What's the deal with totem poles?

as you going, No, we're not quite going. Oh, there's a TV show that our parent company, Discovery, specifically the Science Channel has about a great fall tradition in Delaware where they chunk punkins, punkin chunking, punkin chunking and actually hurl these things through the air with a catapult and it's fun and that they've done a TV show on it, and it's on They did two TV shows, Buddy two, Yeah, say it's say the names. Well at eight o'clock on

the Science Channel, it's Eastern time. There's going to be the road to punkin Chunking and where does that road lead to punkin chunk in itself? At nine and that is Thanksgiving Night on the Science Channel and Science Channel HD. Yes, and we just wanted to say watch it, yeah, because we like Chunking Punkin's Punkin Chunking. And now we're gonna talk about whatever. You're gonna cleverly set it up as

all right, you ready? Yes, Hey, Chuck, Hey Josh. Have you have you ever heard the phrase the low man on the totem pole? I have, and you know what, go ahead. So it's usually too it's it's usually somebody who's the grunt. They're at the bottom, they're they're just it's us. Okay, there you get lowman on the totem pole. Not true if you're suggesting that you and I are at the bottom of the heap. True, I had I know what you mean. It's actually on totem poles, the

lower uh carvings were actually of the most high esteem. Right. I have no idea. You do now and I do too, because we read an article called how totem poles will work. By the way, I think we should start using the correct version of that, just to confuse people. I get on the elevator like house work. Oh well, you know, I'm the lowman on the totem pole Like, sorry, you're like, what are you talking about? Them? The VP? Right? Yeah?

Things are great? Right? Or when one of the higher ups walks by, go, there goes the lowman on the totem pole. Exactly, give me some skin. What happened? Did they get fired? So? Yeah? Okay, well, Chuck and I are going to start confusing people after this, But let's talk about total poles first. Okay, let's do. I learned a lot of stuff in this one that I didn't know. Everything I read in here I learned because I knew

nothing about totem poles. Really, have you ever seen him? Well, I've seen him, but I didn't know anything aside from you know, to pole. All right, well, let's talk. Let's share this information that we've we've learned, let's impart it. So one of the things I learned, besides lowman on the totem pole being actually important, um, is that the uh, the natives Native Americans actually had socioeconomic strata. Yeah, stratum.

I didn't know that either, strata one of the two. Yes, I did, And I know what you're talking about here, because totem poles were typically commissioned by people of esteem and people had money, right, people who wanted to show off basically uh, And what they would do would be to commission a totem carver who was a person of very high authority a littlement on the totem pole and might say uh. And the head carver would basically be treated with tons of esteem and respect uh and was

housed at the home of the person who had commissioned them. Yeah, and basically retreated like royalty. Because I guess this guy could be like, once you've commissioned this, I'm going to do it, and if you mistreat me or I am not amused at any point in time him, I'm going to carve you naked on this and you have to put it up. Yeah, I got this. That is the law of the Pacific Northwest. I got this from this

that totem pole carvers were like many temperamental artists. It's kind of funny how they had that same attitude, like it's cross culture. If you don't make me happy, I'm gonna ruin your commission work and shame you right with a shame pole right, well, not necessarily boiler. So the other thing I learned is that, um, I'm just gonna introduce every point with that for this whole podcast. Another thing I learned is that um totem poles haven't been

around that long. No, I did not know that either, And I will say that at the end of every time you mentioned that that I didn't realize that they have just started in the seventeen hundreds. Late seventeen hundred and when the Europeans came over is when they really

really started booming. They think the Hida tribe h a i d a tribe of south eastern Alaska were the first to start carving totem poles, and I guess it was kind of slow going at first, but really picked up once UM settlers colonists started hitting the Pacific Northwest and more and more numbers because they brought with them tools. Yeah,

but they were a little frightened by them. They were, which is funny because from what I understand, UM European settlers were among the most superstitious, easily frightened, and most suspicious people ever to populate the earth. Seriously. Yeah, so they saw totem poles and I think Captain James Cook had a famous quote, right, Yeah, he said that they

were truly monstrous figures, yes, and he was wrong. Um. And then you also have the superstition or myth that totem poles were used to ward off or worship evil spirits, depending on how you felt towards your native neighbors. No, what is a totem pole, Chuck, Well, a totem pole? Uh? And totem, by the way, is an ojibwa a word? Is it really? Josh actually winked at me, by the way. Just then for reels a totem pole, Josh. Many times it's used to commemorate an event, like Um, I looked

some of these up. What it might commemorate a funeral, sometimes childbirth, marriage, and even monarchy. No, yes, no, yes, yes, I read that that is true. And Uh. They could range in size initially, and I didn't know this either. They could be as small as like a walking cane. Yeah, way smaller than I thought I thought they were. They were all like extremely large. No, they definitely vary inside as I've seen some that are like kneehigh to a grasshoppers,

you like to say. And then there's others that are, you know, a hundred and seventy ft tall, which we'll get into the world records here shortly too, and not just any No, no jackass can come along and carve some wood up and say I just made me a total pole. There are some very specific, um, I guess details that have to be followed for a total pole

to truly be considered a total pole. Yeah, to be authentic, Josh, it needs to be the work of a trained Pacific Coast carver Pacific Northwest Pacific normally more specific and uh yeah, no San Diego carvers up there, forget them. Uh. It must be raised according to the specific American Indian traditions and ceremonies. There's a ceremony that goes along with it, which we'll get to. And it must be blessed by

natives of the Northwest specific coast. Plus also, it doesn't hurt your case if you want to prove that you have a an authentic totem pole, that it be made from your redd or yellow cedar. Ah. Well, sure you can't use you can't use power tools or chainsaws. Well they do now, but if you really you didn't, You just wasted your time if you were trying to make an authentic totem pole. Um. And there are certain colors they're traditionally followed red, black, yellow, blue, green, white, um,

which I find to be an unappealing color combination. Those those four or five. Yeah, you know it said they did not need to be painted. And I've never seen a natural totem pole, but I think that would be my preference. Yes, and you can't preserve it in any way. I didn't know that either, which means that total poles ain't gonna be around all that long. An authentic total pole has a lifespan of about a hundred years, especially in the Pacific Northwest where it's wet, rainy, muggy, not

good on on carved wood. Yeah, that's not bad. Tho hundred years is pretty good. And did I also say it has to be from one single piece? Oh no, you didn't say that. It's important too, Yeah, of course. Okay, so Chuck, Basically, we've established that totem poles are there's authentic, and there's an authentic ones. You can't just be some

jackass with a chainsaw. Um. They are the bar or bob mitzvah of the Native American culture, with the ceremony and the shore and um that they are commissioned, usually by a wealthy Native American by a head carver. So you've got the head carver, he's got a couple of junior carvers, and they get to work. And here we reach why the low man on the total pole is actually the most prominent figure. Why because the head carver carves the lower parts of the totem pole. Yeah, the

first ten feet. And I would and it's just a guess, but I would say probably because they don't want to stand on whatever you need to stand on. That's part of it. It's also that's also the most visible and scrutinizeable. Yeah, yeah, good point. Okay, So the carver finishes and and probably some of the stuff that he's put on there, there's some uh basically uh, he'll say, tell me about your family history? Yeah, yeah, what kind of birds are you fond of? Right? Do you have any ancestor who has

ever shape shifted into an animal? And the the carver is going to take all this into account. The person who commissioned it will probably have some ideas and then they combine them and you have things like eagles, thunderbirds, bears, owls, wolves, ravens, frogs, and each one kind of has a different meaning in Native American culture. Sure should we go with those briefly? Uh? Well, the eagle obviously flies higher than any other bird, and

it can spot trouble, so that's a good thing. And um, the thunderbird is a mythological creature and it can create lightning and thunder by beating its wings and blinking, which is why it's mythological. Yes, bear obviously teaches natives certain things like, um, how to hunt salmon and how to forge for barry, So that's probably good luck to have on your pole. Um. Owls are represent souls of the deceased.

So that might be a mortuary pole. Oh, actually, no, that is when the ashes are actually in the pole, correct, right, that's the type of poll. There's a there's a entry way totem pole, which is kind of like a coat of arms. Um, and that's what that's what A lot of the early settlers of the Pacific Northwest took these ass as a coat of arms, like family coat of arms. Um. So you've got entry way totem poles, mortuary poles, which actually do have a hollow cavity to put the ashes

of a dead person in. Yeah, it's like an urn basically. Yet a very cool urn, a very tall urn. Uh. And then there's ridicular shame poles like you mentioned, right. That's what I want to bring back, the shame pole. Okay, So Chuck, talk about the most famous when the Lincoln Pole in sex Men, Alaska. Yeah, this is when um and I didn't know to see this. Here's another thing. I learned Native Americans had slaves. The the the Lincoln poll was actually uh to shame the US government because

of the Emancipation Proclamation in eighteen sixty three. And many members of the is that Lingott is that I was pronounced the Lynott tribe Lingot. I think the team might be silent, but they're they're slaves were freed. I didn't know that Native Americans had slaves. I know, That's what I just said. Neither did I. And so they got all mad and said, you know what, we're gonna do a Lincoln poll and it's gonna shame President Lincoln for

the Emancipation proclamation. Actually that's not true. I guess I did know that they would capture other people in battle and force him into slavery. I didn't know that. Okay, So, Chuck, we've got the type of pole established what we know what's on the pole and it has to be raised. Now, well, this is when the fund starts, the rowdy fund. Yeah, we're talking about the potlatch. And a potlatch is basically

a big whopping party that you raise the pole. Obviously, you put it near the ground and you have the ropes and you pull it up and sink it into the ground and then it's it sounds like from what I researched on potlatches, it's just a big freaking party. So now we've reached a the Native American equivalent of a bot mitzvah and an Amish barn raising put together. How did they do the same thing? Well, the Amish raised barns is a big communical event. Have you ever

seen witness? Yeah? But they have a big party, yeah, well an Amish party. Everyone eats sandwiches and drinks lemonade. Sure. And the reason we can get away with that is because no Amish person will ever hear this podcast, that's right. And if you write in and say your finding because you're Amish, then you're a liar. Liar alright, So chuck um.

They have a great party, and apparently it does get rowdy as I alluded to before, because the Canadian government actually banned potlatches at some point in time, UM, and they that had a really deletrious effect on the number of totem poles that were carved and raised in North America and then in the twentieth century, because a totem pole without a potlatch is like a donut without a hole,

very much so it's like a jelly donut. UM. And that's not the only reason that that totem pole carving declined in the twentieth century, and actually it came close, very close to the point of extinction. UM. The Native American children were not being educated in traditional means any longer in the traditional ways, UM, so they were losing that knowledge of how to carve a decent thunderbird. There were in a lot of head carvers that were being

trained any longer. UM. Atari is a huge is generally pointed to is one of the biggest reasons the total pole raisings declined. UM. And there was also a ton of theft by museums and private people. I didn't hear about it, but just go steal totem poles for their own collections. It's how do you hide a totem pole. I don't think you're really trying to. You just say you've been exploited by my people a really long time.

I'll just take this and get away with me. Go. It was so rampant, in fact, that in President George H. W. Bush, Herbert Walker, yeah, Herbert Right Bush signed the Native American Graves Protection and Repatriation Act, and it basically said, if you've ever stolen a totem pole, take it back. And people did. And as a result of this kind of renewed enthusiasm for totem poles, we lost our puritanical fear of them. People started carving him again. You know what

else is in that bill? What wire tappings? Bad? Total poles back and talk openly on your phone? Right? Um? So, okay, So there's a resurgence in totem pole creation, right, in native and non native. Right. So let's say, Chuck, I'm like, I want an authentic totem pole to talk about my daughter's monarchy. Well, then, like anything else, Josh, you would get on the internet and search totem pole carving, and you would find some people that do that for a living, right,

some Native and some non native. Yeah, depending on So if I wanted an authentic one, how much am I going to show out? Josh? You would have to pay about grand to a hundred grand rageous? Yes, I won't pay more than ten thousand dollars you sa, Charlatan Minachia, No Minachi. Uh so yeah, that's and I think, um, like, seven hundred and fifty bucks is the low end of a non authentic three foot pole, right in about fifteen grand for twenty ft right, non authentic, non authentic? Right?

But you know who knows? No one knows. Yeah, Josh, you want to talk about the records. Yes, this is that heavy, Chuck, and that heavy each Everything that comes out of Chuck's mouth right now is a statistic, right, Chuck Richard and South Korea, Good luck here, buddy, um Albert Babe British Columbia had a has a hundred and seventy ft tall, hundred seventy three foot tall totem. It's

got to be the world's tallest totem pole. Right, No think again, sir, because uh there was one that the Guinness Book certified at one hundred and eighty five ft. It's got to be the world's tallest totem Victoria, British Columbia. But you know what, it was torn down because of controversy. The town evidently got really upset about all the grief about the Guinness Book record and was it authentic and

was it the really the tallest one. So an angry mob, from what I gather, led by motabatd tear down this totem pole and cut it up into pieces and burn it. Yeah, the record holder. There goes the grief. I mean, how much grief could it have caused? I don't I don't know. Yeah, I mean that's gotta be Um. I've been to Victoria. It's not exactly like a rough and tumble town. It's pretty peaceful. Um, so I imagine there must have been

a tremendous amount of grief. I guess so, or they hadn't put their chainsaws to you slately and we're looking. You know, Betty was hungry, right. But the thickest pole Josh is not disputed. That is in British Columbia as well, and that was carved by Richard hunt In and it has a diameter of six feet. That is one thick pole. Yeah, and I'd like to say Richard hunt. If you listen to this podcast, I would like to see a picture of your totem pole. Yeah, seriously, so email, it's conture.

We'll give the email address at the end. Right now, Is that the end? I think? So you got any more on totem poles and I got nothing else. I like the ones with the wings. I'll just say that. I like at the top, like a thunderbird with the wings coming off the side. It makes sense to have them at the top. But that's at least important. So yeah, yeah, So well, if you want to know more about totem poles, and I kid you not, Chuck and I learned a lot of surprising facts that we're just kind of in

between the lines of this article. It happens a lot on how stuff works dot com. You can type totem poles into the handy search bar of our venerated site. And uh, I guess it's time for a listener mail, right Yes, Josh, I'm just gonna call this. I like to read these um funny emails from time to time. Okay, this guy is really funny. He's a good writer, he's clever,

so he gets on the air. This is uh, this says Hey, guys, I've been traveling backwards in time, and I'm writing you from February two thousand nine, where Haiku Theater ends abruptly with refrigerator and sayings like the Germans compass head and it's a poncy scheme haven't even been uttered yet by some strange quirk. When I load your podcasts into my iPod, they play back in reverse chronological order, giving me side effects like hearing listener mail for episodes

that haven't even mentioned or haven't happened yet. However, unless I start tattooing myself like the guy Memento, I'll probably just keep things the same, as it makes listening even more fun. And we've heard this before. The people listen out of order and they liked that better. I'm no stranger to self imposed odd circumstance. For instance, I've purposely used my mouse left handed, even though I'm right handed. I sometimes reason things out while I'm dreaming. I often

balance on one leg while brushing my teeth. Like this guy, I learned to read things upside down, and he has also run into some groovy things, like when I was in the army, I knew a guy who saw things upside down and backwards, and he learned to cope by writing things upside down and forwards, or I guess right side up upside down. I once dated a girl whose mother would eat the same thing for every meal for

a period of time. Two weeks of hard boiled eggs for every meal, black licorice for three days straight, et cetera. And I once worked with a guy who owned a car that wouldn't make left hand turns. He's my favorite dude, uh and basically he's leading up to a request. All of this makes me wonder if you should do a podcast on something like how living Strangely works, an explanation of odd things that people choose to do which may or may not actually provide tangible benefit to their lives.

We'll get Fuller to pitch it. Maybe. So so that is from Michael Mack. You're not gonna say my last name on the air anyway. Cracking from Colorado. Nice, thank you, Michael. Yeah, very funny. Yeah. If you have a funny email you'd like to send Chuck and I, there are a favorite you can send it to. Oh wait, or if your name is Richard Hunt and you've created the world's thickest totem pole. You can send it to stuff podcast at how stuff works dot com For more on this and

thousands of other topics. Does it how stuff works dot com. Want more how stuff works, check out our blogs on the house. Stuff works dot Com home page brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. It's ready, are you