It really is like a fine art of vulnerability because you wanna be vulnerable enough where you allow people to resonate with you, but you don't wanna be so vulnerable that they think you're weak or they think you're just completely out of line.
This is Tales From the Pros, where business leaders and influencers share their stories of inspiration, struggles, and successes. And I'm your host, Michael Georgiou. Hey, everyone. Welcome to Tales From the Pros, and this is Michael Georgiou, your host and cofounder of Imagine Ovation. My awesome guest with me here today is the CEO and cofounder of MedSnake Media.
She's a stage 4 cancer survivor and is one of the top content creators on LinkedIn that has been able to generate 100 of millions of views through her inspirational and insightful content and has a social following of over 260,000 people. She is an international goodwill ambassador for public health, and she also serves as a global goodwill ambassador. Please welcome Chanae Moret. Chanae, I really appreciate you being here today. Thank you so much.
I appreciate the invite. This is awesome. Thank you.
It's a good a good ending to a busy day. Right? We talked about this earlier.
Yeah. I was supposed to be on here, like, early earlier today, but I was stuck out of the office. But now I'm here, so that's all that matters.
No. It's good. No. I appreciate you. I know you're you're a very busy woman, and, you know, I know you're doing probably a thousand things. So I'm I'm very grateful for you to, you know, spend 30 or 40 minutes with me. So, you know, and I I I wanna start off, Shanae, of talking about, you know, your story. I know from you know, I've been following you for a while now. I mean, well over a year, year and a half. And, you know, I love your content.
It's very positive. It's very inspirational. And as I mentioned before, it's insightful. And and I think it you know, a lot of people are learning from it, how authentic your content is. And I think authenticity is it's not as it's not that easy.
Sometimes it's hard for ourselves to for us to be ourselves on camera. Even for me, I'm guilty of it. I'm just like, what the heck do I say? Or what do I I don't even know how to you know, it's just it's crazy. But, I think that's a gift that you have, and, people are learning from it. So, you know, I I want you to talk a little bit about how you got to where you are today. You know, we mentioned that you're also a cancer survivor and
Mhmm.
You do, you know, you are a successful entrepreneur. You own a a company. But talk give me a little background of of yourself and and kinda why you're here.
Okay. So, well, the cancer survivor part, I grew up in and out of hospitals for about 10 years, hospitals in Miami, mainly Jackson Memorial Hospital. And I was diagnosed at an early age with bilateral Wilms tumors. I basically had cancer, like, a lot of cancer in both my kidneys, an extremely rare type of cancer. And, they told my mom multiple times that I was not going to make it.
I was not going to, you know, that her child was going to die. And I had to go through chemo and surgery. But that really, as a child, it made me it made it impacted me to really appreciate health care and really appreciate the doctors, the medicines, the nurses that would help me feel better as I was healing. And I understood it from a patient perspective. I understood health care very early.
So today, it makes sense that, like, what we do, the creative that we do, the growth strategies that we do for health care digital health care startups or just health care companies in general, it's kind of a way for me to use my skill set to give back to the industry that helped save my life. So that was, that's part of, like, the cancer journey. But that really and that's where copywriting you wanna talk about storytelling, I know, in a little bit, but that's really where I couldn't go out and play like a normal kid because of the germs and stuff. Even my little sister would have to wear masks around me and stuff for a long time. So my first love was really like reading and writing.
I would love to read. I would devour like books, like one book a day almost. And, yeah, and I would love to write, you know, so because I couldn't really use my body. I had to lay down and heal and whatever, stay in the hospital. So I entertained myself that way. And that's really where, you know, I guess my respect for health care and my love for writing kind of were born through, you know, me having to, go through that healing process.
Wow. So it seems like all the the difficult times you went through, especially, you know, you know, going through cancer and all of that, it it kind of gave you this, it it's almost like it gave you gave you this drive to give back, back to health care because that that's, you know, you're you're a health you're a health survivor. You know, you survive, you know, a, you know, a deadly disease and you feel that it's, it's almost like a something, a blessing that you feel that you need to pour onto others. It's pretty awesome.
Yeah. And I didn't really know how I was going to do that, like, you know, getting out of college, going into college even. I didn't know if I was gonna do that by becoming a doctor. My parents really, admittedly, wanted me to become a doctor, but there's there was just something within me that I didn't feel like that was my calling per se. I knew I would have to do something with health care, but really wasn't sure what that would be until I had my daughter.
And that was 3 years ago. She'll be 4 in December. When I had my daughter, everything started to kind of fall together in terms of, like, okay, health care. I could use my copywriting skills in the health care space. And, and then that's kind of where, like, how I am where I am today started like the foundations of it.
But, yeah, it just makes perfect sense. I really thought about it one day, and I was like, wow. Like, I'm so passionate about this. I could push so hard. I can perform high every day because I am passionate about it. But the reason I'm passionate about it is because, like, I want to help these companies grow so that they can impact patients' lives and help people live high quality lives.
That's good. You have, it seems like you have really good intentions. I know you deal with a lot of start ups and even even larger companies and, you know, I do as well. And we I I I'm not hearing this as much as I used to, but I have definitely heard it that you get the start up and they have, you know, they're they're very smart. They have all these great ideas, and they're just like, you know, we we wanna exit in a year or 2 or we wanna you know, it's just like, oh, man.
Here we go. You know, it's, the the intention is to, you know, to make money fast. And, I'm sure a lot of the the leaders that you follow, they they talk about patience, patience and perseverance. I call it the 2 p's. It's patience and perseverance. Yeah. I think are are, some of the, the the keys to success. I know success is all different. We all identify success differently. We all have our subjective views on success.
For me, it's not really monetary. I'm sure for you, it's not either. Obviously, we have to provide for our families and for others, but, at the end of the day, when we when we die, we're not taking any of these things with us. Right? We have to leave something behind.
Right. You know, Yeah. Somebody that I was on LinkedIn Live with earlier, his name is Justin. He he comes from an incredible family, but that's another story. But he mentioned something, and he said that the person that has impacted him the most asked him what his dash was, and he's like, what's a dash?
And the guy is like, you don't know what a dash is? And he's like, no. What is that? And he's like, you know, like, on your tombstone, it says, like, your birth date, and then it says, like, dash, and then it says, like, the day or the year you die. And it's like, what are you gonna live for?
Like, what what is your dash gonna be made of? What is the legacy that you're gonna leave behind? And when he said that, I was like, oh my gosh, That's so powerful. So, I'm gonna pass that on. Like, what what is what is the listener's dash?
And it should be more than money. It's incredible to have nice things and and to have nice things and to really take care of your health and your family's health and have have them, you know, have a good education and stuff. There's a certain necessity for financial freedom and all that finances, but your dash should be more than just money. And, I I don't know. I'd like to pass it on. When I heard that, it was, like, pretty interesting.
Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's it really is true because I think when we focus on something like money, and I'm not saying people people that have done this, it hasn't worked. I'm not saying that. There's I know a lot of people that have focused so much on money, and and they're really wealthy.
They're they're so financially driven and, you know, and it doesn't make them bad people. Nothing like that. It's just at least for me, I can talk for myself. I don't want to rely on on money or on just on being fine you know, wealth wealthy financially. I want I want wealth in here and in here.
You know, and and for me, that's better because I know if my intentions are in the right place, I thought I always talk about motives on on this podcast, and, I think if we have our motives in the right place, then we're unstoppable. You know, if if we have the best intentions, no one can stop you because you're so passionate. You're doing things for the right reasons. Right. You can overcome, I mean, I think almost any struggle, any obstacle.
So And you'll you'll attract a lot of people to help you on your journey. So I feel like when you have that those pure intentions and that authenticity, people recognize that, and they're more willing to, you know, give give their mentorship or kinda give you their guidance, especially if they're far more successful than you. That's kind of how I've come across my mentors is that they recognize a certain, you know, level of, like, okay. She's passionate. She her intentions are pure and, like, you know, this is, like, a driven person.
And usually, successful people wanna help driven people to succeed so that, you know, they can work together with them in the future, so on and so forth.
Yeah. That's really cool. It's true. You know? And and talking about authenticity, and also in regards to your story, what what was the journey like when you first got on to LinkedIn? I know now you have a huge following. You're probably I I don't know how you keep track of like, we talked about before all the messages. I'm just like, how do you do that? You probably do thousands of them. But, essentially, you know, what is it been like on LinkedIn as part of your story?
Did you Yep. Were you always very aggressive with your content, or did you scale up slowly, or you were always doing videos, or how was what was it like to be?
Good question. So, I joined I started, like, looking on LinkedIn around July 2018, and, it allowed me to get enough, like, freelance copywriting contracts that I was able to replace my income at my corporate employer, like, through just my freelance gigs on LinkedIn. So I knew there was business on the platform, but I didn't I didn't post my first video or my first piece of content until late November of 2018. And when I did, it did really well, but I kinda thought it was a fluke because you can't you see how supportive people are on LinkedIn. So I was just like, oh, they're just being supportive because that's my first video, you know, whatever.
And then the next day, I posted my second video, and it did even better. And I was like, that's just my second video. Like, you know what I mean? It's just whatever. By the time it got to, like, my 5th video, like, it just all the videos kept doing better and better.
So I was like, well, what's going on here? Because I'm the type of person that I like to get feedback from people, whether it's our clients, whether it's my colleagues, whether it's my mentors, whatever. So I want to understand, like, I wanted to understand why I was getting these views because, the sound quality was terrible. I didn't, you know, some of them I looked like a mess. And, you know, so I just started asking people, like, why did you think this video was good in person and then in messenger?
And they're like, yeah. Like, the sound isn't the best or whatever, but it's what you're saying. And that was, like, basically what everyone was getting to. The message that I was trying to get across was, like, really cool. And, also, a lot of people at that time, video was relatively new to LinkedIn, and especially the women on the platform were getting, like, all their makeup and dolled up and kinda like treating it like it was like a studio.
And I just kinda grabbed my phone and was like, yeah, I'm just wherever I was, I just did a video. And so they're like, oh, you're real. And so I kind of understood the power of video after, like, a week of it. I started getting, like, this, like, wave of, like, higher quality, higher, contracts and stuff. And I was like, woah, this can generate business.
And again, I'm the type of person, like, I whatever is gonna give me 80% of the results, like, I'm gonna go, you know, like you know what I mean? I I saw the results very early on. So I just kept doing it. I stayed consistent. And there were, like, a lot of great people on the platform at the time, and I've just been able to surpass them in terms of growth and my growth rate and stuff, not because I am I do anything extraordinary, but just because I'm consistent.
Like, a lot of people fall off for a week or 2 or a month when they try to get back on the horse or whatever. And I've just stayed consistent since that time. So that's really how it started. And if you go back to, like, my first videos, which I should, like, reshare, like, the You should. Combination of them. But, like, you will see, like, the sound I didn't even have an iPhone. Like, the quality was so bad, but yet people really like the message. So, it was interesting.
It really is about the message. I mean, I'll tell you this. It's a little embarrassing, but, a lot embarrassing. It's just you're wondering, you know, why did I spend so much time and money on that? We've, you know, for, for us, we I used to have a we used to have a video team, you know, years ago, and, and it was a great experience, but we it was good for clients.
We did a lot of videos for clients, which is great. But when we did it for ourselves and we spent, you know, thousands of dollars and time and hours, resources, all of that, And you put it on YouTube or LinkedIn, and you see, like it's, like, 80 views. You're like, ay ay ay ay. Yeah. And you can all Why is it it's so professional, and it's not yet it lacks in authenticity, and I'm guilty of that.
I think we're all guilty of that. And then the ones where I didn't expect I was just myself, and you and I'm like, you know what? I I can give to hoots about what people think. I don't care. I'm just gonna I have a good message. I'm passionate about it,
and I'm
gonna put it on on, social media, and that got better engagement. It's just Yeah.
Yeah. It's, you know, it's just also the psychology. We've just been so inundated with, like, ads and and all of that. And there is actually a company that came to us, a health care company that came to us during the whole COVID thing, and they're like, marketing I guess their marketing consultant had told them you have to do professional videos for your brand, whatever. They're coming to us for, for, like, advice on how to grow on LinkedIn because we help people do that.
And I said it's only gonna work. The people that follow my guidance grow at even a faster rate than I have grown. We have and it doesn't matter. Males, females, because in the excuse, it was like, oh, you're just growing because you're like a girl on the platform. I've heard that a million times. Well, our our largest client is a guy. So, like, I mean That's
true. That's true. Yeah.
But like, I told them, you have to take, like, these authentic videos. We'll send you the scripts, like, blah blah blah. And they didn't wanna do it. They they they thought it was unprofessional for their brand. And I'm like, well, we can't work with you then because what you guys are doing, it's like what what you're saying.
They hired all these camera crews, all this stuff. They're posting it on, YouTube and LinkedIn, and they're getting, like, 60 views, 50 views. And it's like you have to you have to understand what people want. A lot of people make content for themselves, and it's kind of like, oh, I look good or whatever. You have to understand that's not what people are are gonna be able to resonate with or connect to. So
Yeah. I I you know, I'm I'm seeing a trend with, you know, a lot of the people I've interviewed on the show that do have an amazing reach on LinkedIn and even in the other platforms. And something common, a commonality that I see is, they say that it's about others. It's about you.
Yeah. Yeah. I don't make the decision.
That itself. It's it's some it's somewhat reverse effects that when you keep doing something for other people, you're gonna get it back. Mhmm. You know? You keep doing it. And even if you don't, that's okay. You know, you don't have to get it back. If for you to even provide inspirational content on LinkedIn, you probably help someone from
Oh.
They're even doing damage to themselves. I mean, in reality, right now, we're living in
a world that is really giving up. Giving up. I mean, I've had people message me like, hey. Your your message is, like, the only reason I got out of bed today. Or, you know, I've never told I've never heard, like, hey, I didn't commit suicide because of this message. But, like, you never know how you're gonna impact somebody or how
Right.
Your message is just gonna give somebody that extra glimpse of hope that they need to, like, send out one more job application or meet go to one more networking event where they meet somebody that you know, then their life will change. You know what I mean? And and I really, that's where feedback comes in. A lot of people who the mistake they make is that they continue to publish content. They're not wondering why their engagement is not going up.
And that's something where I really recommend that people do. If your engagement is plateauing or it's just not compounding and not going up, you know, you have to ask people, like, why? What could I have done? You have to really put your ego aside. Like, how could I have made this message better for you?
How it just it just means getting zero engagement means that people are not connecting with your message. So you have to, like, really have that humility and be like, okay. Well, why are they not connecting with my message? How could I present this in a way where they can't connect with my message? How is it gonna help them?
Like, if you don't put it around the consumer, which is basically the person on the feed, you have to give them a reason to stop and give you their time. You know, you have to give them a reason to pause in their busy life to give you their attention. And the way you do that is, you give them a reason to. You have to. If not, they're just gonna scroll down and then come to somebody else's post and give them the attention that you should have had. So
Mhmm. Yeah. It's so true. And I love when you talk about consistency. It's yeah. It it really is. It's so true because and I'll tell you this, I I'm a I'm a case study. I had, you know, nowhere near the amount of the reach or followers that you have, but I told you even before inter you know, before we started, the interview, I I've been consistent the last, I would say the last even 2 months. I'm very new to it still. Before I was on LinkedIn, but it wasn't as much now.
I'm probably spending Right. Right. I would say 3 to 4 hours a week on LinkedIn. I would say maybe even more. I'm I'm really focusing more on it.
That's good.
And I'm I'm putting in extra time, and and I'll tell you that my reach has gone up. In one one post, I even got over a 1000 likes. That's amazing. You know? And I'm like, wow. This it really is true. And some and some posts, they get 7 likes or 10 likes. It doesn't have to be every post, and and I don't let that get me down, and I'm not even doing videos yet. This is just from text.
Oh my gosh. Yeah. I'm not
doing any videos at all. I haven't done that yet. I still have that fear. It's not that I just sometimes I overthink it. I'm like, what the heck am I gonna talk about today? I do so much in my life. I have this tech company. I have this podcast. What should I talk about? In my post, I just I do I have a, you know, a content plan.
I'll do something on Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, inspiration or storytelling or branding or, you know so I think a big part of it is don't overthink it. Just post. Yeah. It's You don't overthink it. Yeah. Yeah. So
I mean and it's just also, like, what I all my content, like, the the way that I don't get burned out per se, because a lot of people are like, oh my gosh. How do you think about your content? And it's just like paying attention to, like, real life experience. So, like, if I do a post about a friend, like I mean, people are calling me all day or messaging me on LinkedIn that they lost their job, that their employer treated them like x, y, and z. You know, I'm paying attention to what's going on in my close circle, my family.
And it's like, you pay attention to your life. You're gonna, like, be able to, like, see these stories and be able to translate them in a way where it could help other people. Like Mhmm. So that's what I do, so I don't have to, like, basically make something out of nothing. I'm just paying attention.
And, like, it's funny because if I if I hear something or if I'm in a conversation with something with somebody and they share something with me, my mind, I'm like, okay. That's a post. And then I'll put it in my Apple Notes, and then I'll I'll put it as, like, kind of like you're saying in a story form, at a later time. But I'll, like, jot it down and stuff. I'm, like, always paying attention to, like, what's going on with the post.
Yeah. That's so cool.
The sun's, like, shining like
Yeah. It is it is on me. Yeah. It's, like, it's, yeah, setting. But, no, I I I definitely do that. I'll have these ideas, and I write it down. I'm like, oh, that's such a good post. I'm gonna post that tomorrow. And I like what you do, Shanae, with, your content is you don't I I know you have, we'll talk about med MedSnake Media, and I want you to to talk a little bit about that. But, with your healthcare marketing company, you don't really talk about it a lot.
Yeah. I know.
You know, that's interesting. So you see people that have this content. I've seen it. They're always talking about their company. And you're like, cool. Okay. Like, some of it's okay, but you're like, alright. Alright. Alright. For you, I wouldn't even know. I went to your after I saw your content, you know, so many times and I found it engaging, I would see what you did. Boom. There's a connection.
You know
what I mean? And that's how I found you in network. Yeah. You know, we're connecting.
And and that's how I mean, I'll give I could give you, like, so many examples, but that's how all of our clients, like, 99% of them are inbound through LinkedIn, and that's what happens. They just resonate with the story or with the video that I do. They don't necessarily know what I do, but they see me over the weeks or the months. And then they just they go on my profile, optimize for people in the health care health and health care industry. And then if they feel like they need help with growth or whatever, that's when they reach out, and I explain our services and stuff more on the back end.
But, you know, one woman, we recently started her contract less than 2 weeks ago. She connected with me on a post where I was explaining that I don't feel like people need bachelor's degrees to, like, be reception or admins or salespeople. I think that that's absolutely overrated and ridiculous. And she owns a grow company. She owns several nursing homes and home cares.
And she was just like, that's how I've that's my leadership style. That's how I've led in health care in the last 15, 20 years. That's why people, that have been by my side for the past 15 years, and I loved your post. And it was just synchronous synchronous and, serendipitous rather that she also Right. Was looking for marketing.
And so that is that post led to an inbound lead, which led to conversation, which now we're working with her and obviously have the opportunity if we deliver well, which we will with this company. She has, like, 5 other companies waiting for us to serve her too. So that I mean, that post wasn't about marketing. So that's kind of how, I approach LinkedIn. I help as many people as possible through, like, big funnel kind of, topics and stories.
And then whoever I can help, they see my profiles optimized, and then they reach out.
That's cool. Yeah. And and I know, MedSink Media, the company, you and I believe 2 2 other 2 other partners. Is that right?
Yeah. Just Courtney. Courtney, and then we have, like, other other people. You know what I mean? We have Andrea and and Joy, and we have a whole team marketing billing side. But, yeah, Courtney is my my cofounder.
Cool. Yeah. And and, when you both founded this company, I know your target market is health care, which is good. You have this niche market. You're not trying to do everything. Yeah. And, you know, what is all the what are all the what is all that you do there? You know, is it is it just content, or it's I know there's billing. You mentioned billing, and you probably do content as well, and digital marketing, or more content side?
Yeah. So that's a great question. The reason that Courtney and I cofounded this company to begin with was we connected on LinkedIn, and, she was doing medical billing credentialing. If you understand health care, once a facility opens and can accept insurance, whether it's a nursing home that has residents or a private practice or a hospital that has patients, they they need marketing. Because so then they would be like, do you know marketing?
Because now we have to get people in the door. And she was like, no, I don't. But once she met me, she started referring all her people to me. And I was like, wait a second. There's definitely, like, a need, between credentialing and marketing. And we looked. It didn't really exist. So we created a one stop shop where, you know, a nursing home from full development or private practice could get their credential because this is like a 6 month process to get that insurance.
And then
once they open their doors, you know, have that campaign start before they open to start their marketing or whatever. So if it's a new if it's a new company, we really do everything from, like, you know, the branding, the website, like, all of that. A lot of our clients so let's say they're already an established company or they're an older kind of business owner or entrepreneur that's starting a new venture. And what we do is we audit what the what their current marketing efforts are because it's like in health care, they rarely audit the efficacy of their marketing. So we audit what works and what doesn't, and then we kind of help create a custom strategy based on whether we're working with an in house team or whether they're just outsourcing completely to us.
It really just depends. Some some companies were, like, more like consulting if it's like a big health care network, and then we're kind of collaborating with their in house team or, like, leading their in house team on what to do. You know? Other companies, are just like, yeah, I don't even wanna think about this. Do it all. You know what I mean? So we really do acknowledge the needs of the company.
That's good. Yeah. That that's good.
But it could be, like you're saying, video production, just content strategy could be us manning the whole campaign. Like, they don't even wanna think about it. It could be that they wanna learn or that they want the in house marketing department lead to learn, and we're kind of teaching them. It really just there's so many different levels of, like, what we offer that it's, it's really just on a case by case. We can't fit any all of them into one package.
Yeah. And you're you're giving custom packages based on your needs and wants and expectations, and, I'm sure with with you and Courtney's experience, you're probably in in essence, you're guiding them as well. I mean, you have to. A lot of them are looking for guidance because, you know, I mean, we deal everyone's we're all gonna deal with clients that they have certain needs. They're gonna say, hey, Shanae. I'm I'm looking for storytelling video marketing services. That's what I want.
Yeah. And that's amazing. They do not know what they want. But a lot of them it's sad because and it's not even, like, the fault of the marketing companies either, but health care is such like a niche space that a lot of them, you know, go to or they're kind of they're kind of convinced to give, like, a very expensive digital marketing agency. And a lot of the digital marketing companies work with tech and stuff with people that basically understand clicks and all of the marketing lingo.
You're dealing with health care. A lot of the people are older. They don't understand that. They need more come or the marketing agency doesn't really understand health care. Or the marketing agency doesn't really understand health care.
So they have to spend half of their time during the campaign educating them on, like, what what they even really do in the health care space. And it's just, like, it's a waste of money. So, actually, a lot of our clients come to us with a story like, hey, I just wasted a $100 with x, y, and z because either they didn't understand health care or we were just conned. Because they're so busy. Again, they don't have time to even manage their marketing vendor usually or even check-in on them.
So they're just writing monthly invoices and not really understanding the value that they're getting in return until somebody goes, wait. We've paid this company $50. What have they given us? You know what I mean? So then they come to us kinda like disenchanted in, like, a hoax, like, do you guys really understand health care? That's where once we prove that we do, they're like, it's kinda like a sigh of relief. And, and we go from there.
Yeah. I could see you guys probably having to get, you know, because with with health care, you know, we talk about this HIPAA compliant and there's all these laws and regulations and, you know, especially let's just say you're going to be doing, a a digital campaign for a nursing home. So if you do that, and you wanna let's just say you want your video offer to go on film patients, you're gonna need to have slip sign and all these all the, you know, documentation and the policies policies approved and all of that. So you reporting are are aware of that. But some other companies, they'll probably just move forward.
They're like, you know
Or they put it You can't just fill
my patience. Yeah. Exactly.
And or what happens is they kinda just wait for the slips to be done by the in house staff. So now it's gonna take 12 weeks instead of 2 weeks. And because we understand the space, I would be like, who's your chief nursing officer? Like, how can I make her job easier? You know, the this is a patient.
I'll go there with her and have her just, like, sign it right in front of me or whatever. Like, we really make them do as minimal work possible. Like, even even, let's say, like, the the videos, we go to we go to them as much as possible, because, again, you're dealing with people in health care. They don't have time. So you're like, yeah. We'll start the campaign when you send us the videos. You're gonna be waiting for, like, months.
Oh, yeah. Yeah. It's definitely a different
they'll do it, but, like, you're gonna be waiting a long time for them. You know what I mean?
You gotta go over there. You gotta be proactive and and Exactly. Well, re reactive and proactive.
Yeah. Yeah.
That's good. So, you know, Shanae, we talked, you know, we've been talking about storytelling here and there, and I know I've read through your content you believe in the power of storytelling. And, you know, even in one of your articles I think you wrote, you talked about a little bit about the science behind storytelling. Do you have I don't wanna put you on the spot and say, hey, what's your science to storytelling? But what do you consider for you, what what are your storytelling methods that you've seen that are effective with all of the content that you put out?
Whether for your business, personal, whatever it is, what has worked and you're, like, you're very confident about that that has an impact?
Well, I mean, everyone likes a story where someone overcomes some type of adversity and, comes out on the other side. That's just I mean, people love that. And if you have that, you just have to understand how to position it. So I always tell people, like, the way that you even people don't even know their story. This is the problem.
Like, people throw around the word brand and story and stuff, but a lot of people don't really have the self awareness to even, articulate what they can use and what they can't use in a story. And it really is like a fine art of vulnerability because you wanna be vulnerable enough where you allow people to resonate with you, but you don't wanna be so vulnerable that they think you're weak or they think you're just completely out of line. So it it is, a kind of fine line, but basically a story of overcoming, a story where you have to overcome adversity. And that's how, like, you have to have a story also tied to your brand. So my story is important to our brand because I survived something related to health and health care.
So it makes sense to tie that.
There's the connection.
Exactly. So I tell people, like, what have you overcome? What adversity have you overcome? How did you overcome that adversity? But how can you tie that to what it is that you do?
So, you know, there's people that, let's say, they had to overcome, let's say, living in poverty in their early childhood or whatever. And, you know, they could be an accountant because that they're so passionate about helping people overcome poverty or helping people live higher quality financial lives because they would never want them to deal with the, you know, suffering that they had to go through in poverty. Just that's like a random example, but, yeah, whatever it is that you have overcome, you have to really tie it to what you do so people remember it. On LinkedIn, there's a ton of health care marketers, but there's none that are using kind of their stories to, like, build their brand. And so when people kind of see my content and they don't really know what I do, then they go to my profile, and they're like, oh, that's the girl that does marketing.
You do that for long enough. Whenever somebody needs marketing, they're gonna go to my profile and mess
them up. Top of mind. You're top of mind.
Top of mind. It's drip. And it's just sharing stories, and you don't know what's gonna resonate with people until you post it. So whatever works. Like, let's say the post that got a 1,000 likes, like, whatever the outlier is, kind of go back, get feedback.
Was it, like, the space thing that you did? Was it the first three lines that, you know, caught people's attention the most? Was it the last line? Like, I always love to get feedback so that I could multiply and duplicate those results. That's really what it's been for me. So if a post does incredibly well, I'm like, okay. Why did people like that post? How can I do 10 more posts off of this style so that I could get my message out to as many people as possible? And
that's how you own your story. You know, when I put that post on LinkedIn earlier and I thought that was perfect for you, I was like, yeah, she owns her story. She's you have you have a sense of vulnerability in your in your post. You seem very authentic and really you're honest, but at the same time, you you seem very strong and confident. I think that's good.
Right? Because, you know, sometimes we see on even on LinkedIn, I would say, but I see it a lot on Facebook, or I'll see someone posting. I'm just like, out through my eye. I would look.
I know. So it's like that's where that line of vulnerability comes in. Because you can you can twist the story of overcoming divorce into, like, a very heartfelt story where people can understand, okay, it didn't work out between these two people. You had to pick the pick the pieces up. You had to reinvent yourself, and you had to make yourself stronger from something that didn't work out.
You have to take accountability for what your part was and stuff like that. But you can't, like, bash your ex and stuff like people do on Facebook because then people aren't gonna respect that. So there is a line of vulnerability that people will respect and kind of see as strength, and then that people are, like, gonna be like, okay. I don't want me to even be involved with that. That's crazy. So Yeah.
And it takes you know you know what, Shanae? It takes a lot of guts to do that because, I'm hearing, I'm hearing a lot from, especially the the top LinkedIn creators, like, such as yourself. I'm hearing there's a lot of haters now. I'm not getting it because I don't I don't I don't have that kind of reach yet. And if I do, I'm like, oh, that's a good thing. Cool. Come on. Yeah. I know. That's good.
Problem. Working. Yeah. But, you know, it shows you're getting a lot of attention. I think that's a good sign, I really do.
But it's just, it boggles my mind how there's people that have the time to comment on your post, like, go out and work. Try to close a deal. Go go market yourself. Do something else. Why are you gonna go comment her post and say, oh, you know, that doesn't seem truthful, Shanae, or this doesn't seem right, or it's just, it really, it boggles my mind that people have the time to do that. It it really does.
I know. And and you know what? Some some people, their strategy is, like, go back and forth with them. If somebody, like, respectfully disagrees with me, I'm all for that. Like, you know, not everyone has to have the same or whatever.
But, like, if somebody is, like, disrespectful and just being, like, a hater on my post, like, their comment is gonna get deleted and then I'm gonna block them. Like, I don't even engage. You know what I mean? That's just my personal method, though. Like, I know other people on the platform that get a bunch of heaters. I actually go back and forth with them, and it's kinda like I don't have time for that. You know what I mean?
It's such a waste of time. We I mean, if you think about all the time we spent in our lives and or even in the past, on drama and and Yeah. Like, are they They're not productive.
Like, listen. It is what it is. And it's I mean, some of these people are kinda like I mean, people forget how, I'm not this type of person, but, like, people will screenshot what you post on it or what you comment. If it's crazy, and they'll send it to their employer. And it's just like people are forget about that.
But it's just it's important to just be respectful. You don't have to agree with everybody. But, I mean, if you're gonna disagree, make sure it's just respectful. If not, You're gonna just get deleted and locked.
Yeah. Yeah. It's some some, some crazy out there. But yeah, I mean, you know, there was, there was another article I read, about that were actually that that you I believe you wrote. It was on your LinkedIn profile, and it was it talked a little bit about, growth marketing and digital, you know, difference between growth marketing and just marketing.
And how do you use growth marketing, Shanae, instead of traditional digital marketing to help your health care marketing business and health care customers succeed? Do you think growth marketing is really what we need to be using, moving forward for, you know, for ourselves and for our customers?
A 100%. Because, I mean, traditional marketing just looks like attracting more customers and and attracting more leads and kinda converting them into customers. And then from there, it's kind of like the customer journey is, like, on somebody else. You know what I mean? Whether it's a sales team or or they don't really focus on, like, retention and and referrals and any of that.
What gross marketing really is is, like, we just did this with, a private practice is that we were putting out ads, and they were getting, like, incredible results in terms of, like, calls. But the calls were not converting into appointments, and we couldn't figure out why. So if we were just a traditional marketing company, I would have just been like, that's on your guys' management. You know what I mean? And that's what a lot of them do.
Like, they just put it on the in house staff. But we really wanted to get to, like, the root of the problem, so we we we called, like, the we did, like, some secret customer calls, and it just sounded completely off. So we're like, okay. There's a problem with the training. And then when we talked to the in house staff, there was a complete disconnect.
They didn't understand the software. The software was not even for their type of business. There was just so many issues that we had to rectify. So we had to rectify their software. We created training modules for the in house staff in terms of, like, customer service.
And once we rectified those issues, then the calls started to convert into customers. We had to create, a monthly program so so that the customers could, you know, be retained through, like, a monthly membership. And then we also created a referral program because that gave more incentive, for the current customers to then bring in their friends and stuff. But these were just questions. And we a traditional marketing agency would have never known because we went in there, and we asked the girls at the front.
We're like, what are the main questions that these people are asking when they come in here? And they're like, oh, they ask why we don't have a monthly membership. Oh, they asked why we don't have a referral program. They I mean, they started listing this. They're like, we don't understand this software.
We don't even know how to make an appointment on the phone because the software kept, like, blocking them and, like, they couldn't input addresses correctly. But when we looked at it, it was like not the software meant for that business at all. So it made complete sense. So had we not really looked beyond, okay, like, yeah, these ads are doing great. We have the proof that they're getting the calls.
But had we not really started to question the whole customer journey and be like, okay, why are these calls not converting into customers and wire you know, into appointments so that they can convert into customers and and be retained and then give referrals, then we would have never discovered those issues. So that's really I feel the difference between growth marketing and traditional marketing is that it looks like the whole customer or patient journey rather than
the cycle. Seems like you guys fixed a lot of their processes.
A 100%.
That's cool.
If they have issues in the process, we will discover the issues, number 1, because what happens, especially in the health care space, is that you have a lot of entrepreneurs that put in capital to create a start up. A lot of them are doing it based on data and, like, growth in the market, but they may not necessarily come from a health care background. And what they do is to be able to operate, they, you know, they find a doctor and the doctors pay the yearly salary. And but a lot of the times, the doctor has his own practice as well. So you're dealing with, like, a faceless brand where the doctor can't really market his face all over it because he has his own practice and where the entrepreneurs have the capital, but they don't really have the understanding of the health care space.
So, we look at the whole process, we find out where the holes are, and we do whatever it takes to fix them.
Wow. And Yeah. And when you do find an issue I do have another question that actually, I wasn't planning on asking this, but it's okay. I wanna ask this. So when you do find an issue, let's just say you work with a nursing home and you you're you're doing marketing for them, and you find that it's an issue with with their, necessarily billing, I I would say maybe with their with their client retention, for example.
Mhmm. And you feel like, okay. They're we're generating all these leads from that you know, for them via LinkedIn or even through Instagram or Facebook ads or LinkedIn ads, whatever it may be, but they're not closing them. There's also a conversion problem. Okay?
So when you raise that when you raise that awareness to the decision, to the stakeholders at that nursing home, do you tell them that this is a charge? You're you're not gonna do that for free. Right? You're gonna you're gonna tell them, look. Well, we can do this for you. You just
raised that.
Yeah. Okay. Okay. I was like, you're not gonna
just, like Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No. It would Okay. I mean, it that goes from, like, hey. We're doing your digital stuff to now we have to do this management. And it's actually crazy because, you know, some of them are more open. And then so we actually had this, come up with a big health care network where we were like, okay, this goes far beyond a marketing problem. You have to do this, this, this, this, and this.
And we gave it to the head of the marketing department. And he was like, okay, like, I don't know if this is going to get approved because this is, like, above me. And it didn't. But it's crazy because their main conglomerate owner that they're, like, owned by a health network that owns, like, 50 other hospitals in New York state. He he called me, like, let's say 3 months later, and he's just like, listen, I know we only went with the marketing piece, but I just want to let you know, like, the main owners were here, and they literally told us every single thing that you guys told us, like, 3 months ago that we had to fix.
Like, down to the t, like, I mean but it was just like the CEO is not on board. Like, you can't for some people, it's like we're dealing with the owners, with the investors, and the entrepreneurs. For other people, we're dealing with, like, the CMOs, and then it's like a big health care network. So there there are approvals that need to be had.
A lot of red tape. You know
what I mean? There's a lot of red tape. So Yeah. In that in that deal, we only got approved for the marketing, but that's because there was a lot of entertainment stuff. It was just it was great to hear that validation that, like, the main owner of, like, all hospitals came in and was, like, validated everything he said.
He's like and they even asked, like, what vendor is this? Because this is exactly what we're talking about. And he was like, that's crazy. He was, like, more surprised than us. I'm like, we told you.
And you know what, Shanae? When you when you guys did that, when you raised awareness on certain issues, even though you may not get that, that upsell deal, sometimes, you know, they might say, oh, you know, we don't wanna invest in that right now. Even for you to raise that and cash those problems, that's gonna create a long term that's that's definitely gonna establish a longer term relationship because you're telling them you know, you're doing your due diligence saying, hey. You know, there's these problems. We can do that to help you.
If not, you can do it in house. No worries. But we're here to help you guys. So that
Yeah. I mean, at the end of the day, listen, like, good marketing is great. Great marketing is amazing, but, like, marketing is not gonna fix the bad process. So if you don't and that's where, like, the growth marketing perspective comes in. If you don't fix your process and really have your people on board, like, there are there are hospitals where, like, the paid ad advertising department doesn't even talk to the organic advertise organic marketing department.
It's like, what are you guys doing? You guys should be on the same page. You know what I mean?
Yeah.
But those type of things, like, if they don't wanna fix them or invest in fixing them, their competitor is gonna eat them up alive, whoever does fix them. So it's, but, yeah, I mean, we deal with more thing thankfully, we deal with a lot of entrepreneurial minded owners where we're dealing with the owners directly. But that was a great question. Sometimes we're dealing with a lot of red tape, and, you know, it is what
it is. And it's it's it's, very interesting to see how not interested in health care, but some of these other, more blue color blue color type industries like construction and contractors and all that, where for at least in a digital perspective, like a website, or, you know, or even if they want, you know, if they want content marketing or SEO, a lot of them when, you they would come to us for my company for an app or a website, like, well, we don't we haven't upgraded our website for 20 years. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. It's just it it's mind boggling.
And then some of them, they don't even know they haven't relied on Google for anything. And a lot of their users, their audience is on Google or on LinkedIn. They have been nothing on LinkedIn.
Maybe the company was started 20 especially in development. I know about that. Yeah. Like, that is just, like, old school connections and then bidding and going into their construction programs and stuff. Mhmm.
But what I really the main benefit I feel that at least we've experienced that COVID kinda really put in people's brains is, like, whether you want to or not, like, people have realized the value of having a presence online, whether you're, a chef or have a pizza parlor or have a construction company or have a plumbing company or have a health a digital health startup or private practice. It doesn't matter. Whatever you're in, I don't care if you're knitting for a living. Like, if you don't have an online presence, like, how are you going to reach your target audience from now?
Gonna be with The Times. You're not gonna be with The Times. You're gonna you're gonna end up being, like, Sears or Toys R Us. Yeah.
A lot of people went out of business because they didn't have an online presence. A lot of the people that were hesitant, way hesitant to get an online presence in the past, got into panic mode, started contacting us, and we're like, I'm all in. You know what I mean? Because they they realized, like, if I can't leave my house, how am I going to reach my my target audience? And and it just it is what it is.
Well, because, Shanae, the issue is a lot of businesses in in large companies as we talked about, they're they get very settled. They see the money coming in. They plateau, and they end up, when there's something like this, you know, a world disaster, something happens, they don't survive because they don't know how to work from home. A lot of they had no idea. You know, you know, some of the the older generation I've spoken to, they had no idea how to work from home.
They're like, we don't even know what to use. We don't know
what to do. Even know if I use Zoom. I know. Even the professors. Look at all the professors. Like, I mean, people were making fun of, like, the memes and stuff, stuff, but a lot of the professors needed training on how to even do a class from Zoom.
That's so yeah. That's a good point. So true. Yeah.
And that's like an educated audience. You know what I mean? And they were having, like I mean, you know, the kids are savage, so they're posting, like, memes, like, yeah, my professor's sir.
My, this is funny. So quick quick little story. My my nephew is, he's he's actually 7 now, he's so smart. So he he says he wants to be a YouTuber like his uncle Mike, and I'm not a YouTuber. Like, he likes to say that.
It's funny funny. But, he didn't have these, you know, Zoom meetings with, you know, with his teachers and and, you know, his his other the other students, in the class. And the teacher was or he so his name's Alexander, and he said basically that he's like, yeah, my my teacher couldn't even find the lot of them had
struggle even, you know, adapting to that. So, but it there is a tremendous opportunity for them to, you know, grow and stuff with the companies that and the decision makers even that really want to just stay ahead. And, in front of their audience, they really realize, like, wow, I better work on my online presence. I better because if not, like, how are we gonna reach our customers, clients, patients, whatever it is, if we don't if we don't have a presence online or, you know, a story because that's what people connect with.
So true. Yeah. I love it. Yeah. This has all been great, Shanae. And and, you know, I do have I was end with this last question. So I know we talked a little bit in the pre interview, but, so for you, you have a very inspiring, interesting story. What would how would you define Shanae's story in one word? What would be your one word?
It would be perseverance.
That's just mine. If if you see some of my posts, like, I think, 2 weeks ago, I put my one word is perseverance. And some people put connection or struggle or I love it, you know. Yeah.
It would be it would definitely be perseverance because there's good days, there's bad days, there's days where you don't feel like doing anything, but, you know, you have to. And it's just about, pushing and persevering through the the struggles, the good times, the hard times, and, just pushing forward. It is what it is.
Love it. Love it. Well, this has been this has definitely been an honor. Sorry.
It was great. Yeah. Absolutely. Interview.
Good. Good. I'm glad. I'm glad, you know, and this is this is so cool to be able to connect like this and find each other on LinkedIn. I think it's, it's it's great.
You know, it's good to even just build the trust and a long term relationship, I think, is so important, especially today in in the in this crazy world. There's just a lot going on, so we need a lot of, we need a lot of connections and and relationships and positivity and inspiration. And, I think, you know, great stories like the one you just told about, you know, told us about. So I think that's pretty amazing. Thank you so much.
I really appreciate it. And, Shanae, where can everyone find you? Your website and, obviously, LinkedIn, I know.
Yeah. Yeah. LinkedIn, and then our website is www.medsnakemedia.com. I'm on Facebook and Instagram too. So any of those places.
Cool. Well, I appreciate it. Thank you so much again.
Thank you so much. I'm grateful
for that. Yeah. Absolutely. That's it's it's my honor. Hopefully, we'll do it again. Maybe we'll do, like, round 2, round 3 interview. Yeah. So but, Yeah. I I appreciate everyone for listening. Thank you so much. And, again, this is your host, Michael Georgio, on sales from the pros. And until next time. Thank you, guys. Please subscribe to our YouTube page and also follow our social media. There are links somewhere around here.
But, we really appreciate it guys. Thanks for all the support and I'm gonna be giving you awesome content continuously. And we look forward to seeing you soon.