Hello, and welcome to Something to Talk About the Stella Podcast. I'm Sarah La marquand your host, and every week I sit down with some of the biggest names in the country because when Australia's celebrities are ready to talk, they come to Something to talk about. This is a big year for Natalie bar In December, she and her husband Andrew will celebrate their thirtieth wedding anniversary. Twenty twenty five also marks her twenty third year on Sunrise, making her
Australia's longest serving breakfast television anchor. As a woman who's been called quote unquote breakfast TV's greatest survivor, nat has woken up with the nation for more than two decades or while building a life with her husband and raising their two sons. Yet she insists she's much more focused on what's coming up on next week's show than on celebrating mile stones or pausing to take stock of just
how far she's come. But in today's episode, I ask her to do just that, take a minute or forty to reflect on navigating the highs and lows that come with both a stable and successful marriage and media career, and how she's navigating life as an empty nester. Nat also opens up on the unique partnership she's built with her work husband Matt Shervington, and shares an update on a few of her former on air co hosts, including
David Kosh and Samantha Armitage. Natalie Barr Welcome back to the Stellar Podcast.
It's great to be back, Sarah.
It's so good to I like you.
Said, I like the new set. It's cool.
Oh that's good. I mean that's a high compliment from somebody that works in broadcast media. They're quite comfy. It's a Friday morning while you and I are sitting here, although having said that, you've been up since three am, so it probably feels like early evening in your in your time zone.
No one. I'm going through a phase. I often go through phases where I can't sleep properly at the moment I'm getting up at one thirty, so I just get up. I lie there for a while, realize I can't sleep, and then I think stuff this, So I just get up at one thirty, I have a show and sit in the lounge room with my coffee, with my first coffee.
And on a day like that, when would you start to wilt.
Then if at all I'm right about now Okay, sorry, good time and all the good thing.
We've got the comfy chairs. Then you just go back, have a little snooze. It's all good. So one of the things that's happened officially, I think since you and I last spoke, which was at the beginning of last year, is that you have officially now become the longest serving anchor on Breakfast TV in Australia twenty three years. You have now been on Sunrise. What does that milestone mean to you?
You know, I've never been one to sort of count the milestones. I sort of almost feel a bit weird. I don't really know why. I'm just one of those people who loves still getting up even though it's a non godly hour and going in and doing the job. I get excited to do this job every single day.
I get in there and I'm reading papers and talking to the producers about what angle we're going to take on a story and what questions we should and shouldn't ask, And then of course it all changes sometimes when we're in the studio and you're in the thick of the interview and you're reading trying to read.
The facial sort of signs of someone. When you're in the.
Middle of an interview, I don't think of how long I've been doing it or how it started. That it doesn't really kind of get me going.
It's a bit like that saying life is what happens when you're making other plans.
Of course, it just happens, I know, And it's nice to reflect and then you sort of think, Okay, great, and what's in the show on Monday. Let's make it the most exciting show we've had for a Monday in a while. You just kind of get on with it, and I know we're at a great spot in the show. Chevo and I a real sweet spot. He's been on the show for a couple of years now, and we've got lots of exciting things planned for the rest of the half of the year, and the producers are working
on next year. It's just I feel like we're in a real flow. So I'm just excited for what's ahead. I'm not really looking at what came behind.
When you and I last sat down, Chervo would have been sitting alongside you for about a year. How is that dynamic with Chervo has that evolved more. At the time you described it as it was going really beautifully, but it had been a huge gamble because anyone stepping into that chair is a high risk because there's huge scrutiny and people will either then observe how they're performing in the role, but also how that changes the dynamic with everyone else on the show, most importantly of course
their co host, which is you. So yeah, as we're sitting here towards the second half of twenty twenty five hours of going with the two of.
You, fantastic Australia Love Chervo and we just get along really well. He knows how to niggle me, I know how.
To give him hates as well.
And sometimes during the news I hate to admit it, we're actually not listening to some of the news bulletins. We're actually trying to whisper to ourselves and either talk about what story is coming up or actually have a bit of a gossip.
We just get along really well.
It's going really really well, so I guess better than anyone could have hoped. It's just really really great.
Yeah.
I know you and I've talked before about times where you don't necessarily be best friends with whoever you're working with behind the scenes, all in there, but you just get on with it. But what does it add to it when there is that genuine friendship that you are even chatting during the news no offense to the fabulous news presenters, of course, exactly.
I think. I think it just helps being with someone for that long. We sit next to each other for a long time. We're on air for nearly four hours, five days a week, so it's a long relationship and you're sitting we're touching each other, our knees are virtually touching. It's a very sort of physically close relationship. And very few officers are like that, I guess very few work
relationships are like that. And then we're presenting to Australia, so we get to know each other on a really sort of I guess, a deep level, because we get to know each other's families and each other's likes and dislikes. And when someone's a bit off one day, or when someone's you know, on a high one day, or they're looking forward to the weekend, or you know they've got something coming up, or you kind of know everything that's happening in their life.
You know what not to.
Mention because they're sort of a bit sensitive about something both of us, and it's sort of like a deep dive in everyone's life.
It's a real yin and yang relationship.
It's sort of like no relationship that you have because it's obviously not as close as your family, but it's not as far away as any office relationship. So I just I love it. I love the fact that we can have such a fun work relationship and we can share that with the nation as well.
But it's also I imagine the trust net that's required because it's live TV and you've really got to know that you've got one another's backs, and if one of you is stumbling or not sure that the other one will be there, and if the other one's just really killing it, that also that person isn't threatened and is supporting them. So that trust and that intensity is probably what creates that very unique dynamic.
Do you think you're on a sort of heightened alert in that studio and you're on it for nearly four hours, so you're really alert to what's happening in front of the camera the person that you're interviewing. But you're right, you're really alert to whether you think the other person wants another question or whether they're being affected personally by what's being said, because a lot of the stuff we
do is quite emotional. You know, there are some really sad interviews and you think, oh my goodness, this is really striking my co host, or it's really striking me, and he can notice when it's affecting me, or vice versa. We've had quite a few instances where we've both thought the same thing because we've both got teenage kids, and I feel like we're on the same plane with a
lot of those thought processes. When we're interviewing someone where they may have lost someone and we both are taking it to heart so much, and you can feel the energy because we're so close to each other and the heaviness, and we're thinking, oh my goodness, this person is you know, we're deeply affected by what this person is saying. And then we get off air and we both look at each other and we've both had tears in our eyes.
We've definitely had many many moments, and that definitely brings you closer together.
That empathy that you and Chervo both have, I think is a really important trait to hold on to all the good journals I know have it, despite I think assumptions probably that people in the media don't have it. The flip side of that, of course, is when we're then trying, as you say, you come off air with
tears in your eyes, and when that spills in. I'm reminded of the moment where you did tear up on air when you were talking back in the aftermath of the Link Cafe siege in twenty fourteen, where Katrina Dawson had passed away. Now, that moment is probably the only time I remember seeing you visibly emotional on air. How did you feel in that moment, because the I know it felt I imagine I thought it was a really beautiful,
heartfelt moment. But would I be wrong to assume that you might have felt a bit uncomfortable or hard on yourself after it.
I've actually had many moments since then that I've been upset on air, and it's you don't nessar like when you've mourned someone who you've lost after the fact, maybe a year or two or five years or ten years. You don't know when it's going to come at you. We've all had that situation and it hits you and you think, where did that come from. It wasn't necessarily the anniversary. It wasn't necessarily the Mother's Day or the
Father's Day or Christmas. It was just something and sometimes you don't even know why, and it just hits you and you can't recover.
And I've had moments like that.
On air where you just feel for this person and think, I suppose like all of us. I've had many many messages where people have written into us and said, oh, I was crying in my lune room too when you interviewed that mum or that dad or that person who lost their brother. Because there are so many awful stories in the world, and.
I think.
As a journalist, you never want the story to be about you. It is not about us. So I feel bad when I get upset. But just and Shiv's the same. Sometimes we can't help it. It just gets to you. We're human too, obviously, and you try and be professional because that's the job we have. That sometimes you just feel so deeply for these people who've been through this tragic, tragic event that you can't help it.
So in that twenty three years that you've been on the show, do you think the expectations of the audience have changed in that way.
I don't know.
Look I look back and I think we've always had a big laugh Sunrise. There's a lot of old footage of us having a laugh. But lately, I think with after COVID, with the cost of living crisis, with people sort of you know, going through a lot the last few years, people tune in and they want the news, and we've found that people are coming back to particularly Free to Wear at television. You know, the stats are showing it, particularly this last year. I think people are
turning back to us. They want they want respected news, and they also want a bit of fun and that's what we're giving them. And I suppose like you're sitting around a table, you're chatting about you know, world events, and once once you get that information, then you can sit back and you can relax with a friend. That's how it feels. That's I mean, we're laughing amongst ourselves and chatting on that desk, and it's almost like the
audience is part of us. We're not we're in their lounge room, but they're sort of in our studio as well. That's how we're inviting them in and it's part of the chat. And then people DM me all the time in my Instagram messages and I chat with them and they want to know what top one I'm wearing or where the chicken recipe is and I'll find it on the website send it to them. It's a conversation. It's a community, and I think people You're right, people really
want to be part of a community. And we've got thousands and thousands and thousands of people who are part of the Sunrise community and we love that and it's growing.
When you first started on the show, you knew what the audience wanted that. I mean, there's always ratings and people would have been still writing in the old school mail bag and they wear your post and then the email thing with that literal direct line to you. Now, I mean people listen to this. I didn't know natcheck to DMS. I mean, you might start getting lots of now for what you're wearing and recipe recommendations. So hopefully you embrace.
Yourself for that.
Has your knowledge of the audience increased in that way? Do you think because of the era that we're living in, the parasocial age?
Yeah?
Absolutely, I have.
I have really interesting discussion discussions on my DMS. You know, even I do sort of like I often do cooking segments myself where I find recipes online because I'm not a great cook. I'm just like I would say, the average Aussie cook. So I get recipes onlines from a cook or a chef, and I try and replicate them in my kitchen with you know, varying degrees of success,
often failure. But I just sort of, you know, say what the recipe says, and the cook or the chef who actually wrote the recipe has not realized, you know, what is a dollop supposed to be?
Or what is it? One to two? Ta spens? Is it one or two?
You know, I try and do exactly what they say, and then they probably realize that, you know, the recipe is quite and big you us, And then lots of people end up writing in and sort of discussing recipes.
It's what we do every day.
Girls got to eat, people have got to cook their dinner, so we do it all the time, and people want to discuss their chicken recipe.
I want to ask you a little bit in a moment about your actual husband, because you know, I know you're not counting milestones, but there's one coming up there this year. But if I just stay on your on screen husband for now, we've spoken about Chervo David Kosh. Of course, you work together for so many years, had a really close relationship. Now that he's been off the show for two years, do you still keep in touch with him?
Yeah?
We do, Yeah, we do.
We catch up for lunch sometimes and you know, I congratulate him on things he's done. We text each other and you know, see what the kids, the grandkids are doing. Yeah. I think when you work with someone for a long time, Mel as well talk to Mel, I think, yeah, I think you always do that sort of thing when you've worked with someone for that long.
Yeah, you just keep in touch. So it's nice.
Is it interesting to sort of say, well, how is it like? How is his sleep routine change?
Like?
What does the day look differently to miss it? Are you at home going? Oh? I mean he's still producing content range of platform as his male of course, but that particular sitting in the living room of Australians for more than three hours a day, does that give you a bit of an insight into what it would look like if you ever leave and also find out him from you what it's still like being in the middle of it every day.
I can't think that far down the line because this job is so consuming. This job is your life. When you're in it, it's your life. There's I mean, I sort of, you know. I go to bed at seven thirty eight o'clock. I'm up at well, this morning was one thirty. Sometimes mostly it's two thirty. My lum is set for two forty, but usually I beat it. I'm up and turn it off when I'm heading down to the bathroom. I'm at my desk at three point thirty. I'm down to make up at ten past four. I'm
in the studio at quarter past five. It's very regimented. And then I'm home mid morning. I have a nap for an hour in the middle of the day. My afternoon is reading news, then making dinner.
It's pretty all consuming.
It's so much easier now that I don't have kids, you know, little kids that was you know, as you know.
That is all consuming.
If you're a working mum particularly, that's really really hard. Particularly if you're a single mom or a single parent, that's very, very hard. So I couldn't say that it was that hard, But now I feel like I can't. I can't see past what I'm doing now. I'm sort of just trying to live in the moment.
Obviously, one of your former colleagues, Samantha Armitage, she left Channel six. Yeah, and that's of course when you became co hosts at four years ago. Now, wow, it doesn't feel like that long. Well, I was going to ask you about that, but with Sam so she's at nine now and there over the summer when you were on break, she filled in on the Today Show for a few days, which I did ask Carl about earlier in the year. But for you, because you were on leave, I mean,
I don't know if you saw it. But also would that have been weird if you had been on air and then a former because I know it's a small industry, and I know that TV is musical chairs, there's musical chairs, and then there's like sitting on your lap musical chairs. That would have to be strange if you had been on Sunrise and then sam would be on Today at the same time, would.
It or No?
No?
Because I mean, look, she was really happy to leave, and you know she's doing great. She's got a big new show coming out. I missed her at the logis because I saw shots of her and I didn't run into her. She was at one of the tables, I think, in just in front of us, so I meant to catch up with her, but I'm missed her. So yeah, No, I think there's this whole sort of philosophy that everyone sort of you know, somehow enemies in the media were actually not surprisingly.
And coming up nat on three decades of marriage and the secret that's kept her and Andrew together for thirty years. I mentioned I wanted to talk about your actual husband, not on air husband, and also milestones. So it's actually thirty years this year since you and your husband, Andrew were married. Got married in December nineteen ninety five. It was what are your memories of that day?
Wow, I can't believe it's thirty years. We were so young. We were twenty seven, yes, many years ago, and it was just a great day. We had a beautiful marquis that my mum and her friends had decorated, and we were living in LA at the time, and we'd come back to get married and then we sort of Andrew went back to La after then, and I moved back to Sydney, so we've had sort of trying to sort of coordinate ourselves into one city. It was just a beautiful day. We were friends for years before that, so
we had started as best friends. We'd started our relationship as best friends, and we still are. So I feel really, really grateful that that's been our relationship. I could not have done any of this without him, no one day.
Have there been times, I imagine he's extremely proud of what you have done with your career and the fact that you are there twenty three years on in that role and it's a tough industry. And you've spoken to me and other people in the media in the past about the challenges have come along the way, and there were times we've been given opportunities that didn't seem like opportunities.
How has he felt about that, the good times and the bad, and for you as well, because I think any partnership, any friendship, any marriage thirty years on, even just through what the other person is going through professionally, is their success, is your success and their hard moments you feel those just as much as they are.
Yeah, well, you live through each other's You know, successes and not such good times. You raise a family, you're a team, and we've I've always felt like we're a team, and I feel really, you know, grateful that we've had each other through this time. I feel grateful that we've had two beautiful kids through that time, and that, you know, we talk to each other several times a day, support each other. Every bit of news goes to him first,
and the same with him me. So yeah, it's a wonderful thing to be able to share your life with someone. It's a real gift. So I'm very, very thankful.
It's so nice that you still talk multiple times a day, because you don't always hear that in any long term relationship. Sometimes even a few years on, people go, oh, well, you know, like a bit, I'll talk to them tonight or something to have had that I imagine is a huge indication of how that relationship has had such longevity.
Well, he does joke that I do talk a lot, and on the weekend sometimes it's like I'm just watching the forty. Honey, you're paid to work during you've paid to talk during the week.
You're not paid to talk. Here, maybe a bit of silence.
So yeah, there's no problem with me talking and cheering.
He would attest to that.
As a mum of two boys and they are at both at university. Now your sons and they're not living at home. But is that also feedback that you got from your sons. I mean as a you know, mum of two boys myself. Now, I might just be happening to ask that for a friend. The observation little less chat.
A little less chat.
Yeah, I find that you have to get the message in the first sentence, the very first part of the first sentence, and I wouldn't be I wouldn't be including any key messages in the second sentence.
Really, I'm not even joking.
Because by the time you've gotten to the core information ten words in eyes have glazed over. Sorry I didn't actually hear I'm sorry, I wasn't really listening in the later trance.
Or they've picked up the phone, or they've yeah, they're mentally onto something else. And now that I because one's in Canberra and one's been in Melbourne. Now I've find that they'll be distracted when you're calling them, not all the time, and it depends what it is, because they're really they are really you know, they're they're actually both really good talkers. So strangely enough, they've picked that up
from somewhere I can't think where. Yeah, but there is a moment you can see in the conversation where you would probably happily talk for another half hour and this, and you can feel it. You're like, Okay, I'd better wrap this up. It's basically it's time for a commercial break.
Yeah, right, you're used to that.
I'm not producer in your Okay, you've got thirty seconds.
You're like, you can feel right.
Same when I'm talking. Yeah, the same when I'm talking to my sons. So do you? And and you have anything planned for the actual thirtieth anniversary in December? And I think you recently went to Europe?
Is that right?
So was that a bit early, just to sort of take advantage of the northern Yes summer.
We hadn't been to Europe for about together for about twenty five years since before we have, and we thought instead of having a party, we'd like to we'd like to go to Europe. So we went for two weeks and it was amazing, and we met up with one of my sons who was on a UNI break who you know. In his couple of semesters, he you know, worked at apart and saved his money and he was away with his mates. So we met up with him for the last few days and flew home with him.
So he was great. It was so wonderful. I think you get so tied up with you know, with your life and working and looking after the kids. That yeah, we hadn't done anything like that for an awful long time. So made us want to definitely try and do more.
But then you're back at work.
Your wedding dress do you still have a do you like I.
Do in mum's wardrobe at home in Bumbrey. Yeah, deveil everything.
I know.
I loved my wedding dress, even though it's that old. Wow, I haven't got it up for a while. Maybe this is the year.
The thirtieth anniversary, I think.
So you can't believe it's that here, So you really can't. That feels like it's someone else saying that.
When thinking about this cover with you, was looking and saw that it was your thirtieth wedding anniversary coming up at the end of the year, and suggested from my people, spoke to your people.
I said to my people.
Can we see if NAT's husband Andrew would be like one of the photos with that and good luck with that polite, polite decline.
So it's always a polite decline. He will neverline. It's a big night intimate.
I wanted to ask you about that the relationship because obviously some relationships, especially when people have such a familiar relationship with you in the format of breakfast TV, is so intimate that people feel that they know you. And obviously over the years it would have been the chat. You know, there's anecdotal chat about family life and your husband almost as a supporting character off screen for instance. But that aspect of him keeping his life very private
and the two of you being very private. Has that been something that was intentional from you from the start? Was that just who you are and that hasn't changed And do you think that's affected at all or been one of the many, many factors in the longevity of the relationship.
It was something that we decided years ago. Well, he was never interested in doing media stuff.
Photos.
There's the odd photo when he was I think roped in when we may have gone to a premiere. So there's the odd photo of him around it's just not his bag. We also said no for We also didn't want the kids to do photoshots either, and we've been asked, like you would have asked, many many times, can we do shoots with the kids.
We also decided very early on we weren't going to do stuff with the kids.
So I think we did one Women's Weekly shoot, and you know, one of our kids was over atained and the other was nearly iteen, and I think that's the only shit we've ever done with the kids. It was just a personal preference, and I think everyone just makes their own decision, and that was ours that I feel like I shared lots of my private life on air.
I talk a lot about.
Me and what I'm doing and what I think about things, and I have for many, many years. But we kind of, I suppose you kind of feel like you need to draw the line somewhere, and that's where we personally drew the line. So we drew it and we just kept it and that was it, and you know, that's our little family decision and we're kind of happy with it.
Last time we spoke, we talked a little bit about you and Andrew being empty nesters. Yeah, you kind of footloose and fancy free. How does that impact you as a couple and as two individuals.
Yeah, I think we're getting used to it, because I was. You're right, it was a real shock. And since since our seconds unmoved out early last year, I've had time. I've talked to so many women who've said, Wow, this crept up on me. My. You know, even one or more children have moved out or they've moved away, and I was not prepared for this. And I feel like
I've not counseled. But I've commiserated with quite a few women who were not prepared, and several men actually who were just actually a man on the red carpet at who I won't name, at the logis and he was like, Wow, I'm my wife, and I just so sad one of our kids has just moved away, like I did.
We we just weren't prepared.
And we just didn't you know, we just didn't expect this emotion to happen.
And we're just wandering around the house. It's just not the same.
I don't know whether so many things have talked about now that weren't talked about twenty years ago. Different aspects of lives right. And I don't know whether this one has talked about the impact it has on you when your kids move away, and it's I'm sort of used to it now because it's been eighteen months and they come back and go away and come back and go away a bit, and it's not like they never come home to visit. But yeah, I've definitely coming to terms
with it. And I think as you speak to more people, especially older people who've been through it, it's kind of an interesting topic to talk to them about and make you realize that you know, you're not the only one who feels strange.
I agree. It was a really powerful component of the conversation when we last spoken. It's something that people are talking about more and more socially and I think in the media. But Amanda Kella also was a guest on the Stellar podcast last year and that was really emotional for her as well. I think it is as that person said to you, it can be something that creeps up on you and look, this is not this is
still ahead of me yet. But I do think the bittersweet quality of it, because of course, like so many other things that we've now normalized, whether it's you know, metapause or conversations around mental health. They've always been there. We're just now normalizing the conversation. I think that empty ness slash free birding is the new frontier because also the relationship between children and parents has evolved from what
it was in previous generations. I mean, I know, of course you very close to your mum, were very close to your late dad, but a lot of people from Gen X and Baby Boomers didn't necessarily have that closeness. Once they moved out, it became a bit of sort of you know, Christmas and Easter. That close relationship of them coming back, I think is meaning that the conversation is shifted a little bit for our generation.
Maybe or they just didn't talk about it.
I think maybe it was particularly mums. I think they just sort of had to go, you know, cry in the bathroom, yes, and not vocalize it. So now I think because we talk about everything, you know, I think it's just something that yeah, I've had I've had quite a few conversations, and I think it's just nice to chat with other people who are going through it or who might be about to go through it, and it's you know, it's not the end of the world, but it's nice to sort of have support and you want
your kids. You don't want your kids to be still living at home at thirty five, do you.
Before we wrap up, I just wanted to come a bit full circle reflecting on your status as the ultimate survivor of this TV. No, you're fifty seven, and as I just said, I don't think you look a day older than you did when you were in your wedding dress in nineteen twenty five. I mean, really, we cover Asella today. I mean we look fantastic. I'm not saying everyone has to look that fantastic at fifty seven, but you do. And I'm not blowing smoke. That's just true.
I'd love to ask you about how that veteran status. And I almost I caught myself there because I was going to say, oh, is veteran a loaded word? But why is that a loaded word? If I was sitting here to Carl, I didn't think that. If I'd said to Kyl, you're like the veteran of today, I don't think there's any tension around that. He is and he inhabits that space with great confidence, and Koshi did as well.
I'm assuming I'm thinking that because oh, there's a loaded dynamic because women are judged differently from an agism perspective, just that the Logis. The other day there was that joke about the it's still rare to have women over sixty on TV, and I'd like to personally think that that's come a long long way from where it was ten, fifteen, twenty years ago. But I think the fact that it's even being used as a punchline at the Logis means it's still a thing. What are your thoughts on all of that?
On how long I'm gonna last?
Even the fact that that would be a conversation if I'm saying to you, you're the reigning veteran of Australian Breakfast TV. Can you just inhabit and own that or do you think, oh, what does that mean? Like is she saying that I'm old? Of course I'm not. But Carl and Koshi I don't think would have second guessed that in any way, And maybe you're not.
No, I don't think too much about those sort of labels. I don't think too much about my age. I just I'm just the person who goes into work and does my job, and I just I really just try and work hard.
And I.
Don't think too much about age either. I really don't. I mean, I walk in with no makeup on the They all see me how I wake up. I scrape my hair back with none of these hair pieces and no aleshes and no makeup. They see what I look like. I'm coming in cold, and then we do we tv afy ourselves because that's how it looks better on camera, and that's how I present. And then when I do my cooking videos, I have no makeup on either. I
think I'm as advertised. People see me both ways. I'm not hiding, so I think, you know, you.
Just do your best.
You go in, do your job, work hard, and we'll just see what happens, won't we. I've never looked too far into the future. The whole time I was reading news, people ask me, what's the next step? Where do you want to go? What do you want to be? Do you want to take over from Mel? Do you want to take over from Sam? Every single interview I did, I honestly have never looked that far forward, and I kind of think that's worked. So I I'm just living
in the moment. It's a great job and I'm really enjoying it, and I honestly can't think too far ahead.
It's it's for now.
Do you get annoyed when people like me, like you interview people every day? So it's a journal interviewing your journal?
Yeah?
Are you thinking come on and the milestones and this and that I'm living my life when you're coming in to do an interview like this? Is there a part of anything? So that's just not how I think, and I don't.
Want to go there. Yeah.
Yeah, I would much rather be asking the question Sarah. And you know that I'm not as comfortable on this side, so I do get an insight into how everyone else feels when I'm doing the interviewing.
It's not my natural habitat.
Well, look, thank you for your time and your generously. My final question, actually, because it was recently the logis was that Lynn McGranger. Of course, yes, one this year Lynn was on the Pop cast early this year. Last year was Larry MdeR. Larry hasn't been on the Stellar podcasts. I don't know how he wanted to logo, but there you go, because everyone else that's one the Gold logo has been on the Stellar podcast. Heah, exactly, but love Larry our Sonia the year before.
So this.
My question is, now, when are we going to see you up there? Because that's got surely there's got to I know you don't like to look into the future, but there's surely got to be a gold LOGI.
Oh god, no, look at you as I say, I just rock up and do my job.
Not thank you for squelching the natural aversion to coming and talking about yourself me asking the questions. But it's been lovely to talk to you. Congratulations on your upcoming thirtieth wedding anniversary to you and Andrew, and congratulations on twenty three years.
Thank you, sun Rise, thanks.
For having and you of course can see the fab Natalie Barr on Sunrise on weekdays on the Seven Network. Thanks again, now, thank you, thank you for tuning in today. Before you go, we'd love if you take a moment to leave a review or send this episode to a friend. I'll be back in your ears with another exclusive guest next week.