Episode 333

Sword and Scale contains adult themes and violence, and is not intended for all audiences.

Listener discretion is advised.

When you get the light tempt tests up for him, then you'll just have.

To contact me. Place your roast.

He's said he's sixteen years old? Where are you going to hear them? Take him?

Didn't think we'd be back so soon?

Did you?

Always so pessimistic? We're so negative this audience. I don't know what's wrong with you people. Anyway, I hope you had a good holiday season. We have some big news, so don't skip ahead just yet. We uh, we got something to tell you, and I think you're gonna like it, or maybe you won't.

Who knows.

You guys always complain about everything, so it's hard to tell. It's really a losing battle sometimes with you guys such missingthropes. No, anyway, this is season thirteen, episode three d and thirty three of Sword and Scale. Is show that reveals what the worst monsters are.

Real.

All right, here's what we got for you. Sword and Scale Television is now available on YouTube. That's right, it's on YouTube. You can get it for just ten bucks a month on YouTube. Now here's the thing. A lot of people are not very technologically inclined, so just understand. It's a separate service, a separate subscription on a separate platform. It's not connected to our website in any way. So it's like a standalone kind of thing over there on YouTube.

So there you go.

That's what we got for you.

I hope you like that.

Monday, September two, twenty nineteen was Labor Day. It was a day that many people circled on their calendars, the unofficial end of summer. Well last chance to soak up the sunshine, to hike and to explore. In southeastern Ohio. There's no better place for that than Hawking Hills State Park. With over twenty five miles of hiking trails, massive rock formations, explorable caves, and towering waterfalls, this park is the perfect place to get lost in nature. For many, it's like

Nine or one, where's your emergency.

Okay, what.

Treatment light? Okay, take a brook. You're an old man's cave, yes, okay. And what happened you're say, flow down. I can't understan what happened.

On?

A tree branch fell on some one? Yeah, okay, okay, are you with that?

Afternoon, the Hocking County nine one one dispatch center lit up with panicked phone calls, all coming from teenagers. They said a log had fallen from the cliffs at the state park and hit a woman hard in the head.

I remember being in.

The park and just making goofy memories, and we decided to go on a hike to one of the other places, and he ended up getting lost. We were talking about running marathons and just laughing and making good memories when we started to hear a bunch of cracking tree branches in a large cracking sound, almost as if a tree

My immediate reaction was to bend down to help her.

The woman hit by the log was a forty six year old professional photographer. She was also a beloved wife, daughter, and mother of four children. Her name was Victoria Shaeffer.

Victoria managed to complete her undergraduate schooling and later after her marriage, she graduated with a master's degree. One of Victoria's most fortunate life decisions was to meet and eventually mary, someone she met while we were on a family vacation, to maybe Fritz Shaeffer. While I had been notoriously hard on all her previous boyfriends, this one appeared to me

As a photographer. One of Victoria's regular gigs taking portraits for local high school students.

I think she did fifteen weddings ninety or so high school seniors. She owned a sports and school photography business that she was building up in many other events.

Victoria Schaeffer was one of the most kind hearted, amazing people I have ever met. She never let anyone show their face smile. How could you when you were around her? She always knew how to make you smile, just the way she wanted you to get the perfect picture. And it wasn't just because she was taking your picture. You were genuinely happy to be around her.

On Labor Day of twenty nineteen, Victoria had gone to Hawking Hills State Park with a group of high school seniors. They had just finished a photo shoot and were walking towards the parking lot to leave when tragedy struck.

The other seniors.

And I can tell you it started with the crack of what sounded like tree branches falling down on us, which having you friends particularly looking around, until my eyes had met a huge log hitting the side of the Schafer's head, bringing her to the ground instantly. And I will say this image is in my night years, in my mind forever. First light, second, I was in shock before then jumping to see if she was all right,

From the teenager's perspective, a six foot long, seventy five pound log had seemingly fallen from the sky. It came down with crushing force, landing directly on Victoria, killing her instantly.

The group was following along this trail back to the parking lot when out of nowhere, a seventy plus pound log came crashing down from above, crushing the photographer. The students and other people nearby called nine to one one, but her injuries were far too severe.

She had a twelve inch.

Long gash on the top of her head three inches wide.

The broker's spine in two places, crushedber chest cavity and broke six ribs, along with multiple other internal and external injuries.

Since this tragedy had taken place at a state park, two agencies were responsible for figuring out what happened. Victoria's death was investigated by the Hawking County Sheriff's Office in Ohio's Department of Natural Resources.

We're right above the top of Oman's Cave. Is what I know this has on top of here. To my left is there's a walkway where the tunnel would be located. In front of us is where the tree stomp was located. And we'll be walking doing a walk through here and what we believe is here located in this section is where the approximately six foot log was located at which you can still kind of see where the love was looking had with this colouration, or it's been there for

Decease was found.

Investigators quickly determined that Victoria's death wasn't a freak accident. This wasn't the case of a tree falling or a log simply rolling off a cliff by itself. All the evidence indicated that someone had moved the log and thrown it over the edge. In other words, Victoria hadn't simply died. She had been murdered. This news not only stunned the community, but it also left Victoria's family completely devastated.

One of us called Victoria had died.

Our family initially believed and there had been a natural accident and acted God, if you will. In my mind, I could have accepted that she died doing what she loved and that no one was responsible beyond nature itself.

It was only days later, when.

Investigators told us that they believed that this was no freak accident, that it began to feel differently about.

How she was killed.

The next step for investigators was to figure out who had thrown the log that killed Victoria and why they had done it. They questioned whether this had been a planned attack or if someone had simply made a reckless and deadly decision. Initially, only one thing was certain, whoever threw the log hadn't come forward. They fled the scene without ever saying a word. Eventually, investigators received a tip about a young man who had allegedly taken responsibility for

Sure SAMs the door.

When an officer knocked on Isaiah's door, there was no response For nearly fifteen minutes. About ten cops searched and lingered outside his home. They peered through windows, looking for any sign that someone might be inside, but they saw nothing. Finally, the front door opened, but it wasn't Isaiah who appeared. It was a young woman named Raven. She was Isaiah's girlfriend where else?

So if he's not here, you probably don't care for us to step in and look, Raven, we're not playing.

We know he's here.

Don't get yourself and doesn't something you don't need to be telling you.

His butt out here.

When investigators questioned Raven, she lied and told him that Isaiah wasn't home, But when they pressed her and asked if they could check the home, she shrugged her shoulders and walked back inside. A few moments later, Isaiah finally appeared.

Come on, Isaiah, are you yeah?

You're scared shit out of him? What? Oh? No, I never had done shars pull up to my house.

Before looking for me. You never had that happen.

That's a good thing.

We need to talk to you about something serious and need you're honest truth and want to get some something care of.

You need to get the walk or something.

Yeah, we're gonna go for a ride and what's this all over? Well, that's what we're gonna go.

Have a chat.

His officers placed Isaiah in the back of a police cruiser. Several of his family members began arriving at the house. They were immediately questioned, Yeah.

I watched the news yesterday the very ving, and.

I had a feeling it was my kids.

What made you think that?

Because all the pictures on Facebook of them climbing.

That wall, and I don't know, it was scary. What did What did Isaiah tell you that they didn't know they cut any other.

That they didn't know if they did hurt somebody, They didn't know.

What did Isaiah say he talked over because he talked about it.

Oh, he didn't tell me.

He talks anything over.

Oh God, what did Isaiah say that?

But they were climbing on rocks.

Yeah, climbing on kave and something else supposed to be on He said he didn't know what happened.

He didn't know anything hurt anybody.

Into the next day, Well, how do you think he heard somebody something fell and landed on there?

I watched it on kream at school today.

Did Isaiah say what it was? He didn't.

He was trying to look at it to see what exactly happened on Krim.

But it said that a log or a tree fell.

On top of her.

They say about it three year alone Isaiah.

No, he just said that he was just saying that it's.

The petty killed someone. That's what.

Allegedly Isaiah. I thought it was dope that he had killed someone. If you're older than me, that means cool or hip or groovy man. Between his refusal to answer the door when officers came knocking and these statements from his own family, things weren't really looking rosy for Isaiah. So investigators brought him and his girlfriend Raven, into the sheriff's office for questioning, Well, why did.

You why did you lie about it? Would Isaiah being there.

Because he told me to tell you guys that that he Wasn't.

You think that's a normal response. Yeah, our experience, gilly people usually high in line. Do you know what happened on save porps? And why you're here talking to us? No idea Isaiah thought he killed somebody?

Well, my mom taught.

Isaiah that him and my brother was being the playing for killing somebody Labor Day.

But I don't know that's what do you think we're talking to you about it?

Because they Isaiah and my brother was like off the trial.

According to witnesses, Raven's brother and Isaiah had entered a restricted area at Hawking Hill State Park. They'd climbed a cliff that put them directly above the spot where Victoria Schaeffer was killed. When investigators questioned Isaiah about this, he seemed genuinely unaware of what had happened. During his interview, Isaiah described the path he and Raven's brother had taken through the park.

So what happened I kind of called it a little just on the news and I looked it up and they didn't say anything about looking, praying anybody or nothing.

Just something happened to lady at old Man's Cave.

Well, let's get this, which what time did you get through Saturday?

I couldn't probably about two o'caoll because we said he's gonna start about twelve when we used a couple of hours later.

And you guys into the men's cave. Yeah, So who else do you know that was there with you? Uh?

My girlfriend's brother.

He was Zylan Dylan right.

Yeah.

During his interview, Isaiah described the path he and Raven's brother had taken through the park. He also openly admitted that he had climbed into a restricted area when the trails.

That go up and around this world tall and he could look straight down like this. It's a straight jawball. Okay, we looked down like that, and then we noticed there's a rock down below us. So we walked all the way around. When we got to the bar, but ether they had a sign and said don't climb, and we only climbed up ply about so.

There's a sign and he claimed up anyways, well, it's only like they literally have chats that.

But listen, it was only like ten twenty foot up.

That was about hot. It's like you don't have a somebody that says, don't push you right button, and you push you rybun.

Oh my, that's like ten to twenty foot high.

And we got up there and we got our pictures taking and stuff, and we climbed down. We didn't do stupid shit angle I t we did this climb up when like the rocks that said do you don't climb one and.

Take a picture a few but that was it.

Isaiah claimed that the only thing he did after climbing into that restricted area was to take some photos. He said nothing about throwing a log or anything else off the edge of the cliff.

Well, there was comments that was made about you thinking that you killed somebody?

Was that?

I mean, where did this come from?

That?

Because everybody said this is why her this is how very first her ponent, my girlfriend's mom calls me crying and she's like, I'm like that should be Yeah.

I was like, what the hell is your called them?

Dude.

She's like, they're.

Saying you and Dylan killed some girl at the National Forest And I'm like, what are you talking about?

And she's like, well, you guys went off the chaniel signed, took the pages and stuff. They're saying that something flop and hit some lady and killed her.

As investigators spoke with Isaiah, it became clear that the tips they had received were nothing more than rumors, most of which had been started by his overly concerned mother.

But something did happen that I was a person to die out there cast quick day?

It was.

It was Monday.

It was Monday, so I'm clear. I'm well, did you do it?

What did you call? Anything over? Is there anything over?

I wasn't even there Monday Saturday.

The truth was Isaiah, Raven and Raven's brother hadn't even been at the state park on the day Victoria was killed. They were there on Saturday, two days before the incident. On Labor Day when Victoria died, both Isaiah and Raven were at home all day with their kids.

What day were you out of homens gave? What day were you out there this last Saturday?

Yeah?

Did you come back any like?

Good?

Back?

Yeah?

Did you ever after Saturday?

Did you back to wimenskav So you never came back here, back to Livia back if it didn't go out to the caves?

It doesn't like that, No Saturday, right, Yeah.

Fortunately for Isaiah he was cleared of any wrongdoing. Unfortunately for investigators, they were back to square one. The question of who killed Victoria Shaeffer was still unanswered, and it stayed that way for a while.

Here at Second in Walnut Streets in downtown Chilicothee, just forty eight hours after Victoria Shaeffer's death, in front of her photography studio, here people have already started to drop off candles and flowers to remember her.

It still hits me with a lot of shock that she's just not here, and I feel worse for her family, especially her younger daughters.

Hoped for a resolution to the mystery surrounding her death. And the apprehension of the person or people the ODNR says are responsible for somehow dislodging the tree limb that fell on Schaeffer, killing her as the group hiked Hawking Hills, snapping senior photos along the way.

They probably never meant for that to happen, because Victoria was so loved. I couldn't think of somebody would want to hurt her.

Just I hope that they come forward, you know, and admit what they have done.

Her family deserves that.

Odn R, the Hacking County Sheriff's Department, and BCI are all investigating the incident. They're asking anyone that may have seen something suspicious regarding Shaeffer's death to call authorities.

For over a month, there were no answers to the mystery surrounding Victoria's death, but in early October twenty nineteen, the Hawking County Sheriff's Office received a credible tip, this time from a mother and her teenage daughter.

My daughter is a student at Logan Heights Colfox, and she has the friend that she writes to us with and this friend boyfriend admitted to her that he took part in the guest of I'm trying to think of what her name was, Miss Shaeffer. Actually, I'm going to have you speech to my daughter. She can give you the information a little bit better than what I can't.

Okay, Hello, Hie.

A girl at the bus list Bailey Cherry, her now ex boyfriend, Jordan Buckley, apparently was one of the two.

Boys at the park who partook in the branch falling down and hitting Miss Shafer. He says he's not the one who hit it. His friend who he's with was, but I don't know his friend's name.

What grade is Jordan named tenth and apparently.

The other boy involved in eleventh grade, but I Bailey said his name, but I can't recall it because I've never.

Heard his name before.

Investigators were given the name of a suspect, sixteen year old Jordan Buckley, a student at Logan High School in Logan, Ohio. They looked at a Jordan and confirmed he'd been at hacking Hill State Park on the day Victoria died. Then they got access to his social media messages. That's when it all started to make sense. Victoria's death wasn't the result of a random accident or a planned attack. Her death was caused by two teenage boys who had made

This actually happened back on the Labor Day of last year in twenty nineteen, and at first everyone thought it was just a terrible act of nature. A log comes rolling off a click in a wilderness area and then it evolves. So we pretty quickly find out from investigators that it was maybe not an accident, and I think that shocked everyone.

After weeks with no answers, investigators finally identified as suspect a sixteen year old high school student named Jordan Buckley. According to one of Jordan's classmates, he had admitted to doing something terrible at the state park. Investigators went to Logan High School, took over a conference room and invited Jordan to have a conversation with them.

But now I know this is about I was there.

I think I don't know what day was on. It's next September. So this last month me and my friends.

Were you're nervous and you're going to get it all out. That's great, and we want you to get it on.

Just let me finish up a few things right here and we'll get We'll let you talk as much as you want.

Nothing really happened.

When Jordan was brought in for questioning, he seemed eager to tell his side of the story and talk about the day that Victoria died. That was, of course perfectly fine with investigators that day.

Me and my friends, I don't know if you guys want me to give you their names or not. Oh yeah, it doesn't really matter. Jadien Churches, mariand the Spencer and aj. I don't know a J's last name.

And it's just us. We were just walking around board so we were like, what's going to hiking?

Just went on an ike, say he was an escape. Yeah, we were on skate that's where it went. And then when we went there, nothing was happening. But we went up like on the backside of the hill and we came back because some guys I told us to someone got smashed by branch. He said, we turned around and we went down towards the bottom part. As we came back up and there was a bunch of like ems, people going to past us and sirens and everything.

Really, yes, we just.

Went up to Jordan explained that he was at Hawking Hill State Park with three of his teenage friends, Jaden Churchis, Miranda Spencer, and aj Warren. Jordan claimed that while they walked the trails, a man came running past them and warned them not to continue on the path they were on because someone had gotten hurt. So the four teenagers simply turned around and left.

Yeah, we were on top and then some guy came up to us.

I don't know who it was.

It was an African American guy. He had long dreads and he came up to me and he said, don't go that way. And I asked him why and he said a branch fell down and smashed some woman. And I said a branch. He said, yeah, like a tree branch fell off. So we went down and then we walked down the stairs and we.

Just came back and.

Nothing really happened, naturally. The investigators were skeptical of Jordan's version of events, and they knew he was leaving a whole lot out of the story.

Jordan, MH, I want should be honest with you dead.

Yeah, before we come in here, we've already got our answers. M.

We asked a serious questions that we have answers to you.

All right, So this is the time of Clinton because there's allegations that brought me in shoe were they Well, you were there, you confirmed.

That she was there.

Didn't know that she was there.

So there's more to this story.

That's about the branch fan up on top. Well that I didn't do anything like I wasn't. I just don't like to snitching on people. The problem this is the time. It's not about station.

This is about telling the truth, and telling the truth gets you even further than not telling the truth.

We were me and Jayden walked all the way part down, like clear to the end, not for the battle bridges. This guy did say that to us, but we did end up going back down.

But I just skipped a part of what we did. We walked all the way down to the end end of this and Jayden kicked off a branch, not a branch. It was a log. It was a big dog like this while this all he kicked it and.

It rolled off to the cliffs and it made a loud bang. So we ran and we ran into Miranda and aj They had no idea.

We didn't tell him that load.

Yes, that log, that lo. He just kicked it. He didn't kick it up, pushing or anything.

He just kicked it.

It took investigators less than twenty minutes to get Jordan to break and to get him talking about the log that killed Victoria Schaeffer, though his account of how the log ended up rolling off the cliff didn't make much sense. He claimed that his friend Jayden had simply kicked it, but investigators knew that couldn't be possible.

I don't know if I wasn't like paying attention what he was doing. So I don't know if he intentionally kicked it or if he, like someone.

On it, did pick it up first and carry it.

No, he didn't pick it up at all.

About glasshole, how to get on the other side of the tree.

I had no idea.

That log that you just pointed to me right later, right here there was a pile of them right yeah, the tree, two of them remember those.

There was a tree and it was in between the streets.

It was like this, and he kicked it.

The evidence at the crime scene told investigators that the log had been moved before it dropped from the cliff. Its original location was several feet from the cliff sete. There was simply no way that a single kick or even several picks would have caused it to fall.

You've been following us on TV phone, What the story on TV?

See anything on TV?

Social media? I'm seeing anything about it. Nothing.

You don't even know what happened that day, Now, I.

Just didn't acknowledge any You didn't acknowledge it. Yeah, I just didn't think anything of it, said, you know what what happened?

Not really?

Yeah, no idea, not really.

So when you sent a text to your girlfriend at the time, I mean.

Yeah, I got well, I knew what happened, but I didn't know what happened to cause that, like completely what happened.

Like I was there with my friends, but I wasn't doing I did it, and I know that it killed.

The one when it fell down on her and I heard the loud bang, and I saw Jade running and I was running with Jade.

So what do you mean?

What didn't go nine one one?

Why didn't you do anything?

Because I was freaking out and I thought I was going to get in trouble for it, okay, and.

I didn't want to get charge expressed against me. I can voluntary mansipire or something.

So you have researched this, No.

I just known a lot.

Not only was Jordan's story impossible, but investigators could tell he had already researched the criminal charges he might face if the truth came out. And that wasn't all. The investigators knew that Jordan and Jaden had made a secret pack to stay quiet about what had happened at the park. In other words, the murder they committed was supposed to stay between them.

You and Jade hooked any more about this?

Nope, I didn't make a pack and say, man.

Never gonna say anything.

You gotta keep his secret.

Well, yeah, we did say that.

That's why I told you that story. But then after I realized the severity of it, I could get in a lot more trouble for his like his actions if I'm.

The one not doing anything.

But and I don't want that to happen.

So I kind of texted the agent, I can do. Something's gonna happen.

This We're gonna get caught.

I said, I don't know what do you want me to say, but I'm not getting in trouble for you.

I said, I won't tell them, but if they asked me, I'm not gonna completely lie and get.

Myself in trouble.

And then he said, Okay, I'm not really worried about it, as you might expect a teenager to do. Jordan put all the blame on his friend, insisting that Jaden was solely responsible for what had happened. You also claim that Jaden seemed proud of what he had done.

You could hook me up to a live text because I can't kick it out and throw it. Almost all Jayden told me was I kicked long offs. I will I swear on everything he didn't put the live attack of tests on me, and I'll say the same because that's.

Exactly what happened.

Did Jaden say he did? Yeah, Jaden says, Jayden's told me that he did people and his girls.

Yeah, he said that for anything.

So the girl said, say, he said, I already caught a body by the age sixteen.

So you more about him with this funny he said, Look, I already got a body at the age of sixteen. He said, I don't think it's funny. I think that's the only reason want to tell you is if I making a serious someone for someone being stuated and messing around.

According to Jordan, Jaden had said, quote, I already caught a body at the age of sixteen. If that was true, investigators figured they might be dealing with a complete sociopath. But moron Jayden in a minute. As for Jordan, investigators already knew he had admitted to throwing the log, not to them, but to another one of his friends, so naturally they wanted answers. If he hadn't touched the log,

Nay?

And the one person I told with baby, what did you tell her? I told her that me and Jayden threw a ball?

Wrong, Okay, but I was just saying that you were cool because I thought it was cool.

But it's not. After everybody's the severity.

Of it and he love cools on the n Sip Churches church was burn.

I know, but that's what I'm saying.

If it comes down to it, I would literally take a lot of type of tests before this back.

If you guys do not believe me, I had nothing to do with it, and I did not or touched that ball, Why didn't you still say something? Because I don't know.

I was freaked out about it because I thought it was just called going to go away and everybody would have forgot about it.

You're gonna forget about it death?

No, I don't know.

It's you're sure what a woman looks like with her head mash up? But do you want to say it now?

Yeah, that's the thing.

It's irresponsible act. I know four kids with my mom, husband's wife grew up. It's time to grow up right now?

All right?

That there's anything you got not toward us, anything you held that anything you don't want to tell us.

Maybe you guys were kicking the wall to him.

You tell him, I don't.

I did not kick that log with him. I'd swear on everything.

Did you touch that log?

Boom? So I pushed I touched the log to move it out of the area, but I to move it.

It was right in between these streets, and you pushed it out, and then I helped him push it out, but he kicked it down and I didn't kick it, so I didn't touch the wall.

So you had helped him. No, I didn't know he was king it off, would you I helped to.

Pull it out.

Yeah.

Once again, Jordan's story changed. He still insisted he wasn't the one who threw the log, but he finally admitted to moving it. But even with this admission, Jordan's story still didn't make much sense.

It's lit told you that I had a special compere to come.

In called a conversation that reconstructed this little scene because the trajectory of the log going over the edge, and the possibilities of what that load weight, and what the possibility is of one versus throwing it versus different people.

I don't. I mean, if you want to, you can, if you can do that, already have.

Truth.

I didn't throw it off. I swear on everything truth. I am. I'm telling the truth. I didn't throw the log off. Yes, I am, I'm telling the truth. I didn't not throw that load off. He helped me. No, I did not. I did not throw the load off. Possible to pick up the six foot bow, but I don't know. I didn't throw the lord off with it, I swear on everything. Did you grab one end? Did you grab the other hand? Nope? All I did was dragon. That's the only thing I did.

There were several things about Jordan's story that were either implausible or impossible. First, there was the size and weight of the log six feet log seventy five pounds. It wasn't likely that one person could have thrown it alone, especially a scrawny, little juvenile shit like Jordan or Jaden. Second, just below the cliff where the log came from, there was another ledge, a protruding rock formation. For the log to clear that it would have taken serious effort and force.

Miranda, and he would tell you that I throw it off to it was Jade.

He threw off four back and then he threw it off.

Yeah, but I didn't know he was. Yeah, but I didn't know he was off.

So every time we talk we get a little bit different story. Now Miranda and ages there.

Initially, Jordan told investigators that the girls he was with that day hadn't seen anything, but like every other part of his story, that turned out to be a lie. His friends Miranda and aj had seen exactly what happened, and investigators questioned them both, starting with the fifteen year old Aj Warren.

But I'm told us about going to the park.

There.

It was me and Miranda and Jada and Jordan.

Then we decided to go to the caves and the boys saw a log or were picking it up, and they're like, you know, they were going to start off, and you.

Said not to do that because you have not like.

You don't know what's over there.

I don't know someone over there, you know.

And so they dropped the log to the ground. I come to the cliff that we were on and it rolled back off, and so we started walking away. A man started walking or was pasting running. He said that a woman got hit.

The large.

Branch or log and he believes that.

He believes that you didn't make it.

She was dead.

So you know, we obviously were very I was shaking up about it and didn't not to do. We knew it was wrong, and we knew that.

Whether it wasn't intentional.

You know, they weren't trying to hurt somebody, and they weren't trying.

To kill somebody.

Putting it mildly. AJ's version of events made a lot more sense than Jordan's, but one critical question remained. Who actually threw the log?

Who touched the log?

About?

Jordan picked it up, well, didn't pick it up, but he grabbed it from one end.

To make it stand up, and they were going to push it off.

So then Jayden looked and they dropped it on, not off the cliff, but onto the ground, and it rolled, it fell.

Back off the cliff.

So let me get this straight.

Jordan's holding this, well on it said, okay, it's picked it up, it's standing on the end, and he's holding it. You're stating that Jayden went over looked over the edge to see if anybody was over there and stated that he couldn't see anybody.

Was that right?

Yes? Okay, Now what happened? Jordan's just Jordan's still holding this.

He's and.

And so Jordan let go the other end, not pushing.

Its holding it, let's go, let's go, not pushing it or not kicking it over the edge.

But he lets go and it hits the ground. Like if you were if we were further from the.

Edge and he dropped it, it wouldn't don't think he would have run off, but it was.

It was close to the edge.

Georgia dropped it and like just rolled back off.

Jordan, let's go it. It falls, goes back to the ground and rolls off. Yes, one hundred percent, positive, absolutely, one hundred percent.

That is what happened. Whatever I remember, Yes, sir, But.

That explanation didn't add up. It wasn't likely that simply releasing the log would have given it enough force to clear the ledge below. To complicate things further, the other witness, nineteen year old Miranda Spencer, gave investigators a similar story, but with the roles reversed. She claimed Jordan only looked over the edge to make sure no one was below, and it was Jayden who actually sent the log off the cliff.

Jordan looks over the cliff and is like, there's nobody done the liking good dude, and then Jaden either case, upper poses is off.

I'm not sure, but he definitely didn't pick it up, so it's just like rolled off.

Basically, Jayden picked up the lawn, pick it up.

I don't think he didn't pick it up, but he's.

The one that pushed it off. Jason pushed it off.

Yeah, Jadon, Jordan didn't touch the lawn at all.

Had anybody in your party touched it prior to that to move it to that location?

Like aj Miranda was adamant about what she saw, but their accounts didn't match, and investigators wanted to know why.

What I'm saying is what happened, like like, I'm not kidding.

How about the law? How long went?

How long was it?

Who held a law? Who moved? He moved?

Then what Jordan did Jayden?

Jordan said that he like, he looked over the legend said that there was nobody down there. So Jayden pushed it off because he didn't think he was going to hurt anybody.

But jay didn't will log.

These conflicting accounts didn't make sense. Aj was certain that Jordan rolled the log. Miranda was just as sure it was Jaden. How could either of them be wrong about something like that? And if someone was lying, the question was why.

Your story and Miranda's one major law. You can't figure that out for the life of me.

Why I don't say what is but just can't figure out for the life of me why there's one major difference here.

Amazing.

I had no idea. Everything I told you is.

Exactly what I remember.

As investigators tried to make sense of the conflicting statements from aj and Miranda, they also had a decision to make what should they do with Jordan and what you charges would he face?

Am I going to get arrested for what?

I don't know?

And that's what I'm saying. I don't know if there's any charges that I can get for witnessing a murder?

Hey, what would you you murder?

What?

I know? But I wouldn't voluntarily did it? I didn't. It wasn't my fault that it happened.

What happens you and the rubber store? He shoots the heels.

Clerk, Well, I get in trouble for me with him?

Do you get charged for murder?

Sus So, I'm going to get charged for the voluntary manslaughter for.

I consider just murder.

So I'm going to get murdered.

Say that before investigators could move forward with any charges against Jordan. There was still one critical step left. They needed to talk to the other teenager, the one who had allegedly bragged about killing someone. They needed to question sixteen year old Jaden Churches. On Labor Day twenty nineteen, forty six year old Victoria Schaeffer was killed when a six foot log was thrown from a cliff at Hawking Hill State Park. The investigation led to two sixteen year

I'd be setting in for two hours.

I'm trying, I said here. I sent two hours.

Stings. Yeah, he would have been here if I did. It was meant to take two hours.

Bot to you.

When Jaden's interview started, there was already a good bit of tension in the air. His mother was frustrated. She'd been waiting for hours before investigators were ready to speak with her and Jaden, and the tension only grew from there.

You can't hear us, so we get recorded or something.

Well, everything we do is.

I record it. Then right.

About ten minutes into the interview, and just staff her investigators read Jayden his Miranda rights. A school employee stepped into the room to bring Jayden some lunch.

Take their out chicken sandwiches and.

Just take it every time he eats lunch here, they're out of everything.

After Jaden's mom made it clear she was ready to complain about literally everything, the investigators finally got around to asking Jaden some questions.

We do ride my.

Bike right Leanster skate park the next place right beside the pool, like going up.

To I couldn't do anything.

I mean, I like the hunt.

I like the duck hunt as stuff, But hiking, I don't like walking a lot. So I just ride my bike a lot and staying down. My friends, he's your friends, Johnny cole Gere at Mace just a lot of football players.

Interestingly, when Jaden was asked about his friends, he left out one important name, but Jordan Jordan.

What's Jordan?

Though?

I know the Jordan.

I mean he's a great under and you're not hung.

Out or what.

Jaiden, we've been picking around the bush and I'm just gonna get stranger.

There's summer.

There's an incident at Hocking Hill stick for I know that she was there. That's all Claire, Okay, tell me about that day. Get pulled up.

We were about to go hike and go down and look around, and then some dude comes running back and he's like somebody just got to with someone and thinks that. So we're like what, and we turn around and we leave because we don't even want to go down there and see it or anything. And then once we walk and now there's like ambulets going up and all this.

The miranda.

The initial stories that both Jaden and Jordan gave investigators were nearly identical. When they were first asked what happened, Neither of them mentioned the log being thrown from the cliff, at least not until investigators confronted them with it directly. It's almost as if they had rehearsed what to say before we.

Come in here. We already have all the answers, might be one or.

Two if we don't do We've already talked to people about as serious accusations been run against you, and this is the time to tell the truths to help yourself, because right now it's really.

Serious, really really serious, and you need to be honest.

We know a lot more than what you think, and you need to.

Talk to me certain private because he's underaged.

He's under age, and it sounds like you're you know exactly what happened, so you you should go tell me exactly what happened, and then I will talk to him, because I don't like you saying that you knew what happened. And okay, then you know who did it and what happened, so good. Then we'll go in the other room and you can tell me if.

He partici hated and it's just it's not I wonder if this mom's name is Karen, it should be.

Your son did something the result in death.

No.

No, but somebody ought to be proven to me before they're saying something like that to him, because it's very upsetting.

We want to know.

There's always I'm not liking this.

I don't like it either.

Excuse me. I know that I have felt very bad about that.

That is sickening to me, and I have even said this is a horrible thing that for you to sit here and say that he had.

Something to do with this, to do the other Jaden's mom became understandably distraught. She tried to step in and defend her son, but there wasn't much she could do except sit there and watch him take the heat.

But I wouldn't know it was this an accident or is this something that he meant to do, because that's a big difference.

If this is an accident where you were.

Trying to do this, I didn't do it. I was there.

Okay, So tell me what happened, step by step.

Like they see what I was saying.

When we walked up by the stairs, Jordan walks. We were walking and then there's the log, and he kissed it, and it starts to start.

To say Jordan kicked it, and.

Then it slid and then he left.

Unsurprisingly, Jaden pointed the finger at Jordan, just like Jordan had done to him. He claimed Jordan had kicked the log, sending it over the edge of the cliff. So much for that secret packed they had made to keep this quiet. Isn't that right, Jaden?

I know about your pack, Jordan. You guys already had this reverse. Did you touch the law because we talked to Jordan's I grabbed the log.

Okay, so you touched the law. I touched it, but I did not kick it off or thrown You know what happened to it? How did that smash? You got kicked off the edge?

You kicked Jordan? Jordan kicked it? Yes, are you sure?

Once again, investigators were put in a difficult spot. Each suspect was blaming the other, and all they could do was keep pressing Jayden for the truth.

Yeah.

I did not kick him off, did no, sir? Not trying to hide anything.

I'm giving you the answer, the draft for truth.

Do you know what.

I'm being very om patient with this, But it sounds like you're trying to talk him into saying something that.

He's trying to talk.

And he just truth.

So you're trying to get him to say something that I'm.

Trying to tell us the truth. That is what I'm trying to do, not a truth.

I don't understand you.

Have.

We're just trying to get him to tell us what happened, because the truth, at the end of the day, that lady lost her life.

I know that I'm very sack with me. I was sick in my stomach when I heard about this, and and and then to find out that he was there.

The investigators kept pushing back, but having Jaden's mom in the room didn't make their job any easier.

So should I arrest Jordan today for homicide? Because that's what's going to happen?

Really better?

Did the lighting detectors have some Jordan? Don't you think before you arrest him for homicide?

There say?

It doesn't matter what he says. You guys have to do it, don't You're just just talk like detectives talk. You can't do you think I would let you arrest him like Jordan's spears are gonna let you arrest Jordan without a lighter detective test.

You don't have the choice in the United States or problem, cause.

You know what I have.

So you're gonna have to just You're just gonna have to talk to get attorney with the minimum wage.

Two jobs that I work, because you know what, we do have choices.

When you get when you get pay, when you get I know this lady died, When you get the light detective tests up for him, then you'll just have to contact me ask for Nale Jane, and I will be leave him.

That's leave James, who place your arrest?

He said he can't be He's said he's sixteen years old.

He did something that result and end of death. I'm gonna shave him.

Where are you think you're gonna take him?

Do you not all the attention?

No?

Jayden remained adamant that he hadn't thrown the lock, and every time investigators pushed him to admit otherwise, his mom stepped in.

You gotta be completely honest. This is your life.

I know.

Miss Schaeffer's life is already over. We gotta make her life right.

I told you, get all you want to said, and your head explodes.

Are you gonna showing a picture of that too?

Picture of good?

That's pretty?

Do you want to see it? Sure?

Show you what your son did.

Excuse me, I'm asking what my son did.

There's witnesses to this.

There's not witnesses. They're all saying that each other did it well, and so you have and so you have some some pretty good. Stop then I know I don't I don't want to believe any of that.

I don't want I'm not asking you.

I want to see some lady's head spattered. I don't want anybody to be injured.

Whoever did it, whoever was responsible for making the mall go over that they put out exactly. Yes, you know, whether the kids were playing, whether it was I'm sure they didn't do it on purpose because they were playing.

If they were saying, I'm sure they was just going to say, I want to kill some lady. Let's grit a ball on her head. I mean, who knows that.

Jaden's mom and the investigators continued to butt heads, but in the end it was a losing battle for both sides. Jaden's mom couldn't stop her son from being arrested, and investigators couldn't get him to admit he had thrown the log. Eventually, Jaden and his mom were informed that a judge had already signed off on Jaden's arrest. He was going to jail, and there was nothing anyone could do to stop it.

That's doing to me, that's with a long You cannot do that because you can't take him to jail. There's fat people there, well they're not good people.

There's bad people there along the head because you're trying, you're trying to take him away from something that.

You can't say him because this is not mean.

This is the prosecutor's office, This is the actual prosecutor in the juvenile court judge.

This is not my aims.

You're just gonna take him out of here with him right now through this school that How does that make you feel?

It hasn't made me feel very good at all. Since the beginning of this is September seven and sixty twenty, when I got that phone call and I've seen that lady, it has not made.

Me feel good at all. This doesn't make me feel good. Do you know what?

I have racist point for seventeen years by myself, and this does not make me feel good.

Why would you take him out of the school like this in front of these people. He's not gonna away from me. You can't just take him beyond here.

So stay, no, you go us. You're going to have forty.

Jaden was officially placed under arrest and when the handcuffs came out, his mom all but lost its.

Cuffs or something.

Oh, graves, start off your life when you're seventeen. Can't you just like walk him out? He's not a criminal.

In the shif six years old for me, the Schaffer's twenty six years old.

I know how she has I read what are you telling.

You that for?

You're saying he's so a team to.

Old?

All right, but you know, I feel really good for this lady that's going in her family. This is not good to do to our family.

Jaden had the benefit of having his mom in the room during his interview, while Jordan had to face investigators on his own, though Jordan did get to call his mother, and the difference between two parents couldn't have been more stark.

Were you a part of it, Jordans?

I didn't like push it off, but I moved the log with him. I pulled it out. I didn't know he was going to kick it off.

Though, But a woman died.

Why did you not tell?

Chris and I I.

Freaked out.

It doesn't matter.

I've taught you to do right. Jordan's a woman lost her life and you knew it. Always coming first is what you do.

So I want to ask him for his DNA sample. It's just a swab of the mouth.

Yes, yes, I mean if he's in the wrong, he knows that.

I've taught my kids that they take the punishment, okay, and.

So we have your permission to take that swab. Yes, okay.

On one hand, Jaden's mom was ready to defend her son no matter what he may have done. Jordan's mom, however, seemed ready to hind and over the police on a silver platter. I'm not a parent, so I'll reserve my judgment on this one. And you guys don't like it when I judge anyway, So you judge for yourselves. Who handled it better, Who is the better parent in this situation. I know you'll have your own thoughts, leave them in the comments. After Jaden was arrested, investigators took Jordan back

How did you move it? Put my foot like well? I grabbed it at first and it wouldn't.

Move, so I took my foot and I pushed it like this my foot.

I just messed around. I wasn't even gonna I was gonna put it back. I was just messing around so bored, and he was high. That's probably why he did it. And then after it went off, it roared and it bounced again. After this, that's where it.

I kind of flent over that and there was a lip right there, so I hit the lip and it bounced.

That's why I pounced. I knew it bounced, but I didn't know why. So that's why I thought he threw it. But he did say I'm going to throw it. After this happened, I kind of just realized the severity of it and how someone lost her life, Like, how would I feel wish if that would happened to my mom when she was taking pictures of me or something for my senior pictures. That's not fair to them to not know the answer to it, And that's why I feel bad.

During this walkthrough, Jordan claimed he felt bad about what happened, but let's be honest, it was a little late for that. If he really felt bad, he would have come forward. Instead, he made a pact with Jayden to keep the murder quiet, and even bragged about it later to impress a girl he liked. Not exactly the behavior of someone with a guilty conscience. Not exactly the behavior of someone with a conscience, period.

So what do you think should happen to you?

Well, I'm hoping that I don't see anything too extreme, but I know that I probably an't going to get charged for being a witness.

You know we're saying anything about it, well, being a witness.

If you don't get charge for men a witness, Yeah, but you charge if he did something or if you lie about it, how's we'll gets you in trouble.

I haven't lied.

About things so far, Jordan claimed he hadn't lied about anything so far. In reality, he'd lied about nearly everything, right up until investigators called him out. At first, he left out the log entirely. Then he claimed Miranda and aj hadn't seen what happened. After that, he insisted he never touched the log at all. None of this was true. All of this begged a question, what else was Jordan lying about.

Our victim was down here with her head bashed in. Okay, so it's impossible for that log to roll wall.

And then we landed here.

You had to have traje Street had had force, some kind of force to get out this then foot where she was at.

So right now, this is the time.

I'm trying totand you're trying to be walker with me.

I need the truth Right now, I'm trying to tell you them trying of things. So if you're standing there and.

I'm holding this log, that he was thrown out whoo where she was at?

Right?

So this is the point in time where you tell us either you see do it, you both hit it, or it was more than than two of you. Whatever happened needs to come out now because we can't tell you.

I did not do it.

I did not do it, and Mirandon and aj had nothing to do with it.

One of the strangest parts of this case was how all four teenagers described the log is simply rolling off the cliff and not being thrown. But that didn't make sense. For the log to land where it did, it would have taken considerable force. The reality was someone or multiple people had to have thrown it, and none of the teenagers could explain that inconsistency. The only thing that made sense was that both Jordan and Jayden picked up the log together and flung it off the cliff.

I did the open do it. I don't remember what he did to get it off.

I just know Jayden did it.

I don't remember everything.

I don't remember that specific detail.

Yes, that's the only thing that trouble remembering the whole time.

That's the only thing be in my shoes right now.

Okay, you can remember everything, but you can't remember that specific detail.

So I'm sitting here thinking, man, because Jordan happened so fast. I happened so fast.

I turned around.

He said, I'm going to throw it off. I turned back around, and it was and he was already going down.

Another unanswered question was why the two female witnesses pointed fingers at different people. Miranda said Jayden through the log. Aj claimed it was Jordan. Miranda even went as far as saying Jordan never touched the log at all, which made no sense considering Jordan himself admitted that he helped move it.

Jordan has admitted.

Jordan's didn't move along, he admitted to me.

But why would he admit to me that he moved the lag.

I'm telling you that Jordan Jayden was the one that moved the log. Like that's what I remember.

That's what I'm trying to tell you, Like me and Jordan have no connections, Like like.

I don't like Jordan at all.

I took Jordan to the scene we've gone to walk through, and he was telling us how he moved the lag where he was standing, not lying.

What I remember, and if what I remember is wrong, then I can't help that.

Like, but I'm trying to tell you what is but as you know.

I can't help that.

Investigators later suspected that Miranda was lying to protect herself because of a prior romantic relationship she had with Jordan. When they dated, Jordan may not have reached Ohio's age of consent, which was sixteen. By the way, Yeah, Ohio sucks. It's possible Miranda did not want to implicate Jordan, fearing he might turn around and exposure. She may have been trying to avoid facing statutory rape charges.

Do you have any relationships with Jordan?

Yeah? Did you understand that?

Miranda admitted she'd been in a relationship with Jordan, but denied ever having sex with him. Nonetheless, Miranda was never charged with any form of sexual assault. Instead, she was charged with obstruction for lying during the investigation of Victoria Schaeffer's murder.

Miranda Spencer of Nelsonville received a suspended ninety day sentence guilty to obstructing official business.

In court, Miranda changed her story instead of blaming Jaden She claimed she couldn't remember who touched the log which of the boys had sent it over the cliff. As for Jaden and Jordan, both were indicted on charges of murder, involuntary manslaughter, and reckless homicide. Despite being just sixteen, both were charged as adults, meaning they were now facing the full weight of the criminal justice system.

They ended up both taking plea deals where they would plead only to involuntary manslaughter in exchange for having the other charges murder and reckless homicide dropped.

Seventeen year old Jordan Buckley walked into court with his family and pled guilty to involuntary manslaughter. Are Buckley then stood up turned in a durss Victoria's family, including her husband, prints.

I understand that my actions had.

Caused your fans like to change, and myer from all of this disease is tron to.

Learn and with the rest of my life.

In a way to arm the shads.

Both teens took plea deals in exchange the murder and homicide charges were dropped and their cases were sent back to juvenile court. At their sentencing hearings, both Jaden and Jordan offered weak apologies to Victoria's family first.

I wanted to apologize the mis shaper's family. I know that no matter what I say, nothing will bring your loved one back.

I know what I did was wrong.

I hope that you know I never intended to hurt anyone that day at Hawking Hill. However, I realized now that my actions can have unattended consequences. I want to lay I know that I think about this this reading for the rest of my life. I have learned from my own coactions and will take this opportunity to become a better person and hopefully use.

This experience and hope of At the sentencing, victorious family members took turns speaking. Her younger sister was first to address the court.

I'm confronted daily by ways in which my sister is missing. I'm sud mindedly thinking of texting her when she crosses my mind, missing or encouragement when I need it most, and the guidance that only older.

Sister can't provide.

We've been catching the closes of her face and my own reflection. I believe that is why, over one year later, not only still heart looking over the loss of someone so critically important in my life, but I'm angry that the individuals responsible did not immediately come forward, in fact hiding the secret among them for over a month until someone else turned them in.

Next to speak and deliver a truly heart breaking impact statement was Victoria's husband.

Victoria's death was so tragic, so devastating, and so senseless.

It's unimaginable.

And whatever I say here.

Today won't come even close to describing how.

Painful this has been for me for my family.

The night before she died, we were up late and she was editing the photos.

It was probably after one am.

She didn't have to get up early. The next day, it was Labor Day.

She was looking forward to going to Old Men's Cave and doing the photo shoot with her senior reps.

We were lying in bed and she was in my arms.

And she told me something she never told me before.

She said the happiest part of her day was at the end of the night and she was in my arms.

She told me she loved me.

And couldn't wait to spend the rest of her life with me. I loved her more at that moment than ever before.

And the next night she was gone.

The loss Victoria's family endured was unimaginable. But despite their grief, they agreed to the plea deals that had been offered to and Jordan.

I want to first clarify how we came to this agreement.

Because it was very, very difficult.

We said we'd think about it for a few days.

My children are very compassionate, and what ultimately helped us make the decision to offer this as one deal was a Victoria was a very compassionate person. We'd all felt that she would have wanted to give them a second chance.

In the end, it was the compassion Victoria had instilled in those around her that likely spared Ja and Jordan from a lifetime behind bars. During sentencing, Victoria's daughter read an impact statement written by Victoria's mother. In it, Jaden and Jordan were offered only one path to redemption.

I need to know that you will do your very vast to turn your life around. I need to know that when you are released from this sentence, you will have become a man who will make a contribution to the society, not just take from it. This is an early chapter in your book of life. I sincerely pray for you that Victoria's loss will not be in vain.

The forgiveness and the compassion that Victoria's family showed in the court was truly remarkable, far more than they would have gotten from me, that's for sure. The guilty please were entered and the impact statements were made. All that was left was for a judge to deliver a sentence the pain that.

You heard from them and describe them.

Why can't.

I got I get angry listening to it, so I don't know if I could be as forgiving as they are.

Do you understand Do you understand that you took a mother of children your age, your same age, you took their mother? Do you understand that they are a wife, sister, and that's a void that can never be filled for them.

Now you're gonna have some time to sit in uys and do you understand that right?

But you understand you're getting a second chance here now because they are forgiving you understand that?

Correct?

You you understand and you understand that that's not and this is shape of that correct if you're getting the second chance to shet a docu.

In the end, both Jordan Buckley and Jaden Churches were sentenced to just three years in juvenile detention, a slap on the wrist if there ever was one. As for the biggest question of all, who actually threw the log? The truth is no one seems to know. Investigators couldn't prove it either way, and neither Jaden nor Jordan ever

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