As much as you love the holidays, it's hard to love the holiday travel. But it gets a whole lot easier when you're staying at an Airbnb. As you know, we had a family reunion trip this last summer, and it was awesome. And we're talking about doing it again. And when we do it again, I think we're going to do an Airbnb because it was so much fun the first time that we found a place that housed all of us. So it was super fun. And I can't wait for the next one.
Hey, guys, I got a mouthful of English muffin with a glass full of apple juice here on the rocks. Thank you very much. And I'm here with my surprise guest today, who is a clapping sea lion. Oh, my God. This is, by the way, before Jason and Will are on. Welcome to Smart List. Smart. Crazy. I can't see surprise guest yet. Maybe their camera's off. No, you're not supposed to. How does it work? You're not supposed to. By the way, he won't stop clapping. Oh, we got a live one? Yeah. Oh, boy.
Might want to just get right to this guest into our chat afterwards. We've got some folding work going on over here. We had, by the way, what a wonderful... dinner we had last night we had a nice dinner didn't we the three of us we really did listener you know the three of us don't really get a chance to have just a three top uh you know Not since the early 90s. Yeah. It went really well. Sean generously picked up the bill. I know. Kind of sneaky-like.
Very sneaky. I got to be honest. I enjoy doing it. I know. I know it's nice to do, but consider this sometime. And again, I don't want this to seem like I'm being ungrateful because it was very nice of you, so thank you. This is all dressed up in a thank you. Yeah. But keep in mind. I got a heart out in five minutes. Other people. Yeah.
might want to have the opportunity to do that as well. I know. So you don't want to take away from other people the ability. Save it. Will's got about the fucking shortest fucking T-Rex arms you'll ever find. What are you talking about? dinner table this fucking guy you could fucking you could drop a check on fire in front of him and he wouldn't bat it out he wouldn't touch it he just let it catch his fucking pants
on fire before he touched a burning chair. That is so untrue. That is patently untrue. Sean, one of the crew members just walked through. Yeah, a bear just walked through your living room. A bear crew member. Speaking of livestock, we ate a lot of cooked cow last night. And I woke up at 2.30 in the morning and had to chug Pepto-Bizzo. because my stomach is so unused to... It was like a four-pound steak. Isn't that so good going down, though?
Oh, yeah, it was great. No, I love that. It was so good. Actually, you know what, Sean? After you left us, we went and tried. We were both stuffed. As we know, we only went five more blocks after you. That fucking steak sandwich.
We're at Bradley's house, and he's got a steak sandwich. You know, he's opening a steak sandwich shop in the Lower East Side. Yeah, so good. By the way, he made them for all of us. Danny and Coops, something like that? I think that's right. Is it Danny and Coops? Check it out. I think it's on Avenue A, he said.
Yeah, in the Lower East Side, it makes just... So good. I think, what did he say on the menu? It's just steak sandwiches. It's just steak sandwiches, yeah. Either with cheese or without, period. No, with onions or without. Oh, God. Right, right.
It's going to be huge. So Sean, after that meal we had last night, Jason and I go over there and then Bradley's literally cooking these up in his house and he goes, here we go. And he's got kids there and a bunch of other people. And he's like, here you go. And we're like, no, man, we just... We just had an absolute feast. Yeah. And then within 20 minutes, JB gets up.
And has one? Well, no wonder you got up at 2.30 in the morning. Well, but because he walked me through the whole process of how he got the recipe from this guy who makes the best steak sandwiches in Philadelphia. And then, you know, Bradley like perfected it over like a year.
because he just loved these sandwiches so much and he taught himself how to cook them and then approached the guy to open up an annex. It's so good. You know, basically. Don't you remember he made them for us like, I don't know, eight, nine months ago. They were so good. Yes, I do remember. Anyway, it was really, and I ended up having one too.
They were absolutely delicious. And I walked back because... First of all, I got two things to say about it. So when we got it from the... Number one. When we got it from the table last night at dinner, Jason... You pulled aside and said, I got to run in the bathroom real quick. So me and Will went outside and waited for you. I should have thrown it all up at that point. I should have taken it all out of me. In the bathroom. And then we're standing there and then you come out.
And both Will and I are like, wait a minute, who's this fucking guy coming up and talking to us out of the blue? He's like, it's crazy. And I thought, where's JB? I'm like, I'm thinking. You're like, who's this twink? I don't even know what a twink is. Is that good or a bad thing? No, you're a twink. So listener, they're talking about because I've had my, I've looked like Jesus Christ for the long time.
last nine months basically was i'm playing this guy with long hair and long beard and all that stuff and i just cut it all off um because we came to the end of the number of people and sean you're probably the same who have come up to me As if I'm your wife over the last six months ago.
Or texted me. People have gone so far and gone like, hey, what's up with Jason? How come he's here so long? And I'm like, he's an actor. But they all assume. I love that nobody assumes that I would be doing it for any sort of acting part. Nobody thinks you're in trouble.
Everybody thinks I'm in trouble. They go there instead of like, well, he's not much of a thespian. He's not going to change his look for a part. He must have just hit fuck it and we've got to send him some money. Why did Marty Berg... Grow his hair. But anyway. And then you dropped me off. And then we said, I went, I'm like, well, where's Uptown? Because I'm so lost downtown. Like, I don't understand. And he would just go that way. I was walking for like 20 minutes.
And he was a half a block from 8th Avenue, and he walked all the way into the Hudson River. That's crazy. I had no idea where I was. I was scared out of my mind. And then I asked these four people, I'm like... Do you know which direction Uptown is? Well, first, give us your wallet. You got mugged. You asked people which direction Uptown is. It was a young married couple and then in-laws. And the married couple was like, yeah, you go that way. And then the mom of the in-laws goes, oh my.
And then the two young married couples are like, oh my God, smartless. And then the dad goes, just to make sure to keep me real, he goes, I don't know who the hell you are. Isn't that the funniest instinct that people have? I've had people come up and go like, hey, my friends want to pick. I have no idea you. I want to pick you out of a lineup of one. I couldn't care.
Zero to me. Yeah, you're zero. But anyway, they want to get a picture. And you're like, okay, well, thanks for telling me, man. I didn't ask. Anyway, let's get into our guest. He's been waiting long enough. Honestly, Sean, I feel like, why are you crying? Anyway. We've unearthed, okay, let's not get into it. Okay.
This guy makes me laugh so hard. I love this guy. We've got a lot in common. Both Midwestern boys. Large Irish families. Interesting fact, he's been in over 200 commercials. He's performed for the Pope. I think that means stand-up. 200 commercials, that's amazing. And how when he was eight, he stood in line for two hours to meet Jimmy Walker from Good Times just to have him sign Dynamite. Well, today...
We get the other explosive Jimmy. Guys, it's the brilliant, the prolific, the funny, the lovable Jim Gaffigan. Oh, wow. Wow. Hello there. I'm a big fan of yours. Oh, shucks. You know, what was so weird is you guys went to dinner last night, and I don't know why, and I think the listeners should know.
that you made me be the waiter, which I thought was strange. Well, just as a rehearsal. Hear us out, Jim. We just figured that we know how real you like to keep it. Yeah. I mean, a lot of people should know that Sean Hayes does not. Not tip. No. Not financially. Which is weird. I said, is this it? Do you need change? And he said, I need you to change your attitude. And I was like, all right.
Now, Jim, do you still have that autograph that says Dynamite from Jimmy Walker? No. Damn it. I love that. I only remember that because I saw a photo of it. Because I had a dynamite hat. Yeah. I'm probably older than all you guys. You are. Probably not. There was a big...
I mean, Will looks the oldest, but like the big thing is that. Wait a second. Do I? No, I think it's, Will could be like, well, I think Will would be, there is, a lot of people don't know, he's doing a movie where he's playing Gavin. but Newsom's dad. Yeah. This is the Arnett roast. Will, we didn't want to tell you before we got started. You know, Will, I just do that because I'm scared. Why? Frankly, I'm a little scared. I'm intimidated. Three buddies. I'm the new kid.
I don't know how to fit in. You're so safe here. You're already fitting in beautifully. The dirty little secret about this podcast is it really doesn't matter who we have on as a guest because we don't let them talk anyway. We just like to hear ourselves talk. You're on cruise control for the next. Right. Or 45. Jim, we don't know each other well, but you came up very kindly to Canada and did that hospital benefit. Do you remember that? Or did you block it out?
No, I remember it. I remember it very clearly. He was, you were hilarious. Oh, thanks. Absolutely crushed. Always is. And you always crush. Yeah. Yeah. I know, because you've been doing it. He never pushes. Never pushes. Just trying to get my dad to like me. And I don't know if it's going to work. Is dad still with us?
No, he's been dead for like 20 years. You're waiting for a message? He's right over here. He's just off camera. Wake up! I've been telling every morning, I'm like, wake up. He's really tired. He's really tired. He just put new ice on him every day. Yeah, he's just... Hey, how did you get to be in 200 commercials? I'm actually envious of that. I was on this show, Silver Spoons. No. That was Jason. No, there was an era in the 90s.
where they really love the idea of the dumb white guy in every commercial. And I was like, I'll do that. Sean wasn't available. I did those too. I did a ton of them. There's a lot of dumb white guy work. I immediately started thinking. oh, wait, this is one of those guys that's got one of those campaigns. It's like, you know, like the Jack in a Box guy. Or the progressive girl. Yeah, exactly. It would add up quickly. Yes, I would do. I did Rolling Rock and...
Saturn, which was a car company. And this is back in the days when they would pay, right? You could get about 30 grand by the time a national commercial is done with its cycle, right? It wasn't about, you could count on about 30,000. Absolutely. How many brands did you sink, do you think? I would say... Rolling Rock for one, Saturn for two. Wait, Jimmy, so you were born in Elgin, Illinois. That's so crazy. Is it Jimmy?
Yeah, it's Jimmy. When I was a little kid, I was Jimmy. Now, where are you from, Sean? Glen Ellen. So it's like 20 minutes from Elgin. Yeah. Well, we moved pretty quickly to Northwest Indiana. I mean, when I was eight, I guess. And you wanted to be a farmer? I did. What did you want to farm? You know, I think corn. Sure. It's weird. It's a pretty vague dream. Not soybeans. Not something sexy like soybeans or rye, but like corn, you know, like a normal plant. No, I...
I did want to be a farmer. And then, but I also wanted to be an actor. I know, like early on, and your dad was the CEO of the Mercantile National Bank of Indiana. Yes. So crazy. And then you wanted to be, and what did he think of you wanting to be an actor? He thought it was pretty fucking stupid. No, you know, it was, my parents were children of...
you know, like their parents went through the depression. So like the whole objective was to seek security. And I think my family had been in the country and my father was the first one. to go to college. But before that, everyone was coal miners. So it was just like, we finally got to the middle class and you want to become a show person? It was just absurd. It was like, why throw it away? Yeah, but it's interesting because this happened.
all the time we talk about this all the time you're the youngest of six I'm the youngest of five and it seems to be like a lot of people we talk to the youngest in the family always wants to be The actor or the performer or the attention seeker, I guess. Isn't that weird? Well, the alcoholism was so significant by the time we were teenagers. Yeah, same. Were you close with your dad? My dad was this huge influence on me, but it was weird. I think it was mostly trying to make my mom laugh, but...
You know, the whole father relationship is so complex. And again, I think, I don't know about with you, there was such a parental fatigue that had hit by the time I was a teenager. My dad was like, I didn't even. sign up for any of this. You know what I mean? And having children myself, I'm kind of like, can they go to boarding school or middle school? Can they do that? It's just...
It's exhausting, right? You say you do have children yourself or you don't? Yes, yes. I have five. I have five. Oh, my God. Wow. I know. That's a lot of kids. I'm a very fertile guy. How old is your youngest, Jim? He just turned 12. Oh, wow. Wow. And I feel like with every kid, there was a reason for me to like him. You're like, all right, this one likes me so much. I like him. And then my youngest one looks like me.
And so I'm like, all right, I got a mini me. I got to be excited about that. It is amazing, right? Like how you have, you develop these different relationships with the kids based on. completely different stuff. I mean, I know you're kind of making a half a joke, but like there is something to be said for like, well, the initial bond started because...
that little thing that couldn't speak or do anything yet has an attraction to me. And there's, it's almost like a puppy. Like kids are like puppies before they can speak. Yeah, of course. Right? And it's like, oh, they jump on my lap all the time. And so, well, I like you too. And now you're my favorite pet. And then your role changes.
And you're like, okay, I'm the peacekeeper between, because daughters and mothers go through some weird crap. And now I'm kind of Boutros, Boutros, golly here, you know, trying to keep some peace. And then there's just different ones where you're like, all right, I'm the evil cop.
that has to be the disciplinarian. Yeah, or the one kid's actually less like a puppy and much more like a cat. So they're difficult. They don't give you the time of day. So you end up being very drawn to that one. You know, I got to win that one over, right?
Independence. You've got almost a half a dozen there. It must be. My relationship with my kids is so good. I don't have to worry about rules. We just kind of click. Oh, man. Sorry, I just wanted to. Just click, click, click. Hey, Jim, you don't really think I look older than the other guys. Let's double back a little bit. Now, Jim, where are you? Are you in Los Angeles, New York? I'm in New York. Have you been in New York a long time?
I've been here for 35 years. I've done some time in, you know, when I was on a show, I would be in L.A. for six months or six weeks. I did pilot season. Oh yeah. Every year. Now your time in Los Angeles, is this something you kind of, you know, hold your nose and kind of get through it or do you like it out there? I don't have anything against Los Angeles. I mean, I'm not a fan of sunlight, but I'm very much... Too much show business is not good for...
my mental health. That's what I like about New York, that you have friends that are not in the business and you can kind of separate yourself from it, if that makes sense. And we will be right back. Before I get into it, I just want to say thank you to my husband, Scotty, who's helped me through a lot of hard times, and my therapist, who's helped me through a lot of hard times. And along with the people I just shouted out, there's another person we don't get to thank enough.
ourselves, right? It's sometimes hard to remind ourselves that we are trying our best to make sense of everything. And in this crazy world, sometimes that's not so easy. So I want to share with you something my therapist told me the other day, because I was getting this medical thing done where I was like...
I don't know if you've ever done an MRI and it's very claustrophobic. And I started to freak out, right? And she goes, when you fight the discomfort, it makes it worse. Your brain is misinterpreting discomfort as danger. And you need to surrender to it. kind of surrender to the discomfort and anchor yourself in reality because there's no danger. It's just uncomfortable. So if you have anxiety or fear of something,
It's not dangerous. You're just uncomfortable. I thought that was pretty profound. Anyway, that's why I love her and I thank her. And that really resonated for me personally. It really helped me in that moment for what I was going through. BetterHelp offers affordable online therapy on a customizable schedule that works for you. Connect with a credentialed therapist by text, phone, or video call. Get empowered to be the best version of yourself. Anyone can benefit from BetterHelp.
therapists in the uk already better help can provide access to mental health professionals with a wide variety of expertise in mental health let the gratitude flow with better help our listeners get 10 off their first month at betterhelp.com slash smart list that's better And now, back to the show. Do you ever worry that like by having that healthy kind of distance from show business and the pursuit of it and all that stuff that you run the risk of not going to the places that you want to go?
Career-wise, I ask because these guys always keep me in check and give me proper ridicule about how sort of keeping my eye on the ball I am about like, what's happening in the business tree and what should I be doing next and all that. stuff i can't help it but um i envy those that uh that have a healthy distance but you also grew up in it so that's a little different in that way yeah yeah yeah i yeah i feel like i've definitely uh
I think my career might be completely different if I lived in LA. I mean, it is 99% of the business. Right. But it's also... I don't want to sound like the person, you know, like there's a, you know, like, I'm not like Sam Shepard said, I'm on a farm in Virginia. Right. You can fax me only. You know what I mean? It's like, I wish I could be that guy. I mean, I.
I definitely care. I'm definitely the guy who's, you know, works really. I'm the guy who does his homework. You know what I mean? I don't even know. I don't even know my agent's name. No, yeah, you've been able to stay so relevant for so long. You've had this really long career, and yet you've been able to, you know... live outside of it to a certain extent, yeah? Oh, thanks. Yeah, it's admirable. Jim, how many years, what was your first break and how many years have you been doing stand-up?
I've been doing it for like 35 years. And was it always stand-up first or was it an actor first and then you wanted it? It was a little bit of both, but it was... I would say, yeah, it was, you know, stand-up was something I always did, but I always wanted to act. But there's such...
fantastic actors in New York. Yeah, but the Jim Gaffigan show was hilarious. I want to give this stand-up. First of all, what was the first night? What was the first time you were like in front of people? The first time I was so... You know, there's such an audacity necessary to go into this business, right? And also with stand-up to go on stage that... I waited until someone dared me. I had a fear of public speaking, so I took an improv class. This is way before UCB existed. And...
And in the improv class, someone was like, there's a stand-up seminar. This is in 1990, 1991. Is this New York or Chicago? New York. And then I, so I did stand-up for the first time. And it was, I fell in love immediately. And then... How about that? Kind of bombed for six months. Yeah. Did you write jokes that first time or did you just kind of wing it? What did you do? Oh, yeah. No, I did this. It was kind of like a seminar thing. It was like someone really holding your hand.
It wasn't like me and my buddies went to a club and I got on stage and it was magic. Do you still, like, what is the oldest joke that you still have in your rotation? Like, still one from the early years? I mean, it's... it's i i you know at this point i you know i haven't done jokes from back then for at least a decade. And sometimes I'll write a joke and I'll think, oh, this is great. And then...
you know, my wife would be like, you know, that was on like your third special that I'm like, Oh, all right. You're like, I don't even remember that. I had done a joke. You already complained about your kids that way. Does she dabble in our industry as well? Yes, yes. So she was the... She did directing, and she also, like, was the showrunner of the Jim Gaffigan show. Oh, wow. And when we were, you know, initially with stand-up, we used to totally...
Once we were married, we wrote together. And then with five kids, you're lucky to have a conversation with your partner. Wait, so she's showrunner for Jim Gaffigan's show. What, you had an overall with the network or with the studio? Yeah, that was before cable completely fell apart, even though I guess it's coming back. We had a deal at CBS. We did two rounds of pilots. They were committed to single-camera comedies, and then they weren't. And so they released us, and we...
We had an offer from a couple cable things, but the most attractive offer came from TV Land. TV Land was going to do this. massive rebranding thing. And of course, we were like, all right, yeah, great. And then we went over there and then like a month before the show started airing, they... Yeah, we're not going to do a massive rebranding. Shawnee did some TV land work. Yeah? Yeah, we did. We produced... With Betty White.
Hot in Cleveland. Yeah, wait a minute. Were you on, was Teachers, you guys? No, that was Melissa, I think. Hot in Cleveland with Petty White. Yeah. That was the first, I think that was the first show that launched TV Land. Yeah, I think that was part of the big TV Land relaunch. Yeah.
We got lucky. Wait, so what network was Jim Gaffigan's show on that? I forget. It was on TV Land. Yeah. It was. It was on TV Land. So you and your wife write the pilot together or she writes the pilot? I wrote the pilot with Peter Tolan. Oh, yeah. Who's really funny, yeah. And then he was under a Sony deal, and so he couldn't go.
when we went to TV land. I mean, sometimes they re-aired every episode on Comedy Central, so that's where people would end up seeing it. Yes. So, wait. So, God, so much I want to talk about this. Oh, wait, by the way. I heard you love to go to Steakhouse after each stand-up thing. I love steak, yeah. We just went to a steakhouse last night. We had great steak last night. You ever been to Strip Steakhouse? Strip? Oh, yeah.
And so do you guys try, how often do you guys get together and pretend they're like each other? Yeah, not very. Not that often. It's too hard. We're not that good at acting. No, we have dinner when we're on town like once a week, but it's with everybody. and family. Just the three of us is a rare thing. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's what's also so great about whenever I do podcasts is like,
It forces you to have these conversations with your friends because things can spin out of control and it's like getting paid to hang around your friends is not bad. Yeah, that's how this started. I know you guys donate all your money. A lot of people don't know that. All the money is donated, which is amazing. Are you worried, though, like...
I do think about, because I love steakhouse too, like in LA. Sean's still at the steak, sorry. Yeah, I can't wait to hear what Jim might be worried about in the steakhouse industry. What is it, Sean? I mean, sure, jump in if you want. Yeah.
But I love... Please finish this. I like the simplicity of the menu. There's like six things. Because remember Jerry's Deli in Los Angeles? Remember Jerry's Deli? You sit down. I bet Cheesecake Factory must really piss you off. Cheesecake Factory too. It's a book.
And it's like 200. And I almost have to get up because my anxiety, like if there's too many choices, I can't do it. But a steakhouse, it's like there's four things here and there's four sides. What do you want? The sauces that get me pissed off at a steakhouse, though. I never know which way to go.
That's why I always do ketchup. I always do ketchup with my steak. Oh, fuck. You are Midwestern. Yeah, it really is. I like it at a steakhouse when they kind of show you the meat or they show you a potato. We got a potato. We got this lobster flown in from Maine. It's just like... Warren does that. It's like so...
Dumb guy-ish. Like, hey, you're a dumb guy. This is a potato. We can cook it for you. I love it. Now, I know I'm jumping all around, but I want to go back to your career. Jimmy, when you first did Beyond the Pale, that was your first stand-up special, and you had... I don't know how many after. And what blew my mind is how many Grammys you've been nominated for. Oh, thanks. How many times have you been nominated? I think seven times.
But, you know, I'm never going to win one. But that's crazy. That's amazing. Well, because some of it is, like, I'm just so thrilled that the Grammys even include... you know, stand-up comedy. And in the end, there's always, you know, some very important newsworthy comedic event that's occurred, you know, whether it be... you know, Chappelle doing anything. Or like, you know, one year it was Weird Al Yankovic did the first comedy album in 25 years. It's like, obviously he's going to win.
You know what I mean? Right, right, right, right, right. Yeah, but I don't know. I think it's pretty... Yeah, you're right. You're never going to win. Which is the award with the circle that spins around? Is that the Tony? Sean, does it spin? It does spin. It does. Wait, do you have it there or is it in LA? It's in LA. Oh, all right. The Grammy's the one with the horn.
By the way, it's so funny. That's the gramophone, yeah. With the horn. It's fun, isn't it, Jim? Sometimes you sit back and just... Just marvel. You just point the pointer, and these two little kitties, they just go all over the rug. And you just point. Point the pointer. A little ball of yarn. I usually ask people if they have any crazy theater stories, but in this case, do you have any crazy fan stories that you have that any kind of insane, out of all of the...
Well, out of all the touring you've done, for sure, but of the specials or the tour where just somebody insane didn't ever stop. Yeah, no, there's, I mean, there's definitely, you guys were talking about, I feel like I'm so goofy looking. So like, I'm very recognizable if you know who I am. You look like John America. That's what you look like. But like a pale version of it. So it's like, I'm either the guy that...
you know, shovels your driveway or I'm Jim Gaffigan, right? So there is, so I could be, and I have horrible vision, but because I'm pale and goofy looking, people can see me from far away. They're like, oh, is that, hey, is that Jim Gaffigan? And I can't see who they are because I'm blind. But you've been loved and on television or some form of media for so long. You must not be able to walk down the street often without getting stopped or going, hey, hey, that's...
Hey, yeah, do you get a lot of that? Yeah, a lot, you know, like I'm playing, I'm, you know, I've provided them a riddle. You know what I mean? Like, hey, do I, how am I supposed to know you? And you're like. You catch a lot of people just staring at you from across the room, trying to figure it out. Especially in strip clubs. They're always like, who is that guy? Because it's too dark.
You've got five kids. What are you doing here? Trying to get a six kid. Yeah, they take their phone out. Click. No, but you were maybe going to tell us. Oh, yeah. You know what I would say is the... You know, there is a theater story. I did that championship season on Broadway. And it was... The amount of testosterone in the cast was absolutely insane. It was me, Kiefer Sutherland, Brian Cox, Chris Noth.
and Jason Patrick, whose dad wrote the play. And so it's a great play. And it was, but like, so like when you talk about theater stories, we went, I mean, it's also like this, this last. I think of, like, there's this last generation of people that... And there's a segment of this generation that drink like our parents did. And those guys are those guys. And so every night we would...
Every night was like a, it was, the stamina is just bizarre. Like, these guys can throw it away and then get up and do a matinee. And I was just like, I can barely walk. But I wonder how that's... I'd love to check in on those fellas now and see how it's aging. Because at some point, you do pay the bill. Yeah. Just the stamina is in forever. Well, I'm sure they're all doing, but it was so bizarre to go out on stage because I always had this vision of Broadway being...
Oh my, you know, like people in top hats and stuff like that. And it's like people would walk out and be like, 24, it's sex in this, it's, you know, it was just bizarre how it was. It was that people were going to so they could see Mr. Big. Right, right, right, right, right. But yeah, people really, really like it. But your earlier stand-up stuff, when you were first starting, is there...
Do you tend to remember the good performances more than the bad ones? I try to block out some really humiliating things. But I did a show on Long Island at Governor's. And, you know, Long Island is great, but like parts of Long Island, you know, it can be not necessarily combative, but just kind of. Oh, yeah. And I would walk on stage. When I started looking like the farm boy that I wanted to be. And...
These, you know, like these New Yorkers would be like, look at this guy. You know what I mean? And so like early 90s comedy was very combat driven. Like this guy is just a pussy. You know what I mean? And so I remember. I was on stage. It was a late show. at Governor's, and I got on stage, and someone in the audience was mooing. They were actually mooing. Moo. Moo. And I was like, oh, this is great. Okay. So, because I'm from Indiana, they're mooing.
And so then I tried to deal with the heckler. And normally, you have a microphone, you have an advantage, but it didn't really work. And so then eventually... There was enough slack on the microphone. So I walked into the audience to find out who this mooing person was. And there was somebody severely handicapped lying in a hospital bed who could only articulate. No, Jim. Only communicate by going, move. No. So I had spent a good 20 minutes.
tearing into this severely disabled. Like they had like the keyboard and everything. And I'm just like, but the crowd had known. And I was like, all right, I'm just going to kill myself. And they, you know, they were very forgiving. And the person, you know, loved the attention. But that was probably the...
That's quite a story. Sean, have you learned your lesson? Never ask that question again. Wow. Do you have a clear, I'm sorry if you've answered this question a million times, but do you have a clear preference? between stand-up and acting? Because you've done tons of both. One, the words come beforehand. The other, the words come after. I love doing both of them because I think that stand-up is...
such a bizarre existence at night and stuff like that. And it's so solitary and it can... Whereas the collaborative thing of acting is so amazing. But I think the... process of getting acting jobs is so maddening that I would totally lose my mind if I had to rely just on that emotionally.
Yeah, I mean, some of this, yeah, it's job security to have created an audience. Yeah, you can control, in one lane of your career, you're fully in control of that. You can sit down and write some great stuff. You can get the creative fulfillment, whereas... You know, I've been I've done a lot of dramas, but to this day I had a meeting.
two days ago, and I've done tons of dramas, and people are always, they all have the idea, what if we put Jim Gaffigan in a drama? And I'm like, all right. I mean, most of them have been indie. but I'm like, and you want to be polite and go, yeah, sure, that would be great, even though I've been doing that for a long time. Yeah, for sure, for sure. We'll be right back. And now back to the show. Do any of your kids share the business tree passion?
Yeah, I think, you know, I've toured doing stand-up with my 18-year-old son. He's really funny. Oh, no way. So, like, he opens for you or closes for you or together? Yeah, he's done, yeah. Oh, really? That's cool. You know, last... A couple spring breaks, we've done that. But it's such a weird business. It's like, and my oldest daughter, who's 20, really loves acting. And I'm like, you know there's no jobs, right? There's just, you want to.
And so I'm like, if you want to, you have to create your own job. So I'm like, I'll pay for film school. But like, there's no, you know. Right. It's not like it used to be. It is a tough thing because you can't walk around with that diploma and sort of guarantee yourself at least an entry-level position. It's so cruel. But it's even different from it used to be like you talked about pilot season. Yeah, and commercials.
You could have been able to- Commercials. You did commercials. When I was a young actor, I supported myself doing voiceovers. I did a ton of voiceovers in and around New York. And then every year by about January for a few years, I would fly out to California.
Well, not every year. Sometimes I would go for like a month, but you'd have at least pilots auditions a couple a day here in New York, and you'd do the circuit, right? You'd go to all the places, and then they'd fly you out, and there was like...
there was a good chance once you kind of got in the mix, there was a good chance you'd get a job, you'd get a pilot. And wasn't the Arrested Development year like the last year you were going to do this goddamn pilgrimage out to Los Angeles for pilot season? No, I didn't.
I got fired the year before and I wasn't going to do it. And I didn't audition for anybody. And Deb Borilski reached out and said, oh, come on, Will, please just put yourself on tape or something like that. I was like, I'm not going to do the TV industry. They're really going to... feel the pain of me not being around. Wait till I show them. I think Arrested Development. I tested for that. Maybe not a network test, but a studio test. What part?
I think the David Cross one. Yeah? Okay. But I think that... Oh, my God, that would have been great. No, it's even worse than that. It was... Because there's also, during pilot season, there's like... do you want to commit to this pilot? Do you want them in first position? Yes. And I think I had been offered a pilot to be in first position. And I was like, all right, fine. Yeah, let's do that first position. It was garbage. But I'm like, all right, fine. I just want to act. And then...
Because I had worked with Mitch Hurwitz the year before on Ellen DeGeneres' sitcom. And he's like, hey, why don't you come in and audition for this? Because I had been... schmoozing him to get a part on it because, you know, obviously he's brilliant, right? Yeah, yeah. And so, but I, and then I, and then he was like, yeah, you're in first position and...
This is a low-budget thing. We can't have anyone in because we're going to do it. Oh, yeah. Because remember, the premise was that they were going to do it in a different way. Remember he wrote that cover letter on it? Yeah, if you want a dressing room... larger than a honey wagon, this job's not for you. Don't even bother auditioning. Mike Terry, who works on our show, whom you met, he... His wife worked for Debrilski, I think it was. Oh, yeah? He sent me recently.
The list of people, and my name's on it, of people who were sent, you know, because I eventually put myself on tape here in New York. I was doing a play in New York, and I was so bummed about being fired from this show the year before that I was like, I'm not going to do another. done fuck fuck sitcoms I don't do that beneath me like I kind of tried to flip it in my mind that I'm above it because I'd been fired and um
Anyway, so I went and I read for Deb Burroughs came, but Mike just sent me, I've got it in my office at home. Wow. Yeah, the sign-in sheet or whatever. Mitch sent me the videotape of my actual audition for Michael Bluth. I've got it on my computer. Wow. And that was the last day you ate, right? Like, that's why you stopped eating. I've been swimming ever since. I just look too puffy. Jim, I forgot that you were on that Ellen show with Mitch that year before. I remember that.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Martin Mull was on that show. That was so... We loved Martin Mull. I mean, he was such a sweet guy. Yeah, such a sweet guy. And it was so bizarre to see this guy that I had watched on Fernwood Tonight. Yeah, Fernwood Tonight was great. I mean, it was just, and you know... I mean, I know I'm older than you guys, but you have to understand, that was the bizarre, him and Fred Willard, that was like my first exposure to like...
Bizarre comedy. And they did like cutting edge, super racy. It was so clever because it was... I love that show. Well, also, I had no idea that... Martin Mull was this brilliant painter. Like he went to art school to be a painter. And then he would just tell stories about Steve Martin, which was amazing. Jason, is that a mall behind you? Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a mall right there. A mall. I got this one cheap. Jim, tell me about unusual jobs before you got all this work when you were starting.
I started off, well, I studied finance, but then... That's wild. You went to school for finance. I was a copywriter in an advertising agency. Really? I think it was really helpful in learning some... you know, word economy and efficiency of writing. But it was, I was the weird guy in the corporate setting, like, Jim's crazy. You know, like, he's napping in his room. Meanwhile, I, you know, I got like three hours of sleep the night before.
But yeah, there was, I was definitely, I was the last of my friends to have a day job because I think the remnants of that retaining security had really stayed with me. And I also... knew that I didn't want to just do some horrible bar gigs. I tried to limit some of the humiliation. Do you keep up with financing? Is that still kind of like a hobby of yours? I didn't really. I don't know anything about finance. And it's like I went to college and...
I even joke around about that in my news special. It's like, it's really sad. I mean, I have middle schoolers and I look at their math and I'm like, did they introduce new numbers? Because I don't know what's going on. And also, if I looked at the Wall Street Journal financial section, I wouldn't know. And I probably passed a class in it.
Got it. But speaking of your special, it's called The Skinny. It's on Hulu right now. Yes. Yes. Oh, boy. So this is number 11. This is the 11th special. Good Lord. Isn't that amazing? That's crazy. And I'm only 22. Jim. That's pretty impressive. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's pretty cool. Oh, thanks. What did she say? It's the 11th of 22? You've decided you're going to do... And I'm only 22 years old. No, he's only 22 years old. Oh, oh, oh. Where do you see... I mean...
What do you, as a performer, do you see yourself as you sort of get older that you want to... keep making special do you do you like the process of making specials or do you get a thing you're like i just want to act more because the specials i've kind of i've done 11 of them and i don't or does it where does the fire live It's all self-assignment, right? Like every aspect of this business, right? We have this notion that someone's in a...
sitting at a counter at a soda shop and someone comes up. It's like you have to steer it. You have to sit there and go, I want to do this. But what I love about writing stand-up is... that it's something I have control over. So it's like, look, I would love it if I didn't have time to do it as much as I do. And I have turned down...
a fair amount of... I mean, I love just complex characters. And, you know, so if it's a good acting role, I'd love to do it. But, like, if it's... you know, some kind of silly comedy where I would have fun doing it, but it wouldn't be something great. You know, I try not to... And also, I have kids, so I have to be very selective on why I'm going out of town, meaning I got to make money. But I do a lot of indies where I make nothing.
Do you still go and jump on stage at the Comedy Cellar and places like that? Absolutely. That's why we're still in New York City. I mean, I wanted my kids to be New Yorkers, but also... I, you know, it's so great. I can just go and do a show at, you know, Gotham or, you know, the New York Comedy Club and then I can be home and...
you know, try and tear the screens away from the kids, you know? Yeah, yeah. Your life sounds freaking perfect. I want to come back as Jim Gaffigan. It's far from it, but thank you. What's your favorite non-comedy or non-businessy thing? I know you love gardening. Yes, I do love gardening. Where do you get a chance to do that downtown? During the pandemic, we got a place in Westchester. And so...
And they had some raised beds there. And I love that. But I love gardening. And during the pandemic, I got into bourbon. If I'm talking to like three people in the entertainment industry, I assume two of you don't drink any longer. you know, but like, it's like, but like, So I was like a beer guy. And then during the pandemic, I kind of got into bourbon. And then, I mean, we've all probably been approached. Maybe you guys have a celebrity spirit, but I didn't want to do that.
But I have a buddy from Louisville, and I was like, can't, because some of them are just so bad. So I was like, can't we just pick our own and do this? And he's like, you might just end up with a bunch of barrels of... a bunch of bottles of bourbon, and I'm like, that's fine. So I'm doing that until I eventually join AA, I guess in three years. I don't know. Turn a profit first, yeah. That's great. I went for beer and then I got into bourbon. It's like saying...
I'm like, I used to do coke and then I got into crack because I was like, fuck it. Ketamine is great. It's just a starting point. Well, they always say I'm drinking bourbon in the morning, but it's actual. Apple juice on the rocks. Oh, there you go. Of course it is. By the way, every step of the way, Jim, Sean will out...
Midwest you in every respect. You can't believe how from the fucking... Do you see how excited he was when he was like, and you're from Oakmont, right? Or wherever. I'm from 20 minutes away from there. And we're always like, isn't that fucking crazy? People are from places. I'm always fascinated that people get out of...
the place they live to pursue their dreams in other places. I love those stories. Sean, really quick, lunch today. Sean, really quick, what's on the menu, quickly? Scotty, what's for lunch, mac and cheese? He's chopping celery for the egg salad right now. Yeah. What is it? I think it's going to be Kraft mac and cheese.
So you can still eat like you're in third grade and you look great. A little bit. I've always got a cookie pouch. Show them the cookie pouch. I got a cookie pouch. There it is. Here it comes. Oh, there you go. That's it. It's my cookie pouch. No, I thought it was... Growing up in the Midwest, I used to look around and be like... I mean, I know I wanted to be a farmer and everything, but I was like, oh, I think there's... I used to...
oh, there's been a mistake. I'm not supposed to be here. I'm supposed to be in New York. And then I got to New York and I was like, oh, well, I'm finally home. And they're like, you're the most Midwestern looking guy I've ever seen in my life. So I realized. how Midwestern I was when I left the Midwest. Because we look plain. We look plain. We blend in. And it's a sexiness, right? When people think Midwestern, they think sexy, you know.
Tim Wall's sexy. Unsnap the overalls and let's get after it. Sean, be honest. How long between now and when? Have you started looking at rascals online? Are you like, what's... am I going to get? Are you just eating your way into a rascal right now? Is that the end goal? You put special tires on that, mags or anything, spinners.
Yeah. Jim, you're the greatest. Thanks for being here today. You're such a funny dude. Very nice of you to spend some time with us. I appreciate it. We're all big fans of yours. Yeah, you're such a... Next steak dinner, you know, when I wait...
you know, your table, please tip. You know what I mean? Some of it's for the bus boys. And we'll act like- Will's going to pick it up next time. Next, I'm going to pick it up all the time. Would you, if we're ever here in New York again and we say, hey, we're going to go to Strip House, would you join us?
I would totally do that. I'd love to see a set at Gotham first. No, I love it because there's certain excuses. Like when I go out with Seinfeld, I'm like, it's like Jerry wants me to have pizza. And my wife's like, I understand. But if I'm just... you know, hanging out, you know, there has to be a reason behind it. And you guys are, you know, very high status. Wow. Sure, yeah. We're worth the cholesterol.
I love it. Wow. Jimmy, the skinny. The skinny. The skinny on Hulu. Thanks for being here, pal. We love you. And thanks for making us laugh for 75 years. Thanks, dude. Thanks, Jim. Thanks, Jim. Bye. See you, bud. Will, I think you look 12, okay? Thank you. That's my opinion. I can't believe he said that. I really found it very hurtful. And you know what? And he started, he kicked the door down with it, didn't he? Started right out with it. You know why? I think he's got a crush on me.
Yeah, you are a little intimidated. That's the way I got to frame it. I'm proud of you for working right through that. You know, that could have wrecked the whole interview, but no, you didn't let it happen. I love that he, I love that he doubled down on it. It's my kind of joke. It's my kind. I love it so much. Gavin Newsom's dad.
Mr. Newsom. Oh, he's doing a new sitcom called Mr. Newsom. Yeah, you know, you should send your headshot to Lorne Michaels if Newsom makes a run at it on the next election cycle. I know. He's one of those guys, when you watch him doing a special, like you said, Jason, he's so calm.
Yeah. Like, he's not like a loud in your face kind of, right? Yeah, you see him, you just kind of start with a grin. He doesn't even need to... need to be talking yet yeah he's he's authentic and he's and he's such a nice guy too oh my god i love him he's so nice yeah i love him huge huge fan i'm glad we had him um i'm trying to think of a bye okay i looked up Finally, seeing your honesty. Finally, by the way, look at this photo that just got sent. Oh, my God. Is that Ricky?
Wait, so you looked up synonyms or cinnamon treats? I cut you off. I have two tabs open. Okay. Cinnabon's near me. By the way, that sounds so good. Right? Yeah, I love that. Well, just after your mac and cheese, you guys can jump in a cab. Yeah, I love mac and cheese. So there's via, there's through, there's across, there's along, there's near, there's...
There's a beyond. There's also a by. Oh, synonyms to by. Yeah. Right? Yeah. Well, but what you did is you spelt it wrong. Oh, I did spell it wrong. The prompt needs to be B-Y-E. I did spell it wrong. Oh my God. Okay. Ready? So there's adieu. Take your time, Sean. Arrivederci. There's cheerio. No, but we need, sorry, you're not understanding the concept. You need to put the word by into the...
Bye. We don't need a synonym. Arrivederci is not going to help you get to a bye. Here's the thing. We've been doing it so long. Yeah. Right. I want to blow my brains out. So whatever we come up with, fine. But for our audience, we just got to make sure that they buy it. Oh, man, that snuck up on me. That was good. That was really good. Smart. Smart. Less. Smartless is 100% organic and artisanally handcrafted by Michael Grant Terry, Rob Armjarf, and Bennett Barbaco. Smartless.