Sometimes doing the right thing comes, of course, be careful you're falling lower.
Hey it's fifty.
Cents and I'm Charlie Webster. This is surviving El Chapeau, The Twins who brought down a druglord Season two.
I know all too well the struggle that comes with choosing a different life. For me, it was music that allowed me to get out of the life and write a new destiny for myself. For Pedro and Mygodo Flores Junior, the Flores twins, it's been a long journey since they were sat in the backseat of their father's car is seven years old, loaded with drugs as it was moved across the Mexican border.
That's what started it all.
Without even knowing, they were put on the path that they've spent the last fourteen years trying to leave. To change the legacy of the Flora's name. Billions of dollars and thousands of decisions over decades have brought the Flora's family to where they are today.
The brothers said at that time, but as far as the government is concerned, the Flora's family haven't satisfied their debt to society.
One of the reason why we want to. I wanted to share the story.
These decisions we make, no matter how they are or whatever we try to fix, is coming at a cost. To this day, we're still We're still trying to make things right. We're still trying to correct our wrongs, and you know, we might get something right on one end and fail on somewhere else.
As men. I've told about this plenty of times.
The man that I was was I promised her that we're going to a different life. That I promised her, that was that put in home's way, like her past relationships, and I failed that by far.
I always hold myself responsible.
Because I think that's what you do as a leader, as a you know, as ahead of your house or.
The man that I am.
I think I hold myself responsible for leaving my family get to this point. You know, my children, I failed them.
After the wives were initially arrested and let go after two days, in twenty twenty one, a case started to be built by the government against Val and viv Remember. Val helped the government as part of j and Pete's cooperation and turned over four million dollars to the FEDS from the twins drug activity. Back in twenty ten, as part of the twins case, the government did a forensic investigation into their financials and couldn't find any further money
that was out on the streets. But it turns out there was more money owed to the twins from drug debts that the wives and Armando, the twins older brother, collected and hid from the government. The government claimed they didn't know about this money until they received a tip off from someone very close to the family.
Jerome Finnigin is the uncle of vv's brother in law. Jerome Finnegain was one of the corrupt Chicago police officers that got picked up on the steamed back in twenty sixty, and part of that arrest was vv's ex fiance Keith Herrera and Jerome and other police officers.
Police officers Keith Herrera and Jerome Finnegan were partners on the force together and known as two of the dirtiest cops in Chicago. The two of them topped the Chicago Police Apartment's misconduct complaints list in the five years between two thousand and one and two thousand and six. Keith the masked fifty three citizen complaints, Jerome fifty two. Keith and Jerome were closely linked to Viv. Before Viv got together with Pete, she was actually engaged to Keith, and
Viv's sister Bianca, ended up marrying Jerome's nephew. In two thousand and six, Keith, Jerome, and other police officers were arrested for making unlawful arrests and searches, gathering false evidence, and stealing money from drug dealers. In one instance, during an unlawful traffic stop, they took the person's house keys, broke into their house, and took half a million dollars in cash.
Well, when Keith flipped, he you know, flipped with the Feds to corporate against his fellow officers. Jerome finking wanning to hire someone to kill him.
Keith turned against Jerome and the other officers and worked with the police to bring them down. Jerome found out and plotted to kill his former partner Keith for cooperating, but the FED foiled the murder for higher plots, and Jerome was sentenced to twelve years in prison. Keith cooperation meant he was only sentenced to two months.
Okay, so you know he got a rushed in two thousand and six and he's in there in the MCC right Metropol Correctional Center in Chicago, the federal holdover right for federal inmates, and he's in the shoe. He's in protective custody. He's the orderly at that time when me and my brother come in. So orderly means he cleans up, he helps out, you know, the correctional officers if you
eat something you asked to orderly. Like so he's you know, sweets, mops, cleans up, might past the food trays or whatever the case is.
Jerome was the orderly at MCC Chicago. When Pete and j first went to prison and were in the shoe there, they didn't know who Jerome was.
The weeks went by, he'll stop by, Hey, I had no idea that he was related to V's like related through marriage to Vv's family, Like I know who he is from the street, like I know of him. But Pe, you know, while we're in the shoe, they start talking and he's like, hey, I know you and they're like, yeah, I know.
You know, like they know that he.
Knows that Viviana's Peter's wife. So they start making small talk right Pee, you know, right away befriends on then moving forward I guess his nephew, by chance, was a person that my older brother had help bring back the money from Washington, DC. And he goes the nephews go visit his uncle, and the uncle convinces him Jerome to bring the information to the FED so that he could get a lighter sentence. So that's how the FED found out.
Jerome was desperate to get out of prison. He would do anything he could to get information out of inmates that he could use as a bargaining tool to help him get his sentence reduced. That's why he befriended Pete. Jerome found out that there was money hidden from the
twins drug debts. Jerome's nephew, the one married to viv sister Bianca, helped Armando, Ja and Pete's older brother to collect the four million dollars from DC that vow turned over to the government, but Jerome knew there was more. He pushed his nephew to give that information to the FEDS, and the tip off from Jerome is what the government used to arrest Val and Viv. Jerome didn't end up getting any time off his sentence. Armando was also arrested
for his part in the collection of the money. If you remember, when fifty and I were recording season one, the Flores family found out that Armando had decided to cooperate with the government. After his arrest, Armando confessed that there was more money and provided evidence that ultimately implicated the wives. Armando was given an ultimatum by the government
to either serve serious time and face deportation. If you recall, J and P got him a US visa as part of their deal to cooperate or get favorable terms in exchange for information on the wives.
Jan Peter's older brother thanks like.
My best friend, and I mean I love him unconditionally, and I worry about his immigration status and him being deported.
Yeah, I mean, no matter what, I'm for my brother to be put in the best scenario possible now got himself and his family.
Just can't wait to put this behind us and.
Just get through it as a family like we've always done.
Amount of resources it takes into something like this, I wonder why the streets have flood away heroin and cocaine and even more dangerous stuff now fentanon and all kinds of shady Okay, because you know.
That's why I'd be focused on. Every office has.
The decision to you know, where they put their time and resources at.
And I can't agree that this is the best, you know, way to do that.
But that's just my opinion onwill all the other people are just keep doing what I was, you know, all the next P and J's probably there now building his empire round and orders.
The first thing that prosecutor will generally tell a cooperator or potential cooperator is the cooperation is an all or nothing proposition.
That's Michael Ferrara, the assistant US attorney that worked J and P's case against El Chapo from the very beginning. He worked alongside Thomas Shakeshaft and Adam Fels.
And the government needs to need that to be true when they say it.
They absolutely need it.
And so the reason for a prosecution like that is that it's a betrayal of trust at some level that they were given a second chance, they were given a clean slate, and decided to use drug proceeds for material things in a way that was very avoidable.
According to the government. In addition to the four million dollars from DC that Vile turned over to them, there was another two point three million dollars that they never told anyone about. One day, a U haul truck arrived at the twins older brother Armando's house in Austin, Texas. The truck was piled high with second hand furniture. Hidden inside the furniture with stacks of cash two point three
million dollars worth. Armando stored the money under his porch and sat on it for four years until twenty fifteen, when he started dispersing it to the wives in increments on average of nine thousand dollars via US Priority mail and UPS packages, as well as through gift cards. He would then pay himself a fee out of each delivery.
The government accused the wives of living a life ravish lifestyle, using the money to pay for luxury cars, designer purss, a platoon exercise bike, as well as private school for their children, living costs like rent, and over ninety nine thousand dollars on vacations.
The government clearly made the decision that that couldn't be tolerated, that they needed to send a message to other co operators, to just society as a whole, that if you join the government's team, that has to meaning from sort of beginning to end you can't be a cooperator and hiden.
Driump proceeds and living off of drum proceeds. At the same time, I.
Feel that in J and Peter sentencing memorandum, they spun it to the court like we basically benefited because we were given immunity.
But fast forward ten years they come and guide us. It's like they're trying to change the narrative. And I feel like the US Attorney's Office today is very different than what it was back in two thousand and eight, and I feel that they didn't have a certain roulebook to go by, and because this case was so big for J and Peter, I feel like there were mistakes made because it's never been done before on both sides.
I don't fault anyone.
I just feel like the US Attorney's Office at the time, they didn't have the I want to say, the right guidance we were given, you know, certain benefits. I feel that today those things that we were promised that obviously
they're frowned upon. But at the same time, you can't punish our family because that's something that somebody that was a representative of the government, you know, which is Thomas Shaikshaft, he actually promised us these certain things when it comes to immunity or when it comes to us being able to keep a portion of the money. So if we were given these promises and we were led to believe that this was going to be embedded in.
Their cooperation, then how.
Is it when you fast forward ten years they're able to charge us on the things that we were supposed to be promised and we were given. On March twenty fourth, twenty eleven, the day I proffered, I spoke to Thomas Shakeshaft, which is a US attorney that was in charge. He basically told me not to worry. I'm not going to be charged. I took that as reassurance that they would
never prosecute me. At my proper meeting was Thomas Shakeshaft, Michael Ferrara, and DEA agents that were involved in the case. Thomas Shakeshaft he told Jay and Peter at a profit session that he didn't want to wipe them out of their money. So these things are being said to our husbands, these things are being said to us. These things are not you know, they're not seizing certain things even though I'm saying that we paid for all of this stuff
with drug proceeds from our husband's business. It's like they're allowing us to keep them, and so I don't understand how you can turn around and a decade later come back and then charge us.
The wives filed emotion to dismiss their charges in twenty twenty two, claiming that the twins deal provided them with immunity from charges related to the twins' crimes. The wives argued that the government allowed them to keep the money, and that's in a profit session with US Assistant Attorney Thomas Shakeshaft, all had tried to make the government aware there was extra money out there, but they didn't want to hear about it. All they were focused on was
getting El Chapo behind bars. A pre trial hearing was held for Judge Matthew Kennelly to examine the evidence. The wives had planned to have US Assistant Attorney Thomas Shakeshaft testify, but one week before the hearing, on July the nineteenth, shake Shaft died from chronic health problems and alcoholism. His alcoholism was blamed in part on the stress of the Flora's case. Michael Ferrara was called by the government to
be a witness. Here's what he had to say to us about the alleged immunity deal.
The way that it was presented in that defense is effectively that they were immunized forever more that they could do whatever they wanted in the future, which I don't know if that's a thing period in law enforcement, but it certainly wasn't here. And immunity like that can only come in writing, and it can only come from.
The US attorney. And I'm positive that no.
Immunity was issued by any US attorney in Chicago. The wives were entitled to take, i mean, just blatant drug proceeds and do whatever they want with them. The other comment I can make is that the whole thing is
very unnecessary and unfortunate for their families. And I truly do believe that Pete and Jay cooperated to give their families a better life, and they had the opportunity to do that, and so to allow sort of like material things like spending money private schools, going on trips, the kind of things that they appear to have spent their money on, all of that is just stupid in my opinion. I mean, to risk your freedom risk the safety of your families over things like that. It's just sad. It's
a sad thing for their families. It's just a really unfortunate thing that those kids were deprived of being around their dads for so long and now for how way long they're going to be deprived of being around their mothers in a meaningful way, all for something that was one hundred percent avoidable if they just would have, you know, sort of.
Kept their heads down, drove a used minivan and those kind of things.
The flip site to that, though, is I mean, in comparison to again, like two tons a month of cocaine coming into Chicago and Chapola being prosecuted and all that,
you're talking about a much smaller sum of money. And whether it's it sent the right message to use government resources like that to go after people who cooperated in a way that that did a lot of did a lot of good and had a lot of benefit to DJ So I think reasonable minds could differ on that and whether it sends a strong enough message of what should happen that that it's worth the potential downside.
To the wives and their lawyers. It was the government that broke its promise to the Florest family from the very beginning the Twins corporation and Pete's eventual testimony in court against Alchapo was done with the understanding that the rest of the family will be kept out of it. When questioned during the El Chapo trial, Pete testified that his wife Viv had been given immunity as part of
his corporation deal. The point was made by Valenvi's defense team that Pete spent eighteen months being prepped by the government to take the stand against Alchapo, and at no point, including under oath in court, was there ever any challenge to the notion that the wives had immunity. The wives argue that the government knew that there was money they were using to live off, and that it was used to pay for their kids' education and their own living expenses.
A single mother, they had to move their families across the country every time J and P were transferred. Viv had to move sixteen times due to viable threats on her life. The motion to dismiss the chargers was denied. They each had a choice to take their case to trial, but they were advised that the negative public perception would make a trial difficult. Instead, they each pled guilty to
money laundering conspiracy. Viv was sentenced to three and a half years in prison and ordered to pay five hundred and four thousand, eight hundred and fifty eight dollars in forfeitshire. She went to prison on the nineteenth of October twenty twenty three.
It's definitely scary because I mean, unusually, I mean, Peter is a very you know, his presence is like the rock of our family. I felt like I took his face when he had to leave, you know, I took over and I had to do I had to be mom and dad everything.
This is what kills me.
I think that it's you know, it's really really, definitely hard. I wasn't built for this, definitely wasn't built for this.
But a strong woman, and by far I know I am.
I think that my kids would definitely be very This is a scar that probably would never ever, ever would be able to repair.
We sit here and you know, you know, we've been here with you, Charlie for so many days, and you know, we talk about the kids and how we wanted to change their lights, and I feel like we're right back.
We're right back exactly where we never wanted to be.
Vaal received the same sentence as Viv three and a half years in prison, plus a five hundred and four thousand, eight hundred and fifty eight dollars forfeiture. She goes to prison on January tenth, twenty twenty four.
I felt like I was being targeted. I felt like they wanted to make an example of me, which is hurtful. But after understanding, you know, the government, the prosecutors that are in charge today of the case, I feel like they're only doing their job. And I know that if they were, you know, the prosecutors back then when my husband was cooperating, I feel like things would have been a lot different. I did actually testify at my hearing, and I did take accountability for money laundering. However, I
did believe that I had immunity. Whether the government agrees with that or not or just going to agree to disagree, but unfortunately I'm going to have to go to prison.
Think that I'm fighting with that, I'm struggling with, you know.
In court, I apologize to my children, you know, for the pain I caused, and I just regret putting them through this again. But I feel really blessed with the time that I did get because I got three and a half years, and I feel like that was a blessing for me. Especially this is my second time going away for money laundering, so I think that I'm very fortunate because it could have went a lot different, that's for sure.
You might remember back in season one that val has been to prison before. As a teenager, she fell in with the wrong crowd and was used as a drug mule. Before Jay, she was married to notorious Latin King's boss Rudy Cato Rankel, also known as King Kato. Before Cato, she was married at twenty one for a short time to Valentine Rivella's, who was working for the Juarez cartel. While she was married to Rivella's, she became caught up in his business dealings.
Back in two thousand, in my prior marriage, I was married to a drug dealer and he got indicted for a drug conspiracy. I deposited money in the bank for him in my accounts and that's what got me into trouble and he ended up cooperating against me and I went to prison for it. I received the ten months but sentence where I was in prison for five months and the other five months I was on house arrest.
There's consequences to everything that we do. And sometimes when you're in love with someone, or sometimes when you're in a relationship, you don't think about certain things. You put yourself second and you don't realize how this can affect you.
And I just hope that, like, by.
Sharing my story, you know, I just want to bring awareness to like other women that have like walked in my shoes and that have that are going through this and sometimes you're living that life and it's like a really fast lifestyle, right and you don't realize the consequences that comes with this life. I'm hoping that other women
can make better choices than I did. I mean, it could be anything taken a small gift from someone, or just trying to be loyal to the person that you're with, whether it's your husband or your boyfriend, and just trying to, you know, get through life. It's like you don't realize that these choices that you make it can affect you and they can definitely change your life. And I'm hoping that other women can see my story and they can maybe think twice about it and not put themselves in
that position. Every choice you make, it has a consequence.
For sure.
I went through a lot of trauma, and you know, I talk about abusive relationships all the time, and I think that it definitely affected my thought process and the things that I've done. But I honestly thought that it'd be different when I met Day. I felt like, you know, Jay was totally different from any person I have ever been with, and so I saw the good in him
and I really thought that I could change him. And I was happy that the judge acknowledged that in court, and he did say that I know that it was because if you convinced your husband to change his life, and I think with that type of validation, I felt like, you know what this is for something, And I feel like our lives could have turned out a lot different.
Than what it is today.
And I feel like if Jay didn't make the choice that he made to change his life, he probably wouldn't be here today, and for me and my children, they probably would have wiped out our whole family.
How do you feel about and how you're going to cope with prison? Is there anything you've thought about and has it come up in your head about your own safety.
In court, you know, there's a Mexican lady in there. She was sitting in the back row and I could just feel her eyes burning through me. And when I was walking out, she just looked at me and smartd and I was walking out of the building, out of the courthouse. She was recording me and taking pictures of me. And it's scary because at the end of the day, there are people looking for us, and these are things that we have to continue to live with.
I don't know, it just doesn't feel good at all.
It is scary. You know, I've been to prison before, so I know what it feels like. More so of just the fact of being alone. And I think that's what scares me, you know, just you know, it's it's really hard to just you know, to your time alone. And I think that's the hart that scares me the most.
Vows with Jay as I was speaking to her after a sentencing and I asked Jay, well, seeing his wife go through something that was ultimately caused by him, felt like.
You can't even put what we're feeling against into words. And to see her struggle like like she don't have to say it to me because I am I.
Understand my kids would have to lose their mom for a little bit.
And that's hard, you know, like being the person that I am, no matter what, I'm always gonna call myself responsible because I, you know, made a vow to protect her and keep her my children safe, and I fail. And this is all consequences of.
Me not being there for her or not being there for my children.
It's gonna be hard to come, you know, to day she has to turn herself in and she would never be alone. I could promise her that she was always there for me, and I even felt, you know, I felt bad that couldn't be with her her sentencing, that couldn't hold her hand and just And it's gonna be like that as well.
Because of her being in prison.
I am one hundred percent sure that they're not gonna allow me to visit her for safety reasons. The BP would never allow me to step foot in their facility. So you know, that's another hard trip that we're gonna have to face. The punishment and its own, it's one thing, but the pain that we're actually gonna feel from that punishment, it's totally on a different level.
It's hard to cope with right. But moving forward, I have faith in my wife and us and our family that we're going to get through this and we're going to be together again and continue on what we just started to do was to try to live, you know, a normal life as a family again. It's going to be put on pause for a little bit, and I just have I'm going to have a lot of work to do. I have to measure up to all of who val is, and that's the scary part to me.
For sure, that could be a lot of things, but I could never fill her shoes.
If I wasn't with Ja, I probably wouldn't be going through this today. For sure, my life would be a lot different. But at the end of the day, I don't regret it. I love my husband, I love my children, I love my family, and I feel like I'll be okay. There's a light at the end of the tunnel. I truly believe that this is the last obstacle, and I really know that once this is over, we can finally have a fresh start at life.
Valenviev will be released from prison in early twenty twenty seven. At the same time that Valenviev were being sentenced for charges related to the spending of drug proceeds. El Chapo's wife, Emma Coronel Aspuro, was released from prison. She pled guilty to the distribution of cocaine, heroine, and over a thousand kilograms of marijuana, as well as laundering narcotics proceeds and
assisting her husband El Chapo in his drug business. At her sentencing, the fact that she facilitated El Chapo's escape from prison in Mexico was also brought up. She was sentenced to just three years in prison and was released after twenty one months and two weeks, a little under two years. As Valenviev were getting ready to go to prison,
Emma was parting it up in Los Angeles. Valenviev's case brought up questions about what this means for future cooperators and the message it sends when cooperation is often based on trust between the cooperator and the government. I asked Michael Ferrara how important cooperators are when it comes to prosecuting a case.
It is the single most important thing it is to be able to develop cooperators once a case reaches a certain level of complexity, and certainly when you're talking about like an international criminal organization as large as the sin of Little Cortel and all of the various things that feed the Cortel and help it to exist, the corruption, all of that. You can put a case together without sort of like an insider point of view.
I mean, you need a tour.
Guide to say, like, this is how this worked, and this is who this guy was, and this is how we did this thing. So without that, those kind of massive cases just realistically don't come together. When the Twins surrendered, I mean, they were certainly the largest drug traffickers in Chicago history, which is saying something, and at the time they surrendered, they were probably the largest in the United States.
They were at the tippy top of the drug world, but they were largely insulated from like the violence and a lot of the things that come along with that. And I think at that time, like around two thousand and eight, Mexico was just exploding with narco violence. They were smart enough to realize that they were at the level where they either needed to become Chopo and everything that comes along with that, or turn against Chopo and try to basically.
Hit to reset.
And what they did was extraordinarily uncommon. They were at the top of the drug world. It is ultra rare where somebody in that position decides to hang.
It up before they're caught.
That facilitated their cooperation in a way that was really unique.
The twins were winning.
They were under no suspicion from the cartel, or their customers or any of these other components of the drug trafficking and money laundering conspiracies in which they operated that they were cooperating, So that enabled them to do all kinds of things that the otherwise would not have been able to do, or resulted in a lot more people being prosecuted and much more robust prosecutions that were it's always trial proof because you had those recordings, you had
the life seizures, you had undercover officers being inserted to a mix, all those kinds of things. The flip side to that is because their cooperation was so long and ongoing, they were put under a microscope like few cooperators are, and so the US government certainly knew more about them
than your average cooperator. I mean, in some ways you could say that they're penalized for their truthfulness, but I don't know that that's fair because again, you sort of have to go back to that all or nothing proposition, and so even if you look at it as what it was, a fourteen year sentence, had they not cooperated and had they been arrested, they absolutely would have died in prison.
J and P cooperated to give their family a chance at a better life, but taken down the world's most neworious drug Blood was bigger than just the Flores family. I wondered what impact the twins' decision had on the drug epidemic, and with actually catching El Chapo made a difference.
The macro level effect on drug trafficking, it's hard to claim it was positive at all. A drug trafficking still exists the United States.
Problems are just as bad, if not worse, today than they were at any.
Of the times when when Choppo was caught or convicted, or any of those those road markers. The cartel is cartel's plural. It's kingpins like Chopo are taken taken out, like the cartels, tend to fracture and splinter, and the unfortunate trend has been like the most violent people, the people who are the most ruthless, the most willing to use violence to sort of enforce their business ways, risen to the top of these now splintered organizations.
They don't get.
Along, they fight each other, and so that is ramping up the bolent side in Mexico. And then on the supply side, I mean, again, things are as bad as they they've ever been, with much more potent, much more dangerous drugs. On your question, like, what did removing Choppo do If you look at it through that lens, like, there's no positive, but I don't think that's a fair way to look at it at all.
You also just have to.
Look at who Chopel was as a person, and he is one of the most prolific criminals in history. I mean, he is singularly responsible for thousands and thousands of deaths, whether they be drug related deaths, whether they be deaths by violence, all political corruption where the tentacles extend.
All over the world.
He was just a completely terrible person to leave out there in the world, and so removing him and the leadership structure that was around him that the twins were central to all of that, Like, if you look at it through that lens, it was historic, an immensely beneficial good thing that happened.
But again it's just a balance. Did chopel and drugs. No, of course not.
But to taking him out did that remove a great threat to everything from Mexican security to U S security, to just having an infrastructure in place that was exceptionally good at moving drugs, nor of pulling money and guns south with all of those things. That, yes, it was
a positive to take him out of commission. The Twins, they were supplying so much of the drug market, and in particular the cocaine market in Chicago in the country that when they left, I mean, there was certainly a temporary drop in drug levels.
So I mean, at their peak they were importing.
About two tons a month of cocaine into the United States, about a full ton of that state in Chicago and was distributed in the Chicago area, which is just a staggering amount. And then the other time went all over the place. It fed New York, DC, places on the East coast. And so when that switch went from on off suddenly and the Twins weren't pushing that product into the United States, that only made levels drop and made
things more expensive. All of that, and in the process of their cooperation, they took out people who were massive drug traffickers in their own right, so all of them left in a comparatively short period of time. It's getting people who were very bad for society out of the mix. And for a short period of time, it did make cocaine in particular.
Harder to get.
But wherever there's that void, it's going to get very very quickly filled, and it did.
Cocaine levels rebounded, And right around.
That time is when the cartel started moving into the opioid markets, and Chopo and people like Chopo recognized that their profit margins were dramatically, dramatically higher with opioids period because they could grow poppies in Mexico, and then with synthetic opiods in particular, once they started to fully understand the benefits of fentanyl, how cheaply it can be manufactured, pope and it is where if you get one kilo of fentol to the United States, it's the same as
getting fifty kilo as a heroine.
And so I mean that that's just a horrific.
Formula for more drugs and more dangerous drugs getting pushed out on the street if you look at it holistically, like problems are worse after the Twins cooperation than they were before the Twins cooperation, which is a depressing thing to say about, but.
I think it's it's a very true thing to say.
Despite the work to stop it, the drug tray continues to grow. The removal of Al Chapo didn't end the Sinila cartel. His four sons, together known as Lost Japzzas, took over the cartel in his place. They are known as being richer, more powerful, and more violent than Al Chapo ever was Lost Japzos used corkscrews, electrocution, and hot chilis to torture their rivals and feed people to tiger.
In January of this year, twenty twenty three, one of El Chapo's sons, Olivido Guzman Lopez, the logistics manager for the cartel, was arrested in a bloody operation resulting in twenty nine deaths. In September, Olivido was extradited to the US. The other three sons continue to run the cartel. One of them, Ivan Arcovaldo, is now on the DEA's most wanted list with a ten million dollar bounty on his head, a higher bounty than his father, El Chapo ever had.
As for El Chapo, he's still trying to appeal his sentence. Over the past three years, I've gotten to know the Flores family really well. In sharing their story, they opened up about things they've never spoken about before. Fifteen years ago, that one decision to turn themselves in sets off a domino effect that led to where they are today. I couldn't help but wonder if Jay still felt it was all worth it. How do you feel about that decision you made all those years ago now to turn yourself in.
I don't live with regrets tortally. I trust in God that he had led us to this point. I believe that everything that's good that came out of my decision was from Him. And I feel like everything that hasn't been good has been because of our personal mistakes. And I would never want to change work. You know, the positive outcome that that He has blessed us with. We're far removed from that life except for our legal issues.
You know, I've been home almost three years. It's been fifteen years since we made that decision and we decided to turn our life around, and fifteen years that I got to be a husband and father, even though I was away from my wife and children for twelve years. I still got to see my children grow and become these amazing young men and young women, and I get
to still be a father to my children. I feel like even though it was from Afar, I still was able to feel that, And there's nothing more important to me than that.
I feel like that it's a blessing in itself.
That would never second guess or never want to change. I still have my wife life, I still have my family, and it was what I did it for the first place. I'm looking forward to, you know, all the amazing opportunities that are away for us in the future, and I know we're going to get through this. I feel like we have to take the good with the bad and the bad with the good, and I honestly feel there's a lot more good us sharing our personal lives review
with the world. It's about our suffering. It's about all these small decisions just snowball.
Into a whole lot of suffering.
For so many lives, for so many of our family members, for our children, for us, And it continues, and it's a fight to just want to make things right. And I know that there's not many people who have walked in those shoes as me and my brother who has made it that far up into the you know, cartel life or drug trafficking life. And there's a reason why my brother and I decided to change our lives along.
With our family, with our wives.
You know, we want to change our lives because it's we would never choose anything else but our family. And I just have this burning desire to not let this go, not let you know, all my children suffering, my wife's suffering,
for it to be for nothing. I feel like we were meant to be here, We were meant to come this far, and I feel like it was to share into our testimony to our past life and hopefully inspire someone not just in drug trafficking, to say, hey, you know what, I was on the opposite end of something really bad, and through support through my family, I had
to endure some sacrifice. It was suffering, but after that suffering because of choices I made, that was able to turn that into something positive, something that could bring hope to other people, right, something that could make my first so that my children could go back and say, hey, you know what, I spent all these years without my father, without my mom, but you know what, it came for a good cause because my dad was able to change his life for wrong and he had an impact on
his war on drugs. He had an impact on something that he helped create, and that's important to me. I have the potential that potentially right changed the way the war on drugs has been attacked or dealt with for the last fifty years.
Jay is now working with Dynamic Police Training to educate law enforcements on the intricacies of the drug world. He runs a course called From Kingpin to Educator.
I did my first conference, my first law enforcement conference. I was a guest speaker for four hundred and fifty officers in August and the state, federal law enforcement, and some local law enforcement. And by chance, I was speaking to these law enforcement officers and I got pulled to the site by for d EA officers that were part of the swat team that rated my home when they came to arrest Vow. And that is a moment where it's like wow, Like they were in my house not
so long ago and they came arrested my wife. But yeah, here I am working with them, right, And I guess it's just another.
Just unbelievable marketing our.
Story that it's hard to you know, it's probably hard for people to believe or hard for.
People to understand. And it's been like that for a lot of my life.
And I'm just thankful and grateful for the opportunity that I will be able to do that moving forward.
And it does make me. It makes me feel good.
I feel like I'm finally doing something positive, especially with something that filled me and has brought so much hardship and heartache. And now here I am, you know, in a room for the law enforcement who are eager to
listen to me, eager to learn. And it's talk about coming full circle, right, like, you know, I started on one end, and now here I am, you know, working with law enforcement you know, across the country, around the world, sharing I guess all my suffering, right, you know, and everything I've learned since I was seven years old in
joy trafficking. It's kind of weird because people are like, wow, yes, you're helping the same people that are imprisoning in your family, right, But no, I don't look at it that way, not at all. I understand the system more than anyone in.
I don't have carrying out alice.
All the classes and conferences something that you're going to do moving forward.
Now, yes, it's my plan. I'm moving forward. I'm doing conferences and classes.
I have sixteen set dates already and I will continue working on those classes as much as I'm able to get booked right and as longest law enforcement officers you know here around the country, around the world are open to hear me that I'm.
Going to be there.
I always say that, well for my brother, and there's not anyone out there that could that has the knowledge and expertise that we have. And I said this, you know, to law enforcement, like I was not made in Mexico.
I was born in Chicago, made in America.
And if I could share this with law enforcement, share all the knowledge and the expertise that I think I have, and hopefully they could take that and use it a positive way, I think to me, that's like, that's the biggest reward.
I'm one of those persons I believe that anything's possible, especially you look.
At my life and where I came from and where I ended up at and you know our family struggles and to have the opportunity that I that I have it it wasn't given to me. Charlie.
I had to create it. I had to push for it.
I had to fight for it, and I'll continue to fight for what I believe in. And I think that we all have it in us, and we just got to look for their strength and courage to go through with it.
Alongside the classes, Jay is looking for more steady work. He's been working on a resume that he showed me, and it's hopeful that someone will take a chance on him. Jay's dedicated to turning his life around and writing a new legacy for the Flora's name. But it's not always that easy when you have a criminal record like Jade's that follows you through life. Half of the seventy eight million Americans with the criminal record have difficulty finding a
job and making a living. Nearly a third of federal inmates don't find work at all after they're released. Will someone like Jay or anyone with a criminal record get a second chance?
Can you read this?
Can I read it?
Ye're sure you read it?
It's an email there, Okay.
I recently came across something unusual, a tweet from Elon Musk that spoke to me drug dealers know more about running a business than ninety five percent of college professors. So here I am today taking a leap of faith and sending you my resume. I worked on it with intentions of sending it to a like minded business person like yourself. My goal is to utilize the business skills I've acquired in the drug trade and apply these street
smarts toward doing something positive in the corporate world. Although I chose the wrong path in life, it's helped me shape me into the businessman I am today. I am a senior operations executive and internationologistic specialist. My twin brother and I built a two billion dollar drug trafficking enterprise nothing We encountered far more obstacles than our average corporation, but with determination and strong will, I pushed through day
to day challenges. By focusing on innovative solutions, I acquired the skills needed to do a thorough risk assessment and quickly mitigate any potential losses. Because in our business there was less.
Room for error. Can I carry on?
With twenty plus years of extensive experience, I gained the entrepreneurial skills necessary to successfully develop, structure, managed, nurture, innovate, and grow any business. Despite being driven and having a fierce hunger for success. I am relatable, willing to learn, adapt easily, and have the interpersonal skills needed for team building and customer relations.
In any industry.
Although I was born into the world of drug trafficking, at the height of my career, I decided to denounce that life and take a road less traveled. At the young age of twenty.
Six, my brother and I gave it all up, voluntarily turned ourselves into the authorities, dismantled our organization, and soved a fourteen year prison sent since I had a federal correctional institution in a special WITSEC unit.
Today, I live under a new identity and I'm a firm believer in redemption and second chances. I know I'm here for a reason and have a bigger purpose in life to fulfilm.
I'm in the.
Process of rewriting my story and with your help, I hope to remove stigmas and leave a positive imprint in this world. That's the end of our time with the Flores family. Thank you for coming on this journey with us, and a big thank you to the Flores's family for sharing their story.
Stay tuned for the Flores Twins doctor series and scripture series.
Commons Surviving l Chapo, The Twins Who Brought Down a Drug Lord. Season two is hosted by Curtis fifty Cent Jackson and me Charlie Webster, produced by myself and Jackson McLennan, Assistant producer and research support by Katy Hurtz, Edit and sound design by Nico Polella, Theme music and original score by Ryan Sorenson. It's executive produced by Curtis fifty cent
Jackson and Me Charlie Webster. Curtis fifty cent Jackson presents a Lionsgate Sound and G Unit audio production exclusively for iHeart Podcasts