You're listening to Song Exploder, where musicians take apart their songs and piece by piece, tell the story of how they were made. I'm Rishikesh Hirway. Seal is a Grammy-winning singer and songwriter from England. His song Kiss from a Rose was first released in 1994 on his second album. It was a huge hit thanks in part to being featured in the movie Batman Forever.
It landed on the top 10 charts in multiple countries and eventually went quadruple platinum in the US. And at the 1996 Grammys it won Song of the Year, Record of the Year, and Best Male Pop Vocal Performance. But Kiss from a Rose becoming a hit wasn't a foregone conclusion. Seal almost didn't record it. And when it was first released, it didn't make much of a splash.
But for this episode, the 250th episode of Song Exploder, Seal and his longtime collaborator, producer Trevor Horn, told me the story of what it took to bring Kiss from a Rose to life. My name is Seal and I'm a record and artist. I wrote Kiss from a Rose around, it would have been 86, 87. I was living in a squat. I didn't have any money and I was just basically getting my act together trying to figure out who I was musically.
And Kiss from a Rose came out of that period when you sort of do things not for any other purpose than because that's what's coming out of you. I had no experience in the studio in a proper recording studio at that point. And so I didn't know the rules. And it started out as a bit of an experiment. Because I just got this piece of record and apparatus called a four track. And I was trying to figure out how to use it. I couldn't play an instrument at the time.
But I tried to imagine what an orchestra would do and came up with these parts. So I was essentially trying to mimic a flute, a pizzeria violins and a few other instruments, essentially an orchestra. And so I ended up recording about 16 or 17 tracks of vocals trying to figure out how to work this machine and everything was impulsive and instinctive.
And at the end of the day doing it, I had this thing called Kiss from a Rose. But I remember kind of listening to the tape and kind of tossed the tape to one side because I wasn't particularly proud of it. Later on, we'd had some success with a song called Killer. That was quite popular. Killer is a song by the English DJ Adamski that featured seal on guest vocals. It came out in 1990 and was a number one hit in the UK.
And so I'd been to see a few different record companies. I remember walking into ZTT records. And as I was walking through the corridors, I was looking at all of the plaques on the wall and there were bands like propaganda, Frankie goes to Hollywood, Grace Jones, slave to the rhythm. And I remember looking at all of these records and going, oh, I like that record. Oh, yeah, I really like that record. Oh, and it was only then that I made the connection that Trevor Horn had produced all of these.
And my name is Trevor Horn and I'm an old record producer. My late wife was Jill Sinclair. At the time Jill and I were kind of like a team. Jill was my wife, but she was also my manager. And we started a record label together, which was ZTT.
Before I actually met seal, she said, I've found him. I've found what I've been looking for. I remember the first meeting it very clearly. As if it were yesterday Jill looked at me and she said, I'll never forget that she said, right young man, let me tell you why this is your home. And I walked out of there and I remember telling my manager at the time that that's where I wanted to be. And so Trevor and I eventually got together and my life changed.
I remember this friend of mine would always tell Trevor, say, you know, seals got this rose song. You should get him to play to you. And Trevor would keep saying to me, what's this song that Paul keeps going on about this rose song? And I'd be, I don't know, I don't know.
And I just passed it off as being nothing. You said it was sort of Elizabethan. Yeah, that was it. And I remember being quite intrigued, but we never got around to it on the first record. And then we got the set record. I remember saying, yeah, what about that Elizabethan thing? And what did you think when he foreshowed it to you? I loved it. You're kidding. I thought it's so rare. You hear something that's in three, four, you know, six, eight, whichever time signature. I loved the other.
What's not to love about that? We recorded at Sam's studio, Sam Weston London. I didn't quite know how to do the song, but then I thought, but probably the best thing is keep it straight rather than trying to get clever with any techno stuff on it. We had a seven piece band, Chris Bruce Bay guitar, Jamie Mahal Brad played keyboards. Guy called Amp Fettler also played keyboards initially. He had Harvey Mason on drums.
An English guy on bass called Charlie Draighton. It has these amazing dynamic bits in it. The band would get loud and then stop. You know, that's one of the things you get from playing it sort of live and feeling it. There is so much I'm and can tell you so much. You can say you remain my power, my pleasure, my pain. I liked singing with the band, but I really liked the focus sessions that Trevor and I used to have in the studio because that's where I learned my trades really.
Baby, I can pay you to a kiss from a rose on the grey. Oh, the more I get a few to strange, I'll refuse. Yeah. And now that your rose is in bloom, I light hits the gloom on the grey. At one point I used to live literally across the road in Trevor's basement flat. And I would walk into the studio at sometimes three o'clock in the morning, sometimes, you know, one o'clock in the afternoon.
And all these different times and there was always a mic ready. There was always a set up ready. There was always an engineer available whether Trevor was there or not. Because Trevor once told me, look, everything else I can control and I can make it work. And whether it's orchestras, whether it's other musicians. The one thing I can't control is your vocal. But did you know that when it snows, my eyes become a large and the light that you shine can't be seen.
Sometimes you were with friends, very nice friends. I would say to you, hey, you see what are you doing vocal? And I'd sing better. Trevor's being tactful. I generally walk in with like some gorgeous lady. And Trevor understood, you know, if I had an audience to perform in front of, I sang differently. Yeah. So he encouraged me to get the vocal. Because it's a tricky song.
It's not for the faint at heart. In the verses, it's low and exposed. And it's harder to sing the low parts when you're nervous and it is the high parts. I don't recollect you have any problem singing it, but we put in little 3 or 8 bar to give you a breath after one line. It used to go like that. But then Trevor put in a little turnaround that would give me time to catch my breath. Then used to be a gradient tower, well, alone on the sea. You became the light on the dark side of me.
That little thing is so important to the overall performance. Love remains a drug that's the higher not the pill. But did you know that when it's known, my eyes become a lot and the light that you shine can't be seen. Trevor used to stress the importance of a middle-late. You started going, I've been kissed for a rose. What I said, I said you could make that a middle-late, we take it down a tone. And then we'll go back up again for the end of the song and it worked great.
I've been kissed by a rose on the grey. I've been kissed by a rose on the grey. And if I should kiss by when it all goes away. I've been kissed by a rose on the grey. Trevor was always bigger on the orchestra. Yeah, I like to be a orchestra. Betsy Kuk, who's a really great writer. She came in and we were working on Kiss Maraudes. She's a great keyboard player and she went, God, I love this song.
Then she left and then she came running back five minutes late and said, I've got an idea for a string part on this. Can I show you what it is? I had a keyboard there and she was playing MIDI strings and I just recorded the MIDI strings into a computer. Then we got the strings. I think there's only 30 strings. It's not like a 60-piece orchestra, but they're all the best players. I've been kissed by a rose on the grey. I've been kissed by a rose.
When you have an orchestra that can do that, move organically. God, that is a very, very unique type of luxury for a singer. There is so much I can tell you, so much you can say, you remain my power, my pleasure, my pain. Seals always like French horn. It's a beautiful instrument. Oh, well, it's a beautiful instrument too. Trevor used to get me to sing each part, the harmonies, eight times. And in those days, there was no auto tune.
So Trevor got me to sing that harmony in terms of tightness and pitch. He would get me to sing it eight times until I got one that was possible. And he'd got, okay, great. Now track to that. I've been kissed by a rose on the grey. Oh, the stranger it feels, yeah. You don't meet many people who can knock off harmonies, who've got two octaves and can sing soft and hard. And can remember how they phrase something. It does take a certain talent to do it. And Seal was just really good at it.
And the payoff is when you come into the studio and you split them left and right and you put them all up together. And you just hear this beautiful lush sound. Kiss from a rose was, it was the fourth single released from the second album. It didn't easily slot into any genre. It went in the charts around 60 dropped to 80 something the next week and it was out. DJs barely played it. No one really understood it, I guess. And no one heard it.
But what happened was Seal started to be managed by a guy called Bob Cavallo. And Bob was really good friends with Joel Schumacher, who had just directed the Batman movie. Joel Schumacher, God bless him. It didn't fit in the love scene that he was trying to put the song in. But he loved the song so much. He just stuck it on the end credits. And so when people went to go and see the movie, the last thing they heard when they were leaving the theater was, baby!
And then Joel got me down to the studio lot where they shot a lot of the movie and stuck me in front of the bat light. And he intercut it with scenes from the movie. And so once we got our foot in the door with this juggernaut of a movie and this great video on MTV, then it had the legs, then it had the staying power. That was what was so funny about it in the end because in the end when we got Grammy for Single of the Year, it had been played on every kind of station.
It was always a great record. The only difference is that people got to hear it. There's a lot of luck involved. One could argue that you create that luck. But whatever. Nonetheless, you do need that win for. You do need that bit of luck. And Joel Schumacher and Bob Cavallo had the foresight to find a way to get that song heard. I was broke, I was struggling to be heard. But then when I met Trevor, I found the one guy who not only heard me but knew exactly what to do with my voice.
I can't emphasize enough the importance of finding that one person who sees you and hears you and who gets you. I think it's a good song, but I think it's a great record. And that's not to do with me. That's to do with Trevor and the people that put that record together. As an artist and producer, if you're lucky, you get one life-defining song in your career. If you're lucky, you get one. And Kiss from a Rose's mind. And now, here's Kiss from a Rose by Seal in its entirety.
I used to be a graying tower, well known on the sea. You became the light on the dark side of me. I loved remains a draw less than higher than the hill, but did you know that when it snowed, my eyes become a lot than the light that you shine can be seen. I can't wait to kiss from a Rose on the beach. And now that your Rose is in the room, I like it to the blue moon again. There is so much I can tell you, so much you can say. You remain my power, my pleasure, my pain, baby.
I loved to be a rocker, but I loved to be a rocker. And now, here's Kiss from a Rose by Seal in its entirety. I can't wait to kiss from a Rose on the beach. And now that your Rose is in the room, I like it to the blue moon again. I've been kissed by the Rose on the beach. I've been kissed by the Rose on the beach. And now that your Rose is in the room, I like it to the blue moon again. And now that your Rose is in the room, I like it to the blue moon again.
And now that your Rose is in the room, I like it to the blue moon again. And now that your Rose is in the room, I like it to the blue moon again. And now that your Rose is in the room, I like it to the blue moon again. And now that your Rose is in the room, I like it to the blue moon again. And now that your Rose is in the room, I like it to the blue moon again. For more, visit songexploder.net. You'll find links to buy or stream Kiss from a Rose.
And you can watch the music video that features Seal singing in front of the Vat signal. This episode of Song Exploder was made by me, Craig Ealy, Kathleen Smith, and Mary Dolan. The episode artwork is by Carlos Larma, and I made the show's The Music and Logo. Song Exploder is a proud member of Radio Topia from PRX, a network of independent listener supported artist-owned podcasts. You can learn more about our shows at radiotopia.fm.
You can follow me on Twitter and Instagram at RishiHairway, and you can follow the show at Song Exploder. You can also get a Song Exploder t-shirt at songexploder.net slash shirt. I'm Rishi K. Shairway. Thanks for listening. Radio Topia from PRX.