Max Whitehead: How do you ask for a raise?

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In the open classroom, why you sample of his sample bas Wow Western class elms, Damn son.

Manco and welcome back to the Weekend Collective. I did let that music run a little bit long, but I thought, now we're not a music station, but a little bit of Jimmy Boards working class Man. I don't think there's anyone out there who objected an extra four or eight bars working class Man, because and we like to tie in a little bit of music into our themes. And we even managed to tie him when we interviewed Todd McLay.

Good afternoon, Hey Tim are really good? Well what are welcome? That's really cool? Thanks very much?

Did I give you? It's a good Read's good for a little bit of Jimmy.

But I love the music. It's hyped me up as well as you.

By the way, Yeah, working class man? Are you a working class man?

It?

Well? Yeah, I did an apprenticeship as a bato mechanic and I got my hands dirty. I didn't like it. Really literally, you didn't like having my hands dirty. Four and a half years I did an apprenticeship and they didn't like it. My hand's dirty.

Actually, that's an interesting is it a different kind of dirtiness, Like if you've been painting or if you've been a gardener. There's different types of dirt. Oil. Actually, if you're a mechanic, I imagine that would.

Be something that we used to clean all the parts and kerosene and whatever. The oil was everywhere and you get under a car they were dripping with oil in those good old days way.

Back, and oh there we go. So he's not a working class man, Tyra, I find another song.

To him.

I'm just kidding us.

Clerical workers do work.

I've been working. I've been doing my own DIY plastering and painting.

Look at your hands, I mean they're just pure white like silk.

Well that bit of white there is actually paint, I should point out, it's only a tiny fleck. Anyway, Hey, look, we want your cause if you have a a question around employment or your position, but also it might be a tactical question about how to manage your relationship within the workplace. Because there's one thing to have rules and this is what you can't do, this is what you

And one of the complaints I get all the time right now is, hey, look, my workers just feel entitled. They come to me and say I want this, I want that, and they need this. Can you provide it for me now? And by the way, I deserve it.

Well, because one of the questions we've got about is the whole thing about is it worth going above and beyond, in other words, doing things that are not strictly in accordance with your job title. It might even be behind for half an hour, staying behind for an hour to finish something off. And that's a waxing and waning situation, isn't it. Because if you're in a when businesses are finding it tough and you want your employer's company to survive,

Oh yeah, Now, look that's really an important issue here because I mean, it works very much with employees. You give them a benefit and which is over and above. You know, the employee gives them a benefit, they'll consider it there right after a few months, and so it's the same thing happens the other way around. So if you're giving their boss or bit the extra, then you pull it back the boss has miffed, what the hell's going on?

This is one of the questions we've got for you. Have you gone above and beyond? And if you did, how long did you do it before you thought? Okay, hang on a minute. I'm giving a bit extra here. I think it's time it was recognized because there is that. It's an ebb and the flow. There's a waxing and a waning of goodwill. So is it worth going above and beyond? And if it is, what do you expect and return? Do you actually spell that out? When do

When you people are around In my place, I lie or over the disk. I mean that's how I do it. Lean there.

That sounds like an HR problem, But I'll talk about later anyway. Just right, we got some calls you read or roll. Shall we get into it?

Bring it on, Chris?

Hello, Hi Chris, Yeah, Hi.

Good evening. Does some inquiry. I wait for a government agency down here, and I just want to ask if I if it's a public public holiday and I was rosted on the day I was off because we don't meet public holiday because Monday was am I still paid for that day because you know how you get time and a half or a day in lou if you've worked a day on the public holiday. But because I wasn't on that day, do I still get paid for that day I was posted to get paid?

Yeah, Chris. It's a very common question because I guarantee you paid by salary and so quite often the employers will require people to come in on a public holiday and think, well their salary covers that, Well it doesn't. It doesn't. So the answer to your question, Chris, yes, you are entitled the time and a half for the extra for work in that public holiday and a day in lou if it's normally your day off, that's what

It's all yours okay, and that's one thing. If I've only been there a short time, in the same coming to Christmas holidays for four weeks holidays because okay, we don't we're not open. Also on the public holidays.

That we.

Well, we don't work those. So I don't have any annual leave. I don't get any annually because I haven't been there long enough.

So what happens, Chris, is such a In the Holidays Act, there's a section talks about shutdown periods. So an employer is entitled to have a shutdown period provided they've given you fourteen days notice. And then, unfortunately for you, you won't qualify to get paid the full amount. Now, since you work for a government department, they probably will give you full amount. I don't know, but their legal obligation is only to pay you eight percent of your earnings up to that date.

I'm guessing they probably do cover.

Right.

Yeah, our government department stup, but most employers won't. Okay, pretty harsh on you start.

Good on your Chris, thanks for you call. Hey, by the way, what is a nice diplomatic way? So you're on a salary, and I imagine for a lot of employers they're like, oh, they're on the salary, just pay them and then ask them to do whatever I want. So they've asked you to come on in a public holiday and there's no discussion about it. You've just said, obviously your own time to time and a half? How

Well, the first thing you should do is check your employment agroupment because if it doesn't say that you could be required to attend work on a public holiday, you can refuse to work that day. So you could say, no, I'm not working Christmas day. I don't want to and your contract doesn't say so, so I'm not contracted to

I think I've heard someone use the expression, look, I'd love to, but I just can't do it. I'm sorry, that's public holiday and I've got other commitments, and just make it sound like you would if you could, but you but you can't, and there's nothing's going to nothing's going to change it. Or is that just fibbing? Should you just say no?

Well, if your boss could actually force you to, or if you didn't, if it's written in your contract that you could be working public holidays if required, and you refuse to work it, you could be disciplined for that. So that's the downside. Whether they would do it or not, it's pretty harsh. Imagine Christmas Day. I mean I must have met I was working in the norsea oil up in Scotland and I volunteered to work Christmas Day, So why.

Wouldn't you I've stuck on an oil rag in the North Sea. Oh you are well, that sounds the very working class man, or are you working an account.

Well, I had nothing, I had no family back on shore. I had nowhere to go. The pub did open, I believe it lunchtime on Christmas Day, and that's where I would have gone. That's probably only an oil rag. No, no, no, when I'm on land. So that's why I volunteered. I actually had to work an extra week for that guy to go home be with his family, and I'm happy with that. I was happy.

Well, you probably got a bit of extra, bit of a bonus.

And then they put a few They put a bottle of whiskey on.

Did they Well, oh, we know maxis price. It's a bottle of whisky. There we go. At seventeen past seventeen past five, it's Saxon Moore calls Dean.

Hello, Hey, Dean, this is quite a quick and hopefully if I was to resign from my position today and I have some accrued annual leave, can my employee.

Make me take that leave in the time in my notice period?

Yep, it is, and it's an issue that it rises quite often. But the requirement for an employee. They have to give you fourteen days notice a when to take your leave. So if it's if you've given a long notice like two months, three months, you could be in trouble. They could give you fourteen days notice to take leave between those times.

But if you only have to give two weeks notice and you've got two weeks leave remaining, then that leave is up your sleeve. There we go.

Yeah, so fourteen days is the magic number thet.

Okay, yes, I have you got four weeks.

They can turn around and go, hey, listen, you know we require you to take two weeks, but it's the last two weeks of your four weeks notice. That's sort of thing.

You've got it, but they've got to give you the two weeks notice.

Have you given notice or.

No?

He's thinking about asking for a friend. Of course you are listening.

Okay, I believe you.

Ask me that question all the time, just on behalf of a friend. Mixed No, I mean fair enough.

People are asking for friends, and we expect people to ask for friends, especially if you've got a voice that's really recognizable.

But I don't think that I love that he actually took it in good humor, didn't he.

Well, I suddenly wondered if he was driving, if he really had to go because something else?

Was that?

We laughing? Poor guy?

Anyway, good sport, Right, let's carry on. Graham.

Hello, Hey Graham, just inquiring about that.

If you have an accident in the company vehicle, can they make you pay the excess?

Well, if you were grossly negligible, possibly, if, for example, ter have a look, you were staggering around drunk and you're not allowed to drink and drive, then you possibly gram you you could be held glible.

Yeah, if you're sober and just generally didn't fail to check, look whatever and pull down and someone hit you, then it's an accident, and yeah, we are we required to pay an excess?

Well, they could be arguable. It's a matter of negligence. Your employer is supposed to cover you for any problems that occur during the worktime. So if it was, for example, a problem with the vehicle and that caused you to get a ticket, then they should cover it. But Graham, I think I think they could possibly hold you accountable. I would push back on it. That's what I often tell Like truck drivers, go, they took a wing mirror

Actually, that is a That is a funny one, isn't it Because if you I mean it meanings to have an accident in a company vehicle and you wouldn't imagine if you found out the excess for the company vehicles was fifteen hundred bucks or something when you haven't signed up for that. I mean, if you knew that, would you take out your own insurance for I don't know, I wouldn't want to be well.

Actually, more and more of my advice is getting closer to actually saying to employees, get insurance because you can be held liable. You know, if you can personally be held liable for all sorts of things in the workplace. Your employer are supposed to dimnify you as the flash word, but that's the word they use from any work related issues. If they've instructed you, but you've gone off on your own, use to your own initiative about something and it's turned turkey on it, you could be in trouble.

Have you had an accident gramm or are you just asking for a friend.

Yeah, I had an excellent and I'm going to be asking me to pay the excess, which is about one thousand dollars. And you know, people have excellents every day. It's not through being well in all accident negligence because shouldn't have had the next.

One technically, But if you were, if you were driving one hundred k and a fifty K area and had an accident, you wouldn't have much of an argument. But if you've simply it's a fifty to fifty thing, and.

You said that, I mean your Graham, you said it wasn't No, I just assume that, yeah.

Yeah, failing a good way to someone and there was an accident, So.

Yes that pushback Graham and try the water. I think that might be the best way to go. Try the water. I mean, never go with them, see what happens, and if you might want to get somebody to help you, like myself or anyone else out there that could represent you.

Yeah, that's that. Thanks for col Graham. That is actually really interesting issue the liability of employees in the workplace, because I guess we would all assume that you're covered for things. If you're going about your business as an employee and people make mistakes and employment, and you wouldn't want to be found liable. I've got a text here that this person's partner forgot to bring in the arm on a truck, reversed it into the workshop and hit

You imagine those big trucks that put arms out, you know, when they have a big hydraulic foot feet actually forget to bring one of them, and it's not a good movie.

I would imagine. I've callers from call some truck truck drivers regularly on talk back, and the machinery they are in charge of and the cargo they would have to be indemnified, surely, because it's a hazard of the job that there's the potential for something to go wrong, for you to break at the wrong moment or you know.

I was going to tell you, Tim, I think it's important to listeners to hear this that many years ago. This shocked me that a draft person did some chabby work and eventually got fired for something else, and he took a personal grievance and they turned around and sued him for the chabby work, and the authority said, yep, you owe the boss. Now, I think it was fourteen thousand dollars.

That's horrendic, that's I see.

To me.

That would have to be because that particular draft person had done not just a slightly dodgy job, but negligently. You know, there's scales of carelessness. Absolutely, there's mistakes that get made there and then there's a flagrant disregard for standards.

Well like employees. Maybe it's time to start thinking about an employee insurance. You've got to protect yourself and in this particular case, the judiciary upheld it and they've done it before.

Yeah, blimey, that is quite something. It is. We need to take a break. We're gonna come back with more calls and just attack. It's twenty four minutes past five. News Talk said, be.

Love me. You can see.

Stand these.

Jell cares.

Yuess, Welcome back to the weekn Collective. This is a smart money we're talking about employment. Actually, sure that's come up in the conversations just about employee liability and what mistakes that you might find. You actually have to write a check out poor to your employer, which should you have an insurance anyway. But we're taking calls about whether

Good morning, afternoon. Just a question if a person's been employed of twenty years plus with the same company doesn't have an employment country, isn't it a contractor has never been plaid holiday play which includes his commission?

Wow? Ouch, If you can prove that you're an employee in the well in twenty years of service, I'd say you are. You can go for the retrospective back six years for those holiday paid six fours to twenty four weeks. That's six months pay. And there's a penalty should apply to your employee for failing to give you a written employment agreement.

Right, that's not me as someone else?

Are you doing it for a friend? We've got a lot of it today that I mean, that's.

So the commission that person's that your friend's working on. Is it a commission based job not regular income?

No, no, it's a salary plus commission.

Oh wow?

Oh hell and no, no holiday has been paid.

All except just as normal standard weekly pay.

Do you know, nevilla, Do they do consistent hours?

Most definitely do. Wow, Well the normal Monday to Friday and work you know, and yeah, work a day to friday.

Yeah, yeah, well that's nevile. They'd say that they've got that employe. Must be absolutely terrified because this employee you could go after them and really cause some of the problems.

Never can I just ask how? And so the time that was so, whenever that employee took time off, they were not paid anything.

Oh yeah, their basic salary.

What are you wondering about.

The whole day pay the commission? The whole day pay from one understanding has to include your your weekly salary including commission.

You make sense, Yeah, okay, that's okay, that's well, that is slowly So the question is you've been on a salary, you get paid a holiday pay, but you're not getting paid any percentage on the commission or any holiday pay in relation to that. Can you claim that back. That does sound a little different, Is it different? Map?

It is different, a lot different. So basically they are getting paid those salaries all the way through, so it'll be their base rate. The question to me is do they get their bonuses as well and the extra pay on top And that's been an argument for years and quite frankly no, I would say that they don't get that, but it's arguable. So it depends on the details on how this person is for into yours, what it is they're actually getting commissioned on, and how they can actually.

Get in it.

They're actually getting commission on everything that's sold within the gum.

May, so even if they don't sell it, they get a commission based on it. Yes, see, the calculation for holiday pay is the average or ordinary whatever is the greatest. So yeah, so it could be argued that the average is up there. So it's no matter what constitutes gross pay. Now Brook van Belden's bringing in a new act because this is such a big question that she's actually going to put a new definition for what constitutes gross pay.

Wow, okay, interesting, But I would say that if you if it's we're talking serious money here, you'd want to get a bit of advice on that.

Yeah, it's not as bad as I thought.

It was.

Company where the staff have taken the company support and one on that exact argument that I've just given you.

Okay, Well that's that's the twenty years, that's that's that's quite a big deal. Last six years retrospective, No, no, six years. Yeah, that's right, okay, Okay, thanks guys.

Do you know what to miss A big case. We're a big timer. He had a bonus of over a million dollars, you know, like this is a chief executive. So when he left, they gave me his outstanding holiday pay. He went back and said, no, I want all of it because I want the million dollars to be built into it.

And did they went?

Well, the Court of appeal for had to go the court. The court said years. The Court of Appeal said.

No, okay. I guess it depends on what grounds you get the bonus. If it's for going above and beyond delivering results above what you're expected, I would say, well, no, you're leaving so bonus. But if it was something that was simply a bonus paid for you doing the job, that would be a stronger arguments. It's such a.

Great You imagine how many people are on this. You imagine every car yard, all the sales reps there, Imagine in every any sale troop who gets paid incentivized.

It is a big issue, right, We've got lots of callers line up, so we're going to keep going on. Josh, Hello, Hey, Josh, Mex.

Tim, Hey, I need to ask hey, listen, last involved in being let go? We'll call it now. Throughout the process, what actually happened was I was put through a disciplinary process and I was sent home. And then what happened after that is I engaged with the union and we tried to mediate and where it went from there was I basically had to resign in order not to.

Sort of be.

Blacklisted, if that makes sense. I resigned for personal reasons. However, I was given what they call a practicing certificate. Have you heard of one of those macs? So I was given what they call a practicing certificate that was part of the agreement. But I was also told that I'm not able to get any referees from this position. When they told me that, I soon made contact with other people, other senior colleagues that I'd worked with and asked them

That sounds weird? What are you allowed to say what particular line of work? This is because practicing certificate sounds like a professional qualification type of thing.

Yeah, so it's healthcare.

It's okay, I don't understand what it's.

Yeah.

So basically what I'm asking Max is a lot of employers want more than two references. I've got plenty of people that have vouched for me, but the company's saying these people are legally not allowed to have a reference for me on my behalf.

Well, it depends that, Josh. If your union represented you, I would hope if you did a settlement and said, look, I'm prepared to resign because you were unhappy about something I did, then there I would have thought your union would have done a standard settlement agreement. The standard settlement agreement should have had in there that there will be no disparaging statements made about you.

So they agreed with that, they said they can't speak a negative word about me. However, they've blocked all my previous team leaders and managers from being able to give me a written or verbal reference.

So then they are they are bad mouthing you, so to interrupt you, Josh, but they are bad mouthing you to the senior people in that organization. So I'd say that you could probably challenge them and go back to union and saying, look, they are disparaging my good name here.

Well I tried that, Max, I did try that, and the union set unfortunately signed on the dotted line saying that you'd walk without anything but a practicing certificate. But that's I think that's kind of no.

I disagree. I think you ought to have a go and I think you ought to file it with the Employment Relations Authority and saying that there's been a breach of selling here.

I would also wonder if we've got all the information that I would be I'll throw this to you, Max. It's one thing to stop an employee writing something, so one of Josh's colin, it's one thing for his employer to say you are not to give a reference on our behalf. But I would have thought, there's nothing for them to say. This is a job, this is my job. I've worked with this person and I vouched for them personally. Who can stop you doing that? That seems a bit bizarre.

Oh, they probably got instructions and they're terrified. I mean, look at government departments and then Josh would be so they won't step out of line if the boss says no. But I think it's worthy worth having to go, Josh, and so check your Section one four nine settlement agreement and you're well going to contact me tomorrow and let me have a look at it for you.

Okay, yeah, Max, Max, I'll just be real quick. I was going to actually try and acquire your your skills. However, I didn't want to ship fight. I wanted to walk away peacefully.

Yeah, okay, well, Josh, look, go and look up Max's look at Max's contact details on the website hundred ten eighty. And meanwhile, for anyone who wants to call the show and have a chat with Max right now, we'll be back in just the tickets coming up to twenty two minutes to sick. Yes, welcome back the Weekend Collective. This is smart money. My guess is Max Whitehead. We're in

Hey, Tracy, I.

Know I've got a shoe with my employee that you know how you get your standard holidays for four weeks? Yea, Then they're telling us once you use your four weeks, you can start using your crude leave. I thought that, I think I thought that a crude leave is what you earn for the whole year, for your full week and your holiday. Didn't get what I mean.

But you can carry it over, so that's probably what they mean. Yeah, accrudely does mean exactly that, Tracy. So but you may have even accrued some from last year which is still there, and so you had one more week from last year. You can take all that up, use it up, and then start chopping into your accrudely. If your boss is happy for you to do.

That, you can do that, Okay, So even if you even if you have no holidays left and you know that you've used up your full weeks holiday, and every year you've told you you have to use your full weeks, it say isn't in our contract that you have to use full weeks within the twelve months.

So usually, Tracy, it's the first year you don't. You're not allowed to take holidays the first twelve and then thereafter you you're entitled to four weeks then and it keeps accruing thereafter, so you've got piles of holidays start after that point. Then they start accruing, and so they're going to let you grab some of those holidays as well.

Oh okay, because the way that they explained it is different to the way that I think it is.

Yeah, thanks Tracy, cheers, Okay, bye, bye, Joe, Hi, Hey, Joe.

Hi.

Just a quick one, a little bit like Nevil's one that seventeen years no.

Contrast, Wow, get paid basically an hourly rate retainer or the year takes out my PA, ye takes out my kiwisaver.

Are basically an employee, and then at the end of the year.

I get for.

Of generated income, so I get.

The difference.

So so you there's no contract that you get an hourly rate and then you get a retainer on top of that. Do you have forty percent at the end of the year, they pay you a bonus.

Just a difference between what what he's paid me as my wages and then how much the forty percent is of generated income and just what the difference is. I get that as a little bonus at the end of the year. It might be like two thousand dollars or three thousand dollars.

Or something like that.

But he's just recently told me that before he pays that forty percent, he takes the three percent kiisavi back out of that that he's paid through my wages.

So do you pay q we Savior? Do you put a contribution into KEII Saver?

Yes?

Okay, Basically I looks like I'm actually paying the whole seven percent out of my wages because he's taking that because he said, well, I'm not paying forty three percent commission, So.

Okay, so he's but he's taken Kiwisaver out, which he's got to do for you, and it's according to it's probably deemed to be your income. So I think I think that's probably appropriate that he does do it. If it's a percentage of your gross income, then it probably is the right thing. Trace Joe, then would.

That not basically kind of make me more of a contractor if he's not contributing.

Any key we save this.

Yeah, but he's not contributing anything.

Legally. Will know he's not distributing anything.

Will you contact I I D and ask them what he's contributing and ask them if it's correct, and then he takes it back.

Off me at the end of the year, So through i ID it looks like he is.

But then he deducts that back off my commission at the end of the year.

So he's not contributing, right.

Talk to I D, okay and get that in writing from them, from your employer, and talk to IOD and send it to them and saying this is what's happening. Is this legitimate?

Okay?

When you look on the IOD website for bet all the qake payment of the that's what it looks like.

He is paying that and he's actually I gotcha, No, I understand, but that deduction should give you written notification of that. Joe, take a diode.

Okay, all right, Sorry, I've got to keep moving, Joe, if you've got any Yeah right, we'll carry on. Rex.

Hello, yeah, hello you there, Yeah, yeah hello.

I'm just I wonder if I have a lead to stand on. My employeer sacked me when I was injured.

I'm injured, injured at work or injured through something.

Else, the injured of work? Yeah, he injured at work or I had even had an operation.

In the arm.

So Rix, what do you thank you for? Was it because you're injured or is it for some other reason?

Well, they said that I missed an appointment of coming back to work so they can do their work planner. I missed an appointment for them to do that, And I said, well, why doctor was sending the medical suits and I haven't even had an operation yet.

On my arm. So Rex, you can you can challenge a dismissal if you feel it's been unjust and unfair, So you can take it to the judiciary if you want to. I think that they've got to have some good grounds to dismiss you, particularly if you've been an injury and its work related, but if you did something untoward and it's caused it, but you're saying now it's because you failed to actually turn up as required. So that's not a secable defense unless you've got a habit of doing that.

No, No, I didn't turn up to a back to work planning meeting. I'm still injured. I'm still off work. I'm still injured. They're getting a medical suit and.

So yes, so Rex.

So that's what I'm saying to you. If you can challenge them for that dismissal on the basis it was just for not tuning up for one meeting, that's not acceptable.

So you could challenge them on that, how would Rex begin to go about challenging get the process going on that?

So you write on a letter lodging a personal grievance for unjustified dismissal, Right, okay, then and then lay it down Rex in that letter.

Okay, good luck, good luck Rex. Okay. Hond a second to hey Tony.

Yeah, good afternoon, Tim and Max. I think I've spoken to you briefly before, Max about the Uber situation.

Remember that.

Yeah, I got fired because I asked the lady to stop a kid ribbing my QR character pieces. But the gist of it is, I just wonder are you following you know, the current situation. If they're not successful in there, I've gone to the Supreme Court I think in New Zealand because I dipped out of the court to appeal this is Uber. What would be the basis that I would you be able to take an issue with them for financial compensation if the if the current case that's that's before the court.

In other words, what.

Would be what could I take them to this Studs Tribes Unal for money that I deemed that they owe me? Or how would I yours the best way?

I've got some good news for you. The Court of Appeal actually said that you were Uber drivers are employees, so.

You can they're going to take it to the court. They're going to take.

What's happening is the government of saying that they're going to put some legislation. The legislating so and whether it will be appealed, they probably will. But right now you're in a position and look eighty I think it's eight hundred employees of Uber lodged to claim in the Employment Relations Authority for back pay.

Yeah, okay, Well, how would I go about briefly joining that particular action? Would I have to calculate what I was earning ever a week right up until now, or how would I go? What would be the formula?

Well, you'd have to be looking for retrospective holiday pay, retrospectable sick pay, those all those things that come into it. And whether there's these other people have gone through through the union, and maybe they the union may allow you to join and actually be part of that action if you wanted to.

Think as I guess Tony's Tony situation won't be covered by the law change because the law change is are going to govern arrangements from here on, and isn't it no?

No, they could be saying that they've always been.

Improv the act is going to make it retrospective.

Yeah, I'm not sure about that. I don't think that's the.

Retrospective legislation is generally a no no.

So they won't do that.

Well, determined on whether uber appeal to the Supreme Court or whichever.

It was making a good point here that you probably still, okay Tony to lodge an application into the authority. I know they're not listening to them at the moment because they know there's going to be a change of law. But I think you've got a case.

Okay, Okay, so how would I go about it? Watch the people I would contact again.

So you contact the union. There's a union that are New Zealand first is it?

No?

No, it's another union. There's a union have lodged it, So give me a call afterwards, and that, you know.

Get in touch with the white Hair grouping and google them for his number. It's easy to yeah, because acts of Parliament will only be generally you're quite road locking. So the existing situation with these drivers is going to go through the courts until it's until there's nowhere else to turn.

I guess, and I don't think the courts will have a lot of empathy with the drivers that are actually going to claim in there if the if the law has changed, but you never know, you never know.

Now nine minutes to six News Talk z B. Yes, welcome back to smart Money. We've only got time for one very quick course of Peter or where you go Peter.

Hey, individual employment agreement and on it that stipulates a work location and then directly under there that has a comment it says the employee after consultation could be relocated. The question is what does consultation mean? Does that mean it can get to be done through agreement as well, or what means at the moment the management has just told people. Most people losing.

Yep, And consultation means they need to talk to you, get your point of view, and then they can still make their own decision, but they've got to take it into consideration.

You'll view it's like a marriage where one partner says, I consulted you, I just didn't do what you sold me. So it's a bit like that. Yeah, so consultation is just hearing feedback, but it still gives the employer the right to do sort of what they want.

Doesn't Yeah, that's exactly right.

Hey, sorry, we can't continue the conversation with empeticus. We are up against the tolop. But thank you for keeping it very brief. Again, if you want to catch up with Max from the white Head Group, you just google Max white Head Employment and all your contact. You do have a website, let's give it to them.

Twenty four seven ninety three, ninety three and it's dub dub dub Whitehead Group. They don't do their dub dubdub anymore, do they.

That's it's so twenty ten. Anyway, thanks for coming in.

Max grat I love coming in with you, Tim, It's really good fun.

And thank you again to my producer Tyra Roberts. We'll look forward to your company same time again.

News next weekday is good, great music.

Yeah. By the way, if you've missed any of the hours, I would recommend going and looking for the Weekend collect A podcast on iHeartRadio and we get every hour up as quick as we can once the show's concluded, so they'll be there hopefully waiting for you. And Sunday at six is next. Look forward to your company next weekend. Enjoy the rest of your Sunday. Bye bye.

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