, but they don't have the application side. So how much is this is really going to resonate and going to stick with them when they actually get a chance to

touch the field. They're going to be doing a lot of doubling back, tripling back, just to go over basic information that like, like you guys really mentioned, Rob, they wouldn't have to be trying to go over at this point in time and to see offseason. Yeah, I thought it was very I thought it's very interesting to hear him point out the fact that, you know, offensively, they were going to try to remain with a lot of the same terminology just so that guys would be familiar

with with you know, with those terms. He knows that you know, in this whole new code of nineteen America that these things are these are very interesting times and the whole teaching method, not only for Mike McCarthy before the league, has had to change and so making sure that he's up to date with the times, and it's very important. He talked about climate control and just dealing with the climate that you're in, and I thought that was very important for him to say, and also his research,

his data mining, his old R and D stuff. You know, how many meetings would they have had up until this point, how many practices would they have had up until this point? And Rob, you're right, he feel short of just saying we're behind right now, you know, but he knows he knows that everybody else is behind as well. And so it's a very unique challenge for all coaches, but especially him being a new coach and wanting to implement his system.

He said he didn't have a way to have like ninety boxes on his computer so that he could address everyone at one time. So that's probably why he was doing the everything in the group setting. But making sure that he introduced himself to his players and let them know that he's available at this point is the best

he can do. But as far as the teaching part of it, he's leaving a lot of that up to his position guys, making sure that they're able to regurgitate the information that they're receiving, testing these guys to make sure that they're getting I think, you know, look, with everybody being in the same barrel, I'm sure Mike McCarthy is looking forward to the opportunity to actually see and greet his guys. Well, we're also in a transition period.

We're going from one offense to another offense, Kellen Moore of course being the offensive coordinator for both. But this is still going to be a little bit of a new look because Mike McCarthy has his hands over this offense and Isaiah you kind of talked about the application side of the process. You have this all digestion and then you finally have a chance to apply it. It's almost like your tests and your studying in college and then you actually go out and do it for a

job later on for following graduation. You don't get that just yet. There's a little bit of a space in between. But how important is that application process? It's huge? I mean I think, I mean, I'll take everybody back to school, right, go back to high school when everybody has science class. Right, Imagine having science class and you didn't have lab, right, how much how much information would you actually remember? Right? How much would you actually be able to apply? Right?

So you know, like I said, it's it's very important to be able to get on the field and run those routes. Yes, I could look up here and say, hey, you run fourteen yards, turn here, and I could do that all day long on paper, right, But until I get out there and do it, and I have the timing of it right, a quarterback puts it on a proper shoulder, you know, the right location with the right you know, in the right formation, with the right motion,

the right timing. All those things matter. It matters, matters, matters. That, don't get me wrong. Classroom is huge. However, the only way in which you really advance is by going out there and getting those reps. And you cannot, I repeat, you cannot get those reps that these guys have missed back. You can't get them back. Yeah, you just can't. That's such a great analogy, you know, the lab versus just

looking at him on a choco. You know, that's so true, and like you can apply it because if you apply it to any spot. Really, we get out there and you practice, not only are you you're going over plays, but things can happen off of that play that you have to adjust to that you can't see on film. It's got to happen live. And so look, every team's

dealing with it. One thing I thought he said that was really interesting that I didn't expect him to say, was that this might be the most experienced team he's had, and that that really surprised me, because I mean, he's won a super Bowl, you know, and he's he's been he's brought a team back a year later that won a title. And but when you think about it, there are certain positions on this roster that are extremely experienced,

offensive line being one of them. And some of the young guys on this team are leaders and key players that have playoff experience. Already, if you go through all the all the projected starting quarterbacks in this league, there's probably less than a dozen that have more starts in the league than dak Press Scott. So that's that's a solid thing to inherit for Mike McCarthy. And they've they've added we talked about guys, they've added defensive lineman with

a lot of experience, Paul McCoy, Alvin Smith. So they do have experience. And that's one thing he said, because somebody asks a really good question, do you try to dial back the volume that you're giving your players because it's all virtual, And he said, because of the experience that we have on this team. I feel comfortable, you know, handling the normal volume that I would with a new

scheme coming in. Yeah, Rob, And that's where that's where he is talking about trusting his instincts and trusting the group of guys that he has. But also, you know, as you know, Isaiah, it's coaches are always, you know, coaching for situations. You know, they call it situational awareness, right whether it be the two minute drill, hash marks, whatever, whatever's going on. Coaches are coaching for that and these other times to try to implement that. I think it's

gonna be very special. You know, it's going to be a special thing for or Mike McCarthy once he gets his guys in, because then he can lay his head on his pillow a night knowing that his guys are aware. Right now, all of these things that he's using as a teaching tool for these guys sitting in their living room still doesn't give him a feel as a coach

for his team. And so these are just words that he's thrown out because he understands in order to actually know what's going on with these guys, he has to put them through the ringer guys have to pass condition tests, all of those things, but at the same time coaching them up understanding that when this happens, this is what you do. You can't get you can't simulate that with the computer. You have to be on the field. You

have to get those live reps. I mean, friendly fire is one thing, but getting out there and seeing it happen live is a completely different thing. And I think that lab analogy that you brought up, I like that. I like that alone, but hey, it's I'm all for it. I was big in the science in high school. Now, Rob you kind of mentioned the experience and how experienced this roster is compared to what Mike McCarthy has had

to deal with in the past. One thing that was encouraging to me that he talked about was just how quickly the rookies have been picking up the installment of what they're trying to do in the playbook and everything involved.

They have rookie meet or veteran meetings in the mornings where the rookies are involved, and they've implemented the rookies into those meetings, and then after that you turn around and you have the rookie meetings specifically in the afternoon, so they're getting a double dose of their two a day classroom study and because of that, they've caught up to where the veterans are in the installment. And I know Mike McCarthy might have just been thrown out some

coach speak. Maybe it was a confident shot in the arm for the rookies that he has, But Rob, do you believe what he's saying in terms of some of these rookies and these younger guys picking it up just as quickly. Well, I think the point you made about this is a good one about having their own time in the afternoon to continue to study up because they

are behind. When you think about the dates, I think April twentieth was when the veterans got started virtually, so they missed a couple of weeks there, And in addition to the fact that they're brand new coming into this thing, I think from a volume standpoint, yes, they probably aren't caught up. I do think beyond the field part of it, that's where I think the veterans probably just have an inherent advantage just because they've been at this level live reps.

In person. Isaiah made disagree with that but I just think, you know, in theory, I think it's gonna take maybe a little longer for rookies to step on the field. And because think about it, though, this is going back all the way since January, where they really haven't been in football mode. They've been in job interviews basically trying to get drafted. So they need to get back on the field as quickly as possible. It's just not up to them now. They also kind of went into the factor.

Mike McCarthy actually went into the fact of Oxnard Frisco. There's two effort options as to how training camp could potentially be done. They're planning for both in full. They want to make sure that the Oxnard, if that's the choice, is ready to go, and if it's Frisco, that that's ready to go. But how different would those two look and how would things kind of change and fluctuate back

and forth. Rob Well, you know, I mean, they've they've viewed Frisco the Frisco portion as training camp in the past few years. It's only about a week or so, maybe ten days, but you know, they're they're comfortable obviously with their facilities when they can use them. I think the difference is I think having two grass fields in Oxnard is a difference. And as well as being able to practice outside in very moderate temperatures, that's that's very

and I say that very, I put that lightly. I guess right, that's it's beyond moderate compared to what it is in August here. But yeah, those two grass fields, I think it's easier on the player's bodies and especially in pads and then and then obviously the temperatures. I love them too. So you know, we'll see if we could get back out there. Isaiah. Is there any difference as to where training camp could be from a player standpoint? Absolutely,

this is not the year going back to Oxnard. No disrespect to the California Asia know y'all know him West Coast till I died, But this is not the year. There's been too much that's gone on. We don't even

know if we're gonna have fans in the stands. It doesn't make sense right now with everything that's going on in the league, but especially with the Cowboys with a new coach COVID nineteen coming off, you know, not being at the in your facilities in there in a proper time span you're gonna be rushing to try to get all this information. You're gonna be rushing to try to get reps. You're gonna be rushing to get guys healthy,

because the guys will get hurt. There's gonna be a lot of soft tissue injuries coming off of this, right So there's no you do not need to be in Oxnard, California, right now trying to get your marketing dollars right now. Jerry, I'm sorry, I love you, but keep this thing right here. That wasn't a one and a half billion dollars, two billion dollars facility that you got over there. You guize that thing this year? Yeah, I think it's gonna be the extra special you know, well, this special set of

circumstances surrounding COVID nineteen. I think that makes it equally as hard to see a training camp and you know, in California. But who knows, you know. I think at this point, with all of the speculation and just the realm of sports in general and looking at deadlines, it's all conjecture. We're all just trying to figure out if this is actually going to happen. But it makes for a great topic but I think the at the end of the day, the Cowboys are gonna do what's best

suited for the health of the team. M and Rob just I wanted to go back to what you you were saying about the two grass fields and just the weather conditions. That's why they go out to California's what everybody gloats about. The weather in California. Seventy four seventy five degrees California. I A, I mean, you gotta love that in comparison to one hundred and ten and the

devil walking the streets. Right, it's because it's I and you know and you know side here, and so that's got to make a major difference, especially with implementing a new office. And I'm sure for Mike McCarthy he is hoping that they are out in California as well, because he don't know nothing about this Texas heat. But you deal it. Heck, you're right there. They're not going to do anything. There's so many variables involved in this and

we just don't know. Yeah, and so they're not going to do anything that's gonna put the team at risk or is going to present a lot of logistical challenges. But Isaiah pointed out, So we'll just have to see. But there's there is a reason why they go out there. It is pretty nice out there in some time, man. And it's been a crazy offseason for all of us, whether we're media or fans of the Cowboys, but especially

for the coaching staff. I mean, I don't even know what it would be like, and I don't want to know what it would be like to be in Mike McCarthy's shoes coming in out of not being in coaching for a year and then all of these obstacles are thrown your way. It's it's been a tough offseason for him. But man, there's been a lot of additions throughout the course of the off season that are very positive for the Dallas Cowboys, which makes us ask the question, what

is the biggest question mark on defense? We'll tell you what position it is and how they fix it when we come back here. I'm talking Cowboys. I'm Jay Novachik, former tight end for the Dallas Cowboys. Back in the day, I was the guy who always got the tough yards and that's why I run with John Deer today. In fact, I have a John Dear three zero twenty five E tractor that can handle any yard work I need to do,

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Glad you're with us on Dallas Cowboys dot Com or the various platforms you could hear us on. Heck, My Harrison, Isaiah Stanback, the Great Rob Phillips, I'm Kyle Yeomans. And before we get into this segment, when it reminds you that season tickets are on sale now for this upcoming twenty twenty season single game tickets on sale as well Dallas Cowboys dot Com slash tickets. Go get your tickets today.

It's gonna be a scheduled chuck full of impressive games and hopefully a very winning Dallas Cowboys team whenever we get to that point of playing football in twenty twenty. But guys, I talked about the off season additions. We talked about the virtual off season just a bit ago. But with all of the additions defensively, you've added both defensive tackles and Doantari Po and Jill McCoy. Oh, by the way, Neville Gallimour was a third round pick and

he's got some upside to him as well. You've added some corners, You've added some secondary depth. Throughout the course of the entire off season, there hasn't necessarily been a whole lot of addition on the linebacking corps, and I kind of wanted to dive into what the linebackers are looking at heading into twenty twenty. And we saw a video the other day Layton vander esh a forty one inch vertical off of one lag looking pretty solid in terms of his rehab and coming back from that neck

injury a year ago. And my question is is does this do anything for you the fact that he has that forty one inch vertical and he's having fun out there shown off as athleticism. Does it do anything for you in terms of a at least somebody looking at player that is coming back from an injury. I mean, I thought it was wonderful also that you see Jordan Lewis do the same jump as well. Jordan Lewis is five eight right five eight by how tall? I don't know how tall. Jordans is five nine five a and

I mean he same one leg jump. But all that tells me about LV is that he's explosive anytime a guy is that kind of vertical. But we all we knew that, and I mean it was a spectacle something to see a guy that size with a forty one inch vertical. But guys, I think the linebacker group, you know, this is gonna be a group that we're gonna watch very closely, especially Jalen Smith and we talked avet him a few shows ago, and I'm really excited about him

and his opportunity. Uh in Mike Nolan's defense, because he's that piece that you can move around when I look down the roster. And also, you know, the health of Lvee Venders is very important to this club. But the signing of Sean Lee let me know everything that I needed to know about what the Cowboys thought about the other group. You know, I think Luke Gifford is that that guy that's in the group that everyone is thinking of.

You know, he has a great upside as far as his potential, but he is a guy if you go back over his career in Nebraska, he had some some hip injuries, season ending hip hip injuries. So staying healthy has been his thing, has been his thing. But also Joe Thomas March, all of those guys, I think they

have a large role to play. But these linebackers, this linebacker group, man, they're definitely gonna have to be a lot more solid than they were last year because if you look over the Green Bay game, the Vikings game, the running game in general, doing those two games, you know it was it was because of the poor linebacker player, just upfront play in general. Yeah, I'm looking forward to the continuity of this group more so than anything. Obviously.

We've touched on this a number of times on the show in terms of their their health concern at that position, and their depth at that position. And Kyle, you alluded to the fact that they haven't added a whole lot of depth there, and that's very true, and I'm concerned about that. As somebody who's had a ton of injuries themselves,

they have some some things that they need to worry about. Obviously, Lee can't afford to get any more concussions and we can't have you know, Vanders, you know, I'm concerned about him being able to run a hit like he wants to. Right, he's excited, he's Egg's athletic. All those guys are right, But there is concerned there because it doesn't take much. It takes one bad angle and all of a sudden

he's back sidelined again. So these are things that we don't wish upon anybody, but these are real issues that we have to be prepared for, and I don't think that we've addressed it and positioned ourselves to be ready to handle that should those issues present themselves again. But you know, I'm excited about that front, that front line allowing these guys to run free, and I'm looking forward to seeing that energy that all of them bring, especially

Jalen and vander As. Those two leads kind of like the the the clearheaded one in terms of being calm and being that you Jedi. But those two on the outside are gonna be able to run free. And I'm looking forward to seeing them all come together and just have fun because they are going to be able to random make plays. Uh you know, they're gonna be in position to how I'll have a lot more blitzes than they've ever had. So it should be it should be fun to watch. Hey, Rob, did I take all of

your points? I knew, I knew that was possible, But I did some research today, did some research today about that forty one vertical. He actually Vanderesh, by the way, thirty nine and a half is vertical at the combine. This what an athlete he is because got this from an Idaho station. Heck, here you go. Players eight players before Vanderesh since oh eight have gotten that type of vertical at the combine at over two hundred and fifty pounds.

And the list is pretty good. Miles Garrett, bud Dupree, Khalil Mack, Jamie Collins, Brian Rackpo and Connor Baldwin. That's a list of a lot of guys that have had success in the league, and it just speaks to his overall talent level. Like like Isaiah said, he's got to come back healthy and he says he's feeling great. That's great news. You know, you've got to have that depthit linebacker because it is such a physical position. They need a guy like you know, Joe Thomas is a great

guy to have as a reserve. Luke Gifford needs to take a step forward. He had some injuries last year. They need him to make this team and be ready to fill in if needed. But when they're healthy, man, this is a group that's as good as when they're at their best, as as any group in the NFL. And you guys are right. Depending on how they make

this defense, maybe more multiple. It could showcase more of what Jalen Smith can do as a rusher and really all those guys because they've shown a knack for being able to get me far and Rob I that you brought up the point of the multiple, the hybrid defense. I don't think there's a position group that's going to be more effected with the new Mike Nolwyn way of playing defense than these linebackers. Then seeing potentially having Jalen Smith kind of pigeonholed into maybe more of a path

treasure role. You have Layton vander Eshi and coverage. I think a guy who benefits from that a lot is Francis Bernard, the undrafted free agent out of Utah who's grating coverage. I think he benefits a lot from what Mike Nolan's bringing to the table, and he may end

up fitting that mold going into twenty twenty. But heck mansary to cut you off there, and I'll pitch it to you here, but what do you think about the changes that are being made with Mike Nolan and this defense and how exactly that could affect the xs and ohs of this linebacking corps. Well, I mean, I think it's evident anytime you have a changing of the guard, as far as the coaching staff is concerned, that you look for a different scheme. We're looking for the scheme

that best fits the guys that we have. And when you talk about that that list that Rob just went off of, I mean, Khalil Mack, you know, come on, man, I mean that's a that's that ain't bad. That's a that's a list of guys that you want to be in the company of those guys. But guys, look, it's the defense itself has to make a change. We have to make a change up from when you look over last season and you know, some of the vanilla coverages

that we had, we became really predictable. But when you have special athletes like Layton Vander esh and Jalen Smith, you have to use them and you have to put them in the situations and the scheme to succeed. And that's what I see Nolan doing. You know, we forget and you know, Kyle, I got a little upset with you a couple weeks ago when we were talking about Jaylen Smith and you kind of throw a little shade.

But I want got everybody to remember that Jaylen Smith is is still the guy that beat Deshaun Watson to the polom. So you talk about a special athlete, that

is who he is. And so if coach Nolan, all of these guys are really salivating to get their hands on these guys to put them in the positions to succeed because they know that they have a bunch of athletic guys that can make make plays for them, Isaiah, I want to ask the question of whenever a new scheme is implemented and you do have guys that maybe see their role change a little bit, whether it's offensively or defensively, do some players take exception to that to say, hey,

I am a hybrid player. I can both play in coverage and pass rush, or do they normally kind of realize what their specialties are whenever it's on the field. Every player knows what they're best at, right and everybody everybody's kind of comfortable in a certain position and being

utilized in a certain way. But when you have as much talent as you do on this defense, I can't imagine there being anybody that's so stubborn to the fact that they don't want to move around and be utilized in the most efficient way to benefit the entire team. So even though guys, do you know, hey, I might be a really great edge rusher. Okay, well I'm gonna move you inside on this play. That's fine if that

helps us get make plays, and let's let's do it right. So, I think having a defensive coordinator that's able to put you in a position and having the amount of talent around you where it really doesn't matter. Right, I can move around, So what if I play on the right end? Okay, this play, I'm on the left, and then next thing you know, I'm playing on the second level in linebacker.

There's so much that could be done here when you have so much talent, and I just I really want to drive home the fact that I'm excited to see these guys get together right and build that continuity, because when you're out there and you're flying around and you're having fun, it just reminds me of my times when I was in Seattle and we had so much talent on defense and it didn't matter where guys were right, it didn't matter. Guys were making plays, and you're excited

for your boy to make plays. And I think that's where we're gonna see here. It just really depends on the culture that's created once they touched the field, and it's going to be interesting looking at how really the linebackers, along with the those tackles are kind of thrown into all of this because you've got Jalen Smith, you've got Layton Vanderiche hopefully completely back and healthy, all of the

depth that Rob mentioned earlier. I want to kind of focus in on here, though, is the unsung hero, the one that's been forgotten even though he's been here forever. And that's Sean Lee. I mean, last year he showed that he has some left in the tank. Whether it was against LA even against Philly on the road, he had a pretty solid game in terms of the grades

that he had. I think Pro Football Focus had him close to in elite grade during that matchup on the road against Philadelphia and in the next to last week of the season. But Rob, what kind of role do you see Sean Lee having in what is going to be a new look defense? Well, I mean he can. I think what he proved last year is he can do and he's probably already proved that in his career he could do whatever he made him to do. I mean, he can play anywhere. He's been a middle linebacker, he's

been a weak side linebacker. He accepted that strong side role, which has significantly less snaps given the amount of sub packages that defenses played. And then he filled in for Vanderesh And you know what, I think he kind of told us after the year, the way he played proved to himself and especially his health too, because as Ai is right, you know, that's been an issue for him and he admits it. To play sixteen games that has

never happened in his career full sixteen. He proved to himself, Look, I can still do this, I can still help this team. I think his role is whatever is asked of him, honestly, because I think I think he could do it. I think he understands that Vanderesh and Jalen are the future of this defense and he embraces that and he is Those guys will tell you he has been a mentors for those guys, and I think he'll just continue to do that, honestly. That's that's a great point. That's a

great point, Robin. And like you said, I mean that milestone for him was actually playing a full sixteen game season and he did that in ten years. It took him ten years to actually accomplish that. But it's not because of any Look, Sean Lee is a tough guy. You know, he is the compliment captain and team leader. And we have to talk about the fact that when it comes down to the linebacker group, I mean, this is the lifeline that quarterback in your linebackers you know

when I was a linebacker. But those are the smartest guys on your team, right, so you you want those guys to be you know, up temple flying around as you said, Isaiah. But also, man, your whole team feeds off of what your defense is doing, and they're feeding off of their living. Your vent is Shun Lee, who

can play all of those positions. And so guys keep that in mind with Nolan's defense, because if these guys are able to put pressures, get interceptions, you know, sacks, you know, big play, who plays and things like that, and especially coming from your eleven year veteran, everybody's calling him Paul Paul. But if he can actually be if he can actually be that guy, that's the tone center

for your defense. Now that just permeates and feeds your whole teams and give you guys the energy and momentum that you need in those tough games. Man, Listen, here, Lee is the John Stockton, He is the Steve Nash of this defense. Nothing is going to happen unless he is at the grand c interestation of it all. And his job is simply to be consistent. His job is

to be consistent. His job is to be the brain of that of that of that front seven, and he's just there to simply make plays like he always does right and be a smart player to get guys in position if you guys don't know. Middle linebacker's job is to make sure that everybody knows what the heck's going on,

knows the calls. He's also in charge of making sure that McCoy and poul and everybody else, all all those guys are gonna be lined up accordingly, that they're in the right shade, right, that he's able to distinguish what the quarterbacks calling right, any kind of keys or tips at the quarterbacks giving golf for office, a linement, giving off. That's his job to identify that and make sure his

guys are in position and make them plays. So that's what it's going to be asked of Lee during this season. He's gonna do what he always does and make plays. And I think he's going to be substantially more healthier than he has ever been because of the guys that are in front of him. So I think he's really looking forward to this year as well, because he's never had had guys in front of him like this or assistance on the side of him. You know, I love

a good to BA reference. Now John stopped Hi back in the day he stopping You were a Knicks fan, and you can't like John Stockton. Stop it. So now with all of that being said, and Isaiah, I think you brought up a magnificent point of hopefully he's healthy enough throughout the back half of the season or even at the beginning, more so than he has been in the past, because in twenty nineteen he was healthy for

the majority of the year. But are any of you worried about his health because of what this offseason has been, the fact that they haven't had the application and they may not have as much application of on field time practice reps and being able to get your body ready for the NFL. If there's anybody that I guess could get the body ready, it might be Sean Lee. But are you guys worried. I'm not. I'm not worried. I mean, you think about what concerns we have about him right?

Is his head right? And at this time in the off season you wouldn't be hitting anybody anyway, So in terms of him, there's nothing. There's no concerns there. I don't have any concerns with Vandersch at this point in time of the off season because they wouldn't be hitting anybody anyways, right. Our concerns that we have for those two specifically are going to be when those guys get the pans on right and they started hitting guys. My concern with Jaylen Smith is, Hey, that boy's explosive is

all get out. Has he been having the offseason that he needs to have because he's going to be running a lot more. He's gonna be blitzing a lot more. He's gonna be asked to go side to side a lot more. So these are you know, soft tissue injuries. I'm more concerned about those early on in camp and all the fans out there get prepared. Guys will get back healthy, but there will be soft tissue injuries because

you cannot duplicate real live reps. And guys are gonna get back, They're gonna be excited, They're gonna be trying to show off for the coaches, are gonna be uh, you know, positioning themselves for you know, to for starting roles. So it's gonna it's gonna get real. So the physical aspect in terms of the head injuries and neck injuries not so much more so to soft tissue injuries. Yeah, I worry about a guy. I'm sorry, I don't. I don't worry about a guy like Sean Lee. Just to

answer that, man, he's the consummate professional. You know that he's going to have his body ready to go at the beginning. And for all of these guys, I mean when you see the training that they're doing and they're putting this on Instagram for all of us to see them getting in shape. But the same for jayals Smith, he knows what's going to be asked of him, and of all the guys. I mean, he had an exceptional year last year, one hundred and sixty eight tackles, which

got him into the Pro Bowl. Laton Vanderish off his rookie season being in All Pro as a rookie, So you know, all of these guys are itching to get back to that prime position and taking care of themselves is the first thing. But in COVID and this whole thing that's going on, I know that Sean Lee is somebody that you don't have to worry about. He's been

in the league for ten years. If anybody knows how to get their body right and how to fuel going into an NFL season, he would probably be one of the ones right up at the top of the list, especially with some of the health issues he's had to go with and go through throughout the course of his career. Now we're gonna step aside. When we come back, we'll

have a special guest join us. Look a little bit different when we come back on the other side of the break because Patrick Crayton, former Cowboys wide receiver, joins the show and he's going to answer the question just how good can this wide receiver corps be for the Dallas Cowboys. And when we come back here on talking Cowboys. Since eighteen sixty five, Stetson hats are American maid with pride right here in Texas, and Stetson is proud to

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no no, you gotta speak up. Go now, go now, he mom, all right, get the ultimate fan experience for the ultimate Cowboy fan. Join Cowboys United and get an exclusive DCU fan packing members benefits. Membership starts at only twenty dollars. Visit Dallas Cowboys dot com slash you're hying it to join today? Thank you very much. Check how about that coming out of the break and look at

a little bit different. We're on WebEx now as opposed to where we were on our normal show earlier, and we'll be popping around like we have in the past. I believe we've done this once or twice, but it is different being remote as as normal. I mean, we're in our respective as WBC Mortgage Studios talking cowboys here on Dallas cowboys dot Com. We're still waiting for our special guests. The suspense is killing us Patrick Craton joining in the show. But Isaiah, I want to give you

a chance. Before we get into Patrick actually being on the show, I want you to preface one of the reasons why he's popping on is because you guys had a little bit of a competition last night. We definitely had a little competition, and uh, you know, I really I love competition, you know, and I and um, you know, coming into the league as a young rookie, there's there's a gentleman, young veteran by the name of Patrick Crayton that I happened to kind of stay in his hip pocket, right.

I was kind of his little brother. And you know, as little brothers, do you know, we're kind of a past you know, we always in there, you know, always in the ear, and a big brothers kind of throw us around a little bit. So whenever you have an opportunity to get back at your big brother, you pretty much hop all over that. Right. So over the past few weeks, I've been bowling my guy down at a

Bowski's Dallas. Over at Lakewood, Dallas. They've been having a virtual bowling a bowl of bullet on every Monday night, and I've been beating friends left and right. And I caught out Patrick Crayton this this past week and I had an opportunity to take him on last night and they head best of three, and I happened to beat him in the first two games, and he decided he wanted to bowl a third game, and your boy had I had to bring out my broomstick, you know. Yeah,

I had a brand of broomstick. Was a clean, sweet, clean sweet you know. I told him he had a valiant effort, you know, And I acknowledged the fact he had a value effort, but he just wasn't good enough. Patrick is on the line now, and Patrick, first off, thanks for joining us here on talking cowboys. Secondly, I want to give you a chance to rebuttal Isaiah has been talking about how he swept you at bowling last night, and I wanted to I want to hear from your side.

Did that actually happen and was it as dominant as he says? So let me just break down everything for you guys, just just just go ahead and start from the top, because what he's not doing and he's not really telling the whole story of the reason why you got me. And I have no excuse, have no excuse. He beat me. But Isaiah travels with fifteen balls to the to the you know, to the to the lanes. I'm like, what the hell he had? He had a chauffeur and brought in balls and a suitcase that had

his balls in it. I don't know what I'm supposed to do right here, and so and so I get there. You know, I had to go get my ball out of the attic because you know, I don't. I haven't both I had, I had put the had put the shoes up in the ball up. You know, I was like, sid, I retired. He brought me out of retirement. And he had just said he had just added what you yeah, added what six more balls to your collection? A couple

more last night. Well, I think he forgets to tell you, guys that he had picked the lane that to buddy of his. But the further and further let me know that he had put magnets into pins in his ball. So he had so he had a remote control on them get a root problem. Oh my god, supposed to do that? Good? What's cool? I get that. You know, if you're not doing the Patriots model, you're not cheating, you ain't trying. He got me last night. He got me last night. I think I think I did both.

Now I take that back. I was gonna say, I think I bowed the highest total. You bowed to one ninety one game, I bowed to one eighty four. Yeah, that's right. I know you wanted to stick with you, with your with your game Jersey never you know, but I had to go. I had to go Jake ratting up one night, so it was out. But man, it was all. It was all good fun man for for a good cause. Uh. You know, I think we uh we want some people some things. Last night I wish

I could have want some people some more. But I wasn't on my a game and at times he was. And that's how it happened. And that's how it goes. I mean, that's how sports goes. It's got the ebbs and flows. You'll get him back, I'm sure. I'm sure Isaiah will publicly. Yeah, I'm getting ready to I'm getting ready to u go over to the store in the

second man and get me twenty seven balls. So, now, as a former wide receiver and a former Dallas Cowboy, I'm sure you've kind of kept your finger on the pulse whenever it comes to what the Cowboys have a wide receiver at least heading into this twenty twenty season. The draft pick of CD Lamb, Michael Gallup, then Amari Cooper and his new deal. How good can this wide receiving corps b not only just this year but moving forward? In your eyes? You know what I think moving forward

past that we have. What I love about him is I think they're all still young and hungry, you know, And I think that's the that's the main part you have. I think they still have a lot to prove. Amari just getting a new country. He has to prove he's worth a hundred million dollars. And then you CD and Gallup coming in that are both hungry guys, which I like, you know, I hate that Jerry keeps wanting to put eighty eight on every first round draft pick that he gets.

CD wants to make his own mark and make his own name, And I'm like, Jerry, let that man he wants to work ten. Why are you wanting to make him eighty eight? He wants to be his own person. He doesn't want to be known as the next eighty eight. He wants to be known as the first ten. So

that that kind of mindset is good. And I'm hoping they don't try to put him in that box of all the other eighty eights to where you know he has do it, because I'm like, well, you just gave Amark Cooper eighty eight type of money, but you're giving this rookie that's coming in the number eighty eight. So it's like, okay, well which one of them? What do you want them to be? But I think they can move forward. I'm just waiting on them to hurry up

and get this Dak deal done. That's gonna be the major thing moving forward, because you got to have a quarterback throw to these guys, and I get it. You know you're going to get Andy Dalton. You know he's the homegrown kid you bring it back home. But he is not your franchise guy. You said back is your franchise guy. That's good, and get this deal done. I don't care what it looks like on paper, what is

the fully guaranteed money. Get it done, move forward, Jerry, because you know he's not gonna make it to the fifth theory anywhere anyway, so that forty five million on paper doesn't matter. So get the deal done, make it happen.

Let's move forward. Now. I want to ask the question of and Isaiah could actually answer this as well, But whenever it comes to a wide receiver not really knowing what's going on with the situation of his quarterback, whether it's a contract issue, health issue, there's just a question mark over that quarterback position. How much does that affect

wide receivers going into a season. But I can't really answer that simply because I've never been in this situation, But you know, you it does add to some comfort level and continuity. When you know you're gonna have the quarterback. You know you've got ahead, so you get working and hopefully you know Dak is out here working with these guys on their own anyway, so you know, as long as they're doing that, let the business stuff him with

the business stuff. You guys go out there and build up a relationship in a repertoire on the field, so when it comes time for September. You're ready to go. Hey, pat we did a show together, I guess the week of the Patriots game last November with one oh five three of the fan and back then it was like everything was still in front of this team. Yep, it didn't It didn't go so well in December right after that.

A couple of two questions for you, why why do you think this team didn't quite take didn't take the step they needed to take last year. And I know you're a student of the game, and I know you played against Mike McCarthy's teams a few times a few years ago. Why do you think he's a good fit for this team coming in replacing Jason Karrett. No, I think he's a good fit simply because of his innovativeness. I love that you know him and Aaron Rodgers bumped

heads because Aaron was trying to supersede the coach. But Mike McCarthy has proven himself to be you know, at one time they were considering him the best play calling offensive coordinator in the game. And with this staple of weapons that he's gonna have, I think he's gonna be able to really open up that offense. But the biggest thing. Now, you know, he's got to be able to connect with

Dak and start running the offense for Dak's strengths. The biggest thing you know they're gonna have is as long as they got a good running back. You know. I get it that they the Cowboys wanted Dak to stay in the pocket and put the pressure on him and everything so they could justify paying him. But at the end of the day, don't take away carries from your main threat offensively, and stop telling Dak to not run the damn ball. Run the ball that when you need

to run the ball, I don't. Don't get labeled as a pocket passer. Who cares you're gonna get paid regardless. Russell Wilson, Patrick Mahomes, Lamar Jackson, they're not pocket passers, Deshaun Watson, they're not pocket passing. The day of that oct Pastor stigma is gone. It is. It is gone pretty much because you cannot the way these d ns and these linebackers come. Then pocket pass if you want to. When you're gonna be over back a minute, PC man,

it's heck Maharrison man. I want to tell you I'm a big fan of yours man, growing up here in the city of Dallas, Texas. I know your history at De Soto. Man, I've always compared you a lot to Cata of Kevin Williams from Roosevelt Man. Both of you guys big, big, big return guys and also possession guys here in Dallas for the Dallas Cowboys, but also with

man with COVID nineteen and everything going on. I want, I'm itching to ask you about this, to know what did you think about the whole draft process and you being a local guy that actually got to live out his dream playing for the Dallas Cowboys and these guys that are from the Metroplex not actually getting that opportunity to participate in Dallas Day. You know what, Like Dallas Day was a big thing for me. You know that that really kind of gives you that little I opening

experience to the NFL. But I actually liked the experience they had this year because everyone was at home with their family, that was not having to go on stage and shake hands with Roger Goodell and sitting that green room dressed and suited. You could be at home with your family and enjoy the whole experience of it with your loved ones, not with the other people who in the media and everything and stuff like that. You know what I'm saying, raw Roy and and and hustling you

around and showing you where you gotta be. Oh man, that's good and everything for the goods and glamour, but it's not the real thing that you're going to see every day in the NFL. Good manrobably running through a wall or wanting to run through a wall after that that question being asked, Man, hema, heckma, smiling ear to hear with Patrick Craig PC PC from De Soto. Man,

I know who PC is. Appreciated, man, you know everyone's finally can get you know, recognized, just how your name seeing I'm feeling good and last night Isaiah beat the Franks off for me. So geez well, Patrick, we we thank you for coming on and we apologize that our fellow Isaiah, I just couldn't. Couldn't at least let you win one to Kyle, he ain't supposed let me win. No, that's how you know I'm gonna get you back. I know I'm gonna get you by in case y'all didn't know,

and PC knows the story. I know we gotta get a log off. But my first day of practice, I remember I got drafted. I was a quarterback quarterback in college, but I got drafted as a receiver, so I had no idea how to play receiver. I knew nothing about it. Right when I stepped on the field for the first day, and PC and Teo clowned the crap out of me because I had on every pad that you can possibly a great thing. He looked like a damn hockey play goad. Dang, dude,

why why are you dressed like the man? So any time I get a chance to get back at PC, I gotta talk to take every advantage I got. Gotta take the chance you gotta. You gotta get them back. But Patrick Craton joining us here on talking cowboys. Patrick thinks so much, and we'll look forward to talking to you again soon. No, man, man, absolutely, man, you guys let me know. I'm sorry I was late, but yeah, please feel free hit me up next time. See me

like a faith notification text. Because I was. I was bitty, so you gotta hit me up with a romand I had much many moving parts. You're a busy man. We get that. We're gonna do it. We'll do better on our party getting you on the show Quicker, but that is gonna do it here for this edition of Talking Cowboys, do you want to thank every single one of you for sticking around over the last hour on Dallas Cowboys dot Com Before Isaiah Standback for heck My Harrison, for

Rob Phillips and our guest Patrick Crayton. I'm Kyle Yeoman saying so long for this week you're on Talking Cowboys. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys four o'clock How long you know