Neuro Self-Care & Havening: A New Way to Heal with Elle McBride

Dave Quak 
Welcome to sunburned Souls. I'm Dave Kwak, and on this show we explore life and faith and our mental well-being. As a pastor that struggles with mental illness, I get to chat to people like me, people that love Jesus and follow the way of Christ while dealing with the messiness and brokenness of lives. This week, I was so excited to chat with Elle McBride.

Elle is trained in the practice of neuro self-care, which then adopts the whole evening techniques to help bring healing and restoration and growth through trauma and all other things that we need to grow through. How evening techniques are pretty new. Since about 2021, and if you want to find out more, go to her Instagram page or her website.

Ellelouisemcbride.com.

00:00:53:12 - 00:01:02:18
Dave Quak
Well, something souls. I've been looking forward to this chat at least for six months, maybe even longer. Elle Helms have been since we've known each other. You reckon?

00:01:02:20 - 00:01:16:12
Elle McBride
I would say maybe even nine months. Yeah. Yeah. You came and spoke at Fire Church. Yeah. And that's when I think we first met. But I think we'd been in each other's, like, you know, the social media world. Yeah. I'd been following you for a while, so.

00:01:16:15 - 00:01:29:01
Dave Quak
Well, I mean, it might be the other way around, because when it comes to social media people, we both have under 60,000. Yeah. So you got 55,000 and I got 280. So we're basically in the same like, you know, same full.

00:01:29:01 - 00:01:53:22
Elle McBride
Yeah. Same fellowship. Let's say it's and so social media is just such a funny thing. I am a bit of a testimony in social media actually. I used to share I was like one of those people constantly trying to work out the algorithm, trying to to post and make it esthetic and going and doing photoshoots. And I was walking in the world, so there was such a big focus.

00:01:53:22 - 00:02:14:06
Elle McBride
My ego was so involved in it and all I wanted was like the 10,000 followers. So it's like the big goal and I got to tell you, I pushed and pushed and pushed and I got into about 6000. Absolutely incredible. And, you know, I'd worked with some pretty, like, high profile people and like, they'd shared and, and then I just kind of woke up one day and I was done.

00:02:14:08 - 00:02:31:14
Elle McBride
Okay. I was absolutely, on social media. I'd found the Lord and been working with him for a while and was like, I'm done. I don't want to do this anymore. I don't like who it's making me become. I don't like that I'm looking for the likes and the followers and the the that this has anything to do with me.

00:02:31:16 - 00:02:50:01
Elle McBride
And, I had started to give it away. And then the Lord gave me a word and I was like, I have to share this on my social media. But it was so far away from what I'd been posting, and it was kind of like me coming out of the closet publicly. People personally knew me, but but publicly and knowing my my faith.

00:02:50:01 - 00:02:55:07
Elle McBride
And I shared one post and, that one post within two weeks doubled my following.

00:02:55:08 - 00:03:00:05
Dave Quak
No way. Yeah. So your first day declaration. I am a Jesus loving woman.

00:03:00:05 - 00:03:23:06
Elle McBride
Yeah. Hashtag Christian. Hashtag. Jesus. That's easy. Yeah. Doubled my following and then I. Major identity crisis is to. Well, what do I post now? It's like, Lord, give me another word. But yes, I kind of just like felt was in limbo for quite a few months, and then just again was came to that back to this place of like, I don't care, I don't care.

00:03:23:06 - 00:03:46:02
Elle McBride
It almost meant less after that because it was like I'd pushed so hard to create this thing. And then it was like overnight. It just doubled. Yeah. And I didn't know why. Like, you know, in that essence of what was it? And then, yeah, now I'm playing my social media and I love social media. It's such a way of like educating people.

00:03:46:02 - 00:03:58:21
Elle McBride
And, there is a ministry there and yeah. So every day on that, Lord, what would you have me post and I have a bunch of stuff that's already created. And then, yeah, he just tells me what to post and I post it and a bunch of it goes viral.

00:03:59:00 - 00:04:10:12
Dave Quak
It's amazing. Hey, like, it took us very practical. I remember during Cyclone Alfred you said something about how evening and yeah, you know, just practical tips, guys. We're about to get hit by a pretty crazy storm. This is what you can do to get through. Yeah.

00:04:10:14 - 00:04:17:17
Elle McBride
And so many of us already dysregulated anyway. So you throw a cyclone into it. Our stuff's going to come up. Yeah. You know.

00:04:17:19 - 00:04:25:03
Dave Quak
I'd love to get to your therapy soon, but before we get there, in that process of social media, you said you came to the faith. How did that happen?

00:04:25:09 - 00:04:45:23
Elle McBride
Yeah, my walk with the Lord. Yeah, yeah. Okay. So testimony in a nutshell, near-death experience in 2013. And, through that a month later, I had a panic attack and was associated into trauma basically. Now, I could say it is a demonic attack. I've had had met the Lord in my near-death experience. Yes. And, didn't know who it was.

00:04:45:24 - 00:05:07:02
Elle McBride
I was trying to figure that out. I was in America so very far away from home. And essentially it took me another nine years where I. Yeah, was looking for, for safety any way that I could go. And relationships in different religions, basically, if you said I could have skipped on my head and and it would have helped, I would have tried it.

00:05:07:05 - 00:05:27:03
Elle McBride
And so, yeah, then I, I stumbled into a church, my brother had moved to New Zealand and they actually had had come to the Lord. And I remember even prior to that, you know, when, when my brother and his wife started going to church, I remember my family being like, oh, if anyone was going to be religious, it would be you.

00:05:27:05 - 00:05:46:16
Elle McBride
And I'm very atheist family. And yeah. So they were like, we're going to church. I was like, I'll come along and I went to church with them and was like, what is this like? I'd been to church. I had gone to a Catholic high school. That Pentecostal, very different.

00:05:46:18 - 00:06:07:15
Elle McBride
Now, what is this place? And, so yes, I came back to the Gold Coast. This is in 2019. You know, life was getting pretty hot in 2019 with Covid and I was out pouring so much. I'd been, a therapist and running retreats and had, like, a community, like a Facebook community of like, 2500 people. So it was a lot of outpour.

00:06:07:17 - 00:06:26:11
Elle McBride
And so I kind of started going to church as a bit of an pool, you know, it was it was I was, I was at a fantastic church, but it kind of felt a bit like a Ted talk with a sprinkle of Jesus is how I'd kind of, you know, say it to people. When I had my near-death experience and this, this face appeared, I didn't know who the face was at the time.

00:06:26:11 - 00:06:46:08
Elle McBride
And, all I heard was, your life has purpose. Your life has meaning. It's not your time to go. And when I was pulled up out of the water and, there was a day in 2019 I'd been going to church for. Yeah, about six months. And I'm up the front at, altar call and just sobbing, absolutely sobbing.

00:06:46:10 - 00:07:06:10
Elle McBride
And no one at this point had come and prayed on me. No one had laid hands but audibly I heard that voice again. Your life has purpose and meaning in that moment. I just knew it to be Jesus. And I recognize the face, recognize the voice, and that's who saved me in the water in 2013 and was actually I was recording a podcast.

00:07:06:12 - 00:07:23:22
Elle McBride
I think it was like 2013. And, when I had a podcast myself and I had a revelation made podcast, love when you have those. And, I realized that in that moment that nothing mattered. I'd been searching for my purpose and meaning and so many things in social media in.

00:07:23:22 - 00:07:24:11
Dave Quak
Yeah.

00:07:24:13 - 00:07:49:05
Elle McBride
Status in, you know, what I'd studied in, you know, how much money I was making in my friendships and all of these things and yeah, I realized that my my purpose and meaning is in being his daughter and having a relationship with Jesus. And now nothing really nothing really matters as much. It's crazy. Yeah. Just like everything perspective is just shifted.

00:07:49:05 - 00:07:52:04
Elle McBride
So yeah, it's been pretty solid for the.

00:07:52:06 - 00:07:54:09
Dave Quak
Yeah. So you said the water did you nearly drown?

00:07:54:12 - 00:07:56:04
Elle McBride
Yeah. Yeah yeah.

00:07:56:05 - 00:07:57:02
Dave Quak
Yeah. In the sense.

00:07:57:04 - 00:08:02:07
Elle McBride
Right. Yeah. You may have heard of Waimea Bay in Hawaii. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I went for a casual swim.

00:08:02:10 - 00:08:05:11
Dave Quak
At what am I. Just a casual swim at one of the. Yeah. It's quite hot.

00:08:05:13 - 00:08:17:12
Elle McBride
It's a pretty hot day. I had no idea what Waimea Bay meant. So the waves were pretty big. We made my best and I was like, oh, let's just go out the side and we'll sneak in. And at this point, I'm 23.

00:08:17:14 - 00:08:19:20
Dave Quak
And bulletproof really like bulletproof.

00:08:19:20 - 00:08:39:17
Elle McBride
But, you know, I was drinking a lot of alcohol. I was partying every night, is sleeping in hostels, you know, the the landscape in my brain, I would say was very vulnerable. There wasn't a lot of resilience. And, I was running away from life, you know, 23 I was I was out of here. And so, yeah, it was a turning point.

00:08:39:17 - 00:08:51:04
Elle McBride
And I think because I didn't have the foundation of the Lord, I didn't know who it was. That. Yeah. A month later, when I was in a bubble bath, in Las Vegas, of all places, I had a panic attack.

00:08:51:07 - 00:08:53:18
Dave Quak
Was that were you, like, triggered back to the drowning itself?

00:08:53:19 - 00:09:19:14
Elle McBride
Yeah. Yeah. Well, if you think about trauma, when we are in same or similar experiences, our amygdala doesn't know the difference. Yeah. So, obviously, after the the near-death experience, I was then traveling throughout the U.S and the US doesn't really have like, the nicest beaches. So it's not, you know, taken Aussie beach over America. Great day. And so I think I'd been for like one maybe swim but that was it.

00:09:19:16 - 00:09:37:17
Elle McBride
And yeah. So really the next body of water that I was in and, you know, a bath is quite enclosed and so, yeah, had a had a panic attack and was really associated into trauma that I couldn't figure out. Is this mine? Not mine. Is it real? Is it not real? Was it true. Was it this? Was it that.

00:09:37:19 - 00:09:45:08
Elle McBride
And for about six years it went on to, sorry, three years. It went on to just consume me every day. Yeah.

00:09:45:10 - 00:09:52:01
Dave Quak
So did you know anything about the, therapeutic side of things at that time? No. You hadn't been trained yet or anything?

00:09:52:02 - 00:10:22:09
Elle McBride
No, I hadn't been trained. Knew nothing happening itself. Started in 20, 2001. This study started, but it didn't actually become a therapy until that year. It took me three and a half years to find Haven, but I'd had I'd been predisposed to to mental health. I was diagnosed with depression at 15. Yeah. And, even I remember going to the doctors and, you know, being diagnosed and being told, you know, you can take these tablets and these tablets are going to communicate with your brain.

00:10:22:09 - 00:10:42:03
Elle McBride
And basically, here's an I remember the picture. I'll never forget it, even though I have I evened it. But you said now I just laugh at it. Where before I used to cry. But he he drew down on a piece of paper. He drew a brain and he said, a normal brain. When a thought comes through, the message just gets sent straight through.

00:10:42:08 - 00:11:04:02
Elle McBride
And. But with your brain, the message is being sent, but it's it's distorted. And so we need to think. We need to fix the way that your thoughts are happening. So this chemical is going to help those thoughts just go straight through. And again at 15, already thinking that you're a problem and that you're different and that you're broken.

00:11:04:02 - 00:11:25:00
Elle McBride
And, here is a doctor with a white in a white cloak confirming that my brain is different. Yeah, yeah. And I think at that moment I did antidepressants for a few rounds. This is where I kind of say that my parents divorce was, was a bit of a blessing because I could get away with with things, and I just stopped taking them.

00:11:25:05 - 00:11:26:00
Elle McBride
I didn't like the way because.

00:11:26:00 - 00:11:27:00
Dave Quak
No one thought I was keeping.

00:11:27:04 - 00:11:31:11
Elle McBride
Yeah, right. Yeah. No one was keeping. Yeah, I'm taking them I wouldn't.

00:11:31:13 - 00:11:33:16
Dave Quak
Yeah. So you didn't like the feel?

00:11:33:18 - 00:11:53:24
Elle McBride
I didn't like the feel. And I think that that kind of sent me into a belief of, like, I need to find a way to fix this. Yeah, I know that this isn't normal, but if a tablet can do it, why can't other things? So, yeah, I tried everything. Alcohol unfortunately, became the the thing that helped the most.

00:11:54:03 - 00:11:59:13
Dave Quak
Yeah, yeah. I mean, it is a great numbing agent. Like, it's it's terrible. It works in the moment. Yeah. You know.

00:11:59:18 - 00:12:05:11
Elle McBride
And through my 20s, through my, like, late teens and 20s and it most certainly did. Yeah.

00:12:05:13 - 00:12:11:18
Dave Quak
So tell us your therapeutic name. So psycho phase.

00:12:11:20 - 00:12:13:01
Elle McBride
Psycho sensory. Yeah.

00:12:13:01 - 00:12:13:23
Dave Quak
Psycho sensory.

00:12:13:23 - 00:12:14:16
Elle McBride
Yeah. Yeah.

00:12:14:18 - 00:12:35:01
Dave Quak
Okay. That's what when I initially found your install firstly I was like whoa. At that point you had 45 fails and just you know we're both under 60,000 at that point you were based basically at the same now and then psycho sensory caught my. So imagine there's some sort of tactile. Yeah. Part of your therapeutic process.

00:12:35:06 - 00:12:35:18
Elle McBride
Yeah.

00:12:35:19 - 00:12:41:24
Dave Quak
Tell us about it. I've never had a psycho sensory person on the show. Yeah. Or have I met one tell you?

00:12:42:00 - 00:12:51:20
Elle McBride
Yeah. Look, still, to this day. Well, you have you you have. I probably have had them on the show. I don't know, but if you heard of EFT tapping.

00:12:51:22 - 00:12:54:01
Dave Quak
All, is it like eMDR, adult.

00:12:54:03 - 00:12:54:18
Elle McBride
MDMA?

00:12:54:21 - 00:12:58:13
Dave Quak
Okay, I have heard of MDL, but not if t.

00:12:58:14 - 00:13:16:04
Elle McBride
Yep. So AFTRA is, an emotional freedom technique, and it uses tapping on different parts of the body. AMD is, where we're using eye movement to change the, the cognitive function. So anything that uses the body is a form of psycho sensory therapy.

00:13:16:04 - 00:13:16:20
Dave Quak
Oh, okay.

00:13:16:23 - 00:13:39:14
Elle McBride
So some people would even go as far as saying that aromatherapy or even, you know, but yeah, you can use your own discernment. But acupuncture, yeah, even exercise is a form of psycho sensory therapy because we're using the body, but we're also then using the main senses. We've got the, the, the sense of smell, touch, taste, sound.

00:13:39:20 - 00:14:06:17
Elle McBride
And so for us where we then haven psycho sensory really becomes a third pillar of how we can change our reflection of wellness. Okay. We've then got psychopharmacology using medication to change the way that we feel. And, psychotherapy, we're using talk. Okay. We're talking about how we're feeling. So it's really becomes a third pillar of how we can change our wellness right now.

00:14:06:17 - 00:14:13:16
Dave Quak
Do you only practice psycho sensory? Yeah. And did most people just have one of those three disciplines?

00:14:13:18 - 00:14:30:16
Elle McBride
No way. You can use a combination of both. Like for for a lot of my clients, you can work content free, so we don't have to talk about the things that have happened. I'm predominantly working with trauma. So for me, it's not just the big stuff trauma that I say. There's big ten, little T, there's the big things that happen in life.

00:14:30:18 - 00:15:01:18
Elle McBride
And for us, we often just think that trauma is left for the first responders. It's there. It's the police. It's the war veterans that have gone through trauma. But if we think about little things that have happened in our life that we're still thinking about, you know, whether or not it's that hurtful comment that was said in primary school or that time that, you know, your hat got stolen or you know, that that one time that, you know, you almost were in a car accident, the brain will hold on to that to therefore prevent it from happening again.

00:15:01:18 - 00:15:28:06
Elle McBride
And so within the technique of how evening, we're really revisiting that. And when we revisit something so we can look at the form of like when we get triggered, such a common kind of thing. Society now talks about that triggered me, I got triggered sometimes we don't know why we're triggered. Sometimes we do know why we're triggered. And so when we get triggered, what's actually happening?

00:15:28:08 - 00:16:02:21
Elle McBride
You know, biologies that our amygdala has these very small, chemical channels called AMP receptors, and these receptors stand up and basically they get really excited because they're in a sense of threat and they're trying to decide, what do I do here? So a new information comes in, our brain will process it. And kind of the pathway is our thalamus is kind of like the switchboard and it decides is there any anything here I should worry about now if it's very new information, you've never been here before.

00:16:02:21 - 00:16:30:18
Elle McBride
The cortex gets involved and then it kind of gets sense to the hippocampus. If there's nothing that the hippocampus then becomes like our brains library, and then we have our amygdala. And our amygdala really is known most for being like an alarm system in our brain. And it sends off the fight or flight freeze for defensive rage. So when we're activated, when we're triggered, these receptors stand up.

00:16:30:24 - 00:16:58:13
Elle McBride
So in a session with my clients, when they're talking about things that have happened, whether it's recent or 30, 40, 50 years ago, those AMP receptors is still active. Okay. That's why that we get triggered. Because that that the either the emotion attached to it, the, the physical sensations of the body remembering or we've got even the, the, the full mind, we can close our eyes and we can think about that memory.

00:16:58:15 - 00:17:11:00
Elle McBride
We're getting activated. And when we get activated, that's where high evening comes in. Very gentle, repetitive form of touch, which will change the the way that we perceive that memory to be.

00:17:11:02 - 00:17:17:13
Dave Quak
So you physically touch your clients or do they physically rub their own hands or how does that look?

00:17:17:13 - 00:17:29:23
Elle McBride
Yeah, it can work as both. Yeah. Right. Yeah. If I was if I was with a client, I'd give them the option if they'd prefer me to facilitate the touch. Yeah. But I work with people all over the world so they can advise self.

00:17:30:04 - 00:17:31:14
Dave Quak
And also they stuff themselves.

00:17:31:14 - 00:17:31:21
Elle McBride
Yeah.

00:17:32:01 - 00:17:43:09
Dave Quak
Yeah, it's it's an amazing thing that. Oh, I forget the exact, chemical that gets activated can bring us back to 40 years ago and still be just as kind of potent. Yeah. As now.

00:17:43:09 - 00:18:12:18
Elle McBride
Yeah. Well, we when, when we get triggered. Right. There's that rush of adrenaline. Cortisol goes up, a heart rate goes up. Even sometimes the body has a sensation. The hairs on the back of their neck stand up. Right. So and it was really funny I think it's John 1818. Don't quote me on this one. But, I was only, only learned this very recently, but Peta was standing, by the fire, and it says that he he's reflecting is it?

00:18:12:18 - 00:18:38:10
Elle McBride
And he's standing by the, the charcoal fire and it was really highlighted. Well, why why is it mentioned that he's standing he's he's denied Jesus three times by this point. And they're saying he's standing at the charcoal fire. And then when we look back on where else the charcoal fire is represented, the first time he denies Jesus, he's standing by a charcoal fire.

00:18:38:11 - 00:18:59:01
Elle McBride
Yeah. So for us, we we don't just remember, we remember the details of what was what was surrounding us. And so for us, trauma doesn't isn't just what what happened, it's that the circumstances that surrounded us and it's also the way that we respond to it as well. So yeah.

00:18:59:03 - 00:19:17:10
Dave Quak
That's awesome. You mentioned before, it's quite a popular word being used in today's context. And I think sometimes obviously it's correct. And then other times it may be not the right use of the term. Can you speak to that for a bit. Like how do we know if it's trauma or not.

00:19:17:11 - 00:19:41:13
Elle McBride
Yeah. Well there's only a couple of requirements for trauma. So but but when we're really looking at, you know, us getting triggered and using I don't really love the word triggered because when I think of trigger, I think of a gun being triggered. And I'm like, well, I'm not a gun. Yeah, but it's our brain being back in a state of survival because there's a threat there.

00:19:41:15 - 00:20:03:24
Elle McBride
So when do you say, you know, I was recently speaking to somebody who was, you know, dating a new person, and this new person was like, hey, you know, you've you've done this thing and I don't really know how I agree with that. And, you know, different perspectives. We've all got these different perspectives. And so for this person they're not responding to this new partner.

00:20:04:03 - 00:20:37:20
Elle McBride
They're reacting out of past relationships. Yeah. Yeah. So when we react what we often do is we're not seeing things clearly. We're not seeing them for what they are. We're seeing them through the lens of the past. Yeah. So what I love about happening techniques in particular is that it's so heavily based on science. And when we take what science tells us and what God tells us and we combine the two, we've got a very practical tool to use to overcome and to to stop reflecting on things of the past.

00:20:37:22 - 00:20:58:07
Elle McBride
And it can be in as quick as five minutes. It's not this long, drawn out out process for me. My my panic attack that I had in the bath where I was associated in trauma. I continue to be traumatized daily, sometimes on an hourly basis for three years. Yeah. And the toll that that took on me.

00:20:58:07 - 00:20:59:23
Dave Quak
Oh man. That's horrible. Yeah.

00:21:00:00 - 00:21:17:17
Elle McBride
It was. I didn't want to be here anymore. Oh, you know, my my testimony is huge. Honestly, we could have recorded it for an hour. It takes a very long time. When I first discovered how evening I met a random woman in a coffee shop. She introduced me to it and sent me some videos. And I remember just being like, oh, yeah, that's good for them.

00:21:17:17 - 00:21:27:06
Elle McBride
But I'm really messed up. And this isn't this is placebo. It's not going to work for me. 15 minutes in the chair. I felt a sense of freedom.

00:21:27:10 - 00:21:27:24
Dave Quak
Really?

00:21:27:24 - 00:21:52:22
Elle McBride
Yeah. And I struggled with it. I struggled with it. So for quite a while, I. I had the session. I was living in Batemans Bay, my home town, at the time, and then I, decided I left the relationship I was in. I packed up my life. I moved to the Gold Coast. I had a blowout mattress and a minibar fridge and a kettle and a toaster for basically four months.

00:21:52:24 - 00:22:34:24
Elle McBride
And, I had the opportunity to train in this whole evening thing. The trainers were coming from the UK, and I was like, I need the therapist. I can't become the therapist. Fast forward eight years. I'm a trainer of this modality. It's just full circle. But I remember there was a a short season where I was, you know, kind of coming to face, but very early stages, just trying to unpack it and even in, in primary school, I'd go and description I'd always struggled with the verse that Jesus laid his hands on the ill and made them, well, okay, because I'd had a brother who had passed away as a newborn baby.

00:22:35:01 - 00:22:59:13
Elle McBride
And then. So a bit of context, my, parents had had a child, he passed away and then a later I arrive. So I was in the womb of a grieving mother, a grieving family. And so I'd put, like a lot of my mental health down to that as well. And so that was like the one, the one thing that stopped me from believing really in in Jesus.

00:22:59:13 - 00:23:23:19
Elle McBride
Yeah, is why didn't you lay hands on my brother? And why why would a a newborn baby die? I just, you know, I think we can still wrestle with those questions. And so I, was working with a young girl who had had ovarian, CSM was going in to have a surgery, and she was really nervous about having the, the surgery, as you would be.

00:23:23:21 - 00:23:50:04
Elle McBride
And, so she came to work on the nerves for that. And anyway, while she was there, I asked her if there had been, you know, any experiences, any trauma or any, unwanted sexual experiences. And and she said, yeah, that had been an experience when she was 17 and we, I said, would do you feel open to having that experience and working through that trauma?

00:23:50:04 - 00:24:16:08
Elle McBride
And she was like, that's not what I'm here for. But sure. And so we ended up working through that trauma. And, about a week goes by and I have this, this call show up on my phone and I'm thinking, I know, why is this girl calling me? And I answer the phone, hello? And she says, I'm just, I've just left the hospital and I'm like, okay.

00:24:16:10 - 00:24:17:11
Elle McBride
You know, like.

00:24:17:13 - 00:24:17:20
Dave Quak
Yeah, I.

00:24:17:20 - 00:24:26:09
Elle McBride
Think, are you not okay? Like, are you what's happened? And she said, I, I've just left because there's and I've no, no cysts on my ovaries.

00:24:26:10 - 00:24:27:02
Dave Quak
Right.

00:24:27:03 - 00:24:54:08
Elle McBride
The scans are completely clear. She had pre-op scans. She was able to show the differences. And, I remember in that moment thinking, if I can lay my hands on somebody in very different contexts, I get this. But this is how the Lord works, right? And this woman be healed. Then of course Jesus could. Yeah. Yeah. And that was, that's what the New Age tells you as well.

00:24:54:08 - 00:25:27:11
Elle McBride
Like you are Jesus. And that, that you can heal and that you've got this authority and this power and that. Yeah. So for me that kind of was like one like I remember just so clearly being like, well, of course, if I can then of course the Son of God can. Yeah. And yeah, it was really pivotal. But I've had to do so much like Unbreaking of, you know, my own beliefs and the world beliefs and yeah, the healing world of personal development.

00:25:27:17 - 00:25:29:13
Elle McBride
And it's been a journey.

00:25:29:13 - 00:25:38:04
Dave Quak
I bet. And technically speaking, you're not like long into the whole process. You said mainly at Covid was when it really all started to drop.

00:25:38:04 - 00:25:54:00
Elle McBride
Yeah, it's not that long ago. It's not that long. Yeah. I'm still a baby. Yeah, I'm still a baby. I am, but I'm. I'm so open and I'm so curious. And I'm always asking questions and I'm like, what does this mean? And, you know, surrounded by just amazing people that I can just access questions.

00:25:54:00 - 00:26:12:10
Dave Quak
I mean, they might be needed. I wouldn't say baby in the sense of like not growing because they're small, because you're so hungry and you're devouring Scripture and practicing this. And you're right, you're mentored by some of the greatest humans on the planet. I think. Like, seriously. But, yeah, always joke that if I ever get fired from my church, I'm coming to your church for sure.

00:26:12:12 - 00:26:13:03
Dave Quak
So I'd love.

00:26:13:03 - 00:26:16:06
Elle McBride
To have you. Yeah.

00:26:16:08 - 00:26:38:05
Dave Quak
With this stuff, like. Okay, so say, all right, I'll put myself in the seat of the client for a moment, so I every now and then get taken back to being a little boy who can't regulate these emotions. So my wife will say something, and she's the gentlest, most lovely soul on the planet. And all of a sudden, I'm checking the toys out of the cot.

00:26:38:07 - 00:26:55:13
Dave Quak
Yeah, you know, how dare you? And then I'll, like, go for a drive and calm down. I'm like, what are you doing, you idiot? Like that? She meant nothing by that. You just read into that whole situation. Yeah, I do it to my kids. I do it to my, like my, you know, people I love, even other people.

00:26:55:13 - 00:27:13:06
Dave Quak
I'll be suspicious that they're, like, plotting against me or something. Yeah. What's going on in an adult who loves Jesus? Has been working with them is a pastor not just me but other people like that who you know, it's not like we're immune to this stuff. Why does it happen even after 20 years of.

00:27:13:08 - 00:27:36:10
Elle McBride
Doing well, reacting instead of responding. Okay. Yeah. And when we react instead of respond, it's coming back to that. Okay. Something's triggered. It's that yes, you are the grown up adult now with children yourself. But the little boy still trapped there. Yeah. Yeah. So when we look back on have you got specific memories that you remember.

00:27:36:15 - 00:28:00:11
Dave Quak
Just different things like just it's often when I feel like I'm either stupid. Yeah. Like I hate that feeling of feeling dumb in public especially. Yeah. Or something more like, just being told off for something that I think I should have the right to make the call on and and told off. Sounds crazy. Besides. Yes. And I differ.

00:28:00:13 - 00:28:21:21
Dave Quak
So we differ on a lot. Yeah. So you would be able to have a lot of sessions with us, but we differ on a lot, but mainly around interpretation of moral issues in the Bible. So all think something's permissible. She won't. Yeah. And will never ever come to a place where we're like no one wants to let the ground go because it's, you know, it's like, no, this is my value system or whatever.

00:28:21:22 - 00:28:32:11
Dave Quak
I'm trying to let some of my things go, but it also comes around, you know, things I want to make call on. And I don't like being told that I can't make that call.

00:28:32:16 - 00:28:33:04
Elle McBride
Yeah.

00:28:33:06 - 00:28:34:13
Dave Quak
And I think a lot of us have that.

00:28:34:13 - 00:29:00:21
Elle McBride
What's that is a lot of this. Again it's coming back to that place of to say if there was an experience where you were in charge of making the decisions, but somebody else came and took that authority away from you. And so therefore we go the amygdala. Remember that fight or flight response. Often will come in and go, I'm going to remember this and I'm going to hold onto this and I'm going to make sure that it never happens again okay.

00:29:00:21 - 00:29:11:01
Dave Quak
So it's like a defense mechanism of course. So why did why in my amygdala brain do I think having a hissy fit is going to help me get my way if it didn't work the first time?

00:29:11:01 - 00:29:14:11
Elle McBride
Yeah. Whereabouts are you graded in your siblings?

00:29:14:13 - 00:29:17:23
Dave Quak
I am second lost of five. Yep.

00:29:18:00 - 00:29:27:01
Elle McBride
Probably because a hissy fit when you were a child either worked for you or it worked for one of your siblings and therefore you saw. That's a way I can get out of this, right? Yep.

00:29:27:03 - 00:29:30:01
Dave Quak
Yeah. Right. So it's like the learned behavior of how, yeah.

00:29:30:03 - 00:29:47:16
Elle McBride
We got to fit in when there's five kids. You know, even when you go out for dinner with a bunch of friends. Right. Everyone's still trying to just fit in. Yeah. So someone will kind of be leading the conversation, somebody and adding a few bits here or there. We're all still just like children, you know? Look at your own children.

00:29:47:18 - 00:30:13:15
Elle McBride
I my I, my brother's got three kids. I'm very involved in their lives. You know, the dynamic could always plays out. If there's three, if there's five, if there's ten at all, then taking on a role, usually they'll be the smart one, the sick one, the soft and gentle one, the erratic one. You know, where we kind of just take on this identity, and then we grow up and we realize, oh, that doesn't work in the world.

00:30:13:17 - 00:30:15:22
Elle McBride
Yeah, but the amygdala doesn't know that.

00:30:16:00 - 00:30:16:08
Dave Quak
Yeah.

00:30:16:08 - 00:30:26:24
Elle McBride
So the amygdala is running the show and a lot of us, we can sit here and be like, oh, the amygdala is that guy, you know, oh, it's the amygdala. So the amygdala is your best friend.

00:30:27:03 - 00:30:27:12
Dave Quak
Yeah.

00:30:27:13 - 00:30:42:23
Elle McBride
It's protecting you. It's not punishing you. It's protecting you. Yeah. It's it's like the wrath of God. Right? It's like it's protecting you. They love you so much. But we'll call you out. Yeah.

00:30:43:00 - 00:31:00:17
Dave Quak
Well, that's the thing. Love doesn't have to be gentle to be like, yeah, you know, it can still be. It can still be false, right? Okay, so say so. Along this vein, if we were going to do a psycho sensory session, would you then do get me to do something physical? Yeah. Thinking about this. Yeah. What would that be.

00:31:00:17 - 00:31:24:00
Elle McBride
So we within the, the the psycho sensory therapy that I use which is haven ING techniques. We've got a bunch of different techniques. So I would firstly firstly be trying to work out is there a specific event an isolated event. Yeah a one time thing that that happened where you either remember the first time you felt like this, the worst time you felt like at all the most recent.

00:31:24:00 - 00:32:00:15
Elle McBride
Yeah, yeah. And so if we are like now, there's just so many little things, then we would take a different approach where we would go down looking at the emotion that you felt and really just say you mentioned feeling stupid. We would work on on feeling feeling that. Yeah. Agitated, annoyed. These are these emotions. And we try and just target those emotions because when we target the emotions, we actually can then target a multiple multiple events across a lifetime of, of an individual instead of one event, because you sit here and you get, oh my goodness, but there's 100 events, I'm going to need 100 sessions.

00:32:00:17 - 00:32:06:10
Elle McBride
No, we can actually target the emotion through a course of one's life.

00:32:06:12 - 00:32:15:04
Dave Quak
Yeah, I actually really appreciate that for the practical side. But also I have heard of some trauma therapists who have people every week for two years.

00:32:15:06 - 00:32:16:10
Elle McBride
I couldn't think of anything worse.

00:32:16:16 - 00:32:24:06
Dave Quak
For them or you. Yeah. You know, and you think even the financial burden on them and everything. Yeah. So yeah. Now this is, this is all good news.

00:32:24:07 - 00:32:53:19
Elle McBride
Yep. It's quick. It's you know, we hope it's light. It's. Yes of course with anything there's there's moments of, you know, you're revisiting for some people they're revisiting a trauma that happened. 1015 years ago or months ago. And we're spending that 20s again in that memory. We're wanting to get activated because when we get activated, that rush of adrenaline, cortisol that that comes.

00:32:53:21 - 00:33:21:15
Elle McBride
But then with the evening techniques, there's this gentle, palm, you've got the shoulders down to the elbows and then across the forehead down the chase. What we're doing is we're creating a large amount of delta waves. Delta waves create serotonin, oxytocin, so that opposite brain wave. So when we're stressed and activated, but where we're pumping ourselves with serotonin and oxytocin, it's the opposite.

00:33:21:17 - 00:33:42:14
Elle McBride
Now love drowns out all fear. Right? When we think of fear, stress and adrenaline, when we think of love, serotonin and oxytocin. So love drowns out all fear. We come back into this place of, It feels different. Yeah. You know, I've had people literally look under the chair. They're like, what did you do with the memory?

00:33:42:14 - 00:34:02:16
Elle McBride
Where's it gone? Yeah, yeah. Other people are like, you know, that had had, you know, unwanted childhood sexual experience happen to them. They go, no, I, I got up and I locked the door. Yeah. Predator couldn't come in. We know within ourselves. No, we know the truth. It will never take it away. It will just change the way that we think about it.

00:34:02:21 - 00:34:31:23
Elle McBride
Yeah, yeah. You've also got this identity that, you know, this, this, that you've, you've placed on yourself. Oh, I, I get activated, I get triggered, I get in my thoughts. You know, that's not always true. Yeah. So sometimes it is those like, self-fulfilling prophecies that we put on ourselves about who we are as well. Yeah. And, yeah, there things that there's evidence to prove that there's evidence to prove not.

00:34:31:23 - 00:34:35:24
Elle McBride
And so you just get to decide what, what evidence you want to keep.

00:34:36:01 - 00:34:52:02
Dave Quak
Yeah I like that. I really appreciate your approach to this because you're on one hand very gentle and kind and on the other hand very authoritative and informative. And I feel like that's just a balance that's hard to get. Do you know what I mean? Yeah.

00:34:52:05 - 00:35:16:20
Elle McBride
What do you say that. Yeah I'll take that I'll take that. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's just because I'm so passionate about it. You know, I, I tried healing in the world. I've done healing with the Lord. And I think that the, the balance of the two has been really beautiful and I've, I've, I've had a real fight and a real battle in, you know, the Christian world with this therapy and.

00:35:16:22 - 00:35:18:10
Dave Quak
Not Christians coming against you.

00:35:18:10 - 00:35:45:07
Elle McBride
Well, not not necessarily really coming against me, but, you know, in the Christian way, we, we go and we give it to the Lord. But, you know, we need therapy. Do. Yeah. And science is only proving what the Lord's done. And so let's incorporate it all. Yeah. You know, we've got in the church there's such him you know, he literally the words lay hands and the, the sick will be healed.

00:35:45:09 - 00:36:08:15
Elle McBride
We give each other side hugs. You know, we we like you know and I get it I get it. Yeah I get it I truly I get it. But you know Covid made us. It's still like it actually gets me emotional in this moment. We stood a meter and a half away from each other. We are connected beings.

00:36:08:15 - 00:36:42:12
Elle McBride
Yeah, we're created for community. We made it. If the baby is crying, out we go. And we naturally want to nurture the child. Yeah. If you know when your children were little and they'd fall over and they'd scratch their knee, they'd run to you and they'd want comfort. But when we think about the things that have happened to us, when we're older, when you're triggered and throwing the toys at with a, you know, an argument with your wife, we do we we act out instead of we actually just need that nurturing.

00:36:42:12 - 00:36:51:23
Elle McBride
Yeah, yeah. But we've learned all of these coping mechanisms being the second youngest of five, you know, there wasn't space for you to have a tantrum.

00:36:52:00 - 00:36:52:17
Dave Quak
No.

00:36:52:19 - 00:37:10:07
Elle McBride
Like it's you know, an especially when we look at like the, the ages of the way that we grow up and you know, what demographic you fit in, you know, now it's quite common to go to the mall and say, a child have a tantrum and you think, oh, then how I feel about that? You know, now it's kind of gone too much.

00:37:10:07 - 00:37:13:10
Elle McBride
Sometimes it's, where's that healthy balance? I don't know.

00:37:13:12 - 00:37:30:05
Dave Quak
We want to unpick this today. But literally in our house we had time for one mum had time. You had one tantrum. And the next time she chucked a bucket of water on you and no one had a tantrum again. Yeah. So you'll you're on it. Yeah. I don't know if it was the same for the first kids, but definitely by the time me and my brother were there.

00:37:30:09 - 00:37:43:10
Dave Quak
Yeah, yeah. So yeah. Now you're right. L for people to get a hold of you. So you do telehealth is I mean online. Yeah. As well as face to face. Yep. All over the world. Yeah. What's the best way for that to happen?

00:37:43:15 - 00:37:46:05
Elle McBride
Yeah. Just search me on. Okay. Follow me on Instagram.

00:37:46:05 - 00:37:55:11
Dave Quak
Yeah, definitely. Elle McBride. Elle Louise McBride. Her name is actually Elle, not Eloise. Yeah. So when you meet her, don't say hi, Louise. It's just Instagram.

00:37:55:11 - 00:37:56:06
Elle McBride
I will correct you.

00:37:56:07 - 00:37:59:00
Dave Quak
Instagram says Elle Louise McBride.

00:37:59:04 - 00:38:06:08
Elle McBride
Yeah, Elle McBride wasn't available when I created Instagram, so that's why it kind of everything's down to all the ways. McBride. It's good.

00:38:06:08 - 00:38:07:24
Dave Quak
Stuff. Any Facebook's big too.

00:38:08:01 - 00:38:15:06
Elle McBride
Yeah, yeah I look I think it's I was around when when Facebook was a was a thing. So I think that that's why.

00:38:15:06 - 00:38:16:12
Dave Quak
I, it's still a thing and.

00:38:16:14 - 00:38:19:05
Elle McBride
It's still a thing.

00:38:19:07 - 00:38:28:20
Dave Quak
Okay. So there's that. And do you have any recommendations for anyone who is like immediately in need, like can they come to you within the next couple of weeks.

00:38:28:20 - 00:38:44:22
Elle McBride
Yeah, absolutely. There's always availability. And then, you know, on my YouTube there's like a ten minute guided session that. Yeah, cool. You know, if you've got something you like I just want to suss out what this whole thing is. I've got free guides that you can. Yeah, work through if you want to come in. If you want to become a practitioner of it.

00:38:44:24 - 00:38:46:10
Elle McBride
I also try and PayPal as well.

00:38:46:10 - 00:38:55:17
Dave Quak
So, yeah, even very generous with the information. Like there's a load on there that's free a real lot, actually. A lot of resources, a lot of teaching and a lot of practices.

00:38:55:17 - 00:39:12:15
Elle McBride
I get called out a little bit that I offer too much, too, too many, too many free resources, but I just can't help it. You know, with the way that the world is now, I'd prefer to be offering information that's true than, yeah, things that aren't factual because there's a lot of non factual things aren't so true.

00:39:12:17 - 00:39:15:18
Dave Quak
Element. Right. We actually sadly have to start winding up.

00:39:15:19 - 00:39:16:05
Elle McBride
Yeah.

00:39:16:07 - 00:39:26:14
Dave Quak
But is there any last pearls that you would like to give us before we go or. I'm going to ask you to pray in a moment, but is there anything you'd like to share before I get you to pray?

00:39:26:16 - 00:39:39:18
Elle McBride
Now, I think it's just like he tells us to. To leave it. Yeah. You know, to to leave it with him, to leave it in his hands. We just we need to do that.

00:39:39:20 - 00:39:48:04
Dave Quak
Yeah. Yeah, I absolutely agree. It's been so nice talking to you. Well, why don't you pray for us? And thank you so much for being honest.

00:39:48:06 - 00:40:08:02
Elle McBride
Thank you Lord. Thank you, Lord, for this time. Thank you for for these listeners that are here or with these acts that you open up their minds, to curiosity that you, the creator of all things and that you have given us science to understand what it is that you're doing, the way that you have created our brilliant brains, Lord.

00:40:08:04 - 00:40:31:03
Elle McBride
And, yeah, just by even hearing this information, Lord, I trust that there will be an impartation, of healing that then will the listeners, wherever they are, whatever they're doing right now, Lord, we'll just receive your peace that you, that you offer where it surpasses all understanding, Lord. And then. Yeah, by touch, whether that self or with their own children.

00:40:31:05 - 00:40:47:16
Elle McBride
The next time that they're feeling stressed or anxious, Lord, that they can just place their hands on themselves and just receive your life, Lord. And, yeah, we bless this podcast. We bless all the places that it's going to go. And, yeah, thank you for this space in this time together today.

00:40:47:18 - 00:40:51:24
Dave Quak
In your name, Amen. Amen.

00:40:52:01 - 00:40:58:01
Elle McBride
For more candid conversations on faith and mental well-being, check out some bent SARS-CoV-2.

00:40:58:03 - 00:41:17:21
Dave Quak
Subscribe to our podcast on any major provider, or contact us directly to book us to preach or speak. sunburntsouls.com is a faith based ministry, and we want to thank everybody so far for their generous support. If you want to get behind us, pray our message reaches the ears of those that need to hear it. Feel free to donate financially online.

00:41:17:21 - 00:41:27:14
Dave Quak
But if you feel obliged or manipulated to give you better off sharing a loved one a coffee instead. I'm Dave Clark from Sunburnt Souls. Thanks for tuning in to this week's episode.