What Makes Lead So Poisonous?

up restaurant called Jerry's Burrito Check. Yeah, Jerry's eating a burrito right now, A frozen one. I guess right. You didn't make that from scratch fresh Jerry frozen burrito is fine with me, though, yes, some of them. Nothing wrong with any frozen burrito ever created. Yeah, I mean there's this. They're very specific, you know. I mean, it's not like a fresh burrito, but it's its own thing that's still good. This you call it like a re tet or something

weird like that. It's something that differentiate it, you know. I agree with you, man. Yeah, but man, sometimes when that reef read bean pops out and burns your mouth, that's just the best you have a hole in your in your on your gums for a couple of days. Yeah, alfa a little cheese on top too, to cool it in the oven. No, to melt on top o. That's an antilada then, Uh not really, I think the antilada makes the it's the sauce, right, Yeah, okay, that's what

I'll say, swimming and saucel, right, antilata sauce. This may be your best intro yet, Chuck. We're talking about lead today, that's right. Do you know much about UM the Flint, Michigan lead poisoning scandal that happened, would say blemish. Yeah. I posted about it on our Facebook call UH a couple of months ago and sort of was a part of a lively discussion there. But UM only from that and in this research same here. I mean I was aware of it, kind of. I didn't understand the details.

But for those of you who don't UM, who don't know about the Flint, Michigan water poisoning. But Flint, Michigan UM has faced a lot of problems since the auto industry went away, UM, but one of them wasn't poor water quality. They actually the people of Flint actually paid I think the highest radar, among the highest rates in the country. To get their water, their water was pumped from Lake Huron through Detroit, and Flint brought their water

from Detroit. Get that good, clean Detroit water, right, You know you're in a pickle when you're buying water from Detroit and that's the healthy water. So um, they're building a new pipeline from Lake Huron that goes around Detroit, and Flint said, we're going to get in on that action. And Detroit said, oh yeah, well, we're canceling our contract rather than pay for a short term contract with Detroit.

The emergency manager, the basically the the emergency mayor appointed by the governor himself, UM said, we're just and tap into the Flint River. Not not a good idea, as it turned out. No, it's not because in Flat Michigan,

there were, among other places, something called Buick City. Buick City was a four plus acre um car manufacturing plant that made buicks, and um it really heavily polluted the river, so much so that people in Flint, after just a few months of drinking this water from the tap, started losing their hair. Um. Well, right away they said this looks and taste awful, right, it's taste of chlorine. And the reason it tasted of chlorine is because there were e coal I break outbreaks that they had to like

treat the water with chlorine. And then it also to some people, um, it smelled like sulfury as well. It looked terrible. But people started losing hair, started getting rashes. Um. There's there was one kid who had an autoimmune disease already. He just stopped growing. Um, and it was it was bad news. But the people of Flint, the Flint government, and the the Michigan Environmental Protection Division basically said no, we're following all the laws. Um, everything's fine with the water.

Just go back to sleep. Flint and Flint did something different. A bunch of them taught themselves the science of like water and sanitation and um, the drinking water laws. They became basically citizen scientists, and they took it back to the Flint government and the state government and said, you guys are wrong. This is toxic water and we're being poison and you have to do something about it. And they finally did well. And I think the issue was

don't play dumb. We know you know why, why are you making us tell you exactly, and they kept the apparently the company line was no that here's the science, here the here the results of the tests. But the tests were terrible. And if you want to know all about it, there's a really really great um article on five dot com called what went Wrong in Flint and um it just really chronicles everything very well. But the big problem with Flint isn't that there was chlorine in

the water. It was that there was a bunch of lead in the water. And the reason why there's a bunch of lead in the waters because there's lead pipes going to a lot of houses in Flint and the water that was being pumped through those pipes was so corrosive that it was bringing a bunch of lead with it and poisoning the city of Flints for months. Yeah. And the reason people use lead in pipes is because it's not corrossive. Corrosive, that's how corrosive the water. Yeah, exactly.

That really says something. It really does. Uh. And I guess we'll look back later and talk about the lawsuits and all that stuff. That sound good. Yeah, I think that's a great idea, kind of bookend it. But let's talk about lead itself, like what's the problem with lead? Where did it come from? And that that whole idea of um using lead pipes is nothing new either. It's actually pretty old, to tell you the truth. Yeah, lead um. Well, the Romans, of course were the the first to do

almost everything, either Asians or Romans. Um. Well, I don't know Africa. Oh that's true. So basically everybody excepts he said, Europe as the migration expanded exactly. And don't forget all of the innovations going on in Mesoamerica as well. Shout out to anyone who came before us. But it's been going on since ancient times. Romans using lead as lead piping for sewage draining and carrying water, even stored water and containers lined with lead. Uh. And in fact, this

is pretty interesting. I think the English word for plumbing and the chemical symbol pb that is lead, comes from the Latin word plum bumb. Now a plumb bumb is is that plumbers crack? Oh? Nice? If it wasn't it is officially now. You know. My friend Eddie he his young daughter, asked him what plumber's crack? What's the other day? And he said, said what did you tell her? And he said, well, you know, I told her what it was.

He said, sometimes plumbers they've bent over a lot because pipes are below you, and sometimes their pants sag a little. Then you see their butt crack. And she went, oh, the only thing I take issue with is the use of the words sometimes right all the times. Other than that's a great explanation. So the Latin plum bumb, which means lead. Yeah, which that that has been mysterious to me for many decades. P B doesn't make any sense, Like why would they call it p B because peanut

but head right, and p B is uh. You'll find it on the periodic table. And the reason you'll find it on the periodic table is because lead is an element, a heavy metal um, and it has all sorts of properties that make it very desirable, Yeah, really unique to

although super super toxic, as we'll find. Yeah, it's not often you can find something that is super malleable and soft but also strong in dense exactly um, which makes lead perfect for water pipes because it's also it also resists corrosion, like you said, so you can run water through it and as long as the water is not super bad. Uh. The the lead won't rust. It will leach lead into the water, but it still won't rust,

right right. So um it's also uh, not very good at conducting electricity, which makes lead very useful for other things like um soldering electrical connections. The electrical connection will remain the thing that transmits the current, the lead won't. It's pretty awesome. Did you say soldier solder? Solder? Yeah, I never heard of pronounce How do you say, solder solder? You gotta say that l. I think the silent unless it's regional, regional, regional. To my brain, I think solder.

You said that because you're from Toedo, right. So the use of the use of leg goes back even before the Romans. Actually, but it first appeared mostly in art like lead paint. Yeah, it wasn't like um they described in the articles and novelty. Uh. And it was apparently it makes colors more vibrant and it's less erosive, which is why you still, even in the United States, see lead paint on street signs because it's less corrosive. Yeah,

that's what they say. It's still used on signs supposedly up until as recently as the nineties, and it may still be going on depending on the country that it's produced. In The ink on the outside of a plastic bread bag frequently has lead in it, or it used to, and it wasn't a problem unless the somebody kept the bread bag and turned it inside out to store food in. Then that food leached the lead out of the ink. It was actually like a big problem for a while. Well,

I'm not sure that it is anymore. I couldn't find anything in recent the most recent thing I saw saying that, yeah, it still happens, right, Well, it's less expensive as a paint, which is another reason, uh in the in the colors and more vivid apparently. But um, this hasn't been a problem in the US for a while, but in China they still use a lot of lead head um in paint.

And in two thousand seven there were massive recalls for everything from Dora the Explorer toys to Sesame Street toys due to the fact that they had lead pain on them. And little kids put everything in their mouths, including their toys, because they're big dummies, and they end up eating lead, which is a big problem. So there was a massive recall of Chinese products in because of this. Now it was two thousand seven. What I say seven, Yeah, you're

harkening back and to the Urban Dance Squad day. Did you look them up? Man, you're missing out. I don't think that's true. Really, Yeah, why just because I like them remember them vaguely? Oh yeah, it wasn't like I've never heard of the Urban Dance Squad. No, you have a good taste of music. Mental philosph for the Globe, great, like a legitimately great album that I'll look it up. I'll look it up. It's just weird that you say

you think you're not missing out. It's for no know, because I mean, again, I remember Urban Nant Squad for some reason. I put them in line with like Spin Doctors in three eleven. No, no, well, you know what I mean. Three eleven could be slightly compared because they were kind of a rock rap group, but they were Dutch. Urban Dance Squad was okay, so that that makes them

cool in here right automatically? Yeah. Uh, but if you just picked this up as like, what are they talking about Enchilada's Urban Dance Squad, um so lead paint in the United States is uh, well, it's still an issue. In some ways because older houses still have it. But as of UM nineteen seventy eight they said no more, get the light out. That's right, and they define it as any paint or surface coating that contains lead equal

or exceeding one milligram for a square centimeter. Yeah. So basically um In said, if you're going to manufacture something for somebody's home that people are generally going to come in contact with, most people don't come in contact with street signs, UM, right, then you can't have lead in it. But again, any house built pre there's plenty of them out there, very likely has lead paint in it. It also probably has lead pipes. Um. And there's a lot of lead around us all over the place in places

you wouldn't even think, like there's lead. And uh, leaded glass like really like a glass you like you might be using you conceivably could be drinking lead out of it. Oh, but you don't drink out of leaded glass. Sure. Yeah, they use it to make regular plain old dumb glass into more like crystal. It gives it like a ping when you when you tap it. It makes it, uh, the the reflection a lot sharper. It also UM lowers

the melting point. So you know, if you put it in the oven, it doesn't like, but it's conceivably bad for you. You know, who was on it long but for the United States government. Federal government was the city of Baltimore. In one they banned lead pigment for interior paint, very smart for their housing. And since the fifties had kind of been phased out in different parts of the country.

And then ine, we finally got the Federal Lead Poisoning Prevention Act, and then it took seven years after that to fully ban the paint the paint lead paint. Right. There's another big source of lead that was all over the place in the twentieth century. Uh, and that was in gasoline in cars. There was an additive in gasoline that was added to gaso link called tetra ethyl lead, right, yeah, you remember that, like, uh, you know, fill it up

with unleaded or or or fully leaded. And the reason that they added lead to gas was because there was a problem called knocking right where um, the in a high performance engine, when the gas entered the ignition chamber, the combustion chamber, it it may just get so amped up that it would combust it would ignite before it was supposed to, and this would basically disrupt the movement of the pistons. Right, they knocked the pain that did

all sorts of bad stuff. The lead kept the gas from combusting or igniting before it was meant to, so it was a pretty great additive. The thing is, we already knew that lead was not good for you at the time, but we added it to gas anyway, and it was finally phased out in the seventies. Starting in the seventies, I should say, um, because we started adding catalytic converters to our cars. Yeah, that helped that, and um, just are are the process of the chemical process of

refining petroleum just advanced, so we no longer needed it. Right, So it wasn't just crumby gas. It was pretty good gas. It didn't need lead. If you run leading gas through catalytic converter, it totally messes it up. And the catalytic converters there to prevent emission, so you take lead out

of gas. The problem we found is that during these few decades from like the twenties till actually was the last year you could have lead in your gas in the United states, Um that during this period, basically all the cars on the road were spewing lead, lead vapors into the atmosphere that would just go into the air and then come back into the ground and settle in the soil and water and your face. Yeah, I had. I used lead of gas in my Um. I had

to put it in. My early VW Beatles that I drove had a couple of old you know, vented well vintage. They bought theom new Oh yeah, yeah, my mom she bought a sixty eight Beetle brand New. Wow, that's when I drove. When I turned sixteen, I think it was still around. Huh yeah, yeah, you know those things they never die if you take care of them. Did you like ever use duct tape or anything like that on? No, but I did. Uh. Funny you mentioned I had a hole,

sizable hole in the rear floorboard. Um that we my friends call it the Flintstones car because you could, like you put your feet down and run. So I did have a board, a running board. Um no, just a board over the whole. But I mean you can remove the board and run while you're sitting in the backseat. That's right. Great car. Yeah, lead has been added to cosmetics over the years. Uh, jewelry, jewelry, Uh, pottery, and then uh today because everyone knows let is so uh

such a jerk. One of the only places you're gonna find it in the u S at least as in your car battery your car, Yeah, your car battery or your laptop actually, yeah, which is why it's really important to recycle that car battery, don't or that laptop. Don't throw it in the woods. Yeah, responsibly recycle your electronics

and batteries. Yeah. If there's one thing that we've learned since the twentieth centuries that lead has some serious staying power and it has a very pesky tendency to get out of wherever we put it, right, And yeah, if you put it in just a regular landfill that's not designed to accept things like lead, um, it will just

leach into the groundwater and um. Same thing with your e waste, your your laptops, and the reason that they're used in laptops, um is because the lead actually protects you from the radiation that would shoot out of your laptop screen into your face if it weren't for the toxic lead in there. That's right. Glass cathode ray tubes like you find in your computer laptop screen. Yeah. Well I don't know about your laptop, but your computer, yeah, your monitor. But there's but you should let in there.

You should responsibly recycle your laptop too, for sure, for a number of reasons. I know you did a what was it called electronics recycling? Yeah? What was it? Like? Just a thought or I have no idea what you're talking about. You did a video series where you like, no, sure, deep thought. No, I can't even remember I created the series. Yeah, but you do one on e recycling. Yeah, but nobody cared or watch. So the world was not saved. Everyone said, Chuck,

quit doing it. All right, Well, let's take a break. I'm gonna go cry tire for man. What was the name of that series? I don't know. We'll go get forties and pour them out on the curb Forum. All right, we'll be back in a second. All right, Josh, we've talked a lot about lead so far and enchiladas in Dutch rock rack rap rock bands. It comes from the earth, though, let's let's take it underground. Yeah it's not actually, I mean, it is naturally occurring, but it doesn't naturally occur in

its pure form. Yeah, you don't just like dig down. You're like, hey, there's a big hunk of lead, let me pull it out. Instead, lead atoms have um I think four unpaired uh electrons maybe, and it's outer shell um. So it likes to form connections with other things. So when you find lead in the earth, you're gonna find it in the form of a ox side or a sulfide or something like that. Frequently it's combined with silver,

and so that means it has to be separated. And even the Romans back in the day, which by the way, these Roman um lead pipes that they used for baths and for sanitation and stuff still intact today. You can still dig those up and beat people with them. You could. That's the other place you'll find a lead pipe is in the hand of some dude coming after you, or a game of clue. Oh yeah, that's right. That was bent. Even the guy was hit so hard with it, Colonel Mustard,

he was not to be trusted, he was not. But yes, the Romans they had a pretty us man. They were so smart. They had a pretty ingenious process called coppellation. Uh. The extent of that is basically the idea is that some precious metals, I'm sorry, precious metals. All precious metals won't oxidize, but dumb metals will. So if you heat that junk up, it's going to separate, right. And then

they used it mostly to separate from silver. But these days we get most of our lead from something called galena, where a lead sulfide is found, right. Yeah, And our process is sort of similar. It is very like using heat to separate things. And this this actually it very much resembles Do you remember our waste gasification episode. Yeah, I couldn't remember which one this it was that one,

because the process is very similar. So you take some lead sulfide and you heat it up, uh in the air, so there's the presence of oxygen and it converts into um, lead oxide and sulfur dioxide, right, So you separate them out a little bit. Then you take that lead oxide and you egg carbon co and you again mix it with some air and as that happens, the air combines with the oxide into car you know, the carbon combines with the air and becomes carbon dioxide. Takes all of

the um oxygen molecules from the lead atoms. So the lead, basically what amounts of pure lead, becomes molten and goes down to the bottom of the furnace and carbon dioxide goes out into the atmosphere. It sounds like a very safe process. Basically you're creating molten lead and carbon dioxide. Yeah, that's called roasting and smelting. And uh. Once that lead sinks cools down, it's gonna it's called a pig It's just a big mess of lead basically. Yeah, like pig iron. Yeah,

it's it's delicious. Uh. And then you have slag, which is the non metallic byproduct of the smelting process, and you siphon and cool that down and it's waste waste product. Yes. Uh. And like I said, recycling your car battery is important because there's also a process called secondary extraction where they get that lead out of your battery. You can keep using it exactly. That's the other good thing about lead.

It is extremely reusable because again, it has a lot of staying power, so you're not gonna use lead up, you know, which means you want to reuse it. Yes, we should get to the point where we don't need to mind any more lead or process anymore lead. Just reuse the lead we've got, or maybe find some great substitute that isn't so toxic. You know, you melt down those tiny civil war figurines. Oh yeah, those guys are

lead Okay I thought they were. Yeah, So handling and painting those with lead paint, it's dangerous, right, yes, yes, yes it is. Is that where we're losing so many Civil war figurine buffs? I think so at an alarming rate. That's why they all have like spittle and drool around the corners of their mouths and like zone out while they're painting. Well, there's other reasons for that, but sure contributes.

So uh okay, chuck um, you mentioned or we mentioned lead refining and processing, smelting, roasting, that kind of stuff, right, Um, that does create emissions of not just carbon dioxide but also um lead vapor, which is not good stuff, and you want to control that kind of stuff. But it is emitted and it uh it used to be. Well, these days, lead emissions um from refining and processing are actually the number one source of lead vapor emissions in

the environment. Right, but um forty yeah, about forty years ago, forty five years ago that was not the case. The case was all those cars driving around on the streets emitting lead vapor. Yeah, used to account for about seventy if it came from your automobile. And uh, since the phasing out and reversal, we know coming from the processing and what is it down to, uh road sources, it's

a fuel combustion. Yeah, not bad, No, not bad. Still again, you basically wanted like zero as we're finding, like the um as, we'll see that that lead exposure in any amount is not good and it gets it goes from not good to really bad very quickly apparently. Yeah. And you know, let us know good. We mentioned kids chewing on something with lead pain is not good. If you're redoing your house, uh and it's pre nineteen seventy eight,

you want to get a piece tested. You can't just be like, let me sand off, no the paint on this molding now, because again, even if you think you've cleaned it up, there's still there's lead right there, buddy, um that you're not going to get rid of it. Apparently. Also, opening and closing your windows in a pre nineteen house can create lead dust if you're lucky enough to be able to open your windows. Sure, that's a that's a point minor sealed shut yeah, or nailed chatter, what have you. Yeah,

just from years of painting basically with probably lead paint guaranteed. No, it's not. Actually we we had it tested, Oh did you? Yeah? I mean it wasn't lead paint, but you had it tested like all the way through, Like yeah, yeah, yeah, But what I'm saying is pre nineteen seventy eight, it's not the only paint that was used. I know you're saying that's why you get it tested, right, But did you get like all the layers underneath tested well for any Yeah? Okay, that was my all the layers sound

effect like we hired a lead person. I got too. Good. Good good. That makes me feel better. Yeah. And if you want to if there is lead and you want to get the lead out, you're gonna have to hire someone that knows what they're doing and they'll come in with their has mat suits on to do so. Right. Um, So you can also get it from plumbing, although apparently, um with lead plumbing it's not quite as much of

a thread as you would think. You know, didn't that make you just want to like never drink water again, knowing that you have lead pipes in your house, you shouldn't necessarily be worried because um, over the years, water sanitation experts have figured out that if you have good water that's non corrosive, it actually is not only non corrosive, the water will leave behind a protective coating that coats

the inside of the pipes that it runs through. The lead, Yes, over whatever it is, but yeah, it's gonna leave a protective coat of other substances that aren't toxic that it's gonna form a barrier for later water and the pipes. UM. And uh so you you shouldn't necessarily be freaked out if you have lead pipes coming to your house. Although I mean you've got the money, that's there's definitely worse things you could spend your money on than replacing those pipes.

You know copper, Well, copper can be a problem as well. There's actually a copper lead rule that UM that dictates how non corrosive cities water has to be to follow this rule, and it's detecting not just against led, but copper. You don't really want copper either, although it's not nearly as bad for you as lead interesting. So if you have lead in your system, I mean it goes, it goes into your bloodstream. Uh, it doesn't matter how it

gets in there. If you inhale it, it'll be absorbed to the capillaries and the lungs into the blood or if you uh, if you if you touch it, if you lick it, it's gonna find this way into your blood. Uh, and you can. I mean, it's really easy to find out if you have lead in your blood. You just get a blood test. UM. I don't know why they would do this other test. I don't either, and not just a blood test unless it's like prohibitably expensive or

something so that. Yeah, the other test is called the zinc proto porphyrin um test, and that's a byproduct of red blood cells as they break down in the presence of lead. So rather than directly testing, and it's you're like going around to see, excuse me, lead, I want to see if your shadow is detectable. I don't get it makes zero sense because you gotta take your blood for that too, write and it's not exaccurate. Yeah, it

doesn't make any sense. But the lead blood test is so easy that UM companies like three M and plenty of others sell home lead blood tests. It's yeah, it is nice unless you're the parent who is freaked out giving one to your kid. Well, that's true. You know, anything over equal to or greater than um five micrograms per DESSI leader is bad if you're a kid. If you're an adult, you can tolerate a little bit more,

but it's still distressing, right, And that's how it's expressed. So, um a microgram to a DESI leader, which is a tenth of a leader, right, Um, And so five is not good. Ten micrograms in a desk a leader is where demonstrable UM like behavioral and cognitive problems start to develop. Yeah, that's serious trouble. But the e p A has said, um that there's quote no demons traded safe concentration of lead in blood, like you shouldn't have any in The

problem is nothing but toxic to humans. There is no benefit. Yeah, and um, we'll talk about it in just a second. But the problem with lead is that we're figuring out that we shouldn't be exposed to it at all, while we're also simultaneously figuring out that we have a washed our planet in it from the last like a couple of hundred years. Basically, you wanna take a break. Yeah, all right, we'll come back and we'll talk about all

kinds of fun stuff, all right. So before I left, I t s that there is no function for lead in the body. It is nothing but toxic, uh in it. The way it behaves in your body in a negative way is really interesting. UM your body, and this happens a lot. I feel like we covered the body mistaking something for something else quite a bit. Is there there should be a word for that, uh, the case of mistaken identity. I guess that's it. But the body treats

lead like calcium. UM. So it's gonna go where calcium goes in the body, including your bones, which is super scary. Yeah. Lead settles in very comfortably into calcium receptors, and it's not just bones, Like that's what I always think of when I think of calcium, Like what you need calcium because your bones will break or you get rickets if you don't have it or whatever. Um, But calcium comes in handy throughout your whole body. And one of the big places that shows up is in calcium ions in UM.

Your neuronal activity. Right. So when your neurons fire, one of the ways that they fire, uh, is because the neurons or the calcium ions get them all excited and then poo, your your neurons is fired. If lead is in that calcium ion channel instead of calcium, that kaboo doesn't happen, and all of a sudden, your neurons aren't firing as much as they would if the lead wasn't present.

And now we have a big problem. Yeah, and it's especially big problem with children because children's little brains are uh, you know, we talked about plasticity before. They're constantly forming these new neural connections and any kind of lead in the mistaken for calcium is going to disrupt those connections. And so your child is literally their brain isn't going

to advance like it should, right exactly. Intellectually, Um, the apparently emotional centers like the amygdala can suffer UM that it's been found to produce hyperactivity, anti social behavior, UM, attention deficit disorder, all sorts of problems from the presence of lead, right. Um. And like you said, it's worse for kids because their brains are still developing and forming it's bad for anybody, but it's definitely worse for kids. And the other way that it affects kids is that

so the regions of their brains aren't developing correctly. But then simultaneously, calcium is also important in the formation of myelin, which is that protective sheath around the synapses between neurons. So that's kind of like flimsy, which means that the neurons aren't firing efficiently. So not only do you have brain regions affected, but the communication between brain regions are affected too in little kids. And the upshot is is that it promotes all sorts of problems with cognitive and

emotional and behavioral development and children. Yeah, and like literally lower i Q scores. And we should say that that's just like the most prominent horrifying effect of lead. There's a whole laundry list of other things that can happen to, like um kidney failure, pain in your bones and joints from all that lead settling into where the calcium is supposed to go. Yeah, how about decreased sex drive and sterility and infertility for both men and women. Uh, what else? Diarrhea,

lack of appetite, constipation. I think diarrhea is the least of your worries. If you have a lad blood, high blood pressure, enlarged heart. Uh, it's it's It affects virtually every system in your body basically. And the reason why again is because it mimics or it takes the place of calcium, and calcium is incredibly vital. It's an extremely important mineral that you need found throughout your body. And

if a leg goes in, it's like, um, I'm here instead. Yeah, it's not going to do the stuff that the calcium supposed to do, leading to all this cascade of horrific problems. Yeah. And one of the other scary things is that they unless you have acute lead poisoning, you may not know. In fact, you probably won't know that you're being slowly poisoned.

And you might just think, oh, I have diarrhea and I don't feel like having sex much anymore, and you might be slowly getting lead poisoning, and you you just blame that on too many buffalo wings. But boom, it's lead poison takes care of both. Uh. You remember being a kid and like lead pencils, like it was a big scare, Like you know you lead poisoning if you got poked with a pencil. Yeah, I remember that, But then I also remember learning that there's actually graphite used

in pencils. We should have a buy our age. You should have David Reeson. Oh yeah, how to sharpen a pencil and he can school you on some pencils. He wrote a whole book on it, literally wrote the book on pencil sharpening. Yeah. I still have let or I guess, graphite somewhere in my hand from when I was jabbed very deep with a pencil that broke off and it never left and there still just looks like a little black freckle. It's like you're in prison and got shanked.

I know, I can't find where it is. No, that's a scratch. So we've talked about all the cognitive problems that can come about and behavioral and emotional disorders that can develop from lead. And this is like study after study after study has found this. It's one of the big reasons why there have been so many restrictions placed

on lead exposure. Um And recently some people have some research chers, including a couple of well an economist I believe, and an epidemiologist have UM kind of taken that idea that lead can create all of these behavioral problems and any social behavioral problems UM and extrapolated to this idea that there is a big rise in the crime rate in the United States and actually around the world. That followed about twenty years UM the same trajectory of the

use of lead and gasoline. Super interesting article, very controversial, like when it came well it still is, UM, but yeah, it's very interesting. Yeah, it's called lead America's Real Criminal Element. It was in Mother Jones. Was written by Kevin Drum, who was one of the all time greats working today. And UM, I think I've mentioned it before, but I strongly encourage anybody it doesn't even matter if lads the most boring thing in the world to you go read

this article. You will be riveted by it. And Kevin Drum does a lot of He does a very good job of keeping his extrapolations down as low as possible, although anybody can see by the evidence that he lays out that this is it's pretty clear that lead is some sort of culprit in this UM and it's been shot down and that there's this idea that the science isn't settled. I suspect that it's the same mechanisms that force with climate denial. Like unsettled science doesn't prove anything.

If you look at all the studies associated with this, the correlation between lead use in gasoline and therefore lad emissions in UM cars and criminal activity and its decline again, it just follows it like twenty years after. And the whole idea is that when we started emitting lead into the atmosphere, UM, kids started suffering these cognitive and in

associal but avirs. And then about twenty years after these kids were born, they started actually carrying out criminal activity, and we saw a tremendous rise and everything from like murder to rape, to mugging's to everything. UM. And it's the articles too long to to really go into detail. Again, just strongly urge anybody to go read it. Yeah. The the um the backlash that I've seen on the article wasn't to me like it was all from scientists mainly. Yeah,

I read a few of them. They weren't poopooing the notion. They said this what this means is it bears a lot more investigation. UM. But as much as you want if you can't replicate it. It's still possible confirmation bias or just sure correlation and not causation, like could be a host of other issues that went into that. It could be And and Kevin Joon makes the same point. He's like, there's also a rise in the use of vinyl albums that followed roughly the same trajectory as well.

But um, you know, of course it needs more study for sure. Well this this one scientist said, what you really need to do is follow what he calls a cohort study, when you actually follow individuals along a long timeline. Um,

it's just a tough study. It's it bears a lot of uh to prove something like this just takes a lot more data than they have, right, And I think the guy you're referencing is Scott Firestone, who is, um, yeah, that was a good who wrote on the Discover magazine blog and um, you know he gives kudos to Drum who definitely deserves it for basically saying every time he says, you know, it's it's it's so obvious you have to be just you know, have your head in the stand

to deny this. He does say that, yes, speaking scientifically that does require more study. Super interesting though, because the crime and drum followed it all over the world. He didn't just go to the United States and he saw the same thing and Canada and Australia, in Great Britain. And the good news is if if that is the case, then we should see crime dropping. Yeah. But the problem is is that it also should get us to do basically mitigate the lead that isn't around, like in the

soil and in the water and everywhere and people's houses. Um. And the dollar amounts that he estimates it would cost are pretty prohibitive at least as far as like the public will goes from right now. But who knows. I mean, if enough science is done on it, and you get the scientific community vocally speaking about this, then maybe the public will will change. Uh. If you do have lead poisoning, you can't get on meds. Uh. There's a prescription called sustamer as U S C I M E R. That

was beautiful. Uh you see that or sucker over I like how you said, Um, it can reduce blood lead. Um. There of course always side effects with every medication. UM. And if you work, if you've like there's been a disaster and you get toxic lead in your body very quickly. UM, they can use something called kellation collation collection therapy. UH. And that's when they use a collating agent. I'm not even gonna try that. I'm gonna try it. Okay, Ethyl

lenna diamina tetracetic acid. Hey, not bad if you like super quick. I missed the last A. That's just a few letters off from super califragilistic xbomy. It looks like the alphabet when it's on paper, but we'll call it E E T A. And that's when it's infused into the bloodstream and actually binds. It basically says lead you're coming with me through your kidney, out of your body, right. UM. But they use that when it's just an acute toxic dose. UM,

that that a person has been exposed to. UM. If a kid's been found to be poisoned with lead, actually, from what I read, one of the best treatments that UM, they'll they'll carry out. They'll they'll be other stuff too, depending on how bad it is. But a really good nutritious diet. UM, getting the kid foods that are high and things like calcium and high in things like vitamin C that help the body absorb calcium so that they

can go displace lead in the body. Because if you've got lead and you've got calcium fighting for the for the same place, if you can get the calcium in there, it's going to displace the lead and then hopefully leave the body. It's like, I'm going home. That's gotta be hard on the kidney. So I don't know. I yeah, I think if you have an acute lead poisoning or a serious lead poisoning, it's not good. But yeah, of course it'd be hard on the kidneys because one of

the things is kidney failure in anemia. Uh it. Lead is um Lead is definitely invariably in the ground and the groundwater and then the soil um around us. And that's a problem because it's sort of works this way up the food chain and a weird way because what you have are these tiny organisms um it gets in their body, like plankton and microscopic plants, and they die and then other things eat that their waste, and then it just sort of like bigger animals come along and

keep eating these things. Yeah, it's not just humans that suffer from lead toxicity. Other animals too, even the small ones. So should we talk about these Flint lawsuits a little? Yeah, and then antilotis and that hopefully toxic. I guess it depends on who manufactured. So I did some reading on the lawsuits. Right now, there's more than a dozen and probably growing. A few of them are class action suits

on behalf of tens of thousands of Flint residents. And you know, attorneys always look their chops when they hear stuff like this. UM. But there's some concerns. One is that the state of Michigan is, like the city is broke, so don't even bother the state of Michigan. Maybe an out to go if you want to get a lot of money, but then they say that will just get

packs pass along to the taxpayer. UM. And a lot of experts in the legal world say that compensation is unlikely to begin with as far as money goes, because of something a couple of things. One thing called sovereign immunity, which basically means the government can say, you know, giving water to the citizens is a core government function, so we're shielded legally from liability for doing that, uh improperly, So like you can't sue us we're trying to give

you water. And the other thing is specific causation has to be proved. So not only do you have to prove that the lead came from that water and not like the lead pipes in your house or other like the lead paint in your walls maybe has to come specifically from that Flint River water. Uh, And you also have to prove that that directly lead to the problem

that your kid is having, and not you know other things. Well, one of the things I read was that it's very possible that the lead came from the pipes in those people's houses, but that it's still on the provider of the water because they were supposed to be following corrosion protection techniques that they lied about following. They weren't following them, so it got rid of that protective coating that had been on the lead pipes before and was bringing all

that lead into people's homes directly. So it may have been lead from the people's homes, but it was the corrosive nature of the terrible drinking water that was being pumped through those that caused that lead to be brought into the people's homes. And then again on top of it. The government was lying about using the techniques that they were supposed to be using to prevent that from happening.

So that now that they've switched back over to Detroit water, it's going to take a while for that protective film to develop on the pipes again. So even now that the different waters coming through, it's still lousy with lead. And the sad thing is that some people in Flint are too um poor to do anything about it, and they's still need water, so they're still drinking leaded water even though they know that it's going to hurt them down the line. Well, and it's sad that it sounds

like getting real compensation is maybe unlikely. Yeah, because a lot of these people who have kids, like if their kids suffer severe cognitive development problems, they're gonna need help like the rest of their lives. Yeah. This one guy, uh, he's a law professor specializing in environmental law named Noah Hall.

He says, what the probably the smart thing to do if you really want to help these people is set up do what they did with the Deepwater Horizon spill and set up a victim's compensation fund um instead of doing it via lawsuit like legislator legislated, Um, maybe that would help. I don't know. Yeah, I don't know that. He basically said what the states shouldn't do his fight this, He's like, that would be big trouble. Uh. He said they should set up some sort of fund so then

they look like the good guys still. But then I think you don't get all the dirty details dragged out in public like you would with a lass. Well, apparently they're already coming out anyway, like tropes of emails have been released. Um. The the governor set up a task force to find out who is to blame. And they turned around and they were like you um, and he said,

fired the task for right exactly, You're all fired. Um. Yeah, I don't know what's gonna happen, but it's it's very scary public health scare Flint, Uh, I know, talk about a city it's been roughed up over the years. I know. Well, we're there with you, Flint, hanging there. If you want to learn more about lead or Flint or criminal activity, you can check out all these different articles on the Internet and you can type lead into the search bar house to works dot com and it'll bring up a

pretty great article. Since I said pretty great articles, time for a listener, I'm gonna call this Finland rules. Remember we did the Dark Money podcast and I was like, what's a good place. It's not corrupt. I remember we heard from a lot of people. Um in Scandinavia. Hi, I'm an American living in Helsinki for the last few years with my finished husband. Um, Chuck, you were right on the money when he said there's very little political

corruption here. Of course there are some, but because there are humans after all, But the level compared to the States is laughable. When I asked my husband about it, he thought for a second and asked about corruption scandals. He said, a few years back, Uh, there was something about a prime minister who accepted lumber from a company to build his house. That was it. It seems comical to me considering the States in an election year. Also, the campaign season is much shorter here, and it's done

a little different. Party runs there at least five major parties. That's crazy in and of itself, like crazy, good party runs and whichever gets a majority elects from its ranks the prime minister and makes a cabinet out of a coalition of the other parties which received high numbers of votes. How about that, Like you came in second, you're on board too, Come on and here's your participant. Ribbon campaigns

are paid for by disclosed donations and public funds. Uh. You also made a comment about the high taxes here. Many people, usually Americans, say that with this taste, that the taxes are so high here. But I've come to think very highly of it. I've discovered that I don't really need another pair of jeans or a new jacket, but I need there's an educated society around me, in access to quality healthcare, and a truly equal society where everyone is safe and has her basic needs met. Uh.

That it's from Gabrielle. Wow, a lot of people hate your guts for saying that. Gabrielle, that was so brave of you. Thanks Gabrielle for writing in. Um, I don't know how they say audios in Finland. No, she's American. Well goodbye, Okay, thank you for writing in. If you want to get in touch with us, you can tweak to us at s Y s K podcast. You can join us on Facebook dot com slash stuff you should know if you can send us an email to stuff podcast that how stuff Works dot Com and has always

join us on the web. It's stuff You You Know dot com. For more on this and thousands of other topics, visit how stuff Works dot com. M