And we were having dinner and the woman of the couple was sitting there and we were talking about how, you know, this house. And she'd seen how nice it was. And she said, Do you ever get the feeling that somebody is going to show up at your door and knock on it and say, you got to get out, You don't own this house, you don't belong in this house? And I looked at her and I had never heard anybody say that before. That's the way I felt inside. And
Yeah,
I said, yes, yes, I know how you feel. Like it was the first time, you know. But I heard anybody say that.
One of John's favorite topics is the wreckage of the future, and I think it is one of my favorite topics as well, because I can live into the place where things are always going to go bad. S and I have a little bit of a situation today that happened at work but has been kind of building for a long time and I don't think it's necessarily about work, but I think it is about something bigger. And I think it's worth talking about because I think other people can benefit from
this. So if we start talking about, well, you tell me where you think we should start, Steve should explain the situation. Should we talk about what wreckage of the future is?
Maybe we need to talk a little bit about wreckage of the future. Right. Which is, people, not just alcoholics, but alcoholics have a tendency to do it. And it's more dangerous to predict outcomes. Right. Are based upon.
Right.
Based. Based upon feelings. Really Based upon what we feel might be
I
going on more than data. Right.
mean,
And I think that's what the way I look at that and I think the way a lot of people look at that and we talked a little bit before coming on how this happens to some of us in our career situation, our work situation. But it can happen in relationships, situations. It could happen in any aspect of
your life. So, I mean, I think that's what we're talking about, sort of predicting an outcome of something that's in the future based upon, at least I would say, flimsy information or, you know, less than good information.
there's some there's unfairness creeping in here, when you have finally heard this podcast, I'm taping this back to back. So last week when you've heard this, I would have appeared on Marcus's Recovered podcast. And I think that actually doing that show has helped me a little bit. This will be airing a week after that is. But in reality I'm doing this back to back, so it's a lot better that I'm doing it that way. So a little bit of background in my current job.
I've been there ten years. Eight of those ten years I have been rated at the highest level you possibly can be on a performance evaluation. For a number of years I've been viewed as high potential, although I've applied for positions and not gotten it. I have a great brand. I probably had my best year I ever had, and the raise that I got was not commensurate with what my performance was. And the reason for that is I might be putting up against the top of the pay
band. That causes some anxiety because there is some resources that are going on in knowing how corporate culture works. Even if you're really good. If they look at that salary, they could say, Why haven't you promoted? Why are we paying you what we're paying you when we could maybe take that salary and hire two people, even if they're average and get more out of what they're doing with me and I'm agreeable to move to another level, I'm ready to go. I'm not perfect that what my role is now, but
I'm ready to. I agree. I'm this is the first time really. I've like, no, I'm confident I'm not. Oh yeah I think I know, I know. I'm ready for more responsibility. Somebody give me the goddamn responsibility and I'll do it and I'll, I'll. I'll build up to the top level again. But then it starts to feel like I've done all this work. It's not fair. I could be putting myself on the chopping block. And now I have a resentment
it is. And isn't that the way it works? Right. When you boil it right down, we start looking at this stuff, and that's why it becomes problematic for alcoholics and addicts. And people who struggle as we do is because you end up right where you said, I have a resentment. Right. And
right?
in our literature, in our literature, it tells us that that is the number one killer of alcoholics. Right. Is resentment is the reason why we go out most times is the reason why we struggle. A couple things I will say is, you know, I felt the same way. Part of it was for me and I think I remember you and I talked about this in the past was I had this feeling and I think I've mentioned that maybe on this podcast podcast before, but I'm not sure I always had this feeling of being unworthy
of my successes. Right.
This is so funny that you're saying this because Mark was just talking about this,
Yeah,
and Mark's like one of the smart.You're also one of the smartest guys I know, but he's like an engineer. He has gone through hell, he's sober, has a good podcast. He's a really smart guy.
yeah,
And he was just saying, I feel less than.
No, I felt that way my whole life and I've shared it many times. Is that when we first moved into the house for living now and it's not a it's not a big fancy house, it's a nice house, but it's an old ranch that was built in 19 late forties, early fifties, with a nice addition on the back that spruces it up really, you know something? But more than I ever thought as a child, I would
probably get into. And we had some friends come over for dinner after we moved in and they bought a nice house out in a really nice town. Avon, Right? A nice town out there, a big house, a really nice house. And we were having dinner and the woman of the couple was sitting there and we were talking about how, you know, this house. And
she'd seen how nice it was. And she said, Do you ever get the feeling that somebody is going to show up at your door and knock on it and say, you got to get out, You don't own this house, you don't belong in this house? And I looked at her and I had never heard anybody say that before. That's the way I felt inside. And
Yeah,
I said, yes, yes, I know how you feel. Like it was the first time, you know. But I heard anybody say that. And my wife, who grew up the daughter of a banker. Right. Middle class. Right. She never had those feelings. Like she always felt like she would end up in something. And and she had a fairly nice house before we met. I always felt like I did not deserve, even though I worked hard. I've been working since I
was 13 years old. You know, I started cutting lawns, a button on lawn mowers, all those type of things. I had a very good work ethic even though I had all those things, I still felt like I was left there. and now the problem and that was, listen, I drank to cover up my feelings right? I drank to cover up my feelings. So when I when I feel
you.
less than it's a problem for me. And it took me a long time to work that out. And my program helped me figure that out.
I would take that addition on your house any day.
Yeah,
If it wasn't in the town that you live in, I would
right,
swap houses in a heartbeat.
Right.
I'm married more to my school system than I am to my house.
right.
But for here you talk modestly about that addition. That addition is gorgeous.
It
I
is.
would kill for that.
is
Yeah.
a gorgeous addition and it does it makes the house or I go side of the old part of the house, you know, is is an older ranch style. But that addition does make it and and I agree like we didn't when we got here we didn't have kids that were in the school system. Not that, you know, my my wife's kids went through the school system and they've done okay for themselves. But you're right. You're in a nice town one of the better school systems in the state. that's why you moved to those towns, right?
Yes.
know, that's why you moved to Connecticut. So you can find those school systems, right? One and things like the third ranked state for public school systems in the country. So that is why you where you come. but yeah, we all, you know, we go through these projections and again, I talked about it. talked about it on this podcast many times. I was in for almost 30 years, a sort of high pressured
sales position. It wasn't always high pressure, but by the towards the end it got the company's got bigger and bigger and bigger. And I always felt like just like you talked about being let go, being replaced. I always felt like up to next reorg, it's going to be me. There's no way they're going to keep me through this reorg. All these. And then one day after probably three orgs or companies being buying or, you know combining with com, we did all
kinds of stuff. And every time we did this, there were salespeople from the other company that came in and there was always layoffs, there was always layoffs after this. And I survived them and I survived them and I survived them. And one day I just sat down and went, Huh, I've survived all of these re orgs. And, you know, we talked about it as one of the two highest salespeople base salary there. And I finally realized I hey, I really remember thinking this. Maybe I
know what I'm doing. You know, maybe I'm actually pretty good at what I do. And I never felt that way. And I was I was in my fifties when that happened to me. You know, I was in my fifties when I got that feeling. So it's easy to look at that. and have that wreckage of the future, you know, happen to me all the time in my relationships too. I always thought my relationships
were going to burn up. And, you know, from early on I sabotage a lot of relationships because I was like, I wanted to be in control of how they ended, you know? So I would just sabotage, act, act out, and then that relationship would end. it was like, well, at least I controlled it, you know,
Well, I've always wanted to have somebody break the relationship with me that I don't have to be the one responsible.
yeah.
And again, I can luxuriate in victimhood.
Oh, yeah, of course. Yeah, we can all do that. So we got to be careful with that. Again, what happens, I believe for most of us, for many of us, I think part of what you're going through is there's some fear. Right? And, you know, fear is always that thing. I mean, you're you know, you got a young family,
I got
you got
a lot
a
of change at work,
right,
more
you got
than
a
we've ever had.
lot of change. You're in an industry that's gone through a lot of change. Right?
Huge change.
Right. an industry that's trying to figure out how to move forward yeah. So what comes in is a lot of fear, you know, A lot of fear. And, you know, you got, you got a young family. And I have finally realized that people like you, you're going to figure it out. you, you know, I mean, I've been around you long enough to know that, again, it works me back. I can remember signing my first life insurance policy I remember sitting I was with my wife and I at the time we had a condo in in
a different town. And the insurance guy I was from Prudential, and he came over and he was sitting there and I remember and it was like I was committing to paying a premium on this insurance policy. And my first I asked, I'm like, Well, what's going to happen if I lose my job? And he looked at me strangely and said, he did. He looked at me, went he'd go get another job, right? I went, Yeah, I guess. Right. I mean, but that's how I thought. I thought, you know, why would I, you know,
I can't sign this. I mean, there was so much fear around that was so much worry that I just wasn't going to be good enough to to to keep anything,
I lost the job once and we lost one of those life insurance policies lapse. And,
hmm.
you know what we did?
Well,
We got another life insurance policy.
right,
It really was as simple as that,
Yeah. If you're young enough, you can do it right? Or if it doesn't work right, I mean, you do whatever you have to do at the time. I think we find that, you know, for us, for me, for you, for John, wherever he might be,
you know, as is in the woods.
you're probably wet
No,
and cold
here's
out there, but, yeah, he's probably
here's
trying
what you
to
know
kill.
about John. As
Yeah.
an aside,
Yeah,
two things. He's one in the woods
yeah,
and two, there's a family of mammals that are going to lose their mom tonight.
probably. Yeah,
John Will getting dinner.
yeah,
Bambi will lose her mom. And that's
yeah,
a fact.
right. Yeah. It's. It's a sad fact, but it's a fact.
Yep.
but, you know, you know, all of us, I mean, we're going to, we're going to figure this stuff out is, you know, we're going to, we're going to figure out how to move forward. you know, John went through a bunch of change in his his life recently, right?
Last few years,
right. And, and we all went through I remember we
you
were all talking.
can.
You had some opportunities. I had some opportunities. We were all talking a little bit about it, like, Hey, what's going on? John and I are older, trying to figure out how we move forward. and it all worked out, you know? It all worked out. We all, we found our way,
John has less responsibility now. Works for a solid company. I have never seen him happier in his
right?
career.
I agree. I agree. He is. I agree. It's listen, I mean, he he he fell into it. And again, it's one of those things he and he was he was pissed when he got laid off or fired or whatever you want to call it. He was pissed because he felt like you, that he had earned, you know,
I
this he had earned this place. He had a few years left before he wanted to retire. And next thing you know, he was kicked out the door a little bit for those reasons that you're talking about. Right. It was like he was he was expensive he had hit a certain point. that's the other thing, right? Is that you're absolutely right. He, you think about it, if he got his wish, he would have been at his old company and he would not be as happy as he is today.
know he would be dealing with the nonsense that he always talked about. I never
Right,
hear him talk about non. The nonsense he talks about now is, Oh, my boss has all of these problems. It's not my problem though.
right, right,
All I can do is is guide him and mentor him
right,
and teach him what I would do. But at the end of that it would have been mine. But it's not anymore.
right. Yeah. So that's the other thing is that, you know, when things when things change, sometimes they change for the better. And listen, again, in hindsight, it wasn't easy going through it. And hindsight, I look back at the times where I thought things were really difficult and, and they were there were times where, you know, listen, I was I was a commission sales person, and they changed our commission plan every year. It was like every
year. And I always used to tell my boss, I need to figure out how I make my money. And it's, it was always that way. Like I would the first couple of months I would struggle making commission. And then once I figured out the plan, I was like, okay, now I know what I need to do to hit my numbers, you know? And that was same way I got good reviews. it's, it's a struggle. It's a struggle. It's a, it's an internal struggle, not an external struggle, right? Like most of them are. It's an it's
in our minds. you know, that's, that's what we have to fight every day,
I can put it on the flip side and I don't think this is a reality, nor do I think it's likely to happen. But as much as they're going to get rid of this guy because he's too expensive, could be. Let's take somebody who's mediocre at the next level and reassign them or get rid of them. And let's put me in that role with a modest bump. All of a sudden, I went from expensive to pretty cheap.
And here's the thing. You have to remember something I was thinking about when we were talking just a minute ago, is in in the big book, right? You have the section, the chapter two employers, right? Written by our friend Hank P and if you talk about it here, they talk about these these companies that insist back in the, you know, thirties they insisted they didn't have an alcohol problem and he said companies didn't don't understand what kind of
problems they have. And and one of the things he talks about is how much it costs to train somebody to be an executive so that when you lose somebody, right, you've lost thousands of dollars of training and knowledge. And I think that's another thing that you have to think about. And it's one of the reasons why I was able to keep my job is that there was a bunch of knowledge that I had. I had relationships with customers. I
had a I had a bunch of stuff. It they're not going to replace you with two people cheaper because they're not as good as you. I mean that they're not as good as you. And it doesn't mean that somebody, some bean counter won't look at your salary one day and decide that the salaries got to go because the company needs that money to be gone. That doesn't mean that's not going to happen. But it it's harder for them to do it. You know, they're going to look at you and they're going to they're
going to wear. They're going to wear. I mean, no, what's going to happen is you talked you've talked about it before. It's not so much they're going to bring up somebody new. What they're going to do is they're going to probably cut somebody and they're going to ask you to take on more responsibility.
I would be happy to do that.
right,
I'm fine doing that.
right. You're going to say, hey, listen, you know, we need you to take on extra employees or take on this other piece. I mean, that's the way of corporations nowadays, you know, is is to do that stuff.
If anything, that's my problem is I'll take on too much more. I'm not good at saying no. All right. So we've got these fears. I hope that you can identify with these fears. Now we got to talk about, well, what do you do? This is part of life. I can't drink over it to get rid of this stress. So what do you do in this situation? What are tools?
Yeah. Tulsa is one of the things we're doing. I mean, we're doing something publicly, if you will, on this app, right on this podcast. I mean, that we do privately. Privately, right. So typically, a lot of times after a stressful day like that, you pick I know you pick up your phone, you're going
Yeah,
to call somebody and you're going to talk about it. You call me, you call John, you call the people, you call Timmy, you call a bunch of people. And you until you get somebody to talk to and you know something? We all feel better after we talk to somebody about it. So that's one of the tools that we can use. And then, yeah, the other tool lesson, one of the other tools is depending on where you what your spirituality is made of, it, you know, it's prayer, meditation, right? It really is. So if
this
those
is
are.
where I messed with this.
Yeah.
I in talking to Mark, we talked a little bit about, you know, your higher power, and I'm like, God damn it, The higher power didn't even come into my thinking. I was totally in control
Yeah,
of the show again. I took both hands, put it on the steering wheel, and I have a death grip,
yeah,
and I didn't know I did it.
right. that is what we do in those situation, right? We revert back to that. I have to be in control. I have to control this happens to me. Still happens to me today. we do, we revert back to it. So. Right. So depending on where you are with that. Right, if you, if you have a higher power, if you call your higher power, God, if prayer is part of that ritual for you, part of the stuff, then then I would. Absolutely. This is one place where you would turn this over to your higher power, right?
You turn over your alcoholism to your higher power. You have this unknown or you have this fear going on. So you turn that fear over to your higher power. And even if your higher power isn't, you know, even if your higher power is the good old, you know, group of drunks type of higher power, you just bring it to a meeting and you share it. Right.
Because what is going to happen and you bring this to a meeting and you share it with 25 or 30 guys, what's going to happen is you're going to get some feedback either during a meeting or after meeting of people who have gone through the same thing. And you're going to realize, you know something, It's you know, it's not that bad. It's, you know, I'm going to you know, at the end of it, you're going to go I'm going to I'm going to be
okay. I'm going I'm going to figure it out some way or another.
There are times that I'm just so hesitant to ask my higher power for help. Have you ever been in that situation? And if so, I'm sure there are other people who can identify with it. What makes us not want to ask our higher power for help?
I think it's just, you know, selfishness and self-centeredness, right? I mean, that is
I
the root
don't think
of
so.
all our problems, right? I mean, we just we just think that we're all as much as we want to have that higher power take over our lives. It's a it's a difficult thing to do all the time. And the people who do it more successfully are the people who are more successful and have more serenity in their sobriety. Right. Plain and simple. And people who can do that, you look at them, you are that person has a lot of serenity. And I know that, you know, we talk about it. I didn't have that for a long
time. And and even today I can struggle with it. But it's better today for me than it was. But I'll tell you what I think in this situation is that when I look for help for my higher power, I don't look for help.
For
I don't look for a solution. Right. That's what we always talk. Don't pray for things for ourselves. I look for relief from the feelings, right? So I'm the help I look for in this situation is relieve me from this feeling that I'm feeling the fair, the doubt, whatever that feeling is. Like, just take that away. Because if you take that away, I can deal with the rest of it. Right? I could take that. If you take if you take the fear and the doubt and the uncertainty away, then I
can I can do it. You know, I can go get another job. You know, I can even when I, you know, make my company clothes. I was 62 years old. My company shut down. They didn't sell the company. They they got out of the business. It was sort of the unheard of thing. They were the biggest company doing what we did in the world, in the world. And they closed it down. They
didn't sell it. If they sold it, I would have gone to another company and I was 62 years old and I worked until I was September and I had, you know, I had options to go to work and went back went back to work that December. You know, I wasn't I wasn't out of work for two months at a fact. I went to a conference with the company I'm working for now in November before I even was on the payroll. I mean, they paid for a conference and my wife and I went out and it was a great trip.
yeah, we were you know, this program has given me an opportunity to do those type of things. I would have been in big trouble if those type of things happened when I was still drinking, because I would have it would have pushed me to drink more. That fear, that uncertainty would have pushed me deeper and deeper into my into my alcoholism.
I would be loaded tonight if I was still a drinker.
Absolutely.
This would have been I would have gone out and got a nice bottle of coke. Tyrone or it would definitely be a wine night.
Yeah.
And while I'm drinking wine, that bottle is going to be gone quick.
Yeah.
That's how I stopped drinking. The bottle's gone.
No matter what, at the end of both of my drinking's at Well, now this the second one more than the first one, but even the first one, I was drinking a lot of on second one I was drinking almost exclusively wine at the end of my drinking. It just seemed to, you know, seemed to work for me, just like it just seemed to work for me. And the truth. The truth was it was the same thing. I drank until the bottle was empty
Yeah. Mark was talking about sometimes it's tough to go down the beer aisle because you see that beer and all that new stuff that you haven't had a chance
yeah,
to drink. And the beer never did anything for me afterwards because I just think about how bloated and gassy
yeah,
I'd be. Wine didn't have that scotch,
yeah,
didn't have
yeah.
that. That's
I agree.
actually where I was going towards the end is I'd be deep in a bottle of scotch or a bottle of bourbon.
Right?
And it's been it's been almost nine years.
Yeah.
So I would, I would be totally blotto if I continued from that time.
But we don't need to be because
No.
we do have options, right? We do have options and we have tools that we can use. And like I said, the most important one, you know, the biggest, the biggest option or the biggest tool or to tool just is to pick up the phone and talk to another alcoholic.
Yeah.
Right. When when everything else fails, extensive work or discussion with another alcoholic is what will do the trick. And, you know, I got a I got a call today from somebody who was struggling today. Yeah. One one of our guys and he's just having a shit day. And we, you know, we talked for 15 minutes or so and, I'm sure he felt better. We talked about a few things he could do. one of the things I said, you know, maybe you should go to the gym and work off some of the stress.
And he goes, What? He. And he says, I'm sitting in the parking lot before I walk into the gym, and I'm like, That's a good option, man.
Yeah.
That's a good option. I used to, when I was pissed off or resentful or something. I used to love to go to the gym
That's what
because
my
I
14 year old son does.
yeah, I just I would just, you know, I was more of a runner back then than anything else. But I would go, I would do my workout and I would get on a treadmill or something and I would just kick my arm, but I would run hard, I would run long and I would I would just exhaust myself. And sometimes that's what you need to do. You know, we had to have new guy come in to, you know, there's a lot of tools in some of them. Some of them aren't as welcome the other
two as other ones. But I had we had a new guy come in to our Friday night meeting a couple of weeks ago, and I got to talk. I always talk to the new guys and I talk to him he came back the next week and I said, Hey, how'd your week go? And he goes riding it out to many meetings, you know, You know, I felt I felt
kind of crappy. I'm like, Yeah, So you probably need to go to some meetings because, you know, I felt like yesterday or the day before, whatever it was, he goes, I felt like I was really struggling, that I wanted to drink. And he said, You know, I know I probably should have called somebody. He goes, But I went to bed. I said, You know, going to bed is not a bad idea
Yep.
when you feel like that, you know, calling it an early night and going to bed is it's it's not a horrible idea. And hopefully you wake up in the next day and you feel better. If you don't, then you need to do something about it. So there's lots of things we can do. like I said, sometimes it doesn't seem like it's a good idea, but hey, you got to just got to try things that work for you.
There's a lot of tools in the toolbox. You talked about calling another alcoholic as far as I'm concerned, that's step 12. You're sharing the message. And if you're having a bad day, sharing your having a bad day is sharing the message with somebody else who can help you. Another tool sleep. And I
Yeah,
think a lot of what I'm dealing with right now is this freaking time change
right.
which
Yeah,
has put me over a rail. Today was a rough day, mostly because I really haven't slept well in a couple of days. My timing is way off,
y,
way off. And there were things that were just not going well. I screamed the F-word at my computer today because something went wrong and I never do that.
yeah,
So I was already weak today.
You mentioned that. I told my wife today, I. I never. I know. I won't say never. I seldomly nap or, or lay down during the day and for some reason I've been feeling sluggish certainly the last few days it's been a little bit longer than that but last few days for sure. And I too have not slept well. part of the deal is we've got a new cat in the house and all and that old story. But the cat has bonded to me because I take care of the
animals in the house. So the cat just recently got freedom to be sort of loose where she can access the whole house at night, and she has chosen to sleep with me. Problem is, we have a dog and they get foster They're they're leery of each other. They don't you know, there's no issue between them, but they don't like to get too close to each other. And the dog likes to come into the room and lay down
next to my bed. And then the cat can't figure out how to get off the bed, to get out of the house, out of the room, and then to her litter box area. And last night at about 1:00, I noticed that the cat was in my face. And I literally think the cat was trying to wake me up so that I could help her get off the bed out of the way. So, you know, between between this cat for me, between this cat and this time change, I was on a very good sleep schedule. I would wake up every morning somewhere between
00,
me
you know,
too. I was
every
getting up
morning,
earlier.
every morning, like 630 was about almost to the time where I'd be up out of bed about 630 every morning. The alarm clock just looking up. I would be able to tell by how light it was outside what you know. Okay, it's time to get up. And now, you know, the first day I slept after seven. But, you know, I didn't sleep well cause I was up a couple of times. It has not been a good transition. It has not been a good transition for me. I was
No,
tired later.
I woke
My.
up at 630. It was pitch black.
Yeah, right, Right.
Freaked
Me too. I
me
was.
out.
today I lay down on the bed I laid down. I
All
wasn't full. I had a little bit of a headache
right,
and I lay down and my wife literally, I was laying down for about 10 minutes my wife called me. Need some help? Do some stuff with dinner. And I got up that doesn't help, you know, hot, hungry, angry, lonely, tired. All right,
now
So, and they say, you know, have you have any one of those? You got to be cautious. You have any, too. You're in trouble, right? So if you're tired, then all you need to be is one of those other ones, and all of a sudden you got, you know, you got a bad combination going on
let's see what I had today. Definitely. I was hungry. I got angry.
right?
I don't think I was lonely. If anything, I need needed all the people who are in the house today because it was a day off from school to get the hell out of this house and leave me alone.
Right,
So I wasn't lonely, but I was fatigued like you wouldn't believe.
right.
I was exhausted.
Yeah.
Bad, bad news, and I wasn't realizing it. If you're brand new and you don't have a copy of Living Sober, go grab a copy of Living Sober. It's the
Could.
cotton candy of AA. It's not heavy like the big book. It is an easy read. It's enjoyable, and every freaking page is something you can use to keep you sober for one day.
Yeah.
The best
Good.
literature you could have
That's a good piece of advice right there. It really is. It's an easy read. You can just read a little bit of it, right? Like you said, it's just very easy to pick up, read a little bit and put it down without feeling like, oh, you know, I need to finish a chapter, I need to finish this or that. So it's really a good suggestion.
So I think this is good. We talked a lot of tools when this comes up and in the moment, even when it seems so goddamn real that everything's about to fall apart, if you just use your tools and you talk to somebody, you get that focus back and you're not making an emotional decision. We need you to help us
drive the show. So I'm putting in in our newsletter, and if you don't get the newsletter for me every single week, please go to Sober Friends podcast and sign up for the newsletter because one of the things I put in there is a question of the week. It's usually like a yes or no question, something quick. And the question, Steve, that I asked this week was what format of the show do you like best a topic discussion like this, or when we have a guest interview? What do you think? They said
my my thought would be a guest, not sure.
it was a 5050 split,
No kidding.
5050, so it
Yeah.
wasn't a huge sample size. So if you want to get us some feedback, sign up, click on the newsletter. I put some effort into it. I put it in every single week, some type of sober article that you can link to and you can get a little experience, strength and hope of something going on in the world. Here's what I also want you to do. I want you to go to Apple Podcasts, give us a review, give us a rating, tell us what you
like. So other people who are scanning through looking for sober programming see us and know we're the one that is really going to be helpful. We saw a new guy yesterday, and I'm mentioning this because it was helpful to talk to somebody who's coming back and we told them about our podcast is something helpful. And Steve, what did he say?
What's a podcast?
I, I just
You felt old. That
I didn't think he was that he wasn't that old.
Yeah,
I'm like, wow.
right.
There are people who still don't know what a podcast is.
Yeah, yeah. I was surprised by that. Cause I knew the fellow from. From before. been around a little bit, but he was coming back. It was nice to see him. He seems very, He seems very interested in working the program and getting, getting back on his feet. But yeah, I was surprised by that too. but in fact, I checked out to make sure I had his right number today, and I'll give him a call tomorrow. I'll check in on him, see how he's doing.
this is another one where I was taking my will back. I didn't want to give him my number. I didn't want to talk to them. I just wanted to go home last
yeah.
night. I just wasn't in a great place because at the time change and you know what I'm
yeah,
like, I can't do that at this meeting because I'm a treasurer. I help
yep,
out with things. I speak up every week. I'm one of the people who is there every freaking week. And I have I'm not saying this out of ego, I'm saying this I have responsibility.
yeah,
I'm not important, I'm responsible.
right.
And if somebody brand new is coming in at that meeting and we're rather small, I better go over, say hello, pat them on the back, tell them it's okay. Because he
Yeah,
was he was one of these new guys is like, I don't know how to do this. I don't know how to call people. And the answer is, if you don't know how to call people, just say, Hey, I don't know what to talk about. I'm really awkward right now. And he goes,
yeah,
You can do that. Of course you can.
yeah,
Everybody feels that way. But at least you're making a connection.
He's in the right place. I mean, there's plenty of people there who, you know, our buddy Timmy was there. Like, there's plenty of people there who, you know, don't want to call people. We don't, you know, we, we don't want we do a lot of stuff we don't want to do. And calling people is always, you know, I don't mind calling people, especially people that I know. I mean, I love talking to people, even talking to you, even when I'm feeling like shit, Like I know like
Yeah,
I know when I make that phone call, I know I'm going to feel better. So I look forward to making those phone calls because I know I'm going to feel better. And it's and it's a listen, it's a learned experience, right? So. So if he can do it, he'll learn that he'll feel better. And once he
Yeah,
gets comfortable and that's the other thing I he he needs to trust, he needs to do all those things. So he's got some work to do. Hopefully he'll stick around and do the work. And I know if you if you can be helpful to him, you will. And I know if I can be
absolutely.
helpful to him, I will, too. So that's all we can do.
As pissy as I get, I'm responsible. And it makes
Yeah.
me feel better to help people. Well, we hope this helped you. And if it did, tell a friend, if you told ten of your friends and they all listen, then I can quit my job and I can do this permanently. And we solved the problem. Right?
right.
All right, Steve,
Wouldn't that be nice? All right, Matt.
we will see everybody next week by everybody.