Split the Veil 103: Dragon Age: The Veilguard vs. Origins

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I do think there's a recency, not a recency bias, but rather the opposite of that. Nostalgia, essentially, right? People look at origins with rose-colored glasses. It is amazing to me the number of things that have been singled out, like specific moments, specific moments of dialogue, music, editing, acting from, let's say, The Veil Guard.

Which are not great. I would say, yeah, some of them do come off a little bit cringy or a little bit too heavy on the attempt of comedy and not heavy enough on the actual funny. But those moments are... absolutely there in origins and nobody wants to make a reel of those and put that together and say, Hey, look at all of these sort of cringy bad comedy moments and origins.

Yeah, no, like Tegan dancing. Perfect example. Yeah, Tegan dancing is the perfect example. Well, I mean, this is it, right? I mean, we're basically into the episode now. Yeah, let's just start it and just go into it.

So yeah, that's basically the episode. We're going to do what I think has been happening naturally on the internet anyways. We're going to pit Veilguard against Origins. The truth is we love both of these games. Oh, we're recording already. Yeah, we're already recording. I snuck it in there. Did the episode start? Are we just going now? Yeah, we may as well just start from here. That's kind of our style at this point. Hi, everybody. I wasn't prepared for this. Hey, it's banana.

We start slowly and we never stop. That's the theme of our show. What does that even mean? I mean, think about how long we've been doing this podcast and it's like a drip feed of this podcast for the last six, seven years. Yeah. I mean, we remember, Hey, do you remember when we had a schedule and we kept to it? Yeah, that was, but even then it was only monthly, right? Oh no, we did every other week for a little bit. Oh, okay. Yeah, that's right. We did every other week and yeah, we kept to it.

Yeah, and then we did monthly, and then I had a baby, and then you get really busy at work, and then what happened? Who are we anymore? I don't know. A game came out. It's incredible. That too. That too. And now we can talk about it. Do you think before we jump into the main, has there been anything? Because I haven't really been paying attention after I beat Vailguard. I started a second playthrough, which I hadn't finished, but...

Has anything come out? I mean, I know there's been a couple of small up, smallish updates that have come out. Oh, for the game? Yeah. Yeah. For Veal Guard. Oh, which side note, we have to talk about the Bioware news. Well, we'll get there in a second.

so okay so updates yeah there's been like some some updates to the game they added some n7 gear if you saw that yeah the n7 armor is fantastic and then they added hawk's armor which is good um and that's kind of like like that that's the most made like they've added a couple of like um a photo mode god what's the term when you like the color filter filters um and then like some like mostly like bug tweaks and stuff like that

I'm recovering from a cold by the way so I'm just gonna like cough randomly I'm trying to make it easier for editing to get that out of there but anyway um yeah it's it the patches have been like really minor and i think they're going to stay pretty minor we are supposed to get a patch sometime this year they have talked about it but i have not seen any like movement on that or like what that's about

uh the most interesting thing it was very strange so like i've been i've been data mining and sometime in early december um when one of the patches we we found evidence of this new item set called the watchful whatever it's like watchful staff watchful um shield or whatever and like it's this really weird collection of items that we couldn't really find anything else on and it was whatever and like cutting down a very long story

apparently xbox had a promotion that was extremely quiet and no one knew it was going on that if you bought veil guard and a couple other ea games um in between a certain date range you would either get you would you would get like a five dollar gift card to some ea store whatever and then either like five dollar credit to some in-game account or an item set and veil guard got an item set

And this is only for Xbox. So right now, Xbox people, if you bought within a certain date range, you probably got an email that was like, hey, congratulations, here's a $5 coupon. And like next time you boot up the game, you're going to have like these very strange looking items.

And as far as I know, it is Xbox exclusive. How interesting. I always think stuff like this is fascinating. I'm not a huge fan of it, except it is kind of neat, to be honest, that stuff like that still exists every now and then. i wish everyone could have it i'm okay i guess i'm not as upset of it upset about it as i am because those files exist in the pc version and people have already been modding it in um accidentally like there was um

There was a mod I saw that was like, oh, change a dagger to a couple other models I found. And they included one of those. daggers as and they just thought it was a cut content dagger so they just did that no it's just one that's not available on pc so whoever like mods it in could absolutely do the whole set like i have found all of the weapons in the files all ready to go um it's just had a

put it in the game exactly how you want to do that. I don't know. I'm not good at modding. I can poke at it a bit. But it should just be an item swap I would think. But yeah, it's... So PC players who mod, you could totally do this easy. PlayStation 5 users, I'm sorry. You got fucked.

sorry and frankly xbox users because like um if you didn't buy within a time frame like good luck you didn't get it either and like if they didn't even like no i didn't know about it like i've been like my nose trying to search for stuff like this and i did not know about it until people were complaining i read like why did i get this item set what is going on like what do you mean

uh yeah they were just it was just a really quiet promotion i don't know why xbox wasn't promoting it i wonder if eventually they'll just let everyone have it i don't i actually don't know the specifics of this so i'll try and reference it by just prefacing i don't remember exactly what happened with this, but there was a side quest in the PlayStation 5 version of Hogwarts Legacy. I think it was the Hogsmeade.

side quest or whatever that was exclusive only for pre-ordering but it was a side quest it wasn't huge or anything but it was like actual content that was exclusive to one platform and people were mad about that but i guess maybe one year after they're just like not even as paid dlc it was just like okay everybody gets it now now dragon age did do that with origins and two where it was it was sometime within like i was at one point like i was doing the channel so it was like that

that far along that they were like okay now here's all the promotional gear for free um but they still haven't done that with inquisition and there's still a lot of like inquisition gear that was promotional that you cannot get unless you modded in and somebody sometimes like there there are some like inquisition like um they had like

a couple of like necklaces and rings that were promotional gear that no one's bothered to mod in because like no one really cares about accessories but like there's like there's like horses and stuff like that that people have put in the game yeah But yeah, that's not in there. So like I, and it's been 10 years since that happened and I have seen no movement on that happening. So maybe one day, but I would not count on it anytime soon.

Well, also famously, right? I mean, Shale is DLC. That's true. And that was, was it pre-order? Um, I don't remember. That's beyond my time. Or special edition. Certainly DLC. And so it's not like this has not been done before in bigger ways, quite honestly.

Let's quickly go on to Bioware news real quick. Yeah, let's talk about that. Last week, I don't know if you heard, but Corinne Bush announced that she was leaving for better prospects. She has not announced where she's going.

She's also the director for Dragon Age at the moment. Or was, I suppose. Her last day was Friday. Excuse me. And it's from all... viewpoints like she didn't get fired or anything it's just like she wanted to work on crpgs and so she is apparently going to a team with a crpg uh which good for her um and like there's there's other like if you're really keeping

a track on it there's other essentially the dragon age team is like been either moved on to mass effect or like are on loan to other studios or they're finding new work because the project's over so like If you were holding out hope for DLC or anything, this is like the most over it's been. It's so over. Like, no, it's like everyone's gone.

they're they're doing other things the lights are off they're sweeping up the floors it's we're we're closing it yeah yeah no it's there there is no veil guard dlc like it's just not happening it is not happening It's not. Jeff Grubb reported it on X. It was confirmed via Eurogamer. Corinne Bush said to Eurogamer, quote, an opportunity I couldn't turn down, end quote, was the reason why she was leaving.

So it sounds like, yeah, just greener pastures, more things that are more creatively interesting. And also, as you said, cited the CRPG space. So, yeah, it's. Veilguard is officially over, if you will. Apparently we're still getting that patch. I have no idea what it is, what it entails.

um they kind of hyped it up a bit in the last patch like oh we have another patch coming this near look we'll wait wait for it so like i'm hoping there's something cool in there but i have no idea what it would be at all i i genuinely through data mining through any connections i don't even know when it's dropping i don't know what it is i don't know i just hope that it's fun and add some features

Yeah, I feel the same way. I mean, we covered this when we've talked about Veilguard before already, but I love what I played in Veilguard. I will continue to play it in the future. My true opinion of it will probably form over the course of years in the same way that my true opinion of Origins 2 and Inquisition has formed over the course of years. But I love what I've played.

I don't know. I don't feel any... Maybe I'm disconnected, but I don't feel any type of sadness about this being it. I'm happy with what we got. It feels like a very done thing. Well... There are some companions that maybe didn't feel as done, but in the realistic world of AAA gaming where nothing is ever colored in 100%, it feels like, right, everything...

has stuff that hit the cutting room floor, it feels about as done as we could have hoped for. Yeah, I think there's a sadness for me because I had always hoped for more.

um because i love dragon age and i just want more dragon age and like just knowing that like there's like no movement right now like nothing's happening like we're back to mass effect i i do think there is a little bit of i just gotta admit my bias here there is a little bit of bitterness like oh now everyone's working on mass effect again it's always about

Everything's massive. They get all the money and the attention and Dragon Age doesn't get shit. It always makes me sad. I, so, and by the way, we can talk about this as much as we want. I mean, we kind of said today's topic was origins.

and veil guard but i don't fucking care we can make today's topic whatever you want we can go back to that sorry i just wanted to catch up on the news real quick no no let's honestly like let's just roll let's roll with it this is what i'm feeling anyway so like let's just roll with the news as much as we want to and we can talk about some origin comparisons if we want but so like i hear what you're saying and again i don't know if it's mainly just because i'm maybe more disconnected from it

I guess I'm just coloring some point distant in the future, not anytime soon, because right now, like you said, it's nothing. It's Mass Effect, or like you said, somewhere else in the EA.

ecosystem so there's nothing dragon age that we know of going on right now but i guess for some reason i've just penciled in in the future there will be more dragon age but i don't know if that's a cope or just optimistic I think I had just such a big... pencil in of dragon age four that now that it's here i have like this looming of well now what do i do dragon age five like oh no do i pencil that in like is that too much to hope for i don't know like

because i i think right now what i what i'm really hungry for is like a world of thetis volume three where like they go and they'd be like okay like we didn't have enough time to get to these like weird lore points or whatever here's what let's fill it in That is probably the perfect suggestion. I was talking to a friend of mine named Dan about this.

He was like, you know, I'm good with Dragon Age as is. Like if we never get into the Dragon Age, I'll be happy. And I'm like, I'm almost there. If you could just give me like a World of Thedas Volume 3 to like wrap up a few points, like I could be fine. I think there's just like, like a number of things on my hands that I'm like, I just wish I could get like some closure on that. And like, I would be, I would be a happy camper. Now, now granted, like I, so.

I don't want like Dragon Age as a series to end at all. Cause I love this and I, and I just want more of it and blah, blah, blah. But like. I feel like wherever we're going next, they're really trying to open it up as like a new chapter of Thedas. Like it might not even be called Dragon Age anymore. It might be called something else age, you know? Yeah.

and I would be 100% okay with that if they could just wrap up a couple things in like a novel and like for us hardcore nerds and I would be completely content like okay you have completely enclosed this chapter of of dragon age of Thedas and you've kept it contained and it's over here now I'm completely happy you do whatever the hell you want in the future um and like I I will follow them into that future because that's who I am but like I do wish there was like some more

wrapped up in new sense and i don't even mean like the executor stuff or like stuff they're trying to set up for the future but like stuff that was set up in previous games they just never really got to you know like what's what's going on with like the awakening cast and the architect and all that and like maybe they'll go back to that but like the likelihood is that they never want to touch awakening again they've been ignoring awakenings existence since 2010 yes it's a happy yeah

so i i would just enjoy like wrapping up like just a couple little tight bows and they call it a day whatever but um will they do that probably not because i i i would imagine that there is like this they want to keep those plot points open one because like a book is not going to do it in a way that satisfies them even like creatively and then probably two like they want to keep it for a rainy day like what if suddenly

ea calls down upon them i'm like we want you to make this one thing i'm like oh god what do we do well we have this list of plot points we can attach like i'm just assuming that's how it works out actually but um so i don't know i i i guess like if if they want to be done with dragon age i would just like a little bow on it and then i'd be happy enough i suppose that's where i'm at

I would like a bow for some of that stuff too. It just, it would seem right. I think the community would appreciate it so much and it would just feel right basically. Yeah. And I, and I feel like the, so there's people that complain that they didn't like the writing and veil guard. And like, I think. I think a lot of the hiccups that I've seen people upset about with the writing is more like time constraints and stuff like that. And I feel like a novel would probably go off.

a lot better and I say novel I also mean world of Thedas just the collection of writing because like I think the writers are still very talented but I think like when you put constraints on the game sometimes that things just got cut things got whatever plans change and so things got kind of like frankenstein together so i don't know that's my opinion i i feel like everyone loved tevinter nights so like another like tevinter nights that wraps up some of the

the plot points i want perfect we're all happy yeah i think i think at to winter nights which was an anthology or maybe even just like if they can find the right set of characters and the right story to tell in a main novel And depending on who writes it, right, like that could potentially shore up a lot of things in one kind of like central narrative. I think that would be really, really nice as well. Otherwise, I think a clean break.

maybe in a different age would be potentially really, really good for the series because it also gives you the opportunity to do a different style of game. you know like you could do that anyway i mean each get each um dragon age game has had different gameplay at least slightly if not majorly like in the case of the veil guard yeah but

It would just make the most sense to say this is a totally clean break. Therefore, we're doing this style of gameplay now, whatever it may be, even more towards action. I hold out my little glimmer of hope or copium, whatever you want to call it, that they might.

swing the other direction and go back to their hardcore crpg uh roots but either way they would have the opportunity to do one or the other yeah i mean i would love it if they could even like branch out a bit and like have multiple dragon age games can you imagine that like like maybe they're smaller yeah you know like that would be great i would love that let bioware make smaller games yay that's what i want

let them make smaller games that are like a little bit bite-sized you know a little bit a little bit smaller that that like maybe take like two years to complete yeah you know and not even with crunch just like very leisurely like yeah it's fine it'll be fine just a little it's a little jaunt you know maybe maybe maybe they're a little bit cheaper maybe they're like 40 dollars rather than 60 dollars whatever

I would love to see that in the industry as a whole. The reason why I doubt that it... I want it to happen. I think exactly what you said. The reason why I feel less than optimistic about it happening is I think EA is just kind of like... I know that they are technically speaking an industry leader because of their size, but I feel like they're just going to do what everyone else is doing. Do you know what I mean? And unfortunately, it just doesn't seem like it's a trend yet.

it's the trend is the other direction games keep getting bigger more budget longer development a game like for example that or a couple of games that would have been considered in the wheelhouse of a bit smaller

were like the Pillars of Eternity series from Obsidian, and Obsidian was still one of those. It's like, hey, we can build a game in two or three years, you know? Kingdom Come Deliverance from War Horse Studios was considered probably more like a double-A game, and it was really, really great for what it was. But now the sequels to those about continuing the Pillars of Eternity Universe and Kingdom Come Deliverance 2, those are both five, six year, now basically AAA. Yeah.

productions and it's just like it seems like if a game has any success it goes that direction yeah and i i kind of wish like maybe about is going to be great and whatever. And I granted, I have not played pillars, even though it's, it's been on my, my list to play. I like, I don't know. I kind of wish that they would stay small. For sure.

I don't know. I feel like I shouldn't have an opinion because I haven't played the games and I haven't really looked into about other than going, oh, that could be interesting.

um they'll probably get it on sale like 10 years from now when i remember that other games i mean it's it's nice right it's nice the idea that those smaller games can exist because they can really be diamonds in the rough or or not even diamonds in the rough just like something that has high production quality but it's just a short experience and

I used to think that that was like a ripoff, like, oh, the game's got to be longer because I paid for it. Now I feel like, oh, thank God I can beat this 20 hours. Right? Like, I don't know. Like, maybe just because I'm older and I have a lot of my life, but like. I genuinely fear, um, Boulder's Gate.

I want to play boulders gate there's a lot of stuff there but the problem is there's a lot of stuff there and I'm so intimidated by it and I'm sitting there like okay like I could devote my life to boulders gate and like really get into it and do whatever but then I won't do anything else

there's a lot of other things i want to get to and so i i feel like a smaller game i'm just going to appreciate more because i can actually get into it it like it it could be it could be solid i spend like a good 20 30 hours in it and go great on to the next thing and and i don't feel like married to it like i feel like if i get into boulder's gate that's like all i'm gonna do for like a good year like i i recently just finished um final fantasy 14 i say recently it was last year

um and i haven't even done dawn trail i just finished like the first arc of like you know the arr to end walker um and like that took me i i actually looked at the other day because i had some free days i was subscribed Just subscribe. So that means not even the ARR part, which is like the first arc of the game for 390 days. That's how long it took me to play that stupid game. And I haven't even done the newest one yet.

And I feel like the same thing would be with Baldur's Gate. And me with Veilguard, I have so much to do in that game that I haven't even been able to get to. And I just have too much on my plate. So yeah, I want smaller games that me as a busy person... that could just like chew up in like a good week and I'm done and I would be thrilled but alas EA must make big industry shattering games and whack off to

how great they are yeah pretty much it's it's pretty much like it's so interesting how like we have a conception for that was a great movie but it was a little too long yeah oh god yeah Like that exists, but for some reason in gaming, it's like, no, bigger, bigger.

bigger we fucking want it to explode over it like it's a 200 hour rpg is going to be next you know yeah do you do you genuinely think i i think i genuinely think that in in the next couple years there's going to be like this I'm going to call it a triple a crash when these games start getting too big, too expensive and like too fancy, if you will, like the graphics are too big to really keep up with one people's computer expectations are not expectations, but like.

rigs if you will like some some of the graphic settings like the older ones are like crazy for some of these um and like time commitments like the the things are kind of rough right now We're all working to survive. We don't have a lot of time, you know? So like people aren't buying, I don't know, maybe I don't, I don't have the sales data, whatever, but I feel like things.

people are kind of struggling right now. And like, we love playing video games and we don't have a lot of time on our hands. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, for sure. I think that that's going to happen. I also think that one of the things that's going to...

cause that to happen isn't necessarily the the reception of the games or it is obviously related to the sales of the games but uh the overhead i just you know from what i understand about video game development which is granted not much like a lot of developer-centric techs, or not even just developer and tech, a lot of businesses have scaled out a lot of things so that you can allow...

four people to specialize on these four individual aspects of this process that 10 years ago were actually just done by one person. And that's... in a sense, fine for job creation and growth. And maybe those four things are now individually being done at a much thorough and high level. But I am starting to get suspicious of that.

And I think that there's going to be executives and people who are sort of combing through expense reports and sort of like overhead and budgets that are going, you know. At the very least, we did need to turn one position to four. It only needed to be two or we might have just been able to keep it at one. And I think that when that starts to happen, people are going to realize like some of these games just need to get smaller because the development teams.

That we need to have these huge games. Like we just can't keep doing that. It just doesn't make sense financially. Yeah. Yeah. So I, I, I fear yes for people's jobs, but I, I think. Well, we've already seen like. Like God, the layoffs have been in nuts. Absolutely mental. It's like everywhere I work, someone, I feel like it has maybe died down for the holidays, but I feel like it's only going to grow because last year was.

well what there was more layoffs last year than in like the last five years or something like that It sucks, but it is also like one of those things where a lot of places I think were expanding more than they should have been. And I think they should have been a lot smarter and more prudent.

and so now that's what happens like you hire too many damn people and now it's going to have to be a resizing of things yeah and it's not just the the um the games industry like my husband michael works in the tech industry and he got laid off earlier this year we have a new job now but like yeah it was there was a moment they were like oh cool

Yeah, it's everywhere. I mean, it's happened at the company that I'm at to a certain extent of like expanding, expanding, expanding. Oh, yeah, we just quietly let go of this many hundreds of people. It's like, then why were we expanding so much? Yeah. Six, nine months ago. It's like, you know, but. This is a story that's everywhere. I feel like that story is repeating over and over again. It's just exhausting. Yeah, it is. All right, so Dragon Age. Dragon Age, yeah, the woes of the world.

We can't fix any of those things, kids, but we can try and distract you by talking about Dragon Age crap. Can we? We just failed. We can make an attempt. Oh, God. Well, yeah, we originally set out to do your idea of talking about Origins specifically versus Veilguard. Yeah, pretty much. Like, what happened was I wanted to play the old games again, and so I've played Origins.

I'm taking a little break to play KCD, Kingdom Come Deliverance, before probably going on to... Oh, the second one comes out? Yeah, the second one comes out, and then I want to continue playing the Dragon Age franchise again. But as I was playing Origins, I don't think this is going to...

prize anyone because i think people who are very familiar with the series already have been saying this very loudly on social media in response to some of the in response to some of the criticism that the veil guard has received but like I believe Origins is a great game, but it is a game from 2009. And things were a lot different back then, and we have completely sort of like...

We've deified Origins to the point where it's like, if you actually go back and play that thing, yes, I think it holds up incredibly well. And I played it unmodded, which I know you said was crazy. Yes. But I think it holds up incredibly well. I just also like talking about the parts of it that I don't think have aged well. Can I, I have been saying this. I, I know, I think even said it last episode, but like I.

For years now, I have been saying I don't understand why people describe Dragon Age Origins as dark fantasy. And I... I've never got that. I never will. Like maybe there's elements of that. Like you could say like, you know, maybe like the dark ritual.

or or some of the deep roads aspects or dark fantasy but when i when i think of dark fantasy i think of like dark souls and bloodborne and like there's this like seriousness to it you know there's this like otherworldly horrific sense to it and like origins maybe like flirts with it a bit but never really gets close to that yeah in my opinion because there's always something kind of light-hearted like going on next like the the dark ritual

Like, the ending can get kind of serious, but, like, even, like, okay, so you're playing the game. Morgan's up to you, says, have my baby. You go, sure, great, that's cool. Then you get, like, the little ending cutscene, and then you get a cutscene. um going into like marching off into the whatever you face the dark spawn you battle and then you say goodbye to your companions and half the companions of what they say are jokes

You know what I mean? That's probably like an hour of gameplay. Not even that. It's probably like 30 minutes being generous between a dark fantasy element and someone correcting a joke. I don't think that happens in Bloodborne. Maybe I'm wrong. Yeah, it does it. Yeah, you're exactly right. Or demon souls or anything like that.

And also, like, five minutes before the dark ritual, you could, in theory, try and get your dog to fight Loghain in a fight and a duel for the fate of the kingdom. Exactly! And Dragon Age has always been a little bit jokey and a little bit, like, um... lighthearted in a sense um i i i will say like from behind the scenes sometimes they'll say dragon age is campy and i like disagree with that

That's a whole other matter. But anyway. Dragon Age has always had a little bit of lightheartedness to it. And I think Dragon Age Origins wanted to be a dark fantasy. But it also came out at a time when... What was his fucking name? It's everyone wanted to Whedon. Everyone wanted to write like Whedon. Everyone wanted to be Whedon. So it was Whedon does dark fantasy, which if you know anything about Josh Whedon.

That's like impossible for him in his writing style. Yeah. And I feel like in a weird way, Veilguard has that same issue, but with whatever Marvel is. And it does suffer from a little bit of that Marvelification. Yeah, the Marvelization, as people like to say. I think that that's 100% true in The Veil Guard. In Origins, I agree with you that I...

It's hard to think of it as dark fantasy. It's neither gothic, which I think is the element you were describing earlier about things feeling really visually dark, spooky. ethereal haunted it's neither gothic and it's not that grounded which to me i think that can also be a form of dark fantasy which is like low magic you're in what is

a setting that is very influenced by medieval. And that's just like, if you take that without any sheen on it, it's very sort of muddy, grimy, people are sick, poor, and that lends an element of dark. I think Dragon Age Origins has some of that. It's definitely the most grounded of the series.

But it's not that grounded. There's still magic crap popping up pretty much all the time. And there's still a lot of tropes and elements of what I would consider to be high fantasy, which is not a bad thing. But yeah, I don't agree that it's really that dark fantasy, to be honest.

no yeah like it's the parts of it that are dark are like and this is what's really odd about it and it's uneven and i don't think it's aged that well is that it it veers rather suddenly into very potentially upsetting subject matter at times. It does. Yeah. And then it's like at that time that was considered.

grounds to say oh it's dark and gritty and realistic and now i don't think people feel that way about it it just feels jarring for it to suddenly veer into some of those troubling areas of subject matter yeah And I feel like there's a lot of nostalgia going into this.

like there of like people say like oh origins is this perfect baby of dark fantasy and whatever i'm like it is and and i think there's also like people will say like okay people say dragon age origins is the ultimate dark fantasy dragon age whatever um it's so wonderful and then hardcore dragon age fans like when was the last time you even played

dragon age origins and those people say oh i played it last month and and i think like even when you play these games like sometimes you have in your head like when you played it in like 2010 or whatever when you first played it and so like you're thinking about it in that time frame you know what i mean and so like you you think about i don't know what what it meant back then and i i i don't know i i just feel like a lot of the the drama of

veil guard isn't origins is just a lot of people that wish it was 2009 again it's just not and and i think another thing is people were really upset about some of the let's say political aspects of Elgard when Origins did the same thing. Yeah. But with 2009 politics. Right. I mean, we talked about this, right? It's like you go all the way back to Juhani and KOTOR. Like this is what Bioware has been. Or even Baldur's Gate 1, Baldur's Gate 2. Like this is what they have been doing the entire time.

And if someone doesn't like it the entire time, whatever, that's your prerogative. You can not like it, but don't say it just happened. Like it has been happening for 20 years, man. Yeah. It just went over your head because you were a small child in 2009. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's part of it.

So I will say this, though, like talking about some of the tone of Dragon Age Origins that I think holds up really well. I do think it is the most grounded of the series. I do think that especially in the way that it deals with religion, the chantry. elements of like court intrigue and the politics of Ferelden. I still think that it does some of those things the best or very well.

But the absolute best stuff is still the personal stuff. Like, it's absolutely still just talking to the companions. Oh, yeah. I'm...

blown away by how ahead of its time like the writing was for morgan and alistair which obviously everyone knows because those are like the standouts these are the these are the ones that get ranked as like the best companions ever in a bioware game but like Morrigan's writing in Origins is still loads above anything else that she's appeared in. And granted, she's never been like the focus since then. She's never been a companion. So there was never like the space and the time to explore.

who she is in the other games but she's so three-dimensional and well-rounded in origins in a way that i feel like by the time you get to inquisition and the veil guard she's a legendary figure. And so she has to be written in this very sort of like, not all powerful, but like she's up on a pedestal now. Whereas Morgan in Origins, like could be awkward.

Could be unsure of herself at times. Smile and laugh more than the sort of like serious demeanor or stereotype of Morgan that I think maybe some people have in their head. She was so well-rounded. And like remarkably well written in a way that you don't see characters written hardly ever. I mean, with all due respect to some of the stuff that's in.

Baldur's Gate or any of like the modern RPGs, like the writing for Morrigan in 2009 was freaking ahead of its time. Now, I do want to say I do love Morrigan's very specifically her arc with Kieran in Inquisition. That I love. Because you see how raw emotional she is about her son and, like, her relationship with Flemeth, her mother. And, like, I just adore that. And that's my personal favorite Morrigan writing bit. But, yeah, I understand.

There's a difference between one level and an entire character arc that you see in Origins. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't disagree with that. I mean, the stuff with Kieran in particular, that's just an aspect of her that didn't exist in Origins, so you're right. It's so much more well explored in Inquisition. I'm thinking of some of the combinations, right? Like if Alistair is the father, like there's some really interesting exchanges that can be had there.

So yeah, I agree with that. I like her in The Veil Guard well enough, but she does sort of seem like a superhero figure in some sense. Well, and that's something I wish they got more into because she talks... With the knowledge of what Mythal has.

And I particularly loved her conversation when you do the soulless memories and she's like the, the end of it. And she's like kind of, kind of giving you a like, Hey, here's, here's what's been going on behind the scenes. And like her, she's like, yeah, you know, I struggled, you know, taking on.

aspect of mythol because like that was the whole bit in origins that she didn't want to do and now she she has done it willingly and um i i kind of wish we got a little bit more into that because like there there is i feel like this new sense of like I'm gonna say motherhood in her where like she she sees Thedas as like her own something that she needs to protect however unlike Flemeth that had like this vow of like vengeance and like anger kind of towards like her children if you will like

morgan is much more kind and generous and i and i not generous but um what's the word i'm looking for uh loving i suppose to to the people of thetis and so i feel like you see Morrigan kind of become what Flemeth is and take on the host of Mythal, but almost like purify it. Where Flemeth would hit her daughter that you see in Dragon Age Origins if...

Morgan says to Flemeth like I will not be the mother you were to me like I whatever whatever baggage you and Mathal have going on that that is that is gone I am ending the cycle and I think that's a beautiful story but like I just wish they spent more time on that because I think that really in a moving moment rather than just like kind of implied just like outright said yeah that's really eye-opening I don't think I had thought about that as a completion of sort of like her motherhood journey

I guess in some sense, because it's not directly referenced in the veil guard, right? Because it's not a decision that carries over, but that's true. It is heavily implied in the subtext of her material in the way that you just described. And so that's interesting. I'd never thought of it that way.

and and i think like even if you don't if you have a world state where you don't have kieran i think i think she just like skips like her being a mother it like in like she her like Her feelings of like having a child and like raising Kieran and like being informed with that. And then now that she has.

essentially the dalish i think she's kind of adopted the veil jumper so at least that's what i feel like she she sees them as her children now and like she sees them as like okay like this is my people and like rather than being all like her whole childhood she's on her own and alone and like kind of away and like almost like hateful a little bit to these other people like she thinks she's so haughty now she's like

really talking with them being one with them and like helping them and but you never saw Flemeth really do that Flemeth would just kind of like pop in and be like sup bitches I'm gonna say something cryptic bye and like kind of i'm being facetious but but um i i think like that so in in inquisition you see flemouth

And I think this happens no matter what. I don't know if it's for a specific dialogue, but she has this thing of like, it is a really great voice acting moment where she says, I will see Mythal avenged. um and and you don't really see that in veil guard and like i i do wish maybe that was closed up a little bit more but like in my mind that kind of makes sense that like yeah morgan flemoth who was betrayed took on mythal and like focuses on mythal's vengeance and then

Morgan picks up that soul and goes, no, we got to let go of this. We got to move on for our children's sake. We're not doing this bullshit anymore. I wish it was kind of more said explicitly. But like I, that's how I feel like the, the Mythal arc ended. Like Mythal's vengeance ended with a generational cycle, you know, like it. i don't know that's how i view it i could go on about this later this isn't what this video is about

I was right about to say bravo. That's a very salient piece of criticism or analysis. I don't actually think I saw it that way until you just explained it, but I fully agree with it now that you did. Yay. That conversation with Morgan is clearly the longest or the best part of her.

role in the veil guard and i really enjoyed it i remember having that conversation like you said at the end of the soulless memories quest line and like asking her all the questions that i could ask and i remember feeling like oh this is what it's like to talk to morgan kind of by the campfire

It has that weird... She's very different. She's a different person now. She's gone through a lot. The world has gone through a lot. But it... evoke that same sort of feel and i thought that was really really special and and i think like that's actually a really good point because in in when you talk with morrigan and inquisitive art and origins you kind of have to work up to really talking with her like you have she has to warm up to you

yeah you know whereas when you when you approach her in in veil guard she's just much more opening and she's it's it's almost like this is gonna be a weird way to put it but almost like priestly if you will like my child welcome like you know yeah let me like she's just like immediately warm and open to you because she sees you as a child she sees you as a little one and something that she must protect

And so she's, she's much more willing to be like that mother figure towards you rather than like the, I kind of like bratty little girl that you see in origins. So like, I don't know. I, I. not to say like origins morgan is bad i just really enjoy the character she's become i agree i mean like honestly i think my my i agree with what i said about origins obviously i don't change that is what i mean but like

her arc really is something pretty special and she's a hero like she's a hero multiple times over by the time you're talking to her in the veil guard and i think while Origins Morrigan was maybe reluctant to be in that heroic role she was, and then throughout the events of more of the world of what's going on at Thedas.

she becomes more and more heroic. So it sort of makes sense that eventually she is in that priestly leadership type of role. Now, I will say, at least giving the people that prefer Origins.

not to say that's a bad thing but like um we were saying a lot of i i wish i wish morgan did that and i could wish morgan did this in veil guard so like yeah but point to origins like she does what she needs to do completely where i like i wish some things were tweaked and a lot of the morrigan bits i love and veil guard are kind of implied and not really said outright

so i at least want to like give that like yeah okay i maybe a lot of what i like about morgan and veil guard is all in my head and that's my problem

well okay so also talking about the party more broadly i i think the veil guard party is very good like i think it's i think it's surprisingly solid um it does not have that many weaknesses in it but the origins party is Freaking stacked. I... I think Liliana Alistair Morgan is like, even if it was just that, I think there's an argument to be made, but I think you put in... Stan Shale, you know, the rest win.

Even fucking Zevrin was more agreeable to me this time. I forgot you hated Zevrin. This time, you know, first of all, I don't know how many playthroughs in a row. I just stabbed his ass as soon as he showed up. So it had been a while since I had even listened to this.

stupid Antivan assassin who's hitting on everyone. I, Zevran is so funny because Zevran, as he's played, like if you don't romance Zevran, he's kind of annoying. But if you romance him, like there is something really honorable there. And like. You're not fucking Zevrin. You don't get Zevrin. That's my opinion. No, well, I mean, I didn't romance him. I just thought it's like, you know, he's he. Yes, he's an Antivan crow. That wasn't necessarily his choice.

I can't see anything new or that interesting about him just for some reason, like just giving him a chance, I guess. I found him less offensive this time over than previous playthroughs. Because I know there's people in the comments that have always raked you over the coals for hating Severin so much. And the fact that you said...

I listened to Zevern this time and I didn't hate him as much. I know they're going to pull out their hair. Maybe I'm just mellowing in my old age. Maybe that's what it is. Maybe that's it. Maybe that's it. I... I...

I don't hate Ogryn. I just don't enjoy him at all. He's just kind of there. I think he gets better in Awakening when he actually has some sort of character arc of being a deadbeat dad that I find interesting. But like... yeah i i i'll be honest i nothing sten i don't care but there there was some concept art in the art book where sin gets it's uh killed by gillanane and i'm like yeah okay let's do it dude

I don't think Sten really does much in the story. He's just kind of like stoic man with vaguely attractive voice. He's just kind of there in my opinion. I like Zevrin. He's fine. But again, like I think he only shines if you romance him. Liliana, Morgan, Alistair are solid. Logan's great if you actually recruit him. Yeah, Logan is great. He really is. I don't like dog.

I'll say it. Break me over the coals. Dog is a cute idea, and it's fun, but people love dog too much. I also think I've grown bitter. I'm not a big fan of the pet characters. I'm not a song is there for me. I don't really care much for a song, you know, in veil guard. Okay. That's, that's me. I'm trying to like, what are the other communities? Shale's great. I love Shale wins. Great. I love when. Yeah. Who am I missing? Is that everybody?

I feel like you covered everyone. Yeah. I so much agree about Loghain. I think I've said this before. My appreciation for Loghain is a sort of tragic figure. And yeah.

recruiting him and this most recent playthrough and just like really spending what time you have with him talking to him and trying to come to some some sort of understanding or agreement especially given the fact that you can do that without making any without condoning anything that he's done and he doesn't he doesn't put up that sort of fight like he doesn't necessarily attempt to just he doesn't he doesn't I think he knows that he's done some gnarly shit and he doesn't necessarily make

excuses although he does justify in some sense um i just i don't know i like him as a character i think he's he is in that um roster of party members for origins and sometimes people forget that he's also a party member

And I feel like the Veilguard characters are interesting. Because I feel like I like them more. But... I feel like they have less time to talk. And so we don't get to know them as much. And I feel like that's kind of what their problem is.

that we don't have we can't really there's not really that moment where we ask them like 600 questions at the party camp like there's not really that time that we can really spend with them and i think that's where where we suffer with with the veil guard party that we just needed more time um that just

like i like i said last time like i think all the companion quests needed like one more story bit yeah um and like i think some characters came off um a little bit better like more quickly like i think emrick it probably is the most unscathed as far as like content Like he probably, he's probably fine as is and he's, he's good to go. But like, I think the others, like they, especially Harding, I think Harding needed one more story mission for me to feel like a resolution from her story.

um because i love what's there i think it's a wonderful story and like they if you really listen okay here maybe here's here's the problem with veil guard sometimes you really need to hear all the party mentor and really listen to what they're saying to kind of get

what the story is sometimes and i feel like with harding harding's story is an inquisition she really wanted to be a go-getter she wanted to like get out there and see the world and like pull her weight and like be happy and go lucky and whatever and veil garden is trying to explore that like what happens to someone who has to go through some terrible horrible shit but she bottles it up inside to be happy and go lucky and like what's it like to always try to be nice

and like yeah that's kind of what her story is about like she gets possessed with the the she becomes one with the titan and inherits all this anger that is well deserved and like she like do but that's not who she is she doesn't want to be that anger

And it's like you helping her decide, like, do you want to continue being this happy-go-lucky girl or accept that you can be angry and feel this depth of emotion? And, like, I think that's a really cool story. I think it's needed a little bit more time to cook, you know?

um and and and not not more like it needed more like space to breathe and like really like explore that and and i think like most of the characters have that problem um so it's i it's not that i think they're worse written i just think that they needed more missions and i and and i will say like origins they don't really have a lot of missions but you can go to camp and like

the the dialogue trees at camp are huge i remember when i was streaming origins i would have whole like two hour episodes where i'm just talking to people at camp you know what i mean so and you you do not have that That's so interesting. I think this might actually be like a critical distinction. And I have no idea if I'm right. I'm probably wrong. If someone had asked me, I would have said that the Veilguard characters have more time.

are more dialogue but you bring up a really interesting point about like you don't have those long dialogue trees like you don't have the option to sit there and ask any of them six questions in a row the way that you do with the origins characters For some reason, I would have felt off the top of my head like the Veilguard characters had more time to get to know them. But now that you're saying it, I don't know if that's really true, is it? Well, it's it's it's weird because in my opinion, you.

just from the data of you look at how much they talk they talk a lot and they say a lot of stuff but it's usually about the story or or about like what's going on and like a mission that they're doing or whatever but you really don't get that much talking about themselves it does happen but like there's a lot more questions I have about some of the backstories or like their emotional

emotional states even like you know like there's there's kind of this um you i don't know i i feel like you could probably talk to um Well, let's talk about Zevran real quick, because Zevran probably has one of the shorter missions of Origins compared to Morgan or Liliana or Alistair. And... you can sit there and like talk about his backstory like you know about his family how he grew up how he got into the the um the crows and all of that and you don't know that about lucanus really

You know more about Lucanus from Tevinter Knights than you do from Vailguard. I mean, Lucanus is really, I think, one of, if not the one that feels incomplete.

yeah yeah well i think it's also like mary kirby was laid off so i'm wondering like how much they wanted to add on you know there's there's there's that element too but let's take someone like like like harding or whatever like you you can talk to harding about how she's doing like probably more so than the others but like right you you really you really you don't spend as much time as you would as say like Liliana in camp you know and I feel like that's

when you, when you put in a romance and you do the romance scenes, I'm currently doing a romance with Harding right now. I'm not finished yet. So like there's that, but I feel like I have a better idea of what's going on in Harding's head now that I have those romance scenes that add more dialogue with her than I, than I had previously.

So I'm kind of wondering if it's going to be kind of like the Zebran problem where like I maybe I have a really good view of Emmerich and like what his emotional state is, because in the first time. I played Veilguard, I romanced him. So I got that information. And I'm wondering if other people have that for other characters. Maybe I'm wrong. That's just my hypothesis of someone who has not played it like 10 times.

That's interesting. I mean, my first playthrough was a Harding romance and I felt very happy with what Harding's content was, but I didn't... associate it to it being like dependent on the romance but maybe it is right like and now that that was my first playthrough i'm kind of always going to have that added context in my head so it's kind of hard to tell but i mean that's interesting

so that's just my hypothesis again like like you you had mentioned earlier like we we played the game once or twice by the time we recorded a review of it but like i think really to get a good knowledge of it we're going to need like 10 playthroughs and it's going to be a couple years and really digest about it you know stuff like that so i i what what i think

is the worst part about veil guard is that there's a lot of good stuff there but it's not given the space or the time to breathe and because i don't think it had that budget because things are so expensive to make now and maybe it should have been a smaller game and blah blah blah blah um and like there's a lot of really good ideas there and i feel like a lot of people that complain about certain things throughout the game like i think i i think they say like oh well it was bad writing like

I mean, maybe the writing didn't adjust for the size of the game. And so it comes off like jilted and awkward and like blah, blah, blah. But I think those ideas work. in a setting where like it's just on paper and they write it down and it's fine but like then they gotta rewrite it but then they gotta get shorter and they gotta whatever and they can't like change the pace and whatever or because I know this happened for a fact um

I think Epler even tweeted about it or blue sky about whatever you want to say. He, he wrote Bellara and, um, he, he was saying like, yeah, this is his first time really writing. And so he wrote a version of Bellara. And then basically rewrote it. And some of the lines. Some lines were already recorded. And he couldn't rewrite those lines. So some of the more awkward Bellara lines.

he wishes he could redo they just didn't have the time or budget to do that right and that's that's just how it is and and i feel like sometimes yeah like maybe a different direction happened like because the the direction of veil guard change i can say that with i saw it with my own eyes that they were given a prompt to write veil guard one direction

and then it went another direction so i think i think some of the more awkward dialogue choices that i hear people like complaining about is a result of that earlier direction um so it's it's veil guard is So much like Dragon Age 2 in that aspect where like there was some development hell that it is what it is and it should have been...

It should have been longer. It should have been a lot of things, but I love what's there. And that's the problem. There's some really good ideas there, but you really got to like look closely with the magnifying glass and wish it got more time to cook.

yeah and that's why i always be sad about no dlc because i then when if they could have done dlc then they would have really known the characters how much time they had how much time they you know i i feel like it's kind of like trespasser like if people did not like inquisition until trespasser came out let's be real let's call it what it is if inquisition came out as just inquisition without the dlc like it would not be as beloved as people remember it

And it's a legacy of Bioware to have a great story DLC. I mean, Mass Effect 3 could be said the same thing, that until the Citadel DLC came out, it didn't move into being truly beloved. They released the free DLC to kind of fix the ending. It didn't fully fix it, but it didn't feel like all was forgiven until the Citadel DLC came out. Yeah.

And I kind of wish that Andromeda got that, because Andromeda is the same thing as Veilgar. It did not get a DLC. And I feel like if you did give it the rumored Corian Arc DLC, that could have been really cool. That could have done a lot. That could have added stuff. But alas. Yeah. And too, also, like, you know, Bioware always talks about, and everyone talks about Bioware as far as the companions and the party members are, that kind of feels like the heart and soul of Bioware games.

Both, I think, Trespasser in its own way and especially Citadel DLC from Mass Effect 3 were like love letters to the companions. Yes, they were. It's like a celebration of who those characters were. And I think that's what makes people feel the most good about about a Bioware game once it's over. And yeah, it's kind of sad that we don't get that. And I feel like maybe to like cap this off a little bit.

to like bring in what we're talking about in in discussing origins versus veil guard i feel like people focus on the wrong things it's not that oh origins is better because dark fantasy or oh origins is better because this was written better it's i i think that origins has maybe a more nostalgia factor because it's older and i think when veil guard gets older it's going to have more nostalgia next to it and hold up but i think more importantly is that like yeah

the companions don't have time to really like play around if that makes sense like they don't have time to cook they don't have time to talk they don't have time to whatever um and and they needed that like dlc to really explore themselves a little bit

just just a tad bit more and that's that's that's the tragedy if it maybe just needed like one more mission and things would have been like super solid or or that like dialogue tree where you just sat there and like you look at harding and go i have um unlocked your level five approval And now I get to hear your sad story. Go. And as much as we all make fun of that, we all love it. We're nosy little bitches and we love hearing that.

If I could also just throw in this thought about it, something that occurred to me, and maybe many people will disagree with this. Maybe Bioware isn't interested in writing the characters like this. If you look at, let's say, Baldur's Gate 1 characters, which... Didn't really say anything. Like the style of character that is the Bioware party member actually started in Baldur's Gate 2. Baldur's Gate 1 characters were sort of just like henchmen.

And kind of when they're introduced, they had some backstory, but it was nothing like the way the characters are from Baldur's Gate 2 onward. And even between Baldur's Gate 2 and... Dragon Age 2, maybe Dragon Age Inquisition. They are sort of, how do I put this? They said that with the Vale Guard, they really wanted to make them all integral to the main plot, right? To the main story. Like you can't take them out of what's going on.

I know that sounds good. Even I said that that sounds very good. But after replaying Origins, I think there is something special about just saying, these are people to help you in combat. And whatever else you want to learn about them is off to the side. Because when you make the choice to sit there and go, you know, I kind of like this character. Like, let me ask him five more questions in that sort of camp setting.

It feels more like your choice. They are not actually being put in front of you as a part of the main story where you have to become friends with them or learn their backstory. You're on a mission. They're there to help you and do their part. Sure. But if you want to make friends with them, that is entirely your choice. You can completely ignore them for the most part. And so when you do end up catching a liking for one of them.

It feels more like you're choosing that than the game saying, hey, here are your six or seven or eight best friends that are making best friends with them as a part of what the story is. I don't know. Maybe people like that or they don't, but, you know.

I guess my, okay, so they absolutely did say that, and I think that was an intent, but I think something maybe changed later on, because when I was playing... not the alpha but the i played twice there was an alpha and then there was like a not quite released about a year out from release version i played and for that one to to progress the story i needed to play some of the companion missions

where um i've played so far right now i have two playthroughs of veil guard under my belt one is like a more completionist this is my first time playing this is what i want to do and second was i wanted to basically speed run to the end So I only did main story quest and I didn't need, I need to, sorry, coughing break. I didn't need to play those companion quests. They were optional now and you don't have to talk to anybody.

you don't let that's not true there you do have to talk to some people you have to check in a couple times but you can completely bypass everybody's quest now like you don't have to do them now your ending is going to be horrific and things aren't going to go very well and i i think some people maybe it's not that you have to do them it's just that's all there is to do

If you don't want to think of most of the side quests are all companion missions. There's not like a side quest that... You have some little ones in the area, but there's not like a big... side quests that doesn't have to do with the companions they're all companion related you know where where i feel like the other games you you did have like especially in i feel like dragon age 2 definitely origins but dragon age 2 had a lot of them were like oh yeah here's a side quest about the coterie

it's just the coterie side quest happy birthday you know and then inquisition had its whole ordeal with side quests that we're not even going to talk about but um you know and there's there's a lot of that where where in in this game like all the major like here's some cut scenes or whatever it's all based on the companions so i i feel like you do get the choice to get close to them but because there's not

most of the content revolves around them. If you feel like you're forced to be friends with them, I guess that's my critique. Yeah, that might be a better way of putting it. There's something about the form factor, isn't it? When you talk about the dialogue tree versus the wheel and that camp setting.

and origins i don't know there's something about it that i can't quite pinpoint or describe correctly maybe it is more time and space but there's something that's advantageous about that i don't know if they'll ever go back to that or if they should but it feels that way i am the most okay maybe i'm a contrarian maybe i'm whatever i'm the only person in the world apparently that likes the dialogue wheel

i don't know it's shiny and it makes me happy and i just maybe i'm just so comfortable with it because i played i've played around with it for so long yeah um but like i i think like um inquisition okay inquisition the dialogue wheel every character had its own way of how the dialogue wheel worked like i feel like whatever writer like would organize it in a way

And so like some things made sense and like, and you go to another character and then their dialogue wheel worked in a completely different way. And if they were just able to like streamline it where everyone works the same way, I think it would have been fine. But the problem is, is like you have some people like. It's been a year since I played Inquisition. So I'm forgetting who's who now. But I think Dorian, you can ask everything once. And if you want to ask it again, fuck you.

Meanwhile, you go over to, I think it's Cassandra. Oh, I forget. But yeah, you can keep asking again and again, the same questions and the same dialogues. Oh, interesting. And then if you have higher enough approval, new dialogue will happen. So you have to kind of keep asking it sometimes, particularly about her brother. Um, and, and so, um, you know, and, and whereas, uh, or, uh, not origins, but veil guard, like you.

you don't really have that. You don't have the chance to come up to you and be like, talk to me. Now, granted, you can go up next to them and sometimes like dialogue will just trigger, but it's not the same, you know? Yeah, it's interesting. I love the dialogue wheel, but I love it because of Mass Effect.

yeah and it's a weird it's it's a weird like this makes no sense but for some reason i'm stuck in time a little bit of 2009 where i'm like no mass effect is the dialogue wheel dragon age is dialogue tree It doesn't make, and you know what? This will blow people's mind if they think that, you know, this could never happen. Eventually, Star Wars The Old Republic had both. They did. Yep.

Star Wars The Old Republic was built around the dialogue wheel from the start. It was meant to have the dialogue wheel, but then... In the later expansions, there are minor characters and minor quests where it has a dialogue tree that looks reminiscent of like KOTOR's. With like, I believe like blue text in the black background on the bottom. is that like brand new well not anymore well i mean several years ago they did this now well because i i remember um bioware like has the

the dialogue will copyright it. And now Kotar is a whole new company. Is that because the company changed hands? No, this is before then. Oh, okay. Nevermind. This was in the Knights of Eternal Empire. if i'm remembering in that and that's either in that expansion or the sequel to that expansion i'm probably getting the names mixed up but somewhere around that time frame and it was all and it's also unvoiced dialogue from the protagonist so it feels very like kotor

And it was only for the minor quests. And so I'm not saying that that will ever come back in a mainstay single-player RPG, but I kind of didn't mind it for some reason in Star Wars The Old Republic. But anyhow.

We've been going for over an hour. Is there anything else that we feel like saying right now? This is a very scattershot episode. I feel like we went to a lot of places. I feel like we did a scattershot episode here. It's already now. Yeah, well, I guess... Yeah, I feel like... I feel like we keep trying to apologize for Veilgard a little bit. Maybe I do. I don't know. Despite loving it. I don't know. I think it's like...

I think I see a lot of negative people and I just want to say like, I'm sorry you're having a bad time and I'm not. And I feel weird about that. I don't know. I know what you mean. There was a lot of concerted effort. to make the game seem worse than what it really was it really didn't have to do with the game it has to do with this weird weird cultural whatever that's happening in gaming that i don't feel like dissecting at this point in time people know what it is

um you're very nice about it i see those people and i feel like telling them to go fuck off well because i because i've talked to people that like that's not the reason it's something else like oh yeah i didn't like how solace's story wrapped up without him having um talked about like his his uh why can't i think of the word i'm i have cough syrup medication i'm like i can't think of a goddamn thing no like his um devotion to his people it really was boiled down just with all where i think like

how i see it is that like yeah they didn't touch on it and they should have they absolutely should have but i i also think that the story that it is was the story behind the scenes and so they just kind of cut out the middleman for time So I'm not as upset with it as I probably maybe should be, but I totally get why people are disappointed in that. You know, like there, I think there are people that generally aren't some of the weirdo.

you know like how dare this game have pronouns in this but like it's more just like yeah no they have some serious issues with like certain aspects of it and I get why they have that I just politely disagree or don't see it or it doesn't bother me yeah like the crows like yeah the crows were retconned a hundred percent that doesn't bother me as much though

i i don't know what to say yeah yeah i don't know i guess like my final thought is like there are there are walking away from this most recent playthrough of origins there are things that i wish would come back tonally right like i'd like to see games that are maybe a little more grounded i think it was awesome how much stuff there was about titans and elven gods

and all of these different things in The Veil Guard. I thought that for what this story was, I liked it, but there's a part of me that wouldn't mind seeing something at the level of a Kirkwall again. Or, you know, or drag it, you know, a story that's in Pharrell doesn't actually have to be Pharrell, then it could be whatever other country and just say, hey, it's actually about this one country's struggle for whatever. I don't know if you can put the.

genie back in the bottle with some of the stuff around the chantry and the maker. But, um, I liked, I liked what they wrote in the beginning of, um, world update is volume one, where it's like we were depicting a religion that still required actual faith.

in that world i think that's a very interesting concept i'd like for them to somehow get back to exploring that um because i think it's rarely seen in fantasy um things like that i'd like to see come back at some point in dragon age whenever whenever in the future that may be I, I'm still of the opinion that they didn't kill the maker. The maker is just slightly different than we think, but that's makers are Titans. But anyway, that's my crackpot theory.

But, but anyway, that's, that's, that's for another day. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I feel like. I don't know. I'm, I'm really curious on the opinion of veil guard is going to be in like five years. That's where I'm, I really am curious. And I can't wait. Because this was, I can't believe I saw it with my own eyes in Inquisition, where Inquisition was like this hated, terrible thing. And then Bale Guard.

If Elgar comes out and everyone's like, oh, actually, that was the best game and it won game of the year for a reason. I'm like, where were you, peep? What the fuck? What the hell? This giant bouquet of flowers that Inquisition never got. This finally rolled out.

and everybody started clapping. Yeah, so I'm going to predict it now. If we ever get a Dragon Age 5, it's going to disappoint someone for some reason and everyone's going to be loving Veilguard and I'm just going to sit there with my heads in my hand going, oh my God, I'm going to scream.

i'm gonna scream like i honestly think whether or not to bash a game or think that it was underrated from the past is like what's that one it's a dr seuss story right star belly snitches or something like that yeah put it on take it off like we're dunking on this thing hey everybody it's cool to dunk on this thing okay okay let's all dunk on it

Fast forward five years. Hey, everybody, it's cool to say that. Remember that thing that everybody dunked on? It actually wasn't that bad. It was underrated. Oh, yeah. Okay, that's cool now. We all say that now. Yeah. It just feels arbitrary. Yeah. Yeah. No, that's absolutely true. But it's cool. We're here. If anyone is interested, we're still doing our little podcast. We're plugging right along and trying to help people to calm the fuck down. Yeah. Now I say that, where can they find you?

Living in Texas, having a dope life. Being cold as hell right now. Yes, but that's it. Pretty much nowhere else on the internet. Katie, where can the folks find you? Uh, thank you. Find me on my YouTube channel, Gilder Thalen. I haven't made a video in a while because, um, I am making a very large video. My next one's going to be an hour long. It's going to be a minute before it comes out. This, this video is a hundred percent coming out with what that video does.

But it's hopefully before February is my goal because I want to get at the end of this month on the prison of regrets. Fun. The official title in my mind that will not fit in a YouTube title is A Therapeutic Approach to the Regret Prison. But no one's going to click on that if that's a YouTube video.

so now i have to think of something else to call it but anyway um and then you can find me on uh blues i've kind of quit twitter for the most part and now i'm blue sky because people are more fun there and there's no algorithm so i i just get the posts from people I actually follow, which is nice. Uh, and that's, uh, again, the end. Yeah. Oh, yeah. All right, everybody.