Understudies: Hardest Workers on Broadway?

Of course not, there was no successor Ben bowling his mind on April Fool's Day. Yeah, that was a good one. But we know that wouldn't fly. No, he got we loved then. Yeah, of course we don't want to put him in that situation. How interesting update. So I was just looking, Josh. The reason I thought to do a

podcast on understudies is twofold. I was in New York recently and I went to Broadway and saw Neil Simon's Plaza Suite with s JP and Matthew Broderick in the lead roles there, and that together the first time they have shared the Broadway stage in a couple of decades, and I think their first lead performances opposite one another real life husband and wife and it was great and we had a great time. And uh, two things happened

on that trip. Want to hung out with Joey cra Are good friend, and Joey was talking about his friend who was a understudy in Hamilton's I believe the touring production but maybe not. Who knew like six different parts that this gentleman could sub ind for and we talked a lot about that. Now I was kind of blown

away and it got me thinking about understudies. But then right after we left New York, Matthew Broderick got COVID just a week or and a half or two weeks into his run because we saw the last preview and his un or study took over. In a play that is almost just two people, everyone's going to see this real life husband and wife on stage, so when the understudy comes on, it's not great. But I was just looking to see if I could find his name. And as of like three days ago, a s JP now

has COVID, so they have just canceled through. Uh when they're better, which is like another week or so, which is something you know that the show must go on. Is the sort of line and Broadway, and that is the whole idea of the understudy is that if someone is sick or stubs their toe or falls off the stage, there is someone else there that knows the part that can immediately step in and play this part um ideally close to identically as the as the lead or you know,

even if it's not the lead, any any part. Yeah, I saw, I put that understudies or the insurance policies make sure the show will go on right. But after reading this and Olivia, who did our Unsung Heroes of the Court, she got another Unsung Heroes of Broadway article here, uh, understudies and standbys and the swing, and we'll talk about what all these terms mean. They are truly heroes because it is astounding what they are tasked to be able

to do right. Like true, they don't save people's lives or they don't you know, learn proprities or anything like that, but they are they are heroes in their own way. They're certainly the hardest working people in show business if you ask me. Yeah, And and it will become clear why because you might just think what you learn a part and if someone goes down, you do that part. Oh hang, onto your hats. It is much more than that, yeah hang on to you, Yeah, I got You're about

to make a joke. So um. So we are talking understudies, and most people check think that when you're talking about an understudy, it is like you said, you just you know a part and if, if some if the star goes down, you fill in. And it's a pretty thrilling idea, like you know, somebody getting their shot at a big

break after sitting in the sidelines. Um, and it can be it can be very um aptly compared to that backup quarterback who literally is sitting on the sidelines and they get their chance and they show like what a great job they're doing. On Broadway, there's the same thing,

and that is the understudy. But there's a bunch of different kinds of understudies, and the one that most people think of is actually called a standby, which is where you are the person who knows every single word movement, dialogue, song, um, blocking que that the lead of that play knows, and so if that that lead goes down, then you stand in. But you can go potentially years without ever getting that call, like over over the run of a place, a multi years run it will play. You might be on stage

a handful of times because you're that's your job. Is that specific. You You've got one role and you're filling in for one part only on the basis of some accident or unforeseeable circumstances happened to the lead, so you

have to step in. That's what most people think of as an understudy, but in reality, that's actually the job of the standby, right, and the standby you know, if it's like in the case of Plaza Suite, where it is largely two people on stage at all times you need another, it's it's probably not going to be some unknown that's gonna be the standby for either s JP or m b uh. And in this case I did find his name. His name is Michael McGrath. And Michael

McGrath is a very He's won a Tony Award. He's a very sort of renowned old school I think five or six years older than Broadwerick even uh Broadway guy. So in a situation like this, you have a heavy hitter on standby that is um just hoping that Matthew Broderick gets food poisoning or COVID, right, so he can step in there. Uh, And I looked up Sarah Jessica Parker has an understudy too, and it's kind of a

shame that they canceled. But in the case of that, you know, you have to make a call as a production, and when it's your two lead stars and in a play of two, uh, it's probably the right call to go ahead and cancel that because what you don't want to deal with is a lot of, as you'll see, unhappy ticket buyers, which happens exactly. So that's a standby, right, And that's they're what the New York Times called the most elite type of understudy. Again, that's what I always

thought was an understudy. But an understudy, it turns out, is somebody who is part of the cast who goes on usually night after night, well Kenny, but not always okay, But they are also ready to fill into one or

more roles, usually a principal role. That's the understudy. Whereas standby is like you might not even be in the theater, but you're on call every time that show is on, and you are expected to be within five minute run or drive to the theater so you can get there because something has gone horribly wrong, and understudy is somebody that's that has a much more frequently attached position at the theater, and usually it's a role in the ensemble cast. Yeah,

I think they're usually in the cast. I don't think it has to be a lot of this is determined, as we'll see, by the Actor's Union for Broadway, which actor's equity and the deals they work out with producers. But before you get to those specifics, you also have your swing. And this is what Joey's friend would be. A swing can cover a lot of different roles, and a swing might be like a performer in the chorus, but can jump up there and play Hamilton's or Jefferson

or Burr at any and this this dude could do that. Uh. It is one of the more impressive things to accomplish, I think, because you know all these parts, you know all the songs, like you said, you know all the choreography and the blocking. You've got to know, as Olivia points out, something you don't even think about, which is um between between sets. I have to go back and I gotta know what costume I'm supposed to be in,

and who to talk to, who has that costume? Like, you've got to know every single part to be able to seamlessly transition so that no one, I mean they know because they announced, like you know, in the role of for Matthew Broderick tonight, the understudy will be performing

and the collective's grown. But uh, had had it not be for that announcement, in a regular understudy role, you shouldn't be able to tell the difference, No, because it's not it's not the star, it's not the lead necessarily right, Just yeah, you you would never know. But that is

something with the swing. So like, um, they might know anywhere between five to a dozen of those roles, and like you were saying, each of those roles has different costume changes, different choreography, different um, different words to to say or sing like, and they know all of those

inside and out. And when you start to understand what a swing does, then you start to get what I was saying earlier that they are probably the hardest working people in show business because and on any given night, they're ready to go at a moment's notice to to do those roles, um at the drop of a hat. And and it's because they've worked so hard up to that point. And keep working too. It's not like there's

a time where you can stop and relax. As long as the show is running um over the course of weeks, months, years, however long it goes, you have to You have to basically keep your engine revving, ready to to put it in to drive all of a sudden, peel out on the stage, lay rubber from the wings. That's how they always put it in in the acting world. So that's the understudy standbys and the swings are also alternates UH.

And this is someone who is scheduled to take the place of one of the actors in that you might be in UH Chicago for a three year run and you're like, I don't do the matinees anymore. We have an alternate that does my matinees. Everyone knows this going in. It's not like a sickness or anything happened, or an injury happened. Tickets half price, UH. So I mentioned the

the Actor's Equity UH and the Broadway producers. They work through these contracts just like they would with UH SAG or the Writer's Guild with film and television, and it's all you know, you don't have a choice on Broadway of how many understudies and standbys and swing that you hire. It's all sort of contractual. You have to hire and understudy for every single role except for bit players and in some case stars. Uh. In the case of Plaza Suite,

of course they had understudies. But if it's a one person show, you're not gonna throw an understudy up there because it's it's really about that one person's Like, there may be some leeway there according to like the production and how they run it, but you're not required to understudy the star. Yeah. They also, um probably, well, they don't necessarily need to hire understudies if it's a limited

run show, like for a few weeks or more. Um. Anything beyond that though, they probably will need to hire understudies, right or if it's off Broadway or in you know, a third area, uh stage theater, it's all bets are off. You can do whatever you want. Yeah, you're smart hire understudies,

so yeah, for sure. Um. One of the other things too, is that you start to get into logistics because if you're working with understudies and they have a regular role in the ensemble, if the lead that the understudy is working under falls ill or sprains their ankle or whatever happens.

Believe me, a lot of stuff happens on Broadway. Um, that understudy is no longer filling that role in the ensemble, which means now you've got to go to your swings and does that swing have anything else that they were doing that you need to bring another swing. And suddenly, like like like ups route in the middle of a blizzard, It's like my nightmare. Logistics is like, I those are the true heroes. To me, you say understudies are true heroes.

I think logisticians who deliver things are like reroute planes. I think they're the true hero is because I could not do it. Yeah, and in the case of like a Hamilton's or a bigger show with a bunch of people that are singing and dancing, if you have a a flu that sweeps through you know, let's talk pre COVID and we'll get to what COVID did to Broadway. But you know, a flu that sweeps through the cast and like three people go down in a week. It's a jinga game as a production because like you said,

you're pulling people from one role to another. Then he'll fools that who feels that role then who feels that role? And all of a sudden you're looking at the stage hand and you're going, can you dance? All right? Have you been attention? Rip off of their norm core outfit, and all of a sudden they're wearing a tight fitting tuxedo and soft shoes underneath. It's so good, What a

what a story. So let's go back to talking about logisticians. Okay, but there's an equation, Chuck, that these producers and the director and everybody, Although I think it's probably up to the producers are making. When you start to go down the list and you're moving everybody around, Eventually you get to a point where the show or the cast doesn't really resemble the cast that the people coming to see

the show are are coming to see. And after a certain point, it's probably like, um, people are so many people are gonna ask for a refund or some partial refund or something that you're better off just giving everybody some time off and just you know, canceling the show

for a day or two. Yeah, you know those uh, I mean, Livia came up with some great examples over the years of like when multiple people go down in there was a cold on this out of Falsettos and the lead role Stephanie J Block's roll of Trino went down,

understudy went down, and then there was a swing. Stephanie umo u m o h um, covering different roles, had to take the stage in the lead with a two and a half hour lead time and apparently had to even use the script on stage, but got a bunch of um support in cheers from the audience, which, um,

you know, like we said, audiences can be unkind. But my experience with Broadway is that theatergoers are understand this stuff and try to be supportive when something like this happens, even though they're expectations in their hopes maybe a bit dashed. Like Livia talks about people booing and stuff like that. I wouldn't like to think that happened. I'm sure it has,

but they're all from jersey Bridge and Tunnel Baby. Uh. Generally, I think there are more stories of people trying to port the people on stage then go ah, what is this? I want my money back? Yeah, like clapping for the person who has to use the script because they're so unprepared. That's a very meta modernist response to that. Let's take a break. Okay, then we'll come back and talk about what kind of money these people make right after this

and things chop and chock stop. Okay, we're back, everybody, and we are back to talk about moolaw Somolians, cash, clamp, lettuce, cabbage, Uh, what else? What are the kids saying these days? Bread? Yeah, they're bringing dead back, aren't they do? I think it's dough. I can't remember money. We'll say cheese, all right. Uh. If you are a understudy again with the with the unions, all of this stuff is um is prescribed how much you're gonna get paid um, even if you don't take

the stage. It's not like there's like, well you're the understudy, you didn't ever make it to the main stage, so you get a pay cut. That is not the case. You get a minimum as a Broadway performer. Uh. And this was as maybe a little bit different now. I'm not sure if they renegotiate it since then, but two thousand thirty four dollars a week on an actor's equity

contract on Broadway. Yeah, and so some people who are in the cast every night, in the ensemble, who have who go on stage every night, may actually make less than a swing who doesn't go on at all. And if you stop and think about it, that actually makes a lot more sense because that one person who's going on every night in the ensemble knows what's going to happen that night. They get a chance to like create

their character and like rehearse and understand it. And as we'll see, like understudies, swings they don't get those kind of opportunities, and yet they're expected to know not just one role, but eight roles and be ready to go on. So it makes a lot more sense. And frankly, I think they deserve even more money than they get because of the requirements of their job. But why would a swing make more We didn't even say because they have to understand and practice and rehearse for more parts. Well,

they get paid more. We never even said that, right, Swings are in additional pay bumps. Oh, I'm sorry, I thought that. I thought that we had kind of established that in some way shape or form. No, no, no, no, no. Your minimum is two thousand, thirty four dollars a week, and if you were a swing or an understudy, you

make pay bumps. On top of that, swings get a hundred and one dollars and seventy cents, or fifteen dollars if you're a partial swing and an understudy of a principal role gets an additional fifty four dollars and fifty cents or understudying ensemble and extra fifteen dollars. Right, So take take take what I was saying before, and now move it to to like right here, because it will

make more sense now that I've said that. But you can understand I think that it's I think you should get a bump for every role that you have, not just a bump for having multiple roles. You know, well, yeah, it'd be great, like if you are a swing for like six rolls, Yeah, you'd be like a hundred bucks a people don't don't put me on stage, give me another role instead. There. I'm sure we have Broadway understudies listening there. They're probably like, hey, let's get Josh in

there from this next union negotiation. Yeah, give me a cigar and like an ill fitting vest and I'll roll up my shirt sleeves and get down to business. Because you're probably the only person that's ever asked for that. Like I'm a genius. I just came just give them more money. Uh, if you're preparing for this, I mean there. You know, depending on who you are as an actor, you're gonna have different ways of preparing period. Uh. And

Livia found some good examples of what some people have done. Uh. There was an actor named j. Douglas in two thousand seven, a member of Drowsy Chaperone, because that's a laugh out loud Broadway title, it is. Uh. He covered two ensemble actors and stand by, uh in a standby for four principles.

So that's a lot of work. And Douglas would sit in the audience at least you know initially, and sit there with a with a recorder and quietly record all the movements and then go home and transcribe this stuff and then just study, study, study, basically. Yeah, that's one high stress job court stenographer colliding with another high stress job of understudy or swing, you know the job. So Jay Douglas um would would take all those notes and and create basically like a dossier on each of the

characters he was expected to fill in for. And so if you got enough notice, he could like consult the dossier and you know, refresh his memory of it, like if you're an ensemble actor or even a lead like you probably have one script and that's all you need. This this like like Jay Douglas and others would have like multiple scripts and multiple like workups or write ups on their on their different characters that in and of

itself differentiates them to an astounding degree totally. UM. And then you know, besides just learning the stuff all the things that we talked about, UM, sometimes it's different accents you know that you have to do and kind of bounce between. You also have to be in in broadway shape.

And uh, Livia found the example of uh, he's either loquette or Looquette Charnell Pringle who was a swing on Mrs doubt Fire, who, aside from learning all these parts over and over again, uh, in her mind was like you know, doing PT and like physical training and doing voice work because you have to keep in physical shape and you have to keep your voice ready for that kind of stamina that it takes because you may may

not just be a single performance. You may have to step in for a week or more, or you may eventually become that part. Yeah, that's the thing we'll talk about. But there is a possibility that you could end up like permanently in that role if if things work out in your favor. You gotta have your your toolbox ready right. One of the things I said is, I don't want to make it seem like it's easy to be an ensemble member of a Broadway show. It's that this is

the point. It's really really hard, stressful, anxiety inducing work to do that, And it's work like it's definitely craft and the people who do this love what they're doing, but it's also like really hard work. Um. What I'm saying is that if you are an ensemble or a principle and you go out there every night, you have all sorts of benefits of developing your character just through

sheer repetition over time, learning the learning everything. So it's it's like wrote, Um, the people who work as under studies and swings, they don't get that. They very frequently will have not actually done any sort of real rehearsal before they might be pushed out on stage and asked to go ahead and deliver a performance that's on caliber with whoever it is they're replacing, even though they've never

actually rehearsed that kind of thing. Yeah, I mean, if you are a principle standby, then chances are they call it a put in. Chances are you have rehearsed with the main cast, You've gotten in that costume, you've worked with the orchestra and the show lighting, because you know

that's all that all counts. Like if you're if you haven't rehearsed this stuff, if you've just done it under just the regular stage lights being on and they're like the musicians aren't there, Like every thing changes when it's go time and that curtain drops on the night, and if you're not used to that, it's a whole different situation. But if you are a principal, you've probably done put ins and at least gotten the benefit of maybe a

rehearsal or two. Um I would like to think in the case of something like Plaza Suite that s JP did a full run throughs with the Matthew Broadwick's standby and vice versa, because it's just such a high pressure

situation with just the two parts. But if you're in a big show, there are no guarantees that you're gonna have gone through any rehearsal at all necessarily, or if you are, it's rehearsing with other understudies and swings and maybe the assistant director with no music and no stage lighting and no costumes like on a like during the day on a on a weekday, right and even during those rehearsals, um swings might have to fill in from

multiple parts during the rehearsal. So I mean, just like just the lighting alone, you've to know the lighting cues. You've got to know where to stand. If the lights supposed to be on you, you want to step in just the right place because that's where the lighting person is going to shine that light. If you're rehearsing with worklights, that's a huge disadvantage if you've never done like the

lighting blocking. And that's that's that's basically like part and parcel with how understudies and standbys and swings are expected to work at a genuine disadvantage, but they're expected to give, you know, like on caliber performances with the people who have had all those advantages. Another reason why I say the hardest working people in show business. I'm picturing a scenario one day, by the way, you might be able

to hear hammering next door. There's construction next door. I can't hear it, Okay, I just wanted to let everyone know in case you hear a hammer banging. Uh, it was bound to happen because there's construction next door. But I'm picturing a scenario one day where we're all out in New York with you, Me and Emily. We're all having dinner with a big group of people and someone's like, oh,

my friends coming is an a Broadway show. We're all excited, and Emily's was a theater girl, so she's musical theater. So she's like peppering them with questions. And you go. You take like a sip on your martini and say, so, how many parts did you play? And the table gets quiet and they're like, oh, just the one. It was one of the main ensemble parts. And you go, oh, just the one. Interesting, man, you just nailed your impression of me, and every and just everyone gets really quiet.

We're like, what's the deal with Josh because they get up and go to the bathroom and I say, he's all about the understudy and they go oh, And I'm in the bathroom going like what do I say wrong? Why? Why did you hope that happens with dinner to Josh, so Chuck, let's move on. UM. Rehearsals not good as

far as the understudies go. One of the other things that I think we have to mention that you pointed out earlier is that UM, especially with principles and stars of the show, those UM, those standbys and understudy are expected to deliver exactly the same performance that the star does every night. Like you, they they're not like, go in there and do it your way, kid, They're they're like, go in there and do it exactly the way this actual star does it. Kid, don't screw up. And there's

real reason behind that. Like it's not just like you know, you're being treated like cattle. It's, um, the star has done this in a certain way so that other people have come to expect this ad lib lind that was ad libbed once three years ago and now is like a regular part of the show, even though it's not. They expect you to say that same line, so that you have to know that role, that character so well that you know how you know the character that the

actual star has created from the script. That's what they want you to do, because if not, somebody's line is going to get thrown off, and you can throw off the entire production like that. Yeah, like the understudy knows this, so it's not like, uh, the understudy thinks, so this can be my chance to really show them what I bring to the role, and then their hopes get dashed. I'm sure you're not necessarily doing a an impersonation of

Matthew Broderick as you understudy. Uh So, like things like intonation, you might be able to change it up a little bit, but generally they want you to do what he does. Um. And we'll talk a little bit more about what COVID has done, But one apparent thing that COVID has done is given a little more appreciation to the understudy and a little bit more of a well, hey, in certain situations, maybe it's okay for you to bring something else to the role if we talk about it beforehand and stuff

like that, like don't surprise everybody. Uh, I mean if you literally have to go on stage, like if someone someone falls over with an appendicitis like ten minutes before curtain. That doesn't happen a lot. Usually there's a little bit of lead time. But uh, in the case of Olivia, found this scray article for mental floss with a bunch of cool examples. There was a matinee of Wicked and midway through the show, Adele de ziem Oh, sorry, Adena Menzel.

Do you even get that? Reference? Is that Adell's last name? That was during the Academy Awards, Uh, John Travolta, he famously introduced Adina Menzel as Adele Desim. Really, I knew that he had screwed it up, but I didn't realize he screwed it up that bad. Yeah, he completely made up a first name in the surname. He's like, why is your name so weird? It's great, it's one of

the all time blenders. But Adina Menzel fell mid show and fractured a rib and Showshana Bean had to go on halfway through the show, and so there's all this like chaos going on to try and get her in there and dress so the show doesn't miss a beat. And then poor Shoshana Bean is also in the back of her mind like I wasn't really told what was

going on. Just Adele Desim has gone to the hospital, and so this is also in the back of the mind as of like, oh my goodness, what's happened to this person that I've been understudying, who I probably have a lot of respect for and maybe have grown close to, but also like how her it is she? And is this gonna? Is this my big break? Like all the emotion that comes with something like that is something that you have to just be able to check when you

tread those boards, right. I want to verify for myself, and I think every listener who caught it you said a del design the second time. It's not okay, okay, good job, Okay. I want to make sure because you slid it in there so well, thank you thought you'd pulled the josh and just completely flubbed it. Well, I was gonna just leave it in there as a hidden

joke to begin with. Well, we'll edit this. When I could tell that you didn't get it the first time, I had to explain so um Karen quack and bush Um is another example of that I've read about in a New York Times article from I think like two

thousand one. She was a standby for Bernadette Peters in and get your gun, and the same thing happened, like Bernadette Peters got really ill with the stomach virus and apparently like I was able to keep it together long enough to make it to UM the intermission, and they

called Karen Quackenbush. She was having I guess a birthday dinner with her husband down the street and she ran got into a cab and got to the to the show just in time to hear everybody booing or when they were announced, and they announced that she would be taking over for UM for Bernadette Peters. But um, that is extremely rare. But it's got to be so dramatic and stressful that those stories are eternally delightful. I could just listen to them all day. Well, I mean, even

though it's basically the same story every time. Yeah, how many situations are there where you're a performer who gets their big break and you're walking into it knowing everybody's going to be disappointed when they see me walk out there? Right, and I have to withhold all of my creativity and make the star just exactly as I can. And on that note, Chuck, you want to take a break real quick, Yeah, let's do it. Okay, we'll be right back, everybody, and

things like chop and cho, Okay, we're back. And as I was saying, those Uh, those stories where you know, somebody gets their big break um because the star you know got sick or whatever. A few far between. Um. But for the most part, all the stuff we've talked about where like the stress um having to you know, keep your creativity, your own personal creativity in check and do mimicry um, like being on call and never having any idea when you're going to go on. For some people,

you're like, I would never want to do that. It sounds awful, But there are people who like make careers out of this, this type of of acting um. And it's one of those things where once you proved yourself once twice a couple of times, you can they will call you any time you want them to. You can be an understudy, you can be a standby, you can be an alternate for the rest of your life because it's so difficult to do that. If you prove yourself,

you're in. Yeah. I think there's a lot of jobs in the world that some people view as stepping stones or transient jobs that other people are quite happy to do their whole life. I remember when I first went to l A and when I was eighteen and my brother worked on Dear John, and I was an X you Got Me off as an extra. I love that show. It was so good and I was in it. Which what which episode? Oh? I remember Kirk goes skiing John.

I don't remember exactly what happened. I could probably dig it up, but I play a bus boy in a scene, and uh, eighteen year on me, I looked like I was twelve, but I was up there with the extras in between, and this is my first experience with any of this stuff. And um, I remember these extras that

seemed so old to me. They were probably in their thirties now that I look back, but they were kind of career extras, and I remember talking to them about that and they were like, you know, uh sure, I still audition, but like the reality has hit me that I'll probably never make it. But hey, I'm in the Union,

I've got great health care. I constantly work as a stand in or a or a u uh an extra or a featured extra and make good money and I know my schedule and like, I'd rather do this than wait tables or something where waiting tables that can be a permanent job. I worked with career waiters as well, but under studies. Like you said, it's not always just

a transient thing you gotta have. Just because you're good on stage and you can sing and dance doesn't mean you can handle the kind of pressures, additional pressures that come with this. It takes a special kind of performer, and some people are good at it and they know it and they stick to it. I'm sure they always would want that lead part, but it's not like they're like, oh, if I could just get out of this understudy thing

all the time. Now. Some people really get off on the additional pressure of not knowing and knowing like you could be called it any second. Some people like really like that, and then the additional work of having to understand and know all these different parts, Like some people really like that. But like you said, a lot of people viewed as a stepping stone, and astonishingly actually has

been a stepping stone. Like sometimes the stars have aligned for people whose names we know today because they started out as an understudy or a standby. UM. And Bernardette Peters who I mentioned, UM, she she went down during one performance. She actually started out as an understudy, I think, all the way back in age thirteen, and then later on on Broadway with her first real Broadway job. Um, she was a standby, so she started out. I don't know that she had any like um like moment where

you know she she hit it big. I think she just was one of those you know, workhorses who was like doing whatever job you can and then just kept going from there and became a star as a result. Yeah. Like, as the story goes, she understudied and performed, uh the lead part or I don't know about the lead because I don't know, Uh, I think the child lead. I

don't know Gypsy as well, but played Dainty June. Um filled in and did this and apparently this the story goes, Burnett Peter's mom put that on the resume that like

she she played Dainty June. I'm curious, you know this was in the night early nineteen sixties, about the sort of ethics of doing that now of your resume, Like if you put you know, aid opposite Sarah Jessica Barker in Plaza swee, They're like, well you did that for three days, Like I don't know if if you're allowed to put that on your resume, right, um, I mean, or you could point it out like understudy and filled

in for so many days. But from the impression I get Burnard Peter's mom kind of said like she played this on Broadway, right, But at least Bernardette Peters had did plausible deniability where she's like, yeah, I'm um, I didn't know this. But Anthony Hopkins apparently got a huge break because he was an understudy this Sir Lawrence Olivier in the West End. Yeah. Um, there was a play called The Dance of Death, um, which sounds like a really odd, unnerving play. Um. It's said in like a

remote Swedish island. I think in the nineteenth century it's just weird. Um. But in nineteen sixty seven, um Olivier came down with appendicitis and Anthony Hopkins filled in for him, and Olivier basically said he crowned him as like his successor by writing about what a good job he said. He walked away with the part of Edgar that was Olivier's role, like a cat with a mouse between its teeth. So that was a huge break for Anthony Hopkins to

start out with him. You know, long story, short hand ballecter uh Tay Diggs, who famously was in rent and obviously in TV and films. He was an understudy UH in nineteen revival of Carousel and then Shirley McLain UH film legend. Shirley McClain was an understudy on Broadway the nineteen fifties as a teenager and uh ten days into the main performance, I believe it was Carol Haney fell

ill or just fell, Yeah, I think fell. It was an injury in this case finished the show, but Shirley McClain had to fill in with about a half hour's notice. Screwed up a little bit, cursed audibly on stage because she goofed up and like dropped her hat in one scene. But everyone was impressed, and Alfred Hitchcock came to see that play a few months later and cast her in The Trouble with Harry, and she went on too great great fame. Yeah, and she became whose mom was she? Uh?

Whose mom? Who's whose? Whose kids? I don't know? I don't either. I always want to say Carrie Fisher. But this Debbie Reynolds kid, right, is that what you're thinking? Maybe? Maybe who knows? Um, there's another one to chuck that's worth mentioning because she kind of ushers us into the Broadway in the Covid age. Her name is Sutton Foster. She was an understudy. She tried out for the lead and thoroughly modern Millie and she didn't get it. So she said, okay, well will you make me the understudy

to that role? And it turned out the actor who had that role UM left and so they turned to Sutton Foster and said, hey, you wanna you wanna star and she turned it into a I think a Tony

Award in two thousand two. Well, fast forward to December and she's working as the the lead in UM, the Music Man, I believe, and she catches Covid and her understudy takes over for her, Cathy Void co Void co yeah v O y t k O. She took over four and she did such a great job that one of the greatest people on the planet, from what I can tell, Hugh Jackman gave a UM now famous speech, UM singing the praises of understudies and Cathy Void singular

almost almost he had to stop himself, you could tell, but he was talking about. He said something like, when when she arrived for work today, she could have played any of eight different roles and then went on to basically talk about how understudies are like the thing that keeps Broadway going. And it was because Sutton Foster came down with COVID that the void Coode got to kind of step into that spotlight courtesy of Hugh Jackman and UM.

One of the reasons it became such big news was not just because Hugh Jackman gave the speech, although in large part it was, but also because COVID was just decimating Broadway at the time, and there were shows that were like, you know, having to cancel performances. There were all sorts of understudies and standbys and alternates being thrown every which way. UM, And it was a really hard time, and I think still in some ways is a hard time for Broadway right now. Like you said, ump Plaza

Suite is now is currently dark, right, Yeah, because of COVID. Yeah, I mean, I think what it did was it really highlighted the necessity and the value of swing and understudies and standbys. I think they were probably, at least it seems, just from reading up on it for many years, a little taken for granted of course, that they would always be there. Maybe under hired because Broadway, like a lot in the film and television industry, you are expected to

perform sick or injured unless you absolutely cannot. It's not like regular jobs. You're like, I don't feel too good, I can't go in. It's like you go in anyway. Uh. There was a um. The president of Actors Equity, Kate Schindel, tweeted out and this was about, you know, the COVID surge and the slide on understudies. Tweeted this, Uh, my educated guess is that when employers consistently reject our efforts to negotiate for more swings under studies and substage managers,

we haven't even talked about that. Like if you're on the crew, when you get six, someone has to fill in. Because the industry model has grown dependent on people working sick or injured. It's shortsighted and unsafe. Uh. And this,

you know, kind of forced Charlotte st. Martin, who was president of the Trade Association of the Broadway League, to sort of apologize, not sort of to like fully apologize and and kind of call for producers to cover their shows adequately, and like said before, it led to more things like hey, maybe an understudy can actually bring a little something to the role. Maybe we shouldn't take such

uh take them for granted as much. Yeah, Charlotte Saint Martin had apparently thrown some shade on the understudies, and um got called out by Kate Sheindel. So I guess from from what the New York Times is saying, they are able to or they're using this to to try to make it easier on understudies and same boys, to to give them like full rehearsals and actually have the lighting people there during it and like like make it so that it's just a slightly less stressful job and

that there's more of them working. Um, which is yeah, that is good, Like that's a that's an improvement. It's the same thing like you were saying with the film industry when the transition it's going through now, where it's like, no, you really shouldn't work at twenty eight hour day every day and just be expected to, uh whenever the director producer wants you to be there. You know, it's um. Any anytime there's an improvement like that, it's an improvement

for all him into that. Uh. The one thing I don't think we mentioned that I think is uh important is that sometimes you may audition as the understudy, and sometimes you may audition for the lead role. If it's not like already set in stone, like Matthew Broderick is gonna play this role and that's why we're doing it. If it's just open auditions for the lead role, they might say, oh, you're really good and I'm not gonna cast you, but I'd love to cast you as the understudy.

Sometimes it goes that way. Yeah, So like if you want to be on stage, you have to basically be like, I'm not I'm not doing this anymore, Like I'm not taking understudy parts because you can get typecast into him because it's hard to do and not everybody wants to do. Or your roll with ice that you know, things happen that thoroughly modern Millie's gonna crack her ankle. Yeah, that was that other funny story we didn't kind of get

to about. Uh. Someone wrote in It Feels Like anonymously to play Bill that was an understudy that said, you know, I secretly wanted to poison the lead actor because like you don't think about like beside is all the work that goes into it. They're like, we we could never make firm plans with anybody. We can never schedule anything because you're you know, you're just on call, that on call life of stuff, whether you're a pediatrician or a or an understudy or a logistician or very nice bring

it all back around. You got anything else? Uh? Nothing else, sir? Well, everybody, I say, go out and hug and understudy a standby, a swing or an alternate today. Ask him first. Yes, they may not want to be hugged, especially if they're not wearing a name tag with the hug dot system on. That's right. Um, well, since Chuck said that's right, of course, everybody, that means it's time for a listener. Mayo, I'm gonna call this uh Sliding Canada. As always, Hey, guys, love

the show. Promised to keep it short. Just listen to the pubs episode, which we heard a lot of people really like. That episode, by the way, which brought back tons of good memories of two summers I spent taking Canadian undergrads to ales. There were many pubs, but I can't not note that Josh said George Washington took his troops to a pub to quote toast the British leaving

the continent of North America. End quote, knock knock, Canada called unless George Washington was still kicking it in nineteen thirty one when the Statue of Westminster was signed, or in two and Canada's Constitution was repatriated. But even then the Crown's representative is still the head of state up here. I realized this is the most pedantic sam of emails. I never heard that. But one of us has to

make use of a PhD in Canadian literature somehow. Love the show heard every episode all the best Brenna, very nice, Brenda. That was we just got taken to school and putting one of those desks that you lift the top onto the man. That's how that's how hard we just got school. Chuck. I'm sorry to drag you along with me, but I'm we're there from moral support. I'll be there. I'll just make clear the inkwell outside and I'll get in with you.

Who is that, Brenna? That was Brenna. It was a correction that was smarmie but also charming and funny, which made it lovable. That's right. So if you want to send us an email, like Brenna did. Let's see what you got. Take your best shot, don't smoke pot or do? You can send it off to stuff podcast at i heeart radio dot com. Stuff you Should Know is a

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