Welcome to Spacing Out with BB and Jason this week covering Foundation season two, episode one in Selden's Shadow.
Welcome to Spacing Out.
I'm BB and I'm Jason, and we are discussing Foundation season two. We covered season one and one full sweep and now he slowed it down a little bit for season two. So this came out a while ago, but it was our first time watching, so we're not going to have any spoilers for any episodes to come. We're talking about Foundation season two, episode one in Selden's Shadow. This is premiered on July fourteenth, twenty twenty three, written by David Skoyer and Jane Esmonson and directed by Alex Graves.
In this episode, Brother Day survives an assassination attempt by the Blind Angels while he is being intimate with the Merzil and blames brothers Don and Dusk of being complicit. He plans the wed Queen Sarah's one of the Cloud Dominion to end the Genetic dynasty and chains the direction of the Empire, but she is not impressed with them.
Empire discovers that Terminus was not destroyed by a megaflayer as they had presumed a copy of Harry Seldyn's consciousness within the prime Radiant, tries to find his way out and on the ocean planet Synax, Gail and Salver, after examining the Radiant and learning that Harry's plan is verying off course, the work to reactivate salver ship Beggar so they can return to Terminus, and after escaping the Radiant, Harry confronts Gail and Salver inside the Beggar.
Vibe check, did we like the episode overall? How does it stand the test of time?
The ship's name is Beggar, all right? Vibe check? Not impressed. I mean it's still confusing as fuck. It's still like convoluted, and I don't know. I'm like, I'm not rooting for any of these characters, not even the ladies. I was hoping they were doing okay, but they're so boring. Like you just met your child who's older than you and you're like, oh, you know, it's gonna take a while to get used to you in your British accent. I don't know, like I would cry or something like emotion. Emotion.
The last piece of the man you loved is alive and is somehow inflicted with the same visions that you have. Here's a something girl. Please, this is a show about like people, right, not robots. I mean there's one robot, but the robot had more emotion. What the fuck? Yeah, she's a little muted. Yeah, I can't. I just it's sad. It's bad. I'm like, why can't we have emotion? Like, you know, I know, maybe they're trying to say that
women aren't emotional. Maybe there's like subtext here that I'm missing, but it just doesn't appeel offthentic brother day, you know, thinking that the call came from within the house more suspicious, more paranoia, more like I don't know what this director is doing where he's like letting these people be would but it just feels weird, Like it just doesn't feel
emotional and it should be. Your empire is failing, You're doing something that's gonna change the course of your genetic line forever, and it just it doesn't Like I wish we would have seen like a better courtship between those two characters, or like I like that girl, Like the cloud lady was cool. She had sass and she was like not afraid to talk back to the empire and
stuff like that. She was challenging, but she got like what two minutes of screen time and then they're like, oh, well, we got to move over here into this the room and talk about ancient history right away. I don't know, it just felt weird. I don't not my favorite. I'm still not convinced by this show. It's not it doesn't feel like it was written about me or for me, or with me in mind as an audience member. So no, I didn't like it. The best then was the part
where they were swimming. There was no dialogue. Does that say anything to you all? What was your like?
Uh?
What about you? Do you like it that you have different opinions than me? So I hope somebody likes the show.
I've found it, like I've heard several times like season two is a big step up from season one. I didn't find it dramatically different from what we've seen season one.
But this is just one episode, right.
Yeah, and it has perhaps kind of slowed down and let us like digest. Yeah, there's still things like from season one that I'm confused about that. I guess they're probably not going to get cleared up. I don't remember why Harry is so mad at Gail. And I'm unclear if we've time jumped with the emperors, if I'm watching the same ones or not.
Yeah, I think we have so from my from what I'm catching, and again I don't know if i'm it seems like uh Selden is mad at Gail because she wasn't supposed to be the one that lived and carried on his plan. That was supposed to be her partner, and he put her in that pod. So you're right, I don't know why we're mad at Gail. Maybe because she veered his ship off course too, so that's another
reason to be mad at Gail. But she survived out of sheer luck and happenstance, like her partner ran into her in the hallway and he like threw her in there, so it's not like she chose to be there. So yeah, I don't know why he's mad at her, but I'm guessing those are the reasons. And then I do believe we're all on the same timeline. The Foundation and the emperors were all one hundred and fifty years later or whatever.
Yeah, So I mean those things aside, like it's hard to it's hard to process this show one episode at a time when it's clearly telling a season long story, and so Gather's things I'm unclear about at this point, but I think that's how it's supposed to unfold. So I'm I'm interested. I want to be more interested in some of the storylines than I am because right now, like the Emperor seem the most interesting, and that's not the one I want to be invested in. So yeah, overall kind of hesitant.
But so you're you're you're that's a non answer. Do you like the episode?
I am cautiously optimistic.
Okay, so you kind of like the episode?
Yeah, trivia time? What backs or news could we uncover for Foundation season?
So just some very general stuff here. So season one filmed in Ireland and the island of Malta and the Canary Islands. Season two is primarily shot in Prague. I think season one shifted around a lot because of COVID season two to not have that problem.
Season three had the writer's strike. Oh so there, I wonder so you're saying the writing's going to be worse in season three.
Well, no, it was just delayed a lot. Oh okay, And then there's more we'll talk about that when we get to the end of season two. But in terms of the adaptation of the novels, the season mostly adapts the later half of the first Foundation novel and then the first half of the second novel called Foundation and Empire. Who says a reminder, it's very loose adaptation. Most of these storylines are created for the show, and some elements of the novel have been woven in.
So reading the books won't film me and on some of this stuff.
There's little things here and there, but at this point everything's confusing.
Yeah, deep space, let's break down some of our thoughts on the episode. You can share your thoughts with us through email or social media. We may use your comments on an upcoming episode.
All right, So, I guess, with these like three ish storylines, which one you want to go and do first?
I don't even remember what they were.
We've got the emperors, we've got Gail and Salvar, and we've got Harry in his little prison.
What about a little bit on Terminus. Yeah, Terminus is just vaguely there. Well, we started with Harry in the beginning of the episode, in his dirty outfit. Why is he dirty? Why is he dirty. If he's like, oh, it's it's consciousness and it's dirty, he's a dirty guy. I don't understand how, like how did like Okay, so the part of the mystery is how did he get there? But why is he dirty? If he is like a fictional bean or like a made up individual, why wouldn't
he put himself in clean clothes? Why wouldn't he be like the best dressed version of himself.
I don't know, because he wasn't wearing that last season right when he now.
No, and like if it was him like coming back from the dead, he'd be covered in blood or something, right, Like. It's just really confusing why they chose this particular outfit and that level of grunge and dirt and then he's in and especially because he's like in a very clean space. Yeah, so where and maybe and maybe that's like the point. Maybe that's like trying to paint him as the odd man out is an element that doesn't belong in this clean,
sterile environment. But I don't know. It just looks nasty. It looks like he smells bad and he's dirty, and he's like ranting and raving like a lunatic. And I can't follow what he's saying. I really care. I don't like him, and he's one of the main characters that's like supposed to be a beloved guy. I don't like him. I don't like a lot of these characters. So I don't care that he's trapped in a prison of potentially
his own making. Yeah, I don't care. And then they try to give him a backstory with this lover and this other random lady that they don't explain who she is either.
Like what, I'm wondering if they're trying to like take him down a peg, because he was like all ego last season, So I wonder if they're like, let's dirty him up, let's give him some childhood trauma. And I don't know he is making a wife, but I guess he lost, and yeah.
Make him human, uh, because he's supposed to be like this kind of deity like frigure.
Yeah, and he's expressing a lot of like self doubt and stuff in there.
Ah. But yeah, it's just confusing. And I just this whole idea of a force dimension being able to be tapped in by a human or a I don't know what he is, A specter. I don't know what he is, but he's like able to navigate the forced and it's just him walking on walls which are a third dimension, Like, we don't know what the fourth dimension looks like, So why are you playing with us? I don't know.
He made it sound so easy though, like, oh yeah, just tint to reshape it.
They just turned him into an e uh the an escher esque like figure where he's like walking on the walls and the staircases that are upside down and things like that, and we don't know where he is to be, like you know what. It kind of reminds me of and I hate to say this, it reminds me of the tartists from Doctor Who, where they're saying it's bigger on the inside, and uh so is he in that little black thing that's in the foundation the foundation?
No, so they're saying that there's there's two copies of his consciousness and so there's that one at the foundation and the other one that Gail had and apparently off screen she put it inside the little radiant box.
Isn't that something kind of important to show instead of tell? So I don't know how he got from the hard drive onto there yeah, especially since she didn't have it right. That's why she said she did it while Salvar was sleeping. Yeah, okay, stupid man. I don't. The show is just so frustrating and the things it chooses to show you.
You know what it doesn't show you though, that penises.
That penis so he's fucking his.
Robot, which is didn't know that was a thing, but apparently they can.
Well. And even the brother Dawn was like or no, not down Dusk Dusk. I was trying to remember Daylight Savings and like can carry over the one and what it? They like savings as their cousin.
Do you remember those books, the Treehouse books where they're like Midnight and Shanghai and shit like that, like where they had like they went into the treehouse and they came out and they were like transported into another like story and it was always like something about like a time.
Of day, like you know, medieval times and at noon. It was very niche book. Okay, you had to be there, but that's kind of the vibe I get from the names.
Uh, they got a whole family, like you got Twilight and the Noon and.
The main brothers are Dawn, Day and dusk, and Dusk is like, you nasty that lady changed your diaper, and he's right, that's nasty. That is super nasty. And he's like, she initiated and that makes her a predator. Bro. He's like, it was a good thing she was there because he ended up. She ended up like uh, shoving her hand through somebody's skull. She could have done that to your dick, dude.
Well, they also like used her as a shield first thing.
Yeah, I mean she's a robot, she's not a person, So no feelings. The only thing hard in this episode was his dick didn't look like it. We couldn't tell it was just blank.
If he was like interrupted in the middle of sex, like that thing should have been pointed up. And all those silhouettes it wasn't there.
Yeah, there was a lot of silhouettes and a lot of uh butt work, but no dick. And I'm so tired of Hollywood hiding the penis. I'm so tired they always show boobs an ass, but they never show dick. It's indecent, it's disgusting and nobody wants to see it. But you know what, it's equality. I don't know if you're gonna have a naked dude show his dick, don't tease me. The guys who were trying to kill him, Uh,
they were pretty impressive considering they didn't have eyes. Yeah, and like, I don't know, I feel like getting to the scene in the middle of them having sex and orgasmine felt like cheating. Like we should have seen her initiate. We should have seen that. We should have seen like her soothing him and telling him everything's okay and bloody blah blah, and he was the best empire there's ever been.
Yeah, it's the way, like it kind of catches us up on stuff. It's so like kind of nonchalant about it in a way that like this is interesting, Like he wants to marry someone and like break the genetic dynasty. But they just casually mentioned that, and then we get to it and then he's also in this you know step mom porn as well.
Like.
Not step mom pork, that's one of the most popular porns out there, you know. But Yeah, I would have liked a little bit of worming up.
Like if we saw the conflict within him of like deciding to alter their genetic dynasty or the.
Thing that was putting pressure on pressure on him him, like systematically losing planet after planet and seeing the empire shrink and the mindset change again, telling instead of showing sad.
Yeah, and maybe that's why I'm a little more hesitant on this episode. Is just like it's it's telling us stuff to set the scene, and it's not that rewarding in the way it's telling it right now. But I'm hoping that it's just like catching us up to where we want to start the story for the season.
Yeah, we'll see. I'm not holding my breast. But Gail is dang nicely. I'm sorry. I was so proud of that.
So Gail is a mom now, and.
She has no advice, no information, just vague wordage and a really sick accent that we don't know quite where it's from, because I don't think those people from the Ocean talk like that. She's like this Madonna, a girl who came from Jersey, but all of a sudden she has a British accent. I think that's her real accent, like the actress. Yeah, but she came from a planet where nobody else had that accent. She learned it in
a book. Yeah, Well, I guess she's like one of the few people from that planet now, so they do have that accent because she's one of two.
So yeah, as you were saying earlier, her reaction to having a daughter that's older than her pretty just muted, just kind of like she doesn't even want to attempt to process it. She's just like not anytime that Salvo tries to bring up the connections they have, she's like, oh, it's not the same thing.
It'd be interesting if she was like withdrawn in a way that was like more interesting, like you don't know what you're talking about, instead.
Of no, it's not really, it's not like overwhelmed by it. Yeah, like not like she's somewhat in denial of it having like any meaning at all, but she's not in denial of it being like true.
But like she traveled from outer space to this planet to find this girl, and she's not finding any meaning in it even though she did it. She's not like, oh my god, I can't believe I've found you. I can't believe this is happening, Like what are the odds? Nothing? Or tell us the odds, bitch your math ho. And then the most interesting thing she did was explain the trajectory of the time of the human timeline.
Yeah, so we learned that we're reverering off course from what Selden was trying to put in the motion. And as they keep going off course, then might not ever get back on course.
The importance of the course, you don't know, that's not explained. Why it's so important to stay on course? What's his plan? He doesn't know it, We don't know it. Nobody knows it. Jesus Christ. This show is so infuriating. So what we go off course? We're in a red timeline instead of a blue timeline? Is that the bad thing? Because we're we're crips, not bloods. What's going on? And I maybe because there's more crisis crises in the in the red timeline.
It's like because there was a little nodule after nodule after nodule.
So the crises are things that I think can push them further away away from what from So basically like he predicted the fall of the empire and like the fall up of humanity, the darkness that would come from that before kind of humanity rebuilds itself to you know, not suffering anymore. Basically, and if they if they follow the course that he's kind of predicted and set out, then they can shorten the.
Timeline of suffering. The suffering. Yeah, that's you can't do that. You've got to let nature take its course. You know, in the fourteen hundreds, the plague wiped out like half the population and Europe went back into the dark ages, and it took them hundreds of years to recuperate. It had to happen because people fucking died and you can't recover from that. And right now it's been like five years since we had a global pandemic and we are
still struggling to wrap our heads around the loss. We can't cut that in half because we don't want to suffer. You know, suffering is part of the like human code, it's part of our existence. And the thing is we create our own suffering through our inability to connect with
one another. So even if you solve the next crisis, you're not solving the ineptitude of the human spirit to be a selfish asshole and continue to pollute the world and drop bombs on the brown like third world countries and exploit people like you can try to solve the problem, but you're not solving the root of the issue, and uh, I don't. This show is just like unrealistic, Like you're
trying to solve a problem that's been existing. The humans are the problem and the only way to solve the human problem is to let them be extinct, and that's not humanitarian. So I don't know, let it, let it fear off course, fight like hell for what you have, but there's no way you can ever make it go through a perfect course, Like there is no better timeline.
This is the only timeline. What a fantasy. This is a white man's fantasy for sure, to say we can fix one little thing and we'll be back in the blue, blue skies and rainbows. I don't like it. I don't like it. What do you think.
I'm wondering if you actually want to do every episode of this?
I do, No, Yeah, it's I'm interested, But just this show is really weird and like I want to like it. It has elements that are there, but it's also such high fantasy that it's not and it's not a fantasy where I can like feel myself in it, you know what I mean? Like, I don't know. We'll try another episode, We'll see how it goes. And again, this episode might still be having the stink of last season on it, but the premise of the show to say that there's a better way for us to be that's always going
to be true. And the thing is that we're never going to change the bad course we're on no matter how many good people try to change it. There's gonna be bad people that are gonna fuck shit up for all of us because they have more power, more money,
and more influence than the good people usually have. And it's just it's hard to believe in a future where somebody like Gaeale and and the other one can can fix it, you know what I mean, Like, oh yeah, these two girls who swim good, they're they're gonna fix it. They both swim really well. And seeing black women in water is something that needs to be more prevalent in the media, I think, because there's like a stigma with black people in water that has existed for a really
long time. And to see these two women swimming in this beautiful, like clear blue water was really lovely and almost treeing and they were saving themselves and cooperating. That was like my favorite scene in this whole episode, Like seeing them swimming through uh the spaceship and saving themselves out of a hurricane. That was really powerful. That was
like the most powerful scene. And like I said, there was no dialogue and so like it was an action scene that had to deep impact on the visuals that were being represented.
Any other positives, positives.
I really liked it when the cloud people came to with their cloudy outfits and their hands up like drag queens. They're like serving, They're like walking down the runway, turn turn. And then the gift that they presented.
I like how Brother Dusk, who has been kind of like grumpy the whole episode, he suddenly nerds out over all this pigment they brought.
Right, So I think it's like a thing that happens with these uh the Emperor Empire is when you become Dusk, you become obsessed with a mural because this's got to be a different homie. Yeah, but it's their job to maintain the mural. Yeah, building, And I wish, like I really loved that part where they presented the pigment, but because of the properties of the pigment, I wish that they would have shown him touching it and it reacting and shifting and moving the way that they've shown it
in the past. That was like a really big missed opportunity on the visual effects team, I think, because like, the whole vibe of this show is like sand moving through time and all this shit, So it would have been cool to evoke that visual with Brother Dusk, just like touching the pigment and being like in awe of it. Then the gift they gave back was lame, was super lame. It was a paperweight right of their shrunken empire. And
she called it out. She's like, oh, is this the vision you have of yourself?
Thought the empire's a little bigger than this.
But she was looking down at his penis too so. And then he rudely gets interrupted by the robot lady and he's like, hey, come over.
Here, and like, well, yes, she had important information. I don't see why it couldn't wait.
Like, actually, if they're saying, especially if they're saying, well, let's let them stay hidden. Yeah, that was like the conclusion of that let's not do anything yet. Yeah, so let me let me be super rude to my potential bride to be, who's gonna fix all my problems and my pr problems, Like she's gonna fix my public image. Let me run away from her and and leave her in a room alone with all my co conspirators to talk about some random planet that I'm going to be like, Oh,
let's leave it alone. Stupid, stupid, stupid.
I think it was a robot. What's her name, Demersal?
Yeah, I think she was Jelly Demersal. Yeah.
I think she was like, I'm going to get my man out of here.
My boyfriend's son, Yes, my step son. That's so nasty. Yeah, I don't know. Man, Like, I really want to like this show, but a big part of me is just like, in order for you to fall for the fantasy, a part of you has to be like deeply committed to it. One of the reasons why Star Wars works for me is because it's a show about corruption and and and like deceit and how there's the duality of man exists
and how we struggle with that duality. And uh, you know, there's a sector of people rebelling against the evils of the world, and they're small in numbers, but there their fight is justified, and that's that feels real because that's happened in the past. You know, there a lot of the the Sith lords and all that shit. It's all like modeled after Nazi Germany, a real historical event with real casualties and real people. So it's just like, what what did this guy who wrote the foundation? Where was
he bringing? Like what was his inspiration? Like I can't imagine after World War Two that you believed in a better world because you lived through the real life hell and so I don't know, Like I don't know. I don't know if I can fall into this idea of saving humanity from itself in a way that's going to alter the course of a timeline. It's just a really hard sell for somebody who's been through what we've all been through. A majority of the world is spurning and
we can't put it out, not with our tears. You can cry all we want. And that's like it would have been cool if that's what Gail said, Like, you know, we're just two girls, We're just two women. What are we supposed to do? I don't believe in this either, Like that would have been realistic, that would have been interesting that she was, but that she still chooses to go forward and try to find the cause and try
to do it. But saying I don't think this is real, or I don't think this is going to work, or I don't think it's possible, but I'm going to try. That would have been authentic to a real human experience. I don't know. I'm just I'm missing the human. I'm missing the human in this and it's sad because I like that's like the point of science fiction is to point out the flaws and humanity and give us a satire or a different perspective. And it's just I can't
see it. I can't see it, and I don't I would love to get it from Like I would love to have somebody who could tell me how this is working for them. I would love to be like, oh, yeah, you know, like this show, I don't get it, and then they explain it to me in a way that makes the human. But I don't even know anybody who watches the show, right, Like maybe there's a forum, a Reddit thread or something, but I don't know. I don't know.
Astral Queen, who was the standout character in the episode.
Are you ready to choose your astral Queen?
No? Can you go first? I didn't like any of these toes. Actually, I know who I want to pick. I want to pick the sassy cloud queen. That's a good choice. Yeah. She had but two minutes of screen time, and she made the most impact and the most emotional uh like performance in the episode. She gave emotion, she gave sass, She criticized an emperor. She knows she has the upper hand on so I pick her. And she was dressed really well.
Yeah, that's a good choice. I'm not going to pick any of the emperors. Well, I'm always interested in the robot. She was weird this episode, and we didn't get much on the foundation. We're just like, oh, something's gonna happen.
Maybe what was with that guy that they found floating in space? Too? Was that Gails are what's her name's boyfriend? Don't ask me that? Okay, you don't know. I don't think it was. I thought it was because remember he floated away, but then he came back, didn't he? I don't remember? Never mind? Go ahead, who's your astro queen? Um? Was it Gail probably Sell? Okay, that's her name. I can't pronounce that.
Just because she had more like energy, yeah, more realistic emotions around that interaction.
She also got up early in the morning and caught breakfast. What's Gail doing on a planet she's never been to before? Yeah?
All right, well then that wraps us up for season two, episode one. Next time we will cover episode two, which is titled A Glimpse of Darkness, and thank you for spacing out with us, and remember to respect and enjoy the piece.
Thank you for spacing out with Peb and Jason. You can help us out by subscribing and leaving a positive rating or review. Remember you can contact us through email or social media. Next time, we will cover Foundation season two, episode two, A Glimpse of Darkness,