Forbidden Fridays: Office Hookups, Hot or Hazardous?

Got it. Yep, we have it. Okay, this is what happens when we are left to our own devices that we do not understand. Hopefully we'll soon be pros, though.

You know, I really hope so, because there's a lot of times where it's going to be just me and you, and we've got to get our shit together. And to be fair, we Googled the same thing for the second time now. Yes, and the sad part is, is even Google didn't help. It was you just having to look at the button going, oh, hey, use that audio setup button. I think that looks familiar. Right. And here we are. And we're like, ah, we got it now. Yeah.

So it is just Miss Tiffany and Tink again today doing the podcast. Our second one again. Again. Yeah. Second one again. Ladies edition. It is another ladies edition. Don't worry. It'll be fun. We missed last week. Again, our schedules are so wonky. It's just been last weekend was chaos, and then this weekend was also chaos. And then we were hoping that Pedro didn't have to work tonight, which is why he's not here again, unfortunately.

And of course, with the holidays, we did mass running around yesterday between sports and then the last minute grabbing stocking stuffing things. We are, you know, last minute trying to do things. And here we are doing the podcast. Yes. Between podcast, kids, school, work. Yikes. Lack of sleep. Yeah. Lots of that. We've got a lot of things going on here. But we are here today and we are going to have a fun time going over this together.

And we've got some pretty good topics too. Yeah. So let's get into it. Welcome to Swing Theory. where pleasure meets perspective. Join Pedro, Tink, and Tiffany, your favorite trio of temptation, as they dive deep into the swinging lifestyle. From wild stories to honest talk about connection, communication, and community, they've seen it all. And they're sharing what they've learned from over a decade of non-monogamous adventures.

So pour a drink, relax, and get ready to explore your own theory of pleasure right here on Swing Theory. All right. So it again is Miss Tiff and Tink today doing episode seven of Swing Theory. Whoop whoop. All right. So ladies edition, like we said earlier, it should be quite interesting.

I think we got a really good first topic that came across our feed actually just recently. And it's going to be hooking up with coworkers, which I mean, in all reality, kind of sounds really hot. In my mind, anyway, what do you think, Tiff? Yeah, I mean, so background on this, we saw a post in a group that the couple was, so the husband had posted asking, the wife is interested in a co-worker, and he's sort of encouraging it, but she's hesitant.

So what were your thoughts on it? And I do think it's sexy. I mean, it's definitely one of those like taboo thrills, like, you know, you're not supposed to be doing it kind of things. However, depending on how that goes, it could get quite messy. Yeah, I definitely feel like it can get kind of messy. But I also feel like it's also like you said, it's kind of hot. And I think it's because it gives you that thrill of, oh, I shouldn't be doing that? Or like, what if I get caught?

So it kind of adds to the excitement and the allure of, ooh, this is going to be something new and different. And I kind of want to explore that road. Agreed. I have a little bit of experience with it. Not a lot. Back in the days when I was still in high school, my second job I had, there was one of the guys that was working there and And him and I would, I mean, it wasn't, it was like heavy petting and making out.

It wasn't like anything else, but we would sneak around doing that while we were at work. Okay, so I got to know. Where? Like, what kind of work were you doing that this was happening? So thankfully, there was like a back room where it had like the freezers and stuff. So we would like there. And then it was, there was another room where they would do like repairs to some of the stuff. So we would sneak in there like...

Interesting. So like what kind of, you know, I mean, you said obviously you're kind of probably making out stuff like that and getting handsy. Like what kind of handsy were you getting? Honestly, it was very innocent. Like it sounds really hot, but it was very innocent. Like there was no, it was all over the clothes. There was never anything underneath. So it was a very early stages of fooling around where like everything was still

new and you weren't sure. So you're just kind of feeling around. Yeah. Okay. Well, that's still pretty hot though. It was fun. I mean, it was definitely fun. But there again, there's that. I mean, you have the thrill of getting out. and caught. But then you're also extremely nervous about getting caught. Right. But I feel like that's what is that excitement factor. Because like, what happens if you do get caught? You know, is it, you know, just going to be like a slap on the wrist?

Or, you know, could you lose your job? And I feel like when we're younger, like in your case, with your story, and experience that, you know, you didn't really think about that. Just it was more of the, what happens if we get caught? Right, exactly. Because at that point, it's not going to hurt your career. You're literally like it's an after school job, something like that.

It's not going to hurt your career. That's going to be more of a you might get fired or you're patty smacked, but you don't really have to worry too much. But then the older you are, like, I mean, if it was us, our age, I feel like there's definitely going to be more consequence.

I mean that so that's where I kind of feel like for like this post discussion it is obviously for you know people who are older we have you know jobs that we we absolutely don't want to lose or we've worked really hard to get into and you don't know who you're going to meet you know it could be where you have a connection with somebody and you want to explore that but you know,

your job's on the line, possibly. I also think it depends on whether it's on company property or off, like if it's something and also your relationship at work. Obviously, the, you know, employee manager doesn't work because that don't do that. Yeah, that is, again, while it's hot, that is definitely probably one of the worst things that you can do because you're both going to lose your job wholeheartedly.

All i can imagine though is if it was like a boss and you know you're the employee of that boss is just getting railed over a desk and that is so fucking hot i know like it is again the thought of all of it is so exhilarating and exciting and like it would wholeheartedly be the best or one of the best things i should say but is it worth it you know i kind of feel like it falls on one of those fantasies. Yeah, absolutely.

And I'm sure guys have this fantasy because, you know, say they're, you know, the top of their corporate world, I'll say. And I'm just using corporate just because it's easier to think of that as a fantasy. And there's a hot secretary and they wear skirts and high heels and very put together and low cut tops. And you would never expect it. Exactly. And then heaven forbid, heaven forbid, we want this. You have like a project that you're working on and they happen to be there after hours.

Like you totally can make something happen if all the cards are played right. Yes. Yeah. I mean, I feel like especially if you have an office job or a corporate job, like that's probably one of the top fantasies for a lot of people is being able to do that. I mean, and depending on other jobs, like even if it's, you know, warehouse workers, they can sneak off in the warehouse somewhere or, you know, just different things like that. There's so many things that you can do.

Are very sexy. Yeah. I mean, we've even heard, and this is not in the lifestyle, but we have heard the scenarios, even with like fast food restaurants where they go into the cooler or where they have their supplies and they get a quick fuck in. Like, that's hot. Probably not great when it comes to, you know, your food, but I mean, you're going to wash your hands anyway.

Nobody's gonna know you hope right you hope so yeah and again one of those situations where kind of like yeah that'd be kind of hot too like that's exhilarating and you know just kind of brings it back to the the thrill of things well and even like even in the restaurant scenario, it would be very sexy where even if it doesn't hurt it doesn't happen in the restaurant like you kind of hang back after your shift and like after the restaurant

closes for the night and you mess around in the car and... Oh, hell, if the restaurant closed and, you know, there's no cameras, or maybe if there's cameras, if you're really, like, not caring, I would use those fucking tables. Fair. Like... You just have, oh, I'm going to say this, an elderly couple sitting at that table and you're like, you know what, I'm going to fuck you over that table right now. Or I'm going to lay you on it. Or every time somebody sits at that table then afterwards.

Oh, my God, yes. That. That's what that would be hot. Because I would walk by that table every time and envision what had happened nights before. And just blush. Yep. And be like, oh, they're sitting at that seat that I just squirted all over and had to wipe up. and they had no idea. That would be so hot. And I'm sure it's happened so many times.

It had to have. And I'm sure like we don't hear about it or years later, you might come across a story of that or something very similar and you'd be like, see, these things do happen. But I do feel like in real life situation, as hot as it is, what does take away from it is that if you get caught and lose your job. Oh, for sure. And then the other thing too is the trauma. That can happen. Oh, yeah. Because guys... What if it goes badly?

Right. Guys are just as bad or just as guilty of bringing in drama into a workplace, especially if there's, say, multiple guys that find the same woman attractive. It's one of those things, like the competition of trying to get her attention. So, like, I can just foresee that ending badly. Yep. Wholeheartedly. And honestly, I'm sure it happens all the time, whether it's professional corporate or whatnot. I mean, the conversations of who would you bang?

Literally, you get people in a room that are comfortable enough with each other and having those conversations of, okay, from this team, who would you bang? Oh, yeah. I feel like that happens when you don't have HR hanging on and around every corner. So you're not worried about what you talk about or how you act. So there is that flirtatious ability that comes out because you're being yourself. And as much as we all think that everybody's monogamous, they're not. Nope.

And it is as subtle as flirting. That in itself tells you that not every single person on this earth is monogamous. Because if you were to say, oh, I'm completely monogamous, that means you don't flirt around or have the opposite sex as your friend. Because if you had them as your friend, you know, and at least for us, and I know we're very much aware of this, sometimes, I will say, because sometimes I think we don't always read the signs.

But any guy that a woman is friends with, that guy has thought about fucking you. At 100%, absolutely. It's never on the line of, oh, you know, we're just friends. No, they're at night freaking whacking off to you. I agree. Especially if you've had flirtatious, you know, comments or even just like general conversation where like you are talking about sexual things, not necessarily with each other. Or even just about your current relationship and their sex life or something like that. Yes.

Right. Like it's planting the seed without even realizing that you're doing it. You're just conversing over something that we're all adults. We're all having sex. So we have that level of, you know, we're in the same boat.

So you can bond over that and that just again lands the seed it absolutely does and it's super hot though so yeah i i don't know for me it needs to stay a fantasy that's my bottom line yeah it's again it could it can get really really muddy and it can happen really quick like it may be okay that first time but then you're going to be worrying like is that person going to say something because you pissed them off? Not only that, like what if you're messaging outside of work?

Like screenshots are forever. Sorry, but. They are. They are 100%. And all you need is say that person that you're flirting with has a spouse who is not okay with them talking to the opposite sex, especially anybody at work, especially outside of work. So like they obviously understand that when you're at work, you're going to be talking to whoever you work with, male, female. But then And when you get home, they don't want that conversation to continue because they like leave it at work.

So if you don't do that, that automatically is going to be setting up a huge fight to happen. Mm-hmm. For sure. So again, one of those things, just leave it as a fantasy. As much as it would be fun, it's not advisable. There's just too many variables to things going bad. And I wouldn't suggest it. Yeah, I agree. It's definitely, again, you have to decide whether the risk outweighs the fun that you're having.

What do you want to do? Everybody is their own person, and I'm sure that there's horror stories and also successful stories out there. However, don't get caught as the head of HR at a Coldplay concert on camera. Oh my gosh. Yeah, don't get caught doing that. I think she was head of HR. I believe so too. And he was the CEO. I think that's how it was. Yes, and again, like, what were you thinking? And of all things, HR, come on. Seriously, literally.

Like, you did not think that through. Not one bit. No, and blame it on alcohol and whatever. I'm sorry, sweetie. You guys were way too comfortable with each other. Right. And again, if you're going to blame it on alcohol, those thoughts were already there way before you even took a sip of that drink. Blame it on the alcohol. Exactly. That just made it a lot more fun. That's all that did. Yes. Yeah. It just expedited the process. Yes, it did.

It totally did. And you're like, oh, yeah, this was this is fine. And then you're not even thinking about all of those variables of how this could end badly. Oh, yeah. All reason goes out the window. Of course. Oh, well.

So what is our next one you'd like to talk about? So the next one was another topic that we saw that had come up in a group. And the question was, how important is kissing for you in the lifestyle? Ooh. So for me, I am not one of those people where I say that kissing is off limits.

For me, I need to have that because I need it to feel normal because I feel like if there's no kissing and you're just going to go to soft swapping or just straight up fucking, I don't feel connected and into the moment where if I was kissing you and slowly building upon the kissing to leading to sucking your cock or eating your pussy or whatever. And then going to fucking like that overall experience brings it all together for me.

And I know there's a lot of people in the lifestyle who say that kissing is off limits. And I can't quite wrap my brain around that one just because how do you not make that happen? Like, because it's a go-to for me. Like, it's the, I don't know, it's the first thing that I start everything with. Yeah, I have played with no kissing couples and it's awkward. Like, or couples where I can kiss the female, but not the male, which to me screams somebody cheated or there's red flags everywhere. Okay.

In that scenario. But then, you know, even on the posts and stuff, you see a lot of people commenting and saying, well, that's more intimate. I save that for my partner and I. Which, to each their own, but I'm also on the same boat as you, where I would rather have that little bit of buildup. And I don't know, I feel like it sort of puts my mind at ease, because it is hard to sort of just jump into things right away. Like you said, like, going down on somebody starting to do a soft swap,

like, it's awkward. Yeah, like, it kind of goes along with the foreplay, you know, like that, that kissing part is starting things for me like mentally. I can't just jump right in because then I'm like, okay, so I'm just doing an activist service. So I'm just like pretending to be a whore. Like it doesn't do anything for me. And I'm sure like it doesn't really do much for a guy either, because I'm sure like they want to be, you know, kissing other women.

And I kind of feel like this kind of comes a lot from women who are insecure in their relationship and insecure in the lifestyle because they feel like, well, I will save this one piece for just my partner and I like he cannot do this with other women. And that makes me feel better right and i mean so you have said that you've played with couples that have that as a rule how did that look like if you can think back to one of those scenarios.

How did that look from the beginning to like finally actually like either doing the soft swap or the fucking part i mean i think so like with the obviously in the conversations when you're talking about dynamics and you know the boundaries and stuff like that's all that thankfully has been a boundary that's always been communicated if it's part of their you know boundaries and it is a little bit awkward I now try and shy away from

it because it is harder but in the one scenario I will say it was a little bit easier because thankfully even though they were a no kissing couple they were also like I can I'm more spontaneous I'm definitely you know the type that can just jump into things. However, I feel like if there's a lot of like that sensual touching and different things like that, that's another way to sort of get it going because it's not literally just drop your pants, let's go.

You know what I mean? So if there's a little bit more of that.

Physical touch instead of the kissing i mean it's it's not it's probably the best alternative right it's not the same but it gives you a little bit of something to work off of right not just jumping right in right so in the instance of that scenario where there was no kissing like how did it play out then for you like i mean how did it start then it's exactly that like it's the touching and stuff where it's like, I don't remember exactly because it's been a while, but I think it was more

like me sitting on the bed, them coming over and sort of, you know, like being touchy feely and different things like that. It was the couple focusing on me first.

And then I would say that I will say it is very awkward, though, when they're like making out in front of you and it's like like it's not including you yeah i mean i don't i don't need it to include me but it's also one of those things where it's weird when they're like heavy makeout session right next to you while you're i don't it's just weird because you're not allowed to do that so it's like one of those things where i'm i'm great that i'm it's

great that they're connecting on that and having the experience with someone else there but it just seems very awkward card. Okay, I mean, I guess that definitely makes sense because, you know, you're kind of like, so like, I know I'm here as like an added bonus, because like you as playing as a once unicorn, you know, that was kind of the goal for you. And that's what you enjoyed about being in with another couple and doing a threesome. Um, I just, I don't know.

I guess it's just weird to, to think like how it all would play out. And like, I wish that in some ways, like I've experienced that. So that way I could be like, yeah, no, no, I can totally see why people that say kissing is only for the couple and not for like anybody else in the lifestyle would be like, yeah, no. I mean, like I already feel that way, but like to have experienced it to be like, yeah, no, it's definitely not okay.

Yeah. That's why, like I said, I try and shy away from it because it's definitely something thing I enjoy and I would very much rather have that part of the foreplay instead of just trying to avoid it. Because it also, I feel like it's also natural in play scenarios because like. You're right there in front of the person. Right. Like if you're riding on or, well, yeah, if you're straddling a dude or even the chick, you're going to want to kiss them because they're right there.

And that adds to your experience with them. So like it would be really hard to not do it with them. Yep. Just because like, it's so enticing. It's right there. Why wouldn't you? Yes. Also, I kind of feel like this is going to sound bad, but for the couples that tend to like really be focused on each other when they are full swapping with either another couple or when they have someone added in, I feel like by kissing them, it brings them back in to focusing on you.

And if you can't do that, their brains all over the place. So, you know, I then would start getting in my head worrying that I'm not giving them a good experience because they're almost like having an ADD brain like, oh, hey, look, what is my partner doing over there?

It is definitely hard to keep track of boundaries sometimes because like if you are playing with a couple, especially if they have multiple boundaries, it's really hard to keep that in mind of, oh, crap, I can't kiss them or, oh, crap, I can't, you know, do this certain thing.

Like, because your brain is all over the place then and you are not going to be as much of your normal self in that play scenario because you are going to be worried about making sure that you're not crossing their boundaries. There's a lot that goes along with it mentally when it comes to that stuff. Have you ever had that happen where, you know, you were just in the moment and did accidentally kiss somebody? No, that I have not because there weren't I haven't played with too many no

kissing couples. There's, you know, been maybe two, three at the most. But crossing boundaries, when it has happened, which hasn't been very often, it was a boundary that wasn't communicated. And I feel like it was something that they didn't realize was a boundary of theirs. Oh, so something that was, you know, you're enjoying your time and then all of a sudden something happened that was new for them. They all of a sudden went, oh, shit.

Now, did they call out that boundary right away or was it after play session was over? Typically, it was after the play session was over. You could just tell it was awkward in the room. Okay. Like, it's one of those things where you're like, I have no idea what I did. No idea what happened. It's very fucking awkward. Oh, no. Thanks. Till next time. See you later. I'm out. Like, I'm going to excuse myself while you guys have this conversation.

Right. Because you're like, it's not a me thing. Like, I didn't do anything wrong. I know that I followed the rules because I was very good about that. And I was very adamant about that because I'm not going to be some other person's problem. And that's what makes a really good unicorn, just so everybody knows. Right. So I was definitely really good about that. Tried to be anyway.

But yeah, I think a lot of it, a lot of the things that I had heard or that I had experienced was showing too much attention to me as a unicorn. Doing things differently to me than they do to their partner. Like just giving them an overall, like feeling like they were giving me a better experience than they are with their partner on the regular. That makes sense.

I was going to say, too, when it comes to, like, meeting a couple and say, like, you are interested in playing, I feel like I would really want to kiss them. And then, like, the more that we would talk and get to know each other before play—, That drive to want to kiss them would be really, really strong. Right. And I have a, I, this is going to sound terrible. I have a pretty good gut feeling that I would be the one to fuck up and I would kiss them.

Like say. I could see that. Right. And not intentionally, not maliciously, like you're not doing it on purpose. Absolutely not. It would definitely be, I would be so wrapped up in the moment. And whether, like, for one that I can definitely envision happening is, you know, it's not like one-on-one. So it's like, just we are where I am on top of him. I'm riding his dick. And I'm just looking into his eyes. And he's really into the moment. He's looking into mine.

That's where I could foresee it happening. Yeah, that's fair. And then I know, like, as soon as I did it, I would be like, oh, shit. I wasn't supposed to do that. And then I'm going to feel really bad. And then I'm going to know nine times out of 10, I pissed off the wife. Yeah. I mean, and that's where some couples will deal with it in the moment and some couples will deal with it later. Yeah. And I think that depends too on how they go about things and their maturity.

Yeah. So, and I say maturity, not only as overall, like their age maturity, but the maturity and their lifestyle, adventure, journey, whatever you want to call it as well. And relationship period. Yeah, yeah, that definitely would be the determining factor on how they would handle it. And I would hope, like, they wouldn't be super mad.

But I get it if they would be, just because, like, if it was a boundary and it did get crossed, yes, it was communicated, and I would feel so bad if it did happen. Like, I would be apologizing profusely just because I knew that wasn't supposed to happen, and it did. I'd be like, oh, my God, I am so sorry. But it's also because I'm a big person in kissing. Like, I love to do that. And that's how I've always been. And again, it's the leading up to everything.

Like, you can't just not kiss somebody. I mean, you're missing out on a lot of things, you know. And that's not just... Making out with tongue, you know, because some people and fun fact, I used to be really bad at kissing with tongue to see y'all now. But I've also kissed a lot of people who would shove their tongue down your throat. Yeah. And I can't tell you like going through like high school and like into like my early 20s, how many guys did that?

Oh, I believe it. I think we all as teenagers experienced that. Yeah. And that's all I had to go off of. So, yep, I was that type apparently that was sticking my tongue down your throat. So sorry for all the people who I have ever made out with that I did that to.

Apologize for that. If you ever happened to listen to this podcast, I will tell you I am way better now. Practice. I have practiced. That's for sure. I've also practiced sucking dick because apparently I sucked at that too. Hey, it takes time. Not everybody's born a pro. I was not. But now I'm a certified porn star, so I've got it covered. Yep. All right. So we kind of touched base on boundaries and not wanting to cross them. And we have seen a post about boundaries in many different ways. Yep.

Whether it be, like we said, we were talking about a boundary of no kissing. Can there also be a comparison of a boundary being crossed as far as cheating or having a boundary being crossed in the lifestyle like those two be similar right so you're saying like which one would be harder in the lifestyle if your partner crossed a boundary or if your partner cheated yeah yeah i feel like for me it would be pretty equivalent i feel like it would be because both of them are hard limits, right?

Well, yeah. You know, and obviously, depending on your dynamic, depends on the definition of cheating, right? So, like, is cheating the emotional side? Is cheating, you know... Going like if you're just a soft swap couple, and obviously you're crossing a boundary if you're going to full swap, but that's also cheating then. So I feel like it depends on the couple, depends on their boundaries. But for me, I would feel probably the same amount of betrayal either way.

Yeah, that's a hard one, I think, for me, just overall, because, I mean, like you had said, there's a boundary for a reason. And that's, you know, something that you're not comfortable with, that you don't want to go through because you already know it's going to upset you. So it can't really fall that much farther away from cheating. The difference is when it comes to cheating, it was a secret. You kept that from your partner. You know, you decided to do something that

you're going to hold from them and never tell them. Well, devil's advocate there, you can do the same thing with boundaries, especially if you're playing solo. Oh, yeah. So say you have a rule of you always have to use condoms. What if they don't use a condom? Oh, yeah. That's a fucking gut punch right there. I also think it depends on

the severity of the boundary. Okay. Because like, again, in the situation of a no kissing couple, if you accidentally kiss them, I feel like that that's a little bit more forgivable. Right, because it was somebody else doing it. Or, right, exactly. And, you know, there's the argument of, well, they could have stopped them. Fair. But what if they didn't? Right. So you're participating, whether it's they initiated or whatnot, you're still participating.

So, that's a boundary that's being crossed, but I feel like that's more forgivable than not using a condom when you're supposed to. Yeah, and two, say you did not stop a kiss from happening, or even if the kissing continued during your play with that person. I feel like it depends on how you handled it as well.

Like, did you, as soon as you were done playing with this person, did you go to your partner and tell them, hey, I had a really great time, but our boundary got crossed of kissing and they kissed me and I didn't tell them, hey, we can't do that. I kind of got lost in it myself and it lasted for a couple of minutes. I'm sorry. I fucked up here. And I know like that's still going to be a hard conversation, but I feel like if you're truthfully honest. Yeah, it's going to be way easier to handle.

Right. So I feel like maybe there is that slight gray area when it comes to what's worse between cheating. Agreed. And a boundary being crossed. It depends on, again, how big of a boundary is it? You know, can it be that kiss situation? and you say, as soon as you're done, you let them know. Or, and to me, I feel like this one could be a lot harder as far as a boundary of the, like your example, using condoms, you play solo and didn't use one.

I feel like that would then make me feel like every time you played solo, you were just gonna opt to not wear one. It's the trust. It's the trust thing. Yeah. And again, I also think it would be, it opens up a lot for conversations. Like, again, if you don't use a condom and you would tell your partner about it, again, a lot easier to work through than if you just didn't and then they found out later. Still a big boundary to cross, much harder to come back from than kissing. Yeah.

But I'm sure that there are scenarios where it's successful where if that boundary is crossed, maybe you don't have feelings about it. Maybe you're like, you know what? I'm not that mad. Yeah. I think, you know, it could be because of how it ends up being handled where, you know, at first because you didn't experience it then. You're just kind of like, I don't want to ever have that happen. So this is why it's a boundary. But then say it did get crossed, you'd be like...

Well, you know, you talked to me about it. You were honest. That goes a long way. So maybe it ends up being where you can have those things happen and it's okay. Like you can change things. And we see that a lot in the lifestyle. And that's one thing that we've talked about many times, that the lifestyle is supposed to be always evolving.

You're going to grow in different areas you know you're going to start out small i mean example only soft swap only and then you eventually move yourself into full swap right and say you used to only playing together under the same roof the same room as your full swap eventually maybe you'll start doing the solo play and again you're still growing in this journey so it could just be one of those where it opens that door for you. You just don't know it right away.

And it may not happen that first time either. You know, it could be a couple experiences of different things that you're like, you know what? It's actually okay. Like, I feel like I am mature now that I can handle this mentally and it's not going to take away from my experience. And I also don't want to take away from my partner's experience. Yeah. And I agree with that. I do think it is very situational. I also think it's going to be different if it's with people you trust versus a new partner.

And it is good. We've talked about this before where we would love to be able to find couples or friends that would be regular play partners that we can build that friendship with. And I feel like in those scenarios, you can experiment a little bit with boundaries, but be open with them about it. Be like, hey, this is something that we've had as a boundary for a while. We trust you guys. We'd like to, you know, try and try it and potentially lift that boundary.

I mean, again, that's the beauty of the lifestyle. Yeah. And we've even had that conversation as far as like using condoms versus not using condoms. Obviously, first time playing with people, we're always using condoms. But if they were to get to the point of being our regular play partners, whether we were all together or one of us got together with someone else out of that group that we're close with, that we could all have that discussion of, hey, you know what?

They're not super active. They're only active with us and vice versa. And we all do regular testing. I mean, hell, we got tested. I was tested in September. You were tested in November. No, October. October. Because we went on vacation the first week in November. Oh, that's right. Okay. So I was in September. You were in October. And, you know, we even had the discussion. Well, I mean, even though we're with the same people, we should probably still they'll do it anyway.

Yeah. I mean, again, it's the documentation. It's the peace of mind. Right. Because if we are playing with someone new for the first time, they don't know that we haven't played with anybody else. Exactly. So even though we haven't, they don't know that. Exactly. And just having that documentation saying, nope, we're all good, is that peace of mind. Yeah. And I have no problem going and getting it done multiple times just for peace of mind. And it's not even just for them.

It's just for me too because like you don't know yeah you can have something that you are not even aware of so i would rather after a play with anybody go get tested again especially if you fuck your co-worker go get tested after yes it probably wouldn't hurt yeah especially if you were being wild and crazy and didn't use a condom yep like key to the moment man yeah i mean i'm sure that's hot as fuck, but man, you got to cover all your bases either beforehand or after.

Oh, absolutely. You got to protect yourselves. So, yeah, I definitely feel like those things as far as cheating and boundaries, they're similar in some ways, but they're a little bit different in others. And I think that also goes back to communication, too. When you and your partner are going over your boundaries, talking through how hard of a boundary that is.

And I think that that makes it a little bit easier, too, so that way they know which ones are the absolute hard no's or maybe a softer boundary where it's like, I'm not comfortable with this right now, but I'm okay with down the road revisiting that conversation. Yeah, I mean, that's actually a great point, because you can have boundaries that aren't all lumped under the same umbrella. You can have those that are more flexible.

Like, at this time, I'm not comfortable with it, but I could revisit it. Yeah. May end up not being a boundary anymore after X amount of time or X amount of experience where, you know, other ones are steadfast, condoms are a must all the time. Yep. So definitely, again, one of those things where have that conversation and grow with your partner to eliminate having any of those feelings of, well, they crossed that boundary and I feel like it's, you know, cheating.

Yeah. And in reality, I think it's also good to just check in and touch base before any either experience or event and just be like, hey, we're still good. These are still our boundaries. This is still what we're working with sort of thing. So that way, the conversation is always fresh. Everybody's always on the same page.

Yeah, that's another great idea. And I almost kind of feel like a lot of people who have been in the lifestyle for any assort amount of time, they get kind of lax on their communication, and there's no harm in just double-checking.

Like, where are we standing? Are we still where we left off from the last event that we were at? Or has any of your feelings changed? Yeah, I mean, even if you are one of those couples that have no boundaries, right? Like, just go have a good time, whether it's, you know, same room, same roof, anything like that. It's always good to continue to check in.

Yeah, it definitely is. Because any little situation can change and it can even be down to people that, you know, you know, they were really interested in that those situations will make those boundaries maybe be needing to be revised. And sometimes because we are all human, it's things outside of the lifestyle that might impact the way that we approach an event.

Like if something in your life is happening, you know, now and you're going out to event next weekend, you know, there may be things that you're like, hey, maybe we don't play with other people this weekend. I'm having a rough time. You just you got to communicate. Yep, you definitely do. Communication is key. That it is. So you brought up something to me just before we actually got started. Yes. And this was not something that I was aware of.

So you want to fill in on what it was that you noticed that you're kind of like, what the fuck? Yeah. So saw a post in, again, this is all about posts and groups today. Saw a post in one of the groups. So every year there is a bar crawl. It's the Santa bar crawl that there's a lot of swingers, lifestyle people that go to. So they get a block of rooms at the hotel, at a hotel close. It's within walking distance. And then they do the bar crawl.

Obviously, it is a vanilla event. Oh, but you have a lot of swingers that attend. Yeah. So how does that work to it? Because I have not attended these just because, well, one, I lived in Alabama for almost five years. So I was very much out of the loop on these things. Saw the post for them and like, oh, that sounds so much fun. But we didn't have any of those down here. So you have gone to one. Yeah, I think it was the first year. I think it was the first year that they did it.

So there's one person who tends to sort of run it and it's not anything other than, I should say, they organize it. So call the hotel, get a block of rooms and sort of manage it that way. So then the people actually have to call the hotel and book their rooms. So they don't go through this person? No, they go through the hotel, but the hotel will give them so many rooms. And then if they need more, they'll call and say, hey, I need more rooms.

And they do that to keep everybody together, try and keep them on the same floor. If you need more than one floor, just keep everybody together. Okay. So the event or the hotel is open to everybody. Like, again, it is a regular hotel. It is not a hotel takeover. It is a vanilla hotel that swingers are staying. So you're sharing this space with normal people that are not attending this event. Correct. Interesting. So I feel like this can cause a lot of confusion. Yeah. Hence the post that we saw.

Okay. So after the event, there was a post, a couple posts on the pages. So one, and I thought it was odd, but I understood after I saw the other post. So the first post is I saw that there was a group that started a conversation of if you, if there are lifestyle people at a vanilla event, How do you act? Easy. You behave yourself. You're vanilla. Yeah. Like you have to blend in. Like you're there with everybody else. So it's like it's an innuendo.

Basically, you're a walking innuendo. Literally. So there were a lot of people commenting and saying the same thing. Like if you're going out to a vanilla event... You're vanilla. Like you're not, you're just swingers at a vanilla event. It's not a swingers event. So then I see another post about the bar crawl where the hotel is probably never going to invite them back. They're not going to allow them because of everything that had happened.

What the fuck happened if a hotel says, yeah, you can't come back? Right. Think about it. And it's a moneymaker. Like this was four years in a row. I was just thinking that like that hotel is making bank. Yes. And they're now turning you away? What the fuck did you do to fuck that up? And not only that, they're probably making sure the other hotels in the area know as well. Oh, shit. I would. Like, if that was my business and you came in there and you were acting a fool.

So from what I understood from the post is, and from other people commenting. So obviously rules a hotel takeover are very different than at a normal hotel, obviously. Yeah. So, hotel takeover, you can be naked typically everywhere but the lobby. Yes. Now, it's different per hotel, but, or the lobby, restaurant, and bar areas, you usually have to be clothed. Right. At a vanilla hotel, you have to be clothed everywhere except your room.

Yeah. Yeah, that would be kind of how that works because, like, you wouldn't go to any hotel with your family and be walking around nude. Yeah, you're not going skidipping. Right. Yeah. Apparently, there were people in the lobby in the nude, or at least with no top on or just different things. Like, again, there were other families there. Did the hotel, like, manager say anything to these people? I'm sure they did. I didn't see those details or anything, but I mean, I assume they did.

That's probably one of the biggest reasons they're not allowed back. And I was also wondering, too, was there not security that was, like, keeping tabs on people to make sure that they were abiding by the rules? I think the hardest part, one of the comments that I saw was when there were people in there, regardless if there was security there or not, there were families walking through. Oh, shit. So, and there was some sort of, like, kids team there for some sort of sport.

I can't even remember what it was. So you had... An entire sports team staying there with their families, plus just regular normal family staying there. And then you walk in this lobby that is flooded with people who are just batshit crazy. Oh, I can't even fucking fathom this. Like, what were you honestly thinking? Like, it's, and I'm sure this is like, oh, they're like, oh, it's a hotel. They're drinking, obviously. So you're just doing free nilly whatever you want.

But it wasn't a lifestyle takeover. There probably wasn't a sign on that door that said private event. Yeah. Private event. Hotel is full. Like, that to me was always something that we always saw when we went to hotel takeovers. If you're taking over the event, it is swingers only. If it's not and you're just staying there, again, this was like what we said earlier, it's a vanilla event, basically.

So just because you are a quote-unquote swinger and you're going with other quote-unquote swingers, the facilities you are going to, you cannot be this way. Oh, my God. And speaking of drinking, like that was another thing. So the hotel is very nice. And the lobby is a very decent size. And they also have a bar down there where you can buy drinks. Okay. So unfortunately, there were a lot of people that were BYOB, which, again, I can understand, you know, in your room, you know, whatever.

But they have, and we've even seen this at hotel takeovers, where if you're in certain areas, you have to buy the drinks there from the bar. Right. And you can't bring your own alcohol. Correct. So they had the same rules in their lobby. Like if you were going to drink in the lobby, you had to purchase the alcohol there. And they weren't even respecting that. They were bringing coolers down and sitting there drinking in the lobby. And that's a lot of money lost for the hotel, too.

I'm, wow. See, I'm like flabbergasted. I can't even imagine this because, one, again, did the hotel manager come up and say anything about this? Did, you know, was there any complaints from, you know, these people? Families that were there with their kids and, you know, the event that they, well, not really event, but the people from the sports event. So, like...

I'm sure they were. And again, like those are probably people that may never go back to that hotel because of people, swingers that couldn't act like normal people. Like I can only I can only imagine how a quote unquote vanilla person felt when they walked down into the lobby to see titties everywhere. Yeah. Like what? And especially if you had a kid with you. Oh, yeah. Like I would be like, what the fuck is going on? And I would be pissed. I would be furious.

Just because, I mean, yeah, we're parents. We get that. But, you know, we're also in the lifestyle, too. But we know there's a time and a place. We know the fucking difference. And if it's clearly stated this is not a hotel takeover, there's going to be other people here and children. And you know that going into it. When you book your room, you know that going into it. Like, the person who organizes the event is very clear about that.

Like, there's no mix-up whatsoever. However, every year it has always been, it is not a swingers event. This is a bar crawl that we are getting a group of people that we, like a group of you, are invited. However, it's not lifestyle. And it is very clear. So, I mean, I guess in a way, as far as it not being fully vanilla, because, you know, it is people involved in the lifestyle, you could potentially take someone back to your room. Correct. But you're staying in your room behind closed doors.

You're not running down the hall naked. Nobody would know any different. Because, I mean, it would be no different than you and your husband, boyfriend or whatever, girlfriend, going back to your room because you're traveling and fucking for the night. Right. And not only that, like you have in regular hotels, people that if they are traveling, they stay in the same hotel room, like two couples stay in the same hotel room to save money.

Yeah. That's not uncommon. Right. It's not. I mean, obviously, if it's two swinger couples, you know that there's probably more than that going on. Right. However, again, to the naked eye, it would be no different. Right. And that's how it should be. It should be just normal people conducting themselves like normal human beings. And I just can't even imagine that whole shit show going down. Yep.

And I feel bad for the organizer because like they truly spend so much time putting effort and, you know, organizing everything, making sure people are comfortable, making sure that people have everything that they need to go. And, you know, trying to just manage people in general. And because they're the main contact, then that looks bad on them. And to think they've been doing this for what you said, four years? This is the fourth year in a row.

Yep. So what changed? Why did this year become a shit show where nobody understood how this was supposed to work? Yep. I don't know. Is it the fact that people just don't give a fuck? Honestly, like, it's one of those things where if you have truly been in the lifestyle for a long time or whatever, like, you know not to act that way. Alcohol or not, if you want to do that shit, go to a fucking club.

Right. There are many clubs in the state of Pennsylvania that you can go to and be naked as a jaybird from the minute you walk in.

Yeah. I mean, there's the corral. mm-hmm there's tj's there's charisma there's a lot there's quite a few i know i can't think off you put me on the spot i'm so sorry but there are like there's a lot of clubs that you can go out to and again there are hotel takeovers frequently yeah and you know the way because i haven't gone to a bar crawl even though they do sound really fun it's a lot of fun it basically is a meet and great on steroids exactly well it's it is it's literally

you're bar hopping yeah it's exactly what you're doing is you're walking down the street you're bar hopping it's not any different than going to like nashville and bar hopping like yeah you can dress a little bit sexier but you're not going to show your tits to everybody right you're not get back to your hotel you're not showing your tits to everybody like no that's not how that works it's not like you're going to mardi roll where like you're going to win beads for it

like it's not like that's again a completely different event. Like I wholeheartedly understand. But in normal small town Pennsylvania, this isn't what we do. This is why we can't have nice things. Right. And that makes you, that makes the lifestyle look bad. Wholeheartedly. Because again, everybody that was impacted by that, that was not in the lifestyle is probably sitting there saying, this is exactly why that this lifestyle is such a terrible idea.

And, you know, it's not like you are, you're not expected to represent the lifestyle. That's not, like, if you're a part of the lifestyle, it's not a, you know, a requirement at all. But it's one of those things where you have to look at things in the big picture. And if you don't want to ruin things for everybody, something we've learned in school, don't act a fool. Exactly. Think before you do something. Because now, who knows if they're going to be able to do that event again.

I highly doubt it. I don't, if I was the organizer, I don't think I'd want to. I'd be done. Because they're representing her at that point. Right. And at that point, I would be pissed at every single person that decided they weren't going to take this seriously and treat it like it was a lifestyle event. Yep. Agreed. And maybe not everybody did. Okay, so maybe I can't be bothered everybody. From what I understood, it was a small portion of the people that were there,

but it's still enough to mess it up for everybody. Exactly. Because all it takes is that one person. And it is a big event. Like, I should say it's gotten more popular over the years. Obviously, just like with everything else, the crowd seems to rotate. Yeah. So, I mean, maybe it was one of those things that it was somebody in the crowd who thought like, hey, this is a free-for-all because it's all lifestyle people. So, like, yeah, why couldn't we?

Well, no, because there's other factors here that you obviously were not paying attention to. Yes, clearly. And maybe that's why I would say, you know, one of those things is the people that did it in particular are the ones that you hash it out with. Absolutely. And you ban them 100%. I would be making sure that they were well aware that their behavior was unacceptable.

They will not be welcomed back because, again, that is one of the hardest parts of trying to organize anything is when you have those people that can't follow the rules or just can't, you know, conduct themselves in, you know, such a manner. Yeah. And it is one of those things, too. It's always going to be a gamble because you can't control everybody or anyone, may I say. You can't control anyone. You just hope for the best and kind of prepare for the worst.

I don't know that you could prepare. Like, I don't know that you would think to prepare yourself in that way because you would hope that everybody, because we're adults, would act as an adult. I guess in a way it was in the prepare mind, in my mind, I'm just thinking like, maybe it's in the back of your head. Like, there's a possibility, but I'm hoping not. So I'm not going to worry about the negative sides. I'm going to just go, okay, we're going to have a good time. This is the plan.

If anything bad happens, then we'll go from there. Yeah, that's fair. Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense. But yeah, I feel super bad for everybody that had to, you know, sort of navigate that situation. So hopefully they can figure something out for next year so it doesn't ruin it for everybody. I agree. I definitely agree.

Well, I think that was a very good episode that we have. I agree. We have some pretty good topics. Some heated ones, actually. Or some very strong opinions on them, for damn sure. I know we are coming up to the Christmas holiday.

It falls on Thursday, I believe. so we do have some time off so there is actually a very good chance that we will have an episode coming out for the monday after christmas 29th yep so we'll definitely want you all to stay tuned for that and then i think what we'll probably try to do because then of course the next holiday is going to be new year's we unfortunately are not going to be going out no we're not a nice family night. Yeah, we have our minions.

So I know we were asked about what our New Year's Eve plans were going to be. And unfortunately, we will not be doing any adult lifestyle things. But we are hoping to get out though soon. I mean, TJ's is only about 35 minutes from me. So we're hoping to get out there soon. I know we've been saying that for a while, but... With Pedro getting back to a regular schedule, we'll be able to make that happen. Yeah.

Yeah, it'll definitely be a lot easier once all these holidays are over and we're kind of just chilling and not having a whole lot of things to do. We can make more plans and arrangements and stuff like that. So we'll definitely be getting out there. Definitely before spring too, because I know we do have a hotel takeover. Yes, April. In April. That is going to be the Delco Degenerates. Yes. We'll be going to that one again, which will be a great time.

But as far as like the small little club things we're gonna try to get out so at least one of them like you said whether it was tj's or maybe even going to the corral yeah those are my two favorites tj's in the corral different crowds different places we talked about that but yeah definitely both two of my favorite clubs yeah i will not be going back to charisma ever we we won't do that one that's fine but yeah so one of the things that we'd

also like though is if if you're still listening to this episode if you have any stories that you would like us to share Please send them to us. Any lifestyle experiences, whether it's, you know, fun lifestyle experiences. Club experiences, spicy experiences. Any parallel experiences to the lifestyle, too. Yes. We would love to hear them. If you would like us to speak about them on the show and tell your story for you, we absolutely will.

And we also want to set up having some guests on the show, too. Yes. So if you guys have an idea of something that you would like to talk about and like to be a guest on the show, email us, let us know. and we'd love to get that set up. That sounds like a fun time. And especially with our little fantasy of the, you know, playing with a co-worker kind of scenario. If that happened to you, please do tell. Yes. If you need to censor it, of course, do so for, you know,

your own privacy. Yeah. And it's going to be an anonymous, right? Like, it will be completely anonymous. We can even, to make it a little bit more, we can even just add random names to it, right? Like, it'll be 100% anonymous. Yeah. Yeah, but I feel like that'd be really hot because if some have experienced some fantasy that came true for them, please let us know. Absolutely. Because I want to hear it. I really do. Fair.

I will live vicariously through you since I will not have the balls to try that. Yes, same. All right. Well, thank you all for listening and we will be back soon next week. You've been listening to Swing Theory, where we turn theory into action and stories into connection. Follow the show wherever you listen and slide into the DMs on all the socials with your stories or questions. Or drop your confessions at swingtheory2025 at gmail.com. Same trio, new stories. Next time on Swing Theory.