#14 Breaking Up is Hard to Do

like this is gonna be a good show. Because Tanya's here, we don't have to worry about anything normally. Come in here like very nervous and anxious, uncertain really about what I'm going to talk about, Uncertain if I'm going to be able to give advice and if I do, if it's gonna be good advice. But for some reason, when I walk into the studio and Tanya sits next to me, I have this level of comfortability that's unmatched otherwise nice, so nice, and I don't Oh my god, I don't

know what it is. And I think that it's just because you're so confident in yourself and your opinions, and it's nice to have someone that can um kind of fire it back just as quickly, and I don't know, it's just it's very comforting. It's nice to have you here. There's not a radio show or a podcast in the world that wouldn't be more entertaining with Tanya. I fully believe that as well. Yeah, Eastern, do you want to compliment?

Not only does Tanya bring an air of confidence and excitement to the show, she's just a ray of beauty. Oh wow, thank you guys so much. I'm gonna take that and just replay it for every day. I feel sad now, thank you. And now the studio smells like kimwa and green beans. I tend to add my smell everywhere I go, which is who can blame you? All right? So for this week's episode, we're going to be talking pretty much exclusively about breakups, how to do them, how

not to do them, why to do them? Well, we got into this a little bit last week towards the end when you and Becca stopped by. We said, if you're long distance, let's say long distance like a plane ride away, do you fly to them to break up with because it seems extreme, and I think the conclusion that we drew from that was depending on how long the relationship was, depending how ingrained you two are with

each other, that it all kind of depends. But I think more often than not, it's you can owe it to that person to be in person with them while you're breaking up with And that's a conclusion that we drew last week, and so this week we're going to just kind of expand upon that a little bit more. And I think that this topic kind of stems a little bit from the episode of The Bachelor that we watched this week with Ari and um, he kind of awkwardly ends it a little bit with with some of them.

I think that he initially ends it with what is her name? Lauren s at the vineyard and NAPA, and then he sends Anally's home, and um, yeah, we just decided to kind of stem from that a little bit. But I got we got this email from Kate actually about this very topic. Nice she'd like to weigh in love the podcast. I found this week's topic about long distance travel for breakups particularly interesting because I have firsthand experience with this. Well. I didn't live across the country

from my then boyfriend. We were three hours up by car, and things have been rocking for the last month of our two year relationship. I remember vividly one Wednesday morning, after a particularly bad fight over the phone, he asked if he can come visit me on Friday. I was supposed to be the one driving down there, so him asking to switch the plants put an uneasy pit in my stomach. I asked him, right then, are we okay?

He said, yeah, but I want to talk. I knew in my heart that he was making the trip to break up with me, and to be honest, I think it would have been easier on me if he had just done it on the phone and stayed with the anxiety. It broke my heart when you walked out the door for the last time. I have a suspicion that most people who are about to break up have some idea that it's coming, and my experience prolonging the process by making a long trip in an ordeal out of it

causes more heartache than it does. Good m that's Caitlin Tanya. I agree with her. I do think that like there is like a little bit of a hunch, like you feel like it's coming. But um, I'm just speaking from personal experience. I feel like you guess, I don't know how long did you say how long they were together? Two years? I feel like you owe it to that person to do it to face to face and not just me personally. I agree. I met someone yesterday, a

friend of a friend. We basically it was like all three of us just went and got coffee and Jacob beer, and she was telling me how she just ended her three year relationship with her boyfriend, like two weeks ago, the very first day of the year, and how she woke up in the morning realized that she didn't want to be with her boyfriend anymore, her boyfriend of three years, and then they literally spent the entire day together, essentially breaking up with each other, closing that door, and like

allowing themselves to move on. It's still a little bit different because one of them didn't travel together. There's location, But it's like, I think that the best way to break up with someone, and I'm horrible at breaking up with someone. I think that reason number eight thousand, five hundred twenty seven that I'm not the Bachelor is because I wouldn't be able to break up with twenty eight women.

It's just it's awful every time. No matter what, and what she was telling me was that she had such a a certain level of closure that she's never had before because of kind of that prolonged breakup, and it just I feel like that she benefited from that. And so I think that anytime you're able to like meet that person face to face, kind of discuss why it didn't work out, kind of have that post mortem right away, then it allows you to close that door and open another,

like a day together breaking up. And I'll admit when she was telling me the story, I was like, this is kind of weird. She was like, we didn't like cook up. There was no like physical spark at all while we were breaking up. It was basically just like us kind of going through the relationship, understanding why it didn't work. And it's like a grand finale, the season finale of her relationship. And it seems like a very

mature way to break up with someone. And I think that we all kind of strive for that level of maturity, especially in the breakups, because that's kind of often when we see ourselves, um the most I guess immature, most volatile, emotionally, whatever it is. So if you're able to kind of go through that process and and on good terms while still closing the door and like hoping the best for

the next for the other person. And that's like a very mature and I think even like if you're not in like a long serious relationship and you break up with somebody over the phone, Like I was kind of dating a guy and he had lived in New York, and so it was kind of like it was never we were never an official relationship, but we would every time we would see each other. He flew out here for work a while I was out there, we would, you know, would be like we were dating and I'll

never forget. He called me, and I like just knew. I knew something was weird, and he kind of ended things over the phone, but in such a mature way. He was like, I met somebody out she lives in New York, and I really want to give it a shot. And it's nothing against you. Was never gonna you know, I mean, it was just so such a mature way of like ending it that I was like, and they had no hard feelings yet it sucked and I cried

and I was sad, but there was no UM. I don't know, I think like I just I respect him so much, and I wish that everybody could like take a note from from him, because you know, we always like try and like either like not ghost but like try and just like you know, oh, maybe if I stopped hanging out with her as much or maybe you know what I mean, like try and just go the easy way out of things, and if we were all just more upfront and honest with each other, I think

it would make the healing process a lot better for everybody. I was gonna share this story last week. It doesn't it wasn't me personally, but a friend of mine was dating this guy in New York for probably four or five or six months, so similar to your that dating experience. And I think we had gotten lunch, maybe like back in October November or something like that, and I was talking to her about it, and she was telling me about how, you know, like enthralled with this guy she is,

and how much she likes him and appreciates him. He was like a firefighter in New York or something like that, um, and how happy she was. And then all of a sudden, she like saw on one of her friends Instagram's a video of this other guy who she's always like known and admired, and then she saw the video and she was like, all of a sudden, something snapped inside of her and was like, that's my husband right there, like a completely different guy. And apparently she goes to d

M him. He had already sent her a d M from like two years ago or something like that. They somehow initiated conversation, begin to FaceTime, and the second they start facetiming each other, she's like even more convince It's like this is her husband, and he's convinced that she is his wife. And then so they like they have this like two week relationship where they haven't really met each other face to face, but they've been talking every day via FaceTime, via text, all that kind of stuff.

And he lives in Los Angeles while she lives in New York and heard the girl that the god she's dating still lives in New York. And they decide that the guy that she just has been facetiming decides that she wants he wants to come to New York to visit her, And so she goes to the guy that she has been you know, dating whatever in New York and says, hey, similar to you, Like, Hey, there's this other guy that I feel this like on definable spark with.

And while I appreciate everything that you and I had and everything you've done for me, I think that I

would owe it to myself to explore this. And so even when I talked to her last, I talked to her maybe like a month ago, and she was like, yeah, even the the guy that I was dating in New York before, I'm this guy that I'm dating now, Like he'll check in on me every once in a while, and like he handled it very maturely because we were able to end things so amicably and he's like very supportive of this new relationship that I have and I

don't know. Like that again, a kind of an interesting story and maybe not necessarily applies to this topic, but it's just weird how when you end things so maturely like that, it kind of allows you to um grow and move on. And so there's a lesson there because

no one wants to do it. We're all nervous about doing it, but maybe if you're just as honest as you can possibly be, there's a path to no hard feelings or like more closure, so that you're not like in this perpetual pattern of pain, right, Because isn't it better to make said that before? Yeah, the perpetual pattern of pain? Yeah, I tend to do it to myself. It's better to leave them sad than to leave them bitter, angry and question marks and question mark right, like when

you just get ghosted. Ashley is on the phone, Dean. Well, so it's nice about this episode before we jump on this phone call with Ashley is. Ashley is a friend of all of us in the in the studio here, and she I don't know if we're gonna get into this with her specifically, but she just broke up with her boyfriend face to face. And then we're gonna call her other friend, Brittany, who broke up with her boyfriend over the phone, and so we're gonna kind of get

both of their experiences. We're gonna get Analysa's experience with the breakup on television, So we're gonna get a couple of different perspectives here, which would be nice. I like it, Actually, are you there, I'm here? What's up? Ash How are you? I'm good? How are you? I'm good? Thanks for taking the time to call in. I know we discussed a little bit the other day about kind of how all

of this was going to go. Um, but today we're talking about breakups and we know that you just got out of a long term relationship and we appreciate you calling in and talking a little bit about it. Of course, thanks for having me. I hope that your former boyfriend is not a listener to this podcast, or do we hope that he is. I really hope not either already of like his his girls, like friends that are girls,

because I know that they're this podcast so well. I think if they're listening out there, thank you for listening. That's all I can say. All right, So tell us a little bit more about it, can you guys? Can you give I guess the listeners a little bit of a background. I know that, um, I kind of filled them in. Like I said, you guys have been dating

for a little bit. And what we're really discussing today is maybe like the proper way to break up with someone or even just like experiences that we've had with breaking up with people, UM, so that other people can kind of learn from it. Yeah, I think that it all just depends. Like our relationship was long distance. So I think that when you're dating someone for you know, X amounts of years, then I guess the proper way to do it is to like tell them to their face.

But I don't want to be broken up to the like in front of I don't know if like face to face. That's so nerve wracking because at the end of the day, you can't change it, right, It's like you're not going to change their mind or convince them otherwise. So I guess it's some type of closure thing. How did you and your boyfriend break up? Because I thought you guys did break up face to face? We did.

We did, which is why I was like really nervous, and I initially wanted to do it over text, and then he kind of said, like no, I deserve like for you to sit down and do it face to face. But we were long distance, so the only way that I can do that is for me to drive three

a half hours to him and like slit there. And the sad part is he didn't let me leave after that, so like felt trapped and it was the most uncomfortable awkward thing because here he is like trying to convince me, like no, no, no, we're meant to be, like, this is what I could work on, Here's what I can do, here's what can change. It's like no, no, no, you don't understand. This is not not for me, Like this is me breaking up with you, and we just have

to like accept that and walk away. So I think that's the hardest part about breaking up with someone's in person is just like that awkward encounter of like seeing that person face to face and not being able to just like walk away or turn around when you can. And that's exactly what you're trying to avoid, was having him giving him the opportunity to kind of talk you out of it. It sounds like right right, right yeah, because at the I mean, at the end of the day,

you don't want to hurt anyone. It's never your intention to, you know, do that. And so I think that that was what fucking thing, But over text, I could all be avoided what He wouldn't let me leave his house. He literally was just like, no, just stay for one more hour. This is the last time I'm going to

see you. Then it was like no, just like sleep in the morning like the least, and I'm just like no, no, no, you don't understand, like this is goodbye forever, Like I hope that we can be friends one day, but this is just not working out, Like I don't have to say that like five different languages. I don't understand. But don't you think that after the three year relationship that you guys had, you did kind of owe it to

him to have it face to face? And I'm glad that you didn't do it over text, and I'm sure that he's glad, and maybe in hindsight you might be as well. Or do you still feel like you wish you had done it over text over the phone? No, I think face to face definitely brings closure, and it's it kind of steals the deal. As as sad and heartbreaking as it is, you do oh that to your person because if you think about it, you spent however many years with someone and they kind of get this

part of you and a part of your heart. I guess, and I don't know that those are experiences that you kind of will ever get back and hopefully ones that you can cherish unless something horrible happened, you know, if someone cheated or you know, whatever, But if it ends on a healthy out and face to face isok good.

It does bring closure, and at the end of the day, it kind of it's a heartbreak face to face, and you know, feelings are hurt, but they're able to kind of move on and figure out like, Okay, I guess this is it. Now onto the next chapter of my life. And what was the reason for you, guys any of the relationship. I think the long distance was the hardest part.

And when you're young, you know, in twenty three, so it's kind of you're just figuring out this stage of your life with your career and like post college and figuring out your friends and living in like a new city. And I think that you kind of have to discover yourself before you try and love somebody else, because how do you love someone else if you don't love yourself yet? And I think that the like the most difficult decision to make and to kind of recognize. And we had

an adult conversation about it, which was amazing. And that was pretty recent, wasn't it. Yeah, that was pretty recent. He's awesome, He's incredible. It just it never works out to what you wanted to in long distance is so tough, Like I don't know how people do international long distance or let alone, like with another state. He lived in the same state as me, just you know, four hours or and a half four hours away, and it was

still very difficult. Granted he like traveled the world for her like him, But do you do you kind of look at it like this, like if so so you guys ended things on a good note or at least on a positive as positive as it possibly could be to allow you and him to kind of have the time to work on yourselves. Do you kind of like that because it enables you or gives you the opportunity to maybe circle back in, you know, five six years after you're able to kind of focus on yourself a

little bit. Or is it something where once you've broken up someone, there's no interest ever getting back with that person again. No, I always leave that door open. It depends it depends on like it depends on who it is. Like with this guy, for sure, I can definitely see myself like being with him, and you know, however many years and but with another guy that I've dated, I dated for like five months or you know whatever, I

could never picture my fis like that breakup. I will never go back to that only we can only be friends. But there's probably one guy that I can say that with, and that's probably this guy, the one we're talking. The interesting thing about it, too, is once you begin to work on yourself a little bit more and focus on yourself, you could be a completely different person in the next four or five years. And it might just be moved anyways.

But yeah, no, definitely, I don't even feel like I'm the same person I was three years ago when we first met, So it would just every I feel like you're constantly involving and hopefully you change with your person. But sometimes you guys aren't on the same pace and you go at different speeds, and that's okay when you're when you're young, it doesn't matter what how old you are. You need to discover yourself first and then circle back

when the time is right. That's interesting that because that touches a lot of what we've talked about just recently, is the long distance, the breaking up face to face over the instead of over the phone, all that kind of stuff. So that pretty much covers everything that we talked about just lately, Um, And how are you doing

now with everything? You guys don't talk anymore? You're kind of completely severe communication or we kind of cut it off till cold Turkey in the beginning, and now we're actually friends, which is amazing, and um, I'm seeing him for dinner to night to rekindle the romance or just too it might be a little too soon, I think ash to be honest, I know I think so too.

But we we had another adult conversation about it and just said like, hey, we were best friends before we were even lovers, and so that kind of takes precedent of what we can rekindle before we can build into our relationship. He's not going to let you leave the restaurant. I know. That's why I'm going to be in a public setting that way, I could screen help just in case that's not bad. Tany is over here shaking her head.

I just I feel I just feel like he'll get his hopes up thinking like he's going to be able to win you back over. And that's how what I think. I think He's just trying to guy who thinks you can win you back over. That's why he wanted you to stay at his house all that long. He thought, if you stay longer, he's got a shot until you

walk out the door. He still got to and now he really has had some time to like give the reasons why he thinks you guys should stay together, and he can really explain it over a nice meal and some wine. Meal to him as the door opening a crack. Yeah, this is him courting me tonight. Yes, basically, is this a bad idea? Should I fail? Yes? No? Am I going to have to do to break up all over again today? I feel I think it's going to feel like that. Yeah, I think I'm going to do the

text one tonight, probably to bail. If you do what I'm going through with it, just make sure you keep everything very light. I would say, you know, don't talk about like the past relationship, don't talk about I don't know, don't don't allow that door to reopen just yet at the very least, But maintain that friendship if you guys were friends beforehand. And that's only if you do decide to go through with it again. Tanya advises not to. But you obviously know yourself in the relationship a little

bit better than we do. Yeah, we agreed to like not talked about the past, and we agreed to just talk about the people that we are right now and moving forward, and hopefully that he's on the same page as me. I guess well, I guess we'll see. We'll have to circle back with you and see how it all goes. But actually, thank you so much for calling in and sharing that with us. Of course, thanks for having me, thanks to the advice. Yeah, we'll talk to you.

Let's follow up with that, Okay, good luck. Bye. So next up we have Ashley's perspective of breaking up face to face. I don't really know how well it's going for her if she's getting dinner with her ex boyfriends tonight. But next up we have Brittany, who's also a friend of the podcast, who, on the contrary to that, has broken up with someone recently over text. So let's see what she has to say. Brett, are you there? Hi? Guys, Hey,

how are you good? How are you good? So we just had Ashley on the phone, obviously, you know Ashley, Um, she was just telling us about how she broke up with her boyfriend face to face. Listen a little bit more about your situation. So I think we talked about a little bit about this the other day, and you broke up with someone over text, so we want to hear kind of your side on things and why you did it that way and what the pros and cons to it are. I guess yeah, well I was going

to do it face to face. I felt like I kind of owed that to him, but um, we were texting one night and he kind of prompted me and like opened up a door for me to go ahead and just do it through text, Like he was like, I can tell you've been off, Like is there something going on? Is everything okay between us? And so instead of just being like yeah, it's fine and like waiting to do it in person, I just thought I should do it right then. So I did, and it was

definitely I a lot. It was really harder doing doing it over a text because he didn't like quite get it, and it took me three hours to explain to him, like until he finally was like, okay, we're done, Like I get it, just breaking up with me. But I was just like trying to be nice about it, I think, and then through text it's just really hard to communicate and I personally would not do it over a text again.

Can you give us a little bit of backstory? How long were you too, like dating for how serious were you guys all that kind of stuff. We were dating for three months, Um, I mean we weren't dating anyone else, so we were pretty serious. Uh. He did live a little bit over an hour away, so it was in those three months. I think we saw each other like between ten to twelve times, so that's a lot of times. It's like four times a month, once a week. Yeah. Yeah,

we tried to make it work. Um, and then I think that he was just moving a lot faster than I wasn't it. And I just wanted to be honest with him and break it up when he gave me

the opportunity to. And so you were saying you were planning on doing it face to face, but once the door or once the window of opportunity to do it via tex was open, I can see how you You you kind of like get fed up almost where you're like, all right, well, if you're gonna give me this opportunity, m as well just strike while it can and and just take care of it. It was such a weight off my shoulders to like once that happened. How long ago was this? This was the day before Christmas Eve?

So Christmas Eve Eve, Yes exactly, but I also felt bad about doing it. Then. I wanted to wait till after the holidays, but I couldn't do it. Was he heartbroken? Did he not handle it well? I know it took three hours to convince him. He did not handle it well at all. I felt so bad. I still get like the weekly text being like if I want to meet up and like try to figure out like a common ground between the two of us. But I think

it's done on my end at least. Wait, breat Can we talk about this for a second, because you told me the story not too long ago. Can we can we dive a little bit deeper? Or do you wanted to leave it at that? Yeah, we can dive deeper. Well, not necessarily deeper, but I just want to share. Can you can we share? Um? Maybe? Because that was the holiday season? Right? So how did the how did the breakup fold unfold? I guess more specifically because there was a piece of that that you're leaving out if I

remember correctly, Wait, like before, like the day before it happened. Well, I'm just saying in the spirit. He was very much in the spirit of Christmas. He was like every date he would bring me a gift. Um. And then for the date like before Christmas, he picked me up and

we were going to go to your show. And he picked me up and when I got into his car, he like reached into the back feet and had a basket of about I don't know, like ten of fifteen gifts wrapped in Christmas wrap, and I mixed CD in there, and I literally had nothing for him, Like I had no idea we were doing Christmas gifts or that we were ever going to do that. And so do you think that kind of prompted the breakup or would you

did you already have that in mind a little bit? Um, It definitely you know, encouraged me to do it because he was way more into it, and it freaked me out that he did all that. So yeah, definitely had a um, definite key and that break up. And I think it's safe to say that you kept kept all the gifts as you should. I mean I had already opened up one of the bottles of wine that were

in there, so I couldn't give that back anyways. Yeah, and once you once you crack up in the first bottle, I mean you might as well to keep everything else well, I think that the lesson and the takeaway from this is kind of what we've been saying consistently as well as I mean, they did it for three months, and I think that three months is an appropriate amount of time to be able to break up with someone over text, um, Brittany, as you know, we just said Ashley on the phone,

and she said that they were dating for three years, and I think that breaking up with someone over text of three years is a little bit different than three months. I agree, all right, Well, it's nice to have that perspective. How are things now? He you said, he still texts you every once in a while to see how you're doing. He does, Yeah, I just um, I put on my red receipts so that he knows I see them, and I'm responding, that's actually so good. That's so good. Britney

is a savage. It's so good. I love turning on yours just to rub it in their. Is it red receipts or read receipts? I say read receipts, Well it means they read it, but well they are spelled. The same works for both. I'm going to stick with read read receipts, all right, all right, Brittany, Well, thank you so much for sharing that with us, and um, I mean, good luck with everything. I know that, like you said,

he reaches out all the time. So maybe maybe he'll convince you one way or the other to kind of continue dating. And we'll see. Yeah, we'll see about that. We'll see. Well, good luck, enjoy your wine, enjoy all your gifts, and talk to you soon. All right, what's the ground? I know it just hurts me. I like sympathize with the person getting broken up with because I'm just always the one getting broken up with, so my heart hurts for the other party. And because in life

there are dumpers and there are dumpies pretty persistently. You're a dumpy. I'm a dumpy. I would wady rather be a dumpy than a dumper. But what have you been historically the dumper? Yeah? I think I think it's a healthy mixture of both. Have been dumped a bit, okay, But I've deserved to be dumped whenever I get dumped. I'm not going to deny that. Like when you get dumped, do you think you deserve to be dumped? Nos? Dump?

But like like for the for Ashley, our first caller when she said that her boyfriend wanted to have dinner. They want to get dinner. I can sympathize with him because I was after my three year relationship. I just wanted anything like any little crack, like we kept a friendship and that kept me hopeful that we'd get back together. And when I found out that that wasn't going to happen, I basically just said, we cannot speak anymore because it's

given keep like keeping the hope alive. Actually, these guys literally rehearsing all of the things dinner tonight to try to win her heart. Yeah, and that hurts my heart. I feel for him, like I that's why I told her not to go, because for him it's better. Yeah,

that's a tough one. I think that the only way that I can relate to that story from Ashley's ex boyfriend's perspective is there was a girl that I did in college who I was obsessed with us even after we broke up, Like I constantly tried to like, let's get dinner, Let's like at least meet up and have a conversation, and she did a very good job of shutting me out and not allowing that to happen, but like once every nine months to a year she would be like, all right, let's go talk about things over

lunch or something like that, or like we'd see each other at a party and like we would have this long, you know, heartfelt conversation. And all that does for me is like reopen up a potential avenue for us to get back together. When she's clearly shut that possibility out of her mind, regardless of what said or what happens, like that's not a possibility for her anymore. But I continue to kind of cling onto that possible, um, and that only just leads to hurting a little bit more pains.

So I understand what she's saying. Um, Yeah, I don't know. It's definitely as the dumpy, I can see the appeal of getting dinner, But as the dumper, it should almost be like no tany when you you were blindsided the big one, the big breakup that was face to face, that was a via FaceTime. FaceTime. I think FaceTime is the bridge between phone calls and well, yeah, I mean phone calls nowadays are so rare that it is almost

more personal than it used to be. You know, it's a step up from text, but I don't know, I don't mind the phone called breakup of its long distance. But so he was in another state FaceTime. You did not see it coming. Did you vomited literally vomited? Did you get an inkling? Did you start to get nauses as you kind of felt, are we heading down this road right now? No idea? Until he said it, you

had no idea, no idea. But then after he after it happened, I was like going back in the weeks prior and like he was being like wishy washy about making plans for like holiday weekends and like things like that. That was like, how did I not see this? It was August four years and you did vomit, vomited and then well, well yeah, I put it down. I went and vomited, and then I had grab my whole family

was in town because it was my dad's birthday. So I grabbed my sister because I kind of blacked out, like I wasn't like seeing straight, Like I was not blacked out, but like I just knew that four years into a relationship. So I grabbed my sister, and I had my sister stand on the other side of my phone so she could hear everything he was saying so that she could like tell me after the fact, because I knew that I would just wasn't going to hear

anything he was saying. It was very traumatic. Okay, well, let's let's go back to that for a second. Then, how do you think for our listener's sake, do you think that there's a way that he could have handled it better or you could have handled it better had he saw you in person, or it had you done it over a text. How would you have preferred that to go down? Obviously knowing that the breakup was going to happen in hindsight, right, how do you wish he

went about it? If? I guess there's like no perfect there's no perfect science to it. Um. I I wish that I would have maybe had a little of a heads up, but this was coming, like you know what I mean, maybe lobbying a text saying hey, things, I really needed to talk about things. Things aren't going great, Like can we talk, like maybe just like a buffer text and so I know that something's coming. Like I

feel like being blindsided completely is like a lot. And um, I don't know if being in person would have helped at the time, I was like, what an whole He didn't fly out to do this, but I don't know if that would have helped in hindsight, what was his reason? That's a whole. We don't need to get into it. The family stuff is do you think was the like family religion? Oh, I think you talked about this with Becca last Yeah, sub in with Becca Tilly. If you don't listen to that podcas us to be sure to

tune in. Yeah, yeah, it was. It was a lot. It was big, bigger issues that um and you think those are real, right? That was just an excuse totally, yes. And there was a lot of like he had health issues in the family that I think was like kind of just making making everything like more intense in his life. Does that make sense? Making decisions like okay, I need to like do this and he's married now, he's married now? When he when he dropped the bomb on face time?

How long was it till the end of the conversation. It was pretty long. I think I was on the FaceTime for like maybe half an hour. I had a thing with a young lady who lived in Pennsylvania and I had to end it over the phone, and I called her and said, hey, I don't think things are going blah blah blah, and then she just said okay, bye, hung up. I did not speak to her clean break well. She goes okay by click and how are you guys

diating for like three months? Four months? Yeah? I think that, um, like when you're know, when somebody's explaining the reasons why, like and I think when you're so in love, you're blinded by things and you just think, like, oh, in due time, he'll come around, you know what I mean? Like who want to raise our kids this way? Or you know what I mean? Like, I think we kind of trick ourselves into thinking that your love is so

strong that it's going to beat all those things. Right if the stages you're in denial, this is not happening, he'll come around anger. How dare he? That? A whole bargaining? Right when I was like, oh, if I love to Arizona, I don't depression when it's starting to sink in acceptance and then you can move on. When are we going to get to that party right now? Acceptance of so bargaining? I know you're married, but Dean, what do you do

want to work out because you're looking good over there. Thanks. Thanks. Mark was commenting on your arms, uh bis and tries to be specific, that's biceps and triceps for those at home, for the lesser in fort the front arm, in the back arm. So one of my things is I focused solely on the glamour muscles, which are the bias that tries the chest and the and the apps. Um. But it's it's everyone, you know, it's kind of sets resolutions for themselves to to eat healthier, go to the gym more.

And you see a reflection of that when you try and go to the gym, you'll see, you know, the gym's packed like, uh, like a can of sardines. You can't really use any of the machines you want, you can't use any the weights you want, a lot of things are missing. You really have to wait your turn, and it's not really conducive to getting as in shape as you want. So one best, one great way to

curb that is just to work out at home. And me specifically, I have issues with like I'll tell myself all day that I'm gonna go to the gym later at night, and then I just don't want to go through the process of getting to the gym. So it's nice about Beach Body is you don't have to go through the process of getting to the gym or going to the yoga studio or going to the workout class because you can just do it in your home, on your Apple TV, on your real coup whatever it is.

UM Essentially, what you do is is they have all these different workouts designed for you for whatever mood you're in. If you want to have just a relaxed cardio or relaxed yoga, you can do that. If you want to um Tutania's point, if you want to go all out forty five minutes, they have that as well. So they have like under thirty minute workouts, dance workouts, extreme result workouts, low impact cardio, all this stuff that's really going to

be suitable for exactly what you're looking for. And the best part about it is that it's in your own home, so you don't have to wait around for a machine. You don't have to be worried about being embarrassed in

front of people. I sometimes worry that people are like looking at me, and you know they're not you know they're not looking at you, but you still have this weird feeling that they are UM and sometimes you know what, if you're feeling good after you maybe use Beach Body for a little bit, then you can go to the gym and show everyone the new results that you've been

working on. UM. You know what this is also genius is if you have a workout DVD at home, it gets so monotonous to do the exact same DVD every day because you just have to memorize every little thing that they say, and a person in the backs easy is at one point you remember exact because you memorize it. But there's so many that you can choose from on here. There's over six hundred different ones, different every day for what is that almost two years almost. They're always adding

new programs you can do to a day. They're always adding new programs. If you go on Beach Body, you can actually order some like resistance spans as well. So once you get used to the body way and moving around with all that stuff and you want to continue to improve, UM, you can jump on the website order resistance spans and and even more gear that they have

on there. And it's deeper than gym membership. I think that a lot of people these days are paying, you know, in the triple digits for for a monthly gym membership. I have some friends that pay like two a month for a gym membership, um, and it's just it's crazy to me. That's like four thousand dollars a year that they're spending just on a membership to go to a gym when you can do exactly that and even get better results at your home. And if you want to

try Beach Body, it's honestly, you're gonna see results. You're gonna be more motivated to work out because again, you don't have to travel to the gym, you're not gonna be worried about all the other people there. So if you text Dean to thirty thirty thirty that's d e A end to three zero three zero three zero, you're gonna get full access to the entire platform for free, which means all the workouts, all the nutrition information, which

we didn't mention, by the way, that's key. The nutrition information is also really an important part of this, right. It is huge because a lot of people think that just working out is enough and a lot of times you'll see results, but to see really the results that Easton has over here and has seen himself. You really need to be eating healthy as well. UM, so that's great that beach Body has that that nutritional information. Um again texting to thirty thirty thirty for beach Body on demand.

You can work out in the comfort of your own home. You can work out in the morning, at night, whenever you want. Um, it's on your own schedule. You're able to do it whenever you want to do it. Um, You're able to achieve the results that you want to achieve. You know, if you want to kind of ease yourself into it. They have workout routines for all that kind of stuff. And then once you want to start kicking,

but you're able to kind of kicking and overdrive. Everything should be on demand nowadays because it pretty much is right use on demand, podcast on demand, your TV shows around demand. Finally, this is a genius this idea. Finally, Finally, at what point are you going to be able to just like snap your fingers and your body will be exactly how you want? But until that day comes, beach

Body is the perfect way to go. Beach Body on Demand is the perfect avenue to pursue your workout goals and to get in shape like you've wanted to for all. And while we're on the subject of breakups and how awkward they can be, we have a very special guest in studio today, an Alice, who was on this season of The Bachelor with Ari. We just watched your episode and her and Ari how to split, and we're excited to have her in here and talk a little bit

more about it. Hi, Alice, how are you? Thank you so much for coming and joining me Antonia and Mark and Easton. Of course you're a regular at this point. This is to day two in around I'm like, finally maybe getting a ban of it. I don't know, it feels really weird, like having headphones on and talking into Yeah, I'm I've done this for however many months, and I still don't have the hang of it at all. But it's a slow and steady maturation process. Here we are.

So we talked a little bit the other day about this, and we talked to some callers earlier about breakups, and I guess it's great to have you in here because you had quite the interesting breakup on The Bachelor. Um, do you mind talking a little bit about that? Um no, not at all. Uh so, yes, it was the last last night. Sure, um it was an epic episode for me. Um so I I basically, Um, I had a moment with Ari where I put it out there that I

thought he should be the one to kiss me. I wanted him to like be a man and step up and make a move and uh and he was like, no, I don't think we're there yet. And so obviously that's always a really uncomfortable thing for somebody to say that, And um, I was slightly taken aback just because he had kissed everyone in the house at that point. So I kind of felt like, dude, really, like, you know, we're on a dating show, Like just maybe pretend to

like me a little bit. Um. I mean, I'm sort of glad at the end of the day because watching him kiss all the girls on TV, I'm actually glad that we didn't kiss. Uh. Well, so I don't. I've never really watched The Bachelor before, and you might find that surprising because I've been on three reality TV shows this year. I didn't watch Next season. I maybe watched like one episode of ben season, but nothing before that, and especially not like chronologically as the season's unfolded. And

have you been a fan of the franchise. I've sort of watched them on and off. I guess my question is, is this typical of a bachelor to have kissed? Because a he's kissing everyone and not just like pex, he's like full blown making out with everyone. Is this is this like par for the course? I think that's the thing, like you totally said it is that I think there have been bachelors in the past like kiss you know,

most of the girls, but not to the extent. I mean he is like slobbering all over their face and girls are mounting him. I mean it's like really intense already on episode three, And so what do you think?

So when he said that he didn't think that your relationship was there for a kiss, what do you think that the relationship was lacking that he had with However, basically every other cast member at that point, Well, so, I mean from the get go, I sort of felt that our chemistry was lacking and uh, and I just

felt like for me, I was a nervous wreck. I felt really anxious and I sort of needed him to just like give me that moment to be like no, I am interested in you, and maybe it would have kind of calmed my nerves a little bit just to have him leaning for a kiss, and and you know I would have been like, Okay, yeah, this is not so bad. Um, he actually is interested. But because we didn't have that chemistry, you know, it wasn't gonna happen.

I just kept thinking because for me personally, I've had relationships where sometimes it's not until like the fifth date that you're kind of like, oh, actually I like this guy. Um, So I was like, you know, this could grow, it could develop. Also, there are times that sometimes you kissed someone and then you're like WHOA. I was not expecting to have those feelings come up, and I was thinking, well, you know what if we kissed, maybe that could happen

with us. So I was actually I was. I think I was most disappointed at night with his reaction to it, because I felt like he wasn't even giving me any sort of chance, right, And that was the most disappointing thing. I was talking about this a little bit earlier with Ashley. I about because you didn't necessarily ask him for a kiss. You asked, how did that conversation go? You asked him

if he was going to kiss you or something like that. Right, Yeah, I said something to the effect of, like I've heard in the house that most of the girls are saying they have to be the one to make the first move, and I just feel like it would be really nice for you to make that move and kiss me first. And then he said what he said, it reminds me of on my season when Fred asked Rachel. It's it's different,

but it's somewhat similar. If I think Fred asked Rachel if you could have a kiss, and I feel like that's kind of I don't know, I'm trying to think of the phrase. I know there's a very specific phrase for it's kind of almost like an achilles healed relationship is like when you have to not have to, but when you bring up that, it kind of makes it.

It kind of makes it almost too awkward to overcome from that point, right right, And like the fact that he didn't want to, not maybe he's not even that he didn't want to, but the fact that he didn't make that move earlier on to establish that chemistry, it kind of forced your hand to to kind of even create a little bit more awkwardness to be like, well, what the hell are you doing? Are you gonna kiss me?

Or you're gonna kiss me, especially when you're making out with all of my friends over here, you know, um, and so that's challenging. So do you think that aside from that, do you think that if you were to go back, you could have handled anything differently? Or would you Are you kind of happy with head unfolded? I know, like obviously, Um, it was still pretty early on. It was like week two or week three or something like that, so you didn't really give you a whole lot of

times to develop like feelings for him. Um, as great of a guy as you might be. But are you do you like wish you handled anything differently? Because again, like you said, if you guys can share a kiss, or maybe even if you were around for one more week,

it would have allowed the relationship to mature so much more. Right, And when I did pull him aside and talk to him at the end before I left, I I kind of was hoping that he was going to say, you know what, like, yeah, this I can see that this is really stressing you out, and it's a difficult situation. But things might get a little bit easier from here. It's not going to be as intense like some of the dates, and I'd really like for you to stick around just to get to know you a little bit better.

But he was just like, no, you know, uh, but I do feel like hindsight is is interesting, you know, after watching it all back. Like I said earlier, I am actually really glad I didn't kiss him. I I don't know what kind of grosses me out watching him kiss other girls, And not that I'm like jealous or anything. I'm just like, it's a lot of girls don't know if I don't know if i'd want to be one

of one of them. I'll be honest. When I was watching it the first time, because admittedly i've seen it twice already, when I was when I was watching it the first time and you guys were having that initial conversation, I was like, he's definitely gonna keep around for at least one more week to to see where the relationship

can go. But when he sent you home or I guess when you went home, I don't want to say that he sent you home, but when you went home, I was pretty shocked because I honestly thought that he was gonna, at the very least like be interested to see where one more week might lead you guys to. Yeah, I mean in that conversation too, it was it was a longer conversation that was that was cut down a bit, and he was like, I really love all these things about you, and um, you know, so I do feel

like he saw a lot in me. He just we

both knew that it wasn't there and uh. And I think he at that point he had already established some really really strong relationships, and I think that was also difficult because he he was having a hard time seeing past those And I think that was part of my problem being there too, is that I was I was seeing those relationships form and thinking like, Okay, he's already made up his mind, you know, and he's not even like I felt like his body language towards me, like

everything was just kind of not interested. So I really felt like I was trying so hard, and I'm like, why am I trying this hard for a guy that I'm I'm not even sure I'm into, right, because you haven't had the time to build that correction exactly. So do you think in the spirit of this conversation that we're having on this podcast, specifically the spirit of of breakups and how to go about them. Do you think

that there's anything that maybe he could have done? Because as a viewer, I was surprised to see it happen on the spot like that, um, instead of either at the road ceremony or stead of even just giving one more week, like giving it one more week. So do you think that there's something that he could have done differently that would have been better for you or for him, or for anything, or maybe even on your side? Um?

I mean for me personally, I'll just say that it was a huge kind of growing moment for me because I kept thinking that night I was really struggling with like do I confront him or not? And if I would have been at a party and there was a guy I was dating who was kind of like being aloof for acting the way he was, I would have just up and left, Like I wouldn't have said anything. I would have just left and then never talked to

him probably again. In this in this hypothetical situation, this boy that you're dating is not also making out with fourteen other groups, right, But that's the thing, Like I usually am a non confrontational person, Like I do not like to um to call somebody out on anything. So for me, like having to go up to him and actually say something to him took so much courage and so much uh strength from like on my part, just

because it's not how I usually act. So for me, I felt like that was actually it was a very it was a good moment, like to learn that about myself that I can do that. You know. Yeah, it's just like you guys have both been on the show,

so maybe you like get it more. But like I can't imagine dating somebody that you know is like how awkward to like be in a group of girls and having all these girls be like, oh, yeah, I kissed him it was good, or I made the move and just like talking, but you're talking about the same guy. Like I can't even date more than one person at a time. Same Like I just am not built that way, you know what. I think some people are really good at like having the burners and like, you know, doing

all that. It's so hard for me to do that. So like just imagining myself having a conversation with girls that I'm becoming friends with talking about the same guy and we're all making out with him, I would literally lose my marbles and not only that too, but coupled with the uncertainty or or kind of the understanding that your relationship isn't the strongest with him as the others are because my situation might be a little bit different.

I was woefully certain wrong. Might I ad that I that I had the strongest relationship out of all the guys? So when people have those conversations, I was like, Yeah, that's just you know, that doesn't matter. That's all semantics

at this point, because my relationship is the strongest. Um. But if you're if you don't necessarily feel as strongly about the relationship that you have, then I can definitely see why you would kind of need like a validation of the relationship to be like, hey, if this relationship is going to go any further, like I need this from you, and I want you to at least express physically that we're interested in each other and that there will be a potential for relationship moving forward. Um, it

was just really weird. I thought that kind of how it all unfolded, it was it was, I mean, it was a super uncomfortable, awkward evening yeah. I mean even living through it and then watching it back was probably even worse, but you know, it happened, it's done. I lived through it. I'm I definitely don't regret going on the show. I am so happy that I did not end up with all. I will just say, not that I think he's like a terrible guy or anythink he's

just not my person. And if I would have continued on the journey, I'm pretty sure I would have started to develop feelings just because of the environment thing in and so I actually think, you know, everything happens for a reason, and I'm glad that it all unfolded the way it did for me. Yeah. Yeah, Well, like we were saying, I think it was it was almost at that threshold too where you weren't there long enough to develop real feelings, but you were there for enough time

to at least like develop something. So any any more time spent there than you, like you said, you would have developed real feelings because of the environment. Whatever it is. Um, was there anything that I guess happened that we didn't see that. Maybe I didn't get aired that questions because there's always so much like obviously you're filming twenty four hours a day, seven days a week, for so long, but we only have two hours every Monday night to

see it. So is there anything that, like like a conversation or like anything like that that didn't get aired? I mean, I'm trying to think there were. There were things, but I don't know how interesting they are, how kind of I don't know if they add to the to the conversation at all. Um, Yeah, I know there are. Well,

I will tell you one really funny thing. So when I went out to to meet him that first time that night, I was walking out and a little frog jumped in front of me and I picked it up, like just a little you know wild No, no, sorry, Um, like that very last night that I left, there was just like right on the pathway walking out kind of by the pool, was a frog and it jumped in

front of me and I just picked it up. I was like, I don't know what I'm going to talk to him, you know about tonight, but I have this frog now, so I'm gonna make that something, you know, kiss the frog. So I actually that was like my line. When I walked up. I said something so stupid, but I said something like I've kissed a lot of frogs, and then I think, I don't know if I don't know if he caught that or anything. At the joke, he was just like, what is this girl doing? But

do you have no fear of frogs? Now off the ground? I saved a lizard from the pool too. I'm actually like a huge animal lover. I just you know, I just get nervous sometimes. You got your trick. Did you make any girlfriends? Like are there girls that you're going to keep in touch with? You think definitely, Yeah, there's a lot of girls in the house that I really

bonded with and I think are amazing. But again, like going back to dating one guy with all these girls, Like, I feel like it is kind of weird at the end of the day to be like, oh, guys, like if you did end up, if I ended up with Ari, I don't know if I could really be friends with some of those girls or any of those girls. It's

just so weird. So I don't know. I feel like I'll actually probably be able to stay friends with the girls but last longer on the show, just because they'll be like, we know, it's like we can hang out with her, we can invite her to our wedding us.

She's not going to be a threat. It takes a very comfortable person to be okay with like whoever wins right, whoever wins in quotes, whoever ends up with Ari has to be very comfortable in herself and in her relationship with him in order to maintain friendships with everyone else

from the cast. That's why when I look back at my inn, like Brian has done a tremendous job of being a very confident person in their relationship, like he is very wholehearted leaf wanting to maintain friendships with everyone from the season, and that's very I mean, it's it's you've got to give the guy props for that, Like, that's hard to do. I don't think I could do that, especially the final three that assuming everyone goes to a fantasy suite, like that's that's got And again we don't

know what happens in the fantasy suits. But um, I mean kudos to Brian and everyone else that's been through that and is able to maintain those friendships. Did you go to the fantasy suite? You didn't make it that far? Now, Okay, Okay, I really think I would totally lose my brain if I was on the Bachelor dating one guy with all because and I like get really close with Like I'm a girl's girl. So if I'm like in a house with however many girls, like they're gonna be my sisters

by the time I leave. Like that's just how I roll. I could not imagine like just all coming home and being like, how was your day, and I'd be like, it definitely was weird. I don't know, And I kind of I knew that going into it, and I knew like I'm probably going to be one of those people that loses my marbles or my brain or whatever, you know. But um, and I did a little bit. You know. I felt like if I wouldn't have left when I did, I would have had a full blown panic attack on

national television. I was like leading up to just because it is so hard and you're like seeing things and you're hearing things, and um, yeah, it's just it's hard not to always compare yourself. And I think for me that was like one of the hardest things was just being having like all my insecurities come out, because like when you're dating somebody in real life, there's the potential that they could be dating other people. But it's not in your face. You don't see it. You just it

just could happen, and it's like in your brain. But like to be actually seeing and hearing it every day would be well. Also, like to know that they're amazing women. That's the thing. If you're on a dating site and the guy that you think you're dating is dating other people. You don't know those girls, and you can make up these terrible stories in your head and right and be

like she's this terrible person. You know, he's gonna like me more anyways, whatever, But when you're living with those people, you're like, oh, gosh, she's amazing, or like you see you know, you see them in their bathing suits and you're like, oh, she's like her body is better than mine. Like you just pinpoint everything, and it does drive you a little bit crazy, those damn securities we talked earlier.

Time you get broken up with out of the blue after four year relationship breakups have been the theme so far. I got I was the victim of the rare triple ghosting with three girls in a row, ghost and me. Dean's done some dumping, had his heart broken. What about you more of the dumper or the dumpy outside of reality television. UM, I think it's been like a pretty

equal Yeah. I've definitely had my fair share of breakups, But most of the time I feel like what happens with me is I get the what I call is like being put on the leash, like it ends, but then I'm like on the leash for three or four years where they just sort of keep me on the back burner. Why is that? Um, I don't know. I mean the common thread I get from almost every guy date is like you're the girl I'm gonna marry, or you're the type of girl I want to marry, or

like you know those types of things. I think I'm not ready for you yet. I think that's the thing a lot of times is they think that they're ready and then they're like I'm not, and maybe she's ready and that scares them and so they just sort of like keep me around just in case. But I've had, I mean, I've had my affairship of bad breakups and just like crazy, um crazy stories. My uh my ex

actually met somebody on a plane. We were like talking about getting married literally the week before and then he met somebody on a plane coming back from England and now they're married. How long were you guys dating for? It was like about a year? Was it was like, you know, I was twenty nine, it was a serious relationship. He was like thirty years a long time. Yeah, has that affected your trust issues since then? Have you had

a relationship since then? You don't let your boyfriends fly anymore? Like more flying for you for ten minutes you can meet somebody. Yeah, no, it's actually so flying doesn't bother me, but New Year's bothers me. I feel like every time I've been in a serious relationship, it's like New Year's and then a couple of weeks, a couple of months afterwards,

they break up with me. Those are like the ones that have ended on their part, And I always feel like it's like something happened on New Year's, Like did

they cheat on me? I don't, I don't know, or like everyone has revelations like when a New yeark comes, we're like, Okay, I'm gonna do this this year, and they're but the stats to back that up, you know, cheating Monday is the Monday after the New Year is the most affair start that day, because once people get through the New Years is when they think, well I need something different in Okay, while we're on that topic, I was having I was thinking about this the other day.

I don't think I've had a Nearest kiss in nine years. Maybe maybe not nine, but maybe like seven or six or seven years, and just the New Yarest kiss. I don't honestly don't think I've had one in that amount of time. I don't want to get off subject, but this is just a realization I came to and I'm like, what's going on. I'm with you. I haven't either. What's said is that there's hundreds of people for both of you, really,

that would love to have a New Year's kiss. I just think that we put so much pressure on ourselves to be like, all right, at midnight, we gotta find someone that we can kiss. Yeah, and it's just like it just never happens for me. Never. Never. We're not all as lucky as you are. Mark. Yeah, twenty years run and hopefully we'll be so lucky. Yeah. Um, okay, So how does this I guess break up with Ari rank on your list of breakups? Um? I think it's probably like a seven no, no, but like like maybe

like worst breakup versus breakup. Yeah, so we'll worst breakup. Um. Yeah, so he's probably like the middle of the pack somewhere. Yeah, probably like middle ish. I've definitely had worse. I feel like the thing that was the worst part of it was that it was televised on national television. Yeah and so, and because the entire conversation wasn't aired, you know, I

mean that maybe is good and bad. I don't know, um, but there were probably other pieces in there that were would have been compelling for people to see, you know, just to see like what the whole conversation was and like how it really came came to that, um to me being like Okay, I'm gonna I'm gonna go. Then, you know, not story critical for him, but maybe story critical for your breakup, if if that makes sense. Yeah.

And also just I mean for my own my own brain to be like, guys, it was it wasn't that bad. You know, it maybe looked really bad, but but it really wasn't that bad. I when I left, I actually, um, so this is actually something they didn't air. So when I left, he walked me out, and then a couple of the girls like burst through the gate and they were like, they told us we couldn't come out here,

but we're not letting you leave without saying goodbye. And then and then that's when the water works really started. That's when I just started bawling because it was I mean, it's like you do You're living in a house with these people, and those are the closest relationships that you form. Especial say that early on, and so that was actually like more of my breakup story was like leaving all of them. That seems to be a trend because in the week prior's episode, that girl left and she said,

I'm not sad to be saying goodbye to you. I'm sad because I'm saying goodbye to all my friends in the house. Right. I wonder if that's going to be a continuous thing. That's sort of how I felt that last night too. I kept really I was having like an inner battle, like do I say something? Do I not? Because I felt like if I didn't say something, I'm like you had thought maybe I'd be safe for another week or two, but I was like, Okay, I've already

made friends. I don't need the show to travel, So what like, why am I really here for this guy that I'm like, I don't really know if I'm into him, you know, and he's definitely not into me. So I'm like, what's the point. But let's say in this type, let's make a hypothetical scenario up just for the sake of it. Let's say we got to the Let's say we got to near the end, maybe not like Final one, but

final four. You could see yourself at least being open to that, right, I mean, It's it's difficult because you only know him for two weeks however long it was, but you still went into it knowing that A was about slat, knowing that there was a real possibility at whatever type of relationship that you guys could have had. Yeah, I mean, and I was really hoping that there would have been chemistry and that we would have had a

lot more in common. But uh, I think if it would have gotten to that that point where I was like final four something, I would have uh seen a different side of him, Like when I watched Crystal's date back where they went to his hometown and they were watching those hometown videos. I actually I think I was like one of the only people that was jealous of that date watching it back, because people are like that

was so awkward and so weird. But I felt like she got to see a different side of him, and he really had to let his hair down because he was being shown. He was showing himself in a very very vulnerable way. And um and I do think that it was probably easier for their relationship to form then because he had already been kind of yeah, just he

he had been exposed to her, you know. So if I had been like Final four, I would have hoped that I got to the point where I saw like more desponsive humor or like saw him let that guard down. But I really didn't feel like he was very warm and fuzzy, especially in those couple of first weeks. I don't know if it was he wasn't comfortable or what, but I think it's probably just a matter of being spread so thin with all the all the girls, they're

having the same conversations. I mean, I can only imagine how's difficult to be. But so, so what do we are we going to see more from you? Future Bachelor shows, Winter Games? Well no not. Are you open to the opportunity like totally. I feel like why not. I mean, I've done like dating sites, I've dated a lot. I'm alrty three now like why not? You know, I just

I'm open to any way to meet somebody. At this point, I'm excited to see the new crop of guys that come out so I can compare, we can compare my season other season and see which one stacks up. I'm excited because it might be my future husband on the next There you go. Do you have a fear of crabs or the ocean or anything like that? No, I don't.

I feel like the really funny thing was is that in all of my questionnaires and like different things that I did for the process to be on the Bachelor, I never said anything about a fear of like rumper cars or dogs. I don't think anyways, so like they didn't know any of that. They just really they must have just I don't know, they dug deep. Just the

luck of the Irish, I guess the luck of it. Well, the funny thing was, I actually wanted to be a race car driver for a long time, and I like used to have no fear of like cars and speed and like adrenaline, you know, but and then the same thing with dogs. But they know they love they love to make good TV. Did they starting a Fashion in Paradise soon? No? No? I starts summing in June, I think. Okay, so there's still quite some time because there's has to

be the Bachelortte season well in at least. Thank you so much for joining us, being vulnerable and being vulnerable and being honest too. At the end of the day, like you said, you weren't like faking any of those reactions or any of those feelings, so that's rare. That's where to come back. So thank you for doing all that. I think that's why people like like The Bachelor so much and like listening to podcasts like this, because I think love is such a universal thing everybody can relate to.

So yeah, thanks for being vulnerable and opening up. Who was speaking of love? I want to talk about Soulmates for at least five minutes before I let you leave for the rest of the day, because you guys talked about it last week on Becca's podcast, and we're gonna talk about that. Sorry, that was a little off tangent analys. Thank you so much again. Um, we look forward to potentially seeing you on Bachelor in Paradise. Yeah, we're gonna keep our fingers crossed for love and um best of

luck with everything. I'm sure we'll be seeing more you soon. Did you guys ever read Plato Symposium in like college or anything we used? We used a bit from Plato Symposium in our wedding, Alison, And what was it? Part about the people being split, and that's exactly what I

wanted to bring up. That's my favorite story of all time. Okay, so in the symposium, Um, I can't remember which philosopher it was, but essentially what it was back in ancient Greek times, there was this they were saying, like they're humans at the time, had four arms, four legs, and two heads, right, and they were basically two separate people but in love with each other and attached at every

level of their body. Um and Zeus. I think it was was scared of the power that humans possessed when they had the two heads and they're essentially two people in one. So what he did was he struck them with lightning to split them in half. And then what what someone sold, what's what someone's present day soulmate is, is us trying to find that other half that we were ultimately connected, remember, right, something along the line. I'm

butchering the story, but it's something like that, right. My My wife, my now wife, is very touched by that story, and she wanted to one of her friends read it in front of everyone during the ceremony, and I pretended like I had heard it before, and I was like, oh, yes, of course, but a symposium that'll I would curl up every night and read that before the first time I heard she read it to me, you know, a couple

of months before, and it brought me to tears. If that was a beautiful idea, so beautiful, and it's just so funny to think about people with two heads and four legs and four that idea is so funny to me. And so do you believe in soulmates? Dan, I do believe in soulmates? And that's come on, a soulmates, yes, that you're destined to spend the rest of your life with.

And that's kind of maybe why I think a lot of people find the ability to relate to that stories, because I think a lot of people believe that, and it's just like a fun way to like visualize it, you know, um, but yeah, that was just the one thing I want to touch on. Well, thank you for I was outnumbered. Everybody believed in more than once. So I I go back, I go back and forth on that's like remember the argument, I think, mark me the

argument of one of your friends. Or maybe your parents lost their significant other and then remarried and then they had their new soulmate even though they had their first soul mate. I don't know. I don't know about that, but I all I know is that my wife and I crossed paths is a number of times before we actually imagined. So I felt like that was a universe pushing us together. So somehow there's some sort of magnet magnetism there. You've got a bunch of emails about changing

the name of the show. Kevin says it should be help. Dating is really difficult with Dean Anglers mouthful, but yeah, I like it, Kate, I agree with me, and it should be help. Dating sucks. Michelle had a number of ideas. Does dating suck with Dean Unglert? Dating meets Dean with Dean Unglert? Dean there date that? My god, that's pretty funny. Who sucks at dating with Dean Unglert and we suck

at dating with the younger. That's all from Michelle. She put some thought into it dated that that's good, And Brittany says, I one hundred thousand percent back Dean and changing the name of the podcast. It's really narrowly steered the topics of conversation that he's able to have with

his guests, and it's negatively impacting the show. Amy listening, Dean has so much more than sucking at dating or even just dating to talk about more bachelor Binfoll, family troubles, growing up as a nomad, losing a family member, doing illness, et cetera. Dean could carry a much broader podcast than he is doing right now. Please let them change the premise of the podcast and listens, make get bored and tune out. Thanks for reading. It's Brittany. What's funny is

so we had that guest last week, Diane. Yes, Diane was great. She was great, And we got to this point where we were talking about race in America and it kind of like it's obviously different for everyone, And for like a second there, I was thinking, I was like, we're having a real conversation right now. This is fun. And then I got back and I was talking to roommates.

I was like, we had like a great, like great conversation on my podcast for the first time, not the not the first time, but it's nice to be able to have conversations that aren't just dating. She was called help and we think everything she lift lifted here, growing up as a nomad, losing a family member, family troubles, We've had all that stuff on this show. I agree. I guess we can continue to expand upon them because that's relationships. Was our family relationship, that's true. But we

can talk. We can talk about like ideas instead of events. Maybe sometimes I don't know. Alright, well, can we hit a couple of emails before we wrap? I feel bad for Lindsay. Lindsay's got a situation heidean. Have been recently given an ultimatum in my relationship with my boyfriend of

two years and want some advice. Ultimatums good. My boyfriend's six and twenty three well lived other than an apartment with our nine month old Bernie's mountain dog Kylo deal with my boyfriend randomly one day applied for a home loan and I expressed that I didn't want a house yet. I'm not sure. I'm still getting used to San Diego. I'm not sure if I want to settle here permanently, although why wouldn't she in San Diego? He then said,

I need to make a decision. I need to choose to live in San Diego the rest of my life with him and our dog because he's not moving anywhere, or to leave because our relationship would be over and make things hard. And my dad recently got diagnosed with cancer, and I had expressed that I want to move back to be closer to him. He refuses to leave. I'm stuck. Lindsay, First of all, I'm so sorry about your dad. That's terrible.

Hopefully everything's gonna work out fine. But my feeling is, if he's serious about this relationship being a relationship, it needs to be a relationship, right. I would never have applied for a home loan without including my at the time girlfriend on those thoughts, because if you're part, if she's part of your future, that's her home too, right. He needs to have equal responsibility to way and our big decisions like that. Especially, I think he's checked out.

I think that he wants her to choose to not continue the think do you think or maybe he just feels comfortable enough in the relationship to steer them in the direction that he wants them to go. So he's like an alpha male kind of thing, and he's saying, this is the right decision for us, let's do it. Yeah, maybe, I guess so. The ultimatum at the end of the day is if he if she moves in with him in the new house, they're together. If she doesn't move

in with him, then they're over. I guarantee you. Even if she doesn't move into the house with them, they're still together. There's that's not an I think that he's trying to make it seem like it's one or the other. But I guarantee if she says, sorry, I'm not comfortable moving in the house with you, I want to either live on my own separately in an apartment and we can still date. I He'll build pent be okay with that. That's what I think she should do. If she's really

that questioning of it, I don't know. I think he's overstepped here. Yeah. It's hard because I feel like it should have been something that they both agreed on, because if he does by the house, then it's his house and she'll just be living in it. And then if they get married, like it's still just his house. You know he had the house before they were married to like legally yeah, yeah, I don't know. It's not great. I think that again, I think that she should force

his hand in and basically give him an ultimatum. And on the flip side of it, not the ultimates are good. But again I'm saying, like, think about it from his perspective, say they break up because she didn't move into the house with him, and he's telling his friends, what, why do you guys break up? He's like, well, I wanted to move into this house with me and she said no. It's like, that's not really a reason to break up with someone. It's just it's just another thing for the

relationship to kind of build upon. True. But I think he's putting himself first, and I think because of that, she needs to put herself first. She needs to figure out what does she want if because it sounds to me she wouldn't written this email if she didn't if she really was excited about living in San Diego in this house. But I'm I guess. The point that I'm trying to make is that it's not binary. It's not if she moves in with him there together. If she

doesn't move in, they're broken up. I'm saying, like, if she doesn't move in with him, she could still be in a relationship with him, whether he whether he says so or not. Like I think that he's just saying that because he, I there, wants to force her hand up to move in with her. You don't think he wants her to move in with him, But a relationship

can exist even though they're not living together. The point that I'm trying to make, especially so what's our advice for her, I say, if you don't want to move into house with them, don't move into house with him. I guarantee you're still gonna be dating him in six months. And we get a lot of these, we get a lot of we broke up, but he is still keeping me around and actually and at least mentioned this sort of thing as well. Stephanie says, I'm twenty years old.

I was dating someone for about three months. He works at the gym I go to every day. One day he told me he needed space, he felt he rushed into our relationship and he wasn't ready for anything romantic. He broke up with his ex girlfriend right before he pursued me. Didn't give himself enough time to process that. Okay, respectfully, I stopped all communication and give him what he wanted. What I want, Respectfully, I stopped all communication to give

him what he wanted. But when I go to the gym and he's working, he's still super flirty and friendly. He goes around the gym every twenty minutes to check the floor, but really to check me out, and even texts me to my workouts, commenting on what I'm doing. One day, I was talking to one of my guy friends there and he texted me afterwards, did you talk to him just to piss me off? So obviously he was jealous. I was talking to one other guy breaking

up with him. Heard a lot because they really liked him. But he's sending mixed messages. He doesn't want to be with me. But until texts me and watches me at the gym, what does he want? I don't understand. Help. By the way, I love your podcast, Stephanie, get a new gym membership somewhere else distance. She needs to separate

from this guy. I think you're right. I think this is such a typical guy thing, Like he wants he doesn't want to be in a serious relationship with her, but he doesn't want to say goodbye to or either. What is it is this benching? Is that what he's doing? Is he benching her? He's keeping her handy just in case you made a point maybe in like episode four of Image Control, and I think that that could be what this guy is doing too. Like they broke up

because of him. It sounds like he broke up with this but he maybe wants her to still think of him positively, so by being nice and friendly to her while she's at the gym. Kind of means like when she's talking about him to her friends, she'll stay still say positive things about him. Could be that, it's just it's just something that could be. I mean, he's just

kind of not sure what he wants. He's just yeah, he's just like that's the worst thing when somebody ends things with you because they say you're great, You're You're the kind of girl I want to end up with. Would say you're amazing, Yeah, but I'm not ready for you yet. It's like then by you don't get to be my friend and watch me work out? I agree? Did you remember ship? Did you move on with your life? Ye? Do not respond to his text, turn on your red

receipts and don't respond read receipts. All right, I think that'll do it for this week. Well, that'll do it this week. He's over it. So I would like to thank Ashley and Brittany for calling in and sharing their breaking up stories, and Analysa of course for joining us and sharing her experience on The Bachelor with Ari and that awkward breakup and a lot of her awkwardness throughout the entire show. And it sounds like I was quick

to judge her as a bit of a hypochondriac. It sounds like she's not so much, it's just she has these weird triggers. Um, of course, thanks to Tanya mark Easton. Biggest thanks goes to beach Body on Demand for just being the most incredible on demand workout service out there, saving us all time having to go to the gym. Don't forget. You know, at the time you thought I'm going to definitely text Dean to thirty thirty, but now you've listened to the rest of the show. You could

forget that. Don't forget that, right, go tech Dean to right. So now that you're opening your phone to see how much more time has left in this podcast, what you can do is just jump right over to that message screen and text Dean D E A N to three zero three zero three zero and start getting that Beach Body that we've all, you know, free trial membership, all the workouts to nutrition information for free. Yeah, and how can you beat that? Can't? And by the way, guys,

I've been cooking a lot lately for myself. I've been eating chicken and vegetables and fruit smoothies every morning. Yeah, they say as are made in the kitchen. Yes, that's what they say. I waited myself the other day. I weigh a hundred and ninety six pounds, which is an insane amount for me. I don't think I've ever been close to two D before. And you're proud of this, not at all you seemed proud. So I'm getting high.

It's get out of control. So I'm gonna use Beach Bodies workout routine and it's nutritional information to probably drop like ten pounds or so to one slim as in I think, And on that note, thank you for tuning into this week's episode of Help I Suck at Dating. I'm Dean Anglert, and maybe next week I'll suck a little bit less. Follow Help I Suck At Dating with Dean Anglert on I Heart Radio, or subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts.