Time to abandon ship! Oh no! Here we go! Can I persuade you to join us for a drink? It's a tradition. Here, here. Jar Jar, homie, my main man, quickly! Before the Separatists attack, get into the escape pod! Ah! Hey! This is escape! Then where's the pod? This is escape pod! Welcome back to Star Wars Escape Pod and our What Happened series back in action. If you tuned in last week, you heard us banter about Asajj Ventress. And this week we are talking about Darth Plagueis the Wise.
Uh, we've got... Bryce and Kirk in the escape pod this week. We're gonna be running through some old EU Legends material here, so, you know, spoilers ahead. For those of you who have not read the Darth Plagueis novel, we will be spoiling that in thorough depth, as well as other appearances through the canon, those that have happened so far. Alright, without further ado, let's get into it. Arkham Ashes Arkham Ashes Arkham Ashes Arkham Ashes Arkham Ashes Another happy landing.
Alright, welcome back, Bryce. And hello, Kirk. Hello, there. Hello there. Alright, so this is a bit of an interesting What Happened episode because normally, for those people out there tuning in for their first time this week on Star Wars Escape, welcome to the podcast.
What Happened is a sub-series that we normally do, taking and highlighting a character and stepping through their life one step at a time through all the chronological appearances that they've had and kind of breaking down the character and all the character story arcs. And Plagueis is a very interesting one because we don't really have too much in the canon. We've just got two, you know, and spoilers for the Acolyte. We've got two shots where he shows up.
We've got two shots where he shows up in the final episode, much to my excitement and dismay, and I'll get into that. And also, the mention of him in Revenge of the Sith to, you know, in the big opera house, you know, that presidious conversation with Anakin Skywalker. And other than that, I mean, all the detail, all the juice about this character is in this one book called Darth Plagueis. That simply was called, it's written by James Luceno. And. And this book was published January 10th, 2012.
So 12 years ago, almost 13. And originally it was scheduled to release in October of 2008, but it was canceled. So this was a long, long time ago that this book was actually in the in the making. And then it was later started up again and later released in 2012. But the audio version is performed by Daniel Davis. He was fantastic. I did the audio book. So good. You did the audio book. Absolutely unreal. Yeah. Such a good performance. He did. I just think of that's like his voice now.
Like, that's just Plagueis' voice. Yeah. He like nailed Sidious like a young, a young Palpatine, like super, super well. He did. He did Maul pretty well, too. Like, you know, he had all the all the key voices in there, like excellently done. I didn't think it sounded too cheesy either. When. It's like it's got the respirator, right? It was a pretty cool effect. Yeah, it wasn't too, you know, yeah, that was good. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely incredible voice actor.
Like it may just the I could much better picture like the story and everything that was happening on screen. And he and he and he flipped really well to like his narrator voice, too. What a what a talent. Oh, yeah. Talented, talented guy. Talented editing to the editing. Something like that is is a huge undertaking. So for those EU fanatics out there, the novel Darth Plagueis is preceded by a short story in Star Wars Insider issue number one hundred and thirty.
It's called The Tenebrous Way, and it is a short story about Darth Plagueis and his master, Darth Tenebrous, prior to the beginning of the Darth Plagueis book when his master is killed. So that is worth mentioning, although we none of us even realized that that was a thing until just now. So otherwise, we probably would have mentioned that, too, because that is another canon appearance. So I'll read the plot summary for that and then we can get into the rest of this stuff.
So the Tenebrous Way is taking place when a Darth Tenebrous is is killed, you know, prior prior to that point. And let's see here. What else? The dying Sith Lord had developed a retrovirus that cut him off from the predicting the future. The resulting maxi-chlorians. Long living. Midi-chlorians enable Tenebrous to transfer his consciousness into Plagueis's body, intending to transfer his essence to a savior of the Sith.
Tenebrous panics when he realizes that Plagueis is in turn being killed by his own apprentice. Tenebrous continues to be conscious and is forced to experience the moment of death again and again. So this actually plays into a little Easter egg in the Plagueis novel where Plagueis actually picks up on the potential spirit of of Darth Tenebrous. Tenebrous kind of surrounding him a little bit and then it's very quickly forgotten afterwards and never really comes up again.
But I like how this is sort of a thing, you know, the old sift of old, you know, being like these kind of aroma spirits in the forest that they can, you know, be like that. I like discovering this after reading Plagueis because, you know, it's you're kind of experiencing it like Plagueis where he kind of dismisses it like nothing happened. Right. You find out. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. I found out after the fact that, oh, man, Tenebrous actually does. He is planning for this.
Right. And he is trying to do like the conscious consciousness transferal. Yeah. He's taking the approach to cheating death in a slightly different way than Plagueis does by just trying to extend the life of his own body. Yeah. Like like master, like apprentice kind of thing. So I thought that was really cool how that kind of that kind of makes sense. You realize he's a bit he is a bit conniving because you kind of. It kind of almost feels like he's a bit of a failure.
I feel like in the book like Tenebrous because he tries to make a force based virus that can kill, you know, force users to try to wipe the Jedi out. It doesn't really work. And then, you know, he gets duped by Plagueis and kind of dies. And that's kind of it's kind of, you know, he's a talented starship designer, just designer. But the fact that he has made a virus to change his midichlorians makes him like, oh, and the fact that he.
He recognizes that Plagueis is such a talented Sith Lord that he could actually solve immortality. So he's like, I'll just, you know, let him do the work, take him over and then I'll be immortal. Yeah. Like, OK, he's got some got some plans. Yeah. Big ambitions there. Yeah. All right. So Darth Plagueis, the novel starts off with Darth Plagueis on Baldamnic with his master, Darth Tenebrous.
Who also goes by the name of well, sorry, Darth Plagueis goes by the the name of Magister Hego Damask, the second of Damask Holdings, which is a I guess a subset company of the banking clan. That to me wasn't all that clear. But but he works very closely with the Munes, his other race, very small population. From what I come to come to understand through the book, they don't repopulate very quickly. They're very selfish, greedy people. They want all the money for themselves.
And he's got his own company, which has been passed down from his father called Damask Holdings. And his name is Hego Damask. I assume that's his real name because of just he was taken at a slightly later point in his childhood, I guess, by Tenebrous. Right. So he is the magister of his father's creation being a company. So Hego Damask, a.k.a. Darth Plagueis, is on Baldamnic with his master, Darth Tenebrous, also going by the name of Brugis Nome. Is that right?
Yeah. Attempting to secretly mine cortosis in a mining accident, an explosion happens, which starts a mine collapse. Plagueis uses this to his advantage to bring down the cave on Tenebrous and rise up as the new master. He has been secretly studying midi-chlorians already and observes the activity as his master dies. So from the get go, you know, we see the stereotypical Sith way, you know, the apprentice kills master. But something.
Something very interesting to note here, which serves purpose through the rest of the book, is that he already has this fascination with midi-chlorians and uses the death of his master to try and kind of feel that in the force and kind of get a sense of what's going on there scientifically.
Because, you know, throughout his career as a Sith Lord or throughout his life as a Sith Lord, he gets ever so obsessed with this idea that he can manipulate those midi-chlorians to prevent somebody from dying. And I like how they kick off. The book this way, like it's sort of something he's already like obsessed with. Right. Like, do you like that? And Baldemnik, the planet that people have been. It probably most likely is Baldemnik in the Acolyte. Right.
Like that's the other tie to the canon appearance that we have. And it's unknown to us where where that really fits the timeline of this book because it's expanded universe material. It's legends. It's, you know, a lot of this probably doesn't happen in the. The canon story so far. But so far, I mean, like this, this planet full of cortosis with Darth Plague's being there all lines up. So I just want to ask you guys, like, what do you think?
Where does this fit into potentially the Acolyte timeline and being 100 years prior to Phantom Menace? I think this event is like around the same time, like 150 years, maybe something like that. But if you had any theories of like who Camille is, why Baldemnik? Why is he there? What's Plague is looking around the corner at?
Um, knowing that this is the same places where we kick off things in the book, I think, um, from my point, from my certain point of view, I, I think what we saw in, in the Acolyte was probably Plagueis after, and I'm, and I'm jumping ahead, but after any assassination attempt, because he seemed a little bit more grotesque and a bit more disfigured at that, at that point. And I think, um, I think, uh, I'm not sure what they're going to do. With, with that story.
And I have a feeling they're just going to completely abandoned, um, obviously the now legends book, but it'd be interesting to see how Camille and everyone fits in because, uh, it's, uh, it's, it was clear reading the book, at least that I felt Plagueis was quite set on having just the one, uh, the one apprentice, uh, being, um, being Sidious throughout. So I'm not sure what they're going to end up going, going down with that. Hmm. Yeah, I think.
It is tough because the years don't really line up. And if Plagueis is already nearing the end of his life and it's still, we're still like 120 or a hundred odd years out from the Phantom Menace, we're definitely not going to get him pulling the strings in the way that he, but when the, yeah, like what makes this book so interesting is he, he and, um, Tenebris, they organized the grand plan. Yeah. Which is, which is my favorite part of.
Of this book, because not only are the bad guys that are just, you know, a bit bloodthirsty and evil, they're, they're really conniving in a way that the Sith, um, aren't really before at this point, you know, they turn into more of like intrigue and politics. And, and I think, I think that's what makes them like truly evil. Um, so I would hope that somehow they can take like a little bit of that and put it back into the book. And in the Acolyte, I don't know how they would do it.
Yeah. I think that's pretty important to Plagueis' character for me. And, and it would suck if he was just like a creepy weird man in the cave who liked, who wanted to live forever kind of, right. I think that a big part of his character is like coming up with the big downfall of the Jedi, right? Yeah, for sure. I think what was really interesting going from that was how well aware Plagueis was in terms of his own skills and abilities.
Versus, and how he complimented or how Palpatine's political prowess complimented him and how they work together up until the, you know, the very end, which I think, um, it just makes for a far better, a far better villain versus some creepy guy like, I don't know, Snoke pulling things from the shadows and everything. And just adds so much more depth. Even this whole, this whole book just added a whole lot more depth to Palpatine as well as a character too.
Yeah. Do you guys think Camille is aware that Plagueis is spying on him? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think Camille was doing this without his master's approval in the way that, um, say Palpatine finds Maul or like sometimes, you know, the, the apprentice starts getting a bit of a hot head and decides, I'm going to find my own pupil.
You know, do you think that's what Camille is doing or do you think he's doing it under the, under the watchful eye of his master? Yeah. Kirk, you can go first. Hmm. Well, I would prefer the acolyte to not exist. as Plagueis' entry point, so I guess I could leave it at that. Yeah, I'm kind of with you there. As far as working off of what we have, though, I mean, so there's one possibility which I could see them taking from the book and running with as a edited form, and that is the other Bith.
So Darth Tenebrous, Plagueis' master, he is a Bith, you know, one of those aliens that we see in the cantina playing the instruments, right? Like the cantina band, he is that species. He has kind of like classic Sith fashion, he has a backup apprentice that he's been training called Darth Venomous, and this dude sucks. You know, like he's good, but he sucks because, you know, he's not good enough like Plagueis, right? Like he, you know, and we'll get into that. But I think...
He's not very Venomous. He's not very Venomous, yeah, exactly. I think if I were to put a pin in it, you know, just throw an attack at the wall, like, okay, come up with a guess. Maybe they changed the race of Venomous to a human and maybe Khmer is Darth Venomous. And maybe he's actually not Plagueis' apprentice, but he's actually... Yeah. Plagueis' master's apprentice. And Plagueis has figured this out. And he is peeking around the corner from the cave going, oh, who is this guy?
And this guy who knows nothing of Plagueis wants an acolyte of his own to take on Tenebrous, right? So that's my theory. Well, in the book, did Plagueis just accidentally stumble across Venomous or in the woods? Or did that... I can't remember. Or did he... Or was that encounter planned and then Venomous attacked him? I think Venomous was hunting him down. Venomous was hunting him down. And I think it was almost like... He was sent there on the orders of...
He was because Tenebrous sensed his life. And yeah, this is prior to the book now. But in the beginning of the book, this event happens to Tenebrous where he senses his life coming to an end, right? And so in efforts to preserve that, right? Like his studies go into trying to preserve his spirit or whatever. But also he's been training this apprentice on the side as kind of a last ditch effort to... Take out Plagueis, his own apprentice, you know? And that's why... And he gives the order.
I think he gets the feeling that this event is coming. And I think in the book, it mentions that. That he like had this feeling that he had a vision that he was going to die, right? So he is in a frantic sort of action. He has asked this other apprentice of his to kill Plagueis. The other... His apprentice, right? So that's where that works in because Venomous didn't even know that. Venomous didn't even know that. He didn't even know that Tenebrous had died at that point in the book.
So that was his last order. Then they went to Baldemnic. Then he dies. And then Venomous doesn't even know that. So I think that's where that kind of works in. But maybe it's just a matter of time before... If Khmer is Venomous, maybe it's just a matter of time before he is asked to kill Plagueis. But Plagueis now already knows about him or something like that, right? Maybe we should research what like Khmer means in Latin because I don't know.
Because maybe it does actually mean like Venomous or something. And we haven't looked into it yet. It'd be a hidden thing. Yeah, actually, I never... I mean, if I Google Khmer, it just comes up with his Wikipedia page. It's also a village in Zakatala Rayan of Azerbaijan. Azerbaijan? Azerbaijan? Yeah, yeah. Wait, wait. Wait, but that village is... It's known for having the most venomous spiders. Yeah. Is it really? Oh, my God. No, I have no idea. No, we're just looking into it now.
Okay, it's a shot in the dark, but Venomous also, you know, Venom, like Venom. Big smile, lots of teeth. Kind of like his helmet. I don't know. It's a bit of a shot in the dark there. Oh, hang on. Oh, hang on a second. Bit of a shot in the dark there. But hey, I mean, maybe they were inspired, right? Like maybe they saw, oh, Darth Venomous is a thing. Like, yeah, I don't know what that reminds me of. Whether they're aware of it or not. Right. They could have been, you know. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
So in the book, there is a mention of other dark side pretenders. That kind of leads into this Khmer thing because maybe Plagueis, you know, knows about Khmer like in this way. And in the book, he has this thought knowing that there's other dark side pretenders out there and him knowing he's one of the only true Sith Lords in the galaxy. But also knows that other people try to practice it and try to get to that level. And, you know, they're not a Sith Lord.
They're not from the main hierarchy off Darth Bane. And I never really looked at that that way. But I guess it really is because it is only a master apprentice lineage. And we got into that a lot more in Ahsoka where Anakin tells Ahsoka, like, you're part of a legacy. Like, this is my legacy. This is Qui-Gon's legacy. And Plagueis is a part of the Darth Bane legacy. Like, that is a direct lineage of master and apprenticeships that has come from the guy who made the Rule of Two.
And Darth Bane is a canon character. You know, we saw him show up as a Force ghost in the Clone Wars voiced by none other than Mark Hamill. So, I mean, there is a direct connection there. And he knows that he is of that lineage. And he knows that there is people out there that aren't of that lineage that don't deserve the Sith title. And that's just a small tidbit that they threw in the book.
And this was, you know, again, it's an older book now at this point, but I love how that's still a thing because that still has relevance to this day and age with people like Ventress or Savage Opress or Maul who's been an outcast Sith Lord. He was a Sith Lord and Sidious looks at him like that no longer, right? And so... Or the thousands of little acolytes on... Right. Or Exegol or whatever. Exactly, yeah. Yeah, exactly. He's like, I hate those guys.
Yeah. Do you know what I found interesting is how at this point now, every single Sith has gone through some type of like upbringing master apprentice then goes through a massive like disfigurement like towards the end of their life, which then leads to their downfall. Right. Well, it also makes them more powerful too. Like Maul happened to Plagueis. Which they talk about in the book, right? Plagueis himself. He says, everyone, yeah, everyone goes through it at some point. And it's like, yeah.
Yeah. So next thing that happens, Plagueis stores away on a ship leaving Baldemnic. So in this book, there is other village, there's people on Baldemnic, you know, spaceports and stuff, not very populated, but because it's in the middle of like frigging nowhere, but he becomes a stowaway. And one thing leads to the next, he kills all the crew once they discover him and can't figure out a deal and decide after they check, they decide to check with the authorities on his identity.
He uses the dying crew to study their deaths in the force as well. So again, back to that obsession with discovering the secrets of, of how to cheat death. Uh, there is a droid on board by the name of 11-4-D and he is a droid of the crew that he enslaves slash kills. Um, but the droid, The world's most disloyal droid. Yes. The world's most disloyal droid. And he takes this droid for himself. It is worth noting. Noting that 11-4-D is now also part of the canon.
Uh, he was resurrected by none other than the author of Darth Plagueis in his canon book called Tarkin. So, uh, Tarkin came out, I think when Disney started this whole new wave of canon material. And the first thing that James did was he took Plagueis' droid 11-4-D and brought him back and put him in the canon of the Tarkin book. Is his role in Tarkin in any way connected, could be connected to, to Plagueis?
Yes. Yeah. So in the Tarkin book, 11-4-D is intended to be the same droid and they do allude to that. Right. It's like a gift because, because I know Will of Tarkin is, is mentioned a lot in this book. Um, and is a close ally of Plagueis. Tarkin's dad. Yeah. Or that's Tarkin's dad. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Uh, or his, his family lineage is, is, yeah. I think it must be his dad, right? Yeah. Cause they have dealings with Damask Holdings or something like that. So he's like a business.
Yeah. You know, and I love, that's something else I'd love to mention about this book. I love how I, I know I normally don't, I'm not normally not a fan of this when they do it in shows and stuff, but in the book, when they tie all these little things together, it's so satisfying, you know, like it's like, oh, like this character knows of this important family. And I know it makes the galaxy a little smaller, but at the same time, it somehow pays off better in a book like this.
Maybe because the book is trying to construct this idea of the grand plan. Yeah. And how everything is connected. I think you nailed it. I think you nailed it. It's, it's not that the, the galaxy is small, it's that it's run by a very small sect of very powerful people that all know each other. Right. And I think that, I mean, I think that's just like, you know, what happens in our day-to-day life. Right.
Yeah. So, so I, I can buy it and I'm, and I'm into it because the whole book is all about intrigue and that kind of stuff. So totally. It really works. Yeah. So the setup is given for the banking clan in this book, controlling the galaxy's finances. The trade federation trades free trading routes for Senate voting privileges very early on in this book. And it's worth noting this entire novel takes place over the course of a hundred to 150 years almost. Right.
So as you move forward through the story as we move through these bullet points, like this is perhaps a little later than, you know. Something that came before. This isn't all compressed into, you know, a week before the Phantom Menace type thing, but it does lead into and overlap with the Phantom Menace. So for anyone listening to us talk about this, these events kind of happen procedurally from a century before up into the Phantom Menace story.
But I love how they brought in the trade federation to this and how the trade federation trades free trading routes. Yeah. Yeah. Free trading routes for Senate voting privileges. And this is where it really all begins, right? Like this is where the trade federation gets involved in politics and what leads into the whole plot of the Phantom Menace movie. Yeah. What were you saying, Kirk? Yeah. I mean, exactly that.
After reading this book and albeit very quickly for the last half of it, it just makes me want to go and watch the Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones again. Because especially with the linkage with Sifo-Dyas and how Palpatine and Plagueis like maneuvered the initial order of the clone army to be made, although it wasn't explicit what happened in the end, like just how it's all interconnected just makes watching those movies so much more satisfying I feel. Oh, totally. Totally.
Yeah. Um, Damask has dealings under his holdings branch on the moon called Sojourn. So, uh, Hugo Damask. I think it's called Plagueis, uh, does his business on the moon called Sojourn, uh, which is close to Munalist, which is, Munalist is the, uh, the home of the banking clan.
We saw it in the Clone Wars, I believe, uh, if not, no, maybe that was a different planet, but anyway, it's from all the, where all the munes are from, uh, he has a Sith base and a home there and he conducts his Sith affairs masked under the guise of politics with Larsh Hill as an advisor, uh, Larsh Hill is the father to San Hill, who is the banking clan dude. And Geonosis. The banking clan will sign your treaty. That's right. That dude, that's his dad. So he is Plagueis' advisor.
And he, uh, being Plagueis helps, uh, Gardula the Hutt with a contract for financial business in restoring the Boonta Eve classic circuit on Tatooine. Uh, so that happens also kind of very early on in the book. Uh, he meets with Subtext Mining intended to, intending to punish them and avenge his master for the equipment failure on Baldamnic that led to the collapse of the cave.
Even though it worked out in his favor with him killing his own master, he still promised Tenebrous in his final words that, uh, he would avenge his death. In a plea for their life, they give up information on a massive plasma reserve recently discovered under the city of Theed on the mid rim world of Naboo. That could be a highly profitable for Damask holdings. So Plagueis chooses to spare their lives.
It takes their, their information to heart and, uh, gets involved with the operation that then we see in the Phantom Menace, this big, huge operation under Theed, mining plasma. And I thought that was like one of the coolest parts of this book was working that in to the duel of fates. And I was like, Oh my goodness, like this book just keeps getting better and better. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. So good. Cause is that the big, the big thing under Theed is the plasma generator, right?
That's the plasma miners. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So sick. Uh, Damask encounters a mysterious Sith warrior on the forest moon, a Bith, Darth Venomous, whose last command was to destroy Plagueis. Plagueis wins the duel with the intention of using him as a test subject for midi-chlorian experiments. So that was really cool too. We talked, talked about Venomous a little bit, but yeah, brutal indeed. I mean like decides to spare his life only to basically torture him.
Yeah. I feel a little, I feel so bad for that guy to be honest. Cause I don't think he, I think he's like, yeah, I'll submit to this guy and maybe he'll give me like a, maybe he'll just give me some cool missions I'll get to go on or like, you know, and then in the end he just, he was so excited. Yeah. He, he seemed, didn't seem like he knew what would be in store for him. Right. Right.
Yeah. It's a bit of a shocker too, because he thinks he's the only other Sith Lord and he was trained by Tenebrous. Right. So he thinks he's got some skill to offer Plagueis as a master. Right. And, um, or as an apprentice and, and to be turned down because Plagueis knows that he is not worthy, you know, he, and he doesn't have that synergy with Venomous as he would with somebody else.
So that will make, that's what makes his, his meeting with, with Palpatine so important because he feels that connection and he knows he recognizes the skill that he needs in an apprentice. Right. To achieve the grand plan. Yeah. And Plagueis knows what sort of Sith are going to, um, thrive in this, in this, um, this age of the Sith. Right. I think he describes Venomous as being very talented in lightsaber combat, very aggressive.
Someone that would have been around during like the Brotherhood of Darkness when Bane, you know, destroyed the Sith. Yeah. Someone that would be, you know, a warrior. Right. But recognizes that this is not what I need for my plan. So. Yeah. Yeah. A woman force. Oh yeah. Go for it. Oh, sorry. Yeah. Could I quickly go back to the death of, um, Tenebris?
Because when I was, um, reading it initially, it sounded, um, it sounded like that the mining droid that kept drilling, despite Tenebris' commands and Plagueis' commands to stop drilling, it sounded like that the droid was receiving orders or some type of remote signal from somewhere to keep on mining. Yeah. Like that whole situation, despite it being an accident, like it, it was, it was actually intended by, by something, but maybe, maybe I read into that wrong.
Cause it, yeah, it just sounded like the, um, the droid went rogue and decided to keep mining. Is that so? What was the cause of that? Well, Plagueis, it's not Plagueis who does that, but that's why he goes after the mining company for that accident, because he thinks that, you know, subtext mining is, is responsible for, for however that happened. Right. So whether it was intentional or non-intentional, um, you know, that's definitely left, left to be food for thought, I think, you know.
I think it was intentional because, because people have, um, people have expressed, um, some, some, uh, negative, uh, like, like just various individuals have expressed negative feelings towards Ruge's gnome. Yeah. Which was Darth, uh, Tenebris. Right. Yeah. So I feel like, I feel like it probably was.
I feel like, you know, Ruge's gnome probably wasn't, wasn't, wasn't, wasn't, wasn't, wasn't, you know, Ruge's gnome probably made a mistake, uh, subtext mining, probably thought they could, they could off him because, you know, you, they just think he's just some bith business man. Yeah. Yeah. Not like a Sith. Right. And I think they, I think they tried to get him. Right.
Yeah. Yeah. Because I remember it was something like, um, they, they, they tried to power the droid off, but then the droid, the droid decided to, um, like was receiving specific commands to keep, to keep mining. I mean, that could have been an error or something like that, but I, I guess, um, what I was trying to get to was it was definitely not Plagueis that made the, made the, um, the droid to mine and he just capitalized on a pretty bad situation already. That's exactly it.
Yeah. Yeah. So elsewhere on another planet. Can you imagine the movie opening like this? Okay. Dude, this movie could, this book could, could be a movie like this book could legitimately be a screenplay for a movie and it would work so well. Like this book has a solid beginning, middle and an end and it works.
Incredible. I think, I think it, I think it would work better as a TV show or I know we have like way too many TV shows now, but, but the fact that it just, there's so many, uh, time jumps there in gaps or like, and stuff like that. And there's a lot to tell. Yeah, there is. And there's a lot of different characters and a lot of different cameos. Like I feel like it would, um, uh, there's a lot of like stopping points for each episode too. Totally. It'd be so good.
Yeah. Yeah. They should give, they should give this book. They should give this book to Tony Gilroy. The screenwriter of Andor. And just write a, a nine episode, one season show of this and, and three, three episodes per, per arc, I think like three hours, a one hour each per episode, that would be a, that'd be pretty sick. Oh, a hundred percent. Yeah. So on a planet somewhere, I forget which planet it is.
A woman foresees the entire future of the Clone Wars, the Empire, everything that is to come. And, uh, this woman was someone that Venomous was. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She was, she was keeping an eye on, uh, who, I guess I think it was a Tenebrous who had a list of people for Venomous to keep an eye on or was it Venomous' list that he was keeping in reserve for a potential acolyte of his own. I forget. I don't know. I'm not sure about that one.
That's the part that I forget about, but Plagueis gets information from a list of, uh, that Venomous had and a bunch of people on this list are already dead, but they're all sketchy Force users that are like, kinda terrible.
kind of tapping into the dark side a little bit so this woman basically foresees everything that is to come and uh that's the part that's kind of very star wars legendsy you know not something that i guess would be powerful you know of a certain power level i guess we talk about power levels sometimes but maybe something that wouldn't be implemented in the canon to that thorough extent because she sees like everything right and so he goes to investigate this woman and he kills
her um and i love how he does it he goes up to her like everyone else to shake her hand and like kind of like almost like a toxin releases lightning into her veins like through her body and i thought that was like the coolest thing you know like the funny um like the uh i feel like there's there's some funny like joke shock devices you know where you yeah yeah shake and zap someone yeah i feel like that's what he did just the extreme version totally no i
like it was done with like music like this you know yeah you know and it was like kind of scary and it was like you could just picture this woman being paralyzed as if like a snake had bit her or something right and he's like draining her of life and killing her in front of people that have no idea what's happening to her yeah and uh her message to the crowd is damaging to his cause because he can't have anyone knowing anything as what is to come right so that's why
he goes and kills her but i thought it was such a cool moment it's like she just what he just walks into this big cult leadership ceremony and then just like offs the yeah the speaker yeah yeah i can find it kind of believable because you know there's so many um fortune tellers you know probably in the galaxy that a lot of people might even hear this and just be like whatever you know right there's going to be a huge war machines fighting you know yeah yeah like yeah
and they're just like oh whatever yeah and and i i really like uh you know this scene mixed with uh you know when he gets onto the ship uh it makes him seem like so evil you know it's like you know he's not he's willing just to like get this grandma or like this this really benevolent um ship captain and her crew like just anyone who stands in the way of of the plan right yeah like it i don't know it makes him feel
so evil just just like you know eventually palpatine will be it's and that's it's important to see moments like that through the book because uh there is so much of him as hego damask through this story that you almost forget at times that he is such a brutal sick lord right and then he does something like that it's like oh shoot like yeah this dude is dangerous yeah yeah yeah because there are times you're almost like oh man hego damask so brilliant like yeah yeah he's just a
smart guy behind this guy and then you're like oh man hego damask so brilliant like i love this he's a monster no yeah exactly yeah don't you like when you're listening to this i'm just i'm just thinking like in my life i'm like hmm how can i exercise my political power yeah and like you start like you read this persona yeah like maybe i should think more more than a week in advance this guy's thinking hundreds of years they're thinking he's thinking about like yeah it's
a whole lineage of like people exactly uh so in his business on naboo discussing the plasma exports his holdings company is investing in his attention is taken by a young man of a royal family the palpatine family he's part of the youth legislator program also the same name of the program that padme later uh gets involved with his corruption begins with palpatine using his dismay for his father this leads to palpatine
destroying his own family with the force and plague is taking palpatine under his tutelage and that was a really good book and i think it's a really good book and i think it's a really good moment of the book this was summarized very greatly uh but i love this entire part of the book where he is kind of corrupting this young sheave palpatine and and using his you know fragile relationship with his parents against his against him right or using it to his advantage to
try and get what he wants out of palpatine and and also trying to get palpatine what palpatine is looking for which is it almost seems like he's looking for permission from somebody to do these terrible things it's like the evil is there in him it doesn't need to be put there it's already there it just needs to be woken up and that's what makes city is such a great monster of a person because you know sidious is you know named after the act of being insidious right and and like anytime i
think of palpatine i think of like the most darkest evil that you could possibly be in a story of any kind and uh it's only appropriate that a guy like that or a character like that is somehow believable to a certain extent right and and i don't know if you if i can think of any other story where that's really like that but i guess the closest thing i can think of is maybe perhaps uh like a a serial killer in our everyday world like it's hard to believe that anyone could be so awful right to
other people but you know they're they're like this for for some reason and it's like something's broken right and and sidious is like that he's got something broken in his head which and yes he's like a smart guy he's a sane person but there's something busted up there which makes him this way and and plague is just sees the potential there he's got the skill he's got the politics he's got everything he needs in an apprentice
he just needs to wake it up and i love how his investment into palpatine pays off of course with him being this incredible apprentice that you know he just exceeds him you know he just exceeds him and excels everywhere uh everywhere that plague is can't because he tells palpatine you know he's like i you have this skill in politics that i don't have but that's what makes them the perfect duo is plague has the mastery over the force and sidious has the mastery over the the political
game plan to gain ground over the over the jedi so very cool i love that whole part of the book i think we'll get into it a little bit more but like the the the fact that the force like plague is kind of describes it as a uh like it's it it's its own entity that kind of balances itself right yeah and the fact that it also i feel like it balances itself almost through putting different people you know like the force is somewhat responsible
for creating palpatine even though they didn't necessarily create them it like it made palpatine evil the dark side yeah right and and the fact that plague is can can find and people like these and and the force might even be putting these people in his path yeah i think he's this isn't the first time he's probably done this right you know he can sense this in people he can manipulate them you know um this is the way that qui-gon talks about anakin right like he he
believes wholeheartedly that it was the will of the force that he found anakin in that accident landing on tatooine and running into a slave boy that can get them out of there and also he's the chosen one right like that's why qui-gon believes in the prophecy right because he believes it's the will of the force that brought him to this boy and plague is believes the same thing only in a different way
he believes that it was the the will of the dark side that allowed him to find palpatine palpatine is trained by plague is for a few chapters uh that was cool to read about uh did you want to bring up anything there this would have been a montage episode yeah montage of palpatine the montage around destroying droids you know getting getting really cold on a mountain yeah i i found it really uh yeah i found it really brutal when when palpatine just like assassinated
his his entire family um i feel like i wanted to hear a little bit more about the differences politically uh political ideologies between palpatine and the plague and the plague and the plague and his father um obviously or what was said a lot was that palpatine was just a very troubled kid in in general and if it wasn't for their political status like he probably would have been in some type of correctional prison facility so um maybe there was a lot of that
brewing as well um but yeah i thought uh yeah i just thought it really kind of showcased to me uh how much of an evil person that and a brutal person that palpatine is more so i would say versus um versus in terms of you made the linkage to being a serial killer um in the head yeah yeah no definitely um so the next thing i got here plague is notes that dooku would make a great asset or ally if he was swayed to the dark side uh so i at this point in the book damask he go damask plague us is he
is the so-called funny bub and does that mean don nuked or did he do anything about it i believe it was is on sereno i'm pretty sure it's on sereno okay yeah yeah and um this was interesting to see because in the canon this is where some of the events start to fall apart as far as timeline wise and what's actually happened and what's going on uh because there is and there's two stories that really point to dooku's downfall there's a book called
And this is my third, other than Dark Disciple, this is my third recommended title for a lot of people, which is the audio book called Dooku Jedi Lost. Really great story written by Kevin Scott. And it's a audio drama. So it's like dramatized to be an audio book, first and foremost, not a readable book. It's about Dooku's downfall as a Jedi.
And it's about him stepping away from the Order, his relationship with Sifo-Dyas, his buddy, and this meeting with Damask, how he is kind of in a position of power within the Jedi Order in a certain way. He hasn't left quite yet, but he is already involved in politics. It's kind of a gray area, whereas in the canon, he is very strictly a Jedi Master being repressed by the Order to make any difference within that world until he leaves.
And then he's able to take his title of Serenno and be Count Dooku. And that's sort of around the time where he makes the deal with the devil being Palpatine and executes Yaddle in the Tales of the Jedi series and becomes a Sith Lord in that moment. So this book kind of, it can almost fit sort of, but it's like not quite there. I guess. As far as like the pinpoint accuracy of Dooku's downfall. But anyway, I love how Plagueis meets Dooku as a young guy, right?
And he's like, oh, this guy has potential. Like he has got charisma and like he sees all the things that Palpatine later sees in Dooku, which makes him such a valuable asset to Palpatine as well. I also love he's nearly about to tell Sifo-Dyas about Kamino. For an army creation. And then he stops short when he sees Jocasta New. So this happens in the book around the time that I think was it, was it the same conversation that he meets Dooku or something? And yeah, and Sifo-Dyas is there.
And I guess Sifo-Dyas and Dooku kind of resonate well with Plagueis and begins to plant the seed of an idea into Plagueis, into Sifo-Dyas' mind that this should be a thing. That you can, you know, you should create a clone army for the Republic and knowing what its intention will eventually be and stop short when he sees Jocasta New. And he has a feeling in the force that prevents him from doing this. And this was really smart.
This was such a smart idea because Jocasta New doesn't recognize Kamino when Obi-Wan asks her for help. So they couldn't have this character know about Kamino in mention of any kind prior to the events of Attack of the Clones. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. And I think it was very wise to throw that in as an Easter egg that the will of the dark side prevented Plagueis from talking about it in that way because of what's about to happen later.
And that's like 15 years down the road or something. I think it's also part of the thing that makes Sifo-Dyas want to do this is that I think I'm not sure if it happens in this scene or in another meeting with Sifo-Dyas where they talk about it's just like, well, I don't know. Well, the Republic, if these systems do secede, the Jedi shouldn't be an army. The Republic does need to defend itself, but you can't escalate by having a public army. So what if we just make one in secret?
Yeah. We don't even have to use it, you know, unless we have to. Yeah. So if we don't have to use it, great. It just sits on Kamino. We don't have to use it. I'll fund it. Perfect. Right. Right. If we do have to use it, we can use it. Right. He's just kind of.
If he is, again, he's manipulating Sifo-Dyas, who's a very like, I think Sifo-Dyas is a little bit like he's smart in the way that he can see the flaws of like the Jedi and stuff, but he can also, I think, I think if, if Plagueis pushed too hard, I think Sifo-Dyas would have picked up on something. Yeah. Right. But the fact that he, he kind of leads Sifo-Dyas into it. Into his trap is like, and I think the dark side steps in there for that reason as well to kind of be like, whoa, whoa, whoa.
Like let him, let him do it. Let him kind of. Come to it himself. In his foot. Yeah. Yeah. In the same way that Palpatine and Plagueis talk about, they need to lead the Jedi into the trap of their own making. Yeah. Yeah. I thought this scene was so cool. Such a good scene. Yeah. The assassination attempt on Plagueis happens at some point, sort of halfway through the book, roughly. And this was an event that was, was pretty neat. So basically what happens is, oh, where was I? Where's my place?
Yeah. So there's the, the same assassins that Palpatine, that Plagueis had hired to help Palpatine kill Palpatine's mentor are hired by. The grand, um, Senator, uh, team, uh, to kill, to kill Plagueis and the council and his little cabal of, of, uh, of rich one percenters, which I kind of thought was hilarious. Yeah. Super, super cool. And, uh, they kill Sandhill's father as well. His, uh, aid. Right. Uh, which then gives rise to Sandhill as the next in line for that job.
Right. Uh, Lee. He leaves the mask scarred very brutally. I think his, it's like something to do with his jaw and his face. He becomes like two face, I think, as far as like how messed up it is because he then has to use a mask, uh, going forward to breathe and, and speak and everything like that. And this leads to his iconic look. I think that's his, um, I know he showed up in the accolade without one, which sort of gives you the hint that that whole scene takes place before.
Most of this book has happened. We don't quite see his mouth. So, you know, we don't really see his mouth. No, but you'd think there would be some sort of reflective like thing, but in some of the action figures and pictures of Plagueis, you know, with a cloak and the staff, there's a Star Wars miniature of Plagueis as well with the mask on. Uh, it's a very, um, it's like a, uh, what a definitive look for the character. It's almost like Anakin.
You think of Anakin, you always think of the scar above his eye. It's like, even though he didn't always have that, it's like Plagueis is like kind of the same thing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's, I always think of Plagueis with this mask over his, over his mouth and, uh, it's sort of a definitive look for him. So that's where he tells Palpatine, you know, how this, you know, this happens to a lot of, a lot of people, I guess.
And he's like, you know, it, it, you use it to make you stronger. Right. And, and I think that feeds into this idea that Anakin almost in Palpatine's eyes can be. He can be better as Vader because he's been brute, brutally hurt, right. By, by his old master.
He's like, you know, lost so much and this feeds his rage and what makes him such a great Sith Lord, I guess is, is that experience being burned to a crisp, uh, Plagueis shows Palpatine is based on mutilist and they agree to begin training Maul, uh, to be an assassin for their designs and acolyte that is Maul is at the time. Uh, and, um, I'm skipping over a small portion of the book where play a pal Palpatine has his own chapters here and there through the book.
But, um, basically origins of Maul in the EU, uh, a woman, uh, gets this feeling through the force while, uh, Sidious is actually on Dathomir, right. And she approaches him and, uh, because of his attire and, and everything and gets this feeling that she should give her baby to Palpatine. She's looking for somebody. Actively to try and get her child off world, uh, so that he doesn't need to be part of the Nightsister way, right. The Nightsister call to be taken.
And, and we've seen what happens to Dathomir, you know, Zabrik men in the clone wars, like they fight to the death, you know, on behalf of these like Nightsister overlords. Right. So she wanted more for him, even though he'd undergone a ritual of tattooing and stuff like that and gives him to what she does. He doesn't realize as a set Lord, right. So Sidious puts him in a mall in the caretaker of some droids until the time is right to reveal this information to, uh, she go to the mask.
Once that happens, uh, they agree, okay, well let's start training them all up to be, you know, a, a weapon that we can use against the Jedi. Uh, so, so that was a cool kind of tidbit in there. So Maul is being trained behind the scenes at this point onwards in the book, the N1 star fighter is designed for Naboo.
Okay. And I love how the reason that Naboo has a star fighter force of any kind is because of this looming threat through the course of most of this book, ever since the trade Federation starts to get involved with the politics, uh, places like Naboo are like, Hey, well look, pirates are kind of raiding the free trade routes and stuff like that. Like we need a way to defend ourselves.
So like they come up with their own star fighter military force, you know, in efforts to, you know, fight away those threats. So that's why they have the N1 designed. And I thought that was like a really cool, like portion of the book that got into that. I think, I think they talk about, um, they need their own star fighter force because at the start of the trade Federation helps Naboo get their plasma off off world. Right. Because they don't have the cap.
They're, they're pretty new on the galactic stage and they can't, um, they can't really manage their resources. Um, they don't have, so, so the trade Federation helps them do that. And then the trade Federation starts taking more, more and never was not really getting a good deal. And then all of a sudden the trade for edit federations have been militarized. So Naboo can't stand up to any of these deals. Um, the trade Federation just has way too much influence.
So again, I think the end one star fighter is a, is a, uh, I think the corrupt King kind of, we need this so we can stand up to the trade Federation.
Yeah. So we can kind of have, um, I have a say in our, our, our own resources and in a way, I think, I think that part of the book, I'd like to think that this is where Palpatine starts to become a little bit more influential and, and see me in the way that he can see that he needs conflict in the galaxy to, to start escalating towards some sort of war. Yeah. He needs, he needs conflict to start pushing people's buttons.
Yeah. Because I don't think Plagueis initially agrees with, um, cause he, Plagueis kind of wants, um, the trade Federation to control Naboo. Cause he just, I think he just sees the dollar signs a little bit, but this is where Palpatine, I think really shows his like political, um, um, like his strongness where he's like, yeah, let's get some like conflict in here. Let's get, you know? Yeah. Yeah, totally. Yeah. Yeah. That's a great way to put it. Um, yeah, sorry.
I mean, because of pirate attacks, the trade Federation makes a movement in the Senate to legalize a droid army. Yeah. And so like, it's, it's amazing to see like these pieces all kind of falling into place for Palpatine because now Naboo has an N one force, you know, of star fighters. Now the trade Federation has their droid armies legalized. Like it's like all the pieces are starting to come together, right. For this, this war that is intentionally starting to brew. Right.
And, and it's like, okay, yeah. This is really good. This is really, really neat to see. Um, under the grand plan, Palpatine reveals himself to Newt Gunray as Darth Sidious to form a partnership. And this part of the book was insanely cool to see. Yeah. Pretty funny too. Yeah. Pretty funny.
Yeah. It was funny because like, you know, like he's like midway through his meal or something and this dark Lord of the Sith just like pops up on his like computer screen and you know, like dude, God, it's like, he's just like, he's having lunch and he's just, uh, he's just gone. Some random Scott Cole. Yeah, exactly. He's playing like Hearthstone or something on the other screen. Like he's like, whoa. Who are you? Um, so yeah, it was, it was pretty cool to see that.
Um, but big moment in the book because the Sith have never revealed themselves to anyone publicly ever. Right. For, for so, so much time. And so for him to introduce himself as Darth Sidious, this was a, is a plan that he was going to do. Right.
And, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and this was a it's a plan that both Plagueis and Palpatine are kind of on the same page, page with, with how to start getting this grand plan moving. And, uh, they know that they can buy a new gun, right?
So. part of the reason why they're like no this is we need the whispers of the sith being back to also get this ball rolling right and uh and you can see that come together in the phantom menace but i love how you sort of see them starting to put the pieces together themselves going like oh no no this is something we need to do to get where we're going um all right so uh plagues gets further with his goals in experimenting with midichlorians and the
dark side of the force he brings venomous back to life on more than a few occasions and then at this point in the story finally lets him expire and uh i guess at this point he has learned now so much of what he can with resurrecting people and letting them die and then resurrecting them again and uh you get this idea that now he's gotten to this extreme point of knowledge you get this idea that now he's gotten to this extreme point of knowledge
with what he's capable of through midichlorians plague speaks to jabba the hut and this was probably the weirdest part in the book for me because jabba the hut speaks english yeah he speaks basic yeah yeah he speaks basic um and uh we got a really cool easter egg mention of kamari vosa who at this point in the story turns out to be a cult leader uh now to some groups causing issues in the outer rim this whole conversation with jabba was really important
to the overall expanded universe lore in general uh kamari vosa is a character who used to be duke who's uh padawan as a jedi left the order and then becomes this twisted dark jedi character and anyone who's played the old game cube game or playstation game called bounty hunter with jango fett will know which actually this game is actually relaunched now i think just got remastered just got remastered yeah yeah so everyone's gonna know that this is a game that's going to be a
i guess potentially who kamari vosa is and um and it was really cool to see jabba the hut talk about this character also it's jabba right like it's cool to see a character like jabba show up talk to darth plague as about another cool awesome like eu character like wow this is in basic super sick in basic are you doing yeah it's like like this whole time he's just been that ignorant that he's just like never speaks basic i hope he has like a mobster accent yeah maybe a translator or something
i just didn't say it that's what i like to think right right um but probably it's gonna be sleeping with the sarlacc yeah um so yeah so that was a really cool part of the book that doesn't have like a crazy amount to do with plagues but does have an a greater impact on the surrounding events uh to those eu fans out there uh palpatine has more discussions with dooku who has intentions to leave the order for the future of the game so i think it's going to be a really cool part of the book
he tells more things about any man who's ever seen something like that they all know that that's kind of uh palpatine's moment in Akane comics right i can see that he sort of knows personality well true so um but like the the black etc these episodes become this rä line arc so this is kind of like you realize that death is not the same as sort of the ultra crow side of the you know you're going to go to erotica or you know up sterling universes like
ero uh battery is his main character um but whether it's that bike or if the black belly in the first couple of episodes he's gonna stay there and then he's kinda so stubborn but too much of a critic because he's not that bio we're close to earth because he's gonna end inん you really not going anywhere for life i think he's could explain that but remove that much more than i would say i and dooku both leading each side of the war in their own way and and i thought it was cool to
see like that friendship initial kind of friendship form before things get really dark right uh it makes me um it makes me wonder at what point uh palpatine decided to reveal himself as as darth sidious um because it didn't i don't think it happened at the end of this book in the epilogue right no and in the epilogue like he does tell dooku as dooku is kind of explaining why he wants to find this sith lord right that killed his apprentice qui-gon jinn and you know and palpatine
says to him like well i have a feeling that maybe this sith lord will find you right i was like wow what a guy um palpatine actually one one one thing that's that that kind of puzzles me with all of that is that uh dooku does explain that one of the biggest reasons that he decided to leave the jedi order was the death of his not beloved but he one of his apprentices qui-gon yeah um i almost had the feeling that um dooku knew that dooku was very
well aware and palpatine was very well aware well obviously because palpatine was behind it all um that maul was considered to be the apprentice and that's based off reports that obi-wan kenobi said and i feel like dooku would have like been really not he would have had anger towards the uh the leader of the sith or the actual the master not the apprentice the one that sent the uh sent maul uh because he was the one that killed uh
in effect like indirectly killed qui-gon um but maybe yeah i'm not sure like how i'm trying to remember back like what dooku's relationship is with darth sidious as a person and not knowing that he's palpatine because i have a feeling that he would have had a vendetta against is for killing uh killing his his apprentice well he kind of explains that in in the in the book right like he asks like when dooku reveals he wants to find the sith lord he asks
to kill him right like he like asks dooku what his intentions are and and then dooku to our surprise as an audience goes like no not to kill him like uh you know i i want to he wants to know more from this guy like he he's done with the jedi when he says i must have i must have i must missed it yeah okay yeah no it's just the last like 10 minutes i just like listen to the last 10 minutes yeah yeah i think i think um i i just found it a little bit odd just because
maybe dooku has already been persuaded uh not persuaded but swated to to to disabandon the jedi council in the order previously and that was just the cherry on top um and um he i just i find it kind of harder to understand uh why uh why he then therefore chose to to have that stance and be angry at the jedi or have say that the jedi were uh were the cause of or responsible for his death versus the versus you know the master but uh maybe maybe i'm reading into a way to meta
i guess yeah i mean and this this actually does sort of fit in with the tales of the jedi animated show at this point because um because at that point i think he knows who sidious is or if not maybe he's about to find out maybe that's around the same time that he does get in contact and you know start forming this master and apprenticeship and you know that's when yaddle kind of tracks him down and then he has to kill her and stuff and he's a little regretful at the time to do so but he
does it because he knows he has to right and then i think so i think dooku is someone that recognizes that qui-gon would never would never do what has to be done right or to what he thinks has to be done which is uh to go to the dark side you know for yeah uh and and i think he does that you know because he thinks that uh and and the jedi are um they're too integrated into a corrupt republic right so maybe he can associate the death of qui-gon more to the fact that he's not going to
act that it's the republic's fault yeah qui-gon died um and maybe sidious is just doing what has to be done and unfortunately qui-gon is like as much as he's his friend he's like a casualty in like this this thing they have to do um that's maybe i don't know that's just a thought i'm just trying to about up behind the curtain thing as well as off screen like maybe some conversation happened where he was like i don't know i don't know i don't know i don't know i don't know i don't
he points the finger at at plagueis you know maybe he tells dooku oh it wasn't me who sent maul to kill qui-gon it was actually it was actually my master plagueis and i've killed him right so maybe something like that it's all it's it's like a bit of uh i don't think there's any actual satisfying answer for you kirk but yeah just a little speculating here uh palpatine suggests uh on naboo to uh rui and jobel that
padme should become an elected queen and this part is interesting it's intriguing to me because in the in the and i forget what his intentions are in the book or if it even talks about that but in the movie in the phantom menace that is his his idea of exploiting this very young potentially naive kid is part of his plan to allow the trade federation to succeed on naboo right and i think it's his idea that oh padme you know 14 years old or something like that like
what if she was queen like we would have like no issue taking this planet right yeah yeah so maybe there was something going on there that that allowed him to suggest to her parents hey you should you know get your get your daughter in the in in the running right yeah yeah yeah uh dooku tells palpatine about anakin skywalker the clues that he is the chosen one it's all gossip and chit chat between two friends here and he also shares with palpatine that the
could be behind the blockade so at this point towards the end of the book you know dooku is like gaining ground on sort of i guess allowing himself to believe some of these things and and you know he's like sharing information with palpatine that palpatine obviously already knows but um i just i love how they further that relationship right uh hego damask goes to confront anakin uh and that was pretty a crazy part of the book uh plague
hears from palpatine all about this so-called chosen one this so-called prophecy you know chosen one and goes to confront anakin skywalker but he's already been sent to the jedi temple for testing at this point so this is where we're really overlapping the movie right like in the in this sense and and i i was like oh my goodness like how crazy would it be if anakin was still there right didn't this last
this last like bit of the book just had my heart going because yeah you can tell they're flying by like the seat of their pants on this like palpatine and plague us you know there's so much new information yeah it's such an important pivotal time of their plan they're just running around flying all over you know just yeah trying to get as much information as possible and trying to like meet with everyone getting palpatine elected like it was so exciting yeah yeah it
was also uh very exciting for me to be able to be able to be able to be able to be able to be able to be very interesting to see kind of this revelation that that plague has has you know knowing oh wait a minute this there's this kid who was conceived by the midichlorians by the force he is x amount of years old like this all lines up with kind of some shady stuff that him and him and palpatine were doing you know not only that long ago you know like eight years ago or nine years ago
whatever it is that how old anakin is and uh and and he thinks like oh dang he's like oh my god like this is this is a creation of the force in retaliation potentially for what we were doing can you explain that a bit more like what they did to cause the yeah blackout so like even i was trying to grasp just what that was but they were trying to cause some sort of rift right like they were trying to allow i guess the dark side to break into this bubble or something that that
the jedi had created within the force within the force within the force within the force within the galaxy and i think that's where a lot of that old eu kind of legends lore about the force really plays up where the canon has not delved into that a little bit right like it's as much so it's kind of hard to describe and kind of hard to take as as part of a crucial part of this of this character's story because you know i don't think they're going to move forward with something
like that in future stories but the main takeaway being you know the force has responded to the rise of the sith with the birth of anakin skywalker and this is something that the character of hugo damask really recognizes as a potential threat and something that he needs to get his hands on so he goes to you know meet this boy in person and i love that he's already been taken to the giant temple and he's like kind of pissed off about that um palpatine is also
nominated for chancellor at this point in the book and you know we see the news delivered in the movie uh padme and jar jar or or something when when he comes you know he's like oh the great news and you know um and uh then plagas has a vision of vader and the future and this was the craziest part of the book so plagas has a vision of vader uh a cyborg rising off a table um he knows that maul needs to kill qui-gon who is a quote from the book like key to everything so he knows that
qui-gon needs to die and he knows that he needs to kill qui-gon and he knows that he needs to kill qui-gon for for anakin to be theirs um and he has a like a very very short vision about this and uh and and recognizes that qui-gon is the key to everything you know qui-gon is and this is something that dave filoni has also said about qui-gon and i don't know if it's because he's read this book but you know it's it's like qui-gon is a pivotal role in this story and in this movie and in this
in this book as well uh because whatever happens to him his fate is tied to anakin's guy walker so um that's why it's such a big deal um palpatine kills plagas after this moment uh first with lightning then choking him to death and this is after palpatine i guess gets uh or i think it's before as slightly before after he gets the job of chancellor this is after after because because he as he's you know i could oh no wait
oh no it's yeah because he goes over to plagas's apartment and they're discussing the speech that palpatine's going to give oh right yeah to announce before i guess as his co-chancellor yeah but it but is after i think he wins yes but but he's like he's like how are you going to what is your speech how are you going to convince people that i'm going to be you know your vice chancellor and they're kind of reading this uh his like speech over and over and over again to
get it perfect and just like an your old grandpa plagas just starts nodding off yeah because oh yeah because he drank he gets him drunk right he gets him loaded on wine yeah yeah exactly which is so funny it is funny just that yeah yeah the last thing i got written down as a bullet point here is palpatine takes dooku to the factory the old factory on coruscant where they we see them meet in uh attack of the clones in
the very end of the movie there is a warehouse on the edges of the city the main city that we see it in and uh this warehouse was once owned by plagas uh by damask holdings uh this is where dooku reveals qui-gon's death enabled him to leave the order he also reveals kamari vosa is still alive and is a possible danger to the republic so that part of the the uh conversation leads into the bounty hunter video game um so what did you guys think of this book that's that's pretty much
the uh the tail end of the book the tail end of the book the tail end of the book the tail end of the book the epilogue but um maybe bryce you can start with you like what's your mr pablo points and poodles of this of this book and what do you think of the character of plagas this is like one of the aside from andor one of the probably the only things i'd give like three pablos to like i think it does so much to explain how the force works that you know people are always asking about
right and even even though this is like legends material now i think it's very gives you big standing about how things can be right yeah how it could be and how you know even if we're not going to take all of the information from this book i especially like with metachlorians not being a big part of the new canon i i still think this is a great explanation of how the force works now it tries to balance itself and how it's used by um it's used by the jedi and it went in the
and the and the sith want to tear it down kind of like yeah right like they want um uh yeah i think this book is great and i think it does a great job of give so much more depth to the plant the phantom menace you know if you can imagine i love imagining the phantom menace now with all these added scenes of you know yeah palpatine's like talking to um he's talking to padme and then he just like runs out of the room and like run
takes a takes a speeder and then he's meeting with yeah this right and then they're talking talking and then they're they split off and then they're talking and then they're talking and then they're off and they or when palpatine is meeting with maul on coruscant on the balcony and plagas is watching from the distance and his droid is like translating what they're saying yeah that was super crazy that was wild yeah like there's so much really with with you can imagine dooku
being around in the background he's doing things he's talking you know he's yeah oh man if only all this was like worked into the movie yeah like i would love uh i would love some sort of weird actually i've got a i've got a hypothetical question here we're talking about if this book was turned into a tv show yeah would you title this tv show palpatine or play this that's a good question actually i think it depends on your point of view of the
show but yeah i guess i i don't really know i mean darth plague is a good time but you could even call it something very generic like rise of the sith or something like i don't know let's yeah late title but like something something like that right i think um for me like sorry go on oh yeah i was just gonna say like kind of like house of the dragon right like there's it's a very generic title for a show that encompasses so many
storylines and characters trying to rise to power house palpatine man you are right though like this is this this it is a lot about palpatine hey like and more about palpatine yeah i mean like he's much um yeah i think maybe maybe you're right maybe you could cut maybe maybe not cut but yeah oh that's a that's a cool i never really thought about it i think i i think um just because more people firstly know uh who palpatine is versus plague
is like general star wars people that's that's where i'm going going to as well but i just think um a lot of plague is the story in in his book specifically a lot of plague is the story is not necessarily dependent on the story of the story of the story of the story of the story of the on palpatine but it's quite interlinked with it uh plague has said himself like he can't do this without someone that is able to pull the political strings and act as the person uh the the face of
their sith brand so to speak um so i feel like if i was doing a tv show like i feel like i would do like the first three episodes or the like on um on plague is and then he he meets um palpatine in episode you know at the end of episode three as a kid and then episode four kind of starts off that 10 years later mark when uh that time jump in the middle of the book and then uh and then going from there and then the whole the the whole um
the that way you know i'm like doing hypothetical episode planning here but that way seven of the nine episodes of this palpatine show is uh has palpatine in it yeah yeah there is something nice about it um on the on the flip side there is something nice about about it being plague is because you see him at the start in the middle of the book and then you see him at the end of the you know you literally see i like i kind of like that you have a book called play is where you see
him die yeah you know that's like that's a pretty yeah interesting thing that doesn't happen in a lot of right well and also it's him it's his legacy through city is that's plague is his legacy is the grand plan right because that's the plan that tenebris and plague has came up with and it's sidious that's executing this plan in his own you know his own demeanor um so like like i i think like darth plague is i think is a really good title still because even though
even though he dies and everything and city is also a big part of this book like it is his like plan right it's his legacy that's being yeah executed by his apprentice that kills him i think they'd come up with oh yeah like you were saying like host of the dragon they'd come up with their own little why i wouldn't love them yeah i would definitely like don't get me wrong i would not change the name of this book like this is like this is plague is his book for sure and i like uh
what you mentioned there in terms of how it encompasses everything within um he's he's not his birth but like all the way to his death in in the one book so yeah yeah definitely um so uh two t two key takeaways i guess from from this book uh one about plague is his fascination with midichlorians and i got one little write-up about the discovery of cortosis so i'll just blast through these um oh kirk actually before i do this uh what was your apollo
points and pudus uh and for also for anyone who's new three pablo pudus is the worst of the worst moving up from there you got two pablo pudus then one pablo pudu and then a bendu a bendu is 50 score then we go into positives so one pablo point is good two pablo points is great three pablo points is the best of the best well after reading this book i will also firstly take over the podcast and remove this point system
because it confuses me all the time um you know you know you know what um i i i haven't uh listened to any other star wars audiobooks uh recently i can't honestly i couldn't remember anything off the top of my head um so it's hard for me to like scale these this score uh compared to other star wars books but if i was comparing it to like every other star wars story just in general um all the stuff on screen i think i would give it a three as well there's really there's nothing
really really really changed here apart from maybe just getting a child actor to play the really young palpatine audiobook things but yeah like the story the story is phenomenal um i i it yeah really compares to the um political prowess and underpinnings of um and or and um i i have to give um i have to give so much credit i'm not sure who else like helped um develop the story whether how much you know in involvement lucasfilm
had as a company but if james lucino came up with a lot of like the political underpinnings and the backstory and everything like how on earth do you think of all the intricate you know web of you know a fictional political tale in a galaxy far far away is is just so beyond me um and and to make some like that that point that you mentioned there before josh how jocasta news like uh was approaching and then plague has stopped what he was he was saying purely because of what
happened in episode uh episode two with camino like that level of detail and storytelling is uh is very very so rare i don't know what what thunderbolt struck struck that guy's mind but and whoever else helped write the story but it's brilliant yeah absolutely um i would agree i mean three pablo pablo points is is uh what i would give this as well and uh i think more star wars books need to look at this book and really take into consideration like how they're
approach the uh execution of the story and and the level of detail in here connecting it to the greater world and the greater galaxy and i know there's a lot at stake here with the perception and execution of the grand plan i mean it's so grand in itself uh it needs a grand book to be able to do that and uh this was that book and i do hope that you know disney or somebody at lucasfilm listens to us banter on about this and uh really takes into consideration
just how great the story is and how they can move forward with what they set up in the acolyte with introducing him to live action as a certain appearance and everything uh what they can do to that the potential there is next level so here's another quick uh hypothetical one to put it do you think this would work as a three-hour you know screenplay like just a one one one movie type of type of book or or is it too is it too much to to put into two three hours
i just think it's so much especially with all the time jumps and like i think it would struggle the time jumps naturally fit into a episodic storytell i think you know how house of the dragon season one had a midway through story jump after episode three or four where all of a sudden all the actors were aged up and different and you know played by different people right like that was i think a really cool way to approach a story like this as well like they could
periodically each episode is another part of his life and it is about the legend of you know the legendary darth plague is the wise right the way that palpatine describes him to anakin later being you know have you ever heard the tragedy as if it's like an old tale yeah imagine uh imagine if the movie starts off like that like they just play that scene and then like and then and then the the story unfolds yeah have you ever heard
just like the title card all right so uh plagas's fascination with midichlorian significantly shapes his understanding of the force in several ways he perceives midichlorians not as symbionts as the jedi do but as interlopers that interfere with a being's direct connection to the force this perspective allows him to develop a unique ability to sense and perceive midichlorians which he believes can be manipulated to achieve greater control over the force and the force of the
life and death his long-standing interest in these cellular organelles reflected his desire to dominate the force and extend life as evidenced by his contemplation of manipulating midichlorians to prolong the life of his master darth tenebris this obsession with midichlorians also leads plagas to view his allegiance to the force as an investment suggesting a calculated approach to his power and relationships he hoards his successes and keeps his
knowledge of the force as an investment to his power and relationships he hoards his successes secret particularly from tenebris indicating a lack of trust and a desire for control his understanding of the force is something that can be manipulated for personal gain and may lead to make decisions that prioritize his ambitions over collaboration or loyalty potentially straining his relationships with others including his apprentice palpatine moreover plagas's belief is that he can
conquer death and create life through midichlorians suggests a hubris that can blind him from the consequences of his actions his ambition to manipulate the force could lead to reckless decisions that provoke resistance from the force itself as he acknowledges that the force will test those who seek to dominate it this dynamic could create tension in the relationship with palpatine as plagas may underestimate the power the dark power that palpatine possesses and the
potential for betrayal that arises from their intertwined fates in summary plagas's fascination with midichlorians shapes his understanding of the force as an investment in the life of his master darth tenebris understanding of the force as a tool for manipulation and control influencing his decisions and relationships by fostering a sense of ambition secrecy and potential hubris that could ultimately lead to conflict with those around him uh so there's a little tidbit there a summary on the
character also side mention i do love how he perceives the dark side as if it needs to be won over did you get that like when he talks to palpatine about things like he's he almost presents it as if like you need to earn the loyalty of the dark side you know he and it needs to accept you just as you accept it absolutely yeah that was really cool i like especially that again i'm going back to that jocasta noon moment um the dark side like pulled him away be like nope that's not not your time
yet let's let's stop yeah uh sorry well you know that it is almost like like the dark side was like a separate entity um outside of him so 100 and i love how it's so opposite of the light side of the force like the force is like the light side of the force is like the light side of the force comes naturally to people right the dark side would be unnatural you know and with it contains unnatural abilities and i love how that kind of fits into that story of being a sith lord like
you know it is a it is about you know surrendering yourself to this unnaturalness you know within this balance and there should be something very different about the dark side so i love how they give it almost like an identity in this book which has to me is has never been seen in any other book yeah like the force is its own entity yeah that is that is which ties in a little bit to like the mother the father the the celestials right yeah which the sith may or may not believe in
because they don't like the idea of there being you know greater power power yeah but yeah it's it's like the the jedi seek to use the force and it coexists with the force but i i think they also you know pop like this is always like there's always like the we seek to like bend it and like break the force to our will right we don't want to like like we want to be the masters of the force yeah right yeah yeah so one other thing about cortosis the discovery of cortosis or on baldemnik
significantly influences the broader conflict between the sith and the jedi by providing the sith with a strategic advantage against the jedi cortosis is known for its intrinsic ability to diminish the effectiveness of a jedi lightsaber which are considered symbols of the jedi's power and invincibility this makes cortosis a valuable resource for the sith as it allows them to challenge the jedi's reputation and combat effectiveness the jedi order has gone
to great lengths to restrict the mining and refinement of cortosis due to its potential to undermine their strength the fact that the sith particularly tenebris and plagas were able to discover baldemnik's rich loads before the sith was able to discover the sith's wealth the jedi indicate their covert operations and superior intelligence networks which the jedi and the republic senate were unaware of this not only gives the sith a tactical edge in confrontations
but also symbolizes a shift in the power dynamics of the galaxy where the sith are actively working to disrupt the jedi's control and influence overall the cortosis or serves as a critical element in the ongoing struggle for dominance between the light and the dark side of the force highlighting the sith's determination to overturn the established order and their willingness to exploit any advantage in their quest for power very deep
deep look into the yeah unobtainium exactly all right well we have uh we have maxed out our time for today so um amazing book and it's been great to go through this character in depth uh darth plagas tenebris powerful teen i mean we kind of covered a lot in this story and uh you know this book just as a quick reminder is legends material so uh where it fits and doesn't fit into some stories that we might be familiar with already like the origins of maul or uh dooku or however however
it works you know the bits and pieces of this book that work which is i guess the larger percentage of it works extremely well and i would consider it i mean fan headcanon i guess yeah yeah 100 they should and the acolytes not to be acolyte can suck no we've had we've had a wild jump in public schools from myself and and from you guys versus the acolyte staying quiet because we're quite high compared to everyone else yeah no i was i was up and down i was actually uh i i think i had i think i had
more pablo points than pablo poodles for the show overall um let's see i mean what do you have here so you had actually i'll start let's take for myself then yeah kirk you were uh actually you were 50 50 with points and and poodles uh i was one two three four five points one bendu and two poodles and uh bryce was who only had one poodle the rest of them were all points so i mean it's not like we're you know completely crapping on the show or anything like that but i mean i'll crack my jokes
but still i still wish we'd seen more of plagas throughout that series wow i mean we'll see them right yeah hopefully yeah hopefully all right kirk uh thank you again for coming on bryce thank you for joining us thank you both for co-hosting this week and uh i believe kirk has a has a very long lengthy sign-off for us typically uh let's hear well of course if uh if anyone misses me out there you can uh come party with me and plagas and palpatine down at the plaza on papu
amazing all right we'll see you down there hell yeah always a pleasure all right thank you so much to our audience if you enjoyed this episode we would love a five-star review and yeah if you could just throw in a few words into that if you're on apple podcast or spotify uh you know really helps us out with the algorithms helps other fans find the show and another way you can help us out is by sharing the show with a friend that always helps the
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the character darth plague is what you thought of the book as well if you've read it we want to hear your thoughts what do you think of darth plague is the novel send them in all right join the discord link is in the description below we'll see in the next one may the force be with you and look forward to another what happened in a week or two