Hey, viewers.
Sniffy's Cruising Confessions is an explicit podcast about queer sex, filtered dirty words and unfiltered descriptions of sexual activities. If hearing about orgies, anonymous sex, kink, fetish, and more offends your sensibilities, you might want to skip this. Viewer discretion is advised. It's definitely not for kids.
So, Gabe, I have to ask, have you ever hooked up with a gay trans dude? I am currently hooking up with a bisexual one.
Does that count? Yes, they're on the spectrum. I love that. Yes.
No.
Me and my boyfriend have been dating for about seven years, and I don't want to say a little over a year ago, we met someone that we were very attracted to and have sort of like we're not like Threpple status, but you know, we're like kind of dating him knocking on that door. We met in a very social, somewhat sexual setting, and so I think it was very easy to like make the introductions and be flirty and then we just kind of started to.
Hang out outside of hooking ups. It's been a lot of fun. Yeah, And I think I've also learned a lot about.
The spectrum of the trans masculine experience through him. Not that I ever make him educate me or that he's had to, but it's like I think, when someone that you care about is part of a community, and someone that you're intimate with is part of a community, you're going to learn about that community, and you should learn about that community if you care about them.
Yeah.
I have a lot of transmit in my community, and I have definitely made out with quite a few and like have birched that subject. But I find myself really investigating whether this is a fetish or a desire and really having to like and what has like prohibited me from going that next step is like I have to be very clear about where this is going and why I'm doing it, what my intention is behind it, because I don't ever want to get into a situation where
I'm fetishizing someone. Really, I have had it happen to me for many years and it doesn't feel great, you know. And so I'm knocking on that door, what.
Are you jiggling the handle? That's I am a little bit.
But then I also like get in my head and there's like a fear around like.
How how do I do this?
How do I do this, you know, and you know, I've got twenty five years experience, and so I don't want.
To look like a fool. No, I feel that.
But I feel like there are so many sexual scenarios where I'm like, oh, this is new for me, right, whether it's new partners, new experiences, new kinks, Like we should constantly feel like we are learning in our sexual lives.
Sure, yeah, but like sometimes I just want to, like, you know, feel like I'm good at something and like new tricks.
Well, to do that in these situations, you gotta practice.
Yeah, Okay, I know, I just gotta like rip the bandaid off, so to speak, and just like do it. And I do have some people that I feel really safe with and we've had lots of conversations around this, and I feel like I could do that.
But there, yeah, there's a little bit of fear there. I got to walk through fear. That's it. Well, we're walking through today.
Cruising in person or on the apps can be a different experience for trans guys who hook up with other guys, as today's guests have shared through their writing and work. This episode, we're talking to filmmaker Jules Roscom about his amazing new documentary film Desire Lines, which explores gay transsexuality and history. Then we talked to kink educator Santos jay I say about navigating the world of cruising, dating, and sex as a trans gay man.
We'll get tips and tricks for both trans guys and cisguys to improve your pickups and hookups online and in person.
Get ready today We're going cruising with trans guys. Welcome to Stiffy's Cruising Confessions.
I am Gabe Gonzalez.
I'm Chris Patterson Rosso. Each week weeks for the Sublime World of Queer sex, cruising and Relationships.
Will be talking to queer folks of all kinds. Ask them questions, swap sex stories, share intimate revelations.
A lot of us are discovering ourselves in cruising spaces. This happened to me at this toilet stall, in the library or the airport. I feel like everybody's gonna fuck a little harder here.
Damn.
So I've been like the neighborhood flat and I took pride in that I.
Was so afraid but yet so intrigued.
And the more I gave to him, the more he could take.
If you're having sex on Sniffy's you already have a moral deficit.
Over the weekend game.
And I watched this really amazing documentary called Desire Lines. It's been screening at festivals all over the country.
Through a hybrid documentary and scripted approach, the film explores how trans gay men understand and engage in their sexuality. With a diverse cast of transman we're all very open and honest about their experiences, both good and bad.
Let's take a look at the trailer.
Came to see you, doctor Paully, because I understood that you are the reigning expert on the female to male transsexual and I also understood that you had not met or or heard of a female to male transsexual who identified as a gay man. And that's exactly what I am, and I want my story preserver.
You wanted to know what it's like in an actual bathhouse.
I've talked about it.
And so when I think about the early narratives of transnis, it was like you were female to male or your male to female and that skit and you're head of a sexual. Then you started to see the like parentheses of trans men and trans masculine folk who were engaging with men, and it was like this big secret, and I was like, why is it such a secret. We were all doing it.
And so yeah, So I don't know, it's weird to be like chicken out of the egg, Like, you know, did the tea make me gay?
Was I always deftined to be interested in men?
Desire Lines was directed by Acclaim filmmaker Jules Roscomb, and we were super excited to have him join us on today's episode of Cruising Case Confessions.
Welcome Jules.
We could not stop talking about this film. We're so excited to talk to you about it. Where did this film process begin for you? What was the genesis of this idea?
I was actually thinking about making the film for almost twenty years before I started making it, which is definitely the longest I've spent thinking about a film before starting it.
And it really just came from my own experiences in community with trans men and noticing how many of us seem to develop attraction after coming out as trans, and just being so fascinated by why that is, because I think, in part, because you know, we were I would say lesbian and gay activists of the nineties did so much work to teach mostly sis straight people that gender and sexuality were not the same thing, and yet they animate each other. Right, because your sexuality is related to gender,
you are attracted to certain genders. Gender plays a part in it, so they're not totally different. So I was like, why is this happening for trans men? But it doesn't seem to happen in the same way for trans women, So it's something specific to trans masculinity. What is this about? Why is this also a process that seems not just like a joyous revelation, Oh my god, I'm attracted to men,
but somewhat fraught for a lot of transmen. And I kind of was just waiting for someone else to make the film, and then in twenty nineteen, I finally was like, Okay, I guess it's going to be me. And I don't make films to prove a point or with a predetermined thesis. It's really emerges out of dialogue with other people and from my community.
The doc begins with a quote from Lou Sullivan, an author and activist and for those who don't know, one of the first very visible transmen to come out as gay. And the quote that opens a film is our best weapon in coping with our situation is our imagination? Do you think imagination plays in our conceptions around gender and sexuality.
It's maybe the most central role our imagination, and not just around gender and sexuality, but for everyone who is marginalized in this culture, who is looking for a better or different version of the one we're currently attempting to survive. Imagination is critical, and if you don't have a robust imagination, you're not going to have a lot of fun with either your gender or your sexuality. I think that's why to me and so many other people who know about him,
Lou Sullivan's so. I mean, he's a revolutionary. Every time I think about certain parts of his life and what he did and the things he said, and how bold he was, I get just like I get kind of overwhelmed to think about what it was like to be an out, gay trans man in the nineteen seventies. It's hard enough now, and I just think about what Lou went through and how he he didn't stop no matter how many people told him he couldn't exist, or he couldn't do what he wanted to do or be who
he wanted to be. He didn't take no for an answer.
Yeah, I really love those archival interviews within the frame narrative were so moving and like really helped frame the interviews. Earlier, you were talking about how for some of the folks you interviewed, realizing their attraction to men was a bit fraught. I'm curious how many people did you interview who felt at least a little embarrassed about admitting to themselves or their friends that they wanted to have sex with men.
I mean, honestly, almost all of them were, you know, experienced some period of either embarrassment, shame, disappointment. There's so many other interviews that didn't end up in the film, but one of them in particular was like a non binary, trans masculine person who is literally afraid to take testosterone because they're afraid it will quote unquote make them get and they desperately do not want to be attracted to men. They're very pleased with their attraction to women, and they
really are afraid of that attraction. It's not even the attraction, but it's the sort of social political aspects of it. Hashtag not all gay men, but there's a lot of misogyny still deep in the game mel community and it's you know, very dick focused, and it's still really working on accepting trans men. So you know, I understand people's fears and anxiety as I had my own for sure. Deep ambivalence is about attractions. In some ways, it's not
that different than assist person coming out as gay. Right, whether coming out as lesbian or as a gay man, or as queer or whatever, we all have to fight our individual demons around that, and so I just think this is no different, though maybe a little bit more confusing in some ways.
I want to talk a little bit about why you chose the way you made the film, and what I mean by that is, like, there's this narrative that's happening, but then you're also splicing it with this documentary, and like that was so impactful for me because they both helped move the story along, and the way that you wove them together so seamlessly was really beautiful.
Can you talk to me about that process.
I mean, in some ways you answered the question right. It's that both modes of storytelling tell a story in a different way, and they impact us differently. One might be more intellectual, one might be more emotional, one might
be more sensual. Trying to sort of tell this complex story, especially if we go back to your question earlier about imagination that like these fantasy sequences, these sort of fever dreams in the bath house, moving between the bath house and the archive, but it wouldn't have been as compelling to be done as a kind of straightforward doc. Trans and queer content deserve trans and queer form. Otherwise you're sticking around peg in a square hole or whatever that's saying.
Otherwise it just becomes becomes a straight story or a straight narrative with trans and queer characters, and so we have to tell our stories differently.
I was out last night with my partner who is trans masculine, and his friend who is no binary trans masculine, and we were at like a mixed queer and straight sports bar, and one of them was like, I actually prefer venues like this to the cat katakat gay bars. They're like, I can't deal with the yes, Mama queen bars because sometimes I do feel a bit alienated there.
So I'm curious about how you've maybe seen queer spaces, specifically gay bars, sort of change and what you'd maybe like to see change or for folks to keep in mind in these spaces to be more trans inclusive, you know.
Thinking about when I was first sort of coming out as trans in the early two thousands in New York City and going to gay bars and having ninety nine percent of the time really awful experiences. I would be about to go home with someone or you know, sort of hooking up with someone in a corner or just chatting with someone or whatever, and then I have to disclose that I'm trans, and all of a sudden, I'm she. All of a sudden, I'm disgusting. All of a sudden,
like the whole mood changes. That's not my experience anymore. I would notice a real shift, or starting around ten years ago, of like I would go to Chicago or San Francisco or somewhere else, like can I open up a hookup app? And all of a sudden, it was like people were interested, not it was more interest than rather than what the fuck are you? Or why are you on here? Or just like nasty comments or even when it's not nasty comments, just ignorant comments. I think
that that's the biggest shift. Does one that some people at least know in the gay male community, No transmen exist now, I think most it's not confusing anymore. The issue I've had in some of those kinds of spaces, and I think this still persists, is there's really different culture in gay mal culture are than there is and say like queer women's culture about like bodies and consent
and touch. So I would walk into a gay bar and someone would like go to grab my dick, and then it's like literally without saying hi, you know, like there's no it's like the boundaries are not quite there,
and the like consent forward culture isn't quite there. And there's some times where that really works and it's hot, and other times where it feels really dangerous and feels like I'm not going to go into this space because I don't want to get groped tonight, or I don't want to have to cover conversation after you try to put your hand down my pants or whatever. It is.
Almost every single time I talk to assist gay man and there's like that in a sexual context, there's the assumption that I'm a bottom because I'm a transman, and for me, that doesn't happen to be true. And that's my biggest block in relationships sexual relationships with gay man? Is that assuming that all transmn are bottoms and then going again back to this imagination thing when I'm like, no, I'm not a bottom, then it's like, well I don't
understand how that could possibly work. And I'm like, well, if you can't imagine, like if that's how like you know, sad your imagination is, we're not going to have fun sex anyway, regardless of who's on top or was on the bottom, Like, so we're do it.
Was like, we have the technology, Like there's nothing more exciting than when a partner comes over and brings out a bag of dicks right.
From you.
I'm like, that's the kind of accommodation I could never get who with a cis man?
Right?
Yeah, there are some days I'm willing to take more than I and than others, and like having that option is always wonderful.
Yes, we're like live transformers.
I've seen people put that in their bios now, putting transformer in their bio. What do you think started the shift that you mentioned about ten years ago?
A couple of things, one more transmen being out and just so there being more numbers. I do think also as even though these hookup apps can also be sites of a lot of violence and you know, misogyny, transphobia, racism, all the things we all know. They became the place where the only place I was sort of willing to engage with CIS men because I could just have it out.
I'm out.
I don't have to disclose halfway through the conversation or halfway through a makeout or whatever it is. It was just there and I'd rather just if you're going to talk to me, you know. And then there's been a huge, I think media explosion around trans folks in general, certainly more about trans women or transfemininity than trans masculinity, but trans masculinity in the last like I would say, three years, has suddenly gotten way more attention and visibility, you know,
which also cuts both ways. But yeah, so I think it's a confluence of things. And I think probably my guess is that CIS men are also starting to you know, are over the last decade having more relationships sexual, romantic, whatever, with trans men telling their friends that we exist, that we're fun, that we're you know, whatever it might be. So I think, you know, it's like a little bit of word of mouth to spreading in the community and just getting more kind of knowledge and experience.
I will say we got we got quite quite hot and bothered after watching the documentary. I know, we really fell in love with this sort of bath house through line, didn't we that?
I loved it.
Yeah, I love a bath house, and so anytime there's one portrayed for me, I'm like, let's do that. And like New York doesn't really have any bathhouses anymore, so I'm like longing for that bathhouse experience.
That was not part of my initial kind of conception of the film, but it emerged out of the interviews I did with the trans guys, and I was personally very surprised to hear about how many of them had had like really positive, transformative experiences in gay bath houses, and that it was really an experience where they came to understand their their bodies on a spectrum right, and that in some ways their bodies didn't feel that different than other than guy's bodies, and it was a place
where they experienced a lot more acceptance than say in some like online spaces or other kind of bars or whatever.
I mean.
I think bathostos are just historically such a unique place which is you know, not to over romanticize them and to say they're without problem, because of course that's not true, but they can be. I think these really interesting places of cross racial, cross cross class, cross generational contact, and places where people sometimes I think, actually end up in sexual scenarios or with in sexual relationships with people that if looking scrolling through an app, they wouldn't have quote
unquote chosen necessarily. But you're in a space and you're feeling the energy, which is while we all those online spaces for me are so hard because I'm like, you might be hot and you might be saying hot things, but if we get in the same space and the energy isn't there, yeah, like the sexual energy, like what are we doing?
Like now you know it?
Just yeah, exactly exactly.
Well, I mean I love that moment where it's like there's sort of the awkward chit chat and you can feel the energy building and you're like, all right, when when is this going.
To bubble over?
When is the green like totally right in a way that you don't quite get that same excitement speaking with somebody and then you show up in their ass up and you're like, oh, well this is hot, but like I enjoy the flirtation in the build a bit. I want to be emotionally edged before we hook up.
Yeah, yeah, for sure, for sure. Yeah, all us talk about bath houses. I have to know what was your last experience at a bath house?
Like, I haven't been to very many, and I haven't been in a long time actually, So when I was making the film, at one point, I like set up a Google voicemail where people could leave their bathouse confessions. And I just remembered the most amazing story I had heard. So this transasculine person who had was a gestational parent and so had just had given birth I don't know, maybe a year prior, and was chest feeding their child, so had like milk coming, you know, was producing milk.
Went to bath house, went in, was in this room like an orgy room, and was surrounded by maybe half a dozen Cisca men who were undressing them and were in various modes of you know, we're naked, we're jerking off, we're having a good time. And they started like lactating and we're just sort of squirting their milk everywhere, and everyone was really into it, and it was amazing, and I had so doubly wanted to film this scene for the film, but I couldn't. We couldn't get it, get it,
get there. But I had just when they left this message, like this is the best bathhouse story I have ever heard. And I just love the image of like a transmasculine person who's lactating and there's like ciscay men holding their dicks, jerking off, like living for this moment, Like it's just amazing.
You really have one idea of what a bathhouse is going to be, and it's a different spot every night, you know what I mean. Like it's like you said, it's it's places where different journeys and communities intersect in really fun and surprising ways.
And it's like, you know what I mean.
If somebody would put like I'm lactating, come drink off to me lactating, I'm sure a lot of people would have been like what O.
But then doing a person seeing a person? Right, they were like, wait, I love this. That is incredible. That's so cool.
You're like, they're like, I like watching bodily fluids come out of some one's body part, and who would have thought, but I'm into this body part ejaculating also so here we go, Here we go.
Everybody in the room is leaking somehow, right, Yeah, I truly feel like we could sit here and talk to you for hours. This is fascinating. Where can people see the film this summer and where can they find you on social media?
Jules Roskam Films and then desire linesfilm dot com is our website. I hope to see you guys at are screening sometime soon.
All right, when we come back, we'll be getting tips and tricks from both CIS and trans gay men to have better and hotter interactions and sex.
Our next guest is a leather Daddy, a musician and the host of the kink Punks podcast, where he and his co host August provide holistic, ethical, kink aware, pleasure focused sex ad for trans masculine and adjacent people.
He is one of the organizers of transferno, Y's first trans mask centered sex part.
Please welcome Santos.
Jay Santos, I wanted to kick us off by talking a little bit about an article you wrote for the publication Them in February this year.
It was great.
This is an article about the what you call the complicated reality of being trans mask on apps. What are your experiences in this realm and what prompted you to write this piece.
My experiences on the apps have a lot to do with my experience, right, so, like as in, I've been in this life for almost twenty years, and I kind of at this point kind of know how to handle myself and I don't settle. So that's pretty much how I navigate these things. And that has a lot to do with the kind of education that I want to put out there, because if I can help folks trust their gut and trust themselves, you know, we can all mitigate like a little bit of harm and also like
really promote a lot more pleasure for other people. Sometimes folks will be crude and people will be like, oh, so you're a woman, I want to fuck your pussy or whatever, and it's just like it feels really irrelevant to me. First off, No, a lot of like transmand and transpasculine people who aren't super savvy don't realize that if somebody's really pushy on the apps, they're going to be ten times pushy or in.
Bed, which is terrifying.
Yeah, yeah, totally, But you know, thankfully there there are you know, good like good things do happen. I've met some wonderful subs, some wonderful play partners for some people that's like played out for several years. It's just like lots of really nice chemistry, you know, and some of the chemistry is like led to deeper relationships and some of the chemistry has just led to reliable hookups every once in a while.
We talked about not settling.
What was the conversation you have with yourself where you were just like, I'm not going to settle, and this is what settling looks like.
Before I learned how to cruise, I had different partners. I kind of learned through them that you know, the more you ask for what you want, the more you get what you want. And it wasn't until I was about thirty five I'm forty three now that I was
able to consistently ask for what I want. And still it's a little bit of a struggle, you know, and taking up space just you know, we're not encouraged to take up space in general as human beings, but really like giving yourself permission to take up space and giving yourself permission to ask for what you want. I mean, that's kind of in my mind, one of the main things is like entitlement in cruising. You know, there's a lot of entitlement to touch in shared spaces, and there's
a lot of entitlement to ask. But then those of us who care a little more, I think, don't always feel that entitlement. So I think that like giving yourself that equal entitlement helps you know not to settle. Also, I feel like I have settled when I feel like I can't do better, or like I'm impatient or whatever. And you know, I've just learned a certain amount of patients because a lot of times when I settle, I don't get what I want.
Anyway, No, same, And I think this idea of like accepting that you can be entitled is revolutionary for me.
Yeah, because like, as a.
Black queer person, even in the cruising space, I've never felt like.
I could be entitled to anything.
Yeah, And so giving myself permission to have that entitlement, I'm running with that.
Yeah. I mean, if we could all be as entitled as a mediocre white man, that.
Wi ha oh, So send those I think one of the most powerful parts of this article is where you discuss your body and kind of have this moment of affirmation explaining that your body doesn't need to meet anyone else's standards, right part of this deciding not to settle. Did engaging with people on apps make it harder to realize that you don't need to meet anyone else's standards, or did it in some roundabout way help you make this realization.
One of the things about being on the app apps is the the absolute crudeness, right, which is honestly part of why we're there for it.
Right.
Also, I think rejection is just data, you know, right, And it's not even about you, like it's it's it's how other people perceive you from their background, et cetera. Getting rejected a lot and trying to acquiesce to other people's needs or et cetera. Like just it doesn't it doesn't get you far. And if you hit that wall enough times, you know you kind of you're just like, wait, what fuck it? Like what do I want? I feel like that's an important point to reach.
I'm curious how do things differ for you when you get to the in person cruising scenario versus the apps.
I mean, I started out in person cruising at Glory Holes because of the anonymity. It's really basic. But the first time I heard suck that dick boy, I was just like, this is this is perfect, this is music to my ears. That affirmation and that curiosity led me to start going to sex parties eventually. So there's kind of this Spidey sense where you're like, that guy is looking at me, and if I look back at him, he's going to look back at me again, which means
I should probably talk to him. And if you just talk to somebody like that, you know, you end up in lots of fun trouble if you want to be. Getting a handle on that, and just understanding that sex is available, you know, makes things like sex parties and such a lot easier. Before I really started transition, it was hard for me to relate to other people because I didn't really understand the vector from which my personality
was going to. So it's kind of like, if I'm this spectral entity who like doesn't really understand where I fit within gender, how can I interact with other people.
Authentically?
Yes, exactly exactly. Getting myself right with myself kind of helped me figure out how to cruise.
What advice do you have for folks who do want to start cruising based on what cruising spaces look like today, I.
Would say one of my first things is some folks are coming from Saffik backgrounds, and some folks are just like not necessarily coming from any particular queer background in general, and they're not used to being touched without being approached about it first, being aware that that is a frequent occurrence in gay male spaces, and to be to be ready for that. You can always just push somebody's hand away, And that goes back to the entitlement, right. That goes
back to asking for what you want. Another thing is get your vaccines, take your meds. You know, risk means that it can happen to you, and you know there isn't any STI that is not treatable, and it's it's just a thing that happens and it's totally fine. I really think it's important to value yourself. A lot of people are afraid to go into gay spaces because they are afraid of not being affirmed and afraid of people gatekeeping. And if people are gatekeeping, they're not hot period period.
If somebody is rejecting you, they're helping you dodge a bullet. Because it wouldn't have been hot with them anyway.
Yes, what advice would you give to a ciscay man who's looking to look up a transascular men?
Trans Men are men, right, and which seems obvious, but it's it's it bears repeating. And also not all transvasculine people are men, right, but those of us who do identify as men are men. Early in transition, I felt like I was, you know, a girl becoming a man, you know, And then later on I was like, wait a minute, I was I you know, corrected and corrected and corrected or coursed and course to coursed every single
day growing up. I didn't actually get to expand into this boyhood that was right there, right in front of me. And then I understood, you know, after you know, a long time that I was boil along. So it feels very much for me like less of going from one gender to another and more like awakening from gas lighting and settling into the thing that I always was. Everybody's
got a different experience of their gender. But if we think of it in that way or other ways that are presented to us, you know, we can really take the heart that yes, transmit are men. So that's the place that I always want to start with that. So another thing is be curious, ask people, ask people what they like, what they're into. You can ask people, how do you like to be touched? You can you know, if you want to be subby, you can say, put my hands where you want them, or put my dick
where you want it or whatever. Just being open to lots of possibilities and speaking of possibilities, transmend and transpasculine people may have a variety of different procedures and hormones, et cetera that that our bodies may be, you know, that we may use on our bodies. So I there's there's this, uh, there's this idea that you know, trans men are these like merman, you know, like we've we've we've got we've got, uh, you know, our our top chop and then we've got like, you know, our our
pussy's there, you know. And and also that's not a word that everybody loves. But yeah, so so yeah, I mean there's lots of different, lots of different possibilities. Lots of people get lower surgery, lots of people don't get top surgery. Some people have hormones, some people get hormones, some people don't. So there's lots of different possibilities in terms of that and just keeping an open mind, you know.
And you know, lots of people have sex and lots of different ways, and some of it relates to gender, and some of it relates to just different preferences in general, and also abilities, like lots of people with disabilities have to have sex in different ways. Other things would be wash your damn hands, wash your damn dick. If I'm you know, at a play party or at a sex party, you know, I want to make sure that a dick hasn't been in an ass before it's going inside of me.
That's very important. It's really important to be aware that like t is not birth control, to stopsterone is not birth control?
Yes, yeah, so what are.
You doing for that? Are you having that conversation? Do you have a vasectomy if you're just gonna like go raw. So there's lots of different things to think about. And also some people do need to use condoms because they're you know, delicate ecosystems will react badly to new stimuli, you know, or like new new things going into them. But not everybody uses their front hole. And let's see in terms of in terms of oral anything that is presented to you as a dick, treat it like a dick.
So that could be fingers, that could be a dildo, that could be like a phallus on the person's body. Treat it like a dick. Don't treat it like a clitterius, and you know you'll probably be fine. Check in with the person. Whenever I have sex with a guy who hasn't had sex with a trans guy before, like a sis guy who hasn't had sex with a trans guy before, I'm usually like, you fucked a guy, right, And they're like, yeah, Like you'll be fine. Just treat me like a guy. Yeah, exactly,
You've got it, you know. So you know, if you're going from back to front, I'm gonna stop you. But you know, there are little things like that, little little you know, things to be aware of, but overall, just like if you are having sex with a man, just treat him like a man and it'll be fine.
So I have to ask, as a person who kind of struggles with this myself, how do you deal with chasers and fetishizing right?
How do you navigate that?
Because I find myself really interested in having connections with transmit. But I don't I worry if I'm fetishizing or if I'm chasing, right, and how do I what's that line? And how do you navigate that? Yeah, that's really.
Cool, lots of answers. If I feel like I am the only thing standing between some guy and my genitals, that's what being chased feels like, you know, like it's not about me, it's about what he wants, what he expects. Right, So if that's not the vibe that you're coming from, you're probably not chasing.
Okay, So like I just needed to hear it from you.
Yeah, so I I have every confidence that that you'll be fine.
We can't put it to the test soon. Don't worry. There will be parties coming up. We got you.
Frankly, for chasers, like actual chasers, I feel like there's there is a very select, narrow slot, no pun intending I.
Was going to say where.
Now, Yeah, so a very a very select, like very narrow place where that where that fits if you feel good taking out the adoration from that, which is complicated because it comes with a lot of ship that people don't want to hear, right, so basically like I don't want to hear about my body. I don't want to hear about what you want really because it's like fucked up. But the experience of just taking off your clothes and having somebody go, oh my god, that's amazing, you know,
like just that kind of thing. They're not marveling in you, They're marvel in their fetish If you can pause wanting to be seen, you know, if it's not important to you to be seen by someone and just to take take everything at face value, then that works, you know, Like I've I've definitely had lots of lots and lots of sex that was like that, but also like if that's not something you can do, it's not gonna be fun. No.
I appreciate you delineating that because I think, as you said, it's like there, and I mean, I think this can apply to so many sexual scenarios. There's sort of a fine line between adoration, affirmation, and fetishizing, and I think the way you phrased that difference is like such a clear delineation that I think folks can walk away with and be like, oh yeah, am I.
Hoogab with a person?
Or am I hoogay with a person because I'm fetishizing a body part, their colors, their skin, their gender identity, their genitals.
Like that's yeah.
Yeah. Fetishizing is often you transplanting your your idea of what you want onto a person. So I mean, if you want to if we're talking about you right for right now, if you want to connect with somebody and that's hot for you, that's not fetishizing.
Yeah. No, I just want to connect with these people totally, that's yeah.
Yeah, easy.
They turned me on in ways I can't describe.
Okay, So we've been talking a lot about these spaces, and I know that you are one of the folks involved with organizing Transferno, which is sort of a companion party to Inferno, which is a very trans inclusive event. But I'm curious what drew you to become one of the organizers at Transferno and why why that event, what it means to you.
Chris Gray started it with Adam Barron, So I just want to be very specific about giving Chris Gray his props. I would go to every single like Inferno event or lots of different Inferno events, and Adam is just so so kind and welcoming, and he invited me to participate in Transferno back when it was called play House, and this was in twenty eighteen, twenty nineteen. I think yeah and yeah. It was a really it was a really
hot party. And at the time the difference between Transferno and Inferno was all the trans guys were getting their dick sucked, whereas at Inferno nobody wanted to be seen doing that. But things are very different now.
Oh yeah they are. Yeah, who's like, why?
No? No, No, very different now. Inferno is is such a wonderful space with I think it's pretty singular in that there are lots of like the The idea is no fucking shade, right, which really promotes a lot of community. In my opinion, The idea for Transferno as it is now is that if we center one group of people,
it doesn't mean that we exclude others. It means that we can uplift these people and give them lots of attention and then everybody can come join and celebrate and do whatever it is that they do.
What has been your hottest experience? While I transfer no.
Hottest, I don't know about hottest. I always have great, amazing times. There was one of my favorites was there was this big bear in the sling and I love a bear, and I was just like, all right, well I'll go up to him. And he was into it, and so, you know, his legs were up, he was in the sling. So I started playing with his ass and you know, I just felt his asshole just soften around my fingers. And the more I gave him, the
more he could take. And I was like, I'm not going to push you if you don't want it, but I bet you can. I bet you can take my fist. And and so he just he produced a backpack that had jaylube, so he was ready. You bet right, he was super ready. Like I I got all the way in there. It was amazing. It was really super hot, and it was it was the location of the sling was somewhere where lots of people were watching. I'm not someone I know the one.
It's one.
Thing.
Yeah, I love that thing has truly accommodated all of Brooklyn.
That's amazing.
Sentos, thank you so much for joining us. We also got to thank Jules Rosscom for joining us remotely. What a wonderful interview.
Where can folks find you online.
I have a podcast called King Punk's k I n K p U n X. Folks can find Transferreno through the Inferno Party, which has a substack n y C Inferno dot substack dot com.
Perfect Cool, Thank You.
Sniffy's Cruising Confessions is a production from Outspoken podcast Network from iHeart Podcasts. It's directed by Adam Barron, produced by Stevie Williams and Cameron Femino, and executive producers by Eli Martins. Cruising Confessions is presented by Snippy's, the ultimate map based cruising platform for gay by and.
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What put Your put your poots to?
Y mm hmm,