ChatGPT, A.I., Inflation and Podcasts! Podcast w/Spencer Lodge

00:00:00:01 - 00:00:15:06
Matt Haycox
I'm absolutely not dissing A.I. in any way. I'm dissing the concept of people saying that there won't be any jobs left for them. There won't be any jobs left for the shit people. I kind of had a similar conversation a different way with my video editor back in the UK actually. Your competition isn't really other video editors.

00:00:15:06 - 00:00:31:27
Matt Haycox
Your competition is my 16 year old daughter. What tools can make your job better? What tools can make you more efficient? If my daughter with no training can make a great video with this Tik Tok app in 15 minutes, you as an experienced editor can use that same app and blow, you know, blow the socks off everybody.

00:00:34:21 - 00:00:57:02
Matt Haycox
Guys. Matt Haycox here, and welcome to another episode of The Matt Haycox Show. Where we're here in a new studio in Dubai with my new Dubai friend Spencer Lodge. He's told me I can introduce him as anything I want, but I am going to introduce him as entrepreneur, financial advisor, podcast host, author, up and coming, fitness guru and all and all around

00:00:57:02 - 00:01:09:12
Matt Haycox
great guy. So, Spencer, thanks a lot for being here. I mean, I know we've we've talked about this for a while and I've heard your name come up in just about every circle I've been in in Dubai, so I'm actually surprised it took us so long to meet.

00:01:09:25 - 00:01:13:28
Spencer Lodge
You spend a lot of time in the police station?

00:01:13:28 - 00:01:24:22
Matt Haycox
It is funny, honestly. Every, I mean, literally every circle of differing people. And I say, oh, you know, anyone should catch up with in Dubai? They always go, Do you know Spencer Lodge? -Really?- You look worried.

00:01:26:02 - 00:01:30:19
Spencer Lodge
I've been here 20... well, 18 years. So I suppose that that yeah, some people know me. But yeah.

00:01:30:27 - 00:01:32:11
Matt Haycox
What brought you to Dubai?

00:01:32:11 - 00:01:50:10
Spencer Lodge
Business. Yeah, work. So I've been living overseas as an expat for oh 12, what was it, 12 years back then? I was in Holland. We bought a company over here. One of us decided we need to run it. And my business partners at the time, one of them was in Hong Kong. He was like, I’m not leaving Hong Kong. Dubai? Why would you go to Dubai?

00:01:51:03 - 00:01:58:19
Spencer Lodge
And I was in Holland and it was freezing cold, just like English weather. So hands went up. I'll take that one. And that's how it started.

00:01:58:27 - 00:02:16:22
Matt Haycox
I mean, it's very much the same for me that the.. I guess the weather and the accidental holiday brought me here. But I always say to my mates or business associates, colleagues back in the UK that I cannot think of a better place in the world for doing business. I mean, it's just such a such a hungry and simultaneously friendly business environment over here.

00:02:16:25 - 00:02:22:13
Matt Haycox
I mean, you've been there a lot longer than me, so you know, you might have a different view on it, but I mean, I couldn't speak more highly of the place.

00:02:23:15 - 00:02:39:07
Spencer Lodge
This place years ago used to have a lot of bureaucracy which didn't make a whole load of sense, but when you look at what they've done in the best part of 51 years, no city in the world has ever done it. You know, no country in the world has ever done it. So you have to take your hat off

00:02:39:07 - 00:03:02:10
Spencer Lodge
and say... if you compared it to the bureaucracy of living in Brazil or in Thailand, wherever it is, you know, you deal with different languages and sometimes different alphabets as well, which makes it even more difficult to do business. Then this place really is a place that wants business people to come to it. It wants people to come and set up here, develop themselves, develop their businesses and then geographically, it’s in a really smart place in the world as well

00:03:02:13 - 00:03:18:08
Matt Haycox
I mean, never mind Brazil. I mean, back in Leeds, I mean, it's been taking them three and a half years to build a roundabout at the end of my street. I'm not joking. I, I used to go I used to go back to England. Nevermind used to go back. This is even when I was still living in England, I'll be thinking of that blockage at the end of the road.

00:03:18:08 - 00:03:32:18
Matt Haycox
You know, they'll be finished in a few weeks. I mean, this is literally it's a roundabout with four minor roads coming off. So I mean one of them's double width, but it's not a dual carriageway by any stretch. There's a little subway and a little post office there. I mean that is the, you know, the business hub of the roundabout.

00:03:32:22 - 00:03:34:26
Matt Haycox
And it took about three and a half years to finish this off.

00:03:34:26 - 00:03:48:10
Spencer Lodge
It's funny, you know, when you come here, you see that.. you know, you go back home, you go on holiday and you visit back to the UK again and there's still the roadworks are exactly the same as they were before. Yet here in Dubai, the roadworks go up, a flyover goes up in 12 months and before you know it's done.

00:03:48:10 - 00:04:08:07
Matt Haycox
So we're recording this about 12:00 in the afternoon, which from what I've seen of you on Instagram lately, it must be almost your bedtime because I always see you driving, driving down what must be Sheikh Zayed Road at 4:00 in the morning, telling people you’re on the way to workout and I do get very inspired and motivated by your workouts myself, but there's not a chance I'm coming there with you at half

00:04:08:07 - 00:04:11:28
Matt Haycox
Five in the morning. Are you a morning person? Is that why you’re doing it?

00:04:11:29 - 00:04:44:13
Spencer Lodge
I, I have always been a morning person, so there's nothing unusual there. But I, I think I need it. I think I need that set time every single day that I go. I like the fact that I'm going early before everybody else is up. I like the fact that I'm done, you know, just as the gym starts to get busy and it's me that that video that I make is 14 seconds every day of me driving down the the trunk on the palm of the golden mile coming off my house and that 14 seconds, I film and then get back afterwards.

00:04:44:19 - 00:04:55:11
Spencer Lodge
And I think, what on earth am I going to say today? And I have many people say, you know, you’ve motivated me to get up and do stuff and equally I’ve had people like what you doing you weirdo? And one of them is my wife.

00:04:57:16 - 00:05:02:19
Matt Haycox
Have you always exercised? Has fitness always been a part of your, part of your goals?

00:05:02:24 - 00:05:23:27
Spencer Lodge
I've always exercised, but I don't think I’ve always exercised, you know, kind of like going to a gym every day like I have in the last probably seven or eight years. I had spinal surgery in 2010 and then 2012. And after that recovery, I really needed to be in the gym and cycling was what got me going into fitness properly.

00:05:24:09 - 00:05:44:21
Spencer Lodge
The only thing I could do was get on a bike and being bent forward, stretched my spine and it took the pain away. So it was almost like being on a bike was comfortable, whereas sitting on a sofa was painful. And so it went from there to here in Dubai, if you ride a bike a lot, you're going around a lot of kind of like sand views.

00:05:44:21 - 00:06:00:09
Spencer Lodge
There's not really much else to see on these paths out in Al Qudra and stuff like that. And so it's like gets boring. And so what do you do? Do something else and say, Oh, I'll go to the gym and like anybody that goes to the gym, first probably three weeks of going to a gym is awful for anybody starting out.

00:06:00:09 - 00:06:15:08
Spencer Lodge
You know, you don't see any benefits. It's just, you know, a slog, a labor of love and whatnot until after three weeks you start to feel like you belong a little bit more. And and you know what you're doing, you're familiar and and maybe you start to feel a bit more stronger and fitter than you did before.

00:06:15:08 - 00:06:19:03
Matt Haycox
And I mean, do you find it makes a difference for you in all the other aspects of your life?

00:06:19:21 - 00:06:43:29
Spencer Lodge
So if you if I was to come here today so we're here midday, it's 11:00 to do this. If I was to come today without going to the gym, I'm 20-30% at least worse in terms of my energy, in terms of my focus, my enthusiasm. And it's exactly the same with my work. You know, once I get back from the gym, I have a shower and I'm ready to go at 6:45.

00:06:43:29 - 00:06:59:05
Spencer Lodge
And that seems mad for a lot of people. But I get so much done between 6:45 and 9 a.m. that I've completed like all of my operational admin type functions by then. And so yeah, and it feels good there’s something there's something that makes me feel good about that.

00:06:59:29 - 00:07:17:21
Matt Haycox
It’s a funny one because I'm completely with you on the exercise and that you know, I like to do mine in the morning for two reasons. One, I feel completely set up for the day with it. But then secondly, I also know that if I try and do it after work, something always happens at work, you know, and it'll get knocked back and knocked back and knocked back and potentially not happen

00:07:17:21 - 00:07:41:05
Matt Haycox
Or I'll be approaching after a ten hour day and I'll be too tired to do a proper job of it. But I was I always like seeing the kind of debate about early mornings online because it's obviously such a social media fodder for the you know, for the whole alpha male thing. And I'm, you know, more than happy to say that I've just I've never been a morning person, you know, not because I'm lazy about it by always go to bed quite late.

00:07:41:05 - 00:07:59:08
Matt Haycox
And I think, okay, you could go to bed earlier and then get up earlier, but I just don't want to, you know, I like I like being up late at night. I feel well, A from a social perspective, that's where I kind of do a lot of my enjoyments or also working. But also, you know, it's a good headspace for work for me as well.

00:07:59:25 - 00:08:28:12
Matt Haycox
So what I like about being here is even though I live in Dubai, 90% of my work is still UK based, so I do work UK hours. So I'll get up here, you know, half, seven, 8:00 in the morning. I then go and do my I'll go do my training, probably half 8 until half 10. come home, see the missus, have a bit of breakfast, you know, do a few emails, potter around and I get into the office for maybe half 11, which you know, okay, so half 11, you know, you're so lazy, but bear in mind it's still only 7:30 in the UK.

00:08:28:16 - 00:08:38:00
Matt Haycox
So I then get my couple of hours - So complete clear head space, admin time, get my emails, get everything else done. Then I, you know, then I'll work late into late into night.

00:08:38:15 - 00:08:48:20
Spencer Lodge
Hold on a minute. You've just said to me that the whole early morning thing doesn't work for you, and I know I do, but if you're on UK time, you're doing exactly the same time as me in essence.

00:08:48:25 - 00:09:06:00
Matt Haycox
And that's what I mean. But I mean, in terms of actually physically, physically getting up at you know, people, I kind of feel so competitive about it and it's like I want to be the last man in the office, no matter how efficient, no matter how inefficient I've been, you know, you've got to be the last man in the office.

00:09:06:00 - 00:09:22:28
Matt Haycox
And, you know, I want to be early. The next person I know, if I if I started coming to the gym with you at 5:00 in the morning, I'd be so grumpy a bit. And I've been going to bed, you know, 12 at best, you know, 1:00, 2:00. So even if I get through the workout, I won't be doing my best job of that and I just can be grumpy and knackered.

00:09:24:10 - 00:09:42:02
Spencer Lodge
Well look, my wife's a great example and other people I know as well. Some people are really creative. Around midnight, they're really creative and they're alive and you know, they're in they’re in a really good place. I'm not at midnight, I'm a zombie. But my wife, she's she's looked at me and I'm like babe, it’s 10:30, shall we go to bed.

00:09:42:02 - 00:10:01:23
Spencer Lodge
She's like, why do you wanna go to bed so early for? I'm like, hon, it’s 10:30, we’ll be asleep by 11. I get up at 4:30. That's five and a half hours sleep. And she's like, Yeah, go on your own. And she'll sit there and she'll be on the phone chatting to people 1:00 in the morning and doing stuff with her colleagues from work. All because that's, that's that kind of time that they feel best.

00:10:02:01 - 00:10:04:10
Spencer Lodge
So there is no rule. Yeah. What works for you.

00:10:04:10 - 00:10:24:04
Matt Haycox
Completely and that's- I was absolutely wasn't saying you know you should be getting up in the morning. I was saying in the context of that you know people need to need to know themselves and know what works for them. And I think, you know, following the, you know, the stereotypical alpha male - social media pathways that isn't isn't necessarily the best.

00:10:24:04 - 00:10:40:20
Spencer Lodge
I think I think what you must do is whatever time you get up, you must do some exercise. Yeah, that's all I think. So if you wake up at 9:00 every day and even just go for a walk, okay, do some form of exercise because I think it's better for you psychologically and emotionally and obviously physically if you do that.

00:10:40:21 - 00:10:41:00
Spencer Lodge
I think.

00:10:41:14 - 00:10:59:25
Matt Haycox
Look, we've done the - we've done the fitness. So let's move this in the chronological, chronological order of your day. Let's let's let's talk about some business. Obviously, I always see you post very interesting things on social media, you know, some things that I know a lot about and agree with and other things I'm always interested to think about picking your brains on.

00:11:00:03 - 00:11:06:20
Matt Haycox
And something that's always coming up online now is A.I., artificial intelligence, particular with you know, the whole.

00:11:07:24 - 00:11:08:06
Spencer Lodge
ChatGPT

00:11:09:23 - 00:11:27:27
Matt Haycox
ChatGPT thing. I saw you post about it the other day and when I knew we were doing this, I thought I thought kind of pick your brains as to as to where you're at and on what you think's going on. I mean, I've got my own very clear views on how it's definitely a great step forward, but is and, and is a tool that can help people if they understand how to use it in the right way.

00:11:28:02 - 00:11:42:22
Matt Haycox
It is absolutely not a robotic replacement to the rest of the world. And, you know, 97% of the population are going to be unemployed. But, you know, I've got probably 1% knowledge compared to what you've got. So I'd love to love to hear your views.

00:11:42:22 - 00:11:46:29
Spencer Lodge
And I think I think my knowledge is just through experience. I mean, have you tried ChatGPT?

00:11:46:29 - 00:11:47:18
Matt Haycox
I have, yes.

00:11:48:00 - 00:11:50:13
Spencer Lodge
Have you tried it on your phone or a laptop?

00:11:51:09 - 00:11:52:23
Matt Haycox
The laptop I believe, the laptop.

00:11:53:04 - 00:11:56:12
Spencer Lodge
So I've been using it over the last few days quite extensively.

00:11:56:12 - 00:11:58:27
Matt Haycox
For what, to play with or for a particular purpose?

00:11:58:27 - 00:12:02:20
Spencer Lodge
Because I wanted to see, because I have a team of copywriters that work with me

00:12:03:08 - 00:12:04:26
Matt Haycox
This is exactly where I was hoping you’d go

00:12:05:04 - 00:12:17:07
Spencer Lodge
And I've been I've been literally working out whether I can replace the copywriters with ChatGPT and from everything I've created so far, 100%.

00:12:17:19 - 00:12:18:09
Matt Haycox
Really?

00:12:18:09 - 00:12:46:06
Spencer Lodge
A Hundred percent. Now then if you go to another another AI app called Tomes T O M E. okay, that is an AI app that designs PowerPoint presentations. And anybody that knows me well knows that I hate doing PowerPoints, like it's like frustrating for me. It's labor intensive, it's it's manual, it's a real struggle. If I have someone sat there and I'm talking and they're turning it into a PowerPoint presentation, that's one thing I got to do it myself.

00:12:46:15 - 00:13:01:08
Spencer Lodge
I will put it off and put it off and put it off until the cows come home, until there's a real deadline. So I'll use a PowerPoint for a speaking engagement. And so, Oh no, the speaking engagements the 25th of the month. It won't be until the 24th, late at night. And I'll be lying there going, Oh, I didn’t want to do it anyway

00:13:01:08 - 00:13:26:10
Spencer Lodge
I used Tome yesterday to design a PowerPoint presentation and it designed it in less than a minute. And it was good. Now was it perfect? No, of course it wasn't perfect, but it was good. And I sat there going... You're kidding me. That amount of time that I can save or anybody else for that matter has to go and design them can go onto this website, design their PowerPoint presentation, export it and it can be.

00:13:26:15 - 00:13:45:28
Spencer Lodge
-wonderful graphics and art and whatnot on there too. I thought it was amazing. So when I when I look at A.I. in, in the areas that I have looked at so far and I see the use cases for it, then I'm a massive, massive fan and it's only going to get better and proof of how good it is, because we could all,

00:13:46:01 - 00:14:07:27
Spencer Lodge
We could all- And my personal trainer was talking negatively about some of it today. Microsoft are about to pay $10 billion to ChatGPT. OpenC- OpenAI sorry, who's the parent company. $10 billion to buy a portion of the shares of the company that are valued at $29 billion. What were they valued at two years ago?

00:14:07:27 - 00:14:09:12
Spencer Lodge
Do you know? -No- nothing.

00:14:09:17 - 00:14:10:05
Matt Haycox
I was gonna say nothing.

00:14:10:13 - 00:14:30:02
Spencer Lodge
29 Bi- now, if you and I set a company up that we knew was $29 billion in two years, okay, we'd have big smiles on their faces. We’re certainly very happy big boys. What they're going to do is we have Google, which we go and we use. We say Google, we use Google, we Google it, we don't Bing it, we don't Internet Explorer it.

00:14:30:02 - 00:14:51:03
Spencer Lodge
We we Google it. Yeah. So but, you know that Bing's there. Bing was there before. It was a search engine, just like anything else. But nobody uses it. Well, ChatGPT is going to be inserted into Bing, and if it's inserted into Bing then any search you do is going to be an A.I. based search, which is going to be 1,000% better than any Google search that you do.

00:14:52:02 - 00:15:00:17
Spencer Lodge
That to me is really, really interesting. And I don't think that Microsoft would ever consider spending that kind of money unless there was real value in it.

00:15:01:02 - 00:15:21:11
Matt Haycox
So I guess so I'm with you on certain bits of that. And I guess where I'm more thinking of it is in terms of it's a helpful tool to help people who don't want to be lazy, be more efficient at being good. I feel I have probably completely butchered what I meant to say there, that sounds even more complicated

00:15:21:11 - 00:15:22:21
Spencer Lodge
People be more efficient with their time.

00:15:23:29 - 00:15:42:25
Matt Haycox
As long as long as they've got a quality skill set to add on top of it anyway. So let's, let's, let's use copywriting. And for me, I guess it depends on the quality of copy you want. But I mean, I always have a battle finding good copywriters and you know, I mean I create a lot of copy across, across all my businesses from a fashion perspective, from a from a business perspective.

00:15:42:25 - 00:16:00:14
Matt Haycox
We’re always looking for good copywriters. And I have this conversation with copywriters all the time. I mean, literally, I’ve interviewed four or five this week and I always say that I know a good copywriter will say that they can write copy about anything. Because they’ll say it’s about research and then it’s about applying that research to a tone of voice.

00:16:00:22 - 00:16:23:13
Matt Haycox
But I do disagree because I think it depends on who your audience is. Because if you if you're writing something for SEO purposes, you know, if you're writing something for Google-ability, then fine, you know, probably any any decent linguist with half a brain to research can do something about it. But if you're writing for a knowledgeable audience, then I honestly believe that any any knowledgeable audience can see through the writer.

00:16:23:20 - 00:16:41:17
Matt Haycox
So when I'm writing copy or when I'm having copy written for about business finance, about investment, etc., you know, for me I can tell in 3 seconds whether or not that's been written by someone who really, really, really, really knows it, or whether it's someone who's just, who’s just done some 10 minutes of research and stringing it together.

00:16:42:05 - 00:17:09:24
Matt Haycox
So I've been testing you know, ChatGBT as well from a copywriting perspective, and, listen.. don’t get me wrong. I find it incredibly impressive. I mean, like staggers me and I could say, I don't know, give me give me a 2000 word blog with ten points about how to protect your business from the 2023 recession. That'll be a nice blog title and something and it would spit it out, as you know, in 20 seconds.

00:17:09:24 - 00:17:30:05
Matt Haycox
Is the quality of it amazing? Well, no. And for me, it's not amazing. Okay. It might be enough to get past SEO, It might be enough to get past, you know, a wannabe business person who then can go in the top of the funnel to sell them a product. But to really make me, let's say, look impressive as a as an author, impressive as a businessman, I think I think it's quite a way off.

00:17:30:05 - 00:17:44:08
Matt Haycox
But what I think it's a great job for is saving my time in researching those those ten of those ten points. You know, I can if I want to write about five good points, I'll ask it to give me ten. I can pick the I can pick the best ones and then I can of I can kind of get back to it.

00:17:44:11 - 00:17:45:06
Matt Haycox
Does that make sense?

00:17:45:06 - 00:18:17:26
Spencer Lodge
Yeah, it makes sense completely. So this this is what I've noticed by doing the research. I researched write a 500 word article about inflation, or I did it on a number of different things. Then I changed the way I asked the question. In the voice of J.K. Rowling or in the voice of Warren Buffett, give me the ten most important considerations when investing money in 2023.

00:18:17:26 - 00:18:34:08
Spencer Lodge
It changes it completely because all of a sudden you've got, you know, someone that we would both respect, somebody like Warren Buffett. It's in his voice and he's an expert in that field we would guess. And whether that's Warren Buffett, Peter Thiel or whoever it is. Also on top of that, if you think about me, you know, my background is investing and financial advice.

00:18:35:07 - 00:18:54:13
Spencer Lodge
I've been using it to design portfolios for people. Just testing. Design a portfolio for someone to invest $100,000 at an 8% return over the course of 2023. In the voice of Peter Thiel,- Peter Thiel, who's who's an investment guru. It’s good.

00:18:55:10 - 00:19:00:12
Matt Haycox
But how much meddling do you then do with it afterwards, or is it literally good enough to just present your client then?

00:19:00:19 - 00:19:04:10
Spencer Lodge
No, no, no. I mean, I'm not even at the stage where it will be presented to anybody.

00:19:04:18 - 00:19:05:14
Matt Haycox
But if you want.

00:19:05:14 - 00:19:24:15
Spencer Lodge
But like you said, it's like you go and do all the research yourself, which takes hours and hours and hours, and then you collate that research and you have to put something together which for people like us is like labor intensive and time consuming. If you can put something together very quickly and then you could pick out the bits that you think are really valuable, all you're doing is copying, pasting and adding a few words.

00:19:24:20 - 00:19:46:25
Spencer Lodge
That's a massive timesaver. And there'll be people out there that go, That's wrong. You're putting stuff out there. You should be using your own brain and thinking about it yourself. But everybody in business has a labor intensive task they have to do, and if there’s a tool out there that can help them save time so they can be more productive with their business and it still does a good job then I reckon they should.

00:19:46:25 - 00:20:04:04
Matt Haycox
You know what? As we talking, I think we, we’re both saying the same thing. We’re just saying it in different ways, as in I'm absolutely not, you know, not dissing A.I. in any way. I'm dissing the concept of people saying that there won't be any jobs left for them. And you know, like with anything, there won't be any jobs left for the shit people.

00:20:04:07 - 00:20:22:29
Matt Haycox
But, you know, you're talking about, for example, being a financial adviser and using that to make you more efficient, you know, to to, to to save you time. But you will then still need to look at it at the end and use your financial adviser skills that you've had years of education, years of practical experience to then actually look at it and go, very, very good

00:20:22:29 - 00:20:39:07
Matt Haycox
Mr.. A.I. Need to tweak that, need to tweak that now it's perfect for my client. I kind of had a similar conversation in a different way with my my video editor back in the UK actually the other day, because I've really been hammering this year about getting out, you know, getting more quantity of output out.

00:20:39:13 - 00:20:58:06
Matt Haycox
I'm saying to him, look, I don't want to use the words quantity over quality because I don't want to use it as an excuse of crap quality. But you know, but the reality is, you know, when you put that so you're putting out video on social, you could spend a day doing something that would be 100% perfect or you could spend an hour doing something that's, let's say 80% perfect.

00:20:58:06 - 00:21:17:21
Matt Haycox
And the reality probably is that nobody else can see the, you know, see the difference between that. So I'm saying our our M.O. for the year is 80% because I want you to do it in an hour, not a day. And I want to get five, six, seven times the amount of content out. And I was saying to them, what you need to appreciate is, is, you know, your competition isn't really other video editors, your competition is

00:21:17:21 - 00:21:34:24
Matt Haycox
my 16 year old daughter sat at home with, you know, some fancy TikTok app where she can create a cool reel or a cool whatever in 15 minutes. But also don't look at that as a negative that I'm threatening you that you're going to be out of a job and replaced by, you know, by my daughter or by somebody else.

00:21:35:00 - 00:21:50:23
Matt Haycox
Look at that as a positive that, what tools can make your job better? What tools can make you more efficient? If my daughter with no training can make a great video with this Tik Tok app in 15 minutes, you as a you as an experienced editor, can use that same app and blow, you know, blow the socks off everybody.

00:21:50:23 - 00:22:07:07
Matt Haycox
So and when I was thinking about that, it was it was making me realize it's the same kind of comments that we can apply to ChatGPT and things that you know, look at any of these tools as something to make you more efficient, something to make you do a better job, something to move the world forward.

00:22:07:12 - 00:22:32:20
Matt Haycox
But none of it should be it, you know, let's say making you lazy, you know, that the people who should be worried about it are the people who probably aren't capable in the first place. Almost like when when the calculator came along, you know, people were like, Oh well, you know, we don't need to do any work now. Okay, fine. You might think you don't need to do any work, but if you don't actually understand how to do the calculations behind the calculator, then ultimately you're going to be in a very dangerous or unemployable position.

00:22:32:20 - 00:22:48:28
Matt Haycox
I actually, talking about calculators. I mean, I walked into my accounts office back in the UK, which I go into very infrequently now, and I asked I wanted to ask one of the accountants how much was in the bank in one of the businesses. I forget the exact numbers, but the conversation went something like this. I said, How much is in that company?

00:22:49:11 - 00:23:07:23
Matt Haycox
She goes, Oh well, there's the main bank account and there's a PayPal account. I was like, Okay. She goes there’s 22 grand in the main account. There’s about 1500 quid in the PayPal account. She said - I've already obviously thought of what I wanted to think of and I’m walking away. I can see she pulls a calculator forward and she’s tapping like this.

00:23:08:19 - 00:23:27:12
Matt Haycox
I said, What are you doing? She said, I'm just adding 1500 quid to 22,000, so I can tell you how much is in the bank. I said, Are you fucking kidding me? As I said, if you are going to use that calculator for that, I said pack your bags and fuck off now. I said You’re telling me you're a trained accountant and you want to use a calculator to calculate 22,000 plus 1500 quid?

00:23:27:12 - 00:23:42:14
Matt Haycox
I mean, like what the fuck. And, and that's, that's the, that's the lazy laziness level that people have got to for me that's, you know, the people who need to feel threatened about, about A.I., about technological improvements, you know, are the other ones that have got no value to add.

00:23:43:08 - 00:24:04:02
Spencer Lodge
I think that if you can use AI to design a spreadsheet for you, that's a great thing. If you can design AI to drive a car for you. And I my, my, my eldest is 23. She loves driving a car. I'm 52 and I hate driving my car. And if I know that I'm going to get up every day and there's driverless cars around me, they're all going to take me wherever I want to go at the time

00:24:04:02 - 00:24:12:15
Spencer Lodge
I want to go there so I can continue being productive with my time. Bring me that technology, bring me that. You know I buy into that kind of philosophy.

00:24:13:14 - 00:24:34:15
Matt Haycox
So you mentioned you're asking you're asking ChatGPT to do you an article on inflation that must have been that must have been subliminal preparation for for knowing what I was about to talk to you about today. But, I mean, inflation's obviously something that is is on the tip of everyone's tongue. It’s in every every kind of media outlet at the minute.

00:24:34:17 - 00:24:50:12
Matt Haycox
And I guess, you know, no matter what country you're living in now and I guess, you know, when we were in England, when we were in America, inflation is something that we probably almost felt immune to in the old days because it was something that happened in those countries over there. But you know, it's something everybody's feeling everywhere.

00:24:50:20 - 00:25:04:12
Matt Haycox
I mean, can you can you give me your I guess, your your five minute viewpoint on how we've gotten to where we've gotten? Because, again, everyone's simple answer is, Oh it’s Russia or it’s Ukraine. I mean, how have we gotten to where we've gotten to? And I mean, you know, what is the answer?

00:25:04:21 - 00:25:20:03
Spencer Lodge
Okay, so there's a couple of points to it. But I think my my first experience with inflation was when I lived in Brazil in 1996, Brazil had just come out of hyperinflation where the price of a loaf of bread, was adjusted three times a day in a supermarket

00:25:20:03 - 00:25:20:15
Matt Haycox
Three times a day?

00:25:20:15 - 00:25:36:09
Spencer Lodge
With a, you know, like the guns, with the price, and before they had barcodes. three times a day, the price would go up. And when you got paid your salary at the end of the month, your objective, the moment you got paid, was to spend all it because everything was going down in value in front of your eyes.

00:25:36:09 - 00:25:39:01
Matt Haycox
Were you getting a higher salary month on month or was you salary always staying the same?

00:25:39:09 - 00:26:06:10
Spencer Lodge
It all depended, salary the same, interest rates in the bank were 140%. So it was an environment where I noticed that everybody became very aware of numbers, calculations and became very switched onto numbers very quickly. So being in that environment and watching that, that was like a massive extreme. I understood then what inflation really meant. When you look at inflation now, there's a lot of people out there that want to poo poo what inflation is.

00:26:06:10 - 00:26:25:21
Spencer Lodge
And the end of the day, it's really simple to understand if you've got £100 in the bank account at the end of 12 months, if that bank account is not making any interest then the spending power of that £100 is less, it's less. It's £93 or 90, £92, but people still see the hundred pounds. So they go, Oh, I've got £92, I've still got £100.

00:26:25:21 - 00:26:42:16
Spencer Lodge
It's like well you haven’t because it can't buy as much. So what you’ve gotta do is, say, what am I going to spend £100 on? Groceries have gone up by 40 to 50%, eggs have gone up by 59% in the last 12 months, and people don't pay attention to that. That's that's how much more money it costs you to buy the things that you were buying a year ago.

00:26:43:07 - 00:27:00:16
Spencer Lodge
Interest rates in banks are low. The base rate of interest has gone up and up and up and it's likely to continue to go up. But the payment they're going to give you on your money at best at the moment is around 4%. So you've got 4% and you've got inflation at 8%. Then you've got a 4% differential and people just want to turn a blind eye to this.

00:27:01:05 - 00:27:21:01
Spencer Lodge
But what you have is official figures and then real figures. Official figures are, we've kept inflation to five or six or 7%, that's just nonsense. Try and book a flight with an airline right now and look at the price it is right now compared to how it was 12 months ago. Airline flights are hugely expensive. Go and rent a car.

00:27:21:06 - 00:27:38:24
Spencer Lodge
Go and get a hotel room in Dubai. Did you see on the news yesterday? The average price of a hotel room in Dubai, the average price, bear in mind one star to five star is $480 per night. -Is that what it is? - that's the average price. If you go to the Mandarin Oriental, a standard room for one night is 6000 Dirhams

00:27:40:02 - 00:27:58:12
Matt Haycox
I mean I mean, I've really noticed, maybe going off on a slight tangent, but I've really noticed coming back in October, having not been here since April, that everything feels materially more expensive to me. And I've never, you know, I've never really been one to to notice, let's say, day to day pricing, you know, go to the supermarket, cost what it costs.

00:27:58:12 - 00:28:17:12
Matt Haycox
I go to the restaurant, it costs what it costs. But you know I use a lot of UberEats, Deliveroo, that kind of stuff over here and I feel it’s, you know, every meal I get is really noticeable. I used to talk about how I just used Uber, didn't even notice it was a three quid fare. I mean, there's no three, there's no three quid Uber's anymore, you know, they’re £9, £10, £11.

00:28:18:01 - 00:28:35:07
Matt Haycox
And the same with the Uber Eats. And then at the other end of the scale, I mean I was renting an apartment here back in, well from last November to last last April six months and I had a three bedroom, three bedroom place in the address, which was obviously new and nice and expensive. And I still working in Sterling.

00:28:35:07 - 00:28:49:09
Matt Haycox
I was paying 12 and a half thousand quid a month for a three bedroom place there. Came back this time, just needed a two bed, just to tide me over while my place is being readied. Rang them up, said, you know, I'll come back, can I have two beds? They said, Yeah, we'll send you our new price list.

00:28:49:18 - 00:28:53:27
Matt Haycox
I'm thinking it’ll be ten grand or something. Two bedrooms, 20,000 quid a month.

00:28:55:11 - 00:29:15:13
Spencer Lodge
I mean, outrageous, unbelievable, outrageous. When I first moved here 18 years ago, it cost 70 Dirham’s to fill my Range Rover up. 70 Dirham’s. You always had change out of the money, and now it cost me 300 Dirham’s or 250 Dirham’s. Or whatever it is. Everything's gone up. Everything's gone up. And people are just they're not understanding it. Now what is caused inflation?

00:29:15:28 - 00:29:33:12
Spencer Lodge
So you can say there's been a there's been a problem because Russia have invaded Ukraine. That's not what caused inflation. Has there been a supply chain issue? Yes, But that then does a supply and demand issue. That means we can't get stuff. People want stuff. So they put the prices up because there's more demand than there is supply.

00:29:33:25 - 00:29:51:21
Spencer Lodge
That's not what causes inflation. What causes inflation is taking the value of a currency and having a government that's allowed to print as much of it as they want. That's how inflation is caused. So when you have something that's valued, the dollar, which which was the gold standard, once it's not the gold standard anymore, the government in America is allowed to print as much as they want.

00:29:52:03 - 00:30:13:03
Spencer Lodge
The more they print, the more they devalue a currency. Now, you've seen this in Zimbabwe, you've seen this in Nigeria. You see in many countries, in Brazil, you see it in Argentina at the moment, in these more developing countries, you see this constant need to print money up because of corrupt officials wanting to take some money out of the pile, whatever it is, debts need to be paid and the currency then is devalued.

00:30:13:15 - 00:30:30:05
Spencer Lodge
That's what you have with inflation. You have a devalue, the money is worth less. And so the cost of that has to go up. The interest rates have to go up to try and bring more value to it. Because if there's no interest being paid on pounds, who wants to buy pounds? But if it's 10% interest being paid on pounds, who want to buy pounds? Lots of people do it.

00:30:30:05 - 00:30:47:23
Spencer Lodge
And so that's why they do it. And so for me, when you when you look at inflation, it's important to take a really, really deep understanding of it and how it impacts your life. You've noticed it. Everybody else, funnily enough, notices it. Everyone says, You know what, going to the cinema cost more money now. Yeah, go to the supermarket.

00:30:47:23 - 00:31:01:25
Spencer Lodge
I used to pay 1,000 Dirhams a week. Now I’m paying 1500 Dirhams a week. Oh, you know what, when I fill up with petrol, like I just did, or when I go to the more dilemmas, everyone says that very flippantly, but they still leave the money in the bank accountn at 2%. And it’s like, Why would you do that?

00:31:02:14 - 00:31:18:17
Matt Haycox
So how, How do we reverse it in real terms? And if it's I don't want to oversimplify it because I guess it's not that it's not simple, but if it's as simple as the fact that governments printing money is what causes inflation, you know, how do we reverse it?

00:31:18:18 - 00:31:34:21
Spencer Lodge
You don’t. The man on the street doesn't. What the man on the street has to do is to find a way to get more income from his money than inflation. So if inflation is at 7%, let's say, how can I get more than 7% on my money leaving it in the banks not going to do that. I've got to, I’ve essentially got to invest it.

00:31:34:24 - 00:31:44:18
Spencer Lodge
And so what do I invest in that can give me a yield as a bigger than 7% yield. So let's say it's 10%. So I can net down a 3% gain. That's how I as an individual fight inflation.

00:31:45:25 - 00:31:55:07
Matt Haycox
Okay. But then how can a government or you know, if if you know, society wants to wants to either reverse inflation or improve inflation, how can that happen?

00:31:55:15 - 00:32:13:01
Spencer Lodge
Oh, what governments do is they put interest rates up by putting interest rates up, that means that their currency becomes more attractive. Okay, becoming more attractive mean more people buy that currency, more people buy that currency, that then slows inflation down. That's what has to happen and that's why interest rates are going up. Governments need people to buy the dollar, the pound, the euro, whatever it is.

00:32:13:09 - 00:32:30:26
Spencer Lodge
And you see that if you go to any country in the world where the currency is on the floor because of inflation, you see interest rates outrageous. Go to Egypt. That's not far from us. Interest rates are really high at the moment. Last week the Egyptian pound lost 15% against the dollar. And so if you put your money in the bank account in Egypt, you get 25, 30% interest in the bank account.

00:32:31:21 - 00:32:39:29
Spencer Lodge
So on the surface of it, you know, the average person will go, Oh I better by Egyptian currency. I get 30% a year on that. But in real terms, that's not what you're getting.

00:32:40:20 - 00:33:03:00
Matt Haycox
So let's just move that move slightly away from inflation onto onto, you know, government debt, knackered economies. And I want to get your view on this because I have a, let’s say it's not so much a theory, but an analogy that's always - I spend all my days dealing with businesses who want to borrow money. Most of the businesses I deal with are impaired in some way, you know, let’s be polite to them.

00:33:04:01 - 00:33:26:01
Matt Haycox
But what you tend, what you tend to find in all of these knackered businesses is that there's there's some decent underlying fundamentals, you know, there’s some income, there’s some customers, there's some profitability. But, you know, it's saddled in some way, shape or form by too many by too many legacy issues. And I guess as as an analogy, you know, that's what I would compare now to so many countries.

00:33:26:01 - 00:33:48:09
Matt Haycox
So many countries, you know, let's use it, use England. But we're both from there. So if you look at these knackered businesses, from an emotionless business perspective, it's always quite easy if you can be dispassionate and I guess ruthless about it and say, well, look, here’s a business, it's, you know, it turns over £10 million, it makes £1,000,000, but it's got £9 million of debt associated with it.

00:33:48:16 - 00:34:05:00
Matt Haycox
Unfortunately, that business is probably just going to tread water or get worse forever because of the debt. So what we need to do to it is we need to put it to an insolvency process, clean it up, it comes out the other side, and it's then got £10 million, you know, £10 million of income, £1 million of profit and little to no debt.

00:34:05:05 - 00:34:27:00
Matt Haycox
And therefore it's in a strong, sustainable growing business to put it through that process is going to involve, you know, some embarrassments, some pains, some uncomfortable conversations. But once those uncomfortable conversations and that horrible situation has occurred, what comes out the end is a strong, you know, sustainable, viable business. Now, my, you know, please shoot me down and tell me I've completely missing the point.

00:34:27:00 - 00:34:42:18
Matt Haycox
But my simplistic view of, you know, a knackered country like England is well, we have the we have the same problem there in that we've got we've got income, we've got you know, we've got income and profitability, if you like, have plenty to offer. But we're just utterly saddled, saddened by debt. And people go, when's it going to end?

00:34:42:18 - 00:35:16:29
Matt Haycox
When are going to end? And I look at it and think, Well, to me it's no different to a business. We've only got two two options for England, we’ll either keep printing more and more and more money like a business, taking more and more debt and that previous example I've just given will be that 9 million of debt becomes ten, becomes 11 and okay, there's still it's still the same income, but you're exacerbating that problem and nothing will change until somebody takes the pill or the country somehow goes through some kind of bankruptcy process, comes out the other end, which will involve some, you know, I guess someone putting the hand up and pulling the trigger,

00:35:16:29 - 00:35:38:00
Matt Haycox
which no one's going to want to do, because politically, even though it might be the right thing, then they're never going to get to, you know, the never going to get put back into power again. But using that analogy, how how does it how does it ever end? Because, you know, these countries are printing so much money and creating so much debt that they can never, ever fix that deficit in any generation lifetimes.

00:35:38:00 - 00:35:39:02
Matt Haycox
Or am I talking absolute bollocks there?

00:35:39:15 - 00:35:46:01
Spencer Lodge
No no, you’re not talking wrong at all. But let's let let's take that knackered company. How did that knackered company get knackered? Probably because the leadership was wrong

00:35:46:08 - 00:35:46:23
Matt Haycox
Wrong people running it, yeah

00:35:46:23 - 00:36:02:15
Spencer Lodge
So the wrong people are running the business. So what have you got to do? You've got to take those people out of business or you've got to retrain those people. Now imagine you didn't bankrupt that business and you and I went in and we jumped into that business and said, Right, we’ve got a big hole here. Okay, yeah, we can go insolvent or we can fight

00:36:02:26 - 00:36:04:01
Spencer Lodge
All right.

00:36:04:01 - 00:36:05:03
Matt Haycox
Some holes are too big to fill though aren’t they?

00:36:05:03 - 00:36:23:05
Spencer Lodge
Well, let’s take the knackered business as an example. And we go and we fight and we turn it around and we reduce the debt from 9 million to 8 million to 7 million to 6 million because we've been really smart about it. Okay, We cut costs. Okay? We're very careful. We boost revenues coming in. We've careful about how the money is spent, all of this kind of stuff that great businesses have got.

00:36:23:25 - 00:36:41:24
Spencer Lodge
When you look at any country and take the UK as your example, you have this big debt and the only way to get rid of that debt is austerity. It's the only way because it's a debt. You can't write the debt off, you can't become a bankrupt country. The UK can't do that. So that that that insolvency isn't then an option.

00:36:42:02 - 00:37:00:19
Spencer Lodge
So what's the only other option is to say let's stop spending money just like a business? And when when I when I go around the world to different countries I've lived in, I was in in Nepal filming the documentary of human trafficking in the summer of last year. All I do is I walk around the country and I look at the country and I go badly run business.

00:37:01:06 - 00:37:20:18
Spencer Lodge
I look at like the natural resources here, badly run business. I take Nigeria, where I lived as a kid. Nigeria has got some of the most high quality, easily accessible oil that exists anywhere on the planet. It’s in the swamps not far from the land. Okay, So this oil is there. It should be one of the richest countries in the world because of its natural resources.

00:37:20:25 - 00:37:45:07
Spencer Lodge
But it's not, okay, badly run business. Now, how do you solve those problems? Well, Nigeria is corrupt from top to bottom visibly. And we all talk about it and we say if there was no corruption there, then guess what? We could solve this problem. The UK is just as corrupt as Nigeria, except it's a bit under the table and so that corruption that exists.

00:37:45:07 - 00:37:53:28
Spencer Lodge
Why do people want to become prime minister? Do they want to change the country or do they want some? You know, we just saw Theresa May's pay statements for the speaking gigs that she does now.

00:37:54:03 - 00:37:54:14
Matt Haycox
Oh I didn’t see it

00:37:55:00 - 00:38:13:14
Spencer Lodge
She's being paid 2.3 million a year to speak. Really? Okay. Theresa May, she was - you know, a lot. How much does Barack Obama get paid to speak? You now.. they get sat on the boards of these companies that are able to lobby and influence in government and yadda, yadda, yadda. Why did you and I would not want to become a politician?

00:38:13:28 - 00:38:28:26
Spencer Lodge
Because when we were young, we looked at it and thought, Who’d wanna do that job? But there are people out there that see the long game, and the long game is to be able to be, you know, for their own lives, okay, have that future. Power and control. What is a guy that runs a business that owns business, and grows the business.

00:38:29:12 - 00:38:51:18
Spencer Lodge
A lot of the time it’s power and control. So when I look at it, I'm like, until you're prepared to make really tough decisions, like really tough decisions that piss everyone off if they have to and everyone has to leave. If that's the only way to live with it, then you're going to carry on creating further and further debt. Our business we'd have to maybe fire half the staff.

00:38:52:00 - 00:39:16:01
Spencer Lodge
Maybe we'd upset the other half because they don't get lunch hours, they’ve gotta work seven days a week now. we'd have to deal with that. Maybe we then have to recruit new people in. Well the UK doesn't have the ability to do that. The only way it can do it is gently use austerity as its tool and make sure that the people that are actually managing the country and number crunchers, because it's a checks and balances thing, isn't it?

00:39:16:01 - 00:39:31:14
Spencer Lodge
Just like insolvency and growth and profit and all that kind of stuff. We have an IPO, it's checks and balances. Who's running it? Now is Rishi Sunak the right guy to do it? I don't know. I've never seen a politician yet that I’ve believed enough to think that they're the right man. But you sometimes get inklings, don't you?

00:39:31:23 - 00:39:48:03
Matt Haycox
But. But do you think any of them- I’m complete, I’m completely with you and I guess you know, I agree. Yes. You can’t bankrupt a company, sorry a country. I'm just I guess I'm putting my my two concepts of of of what's what. So totally, totally agree with everything he's saying. But is it ever feasible that it does happen?

00:39:48:03 - 00:39:59:14
Matt Haycox
Because even if you find a politician that you think has got the legs to do it, the reality the reality is there's probably so many hoops, etc. they’ve got to jump through and only so- such a period of time that they've got to do it.

00:39:59:14 - 00:40:17:24
Spencer Lodge
Well countries have gone bankrupt, countries have gone bankrupt. Argentina went bankrupt. I remember when I was living down there. You could have a peso or you could have a dollar in your bank account. And they were exactly the same. And overnight one, and it didn't matter. So let's say you had dollars and I had pesos. We had the same spending power every day.

00:40:17:24 - 00:40:39:25
Spencer Lodge
Overnight, the bank devalued the peso by 50%. So now it was 2 pesos to 1 dollar. So I had all my money in pesos. I got £1,000 in my bank account - sorry, 1,000 pesos. You got $1,000. I've now got $500 worth of pesos. That happened overnight. Countries go bankrupt when they default on debt. Okay. Brady Bonds were introduced in Latin America many years ago.

00:40:39:25 - 00:41:03:24
Spencer Lodge
High interest loans and Brady bonds were for high risk lending. If you take Zimbabwe, Zimbabwe went bankrupt. Nobody buys anything in Zimbabwe dollars now. They buy in U.S. dollars. The currency became literally not worth having. I think I've got a 17 billion Zimbabwe dollar note home somewhere, which is like three three quid or three pence or something nonsense.

00:41:04:10 - 00:41:20:14
Matt Haycox
I just I just spoke to my missus this morning. I was I was telling you that she's in Bali and I've never been to Bali so I know nothing about the currency or the economy. I can't remember what she told me she’d just bought. But she said she just spent 1.3 million, million whatever

00:41:20:20 - 00:41:21:18
Spencer Lodge
Rupees. It’s Indonesian Rupees

00:41:21:29 - 00:41:31:27
Matt Haycox
Oh, no, that's what she was telling me. She was telling me last time she was there. A million was worth worth $100, and now a million is worth $50. I was like, a million. She's like, Yeah, everyone's a millionaire in Bali.

00:41:33:16 - 00:41:55:07
Spencer Lodge
Yeah, it's funny you know, when you see these currencies but countries countries have done you know and if you look at these countries, South Africa is going that way as well. You look at these countries and you understand what's happening. It's really sad because most people have no influence to be able to make any change. And sometimes it needs an uprising.

00:41:55:07 - 00:42:04:26
Spencer Lodge
Sometimes it needs a war, sometimes it needs the people just going enough for something to happen. But individually, we're just all pawns aren’t we?

00:42:05:22 - 00:42:19:23
Matt Haycox
So you mentioned a minute ago about when you were making human human trafficking documentary, and I've seen on social you've done about that stuff. You've got your own podcast as well. Just tell me a bit about, I guess you know, where that came from, how long you've been doing it for.

00:42:20:13 - 00:42:43:05
Spencer Lodge
So I think that - looks it’s all, everything stems from the podcasts. So I'll, I'll tell the story I interview guy in the podcast who has a TV show on Netflix called The Kindness Diaries. He's a guy called Leo- Leon Logothetis. Leon comes from the fifth richest family in Greece. He's British, but Greek shipping family. Billionaires. He's the only one in the family

00:42:43:05 - 00:43:03:08
Spencer Lodge
that doesn't work for the family business. He made this TV show where he was, he was inspired by The Motorcycle Diaries, which was a movie many years ago. Traveled around the world on a motorbike, relying on the kindness of others so he could accept food, it could accept shelter, and he could accept fuel for his motorbike. But he couldn't accept money.

00:43:03:08 - 00:43:28:00
Spencer Lodge
And when he experienced an extreme act of kindness, he decided to give them a life changing gift as repayment and that life changing gift was truly for that person, a life changing gift because he believes the world inherently is kind. And he wanted to demonstrate that. And I love the TV show got him on the podcast. He told me about it, and at the end of the podcast I literally was set just like you and I are right now.

00:43:28:00 - 00:43:48:17
Spencer Lodge
I said, I'm a bit jealous of you. He’s like Why? I'm like, Because you've got a TV show and I don't? And he said, Well, how can I help you with that? I was like, What do you mean? He said, Well, if you want a TV show. You can have one. He said, Just needs a bit of planning. And I had never in my brain ever, ever thought, computed that I could ever have a TV show.

00:43:49:02 - 00:44:09:25
Spencer Lodge
And so every, he's in LA, every Saturday morning, Friday night, his time, he gave me an hour for six weeks and he said, let's brainstorm. He said, If you can make the hairs on my arm stand up, I'll help you make a TV show. So the first chat we had, you know, we went through different ideas and what not. And he said, Look, let's think about what's important in the world at the moment and think about sustainability.

00:44:10:00 - 00:44:28:06
Spencer Lodge
And and slowly over the about four weeks they come up with the guts of the show based around who I am and what I can do and stuff like that. But I got to the end of it and I'm like, But that's not what I want to make a TV show about. And I just met a guy who won the Nobel Peace Prize called Kailash Satyarthi,

00:44:28:06 - 00:44:44:02
Spencer Lodge
who saved 80,000 children out of child slave labor in India. And I watched the movie and then I met him in Dubai at the Capital Club, and he told his story. And I was really moved by him. And I'm like.. that, I want to talk about that. And so I then went back to them. I said, Look, this is my idea.

00:44:44:02 - 00:45:09:21
Spencer Lodge
This is what I want to do. Human trafficking I really care about dah dah dah dah and they're like, okay, fine. So then you need to work on that. And then from then was the embryo of a TV show. And we looked at that. We then found the people that were heroes. I employed a research team to start researching people, and then we started to film and we created this documentary, which is about three women that have done remarkable work to save children from human trafficking and child slave labor.

00:45:09:21 - 00:45:15:22
Spencer Lodge
And that was the journey that we went on. And that was the TV show. And it and it's changed my life. Everything about my life changed

00:45:16:08 - 00:45:17:08
Matt Haycox
When does it- Has it aired? Or when does it..?

00:45:17:08 - 00:45:22:09
Spencer Lodge
It’s just finished being editing lit- literally this month. So it should be airing either next month or the month after

00:45:22:23 - 00:45:30:02
Matt Haycox
And what does it air on? - Netflix - Oh, it’s actually on Netflix? Had you already agreed to distribution before you filmed it then? It was always going to be a Netflix thing.

00:45:30:05 - 00:45:48:19
Spencer Lodge
Yeah. So and again, all through these people so the production team, they’ve done lots of stuff like that, they know what they're doing. They came in, I mean, the first - where we were filming the first... we were in in Spain, in Madrid, doing the first part of the filming and the director's like, You’re shit. He's like, You can't- this is not good enough. He’s like, You need to be more this

00:45:48:19 - 00:46:07:08
Spencer Lodge
You need to be more that. Bearing in mind everyone speaking to me in Spanish, telling me their stories. And I've got literally an AirPod in my ear with someone translating what they're saying. So I'm not able to react in that moment. I have to wait for the translation and then go, you know, even though they've said 5 seconds earlier, something to make you go and so

00:46:07:09 - 00:46:10:04
Matt Haycox
But how were they understanding what you're saying? Is someone translating for them?

00:46:10:05 - 00:46:17:29
Spencer Lodge
Yes. Okay. But it’s them that are telling the story mainly. But yes, the- everybody in the crew speak Spanish apart from me.

00:46:17:29 - 00:46:24:06
Matt Haycox
And and you say that the show came off of your podcast. How have you been doing the podcast now and what made you start doing that?

00:46:24:06 - 00:46:43:18
Spencer Lodge
So four years ago I started, it didn't want to do it. Someone persuaded me to do it. We’re 230-40 episodes in. We’ve done one a week, every week for the last four years. And it's been it's just been such a remarkable experience because just like you, you know, you and I both sat here right now, but you get to meet really interesting people.

00:46:43:18 - 00:47:06:15
Spencer Lodge
You learn their stories, you build relationships, you build connections and all of that kind of stuff is really good for... it’s really good for me because you can become very insular with just your crowd, your community, the people you work with, the people you socialize with. And the podcast has just opened up this whole world of people to me that I didn't even know existed and also given me access to people that may be my heroes a little bit as well, like Tony Robbins and stuff along the way.

00:47:06:15 - 00:47:23:18
Matt Haycox
Yeah, I think I think I think I was saying that to you about mine when I when I first met when we first met a few months ago, or whenever it was. And, you know, I mean, I'm what, probably 4 years in as well myself now. We're like 150 and 60 episodes an audio one and a load load of videos.

00:47:23:23 - 00:47:39:05
Matt Haycox
But it's really only, only the last six or seven months that it's finally got some track, some traction. You know, the views are snowballing, the listeners are snowballing. And I did it for, you know, for such a long time. And people always used to say to me, well, why did you do it? What you get out of it?

00:47:39:09 - 00:47:58:15
Matt Haycox
And I always used to say that I can't overemphasize enough how even if not one single person ever listened to or not one single person ever watched it, they the relationships I get to make from the people I get to meet or the opportunities it gives me or the, or they say, you know, perception of credibility by walking into business just cannot be overstressed.

00:47:58:20 - 00:48:01:24
Matt Haycox
And I really could not recommend enough a podcast for anyone.

00:48:02:22 - 00:48:32:29
Spencer Lodge
Two things to that. Ken Rakowski did the first ever podcast in 1996. Came on my show and he said to me, How many listeners do you think you need? I was like, I don't know. I would just talk to various numbers. He said, You don’t need any because.. think of think of a podcast as a prospecting tool, he said, Imagine you wanted to do business with ten of the biggest X, Y, Z industry companies here in Dubai, and you just invited the CEO of each of those companies onto your show to come and share their story and inspire your audience

00:48:33:16 - 00:48:49:00
Spencer Lodge
You're going to have an hour, maybe an hour and a half with that person. You can have a cup of tea, a cup of coffee afterwards or before. And I guarantee you four weeks after that podcast episode is released, you call him and say, The episodes out now, people really love it. Thank you so much for coming on and inspiring everybody.

00:48:49:14 - 00:49:05:10
Spencer Lodge
I've got a couple of questions. Can I have a coffee, please? That person is going to say yes to you, he said. So as a prospecting tool, you then go out and see ten of your ideal prospects, whoever they may be. What a great way to do business. And at that moment I was, Ah okay, I see why he started it.

00:49:05:10 - 00:49:07:13
Spencer Lodge
He’s done 20,000 interviews now.

00:49:08:15 - 00:49:23:23
Matt Haycox
Really? I interviewed John Lee Dumas last night. You know him? what was his stats? I think he just, he’d done 3400 episodes. 3400. He’s done an episode every single day since 2012.

00:49:24:12 - 00:49:38:21
Spencer Lodge
It's nuts you say that because I met a guy when I was there, when I was in L.A. filming the podcast, I met a guy and he said to me, How many podcast episodes you've done? I said, Oh, well, 250 or whatever it is, all these numbers. And he goes, Oh, right. How long you've been doing it? I said 4 years.

00:49:38:21 - 00:49:42:16
Spencer Lodge
OH right, I’ve only been doing mine a year. I said, How many episodes you done? And he said, Over 400.

00:49:44:01 - 00:49:48:17
Spencer Lodge
And I’m not even going a year! This guy was like a 65 year old psychologist. And I was like, You bastard.

00:49:49:00 - 00:50:09:03
Matt Haycox
But, but, but that's, that's another way, I guess, you know, another avenue of looking at podcasts aswell, of the ability how easy it is to create mass amounts of content. You know, not, not too complicated. I mean, again, go back to what we talked about earlier about, you know, not putting quality over so you're not putting quantity over quality and producing absolute shit.

00:50:09:03 - 00:50:28:25
Matt Haycox
But you know, as long as you've long as you've got the, you know, the basics of what you're doing, you know, it's so easy to get to get vast amounts of content out there. I don't think, you know, other business owners, whether it's for their business or for a CEO as a personal brand. I really do think that they they overthink and over worry about how complicated it is and all the excuses that get in the way of doing it.

00:50:29:02 - 00:50:44:27
Matt Haycox
And I'm not going to say just get out there record because okay, or maybe I should just get out there and record because it doesn't matter how much preparation you do, your first one is going to be shit, you’re 10th one's going to be awful, you know, and it's probably by number 45 or 50 that, you know, that you're actually starting to get bearable.

00:50:45:16 - 00:50:50:19
Matt Haycox
But it really is just so it's so easy to get, you know, to get to that kind of number.

00:50:51:07 - 00:51:05:02
Spencer Lodge
Mate, everyone’s full of excuses aren’t they? all these people that don't do this kind of stuff, full of excuses. And you know that as well as I do. And you just have to like with everything, you’ve just gotta start. You just got to try it. It doesn't cost a fortune. You can do your first episode on your phone

00:51:05:08 - 00:51:16:22
Spencer Lodge
And yes, you're going to be shit at first, but everybody is! So you're not, you know, special. You know, everybody is. I look at my first ever videos that I made and when I made them, I was like, They’re amazing

00:51:18:02 - 00:51:22:22
Spencer Lodge
I literally made them. I look back and I'm like, Yeah, you've you've got this Spen! And I look at them now and I’m like, What was I thinking?!

00:51:24:05 - 00:51:40:02
Matt Haycox
I mean, I remember at the time, I first did mine. I mean, I couldn't watch it. I mean, I didn't look back on them and go, Oh, they look amazing. I used to have to give them to someone else and say, You just edit them as you see fit. Because. Because I can't even bring myself to watch myself. And then then I probably got to a stage where I thought, No, no, I can.

00:51:40:04 - 00:51:54:24
Matt Haycox
I can watch it. It's tolerable. I can I can I can make a few improvements. And, you know, then you get to a stage, you think, oh, actually, you know, I don't know whether I've thought I’ve got good or I've just become immune to how bad I am. But I can I can actually sit. I can actually sit there watching it now

00:51:54:24 - 00:51:56:13
Spencer Lodge
You've got this

00:51:59:03 - 00:52:18:23
Matt Haycox
It's funny with the weight loss as well, isn't it. Because I mean I never I never saw myself as fat. I mean I've always thought, okay, I could lose a few pounds, you know, and- need to lose a few pounds but never thought that I'm a big guy. And since since I started really hammering my weight loss from, let's say, April of last year, I've lost about ten kilograms.

00:52:19:21 - 00:52:37:21
Matt Haycox
And I now look back at some of my old videos, videos which, bear in mind, and I was happy to post so I thought, I must have thought I looked alright. I’m not gonna say I looked good. But I must have thought I looked passable enough to post. I look at them now and think, Who's that fat guy? Who- Oh God it’s me! And absolutely awful, so.

00:52:38:00 - 00:52:55:08
Spencer Lodge
I know exactly what you mean. I've got. There's a photo at home of me at a friend's wedding, and I've got a stripey shirt on, and I was at my heaviest. I was 93 kilos. And literally the stripe goes like that. And I look at it, how was I ever that fat? you know, how did that ever happen?

00:52:55:17 - 00:53:06:07
Spencer Lodge
But yeah, that's one of the things that we have to deal with. You know, making this kind of content is that that weight does change, that- the wrinkles start to show and what not. And like when you sat down here, now this is my side.

00:53:06:07 - 00:53:06:14
Spencer Lodge
Yeah.

00:53:07:02 - 00:53:09:29
Matt Haycox
Yeah. I don't even know why I say that to be honest. it's just it's just more habit than anything

00:53:10:24 - 00:53:13:11
Spencer Lodge
Why did you say that? You came in and sat down and said, no I wanna sit that side

00:53:13:22 - 00:53:15:00
Matt Haycox
Because I always sit on the side.

00:53:15:10 - 00:53:16:12
Spencer Lodge
Why?

00:53:16:17 - 00:53:30:26
Matt Haycox
I don’t know. I think I've just gotten used to, I mean, in my head I must look better on that side, but I don’t really think it's actually not how I think I look. It's how I like- I like to swing this way and look at you that way, as opposed to swing, the swing the other way. Not for not for psychological reasons, just for just for motions.

00:53:31:09 - 00:53:37:14
Matt Haycox
Reasons of motion. Well, listen Spencer. I'm conscious. It must be almost your bedtime. Given that you've.

00:53:37:14 - 00:53:37:20
Spencer Lodge
Haha!

00:53:37:27 - 00:53:39:15
Matt Haycox
Given that you've been up since 4:00.

00:53:39:15 - 00:53:42:01
Spencer Lodge
Yeah, I'll have my glass of milk and get tucked in

00:53:43:06 - 00:53:55:25
Matt Haycox
But listen, thanks a lot for being there, buddy. It's been it's been great that we finally got to sit down and do it. And I hope it will be the first of many. I mean, look, before you go, obviously, you've got the you've got the show that's coming soon. But where can people find you?

00:53:55:25 - 00:53:57:29
Matt Haycox
Where can people, you know, follow your content?

00:53:57:29 - 00:54:14:04
Spencer Lodge
Well, un- unfortunately or fortunately, my name sounds like an old people's home, so it's easy not to forget it. And having a name like that. You only- you only got to go out and find on social media Spencer dot Lodge Insta. The Spencer Lodge podcast. It's all the same, but if anybody wants to go and enjoy the content, then it's there on YouTube as well.

00:54:14:04 - 00:54:15:10
Spencer Lodge
But yeah, just go... go hunt

00:54:15:23 - 00:54:33:02
Matt Haycox
Perfect. Thanks a lot. And guys, as always, if you've enjoyed listening to this on iTunes or Spotify, you can catch me over on YouTube and see my shiny face today. Been a - been a very shiny dripping face because of the heat. And if you watch it over on YouTube, you can get me on iTunes and Spotify wherever you listen to your podcasts.

00:54:33:02 - 00:54:48:13
Matt Haycox
And as always, I'm TheMattHaycox. That's T H E M A T T H A Y C O X on all things social. So until next time, thank you very much.