How Makeup Works

International Witness that day? Did h? And? Well today, well we're recording not actually today's witness releases. We're gonna miss it by a week or we're still going to be celebrating it though, right exactly because we we let it roll and that way you say when you let a party go along. I've never heard that. I just made it up. I don't go to parties. I don't either, apparently because I don't know what to say when you wanted to keep going. So Chuck, Um, we are talking

friend about makeup today. Sixty billion dollar cosmetic industry. Yeah, it's a sixty two point five and that's up from forty billion when this article that we're working off of was originally written, which apses me Molly Edmonds in two dozen, like seven or eight maybe two, I think, yeah, I mean it surprised me in one way. One way it doesn't because big industries usually grow, but that's an enormous

amount of growth. Yeah, but it seems like, and we'll get to this later with some studies, that make up is among the millennials is sort of falling out of fashion in some circles. But we'll get to that. Okay. Cosmetics from the Greek cosmatique technique of dress or ornament or cosmos meaning ornament. I thought cosmos meant the universe Ko s m O S. I don't know, that's cosmo. Kramer got you. That's the lettymology. I had not heard that before. That was the Greeks. Huh, that's what it says.

The Greeks definitely did engage in ornamentation of their face through pigmentation a cosmetics, but they weren't the first supposedly as far back as we found it, um or the Egyptians Sumeria before that even I think, oh, is that right? Yeah, I saw that men and women were lipstick, and Sumerian men and women did so this is pre Egyptian then, because the Obsgyptians went back pretty far. Yeah, well, I think there's some debate there about who was first, right,

Apparently we're debating right now. I think I think Summer was pre okay Egyptian. All right, I'm sure I'll get taken to task. No, not necessarily. I think you're probably right. But um, at any rate, at least a few thousand years ago, there were people wearing lipstick and the the Egyptians in particular were known for using coal k h o l k o h L. That's right, and that is basically like a using very dark um like I

shadow above and below the eye. It's it's very think um. Uh. What was the dude's name from Dead Calm the Killer Billy Uh? Billy Zane. Yeah, I think Billy Zane in The Mummy. Yeah. Basically any movie where they try to make white people look like Egyptian, which is a big thing now in the news it says who whitewashing casting white people to play Egyptians? Like, you know, it's all over the place, every every one of these stupid movies about these big hundred million dollar movies about Egypt or

starring like British dudes. Well, I was on Snopes yesterday and it found that there was apparently a rumor that um Cameron Diaz had been cast to play My Angelou in a biopic and apparently people bought that. How seriously who saw that and was like what and didn't automatically think, well, that's a hoax or a joke. Well, there are some

people upset that Zoe uh, who's it from Avatar? Oh Zaldano is being um because she's playing Nina Simone and like they darkened her skin, and there are some people that are outraged by that even U. It's interesting. Yeah, um, so back to cole Uh. It was specifically a mixture of uh copper and lead and ash and burnt almonds that would mix up and smear on their eyes. Yeah. And what's interesting is the the it was supposedly kept away the evil eye, right, that was the main reason

they wore, in addition to just looking awesome. The stink. Um, Yeah, just give me the stink. It doesn't matter because I'm wearing coal. But it also and likely unbeknownst to the Egyptians at the time, um, it would have warded off bacteria because of some of the ingredients specifically lead or killed you eventually. Yeah. Um. And then it also would have deflected the sunlight from the desert. Yeah, because you're

all set, which is why you know. Ballplayers will put tar into their eyes right to keep that reflection down. If that's tar, well, it's tar on the baseball bat. It can be Uh, it can be whatever. I'm sure they don't use real tar. My dad back in the day for church softball, used to go out and get it from his car tire and put it under his eye. Yeah. I thought it was pretty tough. Wow, Yeah, that is tough. Um,

you know, church softball the top of sport. Uh. Ancient Greeks and Romans also painted their faces uh from ground up stones and minerals, and things were pretty much like that until the Middle Ages, when people said, you know, I don't want my face colored up, I want it white. Well, prior to that, prior to the Middle so early Middle Ages, the early Medieval era that women um used hot tongs to curl their hair, they dyed their hair, they use vegetable pigments to um to redden their faces. So there

was makeup use in in Europe. UM prior to the Middle Ages where you did use pigments to colorize yourself, right in much the same way that like the Romans and Greeks would have. Now were these tawdry women, know, these were just average ordinary women. So later on it fell out of fashion unless you were like a prostitute, right. And the reason why it fell out of fashion was

because um of income inequality. So if you were a woman who was among the poorer classes, you were a labor and you likely had to labor out of doors, and in doing so you would gain a tan. So a way to show that you were wealthy and of higher status was to accentuate your paleness, and they would use something called um. Oh man, what is it? Sirrus? Yeah, cirrus, which is vinegar and lead lead is It's gonna come up a lot in this disturbing comes up sometimes we'll

find out, um. And that is the that's the kind of um grease paint, the cosmetic whitener that women used for centuries actually when very pale skin was in. Yeah, and Elizabeth the first came along and she's like, look how pasty white I am. Um, she's a perfect example of the cirrus use. Yeah, and she there was. There's a misnomer that she was bald by the time she was like thirty. Uh, and that comes from the fact that she has a very large forehead and most of

these portraits. Yeah, this say is it was from the use of the lead that it made her hair fall out. I've heard that that they plucked the hairline that far back. Well, there's a few theories. One is that they plucked because they wore wigs and you know, it would fit the wig would fit better. Another is that they just exaggerated it in paintings because a big forehead, a high forehead

was supposedly tied to intelligence, no smarts, which is hot. Uh. And then the other theory is that the lead, you know, made it creep backs. But she was not bald. So I've been fighting that fight for years. Have you've been the q E one wasn't bald? And finally, here in International Women's Day you get to lay it down. Uh. This next part to me was super interesting for the dumb reason is that I didn't know a lot of

these cosmetic companies were actually named for people. Yeah, max Factor was Maximilian or Maximilian Factorrowitz really Yeah, and he shortened it to max Factor for obvious reasons. But I don't. I don't. I'm such a dummy. I thought it meant like the maximum max power factor or something you could have. The max factor was a dude. Sure. Yeah, Actually you'll find that a lot of cosmetics that you use today were founded by dudes. As Stay Lauder was a lady.

She was a lady, and actually the founder of maybe Leen was inspired by his sister Mabel. Yeah. Pretty neat, But yeah, there's there's the the modern idea of cosmetics and the modern use of cosmetics in in that um the idea that you have to or else you are making a statement or not a beautiful woman. Um all comes about around the end of the nineteenth century early twentieth century, and it really comes kicking in in about ninety thanks to the cinema and specifically Max Factor himself,

who originally provided wigs to them to the movies. Yeah, and previous to that, interestingly, the rise and makeup was tied to a couple of things. One, people getting their portrait, like their kind of singular portrait painted. They want to look good for it. Uh, and then the fact that mirrors we did a great podcast on mirrors. Um didn't we yes did any many moons ago. It was surprisingly difficult. It was the physics of a mirror is really mind bending,

so ate some lead. The affordability of mirrors all of a sudden was a thing, right, So those two things, and then the movie industry comes along, well, and photography too. Did you say photography, well, portrait project, which could be I guess painting and uh photography, right, yeah, so apparently I guess you were just kind of figuring it out as you went along, maybe when you did your makeup for that one picture that was made of you, and

then the movie the movies came along. And when the movies came along, uh, you know, obviously it went from like stage to screen heavy makeup as a stage performance, right, because people had to be able to see you all the way in the back of the house, so and they want you. You had to accentuate your facial expressions. But if you if you did that and did a close up, you looked like a clown. A clown. So they had to just basically reinvent makeup for the movies.

And Max Factor was one of these people who were working to do that, and he said, you know what, stars love this stuff. I've invented this grease paint that's a foundation that makes the skin look so even and beautiful. That the starlets who wear it are wearing it not just for work, they're also wearing it out on the red carpet. That people are going to go crazy for this. And Max Factors started to market it and looked round and figured out what else he could invent, and he

came up with the eyeliner and lip cloths as well. Yeah, huge, huge breakthrough and makeup a tree right. A few years later, actually around the same time nine uh T L. Williams started Mabeline after his sister Mabel, which we mentioned because she came up with a way to make her eyelashes look better. She took petroleum jelly and coal dust and mashed it up together, painted it into her eyelashes and said, the stuff is a bear to get out, but look

at these lashes. Can't see maybe she's born with it. Uh And around the same time in the ninet twenties, and nail care really took a leap forward courtesy in a weird way of Henry Ford. Yeah, in a roundabout way. He had a very famous um uh slogan that people who bought his Model T could have it in any color they want, so long as they wanted black. And the reason that he chose black was because black paint, the black lacquer paint that he used, dried faster than

any of the other pigments. So black is what he went with because he wanted to pump out cars, right, and he was doing a really good job humping out cars. So to separate their companies from his, other guys started to look in at how to come up with colors

because colors were in demand. People did want colors. This didn't have any options, so they started investing into research for new kinds of colors, of fast drying lacquer paints, and it actually ended up saying they came up with some breakthroughs, and some people said, you know what, forget the cars, let's put this on fingernails. Yeah, let's paint fingernails with this nitrocellulose uh and all kinds of colors, a rainbow of colors. Have you ever seen yellow fingernails? Well,

you're about to do yellow, not yellowed yellow. That d makes a huge Well, no, I thought yellow fingernails would look kind of kicky and like a Swatch commercial, you know. Okay, Uh, then Mr Charles Revson sound familiar rev Lan. I guess Revson didn't sound as good through Alis Island or something. Uh.

He co founded it with somebody else, one Cheney. Uh. He made nail polish super famous in the US by combining like matching nail polished to lipstick and like putting a personality on it, like if you're a saucy lady, you meant like this combo. Yeah, it's actually very well known. UM advertising campaign called fire and Ice, and like on these fire and Ice ads, UM, there would be like a little questionnaire at the bottom of the ad like

does gypsy music make you cry? Or would are you the type of woman who would dye her hair without your husband's consent? Um? And if you answered yes, Elliston, yep, you need this. Um this type of lipstick with the matching nail polish. There was a big deal. But Revlon was not the only game in town with lipstick, and it actually kicked off the lipstick Wars, the famous lipstick Wars. Yeah,

there was. There's a company called Hazel Bishop and Hazel Bishop was an actual chemist who was making lipstick for women, and she had some good stuff. She she came up with what's called indelible lipstick. I think it had been around, but she really like made some good formulations of indelible a k a. Smudgeproof lipstick. Yeah, I mean you could you could do a little kissy face and not have it look sure. And so Bishop and Revlon are going

at it back and forth. Cody, which had that very famous fragrance in the seventies, Cody c O T y Um, they came into the mix too, and their big role that they played was they told play text which had apparently a trademark on the word living that Revlon, Yeah that Revlon had a lipstick line called Living Lipstick. Play Texts suit him and Revlon had to abandon their entire

line of this type of indelible lipstick. The whole thing ended though, with Revlon coming out on top because Revlon decided to sink a pretty decent amount of money into advertising on this new TV show called The sixty four thousand Dollar Question. Charles Revson thought this movie or this show was going to be crap. Apparently his word and um it turned out to be like just the hottest thing on TV, and Revlon was the only sponsor. Ultimately

what ended the lipstick Wars of the nineteen fifties. So I thought it was a single gunshot to the head the hazy Bishop, which isn't funny at all, but it didn't happen. Ok uh. And then of course Stay Lauder comes along with her husband, Joseph Lauder, and they were great. She specifically was a great marketer or she was the first person to go set up shop in department stores and say here have some stuff for free. People went, what Yeah, like, go use this stuff and that's how

I'll get you hooked on restaurant you. Yeah, and that's you know, you've got any department store today and wander through the cosmetics. Yeah, don't give you whatever you want for free. Yeah, you can walk out there looking like both of the clown if you want so. Um. State Lauders big thing was skincare, right like skin I mean a lot of a lot of other stuff too, but yeah, um and so the the the By the nineteen fifties nineteen sixties, the cosmetics industry was established. It wasn't going

anywhere big money. It was gonna do nothing but build up and up and up right, and the thing is is a buy. About this time, Uh, the ingredients had all been kind of established, and so nowadays, if you look at makeup, you're gonna see basically the same stuff. We'll talk about all that right after this break. How

about that sounds great? So, Chuck, if you if you take a tube of lipstick and you crack it off, and you take another two lipstick from another company and crack it off and then throw it through a mass spectrometer, you're gonna find the same stuff in there and both of them basically. Yeah, and most cosmetics it's largely the same ingredients. Um who wrote this. Molly Edmonds are former colleague original co host of Stuff Mom never told you, Molly,

if you're listening, she's not listening. Hello. Uh. Foundation UM is usually got some moisturizing bass with some oil and water or wax. Uh. You're gonna have a filler, UM that's gonna make things smooth on your face. Then you're gonna have some pigment like iron oxide, and that's gonna you know, you want to match your skin tone. So that's why they have all different varieties of pigment of uh,

moisturizing bass. Right, that's with like yeah, with foundation right um, and then they'll add some other stuff here there, like if you have dry skin, you might find some hulhoba oil in the mass spectrum tectrometer uh analysis read out print out um. And then uh so eyeliners and guyliner, sure, which is the same thing, it's just used by different people,

right um. Yeah, like the Hollywood vampires they use guyliners. Um. Eyeliners have they consist of something called film formers and thickeners, right, and then pigments on addition to that, So the film formers the actual makeup itself that contains the pigment again, usually some sort of iron oxide. Right, Those come up a lot um, which is funny because I think that that's also what they used originally, like back in the

day in Egypt. So we've come a long way chemistry wise, but we're still using the same raw materials in a lot of cases, these minerals yeah. Um. And then you also have the the thickener, which basically keeps that eyeliner on your eye and that just going off um to the side. Yeah, And the same is basically true for eyeshadow. Uh. It's gonna have that base ingredient maybe talc or cowling cowling clay cowln like shaolin, Yeah, but with a K

instead of an S a link lay uh. And then a binder of course, made out of zinc or magnesium, uh, some sort of derivative of magnesium. Uh, mascara. I mean basically we're not gonna go through all these Oh no, it's all basically the same stuff. So you have a pigment, you have something that creates the base of the whole thing, whether it's some sort of wax or powder or cream, and then you have some sort of binder that keeps the thing in place and makes it difficult to come off.

And with mascara in particular, um, it's very famous for um having a waterproof version. Yeah, so you cry at your wedding and you don't look like a scary prom night girl. Sure right, So um with mascara being waterproof, apparently the as long as it doesn't have water in it, it's likely going to be waterproof, because that'd be terribly ironic if it included water is an ingredient. Yeah, but apparently those are really tough for to get off. So

you don't want to wear a lot. Yeah, and you want to take them off though, or else your lashes will fall out. Supposedly, you want to take off your makeup every night, they say for for quality skin. That's what Stevie Nick said. Her secret was, I've heard that. I think I said that before that, which is weird. So, um, well, let's talk makeup safety, chuck. That's actually a step in

makeup safety. Yeah, this is a huge deal right now, um, because the standards for makeup safety have not changed since nineteen eight. No. In in ninety eight, the Food and Drug Administration was created, and when it was created, the cosmetics industry apparently did a really good job of lobbying the government to say, hey, hey, hey, imagine that, go regulate the food and the drugs. Sure, we'll fall under your cute little umbrella, but just stay out of our business.

We're going to self regulate. And since, seriously, guys, it's two thousand sixteen, since nineteen thirty eight the law is governing the regulation of cosmetics have not effectively changed in any real way, shape or form. Yes, but that could be changing very soon. This article from just this week here in March. Uh, there is the Personal Care Products Safety Act h UP Bill s Z one four, introduced last April and his waiting hearings. Introduced by Diane Feinstein

of California and UH Susan Collins of Maine. It's a bipartisan bill basically saying, hey, in Europe, in the EU, they've banned d uh chemicals from personal care products for a real good reason, and we have only banned eleven and well, thing is wrong. They're banned banned eight I think in restricted three. Yeah, I think they're they're all technically on the band list now and so like we're we're using these same chemicals that are banned in the

EU because they're not banned here. And the reason they're not banned is and there's a huge distinction between Europe and the United States as far as chemicals are concerned. In Europe, the approach is a chemical is potentially harmful until it's proven otherwise, right, And they treat them like that, and when they find out, they investigate these things, and when they find out that they are harmful, then they

ban them. In the United States, a chemical is determined to be not harmful until it's proven otherwise, and it's

exceedingly difficult to prove that something is actually harmful. Like we've been talking about things like parabins and thallates for a very long time now, many many years, and um, public sentiment blows up and the science behind it blows up, and everyone says, well, you can't point to a parabin and say conclusively that it caused that tumor, despite the fact that when you dig around in that tumor you're

gonna find parabins. Or you can't say that parabins are harmful the kids, even though you can find parabins in placenta because it crossed over into the placenta, which means that it's being transferred from mother to child. Yes, you can't conclusively say that parabins cause cancer, but the evidence uh in support of that idea is so abundant that we really should be regulating these things. Still not. Yeah, there's a woman named Jessica Assaf who has been battling this.

She's on a crusade for the past ten years to get more oversight. And um, she's she basically, I mean the name of his article is the average woman puts five and fifteen synthetic chemicals on her body every day without knowing, and six that is absorbed into the body. People make a big deal these days about what you eat, and people don't think a lot about what they put on their skin. The largest organ and that comes that gets into your body as well. Apparently there's a two

thousand and seven study. Um I didn't see who he was affiliated with, but a biochemist studied cosmetics and found that women absorbed just under five pounds of chemicals a year through their cosmetics. Yeah, it's unbelievable. And the stuff in the United States is basically unregulated. Well yeah, and her contention is, which is correct, is basically we're all

guinea pigs. What you do in the US is you can use these colleges medics until something bad happens and then they take a look at it, and they're responsible for self reporting this stuff, right, but they don't have to self reported. That's one of the big distinctions of feine Stein's and Collins bill is that it would require the f d A, or that it would require cosmetic companies to report incidents of of death, disfigurement, or hospitalization.

So right now, you could put on some some lipstick and like end up in the hospital and the Revlon could come and look into it and find like, oh god, it's because of this lipstick. They don't have to say a word about it legally and nothing happens to them because the FDA doesn't have any kind of teeth in this,

in this UM, in this industry. Well, just a couple of weeks ago, Johnson and Johnson was ordered to pay seventy two million dollars UH in damages for the death of a woman from ovarian cancer that was caused by using talcu and baby powder. UM. So what the what? The proposed bill would do a few things. One, it's gonna require companies to report any adverse health effects within fifteen days UH. And then there there would review five risky product ingredients per year and banned them based on

the findings. And this year up for review it would be UH dias zolena dental urea preservative found in lip bomb deodorant. UH may release formaldehyde lead acetate. It's in hair dies linked to neurological problems, formaldehyde, methylene glycol, UH carcinogen,

and hair straighteners, including Brazilian blowouts. It said, which you know the problem for me, UH proper parabine cosmetics preservative, and finally, uh, quater quaternium fifteen it's another preservative and um, my wife to new listeners may not know this, My wife Emily has her own natural body product company and she has been up against this since she started because the FDA doesn't regulate using things like words like all natural or organic. So she has competitors out there selling

soap and lotion that says all natural. And you know, she's always saying, look at the ingredients on this, like you can't even pronounce half of them. So she's having to self educate customers, like on a daily basis on what all natural really means, like it don't don't even use fragrance oils. Uh, Like this is really all natural. So she's been up against it for years. So there's

something like that's very close to her heart. And you can go to love your Mama dot com and if you want to h support Mama at the butt with all natural ingredients. Yeah, you're just sitting there like wait for it, wait for it. But it is a big deal in our family because we don't you know, I think I went off on fragrances and maybe the Smell podcast. No, we did one on perfumes. Oh yeah, perfumes, and it's just we we don't use any of that stuff anymore.

And it really stands out now, Like if I smell a T shirt that's been washed and like tied, it stinks to me. Yeah, like you know, like it just smells fake synthetic. But most people love that. We'll scored a little for breeze on the clothes. Sure, um, but you you you get used to it, I guess, and if you stand away from it for a while, when

you're exposed to it again. But here's the deal though, with small businesses, Um, they sort of have mixed reactions to this bill because on the one hand, it would help them out because the big corporate giants that use all the synthetic chemicals will have to be uh under the pressure to like you know, they don't even have to say where they make this stuff now. Um, But small businesses that might hurt them because they're gonna have to comply with all this stuff, which takes a lot

of time and resources and a k A money. Right, So it's sort of a double edged sword, is that what they call it? Yeah? Yeah, but I mean the thing is what the Colins fine Stein bill reflects is taking the onus of cosmetic safety from the individual user onto the manufacturer, which is the reverse of what it is. Now,

you know what I mean? Like right now, make cosmetic safety tips include don't stab yourself in the eye with the mascarro wand um because it might allow bacteria to seep into your cornea and you'll lose your eye or something like that. Um, rather than don't use this mascara because it contains known carcinogens that we know are now carcinogens because at the A finally got around to actually

study in chemical to find out whether they're harmful or not. Yeah, we should do a show on whether cancer is a man made disease. There's a lot of speculation now, oh yeah, some people think that, like there did not used to be cancer. Yeah, and it's all because of stuff we've created, an uh And even if you don't believe that, at the very least we have ramped it up. You know, Yeah, I definitely I would agree with that. I don't know enough about it to say either way, and I'd love

to get schooled from both sides. So yeah, let's agree that uh, is it time for another break? I think it is time for a break. Man. We're pretty worked up about this whole FDA thing. I know. All right, We're gonna come back and talk a little bit about the psychology of wearing makeup, which is pretty interesting. And if you, um are into natural stuff, all natural ingredients, that kind of thing. There's actually like lines of makeup too that you can look into that don't contain a

lot of like added stuff. Yes, so like, um, it's called mineral makeup for the most part, which is just like naturally occurring minerals that are ground up, um, and there you go, no fragrances, that kind of stuff, and they're supposedly better for you. They don't last as well apparently, but that's you know, it's like do you want the chemistry or do you want the shelf life. Well, that's another thing. Emily battles a shelf life. That's something to

deal with. And she doesn't make cosmetics either, to be fair, Um, you know, soap and lotion and stuff like that. That that stick of civilization doesn't count as a cosmetic. Though some states are are taking it into their own hands, notably California. Of course, They passed in two thousand five the Safe Cosmetics Act, which requires UM manufacturers to disclose ingredients that are on a watch list as being dangerous. Yeah. Yeah,

they do that with not just cosmetics. With and you can buy a frying pan and they'll be like, this frying pan contains something that we're not gonna say that is known to cause cancer and humans. It's like, what which pot, like a tephlon pan or whatever? Uh? Boy, man, I got good cook wear for Christmas? Oh yeah, Oh yeah. All Claud's the way to go. Good stuff, pulled all the Christmas money smart and through in a little and uh, it makes a huge difference in like how much I

enjoy cooking. Yeah, And I mean like you can very easily say All Claud is too expensive. No, All claud is an investment. And if you take care of your all Clad stuff, you're gonna have it for the rest of your life, rather than having to buy new ones every few years. All Clad. Oh man, maybe maybe they'll send to something. So we promised before the break about to talk about the psychology of makeup. Which break just

the one we did um and I think it's super interesting. Uh, when you look at like beauty and the ideal of physical beauty and where that comes from and how it changes. To look at Elizabeth the First and you're like, oh you think yeah, high forehead and like, I love it. Man, she's a hot mama. No white hand, I'm not. That's a hey. I'm sure someone out there is like, you're crazy. Elizabeth the First was hocked. But that's another very big

point too. Is there a universal ideal beauty? Well, scientists have looked at it, uh, And one thing they've come up with that's been pretty universally accepted as symmetry is a very important thing. Uh. I saw special one time on PBS when they took supposedly the most beautiful people in the world and split them down the middle and and measured them out, and they are usually pretty symmetrical.

I saw one site that suggested that faith has follow the Golden ratio, like perfectly beautiful symmetrical faces follow that golden ratio. Likely pops up in nature all the time. Interesting, we should do went on the golden ratio? Okay, so here's the deal. Though. Growing up, we did episodes on male and female puberty. Uh, little boys and little girls have kind of similar faces. Until they reach puberty, and then that's when things start happening um to distinguish us uh.

In general, a guy's knows will be bigger, more prominent brow and forehead. Woman might have plumper lips and higher cheekbones. And this is how we change, generally speaking into men

and women. Right. So, So one of the theories behind why women wear makeup is because they're trying to hyper accentuate there naturally um distinguishing features that right exactly, um so like making the eyes bigger, accentuating the eyes with like eyeshadow and eyeliner, and making the last is longer, um, plumping the the lips, right, which supposedly I've always heard and I found it elsewhere in another House to Work article about lipstick itself, that there's a theory that that

emulates vagina. That like the lips, applying lips and lipstick and lip gloss and all that emulates a vagina. So there's like a psychology behind that as well. And the whole point is here is is the idea behind makeup then is a woman showing off her fitness for mating

man basically, which makes sense evolutionarily speaking. That's the predominant theory behind makeup, which I mean, if you go talk to Max Factor, they're probably not going to say that it's all about beauty, but ultimately it's supposedly it's it's intending to set off certain evolutionary cues in men who are seeking a mate. Uh. A youthful appearance again is usually looked at it as more attractive, probably because reproductive, you're able to reproduce as a younger person easily or

more easily. Um So allegedly, uh. Second wave feminism comes along in the sixties and seventies, and that's when women were like, you know what, take your bra off, grow that armpit, hair out, and quit painting your face so other men, sisters, so so men think you look good?

Right that second fix yourself with makeup, the second wave feminism, and it was very much um hip to the idea of what was really behind makeup, that theory that it's all about attracting or sexualizing yourself in order for men to find you more attractive. And they were saying, forget that, forget men, stop wearing makeup, sister, Yeah, you look good

as yourself. We gotta doing one on feminism too, and um, The thing is it didn't take off like as sensible as that that idea was and timely as it was, you know, Um, it didn't take off like a rocket because a lot of women were like, yeah, let's a get No, I don't want to do that. I want to wear makeup. Well yeah, and a lot of women are like, you know, feminism is about me having a choice. That's third way to do what I want to do. Yeah, right, yeah, which is like, I want to wear makeup. It's art

to me. It's like the way I look. It's I like applying it, um, and I'm not doing it for a man. I like like making myself look this way. There's also there's um there's a similar school of thought is like yeah, I'm wearing lipstick to drive men crazy and that gives me power. That's an in and of

itself a type of feminism as well. So, um, the idea that a woman should have a choice whether she wears makeup or not and not be viewed as um, being a harlot or as being a turncoat to her a gender is I think the basis of like this third wave feminism that it's like, yeah, wear makeup if you want don't wear it if you don't want, but don't don't force your belief on on other people, because

there's a special place in hell for women who wear makeup. Uh. And then of course younger girls, like when should you start wearing makeup? Like, well, this is a this is a into me an entirely separate uh um conversation. Oh absolutely, but does you know does it sexualize a young girl by wearing makeup too young? And just physically speaking, if this stuff is dangerous uh in a carcinogens carcinogenic way, like what does it due to the skin of like

a twelve year old? Yeah? And and not to pick on thalet so though they definitely definitely deserve to be picked on along with parabins. If you look at the medical literature about whether they're potentially harmful or not, they seem to have the most toxicity in pregnant women and in younger people have so yes, if you are using makeup as a younger girl, then you potentially are being

exposed to things like endocrine disruptors. Um. That could be even more harmful because your body is still developing, so they're going to have more of an effect on you. Um. So yeah, there's a there's a number of reasons to say maybe wait uh men, but hey, that's your choice. Yeah, agreed, unless your parents they know. Yeah, that's a whole other issue, isn't it. And you can't wait to face all those things. Uh So let's talk about many a little bit. Um Well,

there's a couple of different uh categories. Have been with makeup, men wearing makeup. Um, you and I had a TV show. Oh man, I wore so much makeup. I didn't wear any makeup I know, and Chuck, I wish I could go back, And it's just been like, and here's the deal. I didn't h I didn't not wear makeup because I thought it was girly or anything. I didn't wear makeup because I sweat like a beast. Our stage was hot as hades, and the thing you look totally fine. Well

and in HD I've seen you. I appreciate it, but makeup doesn't you know. I remember our makeup artists being like, well, this will help with the sweat, and I'm like, you don't understand. You had a hand fan, do you remember they had it like right right? And when it takes somebody put Yeah, Fanny that's right in Chuck's hand. Yeah, makeup won't. There are some scenes though, where I look. I remember used to stop and be like, guys like, look at Chuck, he's got sweat pouring down his head,

like we can't shoot. I remember that too, But you were right. There are some scenes where I look very glossy, but there are many scenes where you look orange. So I just I just didn't like it. I didn't like the I didn't want the chemicals on my face. I didn't like the way it stung my eyes because I sweat, and it just was like, no, it wasn't fun to take off at the end of the day. Um So, anyway, that's my makeup story. UM my friend, I'm not gonna

say his name. You know, he was a personal driver for Burt Reynolds on a movie here Atlanta, and I was like, what does Burt Reynolds look like without his makeup? He went, what do you mean? He's like, he puts it on in his room that morning, so he you don't know what Burt Reynolds looks like without makeup and it was caked on. If Burt Reynolds and Tim Kazarinsky

are actually the same person, Uh. The other aspect of men and makeup is whether or not men well a if they should have any say, and whether or not women wear makeup, but whether or not men like men have long tried to have a say in whether women wore makeup in a lot of it sadly is like bullying, yeah or or uh, accusations of fraud or witch craft, sorcery. Seventeen seventy British Parliament had a law that said if you wear makeup, they it was akin to witchcraft. They said, basically,

you have a false face, so you can get an annulment. Gentlemen, once you wake up after your wedding night and your wife doesn't have makeup on, and you're frightened by her appearance, you can get an annulment because she tricked you with thinking that she was pretty with all her makeup. That's exactly right. Unbelievable and who was it? The poet Marshall, The Roman poet Marshall Um He wrote to a woman apparently who wore makeup, and said, you are but a

composition of lies. No man can say I love you, for you are not what he loves, and no one loves what you are what a mean poem to write. It's like, just shut up, keep it to yourself. If you have preference for a lady who doesn't wear makeup, fine, you know. It's like it's like today on the Internet where somebody's like, I don't like that TV show. They these guys have to hear about it. It's like, now, just move along. Yeah, I'm not a big fan of makeup,

but I don't care, like it's it's your choice. Eily doesn't wear makeup because she's lazy. I'm just she'll love that. No, she'll she'll be the first to admit it every now and then she'll she'll doll herself up a very little bit when I'm coming over. Yeah, he's like, Josh is coming, let me get out smoky eyes. I know it drives him crazy when you wear it, chuck. But when she does, I was always like, well, you look like a different version of my wife. I'm not like you. But also

just like the way she looks normal, you know. Yeah, well, yeah, there's definitely something to be said about how a woman looks without makeup, Like, no, not much at all, and she frequently goes without it too. Um, and I understand that there's like that's that's not to ignore just a whole group of women out there around the world who are like, no, you wear makeup, you put your face

on exactly. That's is frequently what it's called and and they just can't imagine not wearing makeup behind bully for you do what you want to do. Um. It does seem like there's a big conversation that you can start up any time if you want, especially on Slate where you know, are those women, um, you know, selling out the feminist movement still or that kind of thing. But yeah,

I tend to agree with the idea of choice. Yeah, there's a big movement now among some of the celebrity uh, some celebrity women that's like, now I want to be in the cover of this magazine without makeup, Like I want to show my true self because we're I'm tired of this ideal that uh, we've created in culture and pop culture that we have to look a certain way. And um, one of the things that I hate a lot of things about the Internet, but I think one of my things I hate worst is look how ugly

these celebrities look when they're grocery shopping. Look at this lady without our makeup on, like it's just awful, man. Or there was this movement called the hashtag no makeup selfies. Yeah, that one around Twitter recently last year maybe I think, and they raised something like um ten twelve million dollars for cancer research general cancer research. Sure, that is great,

but it was like daring. It was like it was a daring, bold move to to release a photo of yourself publicly without wearing makeup, which still suggests that it is basically a social expectation or a social requirement. People expect you generally to wear makeup then and to not where it is like a bold act that one's willing to sacrifice oneself for in the name of generating money for cancer research. Yeah, and all in the name in general of submitting to the whims of what a man

finds attractive. That's kind of at the base of it all. Yeah, But again, I don't think you can discount the idea that women themselves find frequently find themselves more attractive when they have makeup on, you know, And there's no reason to discount that. Oh man, all right, let's take the wasps wasps nests off of our arms. I thought this is very fair. I thought it was our old trustee saying to each their own yeah, which we frequently adopt

and then abandoned depending on the topic. That's exactly right. If you want to know more about makeup, you can go to UM department store. Did you know the stuff in department stores are called prestige cosmetics. That's what they're called. What do you mean, just the stuff they sell? Yeah, like the good stuff. They don't call it like high end or they call it prestige cosmetics. Man, it is expensive. Oh, we didn't talk. Did you see some of the weird

stuff that they put in in cosmetics? Yeah, you want to run through the real quick. There's just a couple that stuck out to me, like roague kill. Alright, go in so talo you as like you render animal fat and you come up with talo and tallow is used in a lot of different moisturize or shampoo's that kind of stuff. And apparently it is legal to source your um animal fat from everything from zoos to roadue kill, and the stuff ends up in cosmetics. It is a

little weird. Now here is one UM. The TNS Recovery Complex by Skin Medica infant foreskin. This is one of Oprah's favorite things, and I looked into it because it's a big anti aging product and I thought, they're not using infant foreskin. Uh, and they aren't in a way. What they did was U twenty years ago they used cells from a single four skin grown in a lab

that they still use that the same thing now. But people act like they're like taking foreskin and grinding it up, and Oprah is like, look under your chair, there's a for skin under there. Uh. This one sounds kind of gross at first with them when you look into its awesome. Snail us. Yeah, so snail Ouze they using moisturizers and I imagine prestige moisturizers because it contains glycolic acid and elastin.

And the reason that it contains is because the snail needs heal it's own cuts and bruises and stuff like that. And apparently it works in human skin as well. Yeah, pretty cool stuff. Yeah. I mean, if you're a vegan, you're probably not using a lot of these products because everything from landelin to crushed beetles go into a lot of cosmetics, and so U they vegans are like, I don't want animals in my products. Well, Lanelyne is squeezing

from sheep's wool, so technically you're fine. And don't tell a vegan that the wool industry is very uh oh, I see hotly debated. Uh do you got anything else? If you want to know more about makeup, go type that in the search part how stuff works dot com. And since I said search parts, time for listening this one. I'm gonna call using us to teach English in China like this one. And we're even gonna play a little

bit of this because it's so awesome. Hey, guys, have been listening to you Stuff you Should Know for several years now. I used to listen to them every night before bed. It's very relaxing, and in recent months have been playing them for educational purposes. I teach at an international school in Shanghai, China, and your podcasts have helped

me to teach English to my high school students. Recently, we had an assignment where the students had to create their own stuff you Should Know podcast and many of them loved the projects so much they did an excellent job. Feel free to listen to some of these uh. You have inspired my Chinese students don't need to listen to the show, but also to speak more English inside and outside the classroom. I'm so impressed with their language improvement. Thank you for that, and thank you for making my

job so enjoyable and rewarding. So warmest regards. That's from Jason, And let's play a little snippet of these Chinese students doing stuff you should know. This episode is brought to you by on his six team R and B for two Big Fried Chicken Wings, Ken Grant, Part Chicking. Welcome to the st you should Know from how Stuff Work dot com. M hm, hey, and we welcome to the podcast. Think there and Mona here a couple of stuff writers at how stuff works dot com. Hi, how is your

winter holiday? Scenes? Yeah, my winter holiday, you know, because of the Spring Spring Festival, I'm wondering between different realities for greeting. That's really boring, boring and worrying. And the most serious problem is once the holiday's end, my weights must add about one point five kilograph. But I know you're one ronning with your father, right, don't worry about that too much. That is awesome. Jason is doing God's work as it's just it's cute, even though they're not

little kids. It's just keete to hear these these Chinese students like doing a stuff you should now, Yeah, I think it's awesome. Yeah, so hello to Jason's class guys out there in Shanghai. He said, right, yeah, yep, thanks for listening and keep up the good work. And if you want to get in touch with us, you guys

can tweet to us at s y ESK podcast. You can join us on Facebook dot com slash stuff you Should Know if you can send us an email the Stuff podcast at how stuff Works dot com and has always joined us at our home on the web, Stuff you Should Know dot com for more on this and thousands of other topics. Does it how stuff Works dot com