Hello and welcome to Shoot a Hostage with me, Dan, and my partner, Sarah. We're a movie podcast who talks about a different film each week based on a theme. We do swear and we do spoil the featured movie. So, only ever listen if you've seen the film or you don't care too much about spoilers. If you're a regular listener, you can just skip forward until you hear the intro music cuz you've heard all of this before. But if you are new to the show and you do enjoy what you hear, there are a couple of things you can do to help support the show. Firstly, make sure that you're subscribed on your podcast. player so you get notified when new shows drop on Mondays. Uh you could rate us five stars on Spotify, which couldn't be easier. You just hit the star icon below the show's artwork. Or if you have a spare few minutes, we'd love it if you could submit a review wherever you listen. Uh make sure you come follow us at swth_pod on social media. We are active on Instagram, threads, and Tik Tok. And lastly, the biggest thing you can do to help is tell a friend about the show. So that's about it. That's enough preamble from me. Uh Over to me and Sarah for this week's episode.
Welcome to episode number 69. 9. Yeah, 69 this one. And you chose the Wicker Man remake for episode 69. The Wicker? What do you mean remake? Don't do that. Is it Is this a remake? Don't do that. We've seen the original together at the cinema. This won't fly with me. A s***, I forgot about that. When What year was the original? Was it 73 or It was 73. Okay. Um I'm sure we'll mention the original the Hick Man at some point.
Can we talk about that instead? In fact, Um, we No, because Nicholas Cage wasn't in the original The Hoer Man, was he? That was Edward Wood. Wood, I suppose. How much wood could a woodchuck chuck? If a woodchuck could chuck wood, loads. Edward Woodwardwood could chuck wood chuck. Could he? Sweet chuck. Knuckle puck. You've always got to bring things back to police academy somehow. Yeah, no matter what.
I've got that eggs just firmly cemented in my brain constantly. Um, listen, let me begin this. show by extending an extremely heartfelt apology to you Sarah and to you the listener. I'm very sorry. I don't accept.
If you if you are completely insane and for some reason you watch the movies before we release our episodes on them, I'm really sorry that you've had to suffer watching the Hicker Man. Um but equally, you know, you don't have to. There's no one's holding a gun to your head. No one's holding a bees to your head. Are they holding bees to your head? Not the bees. Um, we'll talk about that. We will.
We will. Um, yeah. Nicholas Cage season. We're in the second half of our Nicholas Cage, my Nicholas Cage season now. And why did I choose the Hicker Man, I hear you ask. I don't know. Please, please elaborate. Uh, honestly, it I was just curious. I've never seen this before. You know the saying, don't you? No, curiosity killed the cat. Well, luckily I'm not a cat and I am still alive for now. Or maybe I'm dead. I don't know.
Maybe you expired during the making during the watching of that movie and you just don't know it. Yeah, it's possible. I guess maybe I my brain exploded or something. I had a stroke.
Um yeah, so I'm very sorry if you had to watch The Wicker Man. I'm I was just dead curious about this movie because it's definitely one that's in the zeitgeist that a lot of people know a lot of people people reference as a really terrible movie and probably one of the worst remakes people would would would say about it. Um I don't know if I would go that far, but we'll get into that. I believe it's got a 3.8 on IMDb and about 15% on Rotten Tomatoes. No, which I think is more than Madame Web.
I think this is better than Madame Web. I know what I'd rather watch. The Wicker Man. Yeah. Yeah. Without a doubt. At least there's more unintentional hilarity in the Wicker Man. Is it unintentional though? Yes. I don't care what they say. Look, we'll get to it. But yes, it was unintentional. You can't convince me otherwise. When you say they to which you refer I am referring to Nicholas Cage himself, the man himself and director Neil Lebout. Neil Lebout. Is it Leoot?
I don't know. I've never heard of him. I before this movie. Never heard of him. No, I know that he directed That thing with Samuel Jackson. That's about it. What thing? I don't know. The Avengers Infinity War or whatever it was. No, it was um it was the one where isn't I don't I haven't seen this movie. Oh, no. So, please don't come for me. But isn't it the one where Samuel Jackson plays a racist? Wait, what? I think it's called Lake View Terrace.
He's a police officer. I know that because on a poster he's wearing Is that the plot of that movie that he's a racist? I You're making me doubt myself now. Yes. Let's go with yes. Against who? White people. I guess you can't be racist to white people. I'm not saying you can, but I'm saying that might be the premise of that movie. And I could be wrong. Samuel Jackson hates white people. Understandable, honestly.
Yeah, I get it. Um, but I didn't know that. I had never heard of Neil Lebout uh until we watched this movie and I went back on um letter Fox, looked at his credits and thought, "Oh, that's the thing with Samuel Jackson. I think he's a racist in that movie." Right. That was the that was the the extent of my research for this episode. So, that was it. Wow. The rest the rest is on you, I'm afraid.
I mean, he used to be like quite an edgy filmmaker. I remember. Yeah. Like I remember sort of late 90s, early 2000s when he was making stuff like In the Company of Men and Nurse Betty, both of which I sort of read about in Empire magazine at the time and sort of s quite asserbic and black, you know, black comedies like a little bit dark. So, you seen those? Um, I've seen In the Company of Men. I don't think I ever watched Nurse Betty. All right. I've never heard of those. Not seen it.
Okay. But yeah, got a fair bit of buzz when they came out, I believe. But now he's sort of just making straight to streaming garbage like House of Darkness and Fear the Night. Oh, what other generic titles you can think of? Exactly. House of Darkness. I have actually seen of course. Yeah. I watch that when you weren't here. It was It was a really s***** um kind of single location horror film with Justin Long and his partner Kate Bosworth. Of course, Justin Long's in it. Yeah,
it was a crappy movie. Who should we get? Long. Long will do it. Except from some decent stuff, too. Yeah, Barbarian and Idiocracy. Is he in that? Yeah. I Why come you don't get a tattoo? I've only seen that once. saw it I think a couple of years maybe after it came out and thought this is ridiculous. We don't need to watch it anymore. We're living it. Well, that's the point. Now I'm curious to go back to it and go, "Oh, this could be a documentary." Yeah. They didn't go far enough.
Yeah. Oh, precisely. Mike Judge is a genius. Terry Cruz president had better hair than the current one. That's for sure. I'd vote for Terry Cruz. Yeah, me too. Yeah. I'd never heard of Neil Lebout. I'll be honest with you. We can say Neil Lebout's a Canadian if you want. We can say it the Canadian way. Boots. Neil Lebout. What am I saying? Neil Lebout. No, that's what I was saying. What am I saying? Lebout. What's the difference? That's the same, isn't it? Boot and Ah, it's the you bit. Yeah.
Right. All right. Well, who cares? I'm never going to watch another one of his movies. Okay. Maybe I'll program program one into another lineup just to piss you off. Just uh as a like a form of revenge for making you watch this one. Yeah. Oh, I'm already working on my revenge for my next uh my next theme. Yeah. Don't you worry. We were just talking about that before we started recording. So, that will be fun. But that's for one of us. That's months away.
That's That's 11, isn't it? That'll be season 11. Yeah. This is nine. This is nine. We've still got to do f****** 10 yet. Yes. Um, which I can't wait for. I can't wait for 10. Yeah, I know. I know. But that's even that's a while away. We've still got to get through the Wicker Man and three other Nicholas Cage movies. Well, come on then. What? Come on. What do you mean? Let's get to it. The Wicker Man.
Let's get to it. The Wicker Man. So, it's obviously a remake, which we mentioned we did watch the original in a cinema. What last year? The year before? Fairly recently. I think it was the year before it. That would make sense. It was an anniversary, wasn't it? It would have been 50. Yeah, that's right. 50 years old. Wow. And yeah, it's all right, that movie, isn't it? It's all right. It's excellent. I love a bit of folk horror.
I didn't mind it. I thought it was quite good. Um, but I was just dead curious about this movie. I I'm obviously big big fan of Nicholas Cage. Uh, I thought if I don't put it in this season, you'll never watch it. I'll never get around to it. It is also kind of a thing that I wanted to do in this season where we we've obviously gone chronological and I wanted to also explore not only the movies that he's in and talk about them, but perhaps why he might have done certain things. What Yep.
And that really would be my my biggest question. I think when you ask in this period of Nicholas Cage movies, We're at 2006 at this point. Mhm. Our last movie was um uh Snake Eyes, which was 1998. So, we've we've had an 8-year gap between his last movie and this movie. And a it feels like a lot kind of happened to to Nicholas Cage. He he carried he did like gone in 60 seconds. He had done um I'm going to steal the special document from the the talking about National Treasure.
National Treasure. Yeah, that's it. Um which was wildly successful and is not bad, you know. It's all right. And then he starts to get into a period where he's not m he's making movies that are not great. Uh Left Behind, I think, is one. You always reference Left Behind. I've never seen it. I'm so curious.
I was considering putting it on like it was it was probably going to be between the Wicker Man and Left Behind because the Left Behind is one that consistently goes on the bottom of everyone's Nicholas Cage movies lists. It's not even this one. Wow. And it's it's pretty bad apparently. Like he's some
there's you go on Letter Box. There's like an eight-year period where you're just like, I never heard of that. Never heard of that. Like in this one, he's a pl a plane pilot. In this one, he's a a submarine driver. And it's just like random movie. USS Indianapolis or whatever it was. Is he just getting all of the vehicles in? Yeah, I believe so. Gotcha.
Uh and to bring it back to the wicker man in he in this in this movie, His vehicle of choice is a motorbike because he's a traffic officer and then a bicycle and then a bicycle which is f****** brilliant. I love it. Um it's interesting because I believe the movie before this was World Trade Center. Oh, right. Okay. Which I've not seen but is about um the one that I kept confusing End of Watch with. Did you? Is Michael Pena in it? I don't know. I never seen it. Then I'm not sure.
Um, it's the one about 9/11, right? Yeah. Yeah. Uh, well, OB, of course it is. Stupid question. What else is it about? Day traders. Don't I don't don't make me do dark jokes about that cuz we'll get cancelled. So, the one before The Wicker Man was World Trade Center. He does The Wicker Man where he rides a motorbike and a a bicycle as you mentioned. Mhm. Do you know what movie came after this? I'm going to say Ghost Rider based on what you're talking about. Correct. That pile of s***.
Which is funny because in Ghost Rider, he he rides a motor motorcycle and he's also on fire. Yep. Yeah. Bit like this movie. Um Yeah, there was some fire. There was some fire. We didn't see much of him on fire because this movie was a 12 12 certificate movie. Do you know what? I think it's important to point out if anybody's listening uh that owns the DVD or Blu-ray um which if you do then firstly why
why do you do that? Um, secondly, we watched the only version that was available to us, which was the theatrical cut, which as you've said was a 12A. However, it was originally intended to be a lot darker. Yeah. And there is an unrated cut available for purchase. Um, but I would rather gouge out both of my own eyeballs than spend money on the remake of The Wicker Man. So, we we didn't purchase that. Um, you look like you're filled with some regret. Don't buy it. I might. Don't buy it.
Don't. I I didn't hate this. But it was intended to be an 18 certificate. Oh, right. Okay. Well, that makes sense if you're going to remake The Wicker Man. It's definitely in that period as well, isn't it? In that 2006 where they were doing a lot of remakes and watering it down, making them 12 certificates. Were they though? Like when was stuff like Wrong Turn? I feel like there was some pretty gnarly stuff coming out.
Wrong Turn I think was maybe a couple of years before that, but that was an original property. Wasn't it? Yeah. Um like House of Wax maybe. Like I don't Right. Paris I mean let's put Paris Hilton in a in a movie. We get to see her impaled. Do you? Yeah. Right. Okay. I quite like Paris Hilton now. She seems cool. She gets impaled in a in other movie, didn't she? That's the That's Moving swiftly on. It's a joke that cancels me. Yeah. Um
yeah. I I don't know. It's it's it makes sense. that it was intended originally intended to be an 18 certificate. I don't know quite why other than financial problems that Nicholas Cage would have agreed to make this movie because he's a big fan of horror movies. So I know why. Ah well firstly I just want to say like it it was always intended to be an 18 certificate um to quote Neil Abute um due to extreme violence and disturbing elements.
I want more of that. I want more of the extreme violence and the disturbing elements. Bring that on. Yeah. Um But he wanted a broader audience. A broad audience, if you will. Audience. Broad audience. But so, so hang on. The director's saying that he wanted a broader audience. That's a lie. It was studio. Obviously, it was studio and he wanted to maintain that relationship with the studio. There's no way probably
that you want to make a remake to the Wicker Man and go, "Oh, let's make it for children." But what's the point? I agree. I f****** point. But I will say that this movie is I I don't think it's really a 12 movie. Like there there's certain things. You don't think it should be? You think it should be rated higher? A man gets set on fire. Yeah. Like you don't see some stuff. There's some stuff where you hear, "Oh, my legs are broken." Yeah. A lot of it's just like implied.
Yeah. But like literally a man gets set on fire. Yeah. If I had a child and they were 12 Well, I haven't got a child and I watched horror movies when I was a kid. You're not the person to comment on this, are you?
But I do feel like it's not it's not really just sort there's no way to make there's certain films that you can go oh I can see how you can get around this and make it like I could see a version of the 13 Ghosts you could make. I think that was a 15. That's one actually that they remade. But maybe they could have paired that down a bit and made it a 12 and it would have been fine, you know. Yeah, I do enjoy that movie and there's some there's some interesting stuff in it.
But um but but the Wicker Man like thematically It's about a weird f****** cult and a man gets set on fire. There's no way to 12A that s***. Well, they did though. But they they did. Yes, there is. Yeah, I guess I stand corrected unlike Nicholas Cage who gets his legs broken. But so he wanted to do this film. Cage, he not only starred in it, he produ like was a producer as well. EP I saw he had an EP credit. Yeah.
Yeah. Um and it also links to the weird credit at the end where um they do say that this film is dedicated to Johnny uh is it Johnny Raone? Johnny Raone. Yeah, Johnny Raone. Who I'm sure was thrilled about that. Well, he he been dead two years, so I'm sure Yeah. Did he rolling in his grave? He'd been dead two years before that he died prior to this. Yeah. This didn't kill him. I was going to say, did he Okay. Right. I can see why you would be confused. Um
that was random when that popped up at the end. I was like, what? It was random. But I have answers for you. Please. So, Nicholas Cage was good friends with Johnny Ramon and it was Johnny Raone that introduced him to the original Wickerman which he became a huge fan of. So I think he wanted to be part of this remake just because of his attachment to the original. Yeah. And actually um it's funny because a lot of the dialogue in this version actually remains the same as the original
as the as the original as the 1973 version albeit in slightly different context. I'm getting this straight from IMDb. I didn't go back to cross reference. I will point that out now. But yeah, apparently a lot of the dialogue is same is the same. But um but it was so poorly received and Robin Hardy, the director of the original Wickerman, wanted absolutely nothing to do with this from the word go. Just was adamant that this project should not take off.
Um so much so that when it was finished, he got his lawyers to get in touch with, I think it was Warner Brothers, to get his name removed from the credits. He did not want to be credited for any of the dialogue or anything to do with this movie. I understand that completely. Um, we're still knocking around though. That's Well, that was 20 years ago, I guess.
I Yeah, I don't know if he is now. But, interestingly, Robin Hardy only made, I think, three films. One of which was a sequel to The Wicker Man. I don't know if you know that exists. There's a sequel to The W. There's a sequel to The W man called the Wicked Tree. I've never seen it cuz I heard it was dog s***, but largely um was received worse than this one. Worse than the remake. Yes, that's interesting.
But I did find that interesting that he wanted his name removed from this one, but then went on to make a worse film. Did he Did the Did the sequel to The Wicker Man come out after the remake? Yeah, I think it was 2010, 2011. Really? That's fascinating. Yeah,
cuz I I was going to say I could understand had you made the Wicker Man and then they make the remake, they screen it for him and he goes, "This is terrible. I don't want anything to do with this." I get that. I understand it. Please remove my name. I do not want to be affiliated with this project in any way. Yeah. But the fact that he went on to make a sequel some 35 years after the original and it was bad and it's received worse than this movie, that's very interesting.
Yeah. Like I say, I haven't seen it so I can't Can't say that with any confidence, but from what I've from from the digging that I did, um it's it's not a well-liked film at all. He wanted it to be a trilogy, would you believe? When did he say that though? When when the second one came out? I have no idea. Cuz he didn't say it when the Edward Woodwood would would Oh s***, I'm stuck in a loop. He didn't say that when the 73 one came out. I'm sure. No,
because no one was talking about trilogies then. It was just make a movie. I don't know. Maybe that was his one good idea given that he only made three films. Yeah, who knows? But yeah, I'm I'm not exactly devastated that that didn't come to fruition. That's fascinating. It's It is a like another reason that I decided to put this on. I number one, I was just very curious. I did I did want to do a movie that's not been received greatly as well.
Well, they're always fun to talk about, even if they're not fun to watch. And sometimes I just like to try and find the good things in a bad movie. How's that going for you? Yes, it's all right. Actually, like Snake Eyes last week, that was an interesting conversation. Like the first time I watched that, didn't love it, but actually this time, you know, there's quite a lot to that movie. It's not perfect as we we discussed. Go back and listen to that show.
But I did want one in there that is not necessarily wellreceived, but there would we could maybe ask the question why. Yeah, because I mean, as you've already stated, especially during this period of his life, Nick Cage did do a lot of films that were not critically received. Well, yeah. I mean, I'm just I am very grateful you didn't put Ghost Rider on the the lineup or Drive Angry. Oh, I don't I haven't seen Drive Angry. Oh, no. No good. Awful. All right. Awful.
I mean, that is that is one that I I thought that maybe I would get some enjoyment out of it because it's got the word drive in the title. Um there's I haven't seen Bangkok Dangerous. There's a bunch of that stuff that I haven't seen. I think this was the right choice. As much as I dislike this movie. I will say that
we can loop it back to the original. Like I said, it's the question of why it's Nicholas Cage. It's it I felt like there would probably be enough to talk about even if the movie was terrible. And I got to be I did not think this movie was terrible. Really, I didn't think it was terrible. It It's not good. Don't No, it's not.
Don't misread me. Um but I didn't think it was I was expecting this to be way worse. Like there's sometimes with movie like it took me years to watch The Room and everyone had said it's about it's a terrible movie. It's the worst movie you'll ever see, but it's so much fun. And the first time I saw it, I went to Prince Charles and watched it there and it was the one of the greatest evenings of my life. It was so much fun. Did you throw a plastic spoon at the screen?
No, because I didn't know that that was a thing. Spoon. Brilliant. Like terri like if you remove like if we if that came out now and we went to see it and no one knew what the room was. We would just watch it and go what a piece of s***. Yeah. Right. But it's taken the time for people to go actually it's terrible but you know it's a lot of fun to watch it isn't it? Well it took a while for people to even find it.
True. And I was kind of expecting something akin to that. But this is not as nowhere near as bad as the room. And I was kind of like I said I was going into it expecting terrible like like really really bad. And it wasn't. And I'm almost a bit disappointed that it wasn't as bad as I was hoping. Like, it's not, like I say again, it's not great. There's some weird decisions in this. And you could argue that maybe the first I it actually passed by quite quickly for me, but I could understand if you said it's some of it is quite dull.
The first hour, say the first 50 minutes. I don't I don't even know that it's dull. I didn't think it was particularly dull. But I could understand if you had that criticism. It's I don't I don't know. I think I understand what you're saying, but at the same time, I think you're kind of comparing apples to oranges because the room is the room that exists in its own like biosphere that that is its own entity rem like completely removed from everything else bar perhaps.
Yeah, that's another good example. And then the wicker man is directed by an actual filmmaker. starring actual actors. Yeah. Using a lot of the original dialogue. So, there is a lot of talent here. Ellen Buren, like one of the greats, you know, there are people in this that are very very good at their jobs.
But all of those elements together, I think it's I think this film sort of exists more as like a curiosity because like how did it go so wrong? The elements were there. It could have been good. Maybe the 18, maybe the unrated is good. Who knows? I I might buy it. Oh god, what have I done?
I'm dead curious. But you said something interesting when we were watching the film, actually, and a lot of the discussions we've been having thus far about Nicholas Cage's movies is we can't see anyone else playing that role. This is firmly Yeah. I'm going to eat my words from last week already. This is firmly a Nicholas Cage performance. Um, and no one else could do it. Mhm. But this one. Anyone? It could have been anyone. It could have been anyone. Save for the last 20 minutes maybe.
Yeah. Like it's But even then, you could get someone else in it and and the film wouldn't be that different. No, it's it's curious that he didn't go larger. And I He's very intentional with what he does. Sometimes he's larger than life and it can come across a bit silly, but there's always a thought behind it.
There's always good intention. He wants to make a good thing. But in this one, for some reason, he's a lot of his his um a lot of his reactions to things are quite odd, but not in the way that you expect from Nicholas Cage. Not in the not in the way that you expect from any human, you could say. And it's quite inconsistent the the things that he reacts to. Yeah. Throughout the movie, like one minute he's very like a How how many times in the first 15 minutes do we see a child get hit by a truck?
Loads. It was great. And he's just but he's just like right. Yeah. He's supposed to be traumatized like off work with probable PTSD. Yeah. And Yeah. Really really understated to the point of catonia performance from Nicholas Cage. But then the last 20 minutes he's kicking women in the head and he's going out you broke my legs. Did you ever think that you would get to see Nicholas cage dressed as a bear punching not one, not two, but three women in the face. No, I I wasn't. Um,
nothing could have prepared anybody for that. Surely I wasn't expecting it. No, I I was not expecting it. Um, definitely it definitely picked up the last 30 minutes and I was I I was laughing at it like I wasn't going this is this is really this is really interesting. Yeah, this is well written comedy. Yeah.
Well, yeah. I was kind of like, is this is this a comedy? It might be a bit of a comedy. Um, and I guess maybe that's sort of maybe a bit of a criticism is is that it it sort of towards the end of it feels more like a tongue and cheek kind of take on a Wicker Man, but the first half is seems quite uh it's so sober.
It takes itself quite quite seriously at the beginning. And but there's just a series of there's also there's a series of decisions that you just think, well, well, why is he traffic cop. Yeah. Why? Why? Why is that a thing? Why is he wearing a leather jacket on a motorbike? A leather a brand new leather jacket. That leather jacket had never been worn by anybody. Costume really phoned this in. Seriously. Yeah.
But I Yeah, that did make me laugh. And also like why why would a traffic cop go and play detective on an island somewhere? I know he had personal connections. I get it. But dude, you're not qualified for this. You know what? If an ex from 10 years ago ran me up and said, "My daughter's gone missing." I go, "Well, phone the police. Good luck. Good luck with that. See you later. Byebye." Yeah.
He seems to be really upset by that rel the end of that relationship still because when he they first meet again, he goes, "Why did you end it? Did you meet someone else?" I'm thinking, "Mate, get over it. Have you been holding this in for a decade?" Yeah. This is And um what the first scene actually we see him he's in it's in the diner, right? And the diner sells self-el videos. Oh yeah.
Don't live in America. Don't know if that's a usual thing. In 2006 we're buying VHS's in diners. I don't know. Isn't it called just called like it's okay? I don't know. I don't know. But that that kind they he references it again like obviously you can't go anywhere without your self self-help tapes because it takes them on holiday with him to Summers Summers Isle. Is it called Summers Isle?
It is. So in the in in the original Wikim man it was summer ale. and um Christopher Lee was Lord Summer ale, but they weren't confident of the Americans being able to pronounce Summer Isle correctly, so they changed it to Summers Isle for this one, which quite frankly I would find insulting if I were an American audience member. Yeah, that's a strange decision. Like I say, a series of strange decisions like the at one point he goes, "Well, where are my self-help tapes?"
And then it never comes up again. Yeah. Like I So, so what are you trying to tell me by the fact that he buys self-help tape? And is he also ordering supplements online? What's What was that about? I don't know. I've got a few questions actually. I Do you We'll get I'm not confident I'm going to have answers for you. Maybe we'll get to them at some point. But it was just it was curious. And like that that first 15 minutes he he sees the the car get uh driven into into by the truck.
Car catches fire. He tries to rescue the child through a tiny hole in the back. And the child doesn't seem like she wants to be rescued. That that child's performance was very strange. Yeah. But they say that they can't find the bodies. Mhm. And I think one of the first times I laughed actually is is does it skip forward a few months or something after the the accident? I think so. There's a small time jump.
He's he's at home and he's obviously got some time off work. And the police officer comes in and she sits down. He's like, I don't need any visitors. Come in. And she sits down and there's just a really awkward silence for about 8 seconds and it just sort of does look like a little smile and I'm just like, what's going on? It's already funny. I think that's largely down to the editing though. I think the editing was a real mess here.
Yeah. I wonder and I I would love to to see what was what ended up on the cutting room floor or the takes that didn't make it into this cuz I I bet you that K had a range of takes on each scene and they they chose these ones for some reason. Maybe that was the intention was to have him somewhat sedated for the first hour or so and then slowly come to life towards the end of the movie, which doesn't really make any sense narratively.
I mean, it's I guess it does sort of mirror Edward Woodward's performance. in a way. Yeah. Um not in a good way, but in a in a sense. Yeah. I remember him being quite um rigid. Yeah. At the start of the movie. I think that's kind of what they were going for here. Right. Okay. Okay. That makes sense. Yeah. So, they were really just trying to replicate that movie, weren't they? Which makes the question, why bother?
Well, they Yes, they were trying to replicate it, but they did make some really, I think, changes that could have been really interesting, but weren't. Um Obviously, in the original, it's it's more focused on how how kind of sexually liberated everybody on the island is and their their connection to nature and all of this stuff, and it seems really alien to the the cop. Um, and they did away with that completely here and and did a really I don't I don't know if you caught this.
I don't know if you clocked it. I did, but they did a really subtle thing where it was like um a hive, like a beehive. Did you get that? Like there was there was a queen bee Yeah. He doesn't appear until an hour in. By the way, there's also some worker bees, weren't there, carrying bits of wood like like any good bee.
Yeah. But but the the gender politics like that could have been really interesting. The whole kind of subjugation of men and the it felt like it had something to say, but it didn't. Yeah. It it it's almost a good idea, isn't it? Like
almost. Yeah. Like it's there was something there like you say with the be the bees maybe was oh I think the like the queen bee situation on the island with um bursting and the fact that all the men on the island you don't really see them they're sort of out of the picture a bit they don't speak they all seem like mentally and emotionally neutered
yeah and in the last act you kind of find out the journey that their people of their ancestors had had gone through to get where they are and that's kind of interesting like there something there. Definitely. But they pissed it all up the wall. Yeah. And then they decided to give Nicholas Cage a bee allergy to tie it in with Don't forget he's got that bright yellow be epi pen.
I mean, I laughed so hard when they did a closeup of two EpiPens. I like, "Oh, well that's not that's never going to come up again, surely." They were yellow and they had the word bee on them. Be epu. I mean If they're not confident that their audience can pronounce summer, yeah, then they're probably not confident that they're I mean, this is a film that really does not respect its audience at all. Yeah, that's fair. Doesn't grant them any sort of intelligence, which is a real shame.
Yeah, it is a shame. I like I wonder if there's a good version of this. I can't imagine that the uh the original, call it the original, the extended director's cut, whatever you want to call it, can't imagine it's going to be a huge improvement. It's probably going to be a slight improvement. I do wonder how much of it was editing though and and which takes were chosen. Like you said, I feel like they probably could have cobbled together a much better film than we got.
I wonder what version Nick Cage read like when he got the script or or how much, you know, maybe he very much decided to uh pursue this movie and kind of arranged for the writers and stuff like that. Obviously, he's got an EP credit, so we had quite a lot of pull Mhm. on on the um on the job quite a lot of um influence on it. But I wonder which version he originally read that made him excited to do it. It can't have been the version that we saw. It can't. And if that version exists anywhere.
Yeah. I don't know. I I think it's it's almost quite nice and one could say respectful that they chose to go with a lot of the original dialogue with some minor changes. But I feel like like that was a terrible decision. I think they should have updated it. I don't I don't really know why they chose to go with that. I think yeah, if you give it a complete rewrite and bring it up to date, it could have been much better because it sort of felt like they were trying to do what the original did and have people's responses to things be maybe not in keeping with the emotion that the questions were asked in or like they were going for this sort of creepy uncanny vibe. But it just reads as stilted in this movie.
Yeah. And a bit silly. Yeah. Um, was one of the one of the lines that they reused for the remake, was it, "What's in that bag? Is it a shark?" Was that something that Edward Woodward said in the original? Honestly, I can't remember, but I would not be at all surprised because that was so strange. Why would that be your first guess? It would have been even weirder if they went, "Yeah, how'd you guess?" Yeah. What was in that bag? It's like Hessian bag. We never get to see it.
We never find out. And that's my biggest problem with this. I guess that's in the unrated. Oh, yeah. Maybe. I need to get it. I need to get it. I don't know why I'm selling this to you. Do you reckon there's an like an like a second sight version of this? Maybe. Um, I'm going to go no. Get on it. Second sight. So, early on in this film, it does something that is one of my most hated tropes, and that is the double dream fake out. Yeah. You're talking about the on a dock. I hate it.
Yeah, I hate it so much. It was Oh, but I I I did enjoy that scene though. So, he he's sitting on the dock, right? And he's trying to get old mate in the plane back or whatever. Yeah. Doesn't matter. And he he see he he sees um looks like the missing child. Yeah. Yeah. Underneath in the water. So, he he takes off his jacket. Not his shoes. Shoes. Don't worry. diet does the weirdest dive that I've ever seen anyone do. Yeah, he sort of dives and I it's sort of twists around.
It's so weird. It's like he sort of falls but with rigidity. I can't even describe it. Yeah, but he's trying to sort of dive underneath the the the jetty at the same time. Yeah, it is very strange. It just like strains out like a rod though and just like falls sideways and Then you find out it's a dream sequence and it's just like this is your dream. Yeah. Is this how poorly you dive in your own dreams? Couldn't you have like imagined yourself diving in a cool way? No.
And then um and then he's like oh and he wakes up and he's sitting on the dock again and he's holding child dead corpse. Dead corpse again. Yeah. Of a child. And then he wakes up and they're doing the inception thing. Dream of within a dream. But what's really funny to me, he goes, "God damn. like he's losing his mind and like that's his reaction.
But the thing is is that happens throughout the movie. We mentioned earlier that when he's on the boat heading towards Summers is he sees the kid on the boat and he see has a vision of the kid getting hit by the truck. He sort of shakes it off and laughs at that point which was an odd reaction. So he's having these visions throughout the movie but you never figure out why or what's going on. Maybe it's um the results of his PTSD because because of the car accident,
I guess. So, that may or may not have happened. Yeah. Right. Maybe the whole premise is just that Nicholas Cage is insane. I think that's the premise of every movie he's in. Well, fair. Yeah. Um yeah, there's there it was it was weird that that the dream within the dream. There were so many times where he imagined things happening. Uh, but it does make you think like, did he imagine the whole thing? Is he still is he still in that diner looking at self-help tapes?
There's an alternate ending where it just cuts to him in a padded room wearing a straight jacket. There isn't, but there should be. I mean, that that was one of my first questions is um why was he having visions? Because genuinely don't know. Never f****** explained. No. No. Um, there is one way that this film is better than the original in my humble opinion one way. Go on. There's no singing. Yeah, that's fair. There's so much singing in the original. I'd forgotten that. I think
which I get like it's going for the whole folky vibe. I appreciate that. But it's the the geyser in the um in the jacket in the first one. The geyser in the jacket. Yeah. And he's sort of walking and swinging his arms like that. Huh? The the the main guy. The geyser. Lord Summer. Christopher Lee. That guy. Yeah. Right. I knew you'd know it. the geyser. Yeah. Does he Does he do a bit of singing in it? Everybody does a bit of singing in that movie.
I remember that at all. Do they dance around the pole and stuff? Um there's some maple stuff. There is a maple in the background of a scene in this movie which is sort of shown and then never mentioned again. Yeah. Links to the original like like much of this. Yeah. But again, maybe it's in the editing. Yeah. Maybe all of our questions would be answered just with a better cut of this movie. Oh, we'll find out.
I doubt it, but who knows? I think some other sort of instances of how how much this movie just sort of talks down to its audience are times like when he goes to see Oh, I can't remember a name. It's Fran. Is it Francis Conroy? France Ferdinand. It's definitely not France Ferdinand. Frank Skinner. It's not Frank Skinner either. I think it's Francis Conroy. Please stop saying names. Frank Spencer. Stop it. Butcher. Nobody who listens to This is going to know who Frank Spencer is. Surely
they might. They will. We're aging ourselves. They will. There'll be a few people know. Kevin, you'll know Frank Spencer is you'll know who Frank Spencer is. Loads of people know. Okay. Joel, Chris, you all know. All of our listeners. That's all of our listeners. All four. But um Oh, Betty. But yeah, stop it. Don't don't go down that road. Um but yeah, he he goes to see her to ask some question. questions. Um, did you notice some of the windows are hexagonal shapes? No, I did not.
Or like a beehive. Do you get it? Do you get it? Um, there are several references to beehives in this movie. There are. Yeah. It's so cleverly done. But there's just this like comedy winking villain thing that happens. And he's like I think he's looking at a book if I remember rightly and she like nudges it away and shuts it and it literally says on the front like rituals of the ancients. It's like oh Good lord. Yeah.
And it it just feels like the movie's going, "Hey, did you see that? Did you see a weird s***'s happening and it just feels like I'm being insulted to my face." But I I enjoy that. Say no, cuz he's like, "All right, I guess there's nothing to see here then. I guess I'll see you later. Bye." Cuz he's an idiot. And But no, but then it cuts to him hiding in the bush. Oh, yeah. And then he breaks back in. Yeah. To the the person's house who is the doctor and a photographer.
Yeah. And he reads the book and he's like, "I think something nefarious is going. But if I was her, my first question would be, "Why are you asking me about photographs of little girls?" Like, she just doesn't question it. She's like, "Yeah, I'll get you a copy." Why? To be fair, it's not the weirdest thing that happens on this island. No, for sure. Yeah. Um the So, I didn't notice that the windows were in a shape of um what did you call them? Hexagons. Mhm. They're a sh That's a shape. Yeah.
Hexagons. And that's the shape of a beehive. Yeah. I didn't cock that. at all. I I really love I weird thing, right? If I was allergic to bees, number one, I wouldn't go to an island where their main source of where they're famous for making honey. Precisely. Yeah.
Like I probably should not I'll take two epip. I'll take two be. All right. I'll take two be epipens with me just to be on the safe side. I'll take if I need one and I nearly die, I've got a backup. Yeah. So like I've covered all bases. At least two. And I certainly wouldn't get on a bike comedically and cycle. Nicholas Cage pedaling that bike needs to be a gift.
At which point I think you and I started to have a little conversation for about 6 seconds, look back at the screen. He's rolling down a hill through the beehives in the field and I'm like, "What the f*** happened?" The editing is so s***. That's what I'm saying.
But then but then he's just That's my point. He's allergic to bees. Number one, don't go to that island. Number two, don't go anywhere near the bees. He seems to be unconcerned with being near the bees. Someone that might die if he goes near a bee. It's just like like a bee lands on his neck and he goes, "Ah, f****** bees." Mhm. This thing can kill you, mate. Yeah. He's concerned when it suits the plot. Yeah. And unconcerned when it doesn't.
Yeah. Um Yeah. That was That might be one of my favorite scenes where he's running through that field and you've just got the random beehives situated around the place. and he's starts rolling down like Andy Samberg in Hot Rod. I I I've seen that movie. I don't remember much about it. He suffered a long and painful fall. I do remember that bit actually. Yeah. Now you mention it. Yeah. Yeah. But like a comedy. Yeah.
And I I I say again, I didn't hate this. I was expecting to hate it more. I did find it quite fun and enjoyable. And I'm not sure if it was intentional. I I'm I can understand both arguments. whether you you think it was intentional or if you think it wasn't because it does sort of try to straddle that line between serious and tongue and cheek. I think it doesn't get the balance right.
I like we've already said like the first half of this movie is so pfaced and then it descends into almost slapstick. Yeah, it's really bizarre. Like you say, but you in that third act when all of a sudden escalations come out of nowhere, he's just swinging s like a wild man. Yeah, it's mad. Dressed as a bear. It's so I've seen this before and even I was like shocked. It's so weird. Why did you do you like see this at the cinema or something?
No. God, no. It would have been on streaming, I'm sure. You see, like for me, like if people say that a film's terrible, then I'm probably not going to watch it. Well, that's true 90% of the time, but sometimes um the choice isn't up to me. Sometimes somebody else gets to choose. is the movie and I just have to sit there and endure it like this season of like Nicholas Cage movies. This this very show. Question. Do you prefer this or The Rock? Ooh, it's not. This podcast is over.
We had a good run. Yeah. We end on Wouldn't it be a great number to end on though? 69. We did 69 then we f***** it off cuz Sarah almost said the wicked man is better than the rock. No, it's Obviously not a better film, but would I rather watch it? No way. I don't know. This film is a lot less misogynistic. Well, true. That is true. You can't argue that. I can't argue that.
And this film does have Ellen Buren in. I'm sorry, but she's great in this. Even Even in this movie, she's like she's definitely trying. She's too good for this movie. I will say that. Um, but even at like she's she's operating at like 4 3% and she's still the best thing in it. Yeah, it's I don't blame anyone in the cast for this movie particularly. Like it's it's weird that she's got the whole queen bee situation going on which all of that is revealed quite late in the game.
Well, yeah. She's not on screen until an hour into the movie. Yeah. Which I don't necessarily hate that idea, but there's certain things that you maybe could have introduced earlier and had a bit more mystery to it. Like it does because we watched the original in such recent memory. It does feel like it's retreading a lot and you even said that there some of the same dialogue was used like let's go to the school and interrogate the children. That was so weird.
But then it it just all of a sudden the third act feels to me like it kind of comes out of nowhere like it like all of a sudden it escalates to this thing. I'm like, "Oh, f***. All right. It's the end of the movie then, I guess." Yeah. And then Ellen Bernstein all of a sudden is dressed as Mel Gibson. but a lot less anti-Semitic and sober I presume. Anyway, I don't think Ellen Bernstein's friends with Jim Kafitzel. I hope not. Oh, Mark Wahberg.
Oh, wow. Birds of a Feather. Hey, that saying could not be true. She's not in Birds of a Feather. It's another one that our British audience want to know. Pauline Quirk, we spent way too much time together. Don't we? Um, what was I going to say? I hated that show. Yeah, it was terrible. Dorian, but um
to get back to the Wicker Man. I feel like the original did such a better job of like peppering the weirdness through it, whereas this was just like everyone's being a bit weird and a bit rude to him. But he's he's being rude to to the people as well. Like Yeah. It's as if he's never a interacted with another human before. He is snatching books away from people and like interrogating children like shining lights on them. Crushing bees with a beer stone.
Yeah. Yeah. Whilst that's filled with gravy. No. No. Mead. He was drinking me. That was it. Because honey. I've never drank me before. No. It's not vegan. Well, I can't now. No. Um but yeah, I think I think the original did a much better job of like weaving the weirdness throughout. Whereas this was just awkward rather than weird. It was just like I say stilted and odd but not in a way like in the original Edward Woodward was the everyman. He was he was like you say a bit rigid.
I suppose he was an every man back then wasn't he but he was he was like the proxy for the audience. He was dropped into this this world and you situation. Yeah. Yeah. Whereas in this Nicholas Cage is also So really f****** odd. Yeah. It doesn't work. Yeah. And and and going back to our point earlier about anyone could have maybe played this role. And in fact, maybe it would have been better if someone else had. Maybe
because like you say, Nicholas Cage is to just too weird. And for the first half of this movie, I'm going, when are we going to see Nicholas Cage? And then when he dresses as a bear, I'm like, oh, he's here. Finally. Like if you're going to put him in the movie, like put him in the movie. Yeah. Let him go full tilt. Yeah. Go full cage.
It's funny, you you know how rarely I ever found myself agreeing with Roger Eert, but I did find a quote online while I was doing some digging for this film, and I think to paraphrase, he sort of said, "Nicholas Cage is a really good actor in good movies, but he's a really bad actor in bad movies." And I think I agree with that. I think I agree with that. I think that's a really fair observation.
I don't necessarily think it's ever Nicholas Cage's fault. No, like I said earlier like and especially having watched a few of them now for this season and really digging into the man, he definitely wants to do the best that he can and he has the good intentions. He clearly was a like you mentioned he's a big fan of the wicker man like there's no he wouldn't have wanted to make a bad movie there's and he still defends it
or he did anyway for a long time after it release. I don't know if he still does
but but the fact is that he takes huge swings when he makes movies. One of the biggest swings is the Vampires Kiss, which I could understand that movie would not be for everyone, but it works so much because for for me anyway, because he took a huge swing and it it worked, but in another movie, you could take a huge swing and it doesn't work. It just ends up being completely stupid. But that's the risk you take. You you go big or go home, you know? It's like it's either going to be a brilliant or it's going to be a piece of s***.
And I respect that. There's very little middle ground for people that are just happy to just pump out a mediocre movie, which I think this did end up being a mediocre movie. Um, I think that he doesn't want to do that. He He wants to make the best thing possible. And, like I say, it's either the best thing ever or it's the worst thing ever. And And I I I respect that so much more than people just play it safe. Play it safe. Yeah. Exact. Exactly right. Don't play it safe. Take risks.
And we get less and less people taking risks in movies the the further we get. I feel like it's always we've got to play to the four quadrants. We've got to this this is a bad movie. This is a bad example of a movie that that tried to make a 12A out of a a brutal and weird horror movie. But that's that's kind of why I like actors like Ben Foster, for example. Yeah. Like I don't know much about him as a person, but as an actor, he can be really unhinged.
Yeah. And sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. Exactly. Yeah. But at least he, as you say, swings for the fences. Yeah. There's something to it. There's there there's there was some decisions made and some risks taken. Exactly. Not always good. Yeah. Sometimes you were an angel in X-Men 3. Um and sometimes you're uh in Hell or High Water. Exactly. Yeah. There you go. And I think we've com didn't you compare Ben Foster to Nicholas Cage in another episode. I feel maybe.
But that's a really good example I think of if there's someone that's kind of younger than than Cage who's trying to do something similar. I feel like that's not to the same extent. I don't think there's anyone quite like Cage, but he's definitely an actor that I would say I would compare him to Cage more than say Jeff Daniels. That being the other obvious choice. Yeah. The only other actor I can think of. Yeah. I think I think they both care about the craft. Yeah. Take some risks. Mhm.
Not always going to work. Sometimes it's going to be s***. Yeah. That's fine though. If I can see that you've tried, that's enough. for me a a lot of the time I think. So we need to talk about the ending. We need to talk about the climax of this film. Go on. I think this is where so like the final third is the best defense for Neil Lee and Nicholas Cage saying that the comedy was intentional. Yeah.
Because it really does go just off the rails and he's literally just punching women like there is no tomorrow. Neil Leute really said equality. Yeah. And I kind of respect that in a weird way cuz it it is shocking. It is really shocking. Like he it's in that bar, isn't it? Um he like I'm pretty sure he like kicks Lely soi in the stomach and she flies into a wall. Oh. Oh. Oh, by the way, remembered where I recognize her from. Deep Impact. Oh, yeah. Of course.
Um but yeah. Yeah, it's in the bar where he Soies is in there with him and that's where like after as he gets into the bear costume. But I think he punches her and then she's sort of struggle. He throws her over the table and then it cuts to him and he does just like a kick in the head. Yeah. Wild. It's It's wild. And then he gets into the bear costume and then it cuts to a wide shot of him running towards the parade in a bear costume. So funny.
It is It is definitely the best defense for for insisting that this film was intended to be funny. And I I thought and I actually said to you, I was like, "Is he in blackface?" Oh, no. He had like the the bee thing on his head. Yeah. Like Yeah. He just had some mesh. Yeah. Yeah. In in the in the bare mouth. But I was a bit worried for a minute there. I was like, there's someone doing beef face. There's someone doing blackface. Like this. This is not okay. You did say Ellen Burston was in Bace.
Can't do that anymore. It's not politically correct. She was in Gibson face, which is even worse potentially. Yeah. These days. God. Um Yeah. I I feel like that very ending while it does mirror what happens in the original. It It sort of feels like that is the most obvious point at which footage was obviously removed. Yeah. I mean the the the most iconic scene in this the one that was me'd to hell isn't even in the theatrical court. Not the bees. Yeah.
And I was I couldn't wait to see that scene. And then when it got to the very end and there he's in the wicker man I was like so when we're not doing the bees then what's where are the bees? cuz I thought right when I when I I've seen the memes and things like that and I thought that that was what they were doing instead of the wicker man which wouldn't make any sense like you call it the beehive man call it the bee head bee head beef face
but I was I I was really disappointed that that that had never happened in our version but it does exist and they cut it out for the 12 version right so you can't have a man being stung by a bee but you can have a man on fire yes that makes so much sense according to the MPAA. Yes.
And they clearly like they know exactly what they're doing. Uh I'm not going to question their decisions at all. I was so disappointed that I didn't get to see that which just makes me want to get this this original cut even more. I am so deeply regretful that I ever mentioned that to you. But it's he he does the the the bear thing. He runs away with child. Um
which surprise it's his kid. Who saw that coming? We all did. Yeah, who looks exactly like him, by the way. Um, yeah, he's hiding in the in the in the forest dressed as a bear. And, um, then they catch up with him. He's holding a like holding a gun to people. Best police officer in the world, by the way. He doesn't even check if his gun's loaded. Mhm. Then they catch him and it just cuts to them carrying him towards the wicker man. But his face is swollen, right?
Which is why it just doesn't make sense. Like he's got at least one of his eyes is really swollen with like a swap faces with John Travolar, right? You wonder why his chin was so weird. That ridiculous chin. Yeah. But yeah, it just it cuts to that and it doesn't make any sense. Yeah. Okay. I hadn't noticed that his his uh face was swollen, but um I was just I think I was just like, where are the f****** bees? I want to see the bees.
And then you hear the the they left the I guess it's a is it a voice? I don't know if you call it a voice over, but you hear his dialogue of going you hear Ow, my legs. You broke my legs. I don't believe in your god, Mario. I can't feel my legs. Yeah. Yeah. And I I was just thinking quite like to say that. Yeah.
But he did sell it for me in that dialogue, I must say. And then they just sort of propped him up a bit and then put him in the wicker man and um like hoisted him hoisted him up to the top of the wicker man. Uh they had that rope. I noticed they had that rope which They pulled away and I remember thinking they must have asked him to untie that while he was at the top. He Oh, okay. I'll untie it so you can How did they get that road down? That's a really good point.
Didn't make any sense, but you know, one of many things that doesn't That's not the the the worst thing that happens in this movie. No. Yeah. And then he obviously you don't see him physically on fire, but the suggestion is that he gets set on fire. Yeah. And then it sort of like does it like fade to black and then it it skips forward again? There's another time jump 6 months I believe.
Six months later. The six months later scene is again only in the theatrical cut in the unrated version. It does just end with him being burnt alive which it should. Which it should. Yeah. But even then when it cuts to 6 months I'm still thinking oh is this the be scene then? Like is he still alive? He's still holding out hope.
Yeah. I was like did he not die then? Is this how it's different from the original? Like is he now just brainwashed and he's now recruiting people? Like I had a whole question about what was going on with the dudes on this island? Yeah, because they don't talk. So I was thinking, do they have their tongues cut out? They know their place, Dan. I swear though, at one point he tries to have a conversation with somebody and just goes, "Yeah, none of them speak."
So I I thought, "Oh, they had their their their tongues cut out, but potentially it's never explained." No. Um So yeah, so I was wondering if maybe he had become brainwashed and integrated into that society and he was going out to recruit other recruit people. But sadly that's not what happened. What what did happen what did happen is that um Kate Behan Behan. I don't know how to pronounce it. Been she's called be and the like I feel like the the Gaelic meaning of that is literally like beehive.
She's called Kate Bean and she's in real life called Ley Lely Lely. So So be eski. Yeah, that's why they were cast, I believe. Um, yeah. They're in a bar. That's clever. Off Ireland. Yeah. And they bump into James Franco and Jason Rissa. So random. I couldn't believe it. I was like, is that why is James Franco in this? Do you know what? If they made a sequel where they burnt James Franco alive, I'd have watched it. They did. They called it Alien Covenant. I love Jason Ritter.
I don't know who he is. Who is he? Don't burn. He Oh, John Ritter's kid. You do know who he is. Do I? Okay, I know who he is. Sorry. I I love Jason Ritter. He's not always in the best projects, but um he makes Tik Toks where he does interpretive dances to the Matlock theme tune and talks to his cat a lot. And also he's married to Melanie Linsky, so he has excellent taste. Okay. Power couple, right? James Franco, on the other hand, can get in the bin.
Yeah, obviously. It would have been better if James Franco wasn't on fire at the end of this movie. I'll admit. Yeah, just even if it didn't serve the plot, just appropo of nothing. Yeah, it would have been better if like Sabies just spat her booze all over him and then got her big lighter out and just set him on fire. That would have been That would have been a good ending. And the credits just rolled, but half the screen was just James Franco on fire throughout the credits.
Yeah. You see like you see the credits, you know? That happens sometimes in movies. You see like the main players and then it just sort of wipes and the credits on the right and the rest of it like you say the next four minutes of credits are just James Franco on fire running around going, "Please help me. Please help me." And no one helps him. Yes. And then there's people going and he's going, "Someone piss on me, please." And everyone going, "Nah."
There's a bunch of 17-year-old girls just going, "Stop, drop, and roll, mate. I don't know what to tell you." Yeah. Poetic justice. 2006. That was before we knew he was a s*******. All we knew about him, he was a s*** actor bringing it straight back to the room kind of. Oh, that's that makes me sad because I do I love the disaster artist. I think it's a magnificent movie. It's so funny and it's it's way better than it should be.
They should have made the disaster artist with Nicholas Cage as Tommy. So, remake The Disaster Artist. Make a movie about the disaster artist being made when Nick Cage plays James Franco playing Tommy. Yes. Oh, f***. Get on that. But maybe Johnny Vampire and it cuts to him with the Vampires Kiss plastic teeth in. I'm a vampire. This thing writes itself. Oh, we should get on that. Chat GPT. Write me a script. Oh, if you Oh, someone write it, please. Please write it or do your accounts.
So, The Wicker Man, 2006. Yeah. What are your thoughts?
I I'm really happy that I chose this. I'll be honest with you. I I didn't hate it. I I thought it was It's not a good movie. Kind of enjoyed it. Kind of. I definitely enjoyed the last act. Whether it was intentional or not, I did. I just enjoyed it. And there was a bunch of decision in it. And I was just like, why? What's going on? Like, why was he having visions? What happened to the self-help tapes? Why wouldn't the men talk? Um, why were there loads of twins?
Because weird, Dan. Right. Okay. Uncanny. Um, why did he run through a bee farm? A bee farm? Yeah. Where was Jason Staithm? That's right. That's right. Like, none of this s*** would have happened if the beekeeper was f****** about. I'll tell you now. That's a crossover we all need. Yeah. Frank Beekeeper or whatever his name was in that. He's the beekeeper. But he's also a beekeeper. He's also a beekeeper. It's very clever. It is. Yeah.
Yeah. Um I just I had a bunch of questions in this movie and it's not Yeah. It's not good, but it's not as bad as I thought it was going to be. I certainly don't think it's as bad as its reputation. Um it's not great, but I kind of enjoyed it. Like I'm glad I watched Will I watch it again? I might. Yes. When you buy the unrated version. Yeah, I might watch it again. Like I can imagine a scenario where we have mates around,
we have some food, we have a few beers, be like, "Should we put a wicker mat on?" I've just got the extended cut. Should we watch that? And then we never see those people again. Yeah, ideally. Yeah. Let's do it to people that we don't want to see again. I get to watch the wicker man again and then we can people off. I don't know how I feel about that. No, I joke. Um,
but yeah, I I'm I am glad that I chose this one over Left Behind. Like, I wanted to choose something that's not been received greatly,
but I was worried about choosing something other than this because I thought it there just might not be much to it. There might not be much to talk about. With this one, I thought we can reference the original. Um, it's got a huge reputation. Like, there'll be stuff to dig into. So, I'm glad I I chose this one. I know when I did the lineup And I said to you that we're going to be doing the Wicker Man. I don't think that you were terribly excited about it.
No. God, no. No. No. Not even a little bit. What did you think about this? So, this is the second second time you've seen it. Mhm. Um, what was your what were your kind of thoughts on it the second time you saw it? Did you What was Did you like it the first time you see? Did you hate it? What was you like that's rubbish? Yeah, I thought it was s***. So, what about this time? How does it compare to your original viewing?
So, I think the best way to sum up My thoughts about this film are as a horror movie, zero. Zero out of 10. Yeah. As a comedy, six. Okay. So, I'm still not convinced by the insistence that the comedy was intentional. I can sort of see the argument for it, but I'm still not convinced. And I don't think it's a good movie by any metric, not one.
But I kind of had fun watching it. I'm going to say that begrudgingly. ly it wasn't the worst experience and I can count on both hands off the top of my head a bunch of movies that were way worse than this. Yeah, agreed. That star Nicholas Gage like Yeah, I I think I was just expecting this to be way worse than it was. Yeah. And I don't think it's good by any stretch. No, I can't I can't defend it. No,
but I just was expecting it to be like really really bad and that would been fine cuz there still would have been plenty to talk about. Um, stay tuned for our what's happening in season 10 where we might delve into that kind of situation a bit more. But maybe
um I'm kind of happy that I chose this and while we were watching it I was like yeah this was the right choice especially since like the last couple of movies have been some of my favorite movies. I know you you didn't love the rock as much as me. Face off we had a good old time with and snake eyes we had a really interesting chat. So I do think I think it's nice to have a balance of different movies and particularly as we're doing an actor one this season and the highs and the lows along that career.
Mostly highs, but this was a definite slump. There were a lot of people that were high. Yeah, maybe for sure. Um, that's the only explanation. Yeah, but I I'm I'm not disappointed by this. Like I I joke about it. I I I probably will buy that extended cut. I think some of my resistance is because do think the original Wickerman is such a cult classic horror movie. I mean, The Wickerman walked so that Midsummer could run and we both love Midsummer. So, like Midsummer,
I do like a bit of folk horror. I like a bit of I don't know. I sort of associate it with Englishness. So, maybe Midsummer isn't the best example, but um it's got English people in it. That's true. Yeah. Um but I I don't know. I think I think my attachment to the original is maybe a stumbling block for me when viewing this one. I was going to ask you this because do you think that this film would have been received as poorly as it was had it this been an original property? Yeah, there you go.
Yeah, it's not good. It's not good at all. But there is some merit for so bad it's good. Yeah, I think I'm kind of on the same page. Although I don't think it's quite as bad as that. I think it's it's kind of like it feels kind of like a like a twostar movie to me, but I enjoyed it like a three and a half star movie. Well, so the first hour is just sort of soulless. It's just a bit nothing. I think the first half is half a star and the second half, like the final half an hour is two and a half.
It doesn't make up for it though, I think. But moving on. Moving on. What are we doing next week? So, next week we are uh it'll be our first Vera Herzog movie. movie. Will it? Yeah. Yeah. I can't think of another one. We've Oh, no. I didn't know you had a Vera Herzog movie, didn't you? In the lineup, did I? What are we doing? I've forgotten. We're doing Bad Lieutenant. Oh, of course. Port of Cole, New Orleans. Yeah, I've never seen it. I've got the Abel Ferrara original.
I've not seen that. That one. Is that Harvey Cartel? It is Harvey Kitel. We should watch them both back toback so that we can compare. Yeah, that's We should It's been on the watch pile for ages, so we definitely It's a yellow DVD. I remember. We should watch that and then watch this. Yeah. Yeah, you're right. We should compare them. Uh it's I'm surprised that you've never seen the Verheart one. It's pass me by.
It's all right. Like it's um I've only seen it once and it was a while ago and we'll talk about it, I'm sure, but we're doing some Nicholas Cage stuff in it. Okay, that's all you need to know. Can't wait.