Butch Harmon

all the Live conspiracy theories. There's a lot of crazy shit out there. But UM, really excited to be back. You guys know the drill. We're going to have great guests, golfers, people that love golf, and hopefully you'll get better by listening. I always say golf is a pretty simple game that

confusedes smart people. And one of the things UH, A lot of the feedback that I got UH from last year's UM podcast was UM that we had great guests, and I just can't thank everyone enough for listening because listen. I didn't think the podcast was was going to take off, and the fact that I didn't do it. I was constantly getting messages saying where's the podcast? So it's back. And if you're gonna have a podcast named Son of a Butch, who better to have his first guests if

your dad's name is Butch Harmon than Butch Harmon. Um. Last time we talked to my dad on the podcast, I think it was the week after the Masters, and how the golf landscape has changed. He's got some great takes on kind of where we are today. We talk about all the major champions. Uh, just such an amazing year in the majors, and uh, maybe talk about the future of where golf is going. So the Son of a Butcher podcast first episode, sit back and enjoy listening

to the legend that is Butch Harmon. So the obvious choice for the first guest of the new launch of the podcast um is Butch Harmon. If I'd told you at augusta National Scottie Shuffler has just played unbelievable. He's won his first green jacket and then he he starts out and then we have what we have now as the Gulf landscape, which you've believed that golf would be where it is today, No, I think I wouldn't believe

the chaos that's going on. There's a lot of that is you know, you you're you're kind of involved that with a couple of players as you teach, and you know, just life moves on in different challenges you're thrown out there and this is kind of a big one. We're

gonna have to wait and see what happens. And I just think the parties, both parties on both sides, the live side, the pgate tours side, and they take a deep breath and say, hey, look, let's just try and get along and let's let's see what we can do to make this work. And until that happens, I think this is all going to be a bunch of turmoil. You and I have talked about this before. I think there's gonna be some more guys switch over. Who they are,

I don't know. You hear all the routenents, but until they do, we won't know. And I think if any of the bigger, younger stars switch over, and then I think the tour is going to have to somehow are some some way try and get along. Uh Interestingly enough, now they're coming up with all these new plans to pump up prize money very similar to what the Live is all these different things and selling them so forth. So it's I don't know. I think it reminds me

a lot of politics. Uh these days, both parties are going this way instead of coming this way. And so you've been good friends with Greg Norman for you know, a better part of thirty years. You coached him, You helped make him, you know, get him back to number one in the world, he helped him win a major. Um, I know you consider him a friend. You also played the PGA Tour. It was your home as a player, and it was your home as a coach for the

better part of thirty years. Um. Do you think there's a way that this moves forward and we end up with the Live guys doing their thing and the PGA Tour doing their thing. Do you think there's a way that they can come together or do you think that ship has already sailed? Well, I would hope there's a way they could come together. I think for the betterment of the game. And it doesn't hurt to have two different leads. I mean, I gotta give you an example.

When I went to my Q school in nineteen sixty eight, the players broke away from the PGA of America and there was two c schools, and I can remember asking my dad which one do I go to? The one with the players are the ones with the PJA of American. He says, you always go where the players going, So I did so I went through a little bit of this myself at that point in time. Nothing like this though called because of the money that's been thrown around.

Look Great had this idea twenty seven years ago and he approached it. He had a TV contract, he had a bunch of big stars signed up, and all of a sudden, the tour got ahead of it and uh and it went away. So he's always had the this idea in his head that he would like to get this done. Now, this opportunity came along, and the salities came along with their idea, and Greg is involved big time.

And you know, I think at this point in time, and I know both the commissioner Minaham and Greg Norman, I think they both need to put their egos aside and let's look at what's best for the game and then try and get together because, as you know, you're involved with lib Twitter more than I. I don't know anything around except what I read you. You you're out there on it. It's not going away. It's here to stay. So let's figure out a way to make it work.

You know. I think the sad thing is we you know, if you look at the were going into the Tour Championship,

so the PGH Tour schedule has run its course. Uh, if you look at the four majors this year, Dad, Scottie Scheffler, Justin Thomas, Matt Fitzpatrick camp Smith, I mean I think the thing that's I think a lot of people feel like the golf is being overshadowed because if you look at the way those four majors were one and if you look at the golf played by those four players, I mean it was some it was some

unbelievable golf. I mean, well the most recent one, I thought, the way camp Smith performed at the Open Championship down the stretch was unbelievable golf, no doubt about it. And and look at the Sean Patrick Kpatrick hit on the seventy second hall at the Country coming book on from a fairway bunker with a lip in front of one of the find the shots you'll ever see under pressure hit. So you're right, The four Majors were very exciting. I agree.

I think the strange thing I'm seeing and what's going on is because of the known quote unquote known stupor superstars that the Dustin Johnson the books kept, because the speeds that Justin Thomas's, these guys, uh, they haven't been up there on the leaderboards for a while, so all these young guys are getting a chance and they're coming along.

They're fantastic players, as you and I know, unbelievable players, but the tour is driven by star power, and the stars that everybody knew are not quite there at the moment, so you're seeing all the young guys you. I feel sorry for Scottie Sheffer. He has had a phenomenal year, just beyond belief. What a great year he's had in a time when there's so many good players. But I guarantee you, if you went to any golf tournament and said who's the number one player in the world, nobody

would know it's Scottie Sheffer. And that's sad yeh ask for you. I thought, um, you mentioned Matt Fitzpatrick at the US open Um. I've I've watched a lot of golf as you have, and you watch these players, dad, when you're on tour, you watch, even if you don't work with them, you watch their work ethic, You watch how hard their work. I gotta be honest with you.

I mean, I don't know if I've seen a kid work harder day in day out than Matt Fitzpatrick does on on all parts of his game, from his short game to his putting, to his full swing, to his fitness. Um in an age to where length is so hugely, hugely important, Um, do you think it's good for the professional game that a guy like Matt Fitzpatrick just through standing up, hitting shots, hitting the right shots at the right time, making the right pots on a difficult golf course. Um,

you know, Brookline is not an easy golf course. But I think that is a really good thing for professional golf that players light met Fitzpatrick win majors because all we hear is if you don't have length, you can't win well. First of all, match fast. Fitzpatrick has done everything to make himself better from where he won the US Amate threw years ago to where he is now, He's a completely different player. I think he's a different player this year than he was a year ago. He

hits the ball further. He's done a lot of speed training. Uh. He has done everything he can to get the best out of his ability in a way. And this is not a put down to Matt Fitzpatrick. He could almost say he's a little bit of an overachiever in modern day golf because he doesn't hit it three hundred six e r's off the tea. He doesn't do the things a lot. He's a little guy, he's not a big guy. He's got a great caddy and Billy Foster, one of the best caddies in the history of the game, who

has helped him tremendously. And I gotta take my hat off to him. I admire him. I think it's phenomenal what he's done. And it just shows you what can be done by these young players today. And there's so many of them, claud it. It's why I said it a little while ago. The tour is driven by star power with a big, big name. Star power isn't quite there at the moment, but they're still out there. But these young kids coming on, my gosh, they can play, have you um? I mean, I haven't seen anybody put

the way camps. It puts under pressure since since Tiger Woods putted like that. I mean, it's it looks like everyt of this kid's gone. He's just gonna and they're all going down. They're going right in the middle of the hole. They're not They're not side door in it. They're going in the middle of the hole. He's got exactly what Tiger Woods had. Everybody hits has to go in. Look if it doesn't go in, he looks like he gets wrapped. I mean the kid and he's got ice

waters in his veins. I mean, he just stands up to the plate and he his routine. The thing I like about it, and one thing I used to love about Tiger that if you put a stop watch on Tiger Woods in the very first hole, the first party hit in the first hole to the last Partty hit of the seventy second hole, it's the exact same amount of time that he took the two practice strokes. The

head looking at the whole way set up. Cam Smith does the exact same thing on every part, doesn't matter whether it's the first hold the tournament or the last hole to win. And I think the average person can learn a lot by that, so he's learned how to relax his nerves. He's got a beautiful stroke. But the one thing that people don't talk about, and these guys are the great partterns of Tiger Woods, was the best

of the world out of it. It's reading greens. You've got to be a great green reader on all different services. And camp Smith is just like Tiger. It puts phenomenal in every surface, which tells me this kid can really read greens too. Yeah. And the other thing I think that that I always marvel out and watching camp Smith when you know, when I'm out with him in in in practice rounds is his speed control on on puts

from distance. Um. That is probably one thing. And one of the announcers said it on the telecast yesterday, Um, in watching Patrick Cantley win Um, the second FedEx event. You know, Patrick had a very long pot put it up there to two feet. I don't think tour players, the great putters get enough. Everybody knows, oh the great green readers. Yeah, they got great strokes, But the ability to have that consistent speed control on greens, as you know, doubt, I mean the greens that the rest of us play

on day in and day out. Recreational is not the same that that tour players around the world are putting on. So to have that touch and feel, especially at the Open Championship at St. Andrew's, you know how big those greens are. I was really impressed with cam Smith's speed control all week. You mean, because you're gonna have long

pots at St. Andrew's, hundred footers in yards long. I mean those on some of those greens are an acre and those green are slow compared to what they are in the US because they have to keep them that way because of the wind because if the wind comes up, which it didn't at same they can blow the balls off the green. So just to get that beautiful pace

that he had over there on slow greens. You know, in the past they've always said that Americans when they went to the Open Championship they struggled on the greens because they were so much slower and stuff. But camp Smith could could put on the Interstate. This guy man he could put and like like you say, his puzzle gack, they could go in a thimble. They go right in the middle dog on hole. It's actually beautiful to watch.

And he says that in a lot of his interviews, he has no mechanical thoughts in his stroke at all. He doesn't think about anything that's happening with the putter. It's a lot of visualization, it's a lot of kind of seeing. Um. Everybody that plays golf, whether they're trying to play professionally or they're trying to play recreationally, everyone wants, needs, and tries to put better. UM. And and and we've talked in the past about putting. UM, I think there

is an art to putting. Would you agree that there? And I think people don't see it as an art. They see it as a skill that they have to practice. Um. Do you think the average golfer would be better off learning speed and green reading first and then worrying about what their stroke looks like From a technical standpoint. Absolutely, We'll look at it this way. If you can control the speed of every part you hit, whether it's online perfectly or not, you're never gonna be far from the hull.

If you made a bad right, okay, you gotta tap in. You know, you could have the most perfect line in the world and really agreed is beautifully and have bad speed, You're you're not gonna make pots. But if your speed is good and the ball is always get into the hall. Get into the hall, Get into the hall. You're never gonna a three put very much unless you just get some severe downhill slope or some going to an Undernow about that, you shouldn't hit your second shot there. That's

the key of that one. But yeah, this kid's amazing to be suet and he doesn't look like a golfer. I mean, the mullet is disgusting in the attempt at a mustache and beyond the league and things. I don't know if you've got a girlfriend, but she she needs to give him a big hug and cass. He said, Hony, of this stuff's gotta go. Um one of the guys that want to major this year that we didn't. We haven't talked about um. Justin Thomas. I thought his performance

at Southern Hills. UM. I know that when he came out on tour Um when he was a rookie, his old caddy Jimmy Johnson. Um, you said to Jimmy, if you can teach this kid to hit a wedge, this kid could be one of the best players in the world. And now I think under pressure when it counts. Justin Thomas hits some of the best three quarter hundred, two hundred and fifteen yard wedge shots that I've seen in

a long time. It was years ago with slep straits and he was playing a practice round with DJ because you were there, and I remember walking down the first stairway saying to Jimmy Johnson and a lot of people don't realize not only is a great caddy, even how the player play the South African Tour. I mean, he

knows golf. And I said to Jimmy, if you can teach this kid out of hit a three quarter shot, because if you remember, he was all out on every shot, I mean his his nine iron shots were driver contest feed. And said, if you can teach this kid how to fly his golf ball and control his distance, he's gonna be one of the best players in the world. And look, Academy is one of the best players. And he's also one of the nicest guys you could every be. Absolutely

and I think everybody wants that watch his golf. Dad. They all love that wed shot where you've got a slope behind, you've got some room behind the flag. A player hits it, you know, pass and then spins it back. That's the one that I think everybody wishes they can hit. But you, I mean you more than anybody, with all

the players, you you've looked at. One of the shots that I think Justin is is perfected is the no spin where the pin is tucked like they tuck him at Augusta to where you've got about a five yard area square. You need to throw it up on that slope and not spin it back. How the one that just one bounce and just kind of stops um. That's a hard shot to perfect, and it's a hard shot to perform under pressure. Well, first of all, you gotta take the ball out of the aar to do it.

You gotta gotta stop hitting this thing, these balloon wedge shots that you see the average person here, Yeah, the average person loves to see the back spin. The players on the tour don't real they like that. I mean they want to they want to control us. So if you watch them, they send the ball in much lower trajectory. The ball goes in, makes one bounce, checks and may

just dribble just a little. The only time you'll see a guy trying to really bring one back if there is a big slope there and they know they can carry it to the back of the green. It will come back down, but the fans love to see the spinning back. The players go, no, no, I don't want that thing spinning away from the whole, and doesn't. Justin Thomas has done a great job in controlling that. He

really has done a great job in his swing. Right now, I don't think he's playing at the best of his ability. But at the end of the year, I mean, these guys are tired. They play a lot of golf, they work hard. It's gonna be interesting to see with the news schedule what happened because they are They're obviously gonna get real time off if they want to take it, which is pretty good too. UM. Rory McElroy had an

interesting year. Um you know, a dominant performance and up in Canada where he looked like Rory McElroy and then you know, I think everybody I was at St. Andrew's UM I thought I just couldn't see him not winning another major championship at UM, an iconic venue. He has been very, very vocal in his thoughts on what's going on in golf on Live on the PGA tour um, he's kind of been the de facto mouthpiece of the

PGA tour. Do you think that's wearing him out? Do you think that physically emotionally having to constantly ask get asked these questions by the back nine on Sunday when you have a chance to win your you're using a lot of emotional capital on other things that aren't golf. One of the things I admire about Rory Manfoy, I wonder her and got a beautiful golf swing, and he's a great player. I admire his honesty. I mean he he doesn't hide his thoughts. He's very honest about what

he says. He doesn't do it in an ugly way. He doesn't do it in the mean way. He's just giving you his opinion. And because of that, he's the one they've kind of gone to all the time to get to Well, that was until Tiger Woods came into the scene with secret meeting. Sweet for twenty guys, I don't know how you got How about if you showed up wherever the meeting was he came in and you you're in the top twenty five in the world. It's

not I'm sorry you're not You're not. Yeah, I mean I'm trying to figure out how they went about that. I mean, luckily they didn't do it at a tournament where it was a full field, so there's only seventy guys in the field. But let's say you're somebody that really wanted to be involved and kind of know what's going on, so you show up at the meeting. They go, now, sorry, bro, you can't. Yeah, I don't know where to have the invitation. I mean it was done offside in a hotel and

in the meeting room. But yeah, I thought that was kind of strange. I saw one of the things that I noticed when they showed Tiger getting off his point. He was limping quite badly, which I didn't like to see because you know, we all love Tiger to get back and be able to play, so that didn't look good. And then he brought Ricky with him, who, as much as I love Ricky Feller, he wasn't involved in the conversation as far as I was continuing, hunding something in

the world. But because he's such a great guy and everybody likes and maybe that was part of the whole you know, nobody's talking about what went down. You hear rumors and stuff, but until the guys actually come out and say, well, here's what we talked about. And maybe maybe Claude, I don't know, maybe the next week after the fed Ex Cup is over, and maybe we'll hear some of these things. Maybe we'll hear some of the

things that happened there and what made him important. And going back to Rory, I admi Ory admi Ory a lot. He says what he feels. He doesn't pull any punches. He doesn't do it in an ugly way. He does it in a professional way, in a nice way. He hasn't it can shots at people. He just says, Look, I don't agree with him, but they have the right to do whatever they want, which is what the free enterprise is all about. So I admire m for it hasn't put a little pressure on him. I wouldn't say

it's put pressure on him. I think he's probably tired of getting asked the damn questions. But unfortunately, because of the fact, he's one that will actually give you an intelligent, legitimate answer, unlike some of these guys who who don't give you any answers. And I'm not gonna say any names, but you may know one. Uh you know. That's the way it is. When when Rory plays like he played in Canada, where he's just, i mean dominating with the driver.

Is he the best player in the game when he is firing on all cylinders because he he has the ability. There's two or three guys I think in the world. You know, DJ has been in that boat at times. Um, you know Tiger is in that boat. But Rory can make golf look so unbelievably easy when he is firing on all cylinders. But when he's on, I mean, it's just like when Dustin was on the Dustin's prime. When he was on, he was the player, no doubt about it.

Rory has that ability. For some reason, Rory hasn't had the ability to be as good on the weekends as he is in the in the first couple rounds, and that let me go back to what you were talking about, because I think it's the nervous system thing and how you control your nerves and stuff like that. He's far and away modern day the best driver I've ever seen. His swing is built for driving. If you look at it, it's not built to a sixty hard wedge shot. It's

built a beautiful release. I mean he had hit some drives for seventy last week. I excuse me, almost four yard, not fourth seventing, but almost card and but there's more to golf than driving. To me, the two most important things to be a really good player as good driving and good putty. Well, he's got the good driving down. He's got to work on the consistency of the putty. Now the oppst into that is Kem Smith is the best part of what He doesn't drive the ball very well,

so it's getting that out I'm talking about. Um. Another amazing performance over the weekend from Patrick Cantley. Um. When this kid gets an opportunity to win, there is no backup, there is no fear. I thought the shot he hit at seventeen were yet again another wedd shot where you

have to hit one. You're trying to get that inside it, you know, ten ft he hits it to tap in another beautiful controlled What what do you like about Patrick's game and what do you like about him as as a player, Well, I think number one, he's got a beautiful golf swing. Fundamentally, he's got a beautiful rhythm in his swing is His patting stroke is very long and smooth,

which mimics is Gosling. I think his coach, Jeremy Mulligan has done a wonderful job and letting Patrick be Patrick, not try and create a swing for him, just do what he does with his swing and make it better. He works tremendously hard on every part of his game. He minds me a lot of a Greg Norman or a Tiger Woods. The amount of time he puts in on every aspect of the game. Not just full swing, not just three quarters swing, not just part of not just tip. He does it all. He works extremely hard

on it. Uh. He doesn't playing as many tournaments as a lot of the other guys playing, and he takes his time off, which I think is good. Uh. He doesn't have the most garious personality, so I don't think the average person knows him like we know the other players because he's kind of just refined and the way he is. But I mean this, this kid can really play. And look at where he's come from. I mean he went a few years he couldn't even hardly move. His

back was so bad. Uh, he went to a terrible tragedy with his best friend was killed right in front of him. He saw it happen. I mean, this kid has gone through a lot, and I think that's why you see this Uh. I would say this kind of smoothed down demeanor that he has, he doesn't let things bother me. You don't see a lot of high you don't see a lot of loads, you don't see a lot of smiles, you don't see a lot of anger. He goes about his business very well. He's got a

great head on his shoulder for golf. He understands the golf courses that he prepares beautifully for him player and another player. Um, even though he had to pull out last week with a back injury. Wills Alaturus. You know when when you spend as much time as we spend on the tours around the world, you see young players where they get close, they have opportunities. Um. Everybody can see that they can win golf tournaments. They should be winning golf tournaments. UM. It took Will a little bit

longer to get his first one. UM, but very very impressive as a player. And you know he's part of that new generation of players, Dad that comes out. They come out of college. There's no learning curve, there's no apprentice shift. They come out they have chanced. Cam Young is another one of these guys that have just burst

onto the scene and it looks like they belong. And it looks to me when you're around them that even though they haven't had the length of time on tour than other players, it looks like they feel like they belong in their first or second year. Why they can see what you're seeing is how wonderful the college system is. I mean, the college system is like Triple A Baseball League Baseball. I mean, they're they're they're groomed for this.

They come out of college programs. Most of them only stay a couple of years, but they come out of college programs and they're ready to play. They walk on the tour, unlike guys like myself back in the sixties came on the tour and we were intimidated by the great players and stuff. You would tell yourself you weren't. But when you get older and you look back on it, you say, heck, can you get paired one of the best players in the world and you're nervous and how

do I handle this? And things like that these guys they've they've got ice water in their mains. They just come out. They know they're good, they know their strengths. They all work hard. They work harder thing. And you know, I think Dela Tours gets a bad rap about being a bad putter. You know that bad did has missed some sort puts at various times. And you know Jordan's speech, this is two putters sometimes everybody talks about about. Yeah,

I don't think he puts that bad. Yeah, it's a weird looking set up, the way he sets up the way he goes about it. But you can't win tournaments and compete in majors like he has. My god, how many seconds and thirds has he had already? You know, you be able to make putts. I just think it's what's gonna happen. Caud Is he's gonna win one of these and it's going to be a snowball going down here. Is he's just gonna take her. He's gonna do somewilar what Scottie Shefford done. He's gonna get a taste to

win in. And Sheffard is another one who's a really good putter. He's gonna get a taste to win, and he's gonna get a taste to feel uncomfortable in that position. And sometimes you need a break to win. Sometimes you need something to happen to one of the other guys in a tournament. It's not good, it's been happening to you. And so I think this kid has got a great future. I mean, he's skinny, he looks like a one rond

without a grip from kids. Unbelievable he and yet he cannot the heck at well, they all knock the heck Catt. But he's good. Whether he's going to turn it to be one of the great ones, time will tell. But he has the tools that I thought. He showed a lot of mental maturity. You know, in the playoff in Memphis for the first FedEx Um he gets unbelievably lucky late in the playoff for the ball not to go in the water, SEPs track of rinses it in the water. He and his new caddy Um go over. They look

at their options. I mean a lot of people would have said, I'm gonna try and pull this off. Um a lot of maturity to go back to the drop zone and then stand up and again hit one of those wet shots that we were talking about earlier, a hundred and some odd yard wet shot that took one bounce, sat down and it gave him, you know, six ft

for the wind. Right. What he did, he trusted his ability, He knew what his strengths were, He knew that, he knew that yardage was good for the way he likes to go about it, and it was perfect and once again, under pressure, he handled the situation. He did exactly what he had to do. It's Tiger going into a new phase in his life, Dad professionally, Um into that kind of Jack and Arnie role that Arnold had when he was still alive, to where they kind of were golf, right,

they were professional golf. I mean, I know you. Arnold Palmer was your hero growing up. Um, you idolized him. Um, you've been a huge fan of Jack. You you spent a lot of time with both of them. I think when they were both alive, they were kind of seen as the professional game. Um, is that the role you think Tigers going towards. Do you think he's being pushed towards that role? Do you think it's a role that

he wants, Because let's be honest. I mean, there are a lot of people behind the scene saying, okay, now Tiger is gonna go. And you know you heard that Justin Thomas and Roy said, Tiger cares passionately about the PGA Tour. But Dad, you worked for tigraphy years. Tiger never went to the locker room. He never went to the players lounge. He probably if you looked at the amount of people he consistently and religiously played practice round with in his career. In the early days, it was

Marco Mira and John Cook. Was a very small group of people. And then he played practice around with Bubba, he played with Arginette. Well, now he plays a lot of his practice rounds with Justin. But it's not like Tiger rocks up and anybody can play with him. Um, he didn't interact right when you were around him. He Tiger didn't really interact with anyone else on tour. Tiger

did his thing. So now this role that I think a lot of people who are big fans of the PGA Tour they want him to be this role kind of the de facto face of it. Um, how do you think this plays out for for Tiger? Well, first of all Tiger knew, but he had to be and how he had to be to be the greatest player in the world. And that's how he was. He got in his world and he didn't care for anybody else was and all you people are going to get in it. It's so the few he would let it into it.

And so, yes, he didn't spend a lot of time in the locker room. The guys will tell you and all that he was fun to be around the locker room. That he's always giving it everybody a bunch of ship. He can't take it when they gave it back, he he cannot take it. But having said that, I think that you look at him as yes, all the young players look up to him. They all look up to him. If you look at the ten or twelve best young players in the world in their twenties, they are only

on the tour because of Tiger Woods. Because when they were five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve, Tiger Woods was the man and they all wanted to be like him. So I think he carries a tremendous amount of respect among the young players. And I think if you I don't know who went to that meeting, but I bet there wasn't a lot of old ones in there, but most of them were the younger ones, the younger superstars that are in there. And I think he relishes

that role. I think it is a new time in his life. Yes, he would love to compete and win tournaments, that's what he's all about. But I think he likes the fact and and I don't know, only he knows, and the commissioner knows. Did the commissioner asked him to go do this or because this was a player's meeting, commissioner wasn't There was this Tiger's idea. Once again, I don't know how it all came about, but I things

like this are good. You see players in baseball and football and basketball things aren't going right, so they have a players meeting. I'll get everybody out of here, to press out of here, all coaches out of here, Manager is everybody out of here. We're gonna talk this over. And I think they probably talked over what's been going on? What, what what avenue do we have to approach. I'm not sure that a lot of them agreed with the fact. We just can't admit they exist because they're out there.

So we have to figure out how we can all work together and make it good for all of us. And I think that if that's what that meeting was about, and I have to believe it was, I think that was good for the game because you need to have the players get together, not the not the managers, not the tour staff, not any of these. The players are the show. Other people are not the show. I'm sorry. I don't mean to put anybody else down, but the players of the show. The players play, they like. The

players don't play, Nobody likes it. And so I think it was a good meeting. I'd love to hear what really happened, whether we ever will hear that, and and I don't know, but somebody all leak it Sunday. I think it's interesting that that you bring up the point that the players are the show. I mean, I've always thought that at times the p G A tour can come across that they think that they are the show. With this constant we provide this opportunity for you, We

provide all these tournaments. Which is true, you played the tour, you had an opportunity to do it. You did not start flying around on private jets like Jack and Arnold did off of your tour career because you didn't play well enough. So this argument that I think sometimes the tour puts out that we provide this stage for you, But I mean, I live in Jupiter. There's I see guys that played on the PGA Tour at shopping malls, grocery stores all the time that are just normal people.

Now they don't have a tour card anymore. The tour isn't calling them to find out how they are, how they're doing, anything that we can do to help you. If if you get an opportunity to play on the PGA Tour, you are only successful by what you do as a player, nothing else. Well, the tour is driven by the star power. There's no doubt about it. My dad, my dad had a great day. You were very kind to say I didn't play good to make you know how, didn't come close to me when I got out there,

and that was about it. My dad had a great line about me. He just called me a hot dog, bro And I said that, what why do you call me a hot dog? Coach said, it's very simple, but you're a tournament. Three old guys sitting behind the green, they got their program out and there these great players have coming through. So who's in the next group? He said, we got Butch Harmon and Joe Jones and Sammy Sauce. Is not hell? There no good. Let's go get a

hot dog. Yeah, there's that's all the outdog, bro. But the tour is driven by the stars, and the tour sometimes thinks it's all about that. Yes, they're the body that gives them the opportunity. But I think one of the things in this meeting and they talked about I think they talked about was I'm a firm believer, but everybody that qualifies for tournaments should get paid because here's the problem. It's costing your five to ten thousand a

week to play on these tournaments. And he missed the time, you don't get any money. I don't think that's right. I mean, you signed a contract in baseball for four hundred million and you've got you still get to four hundred millions. So I think that was one of the things that we've talked about. Let's make it where everybody

can at least make some money on this deal. And then we I'm sure they talked about we need the bigger tournaments with more money and stuff, and and all of a sudden, the tours found a hundred million and it looks like they're gonna find another hundred millions. So it's coming from somewhere. But you know, like I said to start off with, we'll get this crap all worked out. A mention guaranteed money has been something that everybody's talked about. You know, the live guys, the big guys, Phil d J,

Bryson Brooks. Um, they've been given a lot of money. Um. Some people have a big problem with that. Um. In sports dad, Um, you know, Lebron James just signed a close to two year, hundred million dollar contract. I don't think he's going to practice any less. Dak Prescott signed a huge new contract last year with the Cowboys. I

don't think he's taken any days off. It seems to me at times that we want golf, especially both professionally and recreationally, that we wanted to not evolve, That we want it to be like it was back in the day, you know, and the forties, fifties, sixties. Um. Frank Nabolos said something to me one time about when he used to do live from from the PGA Tour, from the Majors, whatever.

When he would sit with Brandle and UM the guys on set, he said, you know, half the time when we're at a major championship, we devote half the show to talking about things that happened in the past. Why don't we spend the majority of the time on the show talking about golf today. Guaranteed money is something that you know everybody has as an athlete. Um, why do you think there has been this outcry of the guys that went to Live and people say, oh, you just

you went for the money. It's guaranteed you're not gonna play, You're not going to practice. Where do you think that comes from? Just because of the way it's always been. No, I I have a very clear way of thinking on this. I think the players that went to the Lift, and you're probably not gonna agree with me on this, they created the problem because they went for the money. There's no doubt about it. Let's just b s about I'm gonna play last and I'm gonna spend more time at home.

And I said, no, you went for the money. So just say that because the average guy that works, if somebody is in a job and somebody comes up and said, I'm gonna give you twenty times more money to come over here. They're gonna go over there and then they're gonna tell their their buddies say, yeah, they offered me more money. I went. So that to me, that's the first problem. I think the pr of the lift has not been good. The guys should have got together and

be be honest. I think Pat Perez is the only one that says, yeah, right, I went for the money and forty six, forty seven years old, that offering me x y Z I'm going. I think if you asked Peter you Lind the same thing, he'd say, yeah, I'm going And so just come out and say just tell it like it is, as we went for the money. This I'm going to grow the game better. No, that has nothing to do with it not growing any game.

They're they're growing their bank accounts, which every sport sportsman has the right to do to get the best deal you can get. So I have a problem with people complaining about that, but I think they brought that on themselves by coming up with this other stuff. Secondly, the thing that really bothers me is that the public and I'm not going to say I'm pro or anti lib. The public is coming out against these live guys because it's a Saudi run thing. Our government does Scautity Arabia.

Every large corporation in the world doesn't Business Society Arabia. And so why they're picking on golfers. I have no idea. It offers to me have been the most underpaid superstars in all sports because they don't get big contracts. Yes, they make endorsement contracts, but you have to earn those and as soon as you play those go away professional

athletes they signed these contracts. I mean, the Cleveland Brown has just signed a quarterback and pay them almost five hundred million dollars and the money is guaranteed, and and he's just he's a SAX offender and could go to jail. I mean, so why are you picking on us? The office are nice guys. We don't bother anybody. We just go play golf. And yeah, the guy had a chance to make a hundred million dollars that day. What somebody offered me a hundred million dollars, I'm gone, I'm over.

I mean, let's just tell it like it is. Um. Another guy that's that's been a part of this controversy. Dad Um, who you spent a lot of time with, who I think you consider a friend as well, Phil Mickelson. Um has been hard to watch Um some of the stuff that fills going through because you more than anybody who spent you know, as much time almost ten years with Phil Um, he can shoot himself in the foot better than anybody. Well, it feels very honest. I mean,

he's got no filter. That's one of the things I admired about one thing, one of the reasons we were friends, because I've got a lot of that in myself too, where we think you don't You don't have a lot of filter. What we think is what we say. And I think in all honestly, I'm gonna get film some credit. People didn't like about a lot of things he said about the tour. I think we're true, and I think the tour is now seen and and they're trying to change a lot of that stuff. So you gotta hand

to feel for that. He has taken a tremendous amount of criticism for you know, there's things that have come out about him and his personal life that he hasn't done it and Hey, look, we all make mistakes. Nobody's perfect, all right, yuh, we all make mistakes. There's things in our past ist but I think bygones should be gude, by God, let the field this go on and be filed. Feels about fifty two years old. Now he want to met a major fifty one, which is absolutely amazing, one

of the greatest feats of all time. He had an opportunity to do what he did, to sign for The number that I heard was two hundred million. I don't know if that's the number of number somebody offers you two hundred million dollars. I'll give damn who you are. You're going on, right, and what are the parameters are? There's two hundred million? What do I have to do? Yeah,

I can do that. I can play golf. Now. I wish it was playing better, and I know he wishes he was playing better, and I know how hard he works. He's working at it. So I'd like to see him play a little better and be a superstar out there on the limb, because right now he's just one of the forty eight guys. Do you like, um, tell me some of the things you like about what Live is doing. And tell me some of the things that you don't like. I think they made it a lot more relaxed atmosphere. Well,

obviously the guys already getting paid. The guys are still competitors. You know. People say, well then they're not hungry, Sure they are. It's four million dollars. First pride, you wait for the money, so you're still gonna go for the four million. I mean, I like the amount of money that they put out there. I don't like it it's only forty eight guys. I wish it was more players, and like, what would be so for you? What would

be an ideal amount for you? Because we hear about lives only forty eight guys, but last week we've got seventy. This week we've got thirty tigers event in the Bahamas Hero there's eighteen guys in that. The old World Match Play that they used to have in London was a very limited field. There have always been tournaments done to where the fields are limited. I like, I like sixty. I think sixty is a good number. I think you, I think you could probably still do the shotgown starts

with sixty. It might be harder to do, but you could do that I didn't like the shotgun starts. You tell me that the guys love it because they say everybody's playing on the same playing field at the same time, which is very good. The only problem I have with it is, let's say I'm leading the tournament by one and you're one behind, and you're finishing on an easy hole and I'm finishing on the hardest haul of the course and I make boat, you make Bertie, and we

get a clipped. Now, that hasn't happened, but it could happen. You know that that's a possibility. Could happen. The players seem to like the shotgowns start because they said they're all playing in the same weather, same conditions. Greens are the same. Yeah, everything's the same. So the wind blowing the same on every hall, I mean, so they I can see where they like that. I would like to see sixty players, I think would be good. I don't know why they went to three rounds. That's the biggest

question mark for me. I haven't read anything about why they went through. I know that's what l I V stands for. Its roll maneubals for fifty four, but a lot of people don't know that Actually, I'm such a math genius and that's a but I'd like to see him go to sixty. I think he could bring over

a lot more players get involved. I don't think it's a You're never gonna hurt these guys with money, because if they need some money, they're just pump another well for five minutes and covers the whole tour, so you know they're not gonna run out of cash. Uh. But the whole live thing, and you know more about this than I do, card because you've been out there, You've been at every event. You get two players if you coach that are on it. Uh. I think we just

have to see what's gonna happen. I think that the governing bodies European Tour, PGA Tour. For me, there's a way to coexists and here here, here's my way of Sorright. So you you get in a room right now with Greg Dorman and Jayme onhand, and someone asks you to be the moderator between the two of them. Okay, what advice are you given to Greg and what advice are you giving to j to try and see if there's a way that this whole thing can be less destructive

and less aggressive than it is. First of all, I'd say, later he goes at the door, come in with no he goes, So let's come in with an open mind and see what we can do to make it better. That would be the first thing. The second thing I I would think if there is a way for the European Tour, the PGA Tour Live Tour to get together and have four or five huge tournaments either where participants from all three get to play. You can you can make it a hundredman field and you can do it

off world ranking. You can do anyway you want to do it. I don't care for a two amount of money because that's what it's all about. And go to iconic, fabulous golf courses around the world and have this true world event. Now that's gonna happen. Probably not, because I don't think that J Monahan is. He would even go to the media at the moment, so I think until things calm down, I don't. I've never talked to J about it, so you know, I haven't had that opportunity.

But I would love to see some kind of thing get together where it is a world advanta gigantic world event not opposed to the majors. The majors will always do the majors. They're they're ultimating golf is winning the Major. I don't care if you want twenty five tournaments in your life. You never want to major. I'm sorry you're not considered a great champion. But there's gotta be a

way that they can coexist. Because but because I said to you earlier, it's just like our two political parties that the Republican the Democrats are going this way and they're not coming this way to try and get together and do what's best for the country. And I think these two organizations have to get together and do what's best for golf. You've got a lot of friends, um, that are AUGUSTA members. Um, You've got a lot of friends, Dad,

that are real Augusta members. There are members that Augusta and then there are people that are part of the They are the gate keepers of Augusta National, the Masters, and they are part of the gate keepers of professional golf as as the governing bodies. UM. Knowing the way that Augusta and the Masters like to run their tournaments, um, you you, I know you believe they run their tournament. The Masters is the best run golf tournament. It's the

best run sporting event in sports. You've you've always had. Where do you think they shake out on this? Because currently you've got Phil, You've got DJ you've got Patrick Red, you've got Cheryl schwaltzel um am I missing any Masters champions, Sergio,

that's five. They've got fun. The last thing they want is the champions dinner and the picture that you know, you've got a picture in your office, your your your father was part of the first Champions official champions dinner in the fifties and and he was part of that, right and there's you've got a great picture in your office. The last thing that I think the powers that be in Augusta want. He's an asterisk where these great champions,

I mean feels not only in Augusta champion. I mean he's a multiple Masters winner, Bubba Watson, who's now going to live, he's six, He's won that tournament twice. Um. I don't think they want to see a tournament where they're champions. I don't think they want to be taking names off the name plates in the in the champions locker room view. No, and I don't think that's gonna happen. Look, I know a lot of the augusted members. You know, they don't talk about what goes on there. It's very

guarded and how who knows what's happening. I think they love tradition as much as any tournament, and having a former player for former champions there has always been one of their great traditions. My whole life, I've been going

there because my dad was a farmer champion. I think, what's going to happen unless there's a way that the live players can get world rankings once they fall out of the top five world and they're not on the way that you can get in, and then that's going to be a problem for the players he can't get in.

I think the champions will always be invited back. I don't foresee then there's six of them over there, so I don't see for them doing I think the tour taking these guys names off of the all time lists and stuff like that, that's very petty. It's chowish. It's like, Okay, we're in the we're in the playyard, and the guy's got all the toys and we want to play with him and gets mad at me, and he picks all those toys up and leaves and you can't have any That's kind of what I relate that. I think it's

very childish the way they've done that. These guys earn the right Look, let's use Philip Bikerson for example. Bill Michelson's one what six majors, six mates, six majors, forty five tournaments. He's a tour member for life, for life, all before the lift. How can you take that away? He gave it to him. He's a toy member for life. You tell me can't be one because he went he took his toy is away from your play are and your little piste off about it. No, I don't like that.

That's why I say I think there's too much petty stuff going on. And I don't think Augusta will get involved. Man. I think Augusta is Augusta. They will run their tournament and it is the best runs point event in the world. They will run it the way they like to run it. They'll run it with class the top fifty in the world or a tournament winner on the PGA Tour and gets in the Masters. That will always be the way it is and if you're not in the top fifty

in the world, that's your problem. But the former champions, I think will always be allowed. Do you think, um, do you think there's a way that the Live guys and the Live Tour get World ranking points so that they have an opportunity to play in this because listen, UM, it's a vote. But if you look at the people that are voting on the world rankings, UM, you Live doesn't have a seat at that table. Some of the other governing bodies do. That has a lot of seatson.

It's funny. We were in Portland at the Living It Do and UM, you know, as you mentioned, it's very weird for me because this year I was working you know, I've been working with DJ, I been working with Pat Perez, and I was working with Garrick Kego, the young South

Africa Ken. Garrick was on the PGA tour. UM, DJ and Pat made the decision to go to Live, and you know, I was trying to figure out how I was going to bounce back and forth and so Um, the Monday of the first Live event in London, UM Garret the young kids said listen, you know, I'm just going to kind of go back to doing my own thing. And so so it's not that I'm I don't want to go back on the PGA Tour. It's just the guys that I'm working with right now or on the

Live tour. So it's where that you know, like we're hired guns, right, we go where the work is. Um, we we have to go where the players are. But I'm just if you think there's a way that they can get world ranking points and so that we can have more competition, um, rightly or wrongly, I think some of the things that Greg has talked about in the past about trying to get the best players in the world together more often. I mean you've you've talked about it,

you know, privately with me for a long time. There's too many damn tournaments on the PGA Tour. I mean, so in in an ideal world for you, you know, we've got almost forty What do we have over forty tournaments on the page for you? What would be a good number of p g A Tour events twenty five thirty? Well, first of all, let's let's go to the fifty top

fifty in the world. As long as the live is playing fifty four holes, They're never going to get any world right before, So they gotta go to seventy two holes because they got the apples to apples, you can't play less holes, and so that's the first thing that would have to happen. Uh. Second of all, I don't know what what what you can do to make what you were just talking about happen. Have they pulled your credentials p A Tour taking your credential away from you?

Or will you get one next year? That would be interesting. You know, they haven't pulled my credential. But normally, I mean we're one week away, so the PGA Tour season starts in three week. I mean when when they do the wrap around? What a week or two weeks after normally? At this point I need to go through my emails and look is normally I would have gotten a critical just the PJ Tour has no idea that I'm no longer working with garat Kego. I mean, I've got a

credential on the PGA Tour. I could go to the Tour Championship today with my credential. Um, I haven't heard anything. I've heard some rumors um that one of the South African caddies. Um, that was caddying on the Champions Tour. I've heard some rumors that maybe his credential. I just I mean, you you said that earlier. It is really it seems petty. It seems like you the guys you know in pont of Bed should be worried about trying to figure out a solution as opposed to trying to

pull people credential. Were in Portland for the second Live event and that's when they pulled DJ off the all time money list. You know, DJ was third in all time money, you know, seventy seventy three thousand, seventy three million dollars seventy four million dollars or whatever it is. And somebody said something to him, and no joke true. DJ goes yeah. I mean it's kind of I mean, it's kind of petty, but he goes bro. I don't care.

It's not like I don't have the money. Yeah, it's just, you know, I think there's just I'm gonna say it for the third time. This is the last time. It reminds me of politics in our country. Both parties were probably Democrats going away from each other instead of coming towards each other. All they talked about is how bad the other person is not. Let's fix this. Fix that. They've got to come together. There has to be a meeting of the ways. There has to be put your

egos aside, let's make this thing work. And I think the Tiger meeting was probably the start of it. I don't know, Like I said, I know some of the guys that were there, but they're not talking about what went down. The Tiger meeting was probably the start of that. Let's have a players meeting, Let's see what we need to do here. Let's all get on the same page. Any of you want to go to Live, you know,

that's fine. I know Tiger has mentioned that before that he's not a fan of Live, but he doesn't hold it against anybody to win because you you know, gone for a chance to make a lot of money. He he didn't need the billion dollars. He's already you're talking. I mean, it's funny you talk about, you know, Tiger talking about where's guaranteed money? Where's the incentive? I mean, listen, I mean you and I'm at Tiger on the same day.

I think he's the greatest golfer of all time. Um, but there isn't a player currently playing that had more guaranteed cash. I mean you, you, you helped. You flew to Tiger's first event as a pro with him on a G four fifty on a private jet. He was flying on a private jet from day one. This is a guy that's had guaranteed money before he turned pro, right, and it sure as hell didn't keep him from not being the greatest player of all time. He made more

money than anybody. Yeah, I disagree with the people that say that there's no one sentive to win. A professional golfer wants to win. They have a self pride. They're not going to just go out there and let themselves go and not do their training and not or can shoot bad scores. No, that that's not who they are. They want to win. And I think there's a motivational factor there because this has been thrown around a lot.

To those forty eight guys that are playing there, they're gonna say, hey, wait, but we're gonna show you what we can do. I'm gonna stick to this right back up, bed around like you've been trying to figure it out. Mine. So this is going to motivate me to even work harder and play better. So you know, I don't. You know, I can understand because it's kind of like a corporate outing atmosphere with the parties, and I don't get the music and but all that that's going on, and the

guys are more relaxed, and hey, these are professionals. They have pride. They don't want to go out there and make a food out of himself and look bad. I guarantee it. Phil Mickelson is not happy with himself the way he's been playing. And if I don't know what Bill is doing now, because I haven't talked to him, changed his phone numbers, so I don't have his phone

number anymore. If I did, I'm guaranteed and I talked to him, he working his tail off because he doesn't like to put playing bad and looking like a bad player. Nobody's like said. So I think it's an incentive almost a thing that they can use to motivate themselves. They even get better and see better scores. Yeah, I think

I sent it to you. Somebody made up a mock up that if there was a live versus the PGA Tour Ryder Cup kind of format right now, you get Greg Norman as the captain of the live guys, you get Tigers the captain of the um the PGA Tour. And if you look at kind of how it could play out with the stars, um, you know for years the Ryder Cup. Um, Yeah, the guys liked each other. I mean didn't some of some of the guys didn't like it. But there wasn't real real beef in the

Ryder Cup, right I mean it wasn't. If there was a Ryder Cup type format now with live versus the PGA Tour, if they did it next year, I mean, there's real beef. There's a bunch of guys right now on one side they're saying they don't like these guys. The captains don't like each other. I mean it could be it could be really really interesting to watch. Yeah, and and and if there was a playoff, you'd have to have a US you have see uh stadium set up so they can side it out you want to

do And I'm betting on Greg. And that's fight Greg versus man of hand. Now that's not much of the sight. Um. Lastly, Dad, you're coming up next week on a or at the end of the end of this week, monument almost a monumental birthday, seventy nine years old. It's Um, You've had a hell of a life and a hell of a career. Um, what still motivates you? Now? I know you still work with you know players. You know you work with Gary Woodland, you work with Daniel Kaye, you work with Matt McNeely.

I think you've done a hell of a job with with Harold Varner. Um you're still doing work with Web Sinson. But what at this stage of your life, Dad, you could I mean, you don't have to work, you can do whatever you want. What still motivates you to work with these players? And and what's that like at your age? I love, I love to be around great players. I love to watch him, I love to see what they do. I love to learn from him. I love to teach,

you know, I don't. I don't teach so much to the normal players anymore because they kind of wore me out with bad swing. But I still I love the game. I love being around the game, I love being in it. I'm very frustrated that my game at the moments not real good. You know how hard I am on myself when it comes to that. So I still try and practice and work on different things. I got delete to give me a lesson that you give me a lesson.

I'm I'm just turning into Curtis Strange. I think, I think if I go, because I just I just want to play. The only good thing I can say about being seventy nine is that much easier to shoot my age one shot lower. I gotta shoot. I've done it ever since I was sixty six. So you go, what what tease do you play for them? I like to play it about sixty two hundred, sixty three hundred. How far are you carrying it in the air with the

driver right now? Maybe two fifteen. I always tell people they say, how do you how are you playing these days? Which I said, you know, I got a great short game to go, really said. The trouble is it's with my driver, doesn't doesn't? I mean? And I don't think people realize this about you. I know it pisces you off that you don't hit the golf ball further at your age. I know it just it drives you crazy. I try, I try to try to hit it further and try, you know, I just want to get the

best out of what I got. You know, I'm at the test center a couple of times in the past months and trying the new drivers. You know, can they say they go three to five hole an hour faster. I don't know what machine you're testing that on. Right with my swing, I get you that at an eight mile an hour coverage, and I have it, gonna throw it out there very far. I just played to have fun, and I planned with my buddies. I planned a few

Membory guests a year with good friends of mine. Uh, you know, I'm playing to Wingfoot's Memory Guests and in October, I'm looking forward to that. I always playing the Flaridian one I play. You know, I've got I can playing membery time to compete, you know, and I no different than any golfer. I don't like that shots That shots kissed me off because my problem is my mind knows exactly what I'm trying to do, and my body is looking at me said, who the hell are you kids kidding? No, man,

you can't do that. So I gotta the way of doing things. Billy, Billy kind of helped me a lillly. You helped me once down to flow. So I got a lot of information flying about the problem with me is I do none of the things I tell all my players to do. I don't work out, I don't stretch, I don't eat right, you know, I just I'm just me. And then then I have to go out there and perform, you know, and you have to work at it. But the game is the beating of this game is like

I got me seventy nine. It's I can still play golf. I can still enjoy myself. As you know, I became a member of my favorite course in the whole World warld County down just over there. I'm just gonna ask you, you got to take a you know, it is your favorite course. You'd wanted to be a member there forever. Jimmy Dunn, Um it was an AUGUSTA member and run seminal.

He helped you get in. UM. Why don't you tell once you tell us about you took a special golf trip that I know, UM was something that that that was pretty unique in what you were able to do well. We I became a member of two thousand and nineteen and then COVID came. You know, I was over there with some friends of mine and two that of the nineteen before I made a member. It is my favorite golf course, but I think World County Down and it's the final scoff coution. I love the place. It's a

great membership, great course. Uh so I never got to go COVID handed the trip that was organized by Jimmy Dunn and Stan Drucken Miller, a bunch of Augusta members who are good friends of mine, who happened to all the members at the Royal County Down. They decided to come out. We gotta take a bunch over for his first time in the Royal County Down, and so you know it was, it was so so so let me let me set this. Let me set the sea middle seat, uh middle seat on on a on a budget airline

and you you have like fifty five or six stops. Yeah, we had an eighty in dollar global brand new one bla blahs that you could hit wedges inside this plane. We could have putting contests. Uh yeah. I had a good seat sitting right next to my man stand rock A Miller whose plane it was. You think I'm gonna get far away from him, You're crazy. And we had a wonderful time. We stayed right there at the hotel at the course. We went up and played Port Rush and then we came back down and then played three

rounds and well kind of down. It was a quick trip. It was like a four day trip. And then we were back and it was Man, if you're donn't go and you know, somebody's got one of those hop on that damn thanks that is that is a unique situation that um, most people listening can only dream of. Uh about this cause when we landed over there and they take you out to this private area to depart the plane and everything, you know, that's this new Global. It's gigantic.

It's a big airplane and guys there, and you know how it is because I've done a sky for twenty five years. Comes this big plane landing and this guy that's in there bringing them in like this and bringing them in and okay, that's good kind of Um. The stairs come up and okay, here's they pulled this bus up and get all our stuff and get there and

there there are these two guys out there. They were, well, they're taking care of the planet, isn't I had all these guys in a billionaires getting off this plane, and these two guys say, Mr Harmon, please can we have a picture with you in front of your plane? I'm sure, I'm sure Druk love that he was gonna be crapped the whole time about it, said, where do I send

a fuel bills? You don't want that thing. I think you had a lot of great things to say, and and hopefully, um hopefully, like you said, I think maybe everybody can put on both sides, can put their egos aside, and um, you know, try and figure this thing out, because hopefully next time we talk to you will have seen some progress and maybe a little less chaos. Well, I would hope that. I hope. I hope they get together and let's let's stop fighting and let's try and

make this work free enterprise. It's just that that's what our country has founded on, that you have the right to try and do whatever you can do and do the best for you and your family, which I think is what the guys that are over live we're doing. I just hope they all get together, and I'm very curious to see how many more jump over there with you. So I think there's gonna be some big names, You're gonna do it and we'll see what happens. Well, I will give you an update um from Boston, and uh

really looking forward um to the Tour Championship this week. Um. You know there's a lot of good players playing some really really good golf late in the season. UM. I think it'd be a hell of a story with all of the guys. If can't they can win again. If you know, Scotty Scheffler can win it, um, and maybe somebody comes out of the pack, who knows, you know, Claude, our good friend Adams. Scott got in there with a

great last man. I'm so happy for Scott and got he made a great, great bunker shot on a seventy second holding get the last spot, the thirtieth spot. So happy for him because he's a great guy. And hey, hang in there, let's let's let's hope that we can get something done here and everybody get along together and dal stop. We don't need we don't need the w W E and golf. We just good, good players, good scores take care of a lot of things. Congratulations on

all your success. I'm really proud of you, Quoudy, And now how hard you worked at what you do. And you you're a wonderful young man and young what you're fifty something, you know, you three, you're young to mate. But I'm really proud of you. I love you, Thank you, I appreciate it. Thanks for coming on. You got it. So that was butch harmon and listen, you're always gonna get great takes from my dad. He's been around the game his entire life, and I thought he had some

really really interesting things to say. Listen, UM, my dad loves golf. Golf is his life. And uh, he mentioned he's going to be turning seventy nine in a few days. And um, we've had private conversations about what's going on, um, what's happening in the professional game. And you know, I'm lucky enough to be a part of the professional game, both on the PGA Tour, on the Live Tour and

all around the world. And UM, I thought that, you know, my dad had some great ideas that if if everybody could, you know, quit going to these extreme opposites and meet in the middle, I think the game would be a better place. Hopefully, uh, there will be some solutions and hopefully things will um die down and you know, a year from now maybe things look a lot different. So

no questions this week, but uh next week. The recent Open champion Ashley Bouhai, who played just an amazing round of golf, big playoff win and she wins her first major and it was really cool to talk to her about that journey, uh, from South Africa to being now a major champion. And we've got some really really good guests lines up for the future. Keep going to my social Twitter Instagram. We'll be putting up um questions, be asking who you want to hear on the podcast. But

really really excited to launch the new podcast. Want to thank everybody for listening. The Son of a Butch podcast will come to you every Wednesday. We will see you next week.