I drink alone with nobody else. I don't see the problem. I drink alone. It's not like he wrote multiple songs with nobody
Right.
else. That's one of the things that George Thorogood is doing, I think alone. I'll continue in a second. I prefer to be by myself. Now I sure as hell prefer to be by myself. When I was drinking. Somebody asked them, Don't you think it's kind of a problem that you've sung all these songs about alcohol? And his response was, I only did three.
No, that's very
I only did three.
right.
I didn't write them. I covered them. It's like, that's all
Right.
I know about him, man. Our topic tonight, Steve, is about drinking alone. And it was something I didn't want to hear anything about. When people said, If you drink alone, you might have a problem. Well, is this always the case? Is it a sign? What are your thoughts on drinking alone? Well, first of all, I just want to say I I had. I had an opportunity to see George Thorogood many years ago up in Springfield, and it was a wild concert. It was wild. It
was. You know, he was young and I was young, and I was still drinking and partying, and I was with my brother, it was floor. It was standing room only on the floor. It was your typical rock concert. And it was a lot of fun. It was a lot of fun. I've always been a big fan, Oh, old time rhythm and blues guy. yeah, always, always a big I've
always been a big fan. you know, drinking alone, if it's a habit, if you drink alone often or if it's, you know, typically how you drink most of the time, then I think it's something you got to look at. I think certainly the people that I know, the people that I hang around with, the people, not all of them either. There are plenty of people I know. You know, my sponsor was a bar drinker. You know, he wasn't a drinker. Drink alone or drink at home, but he was a bar drinker. I wasn't I
was a drink at home person. And I was a little bit, you know, frugal, if you may, or stingy if you may. And I always thought that I could get my buzz on better, especially when I started having a problem. My only interest was getting a buzz on, and therefore I didn't want to spend a lot of money and I didn't want to drink and drive. I had a you know, I had a DUI and, and so I didn't want to drink and drive. So I drank at home and I drank alone.
I drank alone from early on, so I started doing this when I got an apartment in college because I was a bar drinker. When I went to college and then when I had an apartment on my own, I could drink in the apartment. And
Yeah.
that's when because my roommate had a girlfriend who lived down the street. So he was never around. And it would save me from going out to the bar. So I started stocking up on booze.
Yeah,
And after that, being a single loser guy, after college and moving back to Connecticut, I didn't know very many people. So if I was going to drink, it was going to have to be alone. That was sort of my mindset of, well, how else am I going to drink if I don't do it alone? That sentence right there is a whole lot of problem.
yeah.
I didn't see it that way. No, I didn't see it that way either. For the longest time, I you know, one of the things that happened to me is, like you, I had my own apartment, and I had my own apartment, and I was 19 years old, 19 going on 20. so I had my own apartment. No roommate. Okay? I lived that way for four years. And, so there was a lot of drinking alone and smoking dope alone and stuff like that during that time,
because I was alone. Now I have plenty of friends over and stuff like that because at 19, I was one of the few who had an apartment, so there was plenty of people coming and going out of my apartment and sleeping all kinds of places too. that's one of the places where I picked up on it and I started drinking aloneness. You know, I lived alone and I lived alone until I got married. I never had a roommate. I never had a roommate until Me I got neither. married. So and I didn't get
married until I was 28. So all those years, right, I, I that's not true. For a very short period of time, I moved in with my brother and his wife. Less than six months. Less than six months. And that was, you know, I had met my wife. We weren't we weren't engaged yet, but, my first wife and but anyway, so, yeah, I did a lot of drinking alone. and especially when, when things got bad, when they got really bad for me, all of my
drinking was alone. All of it. I mean, I very seldomly drank in public once in a while I would try to have a couple of beers socially, a couple of drinks, you know, very, very few. I was mostly drinking alone and some of that was even, you know, I was I was on the road. I was a salesman. Some of that was drinking while I was working. You know, I would going door to door that wasn't going door to door. I was going in-home sales of security systems and I didn't drink before I went to any of
those things. But man, my after my last appointment was over, if I was in southeast Connecticut, you know, I had an hour's drive home. I was drinking on the way home alone, you know, just so I had that hour to start that buzz before I walked in, I could really hammer myself. I have totally forgotten about my drinking on the road. So I work for a company where I had to travel to Denmark. It was one year. I think it went five or six times for a week at a
clip. One of these times I had to go twice in a month, and that is a long
Yeah,
ride.
yeah.
I took Economy plus, which means wine or beer was on
Oh,
the house
wow.
and I drank wine the whole right over because
Yeah,
I have restless legs. I trouble sleeping on those planes and I just felt like I was getting ripped off. I was wasting an opportunity
yeah.
unless I drank. And then when I got over there, I think I was pickled the whole time. I'd go down to the restaurant in the hotel, and I must have drank a whole bottle of wine by myself. It was on the corporate card
All right.
so I could drink whatever the hell I wanted. I was drinking wine,
Uh,
sitting there by myself, and it justified it because I'm on the road. I'm in Denmark. I'm not at home.
right,
What else am I going to do? No speaks English here.
yeah, yeah.
And I think about my wife being on the road because she is now traveling. She was on the other foot. She'll go out with people she works with. Maybe she'll have a glass of wine. But if she came back and said, you know, I went out to dinner, I was by myself and each night drank half a bottle of wine, there would be alarm bells going off. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. No
question about it. And, you know, but I did the same thing, you know, is when I was drinking, I was never on the corporate, you know, I never had a corporate card, and I wasn't working that type of job, before I quit drinking the first time. So. But if I was away any way, you know, camping, anything, any time I could, you know.
Yeah, the, the. People that might, you know, my first wife and my current wife don't drink. My current wife likes to drink more than my first wife did, but my first wife drank very little. Just probably like Penny, right? Probably a little bit Mm like hmm. a little bit like, you know how she. A glass of wine here, maybe? Yeah, Maybe one night or two nights out of the year. Maybe she has more than she should have. I could drink with them because it just wasn't enough,
you know? So I had to drink and and then, you know, there was the fact that I knew, you know, especially when I knew I had had a problem or I knew I was drinking more than I should, even before I admitted I really had a problem, you know, then I was hide it because I was
embarrassed right then. I was like, Oh, I don't want to see people that like, you know, I mean, that happened for a long time when I was with my, you know, with the in-laws for the first family, I was always trying to figure out, how do I get some drinks alone? And even if I was with people, you know what I'm saying? I would just
Oh, yeah. try I would try to sneak those drinks, you know, And that's that's one of the things, right? Like to me, even though there were people there, I was still drinking alone because I was showing you that I was sipping a drink. Right. Yeah. But when I walked into the go to a bathroom, you didn't see me pour another four shots of alcohol into my same glass and then come out with it. Right. So those are the type of things I did. Let me tell you the trick
I learned. This is good alcoholic thinking not for you to do anymore. Now that you've gotten sober at the end, I was buying boxed wine. I was a wine connoisseur. And when I stopped drinking in 2014, around that time, box wines were not like franzia. Where it was like low caliber stuff. There were some good boxed wines which I could justify. And the great thing about a boxed wine is I could tell myself in one sense, I
won't drink so much. The reason I drink a whole bottle is how do you save a bottle after you're done? I had the vacuum pumps and that type of stuff
Yeah.
to seal
Right.
it off. I had all the hardware. If you have the boxed wine, you have to worry about that. Now, the alcoholic problem with the boxed wine is you can always top off your glass. And
Yeah.
I learned that people
Uh
are not thinking, or at least in my mind thinking, you're not drinking that much
uh,
because you just have a glass.
uh
And I wouldn't even sneak topping off.
huh,
I would do it right in front of everybody. Because
Yeah,
if you do it in a way that's not sneaky and in front of people, they won't notice. You could
yeah.
just walk over. It's like you walk over, you grab the glass, you walk back, and because it's so conspicuous, And, they and don't notice it's quick, it. right? Yeah, Like, how much? How much wine could you put in there when you're just topping it off? Absolutely. no, I did the same thing. And listen, it was all both tricks of the trade. But listen, I want to, you know, a couple of the things before. Before I realized I had a problem, and maybe I was just starting to realize it. I was
had a problem. I used to go to Maine. We had a cottage up in Maine, and we would drive. And when we had two young kids, a lot of times we wouldn't be able to leave until after work and to go to Maine, you know, on a weekend, especially, especially for the holiday, It could take us a while. And there's plenty of times I would like pull in at
00 at night or even later. And get the kids down. And my wife would go up to bed and I'm like, I'm going to have a couple of glasses of wine. I was drinking wine, too, and my wife would look at me like, Why are you going to start drinking at
00. I didn't drink all the way up because I had kids in the car, so I would. But I wanted to drink and,you know, and I remember having this conversation with her and I'm like, and it was just easy for me. I just need to unwind a little bit, right. And stressed out. And so that was true. Stressed out from driving the whole time. and I'm never like that. Even if I, even today, if I, if I roll into some place late, I'm not going to bed right away. I have to sort of wind down
yeah. without the alcohol now. But I would drink, I would sit there
00, 1130 and drink alone for a couple of hours and then go up and go to bed.
I would do that, too. We'd go to Rhode Island. My mother and father in law had a place in Rhode Island, very close to the beach. Every single time we'd go down there because it was vacation mode, I would have to handle at least a few glasses of wine once we got down there. It was on a Friday night often,
Mm.
and it could be nine, ten, 11:00, and I would have to do that. And it was like it was elevating the experience of being away. What it really was was an opportunity to elevate the drinking. Now I'm drinking in a different location with different glasses. As opposed to it elevating the experience down there.
Ri.
That was a big I will tell you, when we started going away and it wasn't drinking, that was tough.
Yeah.
I had to build in some new habits of do I even like being down here if I can't drink? I agree 100%. It was the same thing when I would have to go back up to Maine and it was always nobody drank it, They
00 be happy hour. It was a beautiful place right on the porch. Everybody did it. All the cottages, the porch faced the water. I very sit up there, 5:00 with the cocktails and before dinner. And we you know, they'd have a few drinks and then we'd come in and have dinner. And when I stopped drinking, that whole thing was very uncle. I had to do some, especially early on. I had had to do some
different stuff. Now, the nice thing about for me was when I got sober the first time I got sober like the second week of August in 95. So we were pretty much done going to the beach that year, right? Because it's a cottage just not a full, you know. And we would go up typically in July. That was early August, so I was pretty much done. So by the time I got back up there, I did have, you know, not eight, nine months of sobriety. So I had a little bit of sobriety to work on. But it
was difficult. It was difficult, but there were some nice walks on the beach. I was able to do. You know, we had kids. I was able to do stuff with the kids. I would take care of them. So you have to build in some new habits for sure.
I remember listening to Howard Stern years ago and he had Craig Kilborn on, and Craig Kilborn was talking about how he loved drinking alone and how it wasn't a problem. And that stuck with me. Mm The fact that I remember a specific guest on a specific show and exactly what I was doing, I think it was stretching at the time at the gym. That's that's a lot of Right. memory of what I was doing at the time. And I'm like, Yeah, well, if it's okay with Craig, it must be okay with me. This is
a really dark time for me. That time that I was drinking by myself
Yeah,
early on, I had this one bedroom apartment and it felt like if I, I don't know as many people. So how am I going to drink unless I don't drink alone? When in reality that stunted my growth. If I had put the drink away and was forced to do other things, I probably would have had a better social life. I probably would have had a fuller life. Instead, I was shackled to the idea that when I was by myself, I had the drink and I had the drink alone because it was the only way for anything.
And there were times I wasn't drinking every night. But when I got in the habit of I had alcohol around. It was tough not to drink after work. It became a habit and it was like I had to go to the fridge or
right.
I had to get that bottle of wine. I definitely was a Friday and Saturday night drinker. I was, you know, I was pretty much doing a lot of them. A lot of time too, especially early on the first time through. But I was a pretty sloppy drunk. I always, I wanted to drink alone so I could get where I wanted to be. Like I wanted to drink alone so I could get so hammered that I could barely get myself to bed, you know? And that was the disease kicking in. You know. But that's the way I wanted to
drink. I no longer wanted to drink. I much, you know, I've. I've told the story before, but I. I relapsed on a business trip. It was a planned relapse on a business trip in October. And when I got back from a business trip, we went up to Columbus. It was a sales trip. It was something we did four times a year, pretty much. And when I got back, I remember the first couple of weeks, I don't know if I drank anymore, maybe I drank a little bit, but so October, maybe into December into
November. By December that year, I was drinking alone in my basement. All right. A that's sort of where I end up. And I've talked about it. I talk about it all the time in meetings. If I pick up and start drinking again, that's where I'm going to drink like that. That's the highlight. That's the highlight of my drinking. Let's go drink in the basement. I'm not sitting watching a Yankee game, having a
couple ice cold beers. You know, I am pouring in, you know, four shots of tequila or vodka or whatever it might be into a drink and maybe just a little bit something just to sweeten it up just so I could get it out. And that's that's the way I know that that was my preferred way to drink, for sure. I was more in control drinking when I was out. It was so important
Yeah.
for me that I not be looked at as an alcoholic.
Yeah, me too.
The big being called an alcoholic was the worst thing that you could possibly say to me because of my father and other people in the family and the alcoholic. That was a bad word. Bad. You can't control your liquor. So I could control myself to an extent when I was out because I wasn't going to get a DUI, because a DUI means you're an alcoholic. That's why I could really let loose at home.
And even at some level, because I remember being at home and I still would have to control my drinking to some level because if I was sitting there drinking a 12 pack, then that meant that I had a problem.
Right?
And there were a lot of times I couldn't control it no matter what I did. When I started drinking, I was putting away a six pack of good beer. And I remember those times thinking, This is a problem. I don't know why I'm drinking more and more. Why can't I stop this? There were those times drinking a whole bottle of wine. Why can't I stop drinking this? That was always
Yeah.
the thing in my head. I couldn't answer the question that I must have a problem, because to me, I'm always thinking about I have to balance this so I don't go over the line and become an alcoholic. Because if I become an alcoholic, then I can't drink anymore. And what the hell am I going to do at that point? Life is over. If I become an alcoholic Yeah. and Like, have to stop. yeah, like you. I grew up in an alcoholic family, right? An alcoholic home. I shouldn't say
that. My alcoholic family, although I did grow up in an alcoholic family, but I grew up in an alcoholic farm home, and I watched, you know, my mother, not me. My mother drank alone and drank until she passed out. So I was in total denial. Right. My biggest thing is I can remember when I started questioning, just like you were talking there, like, why can't I stop or Why is this happening? So when I would have those thoughts, I would admit it. Probably just like you, I didn't
want to be an alcoholic. Right. Watching that happen to someone I loved, I, I went right to denial. So I just immediately dismissed those thoughts, like, Oh, what's going on here? You know, I've talked about it like, I went out for some drinks when I was in college. I did last semester, and I realize I went on this little run of drinking like, Hey, what's going on here? You know, like, I realized it, but I dismissed it. because I was able to put it aside for a
while. But when I started, when I picked up, I would drink and I would drink. You know, I would always drink alone. Like I said, it was it was the place where I had the most ability to get the buzz I wanted to get. And it wasn't always a sloppy drunk, but it was always more than I was comfortable of showing people in public. What do you think makes drinking alone such a troublesome sign? Well, I just think that I. I think there's a whole anti-social thing to it. or a
social maybe. I'm not sure what the right word is. and, you know, I just think there's listen, nothing, anything that you can't do in front of other people. I think you got a question right, wheth it's drinking or other or anything else. So. That's powerful. Right. Any, anything you can't do. Right. So if you got to, if you gotta hide it, if you feel either shame or embarrassment that you're doing, then I think
you have to look at it. So if you're drinking alone, if you're drinking alone, because you don't want people to see how much you're drinking, then that's an issue, right? That's a that's like that. That's a problem. But again, if you if you live alone and you have a glass of wine with dinner, that's probably not a problem, you know. but I just think that there's something inherently bad about it, right? Just that you're not sharing. It's just
dirty little secret, right? We always say shine a light on it and. And, you know, see what happens. When I lived by myself, how was I going to experience the wine I want to experience unless I did it alone? One of the reasons I drank after my wife went to bed is I was so frustrated by the fact that she was such a lightweight.
yeah,
It was like twisting
Yeah,
her arm to get her to share a bottle of wine with me. It was such
yeah,
a rare thing. And when it happened, I don't think she'd finish a glass. And it just bothered me that why would she drink the way that she's drinking? What would stop her from wanting to finish this bottle of wine with me? Why was this so hard? That's an interesting point. What was And you her problem? write N mine. exactly what was her problem. And you know what that is? That's an issue of resentment, right? Yeah, That's an attack on. Listen,
that's, you know, something? I never really thought about it or had thought about it in a long time, but I can remember the same thing. My wife would not want to have a glass of wine with me. She probably could see that I had a problem before I admitted I had a problem. Right. She was probably concerned about my drinking as she should have been. She had two young children. so she probably didn't want to engage me with that. And then I would be the same way. Oh, you don't want to have a couple
glass of wine with me. You don't want to relax, you don't want to socialize with me. And then I'd be pissed off like, Oh, you don't want to do this with me. I'd have this resentment and I would even drink at her more. Right? So it was this whole vicious circle of just bad, bad thinking. We talk about it stinking thinking, right? This bad, bad thinking of how, you know, it just goes round and round and round and this bad, bad circle I had these periods of time where I was dry, where I
would stop drinking. I never would say I was an alcoholic, but I'm not going to drink anymore, is what I said. There were months I could go by doing that on my own, which if it was balancing out, I'm either going to drink or not drink. That's kind of a sign of a problem. But then I would not drink at home, but nothing else would change, which and is why it was hard to sustain that so nothing else
would change. I just wasn't drinking, which would reinforce the fact that I can't do this, not drinking but. this is no good when there were other things that needed to change. So if you're somebody who's listening to this and you're thinking about I don't know if I have a problem but a drink by myself, I think those are some questions to ask.
Hmm,
Why are you drinking by yourself? What is drinking out in public look like versus at home? Why is there a difference between that? If he didn't drink at home, what would that look like? And I think you can kind of answer your own questions
you
and
know.
then maybe think about maybe try it for one weekend. And what is that like? Is it easier if it's hard? Might get some answers to some questions that way. You may, absolutely you may at least you may realize that you have to do a little bit more
work on it. And here's the other thing I would say, if you're if you're questioning that, if you're thinking if you're listening to this and you're drinking alone and you're questioning whether that's healthy or not healthy, listen, you can go to an AA open meeting, right? You don't have to raise your hand to say I'm an alcoholic. You can raise your hand and say I'm here as an interested spectator, whatever
you might want to say. And you could listen in and you could even share like here, you know, I'm here because I'm drinking alone. And you, you you'll get some feedback from people. You'll get some feedback. Some of that feedback could be a little bit tough to hear. So people are always trying to, you know, do the right thing and give you some good advice, but it'll help you understand that maybe there is something going
on here. And the chances are, if you do that for a little bit, somebody's going to walk up to you and go, You know something? I did exactly what you're doing right now. Exactly. I was drinking too much. I was drinking alone. And I came in here. And let me tell you, I'm so happy that I stopped because you don't want to get to where I got right. Mm I hmm. lost a family. I lost, you know, a house. I almost lost my current marriage. You don't want
to get there. So it it it it really, really important to take some time and look at it. So, yeah, if you're if you're drinking alone, I definitely think it's something that pay attention to it. Try not to deny it, don't blow it off. All these things that we talked about, we did. Because it's it's a really slippery slope, ma'am. It's a really slippery slope. And by the time you sort of understand what's going on, sometimes it's too late. Like you don't have the power to say no anymore.
When I lived in an apartment at college, when I was just starting drinking alone, I found out after the fact, just. I went back and I looked up. Where is the closest AA meeting? And it was less than a five minute walk from that apartment. It
Wow.
was walking distance. The next place I lived by myself, I had this recurring dream that I'm stuck at home in my childhood home, which was kind of a remote place, and there was nothing for me to do but leave the house. And this was a recurring dream. And once I got sober, I realized in the dream there is a place for me to go. I could always go to a
Mm.
meeting and I stopped having that dream.
Oh,
There's
wow.
there's always a place that I can go if I need to be around. People always. I live it. I'm
Yeah.
lucky that see you out there May not, but I live in a place where there's a meeting every night.
Yeah.
There's a meeting during the day. It's Multiple. multiple.
Yeah,
I just would have to wait
yeah,
a couple hours. There's always a place for me to go,
yeah,
and I can be around other people if that's the thing. And I wish I knew that earlier. No, I agree. I've always been a people person. I always liked being around people. And one of the benefits that I get out of the fellowship is the fact that I can always go and be with people. Same thing. And, and I can always go and find people, find a meeting where I'm going to know people like I'm going to
know. Because one of the things I did when I got sober is I found the meetings that I liked and I attended them enough that I'm not a complete stranger when I walk and I don't go to all of them regularly. I go to a few of them regularly. But the other ones I know I can pop in there and I know half of the people at least, you know, and and it is such a nice thing to know that I don't. I don't ever have to be alone. Right? I don't ever have
to be alone. I can go out, go to a meeting, sit down, have some coffee if it's a day time, whatever. Do some stuff with some other people All right, So if you want to be connected to our program, you can go to Sober Friends podcast right on the front page. You can subscribe to the newsletter. Once a week I put out a short newsletter where you get a sober article of the week, a little bit of a summary of what the show is going to be about. And oftentimes I'll ask you a question because we want
to get to know you, Steve. I recently asked, how did you find the sober Friends podcast? What do you think our audience said in terms of how they found the podcast? Googling, sober podcasts. You're actually close. I was almost disappointed to get the answer. They said, Well, I typed in sober and you popped up. I typed in recovery and you popped near like the first one.
Hey.
And that's why I listen to you. Hey, I was looking for that. You know, I was just so charmed by something I saw. Now, you're the first one that popped up, and I just stuck around. So I appreciate everybody who did that. Trying to ask some questions because we want to get to know the audience so that we have good content. Here's something I'd love for you to do. Give us a five star review on Apple Podcasts. Tell us a little bit about what you like about
the show. When people search through and they see podcasts that have a lot of reviews and then they can go through and see what's great about it, it does help the show something on Spotify, give us a rating. It would really help the podcast. We'd appreciate it. I read every single one. Steve, thanks for coming on the show again tonight hey, Mac. Thanks for having me, and I look forward to it. and we'll see everybody next week. Hi everybody.