#44 Leading On and Breaking Up with Taylor Nolan

special episode for you. We're gonna talk a little bit about what Jared and Ashley were arguing about all last night for a few hours, arguing having an adult conversation about. We also have a very special guest joining us by the name of Taylor Nolan. You know her from Bachelor in Paradise, Vanessa's bestie from her season. Um, and we're

gonna take some emails later on as well. Yeah, absolutely should be pretty Goodhow but we freaking we jump right into a discussion that I actually posted on the Help I Suck at Dating Facebook group, which a lot of people voted on. Thank you for doing that. Uh So I asked the question, guys, is leading on leading someone

on the same as giving someone mixed signals? And the reason I thought about this because I was watching Colton and Tia and their saga that continues to go on Bachelor Paradise and a a lot of people are accusing Colton of leading Tia on and I couldn't disagree more. Vanessa, what are your thoughts? Are leading someone on the same

as giving them mixed signals? Are they two different things? Okay, if we're basing this off of Bathroom Paradise, um, I'm probably gonna made fun of Remember when we roasting me last time. So like Vanessa never watches anything faster related, Well, I thought up to date with Bathroom Paradise, Vanessa up. Oh no, we were saying that that round of a plus. Listen,

I just saw this place. So when anyone wants to blame your house, all right, moving on leading someone on versus sending mixed signals, I think it's the that's the same book. Wow, it's the exact same thing. We're dropping bs bombs too, that's our passion, always feel about it. Well, then you have the backing of our friends over at the Facebook group because of you said that leading someone on is the same as mixed signal. Now I disagree, so do I. I would like to know if are

female voters. I'm sure they're mostly female. I would imagine. Yes, Okay, well this is my take on it. Um. I know we like we were kind of discussing this last night and someone was like, yeah, but that's the whole point of dating. I think that if you are, we're at

an age. I mean, I'm a little bit older. I just figured out that I'm the oldest in the in the studio right now, son an age where if you know you're into someone, um, you're going to treat them in a respectful manner where you're not going to dive in deep into sending them signals of like, oh my god, I want to be with you, oh my god, I want to scarce monogamously, and then it's two months, you months down the line. That's not where your head as

is anymore. If you know, if that's not where your head is, that then you shouldn't be sending those singles at the beginning. You should, you know what I mean? So, I think leading someone on and then it's the same, it's the same thing. I understand where you're coming from. But having said that, I think listen, leading someone on is with the intent of pretty much lying to them. We're sending mixed signals. I think is someone being honest and saying, hey, I'm confused right now. See I think

you're okay. Sorry, no, go continue, I want to hear you much jumping, Let's go. I think they're so completely different, it's not even they don't even compare in the sense that leading someone on is your intentionally kind of keeping them on a string, maybe going out of your way to do romantic gestures or things for them. No, Vanessa, let me finish, please while you please not interrupt you while I'm trying to do. On the On the on the flip side of that, on the contrary, sending mixed

signals is something that I am. I've I'm guilty of. I've done that before solely because I'm not going out of my way to do romantic gestures. But I think in apparently I'm an affectionate person, and sometimes that affection

can come across as showing interest. And so what I'm saying the difference is is sending mixed signals and leading someone on are so different because you can be kind to someone and that person is going to perceive those actions and that kindness as affection, while sending leading someone on is like sending them flowers or taking them out

to dinner, that kind of thing. And I think that leading someone on is and it's literally leading them to believe that there's a relationship at the end of this when you know there isn't send exactly. It's the same thing as sending a mixed action. That's one thing. Hold on, if you're talking about effect enough one thing. But if you're if you're sending and we spoke about this on the podcast last week theme I forget what the terminology is.

But if you're sending someone a text message read commenting, or last thing at night, or like a sweet message of like I think I'm thinking about you, or just something that makes the other person assume that you're into them, that is leading someone on. But that's also not sending mixed signals. That's the definition of leading them on, not

mixing signals. That's the difference is that's that's one thing, absolutely right, if you're if you're you're sending it, sending a message one day and then you're not that you are, that you are that you're not. Yeah, but mixing those is also being honest about your confusion. For example of vans, if somebody came up to you and said, hey, I

really like listen. I would rather have somebody be honest about um their confusion rather than lie about their decisiveness and then find out that they were never really interested in having relationship at the end of the road. For example, I think that giving me signals, like Dean said, is doing romantic things. Having said that, being honest and saying I'm confused about my feelings. I'm not sure where to go from here, but like, I like you, I like you in my life, but I'm not sure if this

is going to be a long term thing. I feel that's sending mixed signals because you're doing one thing but also saying another. Having said that, leading someone on would be like I want a relationship with you, I want to um, you know, end up with you, and then he knows all the while he's just using you, and

he's saying these things just to get you in bed. Well, I think if you're being honest, if you're communicating your thoughts and saying I'm not sure if I want to be with you, that's a whole but that's the whole other conversation. I'm just if you remove the honestly aspect of it, and if and someone is just sending you the wrong signals and the wrong text messages at the right time, after the right text messages at the right time, but they're just bored and they need like validation from

another person. Then that's leading someone on. Yeah, but I also you're being honest. If you're being honest about it, then it's two different things. Yes, I agree with you, Yeah, but I think the difference it lies in that mixed signals is honesty. I don't know for me, for example, like if I call back on my own past, Yes, I did romantic things for Ashley and I wanted her

in my life because I really cared about her. But at the same time, I was away a little saying like I think we should be friends, and I was also lying to that extent because I was more confused than I was leading on. But I just always thought to be better to say, let's just be friends, because it's unfair for me to be one foot in one foot? So are you leading your send your mixed signals. I was never leading her on, And that's what always makes me mad is that Ashley once said that you led

me on. I was like, no, I did not. I'm remember lying to you, I'm gonna have to agree with Actually, I think you were leading her on because you were, like you said, you were doing romantic things for her. That's leading her to believe that you're interested in having a relationship for her. I'm not saying that you lied about anything or anything that I just the way that I look at him is leading someone on. Is someone thinks there should be a relationship and the other person

doesn't while sending mixed signals. Is it's it's the relationships are removed from it. It's just like you're being a kind affectionate person for whatever reason. Like that me, that's just who you are, because you are you, Jared. You are a very kind and affectionate person. But if you're going out of your way to like set up these romantic things for her and like make her feel like she has a glimmer of hope to like date you, that's leading someone on. So are you saying that you

let on both Christina and Daniel. I think I said I think shots are being fired here today. I'm just saying if if if you are describing that exact explanation of me with Ashley, then you have to say it about yourself, but I dated both of them. Yeah, but I'm I'm I'm engaged Ashley, okay, rubbing it in my face a little bit more. No, I don't it in that way. But like if you're putting on the day asked, I'm saying you, I think that you did lead her on. I'm very very happy that you two were able to

lead into this engagement together. Of course, you guys are my favorite couple of all time. Um, I think that I, like I said earlier, I'm good at sending mixed signals, good obviously being a relative term. I do send mixed signals because I want to love everyone and I want everyone to love me back. And by doing that, it sends it sets someone up to be like, okay, like he's interested in me, even though the interest isn't maybe

quite as high as it is totally. But I was even gonna back you up because I think back upon the Last Paradise and I said that Dean wasn't leading on Christina, or Dean wasn't leading on Delo. He gave them mixing because he was confused. But you were always honest in your confusion. For example, like like Chris is about to be called out tonight apparently on Bachelor Paradise for leading to you on because he said, Hey, I

this guy. He's on Bachelor and Paradise. But he pretty much told Tia, I only want to be with you, and then he went to go and kiss Crystal. He was leading Ti on compared to Colin, who was like, yes, I do like you, but on confus used about my feelings and so he was doing nice things but also saying he didn't want to be in a relationship. So he was sending this was leading to the Okay, can I time in? So I think, let's say hyposthetical situation. I'm gonna put Dean and I in this, Okay, So

let's say beans in love with me. Yeah, okay. So I know that Dean's in love with me, and I take advantage of the fact that I'm getting attention from him, and I kind of want it and I like it. So I'm going to send him those signals that make him assume that I too, am into him. No, here's the questions, because that's you leading me on. I think, well, here's the question for you, Vanessa. If if this was true,

are you into Dean? Could you possibly think that there was a relationship between you and Dean in the future, or do you know right now that there's no possibility of you guys ending up together. I think, well, in our treation, I I mean, it depends, It depends where. It always depends on what Okay, what happens is there's two people that have two different expectations on relationships and on dating. I'm the type of person that's like, Wow, if I'm going to give someone attention, it's because I

actually really like them. I'm not gonna call a guy, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna kiss the guy, or I'm not going to sleep with someone if I'm not a hundred percent into them. So I assume if the guy is texting me, or if the guy wants to kiss me or hold my hand in public, because he's a hundred percent into me as well, And then if he's not, I get confused. I'm like, what the posts? Why why are you? Why are you leading me on?

Why are you sending big signals if you were doing everything that in my book describe a person who's really into me with two yes, But I think you're taking out the part the person's definition. But it depends on what the person's definition is of, Like listen, if I was someone that would be if I work at on Paradise,

I think it'd be like, ah, kiss Sara, Sara. You know, I don't think i'd be flying for one specific person because it seems to me like everyone on Fairdise just kind of enjoys their time getting to know multiple people. It's not like being on the bast Or franchise totally for one person. And that's totally fine, But I think what the part that you're taking out when you're describing that one relationship or like hypothetically speaking that one relationship,

you're taking out the conversations that you guys have. And if he was saying, listen, I'm confused about where we're going and I'm still open to dating other people, then I think he's sending you mixed signals. But if he's telling you, hey, I think we can end up in a relationship together in actuality, he's just lying because you know he wants something else from you, then I think that's leading someone on. I see your point. I think

that makes sense. I don't know, but I guess that I'm I'm just saying, if you didn't have that conversation and if you're not at that stage in the relationship yet, but everything else leads you to believe that you're you are monogamous and that you are committed to each other, and you know before you have that conversation, because there are certain like relationships that you can be in and kind of put the puzzle pieces together and it's like, yeah,

I don't have to be asking this question right now and put holes in the relationship and like get you know, stuck the magic out of the first couple of months in it. I think you as absolutely. I think I think Jerry kind of sold me on his thought process because what we've seen a lot, especially a better paradise

is here. Well, and let me defend it for a second, because I feel like what we've seen a lot of in Bachelor in Paradise this year, almost at every turn, is guys saying what they need to say in order to keep a girl on the line. Like you see Chris talking to Tia to make her feel comfortable and

then he goes and does something completely different. That's that level of dishonesty I think is the what the foundation of leading someone on versus mixed signals is like it's an authentic terror between not really knowing what to do sort of things. So I understand you're coming from. I'm sorry if me saying that you let Ashley on him across is me calling you a lie or anything that because you're not it did not at all. We're talking here, Okay,

I love it. I'm having discussions like this where people are in two different points, like trying to argue to three different points. You want to know whose point I think we should take into account is Taylor's? I totally agree. Can we get her in here real quick? I think while Taylor is coming in here, I have something very special that I want to talk about because I don't

know if you guys. Are you guys big Lionel Richie's face, Oh my god, tiny dancer, dog God, here we go that I want to tell him I'm more of your favorite favorite kind of guy or all night long? The cool thing is, guys, listen all night Long is one of my favorite. Also, endless love, Happy Gilmore. Please tell me you guys know where I'm talking about over here. Lionel Richies all the hits Las Vegas residency has returned to Zappo's Theater at Planet Hollywood. Guys, it's after an

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send me mix sages all right, guys. Tickets, v I P tables and meet and greets are available at ticket master dot com from Lona Richie's Paul the Hits Las Vegas Residency check it out at the Zappos Theater this August and October at Planet Hollywood. Now, boom uh, we have a very special guest in studio, Taylor. How do you say your last aim? So sorry, A lot of coated last night, So I completely blanked because I am an idiot. If you haven't recognized by that. Thank you

so much for joining us. Yeah, thanks for having me, Taylor. We want your input on this real quick. Um leading someone on verus sending mixed signals quick one minute thoughts on what the differences could be between the two of them, or do you think you're the same um at first? Like my gut, I would say that they're very different.

Leading someone on, you are giving them signs that you're interested and maybe you're just like with holding a little bit, whereas Nick signals as like you're very hot and cold okay, interesting, Like mixed signals is like you're you're definitely going for it, you're pursuing it, but then you're also like acting completely disinterested, whereas leading someone on, I feel like the opposite, yes, is kind of lacking, acting interested when you're really not. Yeah,

kind of Okay, I got that. I like that. I like that aspect. I agree. I think that's nailed right on that perfect side with me. Were you not listening, I had the other side to it to me. I'm sorry, girl, I would have had your back. So, Vanessa, do you want to take it? Because you and Taylor obviously have a strong friendship from your time on the season together, and I think you guys have hung out quite a bit post season as well, Right yep, yeah, yeah, we're

gonna be with each other, got in. Yeah, we're face timing before this, and then we're going to be together at a conference here soon together too, So I forgot a thought that Yeah, just's in a couple of weeks. Yes, excited to see you. Thanks guys. All right, well, Vanessa, what kind of questions you want to lead off with Taylor, because obviously we have a lot to cover. Well, I'm just saying you got is really besties. It's just it's mostly appropriate for you to be asking. And just to

give it a little background, I don't think anybody needs it. Taylor, you're obviously on next season of the Bachelor, and then you went on Bachelor in Paradise last year with Dean, and then you were engaged to Derek, which has recently ended. I'm sorry to hear about that. Um, just to give our audience a little background on Taylor, you probably already know it. You also have a podcast I do. It's called Let's Talk About It with Taylor on Perfect Let's Talk About It. I love the name of that, And

so Vanessa go, what question he's got for Taylor? Well, actually, Taylor and I I just I was on Taylor's podcast, uh like maybe last month. We're talking about breakups and uh, you know, having to deal with the public breakups and the steps of going getting over someone blah blah blah blah.

I think so, I think I want to ask, and I know obviously all the answers and I have mulsible questions that I'm like, you know what, we'll keep it for a private conversation, But I guess I just people probably want to know, how are you dealing with the aftermath of your public break up and where your your heart and your head is at right now. Fantastic question, Vanessa. Yeah,

I mean how I handle it. Like initially, it's just a lot of support from friends and family and just kind of like getting disconnected a little bit um from everything social wise, a little bit of disconnect from the relationship communication wise, and like really just getting back in touch with your life and the people that you care about, and um, for me, it's like getting back to the things that I'm really passionate about and give me life and give me happiness. And for me, that's like animals

and food, plants, plants. What's your favorite animal? Cat? Cat? Cat? I think a tat And I'm like, wait, not down with one? A tat is Yeah, cat, I'm like a crazy cat at heart. Um right now, I have one. I had two. They came together. They were my foster's used to foster a lot um and I did a lot of rescue work when I lived in Baltimore, so they were my fosters and then um, I adopted them and one of them passed away recently at the same time as the breakup. Oh my god, I'm what's your

cat's name? Lily? Lily, That's such a great name. Yeah. She came to me with it, and I was like, how right, you know, rip the l okay. So what kind of advice would you have for the listeners that are dealing with a breakup themselves? Obviously it's a little bit different from your situation to the next, just because of obviously the publicity of it and then the engagement is a little bit more severe than like a boyfriend girlfriend.

But for the listeners out there, because we do often get emails or callers or people like inquiring, like I just went through this breakup, it's incredibly challenging for me. And obviously you deal a lot with mental health because that's your you know, your interest in what you study in college and what your profession is all that kind of stuff. So what kind of advice would you have for a listener um that's kind of going through a similar situation. Yeah, first, I would say, like practice being

kind to yourself. Um, Like self compassion is something I think everyone struggles with actually implementing because it's kind of a weird concept, um, but really just actually like sitting

and being kind to yourself. So I think you beat yourself up and you second so many things about yourself during a breakup, and you know, you feel sometimes there's like the sense of rejection or sense of being alone and you're gonna be alone forever, and just kind of giving yourself those like, um, checking in on that inner talk and like giving yourself reality checks you know, and mean kind to yourself. Yeah, those are really important things

to do, was it? Um? So if we rewind a little bit, you were, like I said, you were on NIX season to The Bachelor, and you were famously known for going on a two own kin. So, uh, did you ever talk to Kurin after the show? Did you guys ever become friends? Because then you went to Paradise and the whole thing happened. Um, I think our listeners would be pretty curious, like, because I feel like we always see like two on ones and people that like appear to hate each other on the show, And um,

did you guys actually hate each other? Were you kind of friendly? I don't even, honestly, I don't even know. That's why I'm asking. I don't even. Yeah no, Um, I mean we spoke at Women's Hell all and then uh didn't see each other or speak to each other again until Paradise. Um, but even was short lived because obviously the whole was on the beach for two days. Yeah yeah, so, um, I mean we're not friends. We're not like people that catch up or message each other

or have literally any interaction. Do you guys follow each other on Instagram? I don't believe she follows me, and I don't. I just I'll never forget that too. On one day because man, you guys, yeah, there was a big were there. Oh my god, you missed out. I was at like a viewing party in Atlanta with all these different Bachelor people and um, like James Taylor was there and Wells was there, and there was a bunch

of us jin seven o uh seven. God, I can't pronounce anything Um, but I just vividly remember that too on one and then um, so then you went to Paradise and did you know, so you got engaged not on the show, but you got engaged on the reunion show. Did you see it coming at all? The engagement? Come on? Yes you did. I remember I was at in event in Nashville after Yes, Vanessa, would you want to bet

money on it? If I could see it coming as an outsider, I there had to be like your hint, like an inkling inside of you that's like, Okay, something big is going to happen here. But let's talk about

that for a second. Obviously leading up to it before and because we had a unique season of Paradise obviously with the whole scandal quote unquote um with Kriton de Mario, so I could be like we were kind of working on an abbreviated timeline, but also because you and Derek kind of hit it off in the beginning the first So for the listeners, I guess we had a timeline of we filmed for like three days and then we were all together for like two days, and then we

all left for maybe like a week and a half. We were there for like five days five days total before we left right and then So so the interesting I guess dynamic with these relationships is for those like for that week and a half, there's like ten days where a lot of the cast members who had never met each other, like a Taylor and Derek, like me and Christina were interacting on a day to day basis off off camera, like via text like whatever it is

you guys all hanging out. When you guys had to leave the resort and go back to the Vendanta where you go, you guys were able to interact. So you're really developing your relationship with Derek and you with Christina off and I remember this day, I was like Ben's Orn and Raven. We're all like caddled up next to each other, which is just hilarious look back and look at now. I remember you and Christina were like sneaking because we weren't supposed to like get out of our

hotel room. Remember there were all these rumors of like who's sneaking around tonight? Like well, so so it was just a weird timeline for us because we kind of had the to experience both of obviously being on camera at the beach with each other and then also kind of like real world stuff as well. Um, but it's still such a quick amount of time. And it's funny because I got dinner with a friend actually not too

long ago, and she was talking to me. She's like, she's like, obviously, none of these bacheloration relationships work out is because you don't really have enough time to build a friendship with them before you really like dive into

a relationship. And so when you look back, maybe like on your time on the beach on Paradise, do you think that, like the timeline was too quick to get engaged, but you I mean maybe because you had a little bit more time with him, Like, what are your thoughts on kind of the timeline from meeting to him bending

the knee? Vanessa? Wait, the timeline between? Do you think what are your Vanessa, what are your thoughts about the timeline of getting engaged in the show, Because there are there are critics, Yeah, I mean, Vanessa's engaged after three months exactly. Their critics that say people are getting engaged way too soon. You well, okay, there's three single people. It's a little it's a little quick. It's a little quick, for sure. Would you if you could go back and

change anything, would you anything at all? Even like what you what you wore at a rose ceremony or something like that. If I could go back and change things, which I'm a strong could say yes that you can say yes to that. The answer is obvious. Yes, we all want to go back and change things certain things, sure, but also like I strongly believe and I'm happy with like how everything has led me to where I am today kind of thing, Butterfly, Like you could have changed

something small. I could brush your teeth an hour or later in the day, and yeah, I would have no idea where I would be out to be a very different person. Um but I think like one of the biggest things I've learned that like I want to change in my life going forward, um is I think just like understanding and empowering myself to like take more control over the decisions and the things that happened in my life.

If that makes sense. Well, so what made you kind of have that fun is there's it Was there a specific moment or that you're like, okay, like I need to take more control over this, or was it something like just kind of piled up just like I think like there's a lot of pressure developing a relationship on the show, and that things, you know, move a lot quicker, and you know, people aren't always necessarily on the same page with things, and um, I think it's important like

to not only speak up and like speak your truth, but also like make sure that that you heard and make sure that your voice is heard and that you feel like your voice matters. It's interesting when you say that, because you are, um a rare exception to the Bachelor couple rule. A few exceptions that you got engaged after spending time off screen with somebody. You know, you guys

like paradise. And then so paradise ended, you know, late June filming, I really believe it was, and then you guys spent a couple of months and then went to roon and show August. If I had to assume about this exact time, holy holy. And so it's interesting that a lot of people don't get that. A lot of people have the month of filming and then they're like, Okay, we're either going to do this we're not going to

do this. Um, So I wonder if you could talk a little bit about that, like leaving spending some time with him and then getting engaged, and then I also had a quick question um that I'm completely blanking on, so just go with yours on that. Yeah, I mean, I think it was it was nice to be able to see each other outside of you know, Mexico, but it was also like we were both kind of still

in weird places in our in our lives. You know. Um, I was still kind of trying to figure out where I wanted my life to go post my season um, and he was still kind of in like a weird um what's the word I'm looking for, like limbo. He

was in a weird limbo state as well. Like we're both kind of in limbo states in our lives, which I think a lot of people coming off the show are, yes, in what way just like transitioning what locations are just like headspace locations jobs, you know, just not really kind of knowing what you're going to do and just like kind of staying open to whatever comes up or trying

to figure out what you want to pursue. Um. And so you know, we're both kind of in weird phases like that, and so we would like take trips and you know, we were like long distance. Um, but you know, then you're kind of like trying to see if you can make things work. And then it's kind of like, Okay, we're really trying, really trying. Well. Wasn't there a couple of moments where you guys planned on moving to New York together? I'm like, I remember seeing something like that,

but I could be mistaken. Yeah. Yeah, So he um accepted a job in Connecticut and um yeah, and UM we discussed, like you know, the potential of me moving there, and um, it it didn't happen. I mean I spent about like two weeks of every month out there, so like I did a lot of the traveling back and forth, um, because he was getting situated in this new job and

um where the Seattle. Yeah, and my family so like the three days after the reunion films, my step dad went into cardiac arrest and likest like died and so came back and all this stuff was so my family was going to like a really weird period of time as well. Um, and he had to have like a whole career change. He was a pilot for like twenty plus years and UM, so I really wanted to spend a lot of time in Seattle with my family to

make sure that like they weren't a good place. My mom's like traumatized by this, and she watched her husband die in front of her basically and then come back to side with a roller coaster. Um. And then like my cat Theo was super sick and so I was like,

you know, I want to be here for him. So they were just like a lot of other things going on, and our relationship was still you know, we were really like working to try to make it work and see, you know, if this is like something that we're both mutually like really wanting to move forward with, and that's going to bring a lot of like positivity and connection in our lives. And there were a lot of things that like we were different on and in different places

in our lives. And um, you know, he he was too. He has like such a hard work ethic and he works so hard and something I really admired about him. Um, but it does make it a little bit more difficult in terms of like balancing your relationships in your life. And um, so it's like, you know, I would go to Connecticut and would talk to Vanessa a lot, um and just you know, it's like a little lonely and it's a little different. Was it mostly you traveling out east?

And I feel like he didn't really come out west often? Yeah, so it was it was always me coming um to visit there. How many times did you, like once a month, two weeks out of the month. She said, yeah, about two two and a half weeks out of each month I would be there. So I was living out a suitcase for a long time. UM, that state of limbo just kind of like had can infatuating. Is that your first long distance relationship? No, so I was in the

longest sit relationship. UM a few months prior to the show. I think the show had started in August nine. Got out of that relationship like that December. UM, and we had started dating in Baltimore and then I moved to Seattle and we were long distance for like four months. So I've done it before, but it was like back

and forth. I have a question that's kind of off topic, but on topic, So speaking of since you know you were doing long distance, I did long distance with Nick, and then I decided to move out to l A because that's where he was at and he was reporting gasing and all that stuff. So so, um, I'm I'm not I love long distance relationships, but I'm not someone who's a post to long distance relationships. After how long?

After how long do you think is an appropriate amount of time to decide who moved where and who should move where? Like, how do you make that decision? Is that some three months of dating that you're like, all right, we have to take this relationship with stuff further on the side, you know, a permittent spot where we can actually build a solid foundation? Is it sis months? But after a year? I think it's like about six months

is the cut off line? See, I don't feel like you can put any kind of time limit on it because I think it really depends upon what the connection is and what the you know, I'm very black and white. I know we're working on having like getting comfortable with this gray area and not necessarily knowing everything that's going to happen. It happens in the gray area, it does. That's where that's where all the magic happens to Um.

So yeah, I don't. I think it's really depend Like I think there needs to be a lot of communication about it, um, because you want to make sure that you guys are built on the same page. Well, and it needs to be progress being made towards that too. It's like, I mean, long distance relationships. Some people can do them, some people definitely can't. I would say majority can't do them. So it's like if you don't, you're not you don't like them, right, I'm very anti long distance.

I'm anti long distance. But like I hate to say it, but it's like if you I mean, you're in a relationship with Derek for almost a year, like nine months, ten months, whatever it is, um, and there was never the moment, well there was there was maybe conversations that you guys are gonna live together and all that kind of stuff, but um, I don't know, like what like that just it's such a straining on the relationship, you know. Yeah.

And for me, I mean honestly, I didn't feel like, you know, okay, we needed to move towards moving in with each other. I know. That's more so where he was at, like he really wanted me to be there. Um. It was again, like I said, he was working all the time and so like his community was really just work. Um, And you know, I think it's like a little lonely out there, um, And so it meant a lot to him when I was out there visiting, But to me, it wasn't like we need to move in with each other.

You know, for me, it would have made a big difference, like if he had came, if there had been more of back and forth, like if he had seen more of me in in Seattle and in my home and in my community, which like he got to see a little bit post show, but it's you know, all that stuff was happening with my family, with my cat, and like it's again post show, you're kind of trying to like decom pressed and like get back into like what your life is going to be and how it's gonna

be in Like for me, that's like, Okay, you're getting to know me again and you care about like who I am and what's important to me. Right, that makes sense? Well, so, I mean, I obviously I know it's not the easiest thing to talk about in the world. And I've definitely like we've all had to go through these moments where

it's like you kind of talk about these breakups. Um, was there like maybe a moment that you guys were together where you were like Okay, wait, maybe something's misfiring here and it doesn't necessarily feel like it should be working as easy as it should. Is it something that you are willing to talk about, because there's always like it's always hard to define it as one moment like this is the moment where things started to go awry

a little bit. But is there a point? Thank you? Okay, I'm gonna take the fresh off of Taylor and I'll put it on to me right now. I feel great, friend, I remember right. So I'm very candid about you know, Nick and I have been gone through a couple of therapy, and I think it's something most couple should do. Um, I only started this individuals one. Yeah. Yeah, but I'm saying I don't starting therapy once I was on the Bachelor and I realized just how creatives express. I'm not

all right. I don't like writing things down, so I like talking about it. But every now and then, when you talk to your the same sister, the same front, you know, you get you're getting the same piece of advice. But it was just so nice to hear from a third party. Um. And then we did a couple of therapy and remember that they're asking us what was go back in time, and I want you guys to think

about this too. Maybe practices just like your significant other. Um, go back and think of when was the last time you truly stuff connected to your partner? Think about it and let me know. So I'm like, all right, so I thought about it. I'm like, I got it. The last time I felt was blah blah blah blah. And Nick didn't remember that moment in time where I felt so in love with him. So and he mentioned once one part in our relationship where he's like, this is

where I felt the most connected to you. And I'm like, oh, I don't remember that part. And it made me so that and that's when we realized we don't value the same sort of Um, I can't put my works at a moment. Well, that you guys weren't actually connecting with

each other. We were connecting what we were. Yeah, we were connecting with maybe like the I t of like, I'm not even the idea that's not even true because I was in love with him and I did love him and I still care about him, you know, but I it was we didn't share the same type of connection. Well you're yeah, if you're not gonna value just holding my hand in the street. Well, it's interest. That wasn't

my example, but I think that's. Um. That's when I started realizing it's interesting, Like you said, Vanessa that you were in love with Nick and he was in love with you. You guys developed feelings on the show. Everybody does. And then I remember a couple one said this when they got off the show. Yes, we're in love with each other, but honestly, it felt like that's when we

started dating, which is so crazy. Do you agree with that? Taylor, Like you went on the show, you got engaged, Derek, did it feel like after you guys left, was like, yeah, we're in love each other, but now it feels like we just started dating. Yes, is that? But no, like a lot of bachelor couples say that. I think even Sean and Katherine said that at one time, where Sean was like, yeah, I love with Katherine, but it feels

like just like now the relationship starts. Even I mean even throughout our whole relationship, it's still kind of felt like we were waiting to reach that point of like, okay, can we start dating, because it still didn't even really feel like we were dating, and that was one thing. I mean I went back, um not to basically during

the breakup or right after it was announced. Um, I had gone back and rewatched this interview that we did um together with and he was like Access Hollywood or something it was, and she was asking all these questions about like still like I guys gonna move in with

each other, like what you guys can do? And we were so on different pages, and I was like, yeah, you know, like I wanna go really slow and like I want to have my place and I want my man to have his place, and I want to go over to my man's place, you know, and like have those weekends and like keep the romance alive, developed the romance even and like just date each other and even doing long distance basically right off the bat, like we didn't really actually have that opportunity to like do that

kind of dating. And so you can call him and be like, hey, why don't you come over tonight and we'll watch a movie. It's like he's you know, two thousand miles away, a little bit more movie, yes, in New York. I guess it's a little bit more than two. Um. Yeah, I I've always found that very interesting because a lot of people, you know, they criticized the show a little bit. I'm like, no, the feeling is very real. But you know, when you get off the show, that's when the dating

really starts. And I always feel grateful for the fact that Ashley and I kind of went through that a little bit before we ended up together, because we did have that opportunity to just like hang out and go over each other's houses and and create a friendship and then turn it into a relationship. And um, um, so it's it's it's very interesting. Um. But you know, Taylor, you're you're a wonderful champ for coming in and talking and opening yourself up about everything. It's not easy. You know,

we've all been there. We've had to talk about tough times and we're not talking about this, are we? No, not at all. But I figured that transition a little bit maybe a little bit easier conversation having to talk

about it. You know. I also wanted that I think it's important and I said this, I keep saying this, It's important to no matter what, no matter how or what your relationship when you know, no matter what you went through in your relationship, good that ugly said, Um, I think it's important to always talk highly of the person that you were once with and not hope not even just talk highly, but hopefully like actually feel that, like you have to be able to see that in

your partner. It's easy to it's it's easy to just sometimes be so angry and upset and be in that dark space and you just want to like, you know, throw that person umber. But or because something that you're feel like agent to you or something that you interpret it or whatever it is. And I think it's important that to uh, like you said, like to just believe it, but also to say it out out. Um, yeah, and then there's a great job at that, thank you. Yeah.

That's something like we talked about a little bit on on the episode of my pod that you came on, um, talking about breakup, where like throughout my breakup, especially you know, leading up to when we were going to publicly announced and even when privately it was happening, and just trying to like really focus on the positive of our relationship and the positives of who he is and like the things that I really admired about him and the things that you know, we shared together that we enjoyed and

and it's weird talking about, you know, like the actual dating aspect of it, because even there were like there's different layers the relationship that you developed, Like on Paradise, relationship was very different, and like the feelings that I had for him on Paradise were very different than the feelings I had for him in real life, and like parts of me didn't really feel this strong sense of like being in love with him until way after that,

to way after even the proposal. Even so like for me, it's like looking back at all these different stages of our relationship and like really trying to remember all of those positive things, because it's like you can get so wrapped up in in the negative and why this isn't working out and how your heart hurts, and so you want to make sense of why this is a good decision for you, so you focus on the negative, but like, yeah, no, this is why, like yeah, this is why this isn't

a good idea. But it's like, you know, like that's someone you shared a lot of things with, and you know, you shared your heart with, you shared your soul, and you shared your family and your life, and you know, I think it's important to like continue to try to nurture that. So so when you guys broke up, you said you broke up privately obviously, and then the public

kind of announcement happened. M tough question here, who initiated that first conversation of you guys separating privately, of a separating private like when you like, who initiated the first conversation is like, hey, maybe we should consider breaking up. I'm gonna say it was both. However, he was more. There were two trips that I had taken out to see him in Connecticut, and um, he more took the initiative of saying, like, you know, I don't think this

is right anymore. And I was on the same page, but I was too scared and I didn't want to let it go. And I'm someone that like really tries and wants to, you know, well, let's try this, let's try this, let's do this, because I tried to see where like, no, it could work, like if maybe we just tried these things. I bet it was almost a sense of relief when you heard that the third time. The third time, so after that second time that I was talking about, um, well, I left and we were

basically like taking space. We're basically on a break kind of thing. Um. And then I went back and in that trip it got brought up again and I didn't fight it, and I was just like let it flow, like this is where it's going, Like this is where you've wanted it to go. You're just like I don't know what's going to happen afterwards, and that part's like really scary. So I was just like be present, let be this is where it's going to go, and like

went with it. And then afterwards it was such this sense of of relief and like a weird sense of like freedom almost, and you know, it was very connecting for us, even like I think we connected in a very strong way um before I left that trip, because it's we did take a second like to look back at at our relationship and like where the positives were and where we did connect, and so there were I think some blurred lines there, but it it was for me like a very good sense of like closure of

like this isn't right and we wish that it could have been different, but like I always have love for now. Of course, No, I think that's don't you think it's kind of silly to how there's so much outside pressure to like you almost like feel like you're letting other people down. It is there's so many layers to the breakup, and that's where like, this has been such a different

breakup than any breakup my entire life. And that's what people can understand is there is an outside influence and you try not to let it affect your relationship, either positively or negatively, but the fact of the matter, it does. Yeah, it's this whole other part of your identity that like impacts your day to day life. And a lot of people will say, well, that's what you signed up for, and it's like, yes, but at the end of the day, did I think I was going to get on the show?

Of course I didn't. And also, just because that's what you signed up for, it doesn't mean that it can't also be difficult to experience exactly exactly. And I think it's also people get to have a perception of who you are based of how proceed on the show, um, and so they have this idea of you, and if they like you, then they'll support you through the through

the relationships and through the breakup. If they don't like you, then you'll get the back blast and you'll get the one you'll be the ones whole blame for the relationship that's not working out. You know, it's like it's never I was asked this when I did the interview for a second and Garrett got engage and I'm like, I said this in the last and everyone was at the a f R that if utal in industry to door a, you'll pick people off with you and not only this industry,

in this life. You know, always have an opinion and so to the past. That will make you the happiest no matter what people are going to do with you. Yeah, no, I agree. You have to do it's best for you, um and try to block out all the nights because if you listen to everybody's opinion, you're just going to tear yourself apart and make matters worse for yourself. Um. So,

Taylor obviously going through a breakup. There's a lot of Pele listeners like we talked about that are going through breakups, and we talked a little bit of advice that you can give them. But if you could say one thing, um to anybody going through a breakup right now, that's dealing with heartache or confusion. Um. One piece of advice that you've really taken from your experience throughout this, what would it be. It's okay to not be okay and let yourself be not okay. I feel like I always say,

like feel all the feelings. Like it's easy to distract yourself and you know, jump from one thing to the next door to just be a busy bee and distract yourself from feeling those painful feelings. Um. But my biggest piece of advice going through a breakup, you gotta be in it. It's uncomfortable, but like let yourself feel that heartache and you'll move through it. Like you don't have to project this highlight reel onto social media that you're you know doing totally find an awesome and not faded

by life at all. Um, you know it's okay to like show that vulnerable side of you and you know say that like, yeah, I am struggling right now because this hurts. Yeah. It's so funny that you mentioned social media because there's literally a book right in front of Dean myself that says how to be as happy as you look on social media. Co Um. So Taylor. Tell us what you're up to right now? Where you still in Seattle? Yeah, so I'm still in Seattle. Seahawks fan. Yeah,

I'm and Diard Patriots fan. I wouldn't have guessed. I know obviously from doing on. I love the Seahawks, though I've always loved Russell Wilson. I know your defense falling apart a little bit, but we don't have talk about that right now. Um, so tell us about what else you're up to. You have your podcast, what's going on with that? Yeah? So have the podcast recording with some people here in Elin now. Um. I was telling Dean on the way here that in Seattle, I have my

first apartment. That's just my apartment, like no roommates, no, like boyfriend. Um, that's just me and well and all my plants. And it's really great and it feels like really good to be back in touch, especially after everything with the show. You know, there's this whole like limbo state and honestly, am I allowed to swear on here? Yeah? Yeah? The show really you up, Like it really picked me up, and I got real disconnected from like who I was

and it I was. I was shook after that first experience. So it feels so nice to like just feel like Taylor again and you feel like some normalcy to your life. Yeah, it feels really good. Do you and Derek still have any line of communication at all? Do you guys talk? I know you, Hey, you keep staring daggers at me a rey single time. That's question. Dar wants talk about football. I want to talk about your last We got to

ask our questions. Is Russell Wiston better than every wronger stuff? Um, it's it's uh exclusive to text, and that's very short. I still have stuff um in Connecticut that I'm trying to get back. Um. So yeah, there's but you're friendly, all right, never mind, I try to be friendly. Um. And then there's also times where like I feel like no, I have to like assert myself and be like no,

that's not like I think it was. For instance, I think every couple goes through for instance, like what I just I think this is the hardest thing actually is that everyone handles breakups differently. And like I'm someone that that wants to still, um depart connected and a lot of people need that like disconnect like that just cold, They're not cold, the clean cut, clean cut cold cuts to a fantastic people. Yeah. I don't block people, but

I I advocate if you need to. Yeah, and like I understand people, like know your boundaries and like for me, I still feel like most of my exes, I'm close with one of them. I just spoke to uh two days ago, and you know, he was like the longest relationship I ever had and we lived together. And was it, Nick, I'm kidding, Come on, that was a joke. We're all friends in here, we go there it is. I was

waiting for it. Well, no, so I mean it. It's just you know, I still want to feel connected and want to leave it at least on a friendly you know, Like I talked to his mom and his sister and I'm like close with them and I think they're wonderful people. Um. You know, I don't think he he prefers to not speak at all. He he definitely prefers to have no contact. Um and and I respect that aside from like I

just want to my stuff. Of course, logistical things are it can be difficult to figure out when you don't right before before we move on, Before we move on to the final segment, which is emails. One final question for you, but everyone's dying to know. Will we ever see you on Paradise again? I doubt it, Okay, I doubt it. I highly doubt it. You never know where you're gonna be any year from now. Yeah, I don't. And you know, I don't ever want to like close

myself off. I put myself like in a box. You know. It's definitely an interesting experience. Um. And if the time is right in my life, then maybe it's something I'd be open to. But you know, if it was like tomorrow, I'd be like, no, six or seven months, I'd be shocked. If you're not getting a phone call from somebody and

I drive over here. Is funny enough because Taylor and I were just talking discussing our time on Paradise actually like the early days of it as well, and how we both kind of like sat down and we were like talking to each other near the pool or whatever, um, and how I was like giving her advice on her relationship with Derek, and she was giving me advice on my relationship with Christina, And it's just funny like look back on that moment and be like, like, I don't know,

we didn't really know what the heck, we were talking about But if you go back to Paradise the second time, I mean, I don't know if anyone this room cann't test to go into Paradise twice, but I'm sure you go in with like maybe a newer like amount of knowledge going into it. Yeah, you want to Paradise, of course you go into It's probably very similar to your experience going to when you're as where you're just a

little bit more aware. You know, you kind of know where you're going in for you know where you're walking into the first time you go to Paradise, it's just like, you know, unicorns and rainbows. You're like, oh my god, it's like Christmas morning. And then I think when you go back for a second time, maybe specifically to Paradise, you're just a little bit more aware of your surroundings. So that would be the only difference. Really. Let's be

on emails. Let's do emails cool. Who wants to America? Mark? I mean, we love you, obviously, but Mark Mark was placed on this earth to read emails podcast. Uh he decided not to be placed on this earth for that reason. I don't know. You can get a very upset text vacation thing. He's got a great voice. Yeah, I'm chopped audiobooks, that's what. Yeah, thanks Vanessa. Well, we all love you, I know, I mean, Okay, anyway, this first email is

actually really interesting, so I'm excited about it. It's from an anonymous sender. Always the best anonymous emails us every week. This poor person, I know. Uh there's they said us another one later. But dear Dean, Jared and Vanessa and Taylor. I'm just an average twenty three year old guy from Texas with some not so average dating issues. I recently started talking to this girl. She's pretty. She gets along with all my friends. It's great. I'm picky with relationships,

but she checks just about everything off the list. We've been talking for a month and see each other quite often. I'm planning on making things official. But there's something I've been tiptoeing around and haven't told her yet. About two years ago, I was talking to a guy who I met at the gym. We fooled around a couple of times and would hang out on occasion, just to test the waters and see how it goes. This only lasted two months or so, and I didn't share it with anyone.

I decided to end things, But I've run into him at the gym every once in a blue moon throughout the years. We'll talk for maybe five minutes and go our separate ways. My question is, should I even tell her about this guy? If so, how is this something I should have shared from early on? Help? I don't want to screw this one up. She's perfect, man. That is.

There's um like a lot of I think, like shaming going on internally with like the fact that he feels like this is something that he has to inform her of, as if it's like this baggage, that it's this like big red flag for him, like it's okay. Society kind has to make it feel that way, which is certainly a bummer. I don't think it's really something that he should share unless it specifically gets brought up in some

sort of way. Yeah, if it naturally flows with the conversation and you can be like, yeah, this this was my experience, and this was you know what I like, this is what I didn't like, this is what I learned. Um, then absolutely you should feel feel you know, empowered and confident to share that as you would with if it were a woman that you had had an experience with totally.

I also think they've only been talking for a month and there not even official yet, So is it really something that needs to be brought up at this moment? It seems kind of premature. He's almost like suggesting it as like this might be a deal breaker for her, so let me let her know ahead of time, But like, yeah, I think that's a deal breaker. Then he should have been with her, you know. I think the only question I would have accept him for who he is? Yeah,

is he is he? Is he bisexual? I think that would be a conversation does he still think about guy? Is he like which is actually attracted to guys? Or was there one thing? Because that should be a conversation you have with your signey thinking O, they're obviously, but

that's something. It sounds like he hasn't talked to anyone about this, So I would say, do some like internal reflecting on some of that and talk to someone before you talk to her about it, Like find someone else, a friend, a family member, whoever, who you trust and who you feel comfortable with, and like share in process this experience with them and get get a little comfortable talking about it exactly. Figure it out on your own before you bring it up with somebody else. Yeah, good advice.

You have very good advice. We should holp you here all the time. Yes. Usually it's like all of us, Okay, do we feel ready for the next one? Then great. This one is titled do I Tell Him? I've been in love with him? And it's from Emma, Hi, Danjured, and Vanessa and Taylor. I'm twenty one years old and have an issue. I basically grew up with this guy. We briefly dated in middle school in early high school.

He's a year older than me. We were very close, and I'd consider him my first love, even though we were never super serious because of our age at the time. He's now graduated and I'm heading into my senior year of college. But while he was in college, he got a new girlfriend who's my age and they've been dating for over a year. I'm happy for him and they seem to be serious. But every now and then we're in contact in subtle ways, snapchat's happy Birthday, text, commenting

on relatable stuff, etcetera. I know in my heart I will always love him and could even see a future with him. I really think he should know this, but I don't want to be a home wrecker and step on toes in their relationship. Oh god, I mean this

one is obviously a tough one. I think listen, Emma, if you have feelings for this guy that's in a relationship and a very serious one, then you should not talk to him because he probably doesn't feel the same way back and he thinks that he's just staying friend with you. If is he sending mixed signals or is

he leading her on which one? I think neither. I don't think it's doing If it's literally like happy birthday text and like commenting on relatable stuff, that's kind of it's not the best, but it's really not anything red flag either. This is this is coming back to my

first comments. She has an idea of him and what receptive being is and the sciences leaves as, oh my god, did think that you know the science ares and not satistic to leave and he's probably just like yeah, we mean more just front presses cresses like I think she also it sounds like, Emma, you have a little bit of like a story built up about your guys relationship, and that maybe it's more of the story that you're in love with of you know, he's gonna be in

the in this relationship and we've dated through middle school and all this stuff, and you know that then eventually it's going to be the two of you. And he could feel similarly, but he needs to like work it out throughout his life and come to that on his own as well. And if he's in the relationship that he's in now, and if you really, you know, truly have love for him, then give him the freedom in the space to experience that. And I think, um, there

was another point that I wanted to say. It sounds like my best friend's wedding. That's exactly what it sounds like to me, Like she's being the friend that she's actually in love with this guy when he's dating someone else, and she just withholds it for her entire life while still being like the friend and staying there. Um. I mean, at some point it's got to go on one of two directions. Yeah, I was. My other thought was like, why think about why you would want to tell him?

And it's my guests because from similar situations with friends that I've experienced that like, you're you're almost kind of searching for the sense of validation that he also feels the same way and like yearning for that connection. And so I would like ask yourself, like, well, why would I tell him? Like it would bring more Yeah, exactly, like if he's already in this place, like let him be in that place, and if if it's if it's supposed to work out, you know, then hopefully it will

one day. But also, to use some buzzwords that we've used on this podcast before, it sounds like, if she really has these feelings for him, it could almost be beneficial to put them out of the table and then that way you can be like, look, I have I feel this way for you, and because of that, I can't receive snapchats from you anymore. I can't get birthday wishes from you anymore, like bread coming, benching, whatever the

heck it is. So I think that there's I think it would be important and beneficial maybe to put it out there and just kind of severtize if that's what it would I was just gonna say, I think there's a way you could go about it. And I think just coming out and being like, hey, I'm in love

with you, um wouldn't be the best. But I think if you like started a conversation of like, hey, you know, like I'm I was just curious and like thinking back to you know, back to middle school or back to high school, whatever, and you know, I'm really happy for you that you're in the relationship, and I'm just curious, like if you've ever had feelings for me in the you know, recent past, Like if you've ever thought about that,

Like he's gonna say, yeah, guaranteed. I just can't help but think of also the girlfriend in this situation, and how unfair would have her where I think it might be best just to sever tise with him, and like if it comes to a point where you don't talk to him for six months and he's just losing his mind because he can't live without you, that's obviously a big sign. But if you severtise, you guys never talk again, then obviously wasn't meant to be so. Or what if

she what if she breaks them up? They get together and then they break up. That would be the worst. That's the worst case that everyone everyone loses. Thank you for filling the air with activity, But I will get some clarity and be like, Okay, I guess it wasn't my person. I don't know. I'm what kind of wins in that situation? A little bit, A little bit. Everybody wins. Emma wins in that situation she because then she has peace of mind and clarity of mind, knowing like, Okay,

we tried, it didn't work out. Sorry about that worked out for everybody? Um, yeah, I know it's tough. I think just severtise. I don't think you need to be with anyone you dated in middle school personally. I mean sometimes, okay, experience middle schools. It's part of this story, and I think we like romanticize that a little bit. Yeah, yeah, we all want to be them, but exactly. Yeah, okay,

I keep saying this in every light. Every time we get an email from a younger listener, I'm like, you know, yeah, when I remember when we had my middle school girlfriend on the podcast as a guest, Carmel. She was my high school girlfriend. I did a girl named Carmel. It wasn't that weird, No, it is weird. I don't think I've ever met anyone with her. Her sister's name was River. They were an interesting family. But I was gonna say we had my middle school girlfriend from fifth and sixth grade, Zoe.

I would never date her again, not because she's not a great girl. You're just different people. We've grown apart. Yeah, I don't know. I would maybe date my first kiss. Oh we need to get this guy on the podcast. No, just like he's like a really great guy. I'm like, I'm proud that you were my first kiss. Like I'm probably you are, like, I'm I'm glad. It's really sweet. Have you re introduced yourself into dating world? Yeah, alright,

I'm sure. I'm sure Vans is an advocate for that, Like she says, you know, you need to date to be able to move on and get pasting all that kind of stuff. So well, and I think, like for me, it's not even like yeah, I just said it five

minutes ago. You're like, like I always say, just do, but no, I think like, for me, I learned a lot about myself through other people, through my interactions with people, Like when I'm on a date, like I'm reflecting on like who this person is, what are they bringing out in me? What are they projecting onto me? How am I seeing myself through who they see me? As? Like I'm doing all of this like internal work while also

balancing like being present. But you you learned so much, like when you're actively engaged in dating, you can learn so much about yourself and like and something. And that's like a little uncomfortable because you're putting yourself out there and being vulnerable, but it's also can be really exciting, like to lean into so as long as you're not on TV doing it. So you're saying, the best atmosphere

for you would be Paradise. Well that's the thing. Like I was talking Um actually shortly after the announcement demo to Mario. Um had sent me just like the sweetest voice message and literally had me crying, and he was just like, yeah, hey, like when you were on the beach, like let me tell you, like every guy there like was interested in you and like you have you are such an amazing, incredible woman like and was just really

the best like hype man I've ever had. I was just so supportive of like go out there, like you are so wonderful and you bring so much to the table. And so you guys, you guys had a demo and Adilo on Paradise last year and a Dino and a Dino you know Dil and Demo. That would be a great love tri um. So what's next? Whatnother? One more email? One more email, also from anonymous, and this is called Jared and Ashley situation. So Hi Dean, Vanessa and Jared

and Taylor. I'm coming at you with a situation that's similar to Jared and Ashley's, minus the whole TV show aspect of course. In high school, I worked with this guy for two years and we've always had an awkward but good chemistry and have been good friends. Our co workers would make comments to us about liking each other, and we went on one date. It was good, but we both had to go separate ways pretty soon after

when we started college. I still have feelings for him and care about him, but it's never held me back from seeing other people. Fast forward to a couple of months ago. We had a work party that we both attended and we ended up hooking up. We still talk sometimes, but I think he may be back with his girlfriend now. It's always so natural when we talk, and I feel

like there's still some potential they're worth pursuing. I really care about him and think there's something, but I want to know if I'm holding onto something that doesn't even exist. What would you guys do in this situation? Help by secondating on start dating other people? Yes, I agree. I also love to preface this. I don't think I have I don't think that's similar to model her mom. It

was like long time coming. That could make sense. Um, so you guys hooked up only a couple of months ago, and now it might he might be dating his ex girlfriend. She's reading so much into it, and she's just clinging onto something that's not agree. It's not even that, this isn't even a hard one. You just need you need to forget about it. Yeah, I think you got to move on from this guy. It's just it was a one time thing. It sounds like. See, I'm like, are

we sure he's back with his girlfriend? I think that if the universe is meant to bring them together, it will. It did at this work party. Okay, well, if it's not to bring them back together, it will. But clearly something's not clicking, and because of that, she just needs to freaking move on to the next thing. Just because it feels raw and real and right doesn't mean that you're not going to get that feeling and experience with

someone else tomorrow. I mean, listen that you guys dig the universe brought you back together when you guys hooked up and Dart stopped giving her false hope. Know what I'm saying, Keep doing what you're saying, keep saying he keep going there. Uh, And so I think at this point, yeah, it's probably best if you move on and not think about this guy, not stalk, you know, because obviously if you think he's back with his ex girlfriend, you might be looking on his Instagram a little bit, you know.

And it's it's funny too, in these situations, when we know so little about someone that we're interested in, we're able to fill in the gaps and like the holes of who we think they are and who we want them to be, and like all we do is build them up and build them up and there, like oh this guy is this, this and this, and like the more you get to know them, the more they fill up themselves and the less interested you become. Totally, just move on, Dean. You shouldn't know what the hell pac

Man interesting? Alright. Anyways, that'll do it for this episode of Help I suck at daily. On that note, um, big Thank you to Lionel Richie for the stud in Las Vegas. Be sure to check them out. All the hits Las Vegas residency will be there in October, but he has tickets for August and October available. Go check him out. We're gonna have to go check him out. Big thank you to Taylor Nolan for being in studio with us today. Yeah, no, thank you so much for

coming in opening up. Be sure to check out her podcast, Let's talk about It. She's probably gonna have some pretty great guests here pretty soon. You know, she's in l A. She's got a lot of friends that live here, and you're gonna come on, Oh, I'm gonna be on wondering where this is going. Be sure to check it out. Um, and obviously always thank you to East America and Vanessa for calling in. You're in New York right now? Vanessa, right, I'm in New York. Yeah, Well, have fun out there.

We hope to see in studio pretty soon. And um, thank you everyone for listening to this week's episode of Help I Suck At Dating. Maybe next week we'll suck a little bit less. Follow help by Suck at Dating with Dean, Vanessa and Jared on I Heart Radio or wherever you listen to podcast