Welcome to Sloanies talking with Sony , the candid conversation with alumni and faculty about the MIT Sloan experience and how it influences what they're doing today. So what does it mean to be a slowly over the course of this podcast, you'll hear from guests who are making a difference in their community, including our own very important one here at Sloan. I'm your host, Christopher Riker .
So welcome Tom . Get to the second in our series. Uh , tell us , um, who you are, where you work at that last few years.
Wonderful. Well, I partner at McKenzie and company. My office location is Boston . Do I spend quite a fair amount of time covering different geographies? I have a few responsibilities at McKenzie . I run all insurance practice in North America. I run all of our activities around design, digital and analytics in the northeast of the u s with we have multiple centers and I also run a piece of software that many of our clients are using.
Interesting. So I see a , that you have a few achievements on your , uh, on your resume, some of which are the scholar. You are now a member of the MIT Sloan Alumni board. Tell me about how both ship is that part of Sloan after Sloan.
So I received the serious scholarship while I was at Sloan. I think it was the first or second year of that program. I received a phone call asking me to go see the dean in the morning. And I was wondering what I had done to go into trouble so early in my tenure. And I got the privilege to hear that , uh , I was a recipient of the world and that the part of my tuition will be covered by it, which was just a wonderful experience.
And since then, I've been actively involved with the Siebel scholar community. We get together once a year for the conference. That time is organizing and we have some dinners and it's very humbling to see who is part of that community.
Interesting. And um, tell me about the time before Sloan and what led to Sloan .
So I was born in France. Uh, I grew up in Belgium in [inaudible] education system in Belgium. You get two schools based on their ranking. I was fortunate enough to go to one of the better school , but it turns out to be a school of engineering. And I didn't know at the time was that I wanted to be an engineer. So I graduated many years later with a master degree in metallic energy , uh, and realized that was probably not what I wanted to do as a profession.
I, John proctor and gamble for a number of years where I initially run part of the engineering operation and I had the defining moment where in one of my plans I had two fatalities in a year and I realized I was cutting corner and decided I would never be on the cost side of the balance sheet. And I started a long process of rehabilitation, which included tying to better my education in the areas of business. And so after a few years at P and g I applied to go to MIT.
Sloan went here, I had enough of at Harvard and MIT attended boot admit weekend with my wife. And the , um, evidence came that, you know, MIT Sloan was the community and wanted to be part of. And then while at Sloan, the defining moment was my wife and I welcome our twins, but they were born extremely prematurely so that all sorts of medical issues and I've experienced the incredibly caring community of the school for two years helping us out.
But it also shadowed some of my dreams of being an entrepreneur coming out of MIT Sloan, you know, I needed to find health insurance and that's how I became a consultant. And John McKenzie .
Interesting. And how, what was it about Sloan compared to the other schools that accepted you, that tipped Sloan into you ?
Okay . I think at the time, and I will tell you, looking back at the time, it was really the community, you know, I was coming from a small country, being an engineer, coming to the u s you know, it was an overwhelming experience and being part of a group of people who really, I felt had similar backgrounds, similar passions, similar values was probably the number one. Then I had met in Belgium, a number of Sloan alumni who I felt were just genuinely the most giving people I knew thing .
The second element was it was the the business school of the best engineering school in the world and I was an engineer. And so there was a level of comfort knowing that I kind of knew the environment of engineering school. And I also wanted to find ways of exploring opportunities to be an entrepreneur linking to the broader than 19 at work . I think looking back and what I didn't know, but really I'm glad I went to Sloan was the notion of hands on learning, right?
I realized that, you know, doing cases in class is fine, but that's not the way I learned . I learned by getting my hands dirty. And I remember going for a couple of weeks in New Zealand helping IPO a company and doing those kinds of things. And the environment that salon provides is just so unique and I think superior for my own development.
And so for your entrepreneurial , uh, desires that you said, because you had twins and you need health insurance and whatnot, how do you , uh , exercise that, that spark now in the work that you do?
You might remember, I say for instance, I run a software, McKenzie is not known for software. I was probably one of the first guy to come up with the idea that we could be running software a few years ago. And I have a team of developers, 40 of them in India. That's an example. And I love that it's a small portion of what I'm responsible for, but that gives me a disproportionate share of joy. I also see all of our digital analytics and design activities.
So we've done quite some acquisitions as a firm. We've acquired very day. We've acquired Luna, we've acquired quantum black, and you know, you acquire startups to some extent. So , uh, and , and you become part of their fabric. So that gives me an oh , miss joy. And then many of my Sloan France have become entrepreneur and are asking for my support and advice and whether it's monetary or intellectual contribution . So that's my way of fulfilling it.
I hope that the future part of my journey will allow me to fulfill it . You know, even more so.
And do your work on the alumni board. How did you come to come to the position and how do you feel that that plays a part in your thinking and your aspir aspirations or inspirations ?
So this school has really meant so much to me. I , you know , remember I was a metallic logist in Belgium, you know, and, and where I landed today is because of the school. So I have enormous gratitude and then remember, you know, the traumatic experience. We have literally kids who are born and we're not supposed to be alive. I mean they are really miracles. They've spent years in the hospital not subjected to . And the level of support we got from the school is incredible.
I remember not having to cook for month . We would go home at night and they would be a plate and people helping us out. So I've, I've never left the school. I've never , I've always felt very connected to the school. At McKenzie for instance, I was in charge of all the recruiting and the school in part of , um, I've been in charge in the relationship we have with the Sloan management review in terms of publications , collaborations have always been part of the fabric of the school. Never left.
However, about two and a half years ago I was at asking whether I would want to join more formally the balls and I met with a number of alumni. We're on the ball , Natalia as an example. And I was deeply inspired by when the dean was trying to establish so that world and decided to join and has been beyond please with the experience and the impact.
And so when did you, when did you join McKinsey ? Was that right out of Sloan?
Yeah , I joined as a summer associate in 2003 and now you're a senior partner? I am, yes.
Tell us about that journey because not many people get to senior partner.
We are few of us. So I joined as a summer associate in the Norwegian as an associate when I graduate in 2004 and I had an interesting experience with first few years. I was really local because I had to take care of my kids in a very small office at the time, the Boston office and it falls me to focus early on on few clients in the similar sector, which led me to, the reason I'm leading the insurance practice of McKinsey now is very early on more than most of my peers. I specialized the thing .
One thing that I think differentiated me when I joined McKinsey at the time was at Sloan edge studied system that I'm excited been teaching assistant to Peter Singhi who was the author of the fifth discipline and this notion of how do you think about large scale impact and how you organize and engineer it from the core is the type of big, big thinking that I was exposed to that I tried to emulate and bring into the firm.
And I think that's what created my, my brand in the foam was this is this notion of understanding networking back . So after six, seven years, the kids started doing better. My daughter was no longer fits with you. I was elected partner and all of a sudden it became what's our , they beyond, beyond bust . And so the next five years has been the Liddy entrepreneurship in launching the software, expanding my orders and responsibilities, titling the world.
And five years later I was elected senior partner. And No , it's a , it's a combination of client entrepreneurship. You know, my role is to introduce new clients, but also the people development when , when you are in the role that I am in, it's all about how you create opportunities for the next generation. So I spent in cinema out of time with young people who are much smarter than I am, and that keeps me grounded and I love it.
When you listen to them. Tell me about your , uh, the role your partner played and, and a bit about the , the resilience that it takes, personal resilience that it takes to have children in the condition that they were in. And also having a demanding and increasingly demanding role at a firm known for. It's a , it's a rigor.
So you're right. The , the real hero in all life is my wife, Charlotte. I met her when I was 16 films day . I met her, I told her I would marry her. She got scared. Took me two years to get to my first day , but I've always known that she was an exceptional person. The , the, the notion of leaving her family in Belgium to go study in the U s was a big decision and I wanted it to be her . So we came to the admit weekend and she chose MIT and she chose very wisely.
And , uh , as I mentioned, the community was super , the school did something remarkable. She was a secular , just focusing on patients, kids with cancer, terminal cancer. And for a number of reasons, she could not maintain that level of employment in the u s so the school gave her a job while at what? At MIT, initially Indian mission office.
After that in managing the intellectual property of MIT in international schools , uh , that all stop the day of our birthday when our kids were born four months premature. The second part was, you know, being a mom, being a spouse and being in the community, she became friend with so many partners. We are living in east gate and that's where that community came forward for us and she remains, I think , probably better network than I am because of that affiliation.
Obviously with kids being sick for long, she decided not to attend to work. There was trust in practicality. So she was there to support my professional journey. She has now returned to walk . Um , you know , being a French teacher and we really, when we talk about the school, quite often we, we really feel that it has defined us, made us better people. I think we appreciated the need to welcome help when we needed it.
We appreciated the fact that people from all [inaudible] diversities of, you know, amazing values. And so I just think that we, we became simpler humbler people in the know love for each other, grew from that type of experience or she's, I think she loves the school as much if not more than I do.
That's wonderful. You talked about um, system dynamics as a, as an interesting , uh , topic that you discovered and have developed. Are there any professors, other professors besides Peter saying you, that you've kept in touch with or memories that you have of topics or , or classes that you took that have stuck with you through you?
So it's entire thing. While the students, the accounting class was the most dreadful for me. And so that's what I remember while students , if I look back, the classes that they've had, the most impact one was the classical industrial economics. And the premise of that class is to say what matters is the industry in which you compete. If it's an attractive industry, you can be average and do very well. If it's a shitty industry, even if you're the best, it will suck.
And you know, there is so much truth to that. I , uh , practice that every day . The second one was a class about HR and it, you go to business green not thinking about it, but eventually when you run large organization, you know, it's HR and it's technology, right? And so thinking really thoughtfully about developing congruent systems that help people perform at their best and be motivated I think was an invaluable experience. And then the third one was g lab.
You know, I had the opportunity to go spend a couple of weeks in New Zealand, help a company go IPO. And again, that was an incredible experience. One week into the engagement. The project really allowed us that the books of the company with corrupt . And so we had to face the CEO and tell him that he just could not go public. And I don't think there are many places where you can have that type of experience that young. And they shipped me, they shipped me.
And so you , uh, you're now heading up the digital strategy practice and property and casualty insurance practice. And tell me a bit about the other one. The digital quotient initiative. And, and you talked about the , the digital in HR and how that really enables and empowers people.
So back in the day, seven, eight years ago, the firm realized that digital was transforming the nature of competition and we needed to have an offering . And so some of US started developing some engagement models and after one of two years we ask ourselves , how are we making a difference? I will really , really changing the trajectory of class and we just couldn't answer that question.
And one of my colleagues said, well, does it make sense to help certain companies transform themselves digitally or is it too late? Right? And you can think about, you know , if you compete against an Amazon, and I didn't know the answer to that question entity really started haunting me. Um, and so we decided to do some research of thing . Could we predict whether a company's likely to thrive in the digital area or not?
And we spent two years interviewing, you know, all the digitally successful companies, they tend to be digital natives and asking them, why do you think you're on top? And it was a humbling experience because I would have expected folks who talk about technology, et Cetera . And they were talking about strategy and culture and over and over and over again, the answer was the same. So we decided to qualify that answer in terms of a number of simple management practice.
The question was, was that recipe applicable to non digital natives? And so we undertook a very long experiment of teaching certain companies to adopt those management practices and seeing whether the performance was changing. And we can now demonstrate the correlation between certain management practice and to target and to show order and growth. And so this digital question has become, you know , a tool , uh , that actually is quite recognized.
The MIT Sloan HBR, all those folks who've written about it, that allows you to diagnose where you are and prioritize interventions that will allow you to compete more effectively in the digital age.
So I assume that takes a certain insight for a company to understand where they are on the, on the s curve. I think it wasn't when you leap across to the next. Um, and how do you bring companies along that that don't understand where they are and is that part of the, the services that McKinsey would provide to help elucidate leadership on their potential for success or not?
Yes, it's a brilliant question. You know what, what you are asking too is how do you address the unconsciously unskilled executive? It's a tough one because they need to be willing to learn. One of the thing that I found pretty powerful is just get on a plane with them and go visit startups and have young kids tell them why they think they can disrupt their industries and show them what they're able to do with bubble gum and you know, tip scare them as it scares them.
But then you need to be able to bring it together. As a large organizations, you have a brand, you have customers, you have many assets and you have a lot to lose. As a startup. You have nothing and you have a lot to gain. And therefore the way you play your strategies are fundamentally different. So the first thing is open the eyes and create some level of discomfort. But then after that you need to give them the courage to act and that requires different approaches.
Interesting. Do you have , uh, any , uh, thoughts on a do over at Sloan that if you think back, what w what would you do differently?
So I will tell you when I grew up, I read a book called Love Story and it's about this a guy at Harvard who falls in love with this gal and you know, she has cancer and you know, it doesn't create the right way. That was my first loves story book and I decided to go to Harvard to go on the rink and to save the girl. So my very first day at Sloan , the guy sitting next to me was a French guy.
We met and it turns out that he was captain of the French hockey team and I decided that I will learn to play hockey, not at Harvard but at MIT. And so for two years I, I practice the end of the second year, I begged him to take me on this team to play the Harvard MIT game, which I was utterly unqualified, but I was also pretty pervasive and said, you know, give me five seconds on the rink. I went on the rink, I've got checked and I broke three reps .
And so if I had to do over, I would be a lot more humble, a lot more humble. So when our last couple of minutes, do you have any parting advice or thoughts for prospective students or for anyone listening to this? I would have three funeral [inaudible] . The first one is it will be the most defining moment of your life. You're going to learn more about yourself then through other experiments in a safe environment and you're going to raise your ambition and aspiration.
So it's the best investment you can make in yourself. The second one is you're going to create a community that really Kelly you for years and year and it's hard to describe, but MIT Sloan is really the special gem when people care about each other. And you know, I would tend to say that even today , probably my most valuable network. And then the third day parting thought is when you are there you need to be willing to experiment.
The mistake I think people make is they go to Sloan and say, I know exactly what I'll do coming out of school. And I think they minimize their exposure to different ways of thinking, different ways of working and therefore the not learn as much as they can about themselves. So go do it and get to know the people. They're awesome and experiment. Let the lid , let the school ship you versus try to use the school to shape where you are going.
Excellent. Well thank you very much Tony . Katelyn for your time today and with Stoney's talking to Sony's . Thank you. Hope your early days and t two Sloanies talking with Sloanies is produced by the office of external relations at MIT Sloan School of management. You can subscribe to this podcast by visiting our website, MIT sloan.mit.edu/alumni or wherever you find your favorite podcasts.
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