Hi, hello. Welcome back to nevertheless. She persisted a podcast with Shady Side. Today, I'm here to Kayla. Hello. And we're going to talk about anxiety and worries, and what it's like to have anxiety experiences. All That Jazz. Oh, the fun things. So I'm 16, I'm 15. Yeah! Tell me a little bit brief bit about yourself, so I grew up in Texas and I've lived my entire life there. My parents got divorced, whenever I was in fifth grade.
Aid and my mom is still currently living in the house that I came home from the hospital too. So yeah, I don't know. My world has been pretty small up until the past year whenever I like started my whole treatment Journey like going to outpatient and then Wilderness. And now here at a boarding school. So yeah, cool. I thought I should be just started beginning. Yeah, sure what is like?
Your first memory of like being anxious or having anxiety about something that we think these are so funny because they're like over the worst things ever whenever I was in like kindergarten. I remember being like the coming home from school and telling my mom about all these cool girls who have like cool clothing and like me, wanting to be like them and And small things like that. Like, I'm a role on. Go got an iPod for and one for Easter eggs.
I think and I was like, oh cool. I know it is Easter, it looks like it's really stupid, but I was like, I'm jealous. I just want to be them and she was like like you need to be yourself and I was like, but I want myself to be them. Yeah. So that's probably like my first dosage of me. Not being comfortable with myself and be like wanting to be other people, which I consider
anxiety. Yeah. Yeah, I know when I was really, I think it was like, first grade, but I had a group of friends and it was like, when people are starting to sleep over, as I was like, only one year into this school, but this girl like major Disney fanatic, like Disneyland, every weekend. All that kind of stuff. And she's like, are having a sleepover and I was like, Okay.
And she was like, it's on like Tuesday or something which was like a school night and I was like, okay, and she was like, it's going to be so fun. We're gonna camp in the backyard and we're going to put balloons on top of the tent. And we're going to fly to Disneyland like an up. And then we'll wake up. And we'll go skiing and sing with the Chipmunks from the squeak walls and I was like, okay, okay, I'm coming. Yes. All right, and I like went home and I was like, Mom She's having
I don't chase a name. Go for it. I was like, Mom MacKenzie's like having the sleepover like I my I have to go. And she was like I haven't heard anything about it. Like I haven't gotten an email and I was like, literally, in the first grade like no one goes, someone's house. The parents have communicated, and I was like, she told me, like she said, it's happening. We're going in the tent to Disneyland.
Like, I have to be at the sleepover mom on, and she was like, I'm sorry, like you can't go unless I hear something about it. And so I remember going to school and I say and I was just so anxious that people are going
to be going. And I wasn't, I had to like tell them, I think I can't go to the sleepover and I was just like so upset about it. Um, but the And then a couple days later I was talking about it with my other friend who's supposed to go, and she was like, you know, my mom said I could go also. But then, your mom talked to, MacKenzie's, mom, and MacKenzie's mom had no idea. So, then she was calling all these moms.
And I almost showed up at her house for no reason, and I was like, okay, so there was no flight to Disneyland, but I had hope. Yes. Yes, that was a really long story. So I was anxious that I'd be like missing out on how to tell people and I couldn't do something like that again. I did it for MO is real. Yeah. Missing out is like totally a thing.
Yeah. And it's like I like hate that term so much because you yeah, you always think of it as like, oh, fear of like Peter to see people hanging out but like whatever I get that. I'm like literally sitting in the same room and I'm like I'm just not like yeah, yeah yeah for me it's like anything. I'm from like I don't know, going to restaurant and like seeing my friends hanging out
without me or like I don't know. They're they're all like, simultaneously not texting me. And I'm like, they're totally like talking about me on a different group chatter, something or even like, sitting in the same room with him and they're having a conversation about something that I have nothing. Like, I don't know anything about. Yeah. So yeah, you wait on me every single flavor of social anxiety. That could possibly exist is present.
There's for me, I never really I realized like what I was having was anxiety, until after first time, I was in the hospital. Because before then I was just like, in like a consultative, like, numbness and depression. And then, after that, I understood what was going on. So, it lifted, like I wasn't just like numb and not a misunderstanding but I was like it, immediately reverted to anxiety and it was constantly in flux. So I was too depressed to be.
Expressing are so anxious. It's like really didn't make a whole lot of sense. But I just remember after that point like my parents are so I was much more fidgety and Restless anxiety, like took much more attention from me than, like it did before. Yeah. Um, for me, like, I didn't even know that anxiety was like a
term. Yeah. And until I was in like second or third grade and then Whatever I did figure out it was a term I thought like this is an adjective and I didn't know that it was a lie considered a mental illness or something like that until like eighth grade. Yeah, so yeah. Pretty late into my eggs. Rice field that I even know that it existed. Yeah. So I feel like that was kind of like I do want to say incapacitating but like kind of limited me because I thought that it was a normal thing.
That just no one talked about which kind of played to me having like, really, really struggled throughout my life with like sharing, my emotions and being vulnerable with people. Yeah, so yeah. What'd like that anxiety. Look like for you like, what did that feel? Like it presented in so many ways? It would be like me struggling to wake up at four School in the mornings? It would be because you were like to anxious. You were anxious about legal happened at school.
Of the thing. Yeah, like me, avoiding schoolwork. And then me getting extremely anxious about having to tell my teachers that I didn't do my homework. So, an obvious solution in my eyes was just not go to school, and then I would miss more, and then it would just be like this terrible. Yeah, we're spiral. And then my social life, I just constantly assume that everyone hated me at all times. Which I convinced myself was so, I wouldn't ever be disappointed
in quotes. Yeah, but in reality is that one before. Yeah, back it. The worst something better is always gonna happen. Totally. But I just like live the life of disappointment and sadness and fear. Yeah. And never really had any true friends because I never really trusted anyone to ask for what you need and what you want. And ask and have asking a request or having our quest for someone might be part of that. So everyone is entitled to advocate for themselves and ask
for write something. Okay? So going back to the first one. I gave you, where, it's Miss that and you like say that you're saying this, I don't deserve to get what I want or need. How would you challenge that if you have that thought, like, oh, here's a good example today, we order takeout because on counters are getting resealed and I was pretty, I was pretty pushy. I was like Ruby, we are going to
create fun. We're not going to get Barracuda or t. Plus like I really want to get great fight and you said This is happening again, it doesn't matter what I want because you're just going to get angry. So we're going to do what you want. So that's you pretty much having that belief that you don't deserve to get what you want or what you need. So how would you challenge that belief? I am allowed to ask for something that I would want or
need. And I am not allowed to be like pushed around by other people and their. Yeah. And they're like requests and stuff. So like you're challenging that by saying I have wanted me. It's and that's valid, and that's okay. And that's part of being human. You have questions you want answered about therapy, depression or anxiety, email Sadie's, time dot NS P at gmail.com or reach out via direct messages on any of the
nevertheless. She persisted social media accounts linked in today's episode notes. You can also leave a voice message on anger. I would love to hear from you. Okay. The last one that I'm going to do is actually there's two more that I think are really good. One of them is I must be really in Adequate. If I can't fix this myself and I can challenge that by saying I can't fix everything myself and it's okay to ask for help from other people, is there another
way you would challenge that. Yeah, like it's okay to ask for help on something because as humans, everyone IO makes mistakes, you are isn't able to, you know, complete everything. There is no perfect person around the world so everyone is able to. Yeah, try it on. Okay. And the last challenge for the last myth we're going to challenge is You see the problem is just in my head if I would just think differently, I wouldn't have to bother everyone else and I would challenge this
by saying to be effective. Sometimes I need help thoughts are very hard to change. How else would you charge that Ruby? Yeah, I would say like wait one of the ground. Obviously, the problem is just in my head, if I would think differently, I wouldn't have to bother anybody. Anybody else. Well, one thing that really stands out to me, there is like having to bother someone else, like you're not bothering them, you're just getting what you need and asking for it.
And then, if the problems just in your head, I mean, sometimes that is true. But other times, it really isn't a need to just talk about it. So like As Yang for your help. Okay? Okay. So for the rest of the episode, this overview on interpersonal, Effectiveness. We're going to talk about clearing price clarifying, priorities and goals and your interpersonal situation. And next episode, we're going to do the dear man scale and the episode. After that, we'll do give and fast.
So clarify my priorities and interpersonal situations So freebie, I want you to think about. I want to thank you to think about a situation that created a problem for you. Maybe you're like values, are your wishes from being restrict respected? You wanted someone to change something you wanted to say no etcetera, Etc. What's a situation that we could use um a situation where I wasn't getting what I need or a situation? Where problem arose for you for me? The other person necessarily it
can be the other person, okay? Um, one example of a situation like that would be when I was this a random problem. You're like yeah, just a situation that your values weren't respected. You wanted someone to do something differently. You needed to say, no. Oh, I got into a disagreement with my friend at school and she wouldn't apologize and I Felt a little bit just respected because I had apologized to her and she, yeah, done as I had
requested, which were they? So you needed a repair in that situation from someone else. Okay. So what was the prompting of that? Like, what made the surprise, who did, what to whom, what led up to it? What about the situation is the problem for you? She had told one of her other friends, that I was like saying mean stuff to other people, which didn't happen. And I was like very confused and got a little fresh and was like, hey why would you go around
saying that? And I just immediately accused her of that which I probably shouldn't have done. I should have gone in it with just some more calmness and then she kind of defended herself immediately as like very understandably is that I didn't do that but I had had like three other people tell me she had. So then I said, hey I'm really sorry. I didn't if it felt like I was
doing that I did not. I'm so sorry, I didn't mean to do anything like that and then feature, maybe if you could tell me when it sounds like I'm doing that and I can stop so that it doesn't sound like I'm trying to like say something mean about someone else. So you confronted your friend about talking about, you behind your baton and the problem for you was that she'd been talking about you and you didn't feel like there had better repair. Yeah.
Okay so we're going to talk about your objectives. For what you want, the relationship and your self-respect. So what specific result did you want from this situation? What did you want this person to do stop or except in this situation? I wanted this person to apologize to me after I had apologized to them and then maybe go back and tell the people who she had, you know. Yeah, whispered to about me that she was sorry that she had done that and then that's not true.
Because okay, so you To repair which for you met and Paula G and then her circling back to the people and saying that would happen, wasn't true? Yeah. Okay. So for your relationship, how did you want the other person to feel and think about you because of how you handled the interaction. I would all the other person to think of me is, I mean return. And why? Because I was able to like handle, my emotions and like, interpersonally effective.
Yeah, but I was going to say, So you want them to think that you're mature, anything else and it personally affected perfect. Okay. And then, as far as your self-respect, how do you want to think or feel about yourself because of how you handled the interaction? Um, how do I want to think of myself? I and you want to keep in mind that this is not dependent on whether you get that repair from the other person, no matter what the outcome is. What do you want to think and
feel about yourself? I would want to feel happy and proud because happy because I would know that no matter what she said, I knew that it wasn't true. So I would just feel like, okay, I know, maybe I didn't do something in this situation, but, you know, I'm just gonna not worried about it. I'm just gonna go on My day, and I feel proud of myself because I was able to, in that moment, he's my DBT skills to look at the disagreement in a different
way. And I've come out of it feeling, you know, good about it based on the outcomes, so it's such a good. Yeah. Okay, so I want you to rank your priorities. So one is the most important to second, third least important. So between objectives, which we talked about was And repair your relationship, which was that you want to be seen as mature and for yourself, you want to feel proud for how you acted? What is the most important? What is kind of neutral?
And what is least important? I would say, the most important thing would be to get their repair. So objective number one, okay? The second I think would be for me just some self, the self respect self-respect, just because then in a future it's kind of like positive reinforcement. I know we talked about that a couple episodes ago. It kind of helps, it helps boost your self your self awareness in your ability to be you know your ability be proud of how the way you handled it.
And I'm third probably the relationship but not to say that. I don't value their relationship. Yeah absolutely of course and you're just Just think, how do you want to approach this situation? So you are first and foremost, you're going into this situation, wanting the repair second. You want to make sure that you feel good about yourself and you're proud of how you acted. And third you want to be seen as mature and respectful.
So, is there any like imbalances or conflicts between your priorities, that make it hard to be effective with your objective? Your goal of getting your objective in this situation? The only thing, I feel like guilty about asking that from her, is there anything like that? I think that the only thing I would feel that would like between my first objective, my self-respect and my first objective, which would be the repair would be me not fully getting that repair.
But just going straight to feeling very proud of my accomplishment for using my skills. Yeah, and then not recognizing that, I still do need something from the other person in order to reach my second goal. Yeah. Yeah. And then later so maybe you would forget that. Your first goal is the objective and the moment get consumed with the happiness around your self-respect being met. Yeah, gotcha. Okay. But then also like making sure she feels the same about home.
I feel ya, okay, that was awesome. That was perfect. Yeah, I'm okay. This is actually kind of funny. So this I did 12 days after I got to through East and I filled this out for when you and Mom and Dad relate to come, visit me, do you remember when you brought me dinner? And we sat in the fish bowl, okay? So I said it's the same activity that we just did with Ruby but I did this February 26. 2008 came to the prompting of Was that parents and siblings relate to
visit? It was from they were there from 5:00 to 7:00 instead of from 4 to 6. So what in the situation was a problem was that I was anxious. I was feeling hopeless, worry lonely and depressed. So checking the facts. It was a misunderstanding about time and it was on an honest mistake that have been made. So even though I felt so upset, you guys were late, it was an honest mistake no miscommunication in time. So I said, what specific results I want.
I said I wanted to communicate to how That being late made me feel to them and get an apology as well as validating for the relationship. I wanted to be seen a skillful and having good communication. And for my self-respect, I wanted to feel good productive and that my private priorities were met and that I prioritized well. So I hurt eyes, my self-respect, then the objective, and then the relationship the amounts of in complex for that.
I waited to bring this up again. I don't want to communicate my emotions. I thought. So, I don't know if I ever actually said any of this to you guys. Guys. No. But I did fill out the worksheet. See about that interaction cats. Not So yeah. So that was kind of fun. Yeah, yes. So really quickly, a review about what we just talked about, which is clarifying goals. So, objective Effectiveness is getting what you want from other
person. So, it's obtaining a right, it's getting another person to do something that you want to do. It's saying no to an unwanted or unreasonable request. It's resolving interpersonal conflict, and getting your opinion of you taken. Seriously, some questions you might ask are what specific result, or changes to where I want from this interaction. And what do I have to do to get these results and what will work? So, relationship Effectiveness is keeping improving the
relationship. So it's acting in such a way that That the other person keeps like am respecting you, it's bouncing your immediate goals with the good of the long-term relationship. And maintaining whatever relationships for matter to you because the questions you'll ask yourself is how do I want the other person to feel about me after the interactions over regardless of the result? And what do I have to get or keep in this relationship?
So for self respect Factor - you're keeping your improving self-respect, so you're respecting your own values and beliefs, you're acting in a way that makes you feel more. It acting in a way that makes you feel capable and effective. So your questions you're asking yourself is how do I know what to feel about myself after the interaction is over, regardless of the outcome? And what do I have to do to feel that way about myself? What will be effective?
So, as we'll talk about in the next two episodes, when you're trying to get objective Effectiveness, you using the skill called dear man, when you're doing. You're using skills called give and thank and when you're prioritizing, self-respect, you're using a scale called fast. So, now that we know how to clarify, what our goal is and decide what we want to focus on next episode, we're going to learn the skills that you can Implement those goals and chewy be effective.
Awesome sounds great. So thank you for coming on today Ruby. I'm excited for come here again. Yeah, Thursday yeah I might have 50 but I think I can go. Okay. Okay, sounds good. So yeah, thank you for listening. Hopefully this was helpful and yeah last but definitely no like And subscribe. So, Hopefully this is how good it was. Thank you. All right. Bye. Nevertheless. If you enjoyed this week's episode of nevertheless, she persisted.
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today's episode notes. Don't forget to subscribe and I'll see you next Friday. Thanks for listening PS. Nevertheless, she persisted And check out my blog. Nevertheless, she persisted podcast with Sadie Sutton dot photo dot blog, and don't worry. All of these are linked in today's episode notes. Don't forget to subscribe and I'll see you next Friday. Thanks for listening PS. Nevertheless, she persisted