Crime Stories with Nancy Grace: Unlock Your Own DNA Mystery!

and welcome back to another episode of Spit. Today we've got the one and only host of crime Stories, Nancy Grace. Nancy's taking a break from true crime to get to the bottom of an entirely different investigation her twenty three and Me Test reports. You might know Nancy as one of the fiercest legal analysts around, but she's also a proud mother of twins. Well, Nancy has covered some of the most famous and infamous cases in American true crime.

She's also been known to share the fears and triumphs of motherhood with her listeners. So when Nancy and her family recently took a twenty three me test, she just had to let her listeners in on the journey, Nancy sits down with a panel of experts to get a better understanding of her family's reports and the role genetics

play in their health. And connecting all the dots, she explores the science behind the test and looks to show listeners how the information contained in twenty three and me reports can empower you on the journey to a healthier life. Let's listen. In twenty three and me, you'd have to be living under a rock in a cave in a far away distantly and not to know what three and

me is. It's ancestry testing. You find out where you're from, who you are so to speak, uh, chromosomely genetically that is, can that discovery unlock secrets the secrets of your genetic makeup that can help you lead healthier and I believe happier life. We hear stories about genetic tracing that you you find distant relatives, You find out your family tree goes all the way back to Anglo Saxon times. But how can it help me into here? And now I'm

raising two twins they just turn fifteen. Let me wash my mouth out with soap. I can't believe they're fifteen. Can I learn anything from this genetic Uh? Let me say genetic makeup, genetic identity, genetic composite that will help my twins and me and my husband David and my mother Elizabeth live a longer, healthier life. I'mancy Grace and we are talking about twenty three and me with me an all star panel to make sense of all of this.

If you're a LA person like me, I I'm just a j D. But I know nothing about genetic counseling. What does it mean? Joining me up an incredible host of yes, But I want to go first to Stacy debt Wiler. She is a license certified genetic counselor with twenty three and me, Stacy, thank you so much for being with us. Thank you here? What is in a nutshall remember? This is twenty three? And me for dummy's what is twenty three? And me? Hey, guys, by the way, I took the test, Go ahead tell me Stacy. It's

a lot right. Um. So I think you you kind of mentioned what people first thing about is ancestry. But what I really get excited about it the hall. And there is a lot of information that you can find out from a little bit of spit which we're able to get DNA from, so there's information about your own Wait, did you say a little bit of spit? Because we

have to spit and spit and spit. I mean I'm used to quiminal cases, Stacy, where you get a genetic marker and identity, and like this is mina skill amount of I don't blood saliva. Why did we have to spit so much? Yeah, that's why we fall the spit party. Um, I didn't think about it like that. I don't let to Alisa take this one a little bit, um, just because there's you know, you need to get enough DNA from that spit in order to be able to give

you all these insights. Um, who's over six five? Okay, I'll go to Alisa with me is a Lisa Lehman, Senior manager and product science at twenty three and me and you can find everybody at medical dot twenty three and me dot com and it's and spelled out twenty three and me dot com atly soa welcome to you and Stacy. Why so much spit? You know you're a pH d and a senior manager. I feel kind of wrong asking you why did I have to spit so much? But why did I have to spit so much? Oh?

Thank you for having me? And why do you have to sit so much? As the best question I think to ask, I'd love I'd love answering questions like this. Um. Like Stacy said, right, what we're trying to do is get your d NA um the easiest way possible. Right. We don't want people to have to go give us a blood sample, so spit very easy to get. But what we're doing is we're trying to get the d N A that's in almost every cell in your body,

including the cells inside your cheeks. So when you spit and spit and spit, what's coming along for the ride is some of those cheek cells um from from your mouth. And what we're trying to do is make sure that we're going to get enough of those cells so we get enough DNA to make sure that when we run and analyze that DNA extracted from the cells, when we try and figure out your a's and seas and teas and gees from your DNA, that we have enough so

you don't have to do it again. What are a's and seas and Jason T So your DNA you can think of as a code that is there to um explain how to you know what? Alsa lame and just stop right there. My son who is a star in robotics and science, and he keeps talking about coding, and I keep acting like I know what he's talking about.

What are you talking about? So when I'm talking about the genetic code, it is more like you know codes during World War Two where you are trying there's information, but it is written in a way that you know you need to be able to decode it to understand it. So your DNA is like that. Okay, now I understand. Now I understand with me to new friends Stacy Entwiler and Alsa Lehman from twenty three and me and who longtime friends Karen Start joining us were now psychologists joining

us out of Manhattan. You can find her at karen Start dot com. That's Karen with a C. And Dr Michelle dupre, my longtime colleague joining us out of South Carolina, forensic pathologist, medical examiner, author of multiple books. Dr Dupree, now, what about this a regular role? PhD just told me something you've never told me. I've never heard the phrase cheek seals have you heard the phrase cheek sales, Jackie. Yeah,

you've never mentioned that. Dupre no. I always say epithelial sales, and you crashed down on me for using such a technical term. Yeah, do so. The seals inside of your cheek are epiphilial cells, which I always equate with cells that come from your skin. Well, they come from they come from the outside of the new organ. Okay, I'm learning a lot, you know, Karen, start joining me in New York psychologists. Why are so many people afraid to

get a DNA test? I think they were prey nancy to find out things that they don't know, and the unknown can often be scary, and especially if you get health information and they wonder, well, what do I do about its information once they get it? Okay, Karen, you're so smart. You know what? You just hit the nail on the head. Because, um, when we decided to do twenty three and me, I was reading about it my daughter, this is why we did it. My daughter wants to

know her ancestry. And I said, you're Irish, and I go to bed just you know, I didn't know what else to say. That's all I knew. Um, but I knew that there was more in the mix because my mother is deeply all of skinned, with black hair and amazing blue eyes, and I come out with, you know, really really white and and hazel eyes and blonde hair, and my dad was ready complexed. And I'm wondering how does all this mix together when we're basically mutts. But

that aside, Karen, start what you said. When I started thinking about taking doing twenty three and me and the spit party, I think either Stacy or Elsa said spit party. I said, sure, I want to know all my health information. I wan't to know everything, but when I got the report, I had to tell you I did have a tiny hesitation when I clicked on UM, I clicked on health.

It's really easy to read. Everybody, you get it in your email or wherever you want it sent, and don't ruin it you for or you Jackie, because guys, Jackie is our executive producer on Crime Stories. So Lucy has always wanted her ancestry. And I'm going to print it all out and make it like a college diploma looking thing and wrap it in a ribbon. And that's going to be one of her Christmas gifts. Okay, not from Santa, but from me and so don't tell or anything we're

talking about, especially you care and start. So I was a little bit afraid when I just a tiny bit, I had a pause. So let me go back to you, Stacy Debt. While are joining US Medical Affairs Manager, what type of health information can I learn from twenty three and me? Yeah, so the Helpless Ancestry Service. There's a lot of different health replaces in there, and the big ones that we think about are the ones that why you information about your own likelihood or chances for developments

like type two diabetes UM. So this is using your own genetic information. There's also the more general wellness one, so big one that I think about is likelihoods of being lack of all learning um. But there's also reports that can provide information about there. Do you have a theory, a genetic theory that you might pass on your future children that could impact them? It helps too, So being a genetic health I always think about the family aspect.

There's a little bit for you, there's a little bit potentially for family members as well. There's a lot of different information that you can get miss um. There's even the twenty plus membership that even opens that up more already the additional UM insights. So there's a lot of different health information that you've learned about. It's not diagnostics, but it can ultimately lead you into the passes talking

to your healthcare providers. I mean a potential life change, diagnosis, UM or a lot of these healthy lifestyle is the prevention as that can really promote these actions that you can take every day to help you live a longer, happier, healthy life. Well, I gotta tell you I learned a lot. I learned that I have a higher risk of getting cilliac disease. Now, can somebody tell me what that is exact? Actually?

What is that? Dr dupree Ciliac disease. That's physically a sensitivity to gluten which is found in flour and wheats and things like that. Right, you're not telling me to cut out carbs, are you? Because I don't want to hear that. I'm not telling you. Well, I'm saying it might be a good ideas slightly higher risk. It is not high risk, slightly higher exactly. And they also propensity, It doesn't mean that it's going to happen. You had

a propensity for that also increased likelihood of type two diabetes. UM. Explain what that means, Dr Dupree. But type two diabetes UM means that you usually acquire diabetes later in life. UM. It is UM. It can be controlled by medication. It can also be controlled by nothing more than diet and exercise. UM. If it hasn't progressed too far, it may require medicines such as pills, and it may actually try into insul independence. It's usually found in older adults. UM. But again you're

saying it can be prevented. It can be with diet and exercise. It can be you can actually change your your diagnosis basically of diabetes sometimes if it hasn't progressed your part and if you're on a very healthy diet and UM exercise. You know what else is interesting? Elisa Lehman joining me senior manager product Science at twenty three. In me, everything was dead on it's My results were higher odds of hazel eyes, which I have afraid likely to be afraid of heights. I am not afraid of heights.

My father, however, hated heights, hated hyson. I will tell you after hiking a lot Alisa all Over that when I get to the top of a let's say, mountain, finally get to the top of it. I'm not afraid from the waist up, but from the waist down, my legs seem to tremble. I can always feel it, Like when we went to the top of a summit Grand Can and I look down. I was talking about how beautiful it was and trying to take pictures, but my

legs were shaking. What does that mean? I guess that would be the fear of het Maybe a little part of you still still care, is that? I think? What's you know really interesting about you know, all the information that you can get with twenty three and me, is you see, like how many things in your life. Jenetics may have a little roll in, right, it may nudge you towards one thing or another. But as you said, it's not destiny, right, it's a it's a propensity maybe,

but you may not be afraid of heights. Maybe you know that beautiful view overcomes that fear for you, and you know, like you said, legs up, you are just enjoying that beautiful view, and a propensity for fear of pipe doesn't matter at that point. How in the world, though, do your chromosomes. Um, Jackie's holding a basson. Not afraid of hies, but am afraid of falling. Okay, thank you, Jackie. How do janette markers determine if you're afraid of heights?

Because my father was definitely afraid of heights. I've never heard that before. Anybody jump in that knows the answer to that one, Well, I can tell you at twenty three and me. What we do is we look at people who tell us they're afraid of heights and compare their DNA to people who say they're not afraid of heights. And what we're looking for is differences, like different places in their d n A that's different between those two groups.

And so we can say that people who have who are afraid of heights tend to have this certain genetic marker that people who aren't afraid of heights who don't have. And then we can tell you that that you may have this marker that seems to be associated with being

afraid of heights. You know, really interesting thing I found out my mom has natural degeneration and and my mother in law, who believe it or not, Jackie, ever since the David and I met back in college over all those years, I never had a single cross word with his mother or father. Yeah, I'm really really blessed, just just so blessed to had them in my life. His mother had macular degeneration really badly. Now here's what's interesting.

I don't show a higher likelihood of getting macular degeneration, but my husband does. I haven't told him yet. He's kind of like shut down after he found out he wasn't Scottish. Okay, so that's a whole another thing. He is so convinced he's Scottish. We even bought him a kilt and made him wear at one time. Um, he's not. He's not Scottish. I think that he's questioning the whole oh process because he wants to be Scottish so badly.

He loves bagpipes, he loves everything about it. But he found out that he's a mutt like me and um, and he's got a little bit of French in German and him, and he was just he was upset when he found out our so called thoroughbred dockson was part poodle. Okay. He was very disturbed about that. So I haven't been able to talk to him about being part French and part German. Yet I'm going to save it for just

the right moment. But you know, another thing I found out is that, Um, I knew that I was part Jewish, but I didn't know it was Ashkenazi. Now that is very significant because there are certain health risks associated with being Ashkenazi. Does anybody know the answer to that? What are those health risks? Yeah? I can jump in here. Um, there's certain populations, whether genetic variants that occur more common, as Nazi Jewish is one of those that we see

certain genetic condition much more common in that population. And so one of the ones that we think about is the r are um inheriting breast cancer, had a hereditary breast cancer and or variating cancer. This frest and hold on running that down. Hereditary breast cancer, hereditary a varying cancer. Yes, the rday line and r C too, and so individuals of oh yeah, just so you know, ladies, Karen Stark's breast cancer survivor, go ahead and georr you Oscanazi Karen?

So you know we're related. Not only did we live down the street from each other in New York, now we find out we're related. Okay, breast cancer, hereditary breast cancretary of varying cancer, the brocka Chaine, and I believe tastes lock syndrome, isn't that. Yeah, there's a lot of conditions that are autosomal respessive, which is a fancy way of saying that kind of you inherited that experience from your both room parents, and that can result from the condition.

And we see more of the like thing in certain populations. And so for the r A you're talking about, that about one in forty individuals of the Jewish ancestry are barriers or habits a variance that greatly increases the risk for these certain cancers like breasco various or costee anatic. You know, I found out so much about my mom too, guys. I found out that she is partially Nigerian. I found out so much about mom. What what is that you

care and start jeffing and go ahead. Yeah. I wanted to say, like, if if you get those kind of results and they say a potensity to a dist or something about the brothogene, it's really important not to be afraid, but to go and talk to somebody and go over it with your doctor or a genetic counsels like you have on the show. Hey, you know what it did to me when I found out, um, about the higher likelihood of getting type two diabetes. Well, first immediately ordered

Crispy Kream's and I ate my way through them. Then I swore them off. I'm trying. I have one last beender before I went on Straight and Narrow. But anyway back to twenty three and me, and can we talk about security, because um, I found out all sorts of things in my line of work. When you talk about d n A tists, it's never a good thing. Okay, you know it's as related as I'm crying. But with twenty three and me, Um, you can now explain this correctly.

Stacy dett Wilder and Alisa Lehman. You can actually have all of your your results destroyed after you get them. If you don't want them kept on file, They're destroyed. They're gone, like turning off the TV. It's over. It's gone. Um. You can have it not shared with the public or shared with the public if you want. You can have limited parts of it shared with the public or none of it shared with the public. Is it is all

of that right? Alisa and or Stacey. Yeah, that's right, and I encourage everyone to check out twenty three and me dot com slash privacy because I think you're right that a lot of people think about the privacy and the security concerns about getting this information. And we want people to make an informed choice before they decide to do test or not. And so we have a lot of information about what is what we do to protect your information. So, yes, you can have your sample destroyed,

your DNA sample that you provide. You can completely delete all your information after you after you get it. You can download all your information. You can choose UM which reports that you want to view or not view, and UM within the health reports, you can choose if you want to share information with other people on the twenty three and me site or with research or not UM, and you can use what information is shared. So you have a lot of control over who sees your information.

And we want to make sure that people are you know, informed of those choices ahead of time. And our general policy is that all of these things are opting into sharing. So if you don't do anything, we assume you do not want to have your information and shared. Oh that's so smart. Guys, what she just said. I just immediately compared it to if you're in court and you don't interimpl the judges automatically and there's not guilty for you.

If you don't check any of these boxes, then they automatically put it on privacy where you don't share it with anyone in any degree. And again you can have the whole thing deleted and your tests destroyed if that's what you want. Hey, you know what another thing I found out? This is so crazy, then I am wait for it, Jackie, wait for it. More likely to experience here photo bleaching, which means that when you out in the sun, your hair turns blonder. See. I told you

this was natural, and you didn't believe me. You kept saying, who did your hair? Or who did not do your hair? Can't han't, can't go do your hair. See it's all because of the sun. This is natural, right? How do they know that? Can Alice or Stacy tell me that that is? That is very similar to you know, the fear of heights, um, you know, fear of public speaking, like preferences like you know, whether you prefer chocolate or

vanilla ice cream? All of that is you know, comparing the DNA as people who who say their hair gets lighter in the sun to people whose hair doesn't get lighter in the sun, and finding these little places that are are different between people who have those different experiences, and then again being able to report back to you based on your DNA you might be more likely to have that hair photo bliefing happen. Listen to this, guys. This is what you can learn. Are you prone to

type two diabetes? If so, what can you do about it? Im macular degeneration? What can David and Lucy do about it? I found out that I was more acutely, I have a more acute odor detection, which is really interesting. Jackie Karen start. Remember after COVID, both John, David and I lost a sense of smell, and um I first tested about midnight. We were up watching Elf, the Christmas movie, and um I realized I couldn't smell Lucy's cookie shoes making, and we went and stuck our noses in the coffee.

Couldn't smell it. We finally the Ultimate Desk got two sharpies and stuck them up our nostrils. Couldn't smell a thing, And I'm like, okay, we've lost our sense of smell. Now listen to this Karen start over. A year later, I think my mother smells funny. Then I thought my friend who often comes on our program when a rockwell smelled funny, same smell, Jackie. Sadly, I also thought you smelled funny. Finally, finally I thought, how can all these

three people smell like blee? It's me. I went to the doctor and it was a result, weird result of COVID having lost my smell. And now I find out through twenty three and me I have increased odor detection, more likely to match a musical pitch boy. I wish David had gotten that one. UM fear of high fear of public speaking. And you learn about these things in

order to work on them and maybe even correct them. Um. It talks about possibility of chronic kidney disease, the possibility of hyper cholesterol, and me cholesterol, Ama, what is that? Is that? Bad cholesterol? What is that? Dr Dupree? Basically hyper cholesterol a media hyper cholesterol limia. It is actually you have more what they call bad cholesterol or l D all the low density, then you do the high density, and therefore you are more susceptible to things like stroke,

hardening of the arteries, um, even heart attack. Well I dodged that one, so I guess it's okay to order another round of Crispy krans Um. Let's see. Well, I'll jump in here shop the end our reports. Yeah, I reports specifically on familial hope for cholesteroling you, which is an inherited So why did about people have this? And so you're typically very early on you have very high cholesterol. So unfortunately, most pieces of having a high cholesterol are

due to and lifestyle. Um. So you know you can't go take a while there. Well, so that's an X on the own at days. That's a note to the doughnuts legal legally as I'm throwing you. I'm not gonna say completely not, it's not a total note. Why did okay, why does John David have to take his test again? I think did? Did? Did he screw it up somehow? Does? Why would he have to take his test again? Did

he not spit enough? This can happen um so often it's because you know, like I said, these cells in your cheeks, that's what we're looking for, um in your spit. So it could be that either there weren't enough cells for whatever reason, um that that made it into his

first fit sample. It could be that, you know, when we when we extract the DNA out of those cells, that we didn't get enough, or could be that you know when we are trying to analyze your DNA, that there was there was an error or problem with that analysis. But hopefully you know, his experience was that you got a second kid was able to give it a second try, and we were successful that on that second on the

second try. I'm trying, but you can't eat or drink thirty minutes before, and it's really hard to catch John David having not just eating something. So I'm trying to pin him down before he can eat or drink in the morning to do spent Yes, Karen Stark, Uh, he's six five and a half and he just turned fifteen. You know, a feeding full of vegetables every night. Last night he bought at Raw Carrot's. I don't know why, but he did. But I'm working on it. I'm working

on it. Yes, maybe guys. It's also very easy to view online. I don't know how it's gonna be to print it off and I make Lucy's um Christmas scroll. But and that's not all I'm giving her. I'm giving her some other things too, And of course Santa's coming. You can delete your account, discard your sample, no one can access your information if that's the way you want it. I'm really happy that I took the test. I'm really happy that I will be able to answer some of

Lucy's questions. She's Brettish, she gets some Scandinavian from her father. She gets a lot of Irish from me. She and I'm assuming since they're twins, John Davis, they're both going to have osh Can Nazi jeans within them. Of course that opens up to a lot of health issues we're going to look into. But now I know, and now I can do something about it for them. Um, I'm just really glad it came in into my wife. Hey, let's let's do round robin. Final thoughts. Dr Michelle Duffrey.

I think this is a wonderful You can actually change your lifestyle based on the information that you know and have a better life. I help their life. This is great, you know, it really is. Isn't it great to be talking about genetic markers when it's not connected to a crime. Okay, Karen, start and jump in. I just think that. I mean, I did it, and there was nothing that was frightening. I felt like if I needed to, I would certainly consult you're the doctor or a genetic council. But there

was a lot of things. There were things I said that that we're fun, like the chocolate or the vanilla, because my whole family likes vanilla and people are like, what, no chocolate? It was really a lot of fun to

get that information. What about it? Alisa Lehman joining me PhD seeing you manage your products science at twenty three and me, I mean, I think it's great to hear the good experiences that people are having, and it's exactly what we want, as you know, a starting point stirt your journey, either with your ancestry or with your health. You know, take this and and make good choices going forward and to Stacy while or maybe this is to

at least I'm not sure who would feel this. But we almost didn't do it, And I'll tell you why. When I said, hey, Twins, you want to do twenty three and me after I told him what it was, John Davis said no, Mom, because I don't want my great great grandson to be busted on a felony because I gave a DNA sample And I almost said, where did you hear that? And then of course I need where he heard it from me? Okay talking about it ancestral family trees, and I just want to point out

to Allay my son John David's fears. Twenty three and me has never once handed out information to law enforcement. And again they give you the option if you want your test destroyed, It's destroyed when you say do it. Stacy Detwiler final thoughts. You know, I think our mission this was people to access, understand and benefit from this information. And it's so great to hear UM that it seems like we've done that. We are all about the heart right.

This is your information. You have access to learn so much from it, Um and inspire you to make the positions that are going to lead to that longer have to healthier life what we want. I just want to say thank you to twenty three and me UM for all the questions you've answered, and I will let you know how Lucy response on Christmas morning. Thanks guys, goodbye friends, and that's it. On another dope show. Did this episode inspire you to take a closer look at your health history,

your genetic makeup. Who new DNA could reveal so much about our past while also holding the keys to certain health insights that may impact our future. I continue to be inspired by these stories, and I hope you do as well. Catch you next time. Listen to Spit, an original podcast from I Heart Radio and twenty three in the on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.