You're listening to Song Exploder, where musicians take apart their songs and piece by piece, tell the story of how they were made. I'm Rishikesh Hirway. I'm Hardwired to Self-Distract. In this episode, the song Moth into Flame gets taken apart by singer and guitarist James Hetfield and drummer Lars Ulrich. I'm letting you in a lot of trade secrets here. I've never really talked about this stuff in this detail. It's Metallica on Song Exploder. I am Lars Ulrich and I am the drummer of Metallica.
James here, singer, rhythm guitar player Metallica. About two summers ago in 2014, I was given an iPod by our on the road engineer that has about 1500 ideas on it, accumulated from sound checks. Just warming up on the guitar or even just rehearsing or just getting an idea and I just hummed the riff into the tape. And there was a band that went in and out. There's nothing that happens in this band these days that's not recorded.
And then I kind of step back at that point. I've written the riff. I've done my part with that. I need some fresh ears to hear what's got potential and what doesn't. I spent a lot of time listening to that iPod and I presented James with my first pass at what I thought were potential main riffs for the next record. I have a trust in Lars because he's got a really good musical ear and he's a drummer. He hears the riff differently than I do. He's pretty good at picking out some of the best stuff.
There may have been 20 or 30 that I flagged and one of them was called plow. Why was it called plow? I think it had that feeling of just it could push through anything. It's like, okay, nothing's going to stop this riff. Every single song we do starts with just that, a riff. We have a fairly traditional view of songwriting. We always try to build what we call a cycle. So a main riff, a verse bridge and a chorus. That's a cycle.
A lot of what we do in our songwriting is kind of taking riffs, basically like a puzzle, just trying to connect them. There's a busier one. One that sort of moves around and has kind of more notes. And then a simpler one where the emphasis is kind of on the right hand, on the downpicking. So there were two of these riffs that sort of lived together. The busier one and the simpler one. And so we were kind of jamming on these two riffs.
And it just felt like there was kind of the cornerstone of a Metallica song. We had spent the better part of a couple of decades kind of running away from what we were doing. But Reg Rubin eight, nine, ten years ago, when we started doing stuff with him, he encouraged us to feel okay with referencing our set. And Rick encouraged us to embrace what we've been doing in the past and feel good about it.
So putting this song together, we're thinking old school. Old school as like I think disposable heroes. That's a song from back in the day. That was just a reference. Like how did we arrange that song? What did we do? What makes that song work so good? In disposable heroes, before the chorus, there's a guitar melody that comes in and plays kind of by itself to break up. So it's not just continuous vocals. So we thought maybe that kind of an idea that would be applicable in this song.
So in the pre-chorus, there's that kind of melody, that Kirk plays based loosely on the similar thing in disposable heroes. You'll hear that Cycle 3 has a different sound because I felt that it should maybe get a little more electric or a little crazier. So we re-recorded that melody in the third cycle with his solo sound. You try to keep, as you go along in a song to keep having an additional dynamic and additional thing, something that takes it to a different place, even if it's the same part.
We're all living in the Bay Area. And we made the decision that we wanted to make this record start to finish at home. HQ as a rehearsal space in the Bay Area that we used to rehearse at all the time. When we would go show up and rehearse there, you know, Journey was on the other side of the wall rehearsing something and people selling pot over there. There was people squatting upstairs. It was kind of a hang. And around 2001, we decided that that was a place that we wanted to purchase.
It's not a beautiful space. It's very warehouse district. But when you walk inside, it's just a really comfortable, safe sanctuary for all of us. So we all feel good there. And we're able to feel really creative. We drop the kids to school at 815, 830 down at the studio at 845. And then we'll work till 2 o'clock. So we've got to go pick the kids up and start driving them around to all their afternoon activities and all that stuff.
The time is too precious. And we spend enough time touring and traveling. And then we just want to be there to see the kids grow up and all that stuff. So it's like we have to be home. The two tracking rooms at HQ are really big. So it gives you the options of many different sort of miking approaches. It's like, okay, here's some close mics. Here's some overheads. Here's some ambient mics in a different time zone. But on this record, we wanted the drums to be a little bit bigger.
My good buddy, Brian, who's the drummer in Mastodon, they toured with us for years on Death Magnetic. And I would sit and watch and play all these crazy drum fills. Calling like the Mastodon drum fills. Occasionally, I get an urge to try to at least step in his direction. Doesn't happen often. But once in a while, I have fun with doing that. One take. So I've got this riff in my head and it plays over and over. And all of a sudden, a vocal line comes up.
When he starts getting the vocals, first there's a melody. There's the vocal melody. The last thing that happens is lyrics. My voice is a percussive instrument. And then I put meaning to it. I locked out. Pop green and fed up in the screams, crashed in the silence. At first, it was like the anti-rock star song, Shunning Fame. Like it's an evil drug. You know, it's something I need to be absent from. Light it up. All light it up. Another hit or races of a pain.
You know, we've seen lots of friends just go because of the excesses out there, the escapes. You know, it takes lives that shouldn't have been taken, that could still be extremely talented and creative people. Anyone who's in the spotlight or in the public eye has potential to go down a dark, ugly, lonesome path at the end. I've grown up being in the spotlight basically from like 18 on. I don't know what it's like to go hang out in a festival just in the middle of it all and just enjoy it.
And I got lost in drink and the other excesses of the road. You can get lost in that and forget why you're doing stuff. It's a complete loss of reality. Deck it and set. Deck the V in. This is the path we stops to spiral. There's no doubt I'm daily saved by music and also daily challenged by the effects of music. Same ride that fall. Who cares that all? Seduced by fame. I'm off into the flame. This saves my life daily. This is therapy for me. We're writing these songs because we need them.
We need them to express ourselves. We need them to hear to make ourselves feel better. You know, and when I write lyrics out and other people enjoy them that gives a sense of OK. It's OK. I'm going to be all right. And now here's Moth into Flame by Metallica in its entirety. This is the path we stop to spiral. In for me, all forms of publicity destruction go in spiral. Line it up. Line it up. Another little reason for flame. Pull it through. I kill a troop.
We're falling but we think you're flying high. We're getting higher. So this war will fly more yesterday. Now you're thrown away. Same ride that fall. Who cares that all? This is the life of a few years. This is the life of a few years. This is the life of a few years. We're getting higher. This is the path we stop to spiral. I kill a troop. Line it up. Line it up. Another little reason for flame. Pull it through. I kill a troop. We're falling but we think you're flying high.
We're getting higher. So this war will fly more yesterday. Now you're thrown away. Same ride that fall. Who cares that all? This is the life of a few years. I'm off to do the flame burn. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. Now you're thrown away. Now you're thrown away. That scene brings us the murdering to build some more destruction. So this war will fly more yesterday. Now you're thrown away. Same ride that fall. Who cares that all?
This is the life of a few years. I think you're thrown away. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop. I kill a troop.